Anonymous 2021-12-26 (Sun) 23:35:05 No. 662183
>>662177 why does it matter to you?
Anonymous 2021-12-26 (Sun) 23:36:33 No. 662184
I mean, 'legal' depends on what system of law you want to use, but by international standards no, it wasn't legal.
Anonymous 2021-12-26 (Sun) 23:37:23 No. 662185
>>662183 Бо я з України, а ти америкос вонючий
Anonymous 2021-12-26 (Sun) 23:38:38 No. 662186
>>662184 by international standards no, it wasn't legal.
Wasn't Crimea's 1954 annexation to Ukraine also illegal based on international standards too? (cold war)
Anonymous 2021-12-26 (Sun) 23:43:31 No. 662189
>>662186 Well that was a voluntary transfer between two states (or one state depending on how you look at it) so no I wouldn't say that was illegal by international standards.
Anonymous 2021-12-26 (Sun) 23:45:26 No. 662192
It wasn't legal but just.
Anonymous 2021-12-26 (Sun) 23:48:38 No. 662195
There was a referendum in Crimea that overwhelmingly went to the Russian side. Whether or not it was legal depends on whether that referendum was binding or not.
Anonymous 2021-12-26 (Sun) 23:58:43 No. 662205
>>662195 It's easy to argue that result is illegitimate though when force has already been used to conquer the territory and the conquerer is the one administering the referendum.
In international law it doesn't matter if the majority of the population of a region of one country wants to join another country, it's still not legal for the country to invade to enforce that.
Anonymous 2021-12-27 (Mon) 00:14:24 No. 662219
>>662177 What is more official and authentic is a question for idealists. We could engage in historical masturbation and say that it's all still Soviet territory because the dissolution of the USSR wasn't legal because it was enacted against a legally binding referendum.
You are wrong, the population in Crimea generally prefers to be part of the Russian federation. And the reason for that is Washington's color revolution in Ukraine. They handed state-power to ethnic-hate-type right-wingers, who scared the fuck out of the Crimeans, which included state officials publicly praising Hitler who wanted to genocide the ethnic group that makes up the majority of people living in Crimea.
Nazis tried to genocide Slavs, US backs neo-nazis 70yrs later, Slavs go back to Russia, US surprisedpicachuface It has to be appreciated how much situational ignorance on the part of the US was necessary to make the geo-strategical moves that handed Crimea to Putin. The criticism that befalls Putin is that he did not observe proper diplomatic form. Crimea should have formed a provisional government that declared it self independent before it could join the Russian federation.
I want to stress this one more time the US gave Crimea to Russia.
Anonymous 2021-12-27 (Mon) 00:29:12 No. 662236
>>662219 > >It has to be appreciated how much situational ignorance on the part of the US was necessary to make the geo-strategical moves that handed Crimea to Putin. The criticism that befalls Putin is that he did not observe proper diplomatic form. Crimea should have formed a provisional government that declared it self independent before it could join the Russian federation. It did, the Crimean independent government voted to join Russia in less than 24 hours.
Anonymous 2021-12-27 (Mon) 00:53:35 No. 662254
>leftypol supporting imperialism because russia was once communist
Anonymous 2021-12-27 (Mon) 03:10:56 No. 662365
>>662236 >It did, the Crimean independent government voted to join Russia in less than 24 hours. Oh i guess i missed that, yeah i'm feeling a little stupid now.
Anonymous 2021-12-27 (Mon) 03:20:28 No. 662371
>>662254 It is not imperialist action, the west's intervention into putting sanctions on Russia is far more imperialist than anything Russia did as the West has the full backing of NATO, UN, EU and other such institutions against Russia
>>662365 Your post was very smart comrade, so don't feel discouraged.
Anonymous 2021-12-27 (Mon) 06:16:47 No. 662529
>>662254 OP asked whether something was legal or not. As communists we don't recognize bourgeoise law. To rephrase, the question was whether the act was technically legal or not under bourgeoise law.
