No.1600118
What are the chances he wins though, is it realistic scenario? Also like always people are brainwashed by MSM and social media into acting against their own interest.
No.1600128
The current left candidate is the minister of economy in a country with 113% inflation. Put your ideology lens off for a second and evaluate that from perspective a person living in Argentina. Desperate times make people take desperate measures.
No.1600133
>>1600128Are Lula and AMLO the only left-wing leaders in LatAm that are actually successful?
No.1600135
>>1600128but these people are retarded
No.1600136
>>1600135No, most working people are way too busy staying alive and keeping their people alive that they don't have the brain energy left over to also get deeply educated on politics.
No.1600137
>>1600133MAS is still going strong.
No.1600138
>>1600118he won the primaries, chance are almost 100% he wins. this obvious US puppet CIA backup of the backup bolsonaro 2.0 will literally destroy argentina apart and remove argentina from the BRICS, fuck fascist milei!
>>1600136that's their fault for not organizing and preventing the return of fascism, their fault. doesn't matter if they have no brain energy left, now their lives will be much worse than before(if they survive fascist argentina in the 1st place)
No.1600140
>>1600118being more precise, he will win. unfortunately.
No.1600141
I kind of doubt the rulers will let him do some of the stuff he wants to. They know some of it it would end in economic and social disaster. Kind of how Truss was forced out after the British ruling class realized she was serious about her kooky ideas.
No.1600142
>>1600138Milei is a not a militant person. It's very different than junta leaders of past eras in south america. He does not have militant ambitions nor expressed any. Guy just thinks ancapism is the best thing, he may be retarded for that but he's not going to establish some dictatorship.
No.1600143
>>1600142>he's not going to establish some dictatorshipyou wanna bet? they said the same thing about bolsonaro back in 2018(which I obviously didn't fall for).
No.1600144
>>1600137I know nothing about Bolivia's current leader, but if he's anything like Evo Morales then he must be good. Pepe Mujica of Uruguay also seemed pretty successful.
No.1600146
>>1600143Yes I do want to bet. Milei isn't cut from same cloth as bolsonaro either. Milei is entirely focused on economics. Guy even named his dogs after libertarian economist
Bolsonaro didn't give a shit about any of this and was a multi decade military guy.
No.1600148
>>1600144Objective LatAm leftist ranking
1. Castro (Cuba)
*POWER GAP*
2. Chávez (Venezuela)
*POWER GAP*
3. Evo (Bolivia)
4. Lula (Brazil)
5. Mujica (Uruguay)
No.1600151
>>1600146>Milei: "En Argentina la democracia es una farsa">No cree en el sistema democraticohe keeps attacking the (bourgeois) democratic system of argentina with fakenews, that's the 1st step to destroy a democratic system. that's a dead give away.
many videos of him are just him attacking democracy itself. he will go as extreme as the international/national bourgoisie wants.
No.1600152
>>1600146I looked up the dog names
>Conan, Murray, Milton, Robert LucasLmao, named them after Murray Rothbard and Milton Friedman. Don't know the others.
His campaign has been a meme about privatizing all public sectors and defending everything. If he tries to do this I have a feeling the US will (ironically) coup him so he doesn't fuck up Argentina too much.
No.1600153
>>1600152isn't that exactly what they want? why would they coup him
No.1600154
>>1600142>he's not going to establish some dictatorshipAnd probably he isn't going to "abolish the central bank" or eliminate all the ministries nonconforming with ancapistan either… he's just gonna do some grandstanding while privately reassuring the porkies that he won't really push for anything harmful to them. And completely subjugate the Argentinian state to the US or just wreck the shit out of it.
And then at the first sign of pushback he'll collude with bog standard fascists (with US backing) to do a modern PR managed Pinochet and settle for neocolonialism rather than Ancapistan for Argentina.
No.1600156
>>1600152u really think the US will coup a guy who wants to use dollar as the national currency like a colony? milei will literally install a dictatorship, him attacking democracy with fakenews is just the 1st step.
>>1600154you are all underestimating him, he will do the worst ever possible
>he isn't going to "abolish the central bank" or eliminate all the ministries nonconforming with ancapistan either…wanna bet?
No.1600157
>>1600153If Argentina becomes unstable then the left can take power. "Better a devil you know than one you don't" situation. Just speculation on a possible scenario. Not necessarily a likely one.
No.1600161
argentina bros, prepare for the absolute worse
No.1600164
>>1600144>but if he's anything like Evo Morales then he must be goodIirc he was Evo's economic minister.
No.1600196
>>1600148Where would Nicaragua rank?
No.1600207
>>1600204maduro should be moved to social-democrat these days
No.1600287
>>1600204chile has solely been governed by neoliberals except for allende
No.1600300
>>1600204>Gonzalo>BeLoW libs and succdems who either actively or indirectly persecute the revolutionary vanguards! Bet you adore Allende who effectively gave the country to the US on a silver platter because "humanism", "reform", "pacifism", "peaceful coexistence".
People like you are not only part of why LatAm keeps underachieving, but also why OP's pic related keeps happening. It is this which makes the PCP-SL's persecution of sucdems and and non-cooperation with revisionists not only justified but frankly prescient.
Enjoy being stuck in the loop of capitalist hell you fucking idiot loser. Every successful socialist revolutionary that you picked for your top two tiers would have unironically laughed in your sorry face before pushing you down a well and high-five:ing their people's armies and cadres.
No.1600309
>>1600138Of course it's their fault, just like its our fault where I am and yours where you are. Moralizing about it and just writing off the whole of the uneducated masses is harmful though. It's easy and fun to call people retards or whatever you want, but it's a lot harder to look in to why they might have believe the things they believe.
No.1600315
>>1600128If the lolbert got in. He would make everything worse.
No.1600318
>>1600298because china good
No.1600328
>>1600322>[Bourgeois towel] calling other people [bourgeois towels]Go back to lemmy, cute little nerf-radical!
No.1600348
>>1600315people are politically illiterate and don't understand that. they don't evaluate policy. their brains just run an algorithm:
1. is things bad under current guy?
2. if yes, then vote for other guy, cuz he's DIFFERENT!!!
No.1600351
>>1600298>China doing neoliberalismAbsolute fucking state of ancaptards.
No.1600376
>>1600337>Keeps pretending that Milei has not sayed that he will break relations with ChinaThe man is a 100% US dog (dollarization and a zionist as the bingo checks). Would sell his sister to the american ambassador for the millions it needs to put Argentina on international market display
a carcass for the vultures, or a whore for the vicious but as many have pointed the destruction of the Argentinian bourg republic in favour of a more simpler authoritarian privativistic goverment is the smell that he gives.
<Blood for the blood marketsExclaim the Milei and JxC voters, while facing 125% inflation (+12.4% inflation in august ) and a devaluation (pressed by the IMF) by the centerleft coalition to president.
The endgame is the total privatization of the state (land, water, air, enterprises, function, etc).
No.1600381
So will Argentina be like Somalia or Russia in the 90s?
No.1600383
>>1600107It's a historically reactionary country. Of course they're retarded/
No.1600385
>>1600298except china is literally a 2nd USSR, and it's not like there will be a second gorbachev ruling china
No.1600390
>>1600381it will be like brazil in 1964
No.1600391
>>1600381actually it will be like argentina in 1976
No.1600393
You guys are fear mongering so hard over milei. It sounds like Democrats in usa talking about we need to vote for Biden to save democracy. If milei is some status quo neoliberal shill like is said here then nothing should change. It's not like he's some Hitler who is going to kill millions. At worst he will hurt economy some. Many other neoliberal leaders have came and gone in south america. Then things continue.
No.1600395
>>1600394Neo-liberalism is not a good ideology.
No.1600402
>>1600393>It's not like he's some Hitler who is going to kill millionsyou wanna bet? he definitely 200% is
No.1600407
>>1600390Not even close. Our dictatorship might have been sell outs but they still believed in state led national companies and a lot of our infraastructure was built by state hands.
This guy is an anarcho capitalist.
No.1600412
>>1600407yeah but literally everything that ever existed in brazil was privatized anyways
No.1600433
>>1600407The Brazilian military dictatorship had two factions: the Sorbonne Group (Castelo Branco, Geisel, Figueiredo) and the hardline (Costa e Silva, Médici). The former was more liberal and US-aligned, while the latter was more authoritarian and nationalist.
Geisel was the exception, his government was a mix of the political liberalism of the former and the economic nationalism of the latter. Obviously the US didn't like him and that's when they cut relations with the regime.
No.1600440
>>1600204Ah yes, Vargas, famously known for killing communists is a social-democrat to look for. Along with Dilma (an actual ex-Marxist partisan).
The state of this board.
No.1600443
>>1600440Most of social democrats love vargas because of his later government.
No.1600445
>>1600412Yeah but that was disproportionately in the post dictatorship era. From Collor, to FHC, to the sacred cow Lula, Dilma, Temer, Bolsomeme.
But anyways back to my original post: Will Argentina be more like 90s Russia or Somalia? This argentine lunatic wants their state to be thin like dental floss, privatize and enclose everything, and put their people at the mercy of international finance capital. I dont know how any sane argentine can vote for him.
I know argentina has the most think tanks than any other region of LATAM but I woulf like to believe commom sense and a healthy sense of danger would prevent this sort of thing despite propaganda.
No.1600446
>>1600204>>1600300 (checked)
I know this might upset some, but the fact that Allende offed himself with the AK that Castro personally gave him to literally convince him that militancy is the way to go there because there was no way socialism was gonna be a thing "democratically" (I mean Castro literally embodies that after all the times the US tried to off him) is just poetic irony at its finest and the greatest cosmic critique against social democracy.
Castro was one of the coolest mf's ever. No.1600455
>>1600440"Social-democrat" is probably a misnomer, but Vargas and Perón were definitely progressive leaders for their time.
And although Dilma was a communist guerrilla in the 80s she governed as a regular social-democrat, just a bit to the left of Lula (enough to be couped by the US).
No.1600458
>>1600394Why do they look so alike?
No.1600464
>>1600461Just say you wanna fuck pretty women ar bargain sale prices.
No.1600472
>>1600464No! The thought has never even occurred to me. I just really want to see…uhh… "Iguaza Falls". Okay?
No.1600482
>>1600472Funny. I hope you get sodomized
No.1600496
>>1600463we're so back
>>1600440vargas was also the reason as why the intentona comunista of 1935 failed, fuck vargas
No.1600500
>>1600461mah uygha
>>1600464Not sexpat, I will bag an argie wife.
No.1600503
>>1600496>vargas was also the reason as why the intentona comunista of 1935 failed, fuck vargasLmao no. Read about how butchered that attempt was. They couldnt even hold a barrack. Hell they couldnt even take a barrack. It was unorganized and doomed.
No.1600506
>>1600496Luís Carlos Prestes, the leader of the rebellion, supported Getúlio Vargas in the 1950 election.
I don't understand the Brazilian left's hatred of Vargas. Argentinian leftists worship Perón but Brazilian leftists shit on Vargas despite him being arguably more progressive than any other president (yes, even Lula).
No.1600512
>>1600506>>1600506Brazil's modern left was born from trade unions fighting against the old politicized working class left, that includes PTB, vargas, jango, trabalhismo, and brizola.
The wanted trade unions without ideologies.
No.1600523
>>1600503>It was unorganized and doomedfuck, hopefully we can make a 2nd intentona as soon as possible without the mistakes of the 1st one, I'll be part of it.
>>1600506vargas was literally anticommunist, unlike lula who is pro-communist.
No.1600527
>>1600496>intentona comunistalevante* comunista, "intentona" is a pejorative anti-communist label to describe the event
>fuck vargasele foi o melhor líder que o brasil já teve, com o lula em um segundo colocado distante
>>1600523>vargas was literally anticommuniststill better than any other brazilian presidential figure you can name
>unlike lula who is pro-communistlula is a social democrat who flirts with socialist rhetoric to defang the labor movement and get more votes
No.1600555
>>1600512It depends on the region. Gauchos love Vargas because he was born in Rio Grande do Sul, while paulistas hate him because he crushed the Constitutional Revolution.
No.1600556
>>1600527>intentona" is a pejorative anti-communist labeloh didn't know that, oops
>ele foi o melhor líder que o brasil já teveo cara literalmente tankou uma revolução(mesmo q desorganizada), imagine
(por um segundo) se tivesse dado certo a revolução, a gente ia ser uma outra URSS
>still better than any other brazilian presidential figure you can nameunironically Dilma
No.1600562
>>1600394Watched the interview, it has subtitles. Boring an "alarmist".
No.1600565
>>1600527>lula is a social democrat who flirts with socialist rhetoric to defang the labor movement and get more voteswe should probably be creating a vanguard alternative to PT, so people who are upset about the gobermend join the vanguard
No.1600577
>>1600565I think the Brazilian left is afraid of doing any opposition to PT after the 2013 protests got co-opted by the right and eventually lead to Bolsonaro's election.
No.1600580
>>1600556>imagine se tivesse dado certo a revolução, a gente ia ser uma outra URSSsó vamos ficar na imaginação mesmo pois além de desorganizada ela não tinha o apoio necessário de setores militares para dar certo, vargas até ofereceu colocar luís carlos prestes como líder das forças armadas em 1930 mas prestes escolheu continuar trabalhando dentro do partido comunista
mesmo esmagando o levante comunista em 35 ele ainda trouxe mais progresso que qualquer outra figura que esteve no poder
porém convenhamos que o padrão não é tão difícil de alcançar>unironically Dilma0
_____0 dorgas, not even once
No.1600688
>>1600628question:
Why does being a clown work in politics?
No.1600697
>>1600688 (me)
*political theater, but same same. It's broadcasting to everyone that you are wildly unqualified to actually do anything.
No.1600700
>>1600697Because retarded normies see how normal politicians are all malicious and corrupt and think 'haha that guy is funny and not an ivory tower elitist like those other politicians, he clearly has personality :')'
No.1600742
>>1600142The vice-president of Milei's party organized visits to former dictator Videla, was (and still is) linked with numerous pro-military groups and she is even the daughter of a Carapintada, which is the denomination for mutineers in the army.
Overall she's a fucking piece of absolute shit, same as this fucker named Milei. So yeah, he would establish a military dictatorship if that's what it would take to further his goals.
No.1600837
>>1600700Nailed it, everyone wants somebody they could "have a beer with" even though they wouldn't dare let their actual drinking buddies dog sit for them let alone take on actual responsibilities. I think that just not following the expected etiquette of politics alone is enough to make them seem charming. Who among us hasn't daydreamed of popping some stuffy monocles out of heads?
No.1600856
>>1600839Yeah, it is an exercise of the obvious distintion between "populism"/trumpists and ancaps/neofeudals(with a sprinkle of the artist formerly known as fascism).
No.1600879
>>1600688Yes. Look at Boris and Trump
No.1600880
>>1600107Why tf does he look like a leprechaun?
No.1600907
>>1600880You are getting desperate.
>>1600856Suddenly leftism has nothing to do with the sorry state of Latin America. It was all unabridged capitalism the Yankees could only dream about. kek
Also, a reminder that capitalists destroyed slavery and feudalism.
No.1600915
>>1600463deng beetles be like
the guy under whose term RCEP is signed, financial sector is liberalized more each year to make yuan compatible as a reserve currency, more and more free trade agreements are being signed, Hainan, an island roughly the size of Taiwan is being transformed into a world-class free-trade hub is literally Stalin… yeah RIGHT… do you dengbeetles even know what socialism is anymore ?
No.1600960
>>1600907Yeah, because Latin America was a paradise before the pink tide.
No.1600962
>>1600960It was mostly a feudal shithole which skipped capitalism straight to "scientific socialism". To it's own demise.
No.1600972
He is yet another Cuckservative
No.1600976
>>1600915>do you dengbeetles even know what socialism is anymore?i do, do you?
if you allocated this effort you put into analyzing a simple meme making fun of western headlines into reading history and political theory you wouldn't be a libertarian/ancap/whatever liberal garbage you are, faggot
No.1601003
>>1600455Who gives a fuck if they're progressive? If they are aren't communists than they are reactionary and stand in the way of proleretarian power!
No.1601059
>>1600962>>1600907Didn't you get enough spanking from last thread?
No.1601240
>>1601059Why did you make another one? Have something to hide?
No.1601450
>>1600962Latin America never had feudalism much less socialism (apart from Cuba) you fucking retard. Stop talking about shit you clearly don't know anything about.
No.1601478
>>1601003What an idiotic comment. Emperor Meiji and Kemal Ataturk weren't communists but you're a moron if you think they didn't advance history.
No.1601480
>>1601192>Mad Max Barter Town with Thunderdome characteristics?With the value of their peso they'd probably be better off.
No.1601523
>>1601450>Latin America never had feudalismThe Hacienda/plantation system is still in living memory though, you could say it was a pre feudal formation the Spanish brought over
No.1601533
>>1601523That was mercantilism.
No.1601537
>>1601533More like ancient Roman slavery if Mariategui is a reliable source
No.1601543
>>1601537There's a line to be drawn between slavery in Ancient Rome and the Atlantic slave trade as part of 16th century Europe's obsession with emulating the Romans, but it was still a very different system.
No.1601553
>>1600907>>1600962You realize Latin America was capitalist for most of its existence and the whole reason these socialist governments were elected in the first place is because of it being literally the most socially unequal region in the world (which directly correlates with the absurd levels of crime), right?
No.1601754
>>1601480>With the value of their pesoJoke's on you, one of his signature talking points is abandoning the Peso and adopting the USD
No.1601840
>>1601450Your cognitive dissonance will only get worse when I'll tell you that slavery in Latin America was even more atrocious than in the US _because_ - due to religious reasons - the slaves _could not_ be "privately owned" - they were more or less "communally" abused by everybody who felt like it.
Even a total caricature of private ownership like slavery (people cannot be owned as they already own themselves) was alleviating human conditions because an individual "owner" has an obvious incentive to preserve the "market value" of his "property". No such thing in non-market economy where everything is for grabs and wanton destruction is the law of the land.
No.1601841
>>1601553At most they had the "capitalism for the top 1%, socialism for the rest of you".
Leftists are "solving" the problem of inequality by dragging down the conditions of the privileged classes to the level of the general population - we acknowledge that every-fucking-one has the same rights that used to restricted to the members of some "aristocracy".
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KBKXu3Kg4yg No.1601845
>>1601840post reeks of burger exceptionalism
yes, slaves were also privately owned in latin america dipshit
No.1601854
>>1601845yawn
>Encomiendas devolved from their original Iberian form into a form of "communal" slavery. In the encomienda, the Spanish Crown granted a person a specified number of natives from a specific community but did not dictate which individuals in the community would have to provide their labour>There was no connection with land as part of the encomienda as there had been in medieval Spain, instead, in the colonies, encomienda was purely a legal arrangement, and the right could even be held by municipalities>On the ground, these voices could do little to prevent encomienda becoming, in many cases, a system of extreme forced labour indistinguishable from slavery with the exception that the labourers could not be sold. No.1601857
>>1601845>burger exceptionalismIf anything I am an anglophile you halfwit.
No.1601873
>>1601854>burger called out for being retarded>starts copy and pasting from glowiepedia to make it even more obviousyou dont know shit about latin america
No.1601881
>>1601873>glowiepediaYou are half-right here as wiki is known for being a "communally edited" leftist cesspool kek.
But two other citations aren't from wiki. Good luck with your further literacy exercises.
No.1601960
>>1601840>>1601854You only described the encomienda system, which technically wasn't slavery.
There was, however, enslavement of Africans in the pre-capitalist colonial model across the entire Americas, some places with more predominance than others. US style was indeed the harshest of all, followed by Brazil's, as both were profit-oriented with the enslaved being grinded down until expiration.
>people cannot be owned as they already own themselvesJust how dense are you fucking people? You don't own yourself,
you are yourself.
Simple as that.
No.1602484
>>1601841>Leftists are "solving" the problem of inequality by dragging down the conditions of the privileged classes literal neolib talking point, what a fucking moron
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