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/leftypol/ - Leftist Politically Incorrect

"The anons of the past have only shitposted on the Internets about the world, in various ways. The point, however, is to change it."
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 No.393452[Last 50 Posts]

I've never actually heard a solid, real argument against accelerationism. People just parrot that it's stupid and ultra and "doesn't work", but nobody provides any evidence whatsoever for their claims.

Historically, every major incident of working class uprising followed or occurred in tandem with a major capitalist crisis. WW1 resulted in a wave of socialist uprisings across Europe, mass unionization pushes in just about every civilized part of the planet, and a successful socialist revolution in Russia. WW2 resulted in the takeover of China by victorious communist forces, the mass decolonization of Africa, Asia, and Latin America, the socialist liberation of more or less the entirety of Eastern Europe, and unprecedented rates of unionization in the West.

By what possible fucking stretch of the imagination could someone seriously and genuinely argue that accelerating the contradictions of capitalism "doesn't work" to produce communist uprising? Historically, it is the fucking ONLY thing that works. If anything, milquetoast reformism and cautious labor activism have shown themselves to be complete failures to producing anything resembling a strong and effective communist movement.

Only the grinding, breaking gears of surplus value extraction can lead to the liberation of the masses. Anything else is a silly, liberal pipe dream.


I still don't get what most people here concretely mean by accelerationism. Is it advocating for the worsening of labor conditions under capitalism? Because that's just good old neoliberalism. Is it recognizing that only wars bring revolution in most cases? Even Stalin agreed on that. Is it advocating for a world war? If so, how is it any different than Posadism?


Literally all of those would be accelerationist propositions. Marx argued in favor of free trade because it would dramatically escalate the class war; as you pointed out, wars are the quickest and most reliable way to spark a revolution; and, while most accelerationists wouldn't support a world war because they don't want to get nuked, I think Posadism could safely be considered a subtype of accelerationism.


Retards, and only retards, meaning people who are very stupid and don’t know how to read, think that accelerationism is just having things be violent. What does acceleration mean? It means to speed through things from its current pace. People think a more violent society is more “accelerationist” which is incorrect. Society is more peaceful relatively than it was yesterday. Accelerationism just means accelerating through the contradictions and driving them to their conclusions. This is why reforms accelerate contradictions a lot more than not doing anything. Neoliberalism was a massive set back to socialism.


accelerationism sort of makes sense but you cannot use it as an excuse to ignore the building of an organized movement with a party at the head, and that's exactly what i tend to hear "left-accelerationists" do. many of the conditions that bring about revolution are accelerated by war or crisis, but organization itself takes long enough to build up that communists can be really caught with pants down. that happened in germany, hungary, italy, poland, and finland in the exact same crisis period that gave us the soviet union. if you want to go and try start a war, that's all very well. but you can't get to large operations without small ones. isolated clashes - skirmishes - guerrilla raids - mobile divisions - finally, entire armies march. this takes communist parties decades of brutally hard work in all cases.


Crisis could also lead to collapse, and entropically that's by far the favored reaction pathway.

Rightwing accelerationism is granted totally retarded, and you reach it by ignoring or not knowing that diminishing returns and negative feedback exist, and are in fact dominant in the physical world.


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>Accelerationist General
No. It's not 2014-2017 anymore; please move on.


Wrong. Accelerationism is caused by forcing capital to confront organizers labor. Unions are accelerationist, working class parties coordinating with unions is accelerationist.


Wow it's like exactly what I said in the beginning of my post. "It's stupid and doesn't work" without any evidence, and despite an overwhelming historical record that goes against the infantile "arguments" you're parroting form spineless cowards.


damn wow can we redefine everything that furthers our aims as "accelerationist"? is that what you're trying to say when you use that word?


Periods of peace, prosperity, and stability are BAD for communist mobilization. Communists cannot organize or agitate a complacent population.
That's why unionization rates were at rock bottom during the Roaring Twenties in the States. There was no reason to join a union or the Communist Party, because people were generally happy with life. The world NEEDED the Great Depression. It was a good thing.


Yep. Because the weaker capital becomes the stronger that means labor is. Labor isn’t strengthened by crisis, it is radicalized yes, but it’s not strengthened. Labor is strengthened by organization and fighting for stuff and winning.


Straight up retard.


Demonstrably false. Labor has historically won its greatest gains in periods of crisis. You're spouting things that aren't fucking true because you trust theory over reality.
You haven't engaged with a single point in the OP. You are shitting up this thread with your own masturbation, you are not interested in serious dialogue, and you need to get the fuck out of my thread.


And you’ve removed context of all the work before labor won victories. You think the working class movement took place in a vacuum because you’re not a Marxist and think like a Whig historian your lacking historical materialism ass. So much for your Marxist credentials buddy when you become a liberal and conveniently remove all historical context.


What is an easy introduction to the philosophy of acceleration that isn't drug addled petty bourgeois overly academic babbletalk?


I've removed no context. I never said communists shouldn't organize prior to crises, only that they should do everything in their power to accelerate those crises so they occur sooner.


“Trust theory over reality” I forgot to address this hilarious bullshit. You butcher history even harder when you say something like the May Day strikes just happened out of nowhere because of a crisis that’s magically made it happen. Ignoring all the organizing that came before, decades of organizing both in times of peace and crisis.


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>I've never actually heard a solid, real argument against accelerationism.
The argument was settled in 2017 by Vince Garton. 'Acceleration' is just a term used to describe the present state of capital. There's no such thing as 'L/ACC' or 'R/ACC'—'Acceleration' is unconditional, and because of this no coherent praxis can ever be attributed to it. It is explicitly anti-praxis. Socialist groups from the early 20th century implicitly understood this in their denouncements of the Great War. If you want a period example of what 'Accelerationist' praxis looked like, then look no further than the life of Italian Futurist painter / sculptor Umberto Boccioni. He gleefully enlisted into the Italian Army and was subsequently trampled to death after falling from his horse during a cavalry exercise.


And those crisis are accelerated by working class struggle. Period. End of discussion.


>step 1: install fascism
>step 2: ???
>step 3: communism
Accelerationism is retarded and so are you.


This is a hopium thread feebly pretending to be an accelerationism thread.
You're just going to attack anyone who disagrees with you without counterpoint, because you didn't make this thread to discuss accelerationism, but for some personal egotisical reason.
You also did the zoomer thing of pre-cushioning your ego by writing essentially "…and if anyone disagrees with me they're stupid".

Communism won't happen in your lifetime. Before the rate of profit falls to zero, they'll be a war in which you and your family will die, and everything will be destroyed restarting production and capital accumulation.


The working class should be organized prior to the crisis, but the crisis itself is provoked by destabilizing elements such as government repression, economic collapse, disease, war, etc. Worker organization is not accelerationism, it's just basic common sense.
Fascism is a reaction to communist uprising you fucking chump. Both communists and fascists should look forward to the collapse of the liberal capitalist order but, unlike fascists, communist only have to wait for one failure. Fascists have to wait for two.
Wrong. I made this thread because accelerationism is widely dismissed in leftist circles with absolutely no rational or empirical basis and this has only been proven to me even further with these idiotic, liberal, reformist responses.


I am going to delete this thread because it's filled with stupid people who don't want to have an honest conversation and just want to repeat things they've heard elsewhere by people even dumber than them.


>Historically, every major incident of working class uprising followed or occurred in tandem with a major capitalist crisis.

The difference here is that the Bolsheviks weren't like 'yeah we support the war because it'll make the proles more miserable lmao'


>widely dismissed in leftist circles with absolutely no rational or empirical basis
While I agree there are wild misconceptions of what 'Acceleration' actually means (especially in leftist circles), I've come to dismiss most of it because over a decade of vigorous debate in 'Post-CCRU' / Urbaomic circles on the topic has ultimately been unproductive.


Why are OPs not allowed to delete their own threads? Mods are retards for disabling that feature.


it's stupid and "doesn't work"
it's not ultra really, just extremely armchair/edgy child meme ideology



*Urbanomic; sorry you missed out on #CaveTwitter, OP. Those were interesting times.


on top of every other reason, accelerationism is moronic because it assumes that the left actually has the power to put their foot on the accelerator.

like yeah mate, i'm sure the government will privatize the NHS in one stroke provided the CPGB-ML and WSWS "demand" it.


the sweat on your brow belongs to the people


Also see >>393599 and >>393545 again.


and if you're not talking about political action, just vaguely worded ""support"", then what you have is not a political position: it's 100% cope. "no actually, the boot on my throat is a good thing, i support it" - unless you put the boot there yourself, you didn't do shit, stop stealing valour from neoliberals as a substitute for achievement.


Intentionally worsening social material conditions to accelerate the collapse is right wing.
You are right wing.


>trying to bring about communist revolution is right wing
Fuck you, socdem scum.


Climate change doesn't care for your bourgeoisie fantasies


File: 1626930752437.jpg (261 KB, 1540x576, dialectic.jpg)

>try to bring about revolution by the mechanism of killing everyone
>wtf no you can't criticize me, i TRIED!!


(not that you actually try, of course. you just take credit for shit those with actual power were going to do anyway. me? personally i want credit for the existence of Taiwan.)


you're not promoting a communist revolution, just plain reaction
you fucking retard


Climate change is just what the bourgeoisie call it so they can trade carbon credits.
It's actually broad-spectrum degradation of the entire biosphere, including but not limited to: ocean acidification, habitat and biodiversity loss, soil erosion, loss of aquifers, and a phosphorous crisis.


Reaction can only REACT to something you fucking morons. Communist uprising precedes fascist reaction, words mean things. Jesus christ is everyone on this board a fucking brainlet


communist uprising is one thing, critical support for thatcher declaring war on the trade unions because it will OBVIOUSLY lead to revolution and not a half-century of blackest reaction, however, is a perfect concoction of brainlet and cope.
do not ask for whom the dialectic advances, it advances for thee! well actually the opposite of that, but this is a written threat.


You misinterpret (probably deliberately) what accelerationists advocate. Not open and shameless support for neoliberalism, but rather calculated acts to advance (temporarily) the neoliberal agenda so as to escalate the class war.
This can include endorsing neoliberals over protectionists and isolationists in elections (Biden was the clear accelerationist candidate), organizing for increasing minimum wage workers' so as to speed up automation, and deliberately fanning the flames of international conflicts so as to provoke imperial squabbles. Socialists and communists who go on RT or visit countries hostile to Western imperialism do a great job of the latter.


>Not open and shameless support for neoliberalism, but rather calculated acts to advance (temporarily) the neoliberal agenda so as to escalate the class war.
I'm seeing double here, four Krustys!


>deliberately fanning the flames of international conflicts so as to provoke imperial squabbles
Ah yes, there is is.


I don't understand
This is the right move and you're an idiot if you think hot wars aren't good for the global communist cause.


Whatever happened to the ends justify the means? A crucial principle of Marxism and yet no one is willing to temporarily make the workers' lives harder to permanently make their lives better.
We should be willing to pay almost any price, up to and including global imperialist wars and the slaughter of tens of millions if it means a worldwide revolution ensues.


Jokes aside, even this vision is paltry because it's so vulnerable to ex-post-facto justification. Biden was the acceleration candidate because he wasn't a protectionist, but then if Trump had won then obviously he'd have been the acceleration candidate because he'd be likely to put more effort into stoking conflict with China. When the minimum wage goes up it advances automation, when the trade unions are destroyed it brings class conflict into the open.
You can of course stick rigidly to your own little vision where the dialectic would be further advanced if Gore had become president in 2000, but at that point you're working in a world independent of our own. You might as well just drop the edge and join the Labour campaign for wondering what would've happened if the 1951 election didn't happen.

>I don't understand
gotta watch more classic simpsons, it accelerates the dialectic.


the ends justify the means is a fine principle: the problem arises when there is zero demonstrable connection between the ends and the means.


Trump can, in some ways, be seen as accelerationist but ultimately Biden will do almost all of the bad things Trump did and he'll do it in a way that will much more rapidly accelerate the conditions of late stage imperialism. Biden will continue to escalate tensions with China WHILE allowing the US workers to get fucked over by free trade agreements. He'll do nothing on climate change WHILE still somehow fucking over workers in climate-hostile industries with token environmental gestures that actually do nothing (i.e., switching from coal to natural gas).
Anything that makes the workers' angrier at capitalists is a good thing. That's the means and it has a very clear connection to the end (worker uprising).


I like rose flag because he's actually engaging with my points rather than just quoting someone else or pretending I said something I didn't.
You should all be more like rose flag.


Imperialist proxy wars only serve capital.
Only a massive terror attack on american soil could be considered accelerationist.


'Accelerationists' don't advocate anything other than to acknowledge that capitalist contradictions are 'accelerating' at a seemingly exponential rate. The central (some would say bogus) thesis has always been that 'Capital' doesn't need a guiding hand! To insist that so-called 'Accelerationists' advocate anything else (as in, everything you just described) shows a complete ignorance of the debates that occurred on this topic in the previous decade.


I'm using accelerationist in the colloquial sense of "deliberately making the contradictions of capitalism." This may be a bastardization of what the word originally meant but it's what most people online understand it to mean and I've not found a better substitute word.
A massive terror attack on American soil would likely provoke an imperialist proxy war in the current geopolitical climate.


*contradictions of capitalism worse


You aren't discussing it in the colloquial sense; you are discussing it in the pejorative sense. It absolutely is a bastardization and shows you aren't actually serious about discussing the topic at hand.


Like, it's not 1905; anarchists aren't assassinating kings or bombing parliament buildings anymore. If you want potential arguments against your roundabout call for "Propaganda of the Deed" then just read Lenin's "What is to be Done?"


Plenty of people are in favor of exactly the thing I describe and call themselves accelerationist, so I don't see how it's pejorative


Well, plenty of people are fucking stupid. It's like a caricature of what other stupid people believe 'Accelerationism' is—which of course I mean in the pejorative sense of the word.


>worsening capitalist conditions = guaranteed class consciousness


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Accelerationism in this completely vulgar sense has literally nothing to do with the specific, philosophical school of thought that emerged out of the 90s centered around certain personalities like Nick Land with influences from Nietzsche, Deleuze & Guattari, etc. As many others in this thread have repeatedly stated, accelerationism is the simple recognition of the ongoing revolutions in the instruments of production under capitalism, independent of individual persons. You're right in your observation that revolutions do happen at the peak of capitalist fissures but not because singular actors can bring about these conditions (a type of voluntarist thinking) but because of the self-motions that Capital went through. Mark Fisher explained it best, "The Hegelian-Marxist motor of history is then transplanted into this pulsional nihilism: the idiotic autonomic Will no longer circulating idiotically on the spot, but upgraded into a drive, and guided by a quasi-teleological artificial intelligence attractor that draws terrestrial history over a series of intensive thresholds that have no eschatological point of consummation." If anything Land has repeatedly denied human agency by being the most virulent philosophical anti-humanist he could be, read Machinic Desire.

Choose some other word for this vulgarity


OP here. I have to admit I have been schooled by the philosophy readers.

Mods please delete thread.


Fuck you, don't kill the discussion


But there's not a discussion if I was the only person taking the opposing side


The OP is a trivial argument from ignorance fallacy. A position is true because it has not yet been proven false.
The defense files a motion to dismiss.


>observe the contradictions of capitalism and our lack of ability to respond to them
There is no possible political program in there. No wonder Land went to the Dork side


Then how come Karl Marx himself makes it clear that class struggle furthers contradictions?


Your particular accelerationism is really secular millenarianism (a cataclysmic arrival of a utopian epoch), and not grounded in the history of workers struggle.

>If we austerity workers hard enough they'll do a communism

Literally cargo cult communism.


>There is no possible political program in there.
That's literally what I've been trying to tell OP since they started this thread >>393599


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>If we austerity workers hard enough they'll do a communism
We learned that if you give workers welfare, they definitely won't do a communism. In fact, they will fight it hard.

Most of the opposition to accelerationism comes from residual pacifism, where people overemphasize the aspect of "greatest reduction of harm to greatest amount of people" in communism.


If workers are paid more, porky is forced to accelerate tech to increase profit. China industrializing África is accelerationism.
Merely fucking up the relations is not enough. We can live in misery and people will still defend capitalism tooth and nail. See any third world country or the US. The "cuckery" is insane.

Destabilizing American hegemony is acceleration. This makes markets more "free" and accelerates capitalism. Breaking up monopolies and other shit that stifles innovation is also acceleration. Idk, haven't read the thread yet. My opinion might change shortly.


>Biden was the clear accelerationist candidate
Could you expand? I think Trump was the clear acc candidate. Less wars. More class consciousness. Exposing the insanity of government and the undemocratic nature of """representative"""" """"democracy""""". Leftist orgs saw a huge rise in numbers.


How does making shit worse accelerate anything from a Marxist perspective?
>capitalist contradictions are 'accelerating' at a seemingly exponential rate. The central (some would say bogus) thesis has always been that 'Capital' doesn't need a guiding hand!
Could you expand why it's bogus? We are powerless. At best Americans can advocate to end blockades, wars and embargos.
>Mods please delete thread.
Fuck you. This is why users can't delete threads. This thread is good and no longer yours. We're all learning here, comrade.


>The Hegelian-Marxist motor of history is then transplanted into this pulsional nihilism: the idiotic autonomic Will no longer circulating idiotically on the spot, but upgrade
Quote is from here: https://markfisherreblog.tumblr.com/post/32522465887/terminator-vs-avatar-notes-on-accelerationism
Might read it later.

Nice thread. Illuminating.


Acceleration in the Land / Fisher sense to (roughly quote) Land is the "Intentional hastening of the process of capitalism turning all objects and relations into commodities"


has any accelerationist ever done anything to actually accelerate shit? or does it exist solely to argue on the internet?


Fun fact: There is not and there has never been a single accelarationist who knows how to repair a car. There is not and there has never been a single accelerationist who can program. There is not and there has never been a single accelerationist who has the knowledge to pass a test in physics or math that 12yo old pupils in France are expected to pass. Literally every accelerationist is a malding anglo/burger drug addict who shat his pants and got a heart attack when radlibs protested for BLM. Every single one. No exceptions. They are literally too stupid to read something like a fucking bar chart. They don't understand it. They are anti-communist NEET retards who fried their brains with drugs (and they didn't have good brains before that either). No exceptions.

If they "reply" to this, it will be just pissing, shitting, and farting. That's a fact. They will not address any of the points made here because they got no argument. They call people anti-intellectual when the very point made is that they are dumb as shit. They have no leg to stand on. Nick Land downloads hot-russian-woman-wants-to-date-you.jpg.exe every day. Fact.


The soviets were originally workers' organizations started by the Mensheviks to circumvent the Czarist ban on unions. They gradually radicalized over the course of WWI, and then in 1917 the power vacuum caused by the abdication of the Czar and the weakness of the Kerensky government and the bourgeoisie allowed them to seize factories and propel the Bolsheviks into power.

"Accelerating the contradictions" is unnecessary, since crisis under capitalism is inevitable. Actual praxis would involve identifying forms of organization that can radicalize and empower members during times of crisis, and identifying crises large enough to weaken the bourgeois order enough to take power. If the latter does not occur, then there is no opportunity for revolution and we'll all end up as liberals, which is the fate of most post-WWII communists.


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no. 'accelerationism' is picrel


Acceleration isn't something you do, it's something that happens. You can't advocate for a Acceleration or social engineer it. All you can do is point out when it's happen.


>>393563 You literally simplified the greatest movements of Left-wing history into ur points. The socialist that lead the revolutions immediately following WW1 were the same ones campaigning against the war . Ur falling into the same arguments we had a century ago you can not condemn millions of ppl to death as a win for labour


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Refute this


This is actually a pretty decent understanding of the concept.
You can always work to try to improve production processes, introduce new methods of production, and attack those who would try to exploit their positions of power to stagnantly leech off of society and instead drive things towards innovation and development.


It's a pure strawman that is believed by some number of retards circa 2016


"Accelerationists" can't even agree on what constitutes progress and how to measure when and how much progress has been made. Your U/ACC daddy turned into a sinoboo because capitalism is way too strong and simply refuses to die from its own contradictions.

Also accelerationism was already becoming lame and filled with retards in 2014, /leftypol/ and twitter were just the last nails in the coffin. I bet OP likes Zizek.


Some people have been claiming that Biden is better acceleration than Trump. We see now, like with Obama that he's getting away with more warcrimes, while nobody seems to give a shit, unlike when a Republicunt is in power.
Liberals are worse than fascists. They can stop any movements so effectively, it's scary.


On this particular subject, it doesn't seem like anyone gave a shit about Trump's war crimes while he was in office either. Remember all the media hubbub about his illegal air strikes in Syria or the assassination of those Iranian and Iraqi generals? Me neither.


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I'm not talking about bourgeois media, I'm talking about the people. There had been a big anti-war movement until Obama somehow made it fizzle out, while warmongering harder than Bush.


No one but the regular anti-war groups (which did criticize Obama) actually paid attention to Trump's war crimes.


>Could you expand why it's bogus? We are powerless. At best Americans can advocate to end blockades, wars and embargos.
It's just an attempt to give capitalists' (and their vulgar economists') fixations on the 'invisible hand' of the market a more 'inhuman' , 'alien' or 'foreign' (hint: non-white) character. If the British and American masses had the political will to end blockades, wars and embargos then we wouldn't have spent the past decade arguing over the apparently 'mystical' or 'occult' (self-)reproduction of capital. It's all predicated on the assumption that history is no longer in our hands, as if it's reaching an unintended apotheosis and we've just been swept away by the tide. There's a very interesting nihilism to it that, as unfortunately made evident by those who still identify as 'Accelerationists' after the Post-CCRU / Urbanomic / #CaveTwitter milieu's heyday from 2014-2017, gives way to a kind of fatalism rooted in nothing more than smug pretension. "Biden is Accelerationist! […] Trump is Accelerationist!"—who gives a fuck? Anything can be retroactively attributed to 'Acceleration'—which obviously isn't conducive to a coherent praxis. In fact, as I already said earlier, it's explicitly anti-praxis. It shouldn't come as a surprise the most interesting people that used to be associated with that milieu have more or less become Marxist-Leninists now. They took what Nick Land said to heart: "Neo-China arrives from the future."


>Historically, every major incident of working class uprising followed or occurred in tandem with a major capitalist crisis
You think contradictions of capitalism arising from unperturbed inadvertent preconditions and natural cycles is the same thing as some idiots trying to bring about something superficially appearing to be a contradiction of capitalism through accelerationist means?


>Acceleration is when things are bad
do not read facebook memes or nick land

read Marx's fragment on machines and Deleuze


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You were born at a pretty crappy time in history. And it looks like things are only gonna get worse from here on out. Only capital's neopositive attitude from here on out. Sims I speedrun on expert.

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Are you having a stroke?


>>I've never actually heard a solid, real argument against accelerationism.
2020 is your argument. Remember over a year ago we had lockdowns, stock market crashes and George Floyd protests. This board was celebrating it as the end times for capitalism. There was a sense of optimism that things would change for the better and a revolutionary moment might come. It was thought that capitalism could not make it out of this mess.

But it did. It built back better. Accelerationism didn't work in 2020.


Do the crack artificial intelligence spiels again.


Rock on junkie.


Amphetamines get to.


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landian accelerationism has nothing to do with whatever bs op is talking abt


so become a capitalist?


File: 1627244534344.png (2.65 MB, 1200x1150, hoxhabro.png)

accelerationism is idealist and infantile because it assumes there is a concrete amount of capitalist development that will inevitably led to a revolution all while ignoring the organization of the proletariat and how it can be affected by the same developments that in the mind of the accelerationists are supossed to cause the end of capital anyways OP is not even talking about accelerationism since "accelerating the contradictions of capitalism" is literally what all communist movements have done and is inherent to their nature to be "accelerating" elements since revolution is not even possible without them

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