Legality is mostly consistent but when need be, the ruling class will not hesitate to do whatever the fuck it wants anyways. Liberalism rests on the idea that law is just, but when it comes to real life, the only thing that matters is that the idea remains, not the enforcement of the idea.
Anonymous 2021-12-27 (Mon) 08:22:50 No. 662615
>>662177 >Was Putin's annexation of Crimea legal? >>662185 >Бо я з України, а ти америкос вонючий You should take him to court anon.
Anonymous 2021-12-27 (Mon) 10:56:21 No. 662681
>>662185 Нам поебать, хохол гниломудый
Anonymous 2021-12-27 (Mon) 11:42:13 No. 662719
>>662219 > They handed state-power to ethnic-hate-type right-wingers, who scared the fuck out of the Crimeans, which included state officials publicly praising Hitler who wanted to genocide the ethnic group that makes up the majority of people living in Crimea. please less watching RT.com, more talking with actual Russians and Russian-speakers living in Ukraine
Anonymous 2021-12-27 (Mon) 13:02:24 No. 662769
>>662177 who the fuck cares. legality has 0 weight in international and geopolitical relations
right of people to dispose of themselves ? moron.
Anonymous 2021-12-27 (Mon) 13:04:01 No. 662770
>>662719 what is wrong in what he said ? didnt the fascist ukrainian ban the russian language ?
Anonymous 2021-12-27 (Mon) 13:05:43 No. 662771
>>662177 a legal system must have some legitimacy
yes it was once they voted for it
Anonymous 2021-12-27 (Mon) 13:09:45 No. 662774
>>662254 >because russia was once communist kys propaganda gobbling moron
we defend them cause nato is an aggressive imperialist org, that does threaten russia more and more and started the crisis, only in the US interest, that support a fascist governement there, and the ukrainian people got massively shafted in the process
also make the risk of an actual large scale war (mb even nuclear) a lot higher. Only a completely braindead retard lb or an imperialist fuck can support the war rethoric against russia for the ukrainian
Anonymous 2021-12-27 (Mon) 17:29:08 No. 663030
>>662771 >yes it was once they voted for it they didn't vote for shit moron, you can't just decide to separate from the country whenever you feel like it, the referendum has to be legitimate and approved by the government like it was in the UK, here all it was a pseudoreferendum bullshit with guys illegally on your territory holding AK-47 telling you how to vote
The big difference is crimea was given to ukraine in 1954 legally, goddamn, go read about it, there was an official procedure with documents and such, not some guys with weapons telling you how to vote
Anonymous 2021-12-27 (Mon) 19:02:48 No. 663124
>>663030 >they didn't vote for shit moron, you can't just decide To be fair, they could an they did.
People may not feel the need to ask a government for permission if said government is imposed by a foreign power.
You can't complain about not going through proper channels when you've overthrown a government, that's a little too much hypocrisy.
Military forces don't have that kind of power anymore, you saw what happened in Afghanistan all the military power the US had, and they still couldn't force their will on a population and they tried for 20 years. The Russian paramilitary forces in Crimea were peanuts in comparison, and they operated for how long ? a few weeks ? If you want to go with this argument you have to explain how they did it.
So you want to restore the Soviet Union from the 1950s ? That would mean restoring the Iron Curtain and a hole bunch of other stuff.
Did you really think that one through ?
Anonymous 2021-12-27 (Mon) 19:04:46 No. 663127
>is annexation legal
Anonymous 2021-12-27 (Mon) 19:15:33 No. 663135
>>662177 no it was not legal
yes it was pretty based
Anonymous 2021-12-27 (Mon) 19:37:15 No. 663160
>>663136 Shut the fuck up burger
Anonymous 2021-12-27 (Mon) 20:20:46 No. 663209
>>662770 >didnt the fascist ukrainian ban the russian language No? Where do you even get your news from?
Anonymous 2021-12-27 (Mon) 21:23:21 No. 663268
Fuck Putin
Anonymous 2021-12-27 (Mon) 21:24:48 No. 663269
>>663124 >To be fair, they could an they did. they couldn't, idiot. If anyone could decide to vote for anything just like that then tomorrow any country in the world would split into pieces because people from the hood would just decide on a referendum that they don't belong to this country any more, and the world would turn into a fucking mess.
then why the fuck was referendum on a FOREIGN TERRITORY imposed by Kremlin?
yeah, right, it's just a coincidence that a) russian military appeared in Crimea b) like a week or two later there was a referendum in Crimea. No power at all by the russian military.
