Anonymous 2022-01-01 (Sat) 00:07:08 No. 668598
>>668594 marxist-lenist-maoist-dengist-zieminist-jiangist-xist thought
Anonymous 2022-01-01 (Sat) 00:08:35 No. 668600
>>668598 >zieminist-jiangist it's just jiangist, jiang is his family name zemin is his given name. Also you forgot hu.
Anonymous 2022-01-01 (Sat) 00:09:41 No. 668604
People still defending China are the biggest fools around.
Anonymous 2022-01-01 (Sat) 00:11:47 No. 668608
>>668600 marxist leninist-stalinist-maoist-dengist-jiangist-jintaoist-xist thought with market socialist characteristics
Anonymous 2022-01-01 (Sat) 00:12:58 No. 668612
>>668608 >jintaoist It's huist, Hu is his family name.
Anonymous 2022-01-01 (Sat) 00:14:35 No. 668617
>>668612 marxist leninist-stalinist-maoist-dengist-jiangist-huist-xist thought with market socialist characteristics
Anonymous 2022-01-01 (Sat) 00:14:45 No. 668618
>>668604 Read this
>>668609 and tell me if you still are conviced China isn't socialist and explain why
Anonymous 2022-01-01 (Sat) 00:15:34 No. 668620
>>668618 trying to convince lenin hat is socialist
mate, thats impossible
Anonymous 2022-01-01 (Sat) 00:15:57 No. 668623
>>668620 fuck what i meant to say is
trying to convince lenin hat china is socialist
mate, thats impossible
Anonymous 2022-01-01 (Sat) 00:15:58 No. 668624
>>668608 >market socialist characteristics Socialist market economy =/= market socialism
Chinese market socialism is seen as a temporary arrangement, market socialists see markets as a end in themselves
Anonymous 2022-01-01 (Sat) 00:16:27 No. 668625
>>668624 marxist leninist-stalinist-maoist-dengist-jiangist-huist-xist thought with temporary market socialist characteristics
Anonymous 2022-01-01 (Sat) 00:17:08 No. 668628
>>668623 Allah willing, lenin hat will be in jail or dead by end of the year so we won't have to deal with him for much longer.
Anonymous 2022-01-01 (Sat) 00:20:27 No. 668640
>>668618 China is a capitalist state; it represents what would've happened to the USSR had the Bukharinites got the upper hand in the 1920s-1930s. Thankfully those cretins were defeated and socialism remained in place in the USSR for much longer than it would have otherwise.
China has not been socialist for a long time.
https://espressostalinist.files.wordpress.com/2010/12/battle-for-chinas-past.pdf Anonymous 2022-01-01 (Sat) 00:22:13 No. 668646
CHAIRMAN XI PLEASE SEND THE GUNDAMS ALREADY AND LIBERATE AMERICA
Anonymous 2022-01-01 (Sat) 00:32:29 No. 668665
>>668659 The day when China vaporizes sleeping F-22 pilots and ground crew in their dormitories is not far off, but it is not next year.
Anonymous 2022-01-01 (Sat) 00:33:24 No. 668667
>Ham-fisted revisionist "New Years" thread W O W ! O W !
Anonymous 2022-01-01 (Sat) 00:37:47 No. 668677
>>668667 I'm not even mad, I wish every Communist no matter their "creed" to succeed in their revolutionary endeavor. Have a good night comrade :)
Anonymous 2022-01-01 (Sat) 00:44:23 No. 668683
>>668667 THIS IS DENGIST CENTRAL
Anonymous 2022-01-01 (Sat) 00:50:39 No. 668693
>>668659 >DAILY REMINDER THAT SOCIALISM RESULTED IN THE GREATEST REDUCTION OF POVERTY IN ALL OF HUMAN HISTORY State-monopoly capitalism*
Anonymous 2022-01-01 (Sat) 00:54:46 No. 668698
>>668693 thanks for proving that capitalism can solve the problems of humanity, porky aproves of crusade in his name.
Anonymous 2022-01-01 (Sat) 00:57:59 No. 668705
based based
Anonymous 2022-01-01 (Sat) 01:05:09 No. 668719
>>668708 okay bookcase, but remember that giving China's feats to capitalism is what Neoliberals have been doing to credit themselves, saying commies hate the global poor because look, the poverty in the world is lowering, when reminded that porverty has only been lowered on China since the 80's they call China capitalist, and people like you help them.
Anonymous 2022-01-01 (Sat) 01:06:49 No. 668722
New Year playlist up on cytube, watching
all gas no brakes the rebrand "Channel Five" rn
https://tv.leftypol.org/r/HappeningsviaKlash Anonymous 2022-01-01 (Sat) 01:12:15 No. 668730
>>668719 I am not saying outright "bourgeois capitalism" I am saying state-monopoly capitalism. This is an inarguable fact and we'd be better not to ignore it to take refuge in aesthetic appeals and mass media spectacle. At the end of the day you have to carry out work more a kin to Mