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File: 1634576172478.png (28.53 KB, 849x434, FB8TIDmVkAEntdq.png)

 No.10920

https://www.jcp.or.jp/web_policy/2021/10/2021s-bunya-007.html
Japanese communist party proposes a ban on lolicon stuff in otaku media
Based or cringe?

 No.10921

>>10920
Repost this in the ANIMETA thread… made for this goddamn discussion type

and absolutely based, fuck lolishit.

 No.10925

>>10920
Unbased. The country's youth is in shambles. Work life balance is atrocious. Reactionaries keep winning elections. Who the fuck cares about lolis.

 No.10926

>>10925
JCP never talks about those issues. Their shtick was anti-censorship around 2014 that won them otaku votes. I honestly don't remember when was the last they proposed something that actually does something good. This is why no one cares about them in Japan despite the party being pretty big.

 No.10929

censorship is always censorshit

 No.10931

>>10920
Google translated:
>The current law does not regulate so-called "non-existent child pornography" such as cartoons, anime and games, but Japan has cartoons, anime, CG, videos and online that depict extremely violent child pornography. It has been internationally named as a major producer of games, etc., and special rapporteurs of the United Nations Human Rights Council have recommended more in-depth measures to properly regulate these (2016). Non-existent child pornography disseminates the false social notion that a child can be a target of libido, violence, and an outlet, even if it does not harm any real or living child, and undermines the dignity of the child. Will lead to. We will work together with a wide range of stakeholders to create a social consensus that does not allow children to be the target of sexual abuse or exploitation, while preserving "freedom of expression" and right to privacy.
Seems like a pretty soft stance they're taking, and its not even 1/10 of what the article is talking about overall

 No.10932

They opposed a LDP bill that wanted to do the same and on their website there's a page that explains they have a policy against censoring manga and anime under the guise of fighting child porn.
What a strange situation.

 No.10933

>>10920
>>10931
Based. Sexualisation of children and lolishit should be banned, except for if it can be used to aid responsible pedophiles to keep them from offending.
>>10932
based and decently nuanced

 No.10935

>>10932
It is likely that boomers and more socially traditional elements inside the party won out on this decision. Many such cases in other Communist parties.

There is always boomers

 No.10936

>>10932
That used to be their old stance. Probably forgot to tweak it.

 No.10937

>>10935
Could be.
>>10936
I think it's a stupid move since it came out of the blue.

 No.11032

Radlibs can cope all they want but banning lolishit is never going to be a popular policy in Japan. Some months ago some gaijin woman who worked as a translator complained about lolishit on the Japanese side of Twitter. They decimated her. Keep in mind the Japanese side of Twitter is the second largest one in the world after the English-speaking one.

 No.11033

>>11032
>Nitter is a good source of opinions
lmao

 No.11034

>>11033
>*source of good opinions

 No.11036

>>11033
In Japan, the place where the whole country hung out on a textboard once? Yes.

 No.11044

>>11033
Twitter is very popular in nip-land. I'd even say it's more popular there than it is in the states.

 No.11045

what's with japanese sexuality?
why is jav so based?

 No.11049

Ban pedo stuff but uncensor dicks and pussies

 No.11060

>>11032
You're only focusing on otaku circles on twitter
Most people don't give a shit if Japan decides to actually ban this garbage and otaku are a minority.

 No.11061

>>11032
>Some months ago some gaijin woman who worked as a translator complained about lolishit on the Japanese side of Twitter.
Source? Also that's because the Japanese lolifaggots and otaku hang out on Twitter a lot. Like the other anon said, they're just a loud minority in Japanese society.

 No.11069

>>11060
>>11061
If nobody gave a shit neither would political parties, them having official policies on lolishit speaks for itself.
>Source?
Don't have one, Chrome history doesn't last forever. But if my memory serves me right I located the happening via Sankaku Complex, either directly from there or a rabbit hole that mentioned the aforementioned gaijin woman's Twitter account. This gaijin woman, if I recall correctly, was not connected to weebshit properties and her Tweet went viral so I sincerely doubt it only reached the hardcore lolifags.

Anyway the only thing that should concern materialist socialists is the sale of such material because that involves an actual capitalist mechanism (the commodification of youth); everything else is radlibery, idpol, moralism or revisionism (pick your wankery).

 No.11071

Based
Gets burgershits and nips to commit seppuku

 No.11073

>>11069
>neither would political parties, them having official policies on lolishit speaks for itself.
No, politicians doing non-controversial shit that doesn't matter just to show that they actually did something is a very classic tactic

 No.11076

>>11069
>Sankaku Complex
you might as well get your information from stormfront

 No.11078

Who fucking cares about some niche lewd cartoons? Their working class have to deal with rampant unpaid overtime and a terrible work culture everyday, and this is all the JCP gives a shit about?
Their priority should be to agitate for a 32-hour workweek instead of alienating otakus. Lolifags will find their cartoons on the internet whenever they are banned or not by the moral police.
No wonder Marxist parties are so fucking useless nowadays.

 No.11079

>>11076
Yes, and?

 No.11085

File: 1635374380890.jpg (31.52 KB, 640x480, really nigga.jpg)


 No.11086

>>11078
Nice cope.

 No.11087

>>11036
>>11044
Just because they escape onto socmedia, doesn't make it not shit.

 No.11090

>>11086
How is it cope? The only ones who are coping are boomers who think you can ban cartoons. It doesn't work with drugs, I don't see how it could work with lolicon, whenever you like it or not.

 No.11091

>>11090
>It doesn't work with drugs
Oh you're one of those idiots. It worked in the USSR just fine and as for lolicon, it's fairly easy to reinforce given the impact it had on chans, boorus and many other pr0n sites. Obviously it'll still be found but the point is that it isn't going to be commonly consumed content, easily available to people (as it used to be, back in the SadPanda heyday).

 No.11092

>>11091
>It worked in the USSR just fine
The USSR collapsed, there is no going back.
In case you are a Chinaboo, there are drugs there, ketamine, weed and meth mostly, despite the harsher measures taken under Xi.
>Obviously it'll still be found but the point is that it isn't going to be commonly consumed content, easily available to people (as it used to be, back in the SadPanda heyday).
Whatever, the people who will want to look at that shit will still do it.
Sure, you could make a point about how repression against child pornography can be effective, but CP hurts actual people for life, lolicon is just drawings.
My point was that it's certainly not the most pressing problem Japan has presently. They should start to deal with karōshi and unpaid overtime instead of lewd cartoons.

 No.11100

>>11092
>The USSR collapsed, there is no going back.
>"durr it 'collapsed' so that means this failed and shouldn't be looked to as an example"
Ok reddit
>chinaboo
You really are a lib aren't you, given that the typical terminology used is Dengoid.
>there are drugs there
bans not being 100% means they failed
Are you an idiot?
>people who will want to look at that shit will still do it
At risk and are likely to think over if their stupid fetish is worth problems
>Muh drawings!!!
This is the reason the mods should have not deleted the lolicon containment thread, EVERY fucking time it's the same mental gymnastics. It's not about that, it's about the consumption and influence such products have on society and people.
>They should start to deal with karōshi and unpaid overtime instead of lewd cartoons
>implying that you can't do both.
>not the most pressing problem Japan has presently
That argument can easily be made to almost any problem in Japanese society, hell it's EXACTLY the kind of argument the Japanese government used to ignore shit like Minimata until the last fucking moment. Loli-fetishism is a societal ill that is part of the overall Otaku/weaboo problem - a bunch of shut-ins that do nothing and only perpetuate meaningless, escapist lifestyles and normalization of the kind of ill-thoughts that a normal person ought to dismiss and barely thinks of. There's a reason Japan has grown males marry body-pillows, figurines and virtual 'waifus'.

 No.11107

>>11085
Are you implying Sankaku fabricated the Twitter account and the replies or what please be specific

 No.11108

>>11100
>normal person
normalfaggotry is the disease

 No.11109

>>11107
I'm saying that relying on sankaku to be accurate is like relying on reviews on Craigslist for a hooker, it's just sketchy, biased an inaccurate not to mention fuck nitter and it's dumb shit

 No.11110

>>11108
>yet another newfag that doesn't understand the term "normie"
>another chanfag that thinks being a socmedia moron is good.
kek

 No.11113

>>11110
take your meds

 No.11114

>>11113
no argument

 No.11116

>>11114
that is my argument, your post reads like a schizo wrote it

 No.11117

Based JCP

 No.11436

>>11100
>EVERY fucking time it's the same mental gymnastics. It's not about that, it's about the consumption and influence such products have on society and people.
Not him, but how is what he said mental gymnastics? He was arguing against a ban through a train of thought you disagree with. That is not mental gymnastics.

You sound really angry but your argument has been disproven time and time again. I have never seen evidence that loli porn has any affect on society and it has been proven that it does not increase the chance of peadophilic atcs throughout society. If you have some reliable evidence then please show it to us rather than just using buzz words because you can't explain why you don't like something. Do you think video games make people violent?

 No.11439

>>11436
Nothing you are saying is of any intrinsic value.
>arguing against a ban through a train of thought you disagree with
No, they're using an analogy about "muh drugs" ban failing (in the USA) and then after being pointed out that the USSR and China both successfully clamped down on that, bitched about "muh USSR failed" like a typical libertarian.
>has been proven that it does not increase the chance of peadophilic atcs throughout society
It does and has not been disproven by anything but the most bullshit of social experiments and the amateur essay rants of coping lolicons, the thread on the topic got deleted and rightfully so, do not continue this conversation
>Muh vidya
<All vidya is the same!!!!
FPS games and Mario Kart are different things you fag. Yes video game violence has impacts on real violence, yes there is evidence proving this, cope more.
>ome reliable evidence then please show it to us rather than just using buzz words because you can't explain why you don't like something.
The ironic lack of self awareness is amazing. Imagine bumping a thread to reply to an ended argument.
>our argument has been disproven time and time again.
Except it has not.

 No.11440

File: 1637162034558.jpg (31.97 KB, 630x420, missing y.jpg)

>>11116
>that is my argument
>your post reads like a schizo wrote it
<Ur a normie because you said normal people
<Ur a schizo! Because you said IDU the definition of normie

 No.11441

>>11439
Then please disprove my argument. You are saying that lolicon has adverse societal affects and so you need to present serious evidence supporting your claim.

So do you think violent video games should be banned? If violent video games cause violence (and the evidence is very mixed on that), and they should be banned, what about banning martial arts for making people violent (and that is easier to prove)? If something has unclear, or even clear societal affects it shouldn't be totally banned as that impedes on people's freedom. I would also say that there is a reason Liberals and Conservatives want this stuff restricted.

 No.11442

>>11441
>Then please disprove my argument
You're making a claim, not an argument.
>You are saying that lolicon has adverse societal affects and so you need to present serious evidence supporting your claim
<prove that drawn kiddie pr0n is bad
Are you fucking kidding me? I can do so, I've done it before, but the point is nil, you'll ignore it again. Inb4 "Not reeel" It not being real isn't the point, nobody is saying it just a bad as actual pedoshit, but that's like saying conspiracy of mass murder is permitted because it's not as bad as actual mass murder.
> do you think violent video games should be banned?
They should be moderated, their plots, characters and designs should be made to not encourage political messages a la "kill de mudslimes" or "muh evul russkie rapists" and their gametime should be limited.
>hat about banning martial arts for making people violent
<easier to prove
Yet another whataboutism. Martial Arts ias based around discipline and self-defense or competitive matches, and no good teacher or school approves of aggression, not TKD, not Karate, not Boxing or anything else.
>something has unclear, or even clear societal affects it shouldn't be totally banned as that impedes on people's freedom.
That's not something I disputed, but martial arts (something that has concrete benefits) is extremely different to jerking it to underage shit.

 No.11443

>>11442
Look could go on about evidence or whatever but let's just agree to disagree. My ideas on this topic are fundementally different from yours. We clearly come from different viewpoints on issues such as freedom. This argument is just splitting us up when we need to be unitied against capitalism and I shouldn't have started it in the first place. Have a nice day.

 No.11444

>>11443
Freedom is important, but there is a difference in someone having freedom and being a hedonistic libertine, that has been my stance that I have reached after numerous personal experiences in life in freedom and oppression.
I recognize the need to be free, but also recognize the need for regulation, it is a balance, but in some areas there is need for more strictness than others for people's benefit.
>agree to disagree
No skin off my back, have a good day too.

 No.11446

normally I wouldn't really even give a shit but considering how powerful HAES is right now and how much respect it has in the west, it will be used to claim that anyone who is into thin women is a lolicon and a degenerate and someone who deserves life in prison for not liking fat chicks. Sorry not sorry fat chicks are ugly.

 No.11490

File: 1637275487083.jpg (102.02 KB, 524x1420, rlxdmabx5zn61.jpg)

>>10920
It should come as no surprise that this proposal to ban illustrated CP immediately got a response from /pol/ (and their Otoya posting) and from /GET/ for that matter even though, it kind of contradicts their prior policies that they proposed:
https://www.jcp.or.jp/jcp_with_you/2021/10/post-49.html
Translation: https://otakuread.com/japanese-communist-party-claims-no-contradiction-in-opposing-regulation-of-anime-manga/
>We are opposed to any movement to impose legal restrictions on manga and anime under the guise of restricting “child pornography.”
>The JCP has proposed that the term “child pornography” be changed to “depictions of child sexual abuse”.
>We proposed this from the perspective that the legal interests protected by the Child Pornography Prohibition Act are the freedoms and personhood of real children.
So the JCP is trying to make prosecuting artists harder by narrowing what is punishable under the CPP act.
Then again the JCP has been flipflopping for decades: They were outright banned by the Imperial Government until their defeat in 1945, were surprisingly allowed to still exist under the US-puppet state. They supported the PRC and Mao until the late 60s then briefly made plans to form guerilla mountain groups with the help of the Soviets. Finally they embraced Social Democracy for populist reasons, declaring "We welcome the end of a great historical evil of imperialism and hegemonism." in their statement on the dissolution of the Soviet Union.

But in general this opposition and inanity is just an overall result of the culture in Japan and it's inability to escape the cumbrained content produced to cope with the alienated and pornographically-overexposed people.
https://archive.ph/cOoZX

 No.11493

Foucault was right, it's stupid to give a free pass to fictional violence in general but not fictional sexual violence.

>>11490
That's pretty cool of them. My expectations have been subverted.

>>11036
2ch was wildly popular, but you're vastly overestimating how much. It also peaked around 2005 and has been constantly hemorrhaging users ever since.

>>11044
Twitter is the most used social media in Japan.

>>11069
>Sankaku Complex
Oh lord. Stop supporting aggregator thieves who also happen to be fascists.

 No.11495

>>11493
Sorry, this kind of got lengthy
>it's stupid to give a free pass to fictional violence in general but not fictional sexual violence.
I put little stock in Foucalt given that he had been a pedophilic bohemian of upper-bourg origin and did little but armchair philosophy, and not even as a meme like Bordiga.
My personal misgiving for the man aside, I disagree: it is rarely necessary for sexual violence to be needed to tell a story properly, and if it is described in graphic terms then it is nothing but a cheap method to generate shock, and is artistically void.

Moreover permitting general violence is not the same as sexual violence, as they are not the same, to presume that one permits the other is a slippery-slope fallacy. Sexual violence by its nature is more than just a fight or effort to hurt someone, it takes away the control of the most private areas of a person and humiliates them, because generally rape is done through overpowering or taking advantage of one that is too feeble or unable to fend off unwanted advances and it is far more brutal to a person's psyche. There is good reason that people like Pinochet utilized rape as a tool to break people being interrogated.

PS. I also do not believe in a total free pass of general fictional violence of graphic detail either, just as in graphic description of sexual violence, it serves little purpose but to be shocking and is a lazy trick to generate attention.

 No.11497

>>11495
It's exactly this way of thinking that makes rape and other kinds of sexual violence so traumatizing as opposed to getting stabbed or whatever.

 No.11498

>>11495
>i havent read foucault but i will form an opinion on him based on what right-wingers say about him regardless
thats nice dear

 No.11501

>>11498
>>[strawman]
>[I didn't read your post]
Ok honey.

>>11497
>his way of thinking that makes rape and other kinds of sexual violence so traumatizing as opposed to getting stabbed or whatever.
You are either genuinely retarded or have no concept of just how traumatizing rape is. I really suggest you just stop pretending to understand this.

 No.11505

>>11495
>sexual violence is worse than regular violence
SPOOKY
C
A
R
Y
SKELETONS

 No.11509

>>11505
Just saying "spooks" doesn't make it so.

 No.11512

>>11509
You haven't explained why anything regarding sex is so special, ergo, you're spooked. Society has conditioned us to make a bigger deal about sexuality than even death.

 No.11513

>>11512
They said it was worse, and you just explained why - because of the conditioning.

 No.11515

>>11512
1) that isn't what being spooked is
2) I did explain, the reason sexual violation is more psychologically traumatic than most general violence.
3) If you are dead you cannot feel trauma or pain or suffering (but you also cannot feel and experience the good things in life or be with your loved ones, you are dead and nobody knows if there is a heaven or reincarnation.
4) If you are raped you are stuck in that feeling, the dead are beyond that at the least and
4) Society is not one gigantic being, societies arose in different places at different times. And yet most societies at a certain point arrived to the conclusion that "rape is horrendous". Ethics are not "conditioning".

 No.11521

>>10920
Based

>>11078
u gay

 No.11523

>>11049
baseds

 No.11553

This has nothing to do with communism. They are just alienating themselves from the Japanese people.

 No.11554

>>11553
>Otaku lolicons are "The Japanese People"
Do you comprehend the sheer idiocy of this claim?

 No.11558

>>11554
You're making a false assumption. Whenever Japan gets bullied by imperialist forces to ban loli and shouta artists who mainly are women tell them off for it. People want a party that they can relate to for real issues not irrelevant bullshit to appease woke moralfag capitalists proxies who manufacture distractions.

 No.11560

>>11558
>loli and shouta artists who mainly are women tell them off for it.
AHAHAHAHAHA
post source faggot, not that the sex of the creators matters anyway
>non-otaku Japanese are ok with anime pedoshit
>it's only (((imperialist forces))) who want Japan to stop being based and lolipilled
Yeah gonna need sources for those claims. Pretty sure polls have been done before on that matter and they show that most Japanese people want it banned or at least regulated.
Or maybe your post was meant to be ironic, if so I apologize

 No.11568

>>11560
>post source faggot
The cunt is talking bout that one female (probably fujo) group that had made a statement of "protect real women, not fictional ones" ignoring the fact that nobody is saying that lolishit is the same as actual pedoshit, but is still shit that shouldn't be encouraged.

 No.11570

>>11568
>nobody is saying that lolishit is the same as actual pedoshit
dude people say that shit all the time

 No.11571

>>11570
No, no they don't. I have not seen a single person say that it's the same thing EVER. I've seen people call it pedoshit and they are correct, but nobody has ever said it is the same as real CP or actual pedophilic crimes.

 No.11580

>>11560
The false assumption I was referring to is if someone supports the right to existence of something without legal repercussions it doesn't necessarily mean they personally want it for themselves or encourage it. So if someone isn't against banning loli stuff that doesn't mean they are lolicon or like that it's a thing. Also not sure which meaning of otaku you're using. Otaku in Japan refers to someone into anything with great passion and knowledge and it's kinda their main thing. Someone liking anime doesnt make them inherently an otaku. Even not all mangaka are otaku. Point I was making is all this does is divide the party by taking a platform that shows they dont care about real issues just cencoring the public. No other party in Japan has this as a platform. If there was such a sweeping majority it already would be banned.

 No.11581

>>11580
NTA but
>if someone supports the right to existence of something without legal repercussions it doesn't necessarily mean they personally want it for themselves or encourage it
True, but more often than not, you are more likely to support something/oppose banning something if you have investiture in it. Given that many "mangaka" and "anime" studios rely on shit like fan-service and the same shit loli-gags and pedo-baiting to make money this only make my suspicious stronger.
I'll also add that this is hardly the hill to die on in terms of artistic rights; pornography is not art and doujins are rarely anything more than illustrated pornography. Pornography itself is nothing more than porky manipulation feeding off of social alienation and lack of healthy relationships in capitalist society. The Oversaturization of pornographic content also leads to many people seeking more and more deviant material because relatively normal stuff just isn't doing it anymore.
>Otaku in Japan refers to someone into anything with great passion and knowledge and it's kinda their main thing
That's the original definition, but the definition has changed and most "Otaku" are those that obsessively consume products, often to the point of neglecting everything else.
>Someone liking anime doesnt make them inherently an otaku.
Yeah? I don't think anyone claimed that here.
>divide the party by taking a platform that shows they dont care about real issues just cencoring the public.
If people are given more and more escapist material to indulge in they area obviously not going to be more than Lumpens regardless, at last in this manner people that are right-wingers are revealed and the Party itself given attention.
>No other party in Japan has this as a platform.
It's not a platform, it's a proposal as part of their campaign and the focus on it is artificial because dramafagging is the media's bread and butter, as is getting a rise out of the people. Numerous other parties hade proposed such censorship at one point or another, and frankly international and extra-national laws already prohibit many kind of lolishit already, so it's really a loud minority of idiots bitching and moaning over a non-isue of their "cummies" being taken.

 No.11595

>>11581
>more likely to support something/oppose banning something if you have investiture in it
More likely but that's not what often constitutes a majority for any bannable thing.
>Given that many "mangaka" and "anime" studios rely on shit like fan-service and the same shit loli-gags and pedo-baiting to make money this only make my suspicious stronger.
I will overlook the poor wording here implying a mangaka studio is a thing. Many mangaka are doujin who self produce and live off their works so this isn't all about rich capitalists if that's what you're trying to get at. Some anime studios also are owned by the artists too. I understand the point but I see no evidence suggesting only people that profit from it or consume it don't want it banned.
>I'll also add that this is hardly the hill to die on in terms of artistic rights; pornography is not art and doujins are rarely anything more than illustrated pornography.
No a doujinshi is something self produced not all doujinshi made by doujin are hentai. The proposal wont be limited to porn to my understanding unless Ive seen wrong translation but rather implied ban any depiction in a sexual or violent manner of a fictional character. Take note that sexual is completely open to interpretation as it is not an objective thing. Coupled with how loli doesnt even have a universally agreed upon definition this is just a disaster waiting to happen.
>Pornography itself is nothing more than porky manipulation feeding off of social alienation and lack of healthy relationships in capitalist society.
Porn predates capitalism. Again this isn't purely about porn anyway. Also a lot of porn these days is self produced so that argument really is generalizing. Porn is a natural result of sexuality meeting technology and art. Any exploitation of it is after the fact.
>The Oversaturization of pornographic content also leads to many people seeking more and more deviant material because relatively normal stuff just isn't doing it anymore.
In males masturbating too much or having sex too much can cause some level of erectile dysfunction but I haven't heard of females having sexual dysfunction from such acts. Fetishes are the result of sexual arousal during exposure to any other stimulus which then can create a potential for connection in the brain telling it to become aroused next exposure to this stimulous. This occurs regardless of if it's porn or sex or something non sexual.. Without this natural mechanism such porn never would even exist in the first place for example foot fetishes or people sexually attracted to cars. I'm not sure the exact determiner for what does and what does not become an object of sexual interest the brain is quite complex.
>That's the original definition, but the definition has changed and most "Otaku" are those that obsessively consume products, often to the point of neglecting everything else.
The definition of otaku has not changed. An anime otaku is what Westerners are referring to when they say otaku and they tag on additional steriotypes that may or may not be present in Japan and this about Japan so …..
>Yeah? I don't think anyone claimed that here.
It could be implied from what that anon said.
>Implying a communist party stripping people of more and more things they may enjoy will cause a revolution to overthrow the capitalists that allowed fun
>implying personal interests are ideology
>implying getting attention for doing something stupid is a good thing
No
>It's not a platform, it's a proposal as part of their campaign
Semantics
>Numerous other parties hade proposed such censorship at one point or another
Not in Japan presently no at least as far as I am aware.
>frankly international and extra-national laws already prohibit many kind of lolishit already
This is just an appeal to what is established and more present. Such arguments can be given to support capitalism too. There is no such thing as international law in actuality. The UN has no real power to enforce laws just bully nations. The countries actually have to agree with the UN for anything to be international. The UN, UK and the US have been bullying Japan a while.
>so it's really a loud minority of idiots bitching and moaning over a non-isue of their "cummies" being taken.
Being a non issue you should be arguing why nothing should change because it's a waste of focus for the party.

 No.11599

>>11581
>I'll also add that this is hardly the hill to die on in terms of artistic rights;
It's exactly the hill to die on because of retards like you saying shit like
>pornography is not art
You wouldn't know art if it walked up and fucked your mouth, and you use your smoothbrain takes to try and justify controlling what other people do.

kill yourself faggot

 No.11601

>>11595
I think this thread is over-reacting, given that the part about loli is very small and only a tiny portion of the 7th part of the Policy List.
>not what often constitutes a majority for any bannable thing.
It is the majority, most people are not going to support something they have no stake in because they don't care.
>wording here implying a mangaka studio
My wording is obviously referring to anime studios, and mangaka are rarely single-person efforts unless it is small self-made materials as you yourself speak of; Doujin is Japanese for small group of common interest.
>isn't all about rich capitalists
These groups cannot live on paper and air, for them to make money to survive they must create content that appeals to the most ravenous market even if the number of people compared to the population is small, so targeting things like loli and other crap is a primary concern if they seek to sell their content, and selling content inevitably involves a bigger company to print/publish and market it, thus porky gets their finger in the pie and influences its contents regardless.
>not all doujinshi made by doujin are hentai.
No shit, but a large majority that are sold and found online ARE. The ones that aren't are usually short self-made stories that either catch the attention of corporations, becoming mainstream productions (A la One Punch Man) or die off. In recent times Web Novels have increased the number of non-pornographic doujin material but its still not high, and still often relies on the most overused tropes and gags.
>proposal wont be limited to porn to my understanding
The Proposal aims to ban sexualized loli - or specifically - violently sexualized (rape) content. It has little bearing on content that isn't already SFW, only pornographic production.
>how loli doesnt even have a universally agreed upon definition
People dispute the definition because people are ignorant. The definition of Loli is straightforward: an underage (or underage-looking) girl depicted in a sexual manner. The only expansion for this phrase has been its use to all underage females in anime, regardless of sexualization, ergo the specific emphasis on sexual violence in the proposal. Obviously mp4 related isn't going to be banned.
>Porn predates capitalism
EROTICA is not PORNOGRAPHY. Pornography is a capitalist industry that only really began with the advent of easily available cameras and video, taking off during the early 20th century as shit like Playboy and other content arose. Even then the limited pornography of the time is nothing like the sheer deluge of graphic and absolutely free content online.
>sexual is completely open to interpretation
There are cultural norms and standards that determine if some actions are inherently sexual or not, the things that are contestable usually aren't all that obvious, but a panty-shot or dress-lift is pretty much sexual.
>this isn't purely about porn anyway.
As far as I can tell, it is - or rather about (graphic) depictions of sexual violence, not loli itself.
>self-produced
ALL porn is produced by someone, but it's put in public access and sold for money mostly by porky. R34 and Patreon is mostly Western market, and Pixiv is a large company.
>Porn is a natural result of sexuality meeting technology and art.
It isn't art and certainly isn't natural given that its entire production hinges on exploiting and commodifying sex, there is no point to it otherwise.
>haven't heard of females having sexual dysfunction
Because there isn't exactly a lot for them to lose functionality in, it does make them less sensitive and thus have a harder time getting pleasure over time.
>Fetishes are the result of sexual arousal during exposure to any other stimulus which then can create a potential for connection
True, but people start seeking alternative fetishes if their content no longer makes them feel as good.
>foot fetishes
That can exist because it starts simply - by appreciating a female body from literally head to toe and pornographic exposure directing you to something other than genitals. It's a long discussion about paraphilia that I don't feel like going into, my point is porn burns out your dopamine receptors and makes you a slave to this.
>definition of otaku has not changed
You are correct, it has been generally anime/manga focused since it got coined in 1983: (in Japan) a young person who is obsessed with computers or particular aspects of popular culture to the detriment of their social skills; "every other otaku can run on about their hobby endlessly"
>could be implied from what that anon
No it cannot, you're grasping for straws here.
>a communist party stripping people of more and more things they may enjoy
Because a minority of angry basement dwellers are the main concern and not the overall population. FFS read the actual proposal in its entirety before making dumb statements. Even in the hyperconsumerism of Otaku, lolicons are not a large portion of them and lolicons in general are a tiny proportion of the population, even in Japan and the USA. Catering to some deviants is pointless.
>personal interests are ideology
To paraphrase Amilcar Cabral, most people do not fight for the ideas in someone's head, they fight for the material interests and benefits for themselves and their closest people.
>getting attention for doing something stupid is a good thing
"There's no such thing as bad publicity"as P.T. Barnum said, there's no difference between fame and infamy today, regardless of a stance you take on something there is going to someone bitching and moaning, so might as well stick to your guns.
>Semantics
No it isn't semantics, they're different things and its important to recognize how small and irrelevant this tiny section of the proposals 7th part is.
>Not in Japan
The original 1999 law criminalizing the production and distribution of child pornography had been drafted to have a section specifically target loliporn. The JCP had little power then, there are many other examples of this kind of policy being proposed and denied.
>just an appeal to what is established and more present
No, I'm pointing out that most of the globes people think its detestable schlock and for good reason.
>Such arguments can be given to support capitalism
That'd be a false equivalency.
>no such thing as international law in actuality
Interpol'd say differently
>The UN has no real power to enforce laws
>just bully nations
LMAO
>The UN, UK and the US have been bullying Japan
HAHAHAHA, the primary importers of Japanese production that practically own Japan as a vassal state are "bullying" Japan by not enforcing laws that they can easily force through, kek.
>you should be arguing why nothing should change
It's not a focus of the party if you actually read the goddamn proposal.

 No.11602

File: 1637769381175.jpg (129.76 KB, 532x858, растрилять.jpg)

>>11599
>Don't take muh cummies u stoopid commie, itz ART!
>ad hominum and vulgar projection
Proving further that you have no conception of art or pornography and the reasons they are seperate.
>justify controlling what other people do.
You're on the wrong site, lolberts belong on reddit.

 No.11623

>>11601
>anyone I don't agree with is overracting
Come now.
>It is the majority, most people are not going to support something they have no stake in because they don't care.
Oh so things like slavery abolishment happened because the slaves became the majority in every country somehow because ..reasons…hmm
>targeting things like loli and other crap is a primary concern if they seek to sell their content, and selling content inevitably involves a bigger company to print/publish and market it, thus porky gets their finger in the pie and influences its contents regardless.
But not every artist is doing it for money. It isn't all a sold product. Also this argument makes no sense. Not long ago you were arguing for banning loli content because it's banned in a lot of places but all of them are capitalist countries and it's porky lobbying for these sort of laws. It's a mere distraction away from real issues that actually matter.
>No shit, but a large majority that are sold and found online ARE.
That's just cherry picking. That doesn't represent the whole picture and what are you even using as a reference? Western English language sites?
>The Proposal aims to ban sexualized loli - or specifically - violently sexualized (rape) content. It has little bearing on content that isn't already SFW, only pornographic production.
That doesn't change anything I said. It's fiction and these things can be used for storytelling and even in the case of it leading to some sort of sexual gratification they may get something else from it and what that is comes from within them.
>ALL porn is produced by someone, but it's put in public access and sold for money mostly by porky.
Not all of it is sold. Some people just like to share with others themselves or their art and it doesn't always go through channels that lead to proffits for porky. Also you should know better that you living in a capitalist society no matter what you do porky is proffiting off you.
>Loli is straightforward: an underage (or underage-looking) girl depicted in a sexual manner.
Nope. Even Japanese use the term for more around 12 year under characters not merely underage of consent of any country or even Japan (it's 18 in Japan for the record not 13 like some online sources mislead from misunderstanding). Others argue it's a body type yet this is further complicated by oppai loli. Regardless fictional characters do not have real ages they fake random made up ages. "Looks underage" is laughably meaningless when so many anime and manga characters are practically just same face with a slightly different body proportion but this varies by artist. Some styles they barely even resemble humans. It's impossible to define. Even in real life there is no objective "looks underage" when talking about just under. That sort of thinking creates dangerous president of forming laws based on how people look. Hmm where have we seen laws based on biological appearances before?
>EROTICA is not PORNOGRAPHY.
What is the disctinction you are making? It's pretty arbitrary distinction because they overlap with eachother not as completely unique things.
>Even then the limited pornography of the time is nothing like the sheer deluge of graphic and absolutely free content online.
I mean actually ancient not ancient like a grandmother. There even are cave drawings depicting sexual acts iirc. In India there is pretty much a depiction of every main sexual act considered taboo these days.
>There are cultural norms and standards that determine if some actions are inherently sexual or not, the things that are contestable usually aren't all that obvious, but a panty-shot or dress-lift is pretty much sexual.
Sexual is subject to the individual not society as a whole. Society influences how individuals view it but this doesnt make it objective fact.
>It isn't art and certainly isn't natural given that its entire production hinges on exploiting and commodifying sex, there is no point to it otherwise.
You dont get to decide what is art and what isn't art. Sure it may be fair to say something where it's purely product with no human expression but that's not always the case as artistry can exist to a degree within the capitalist hellscape and it certainly never is the case of complete absense of artistry with 2D where it's literally drawn which requires artistic skill at least untill we get to a point everything can be produced entirely by an AI that optimizes everything for pure proffit but that is a fictional scenario right now.
>Because there isn't exactly a lot for them to lose functionality in, it does make them less sensitive and thus have a harder time getting pleasure over time.
I've yet to see this be the case. It's possible but I havent heard of any despite how sexually open many girls I talk to can be.
>True, but people start seeking alternative fetishes if their content no longer makes them feel as good.
I don't see strong evidence pointing to this over incidental exposure
>That can exist because it starts simply - by appreciating a female body from literally head to toe and pornographic exposure directing you to something other than genitals.
I just used foot fetish as an example. Your explanation still ignores feet are not sexual organs. I could have said vore and it still would have fit what i was talking about.
>porn burns out your dopamine receptors and makes you a slave to this.
You've been consuming too much rightoid nofap propoganda. That's not exactly how it works. Dopamine isnt the feel good chemical it's something that makes you pay attention and helps form memories. Heavy repeated exposure forms stronger connections but works same way for everything including non sexual stimuli. It's not porn that does it it's self induced exposure level and masturbation frequency. Dopamine signaling is actually why schizophrenics start having delusions because faulty dopamine receptor signaling causes them to perceive things as meaningful and start drawing connections that arent there. Though that's a different mechanism obviously porn isnt going to make you schizo.
>claims I am grasping at straws
>still hasn't given a single reason loli should be banned other than because porky said so but so did the JCP so it's okay
Try harder
>Because a minority of angry basement dwellers are the main concern and not the overall population.
You seem pretty angry about loli stuff more than capitalism. The overal population wants capitalism so I guess that settles it.
>Even in the hyperconsumerism of Otaku, lolicons are not a large portion of them and lolicons in general are a tiny proportion of the population, even in Japan and the USA.
You're going in circles. It's already been pointed out one need not want something to not want it banned.
>Catering to some deviants is pointless.
Communists are viewed as deviants. So ban communists, right? Your argument would agree. You don't seem to understand the deeper consequences of this mindset.
>To paraphrase Amilcar Cabral, most people do not fight for the ideas in someone's head, they fight for the material interests and benefits for themselves and their closest people.
Saying something doesn't make it true and quoting someone makes it no more true.
>"There's no such thing as bad publicity"as P.T. Barnum said, there's no difference between fame and infamy today, regardless of a stance you take on something there is going to someone bitching and moaning, so might as well stick to your guns.
Surely quoting porky would assure us all of what you are saying. Shitting your pants to give off a big stinj wont get you anywhere. If this became a thing where it's banned it will just be used against their own party by others as a tool of shutting down individuals for mere drawings.
>there are many other examples of this kind of policy being proposed and denied.
Because it's fucking stupid that's why. It's a waste of resources and is completely unnecessary
>No, I'm pointing out that most of the globes people think its detestable schlock and for good reason.
Irrelevant. Most people are propogandized or otherwise influenced to believe whatever they believe about anything. It doesn't mean anything. Most people dont actually give a shit. The laws actually banning it explicitly named are few and rare. Most are just blanketed from poorly written laws that didnt even consider drawings when writing them.
>It's not a focus of the party if you actually read the goddamn proposal.
Then it shouldn't even be there at all. It's pointless.
>>11602
Replacing liberal policies for the exact same polocies in a so called """communist""" party makes comunism increasingly irrelevant to people.

 No.11625

>>11623
>anyone I don't agree with is overracting
Are you autistic or stupid? The people opposing this in the thread are bitching about the JCP being a non-issue and that there are other issues to address of more importance, ignoring that this excerpt about "muh loli" is literally a TINY portion of PART SEVEN of their overall policies.
>Replacing liberal policies for the exact same polocies
They aren't the exact same and you're proving my point - making a mountain out of a molehill out of an excerpt. The JCP is hardly a benchmark of communist movements, but this bitching and moaning is fucking pathetic. Communism is becoming more relevant every day and ignoring the continued lumpenization of the people in shite media is also a problem to address.

I'll respond to the rest of this liberal consumerist diatribe later.

 No.11627

>>11602
>расстреаяьт - cut
what did he mean by this?

 No.11631

>>11602
>Proving further that you have no conception of art or pornography and the reasons they are seperate.
They're not. Get fucked.

 No.11637

>>11627
You have terrible reading skills, those are obvious Л and Я letters.

>>11631
>They're not. Get fucked.
Cope more, literally anyone but coping coomerfags say otherwise and have actual arguments to the matter.

 No.11639

>>11625
Relying on insults in failed attempt to discredit providing no argument isn't working in your favour. Sweeping it under the rug isn't an argument for it, it's the avoidance of making an argument that can support it.

 No.11640

>>11637
>those are obvious Л and Я letters.
Where?
расстреаяьт in Google translate is just gibberish, but in DDG translate it says "cut". However, in yandex translate, which is actually Russian, says it means shoot.
So I guess the yandex translate makes the most sense.
The filename on the otherhand..

 No.11650

>>11640
As a Russian speaker I can tell you none of these translating machines are correct
расстреаяьт is you reading the font incorrectly.

 No.11651

>>11639
>Relying on insults
I sud no more (and in fact less) insults than you so by your logic you have no argument at all. I'm not relying on insults, I made a specific argument that you refuse to address; heck your entire diatribe isboils to mental gymnastics about "not reeeeel" and "ur /pol/"
>Sweeping it under the rug
You're projecting.

BRB I got work so I still can't piss the time away on your nonsense, I'll pick it apart for the garbage it is later.


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