Anonymous 2021-12-27 (Mon) 21:39:29 No. 663283
https://www.globaltimes.cn/page/202112/1243541.shtml >But the US is continuously escalating tensions in Eastern Ukraine. Since the beginning of this year, the US has sent strategic bombers, including B-52s and B-1Bs to approach areas such as Black Sea. In November, the US sent strategic bombers and conducted simulated nuclear strikes against Russia, and entered airspace 20 kilometers away from Russian border, in an obviously provocative move. In addition, Washington released information such as it would impose economic sanctions on Russia and deploy more troops in Eastern Europe to pile on maximum pressure. It is like throwing matches onto dry firewood from time to time, but avoiding the flames deliberately. To the US, the more tense the Ukraine situation becomes, the more European countries will depend on the US. Setting up a common enemy among NATO is conducive to uniting allies. Washington is the biggest beneficiary of this dangerous game. Anonymous 2021-12-27 (Mon) 21:46:09 No. 663287
True chads don't ask for permission
Anonymous 2021-12-27 (Mon) 22:17:32 No. 663322
People in Crimea speak Russian, not Ukrainian. They identify as Russian. Totally justified.
Anonymous 2021-12-28 (Tue) 01:12:34 No. 663504
>>663269 >If anyone could decide to vote for anything just like that then tomorrow any country in the world would split into pieces because people from the hood would just decide on a referendum that they don't belong to this country any more, and the world would turn into a fucking mess. Abstract idealism completely divorced from material context. Politics is not based on pure voluntarism and good manners. Thank god the reality doesn't need your seal of approval, otherwise my own nation and language would be genocided a century ago.
>then why the fuck was referendum on a FOREIGN TERRITORY imposed by Kremlin? Did you forget what the referendum was about in the first place? Hint: it was about a certain presupposition in your question. It turned the referendum into a founding act of the new legal order on that territory. And it's not the first time in history that an illegal referendum established new legality. Whole new countries have been established that way. I'll leave it up to you to think about why it be like that, but it's certainly not because God enunciated his magic and righteous words.
>it's just a coincidence that a) russian military appeared in Crimea b) like a week or two later there was a referendum in Crimea. No power at all by the russian military. Why should it have been a coincidence? Should the referendum fall from the sky, and should Kiev prevent the referendum from taking place in order for its result to be legitimated by the supreme power of some divine idiot on leftypol? Seems a bit absurd, no?
Anonymous 2021-12-28 (Tue) 02:34:33 No. 663581
>>662177 >Was Putin's annexation of Crimea legal? Crimea was Russia's, gave by a some sort of lend to Ukraine.
Lugansk and Donetsk (both forming the Dombas region) is supported by Russia, not annexed, because they (Russians/Russian ruling class) don't want their Russian-speaking ethnic groups being eradicateted. Russia is very celeous witht communities speaking Russian (see Osetia)
If Ukraine want to be ful retarded against Russians, that's what you get.
Anonymous 2021-12-28 (Tue) 02:35:44 No. 663583
>>662254 See:
>>663581 >implying any of this is imperialism Anonymous 2021-12-28 (Tue) 02:41:59 No. 663586
>>663136 Yep, /thread/
OP cares about "legal" but not about the legal status of the Russians that were threatened by the rightwing militias, and probably would got vote suppressed/re-educated in re-education camps.
Anonymous 2021-12-28 (Tue) 23:24:13 No. 664698
>>662254 Or supporting imperialism because it is antagonistic to western imperialism…
Anonymous 2021-12-30 (Thu) 14:17:37 No. 666811
>>663504 >And it's not the first time in history that an illegal referendum established new legality. Whole new countries have been established that way. I'll leave it up to you to think about why it be like that, but it's certainly not because God enunciated his magic and righteous words. …ok. And? It doesn't change anything. By this logic any country can go and attack any other country right now just because X years ago times were different. Where is that logic going to lead, genius? Crimea was given LEGALLY to Ukraine, but was taken from it ILLEGALLY, and by the way not by Soviet Union which doesn't even exist any more. What?
bruh you just admitted to yourself the whole russian propaganda bullshit. russia didn't take crimea legally, besides, it was a morally wrong thing to do, to annex land from a supposedly brotherly country. what the fuck are you even arguing for? that just because some bald dude in a lecture said it's the west's fault it's ok for russia to just go and invade/annex any territory it wants?
>>662219 >Nazis tried to genocide Slavs, US backs neo-nazis 70yrs later, Slavs go back to Russia, US surprisedpicachuface there are no nazis in Ukraine, idiot, go there and check yourself. It's a fake created by russian propaganda. Visit Ukraine and see for yourself, liar. Same as this bald pseudoscientist in the video talked about fascist elements at Maidan, there were none there, I've been to Maidan, fascism in Ukraine is a fairytale spread by kremlin bots, I grew up in Ukraine and me or anyone I know never witnessed any nazis or whatever bullshit you've been fed
Anonymous 2021-12-30 (Thu) 14:33:26 No. 666825
>>666811 What about all the memorials to Nazis in West Ukraine?
Anonymous 2021-12-30 (Thu) 14:59:09 No. 666847
>>666825 Just memorials to national heroes and god fearing patriots. Slava Ukraini
Anonymous 2021-12-30 (Thu) 15:45:47 No. 666886
>>666861 False flag created by russians
Anonymous 2021-12-30 (Thu) 16:06:45 No. 666901
>>666811 <there are no nazis in Ukraine, idiot, go there and check yourself. Tell it to comrade Texas
disingenuous cunt , then promptly picrel…
http://www.russelltexasbentley.com/ Anonymous 2021-12-30 (Thu) 16:07:32 No. 666903
>>666886 The reason we're not on 8chan anymore is because one of these dudes who clearly was a nazi shot up a mosque.
Anonymous 2021-12-30 (Thu) 21:56:08 No. 667284
>>662177 Dont care, fuck Kiev.
Anonymous 2021-12-30 (Thu) 22:43:56 No. 667335
>>662177 America hasn't invaded Russia yet and they have oil. I think that equals legal under the present world order. Ukraine is now Afghanistan; a training camp for desperate neo-nazis/terrorists. They won't last any longer than the foreign aid.
When you lose the election.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2019_Ukrainian_parliamentary_election But take over the police and military anyway.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Azov_Battalion 98 years old, the devil cannot live forever.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Henry_Kissinger The Awful Story of South America's Most Evil Dictator
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4mDoL3iAGLo Anonymous 2021-12-30 (Thu) 22:45:46 No. 667338
>>666811 >but was taken from it ILLEGALLY, and by the way not by Soviet Union which doesn't even exist any more. What?{Why anti-communists Ukrainians like you care about the legality of the USSR you people despise. You hate it so much but still, want Crimea back. and then what? suppress Russians, kill their voter rights, send them into re-education camps, assassinate dissident voices as you did in one of your own oblasts during the euromaidan?
No, fuck off. Russia will not allow being Armenia'd.
Why don't you important matters in your hand, like the massive emigration you have been suffering since the euromaidan, almost de-populating some areas of Ukraine?
>>666811 > russia didn't take crimea legally it did, it was a lend, just they can administer because the moron gorbashit was too sad for the ukrainians killed during the ww2 (he oposed Stalin using ukrainians as the shock front, but he was an idiot, who else but the first oblast invaded to counter the nazis).
>>666811 > it was a morally wrong thing to do It was a moral wrong what?
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2014_Odessa_clashes was this moraly right?
Do you know Crimea was just a response of these groups that were violently looking up for Russians just to kill them?
>>666811 >there are no nazis in Ukraine, idiot >Who's Stanislau >who's prrotozoo >what's azov battilion https://www.nbcnews.com/storyline/ukraine-crisis/analysis-u-s-cozies-kiev-government-including-far-right-n66061 the thing is so escandaleous, the liberals in D.C. screched about the U.S. government supporting the euromaidan being produced by nazis. There are pictures of John Kerry in the ukrainian congress with nazi flags hanging from the wall, are you this retarded or are you posing as ukrainian?
Anonymous 2022-01-03 (Mon) 16:30:06 No. 672222
>>667338 >Why don't you important matters in your hand, like the massive emigration you have been suffering since the euromaidan, almost de-populating some areas of Ukraine? The migration situation is exactly the same as in any developing country. Like polish or balts go to germany/england. There is no catastrophe. I live in Kyiv and its fine. And finally, russia will return Crimea to Ukraine without any shot and will pay reparations.
Now in Ukraine live about 42-43 million people. The main reason of population reduction is a large number of old people. Now the number of population is stable.
Only with Ukraine crimea has a future.
>>667338 >it did, it was a lend, just they can administer because the moron gorbashit was too sad for the ukrainians killed during the ww2 (he oposed Stalin using ukrainians as the shock front, but he was an idiot, who else but the first oblast invaded to counter the nazis). No, it wasn't legal. If you don't want to be part of Ukraine: suitcase, station, russia! Crimea is subsidy region, so it was not Kyiv who robbing. All processes you wrote are participated in continental Ukraine too. But now we have decentralisation, road bilding … Minimal wage now is higher then in russia. Economic growth despite the eighth years of the war. All thanks to NATO. God bless America. If you think in Russia it's any better you're a naive dumb fuck, russia for all its oil and gas money has done nothing for its citizens, same 3rd world country it always was
Anonymous 2022-01-03 (Mon) 17:29:02 No. 672312
Dont know if it was legal but it sure as hell was based
Anonymous 2022-01-03 (Mon) 19:56:24 No. 672464
>>662219 Why don't you cut it short by just saying that "Tehy ar blynching black plepeple in US too.?#"
Anonymous 2022-01-03 (Mon) 20:37:52 No. 672506
>>672222 >And finally, russia will return Crimea to Ukraine without any shot and will pay reparations that sounds like pure wishful thinking, I see no way that ever happens
what ? why ? a russian speaking population being prevented from government job was their best future ?
that seem doubtful, given your government is begging russia to export more oil through the ukrainian pipeline and most of the trade was with russia. even with USA giving free shit, given the amount of corruption, I somehow doubt things have improved for the average ukrainian.
right, I guess causing a civil war was worth it…
and ukraine did ?
Anonymous 2022-01-03 (Mon) 20:48:55 No. 672539
>>672506 >and ukraine did ? At least we have no lazy russian alcoholics. All russians are alcoholics that do nothing and achieve nothing. Ukrainians are hard-working people that till their land and earn their bread, only for it to be redistributed to lazy russians in the USSR.
Anonymous 2022-01-03 (Mon) 20:49:51 No. 672543
>>672539 >Ukrainians are hard-working people that till their land and earn their bread Lmao
Anonymous 2022-01-04 (Tue) 23:47:42 No. 674155
>>672539 The exact opposite is true.
After Euromaidan birthrates collapsed and there were far more refugees, many intermarrying with Poles, and used as cheap slave labor and cheap women. Your porky president who sold his chocolate company to a Rothschild investment banking firm was a total failure and cocksleeve. Some "nationalist" you are.
As far as "much morality muh laws" you literally banned the Communist party and the Party of Regions after Euromaidan, nothing even remotely "democratic" if you are going to pull that spooks shit.
Anonymous 2022-01-09 (Sun) 18:28:13 No. 683603
if the people in power decide we can't dispose of them, then it is illegal to dispose of them
Anonymous 2022-01-09 (Sun) 18:33:22 No. 683609
>>683576 Ukraininas are not a nation anon.
Anonymous 2022-01-09 (Sun) 18:45:40 No. 683626
The referendum wasn't legit and was done at the barrel of a gun. BUT if it had been legit chances are that they would have voted for Union with Russia.
Unique IPs: 50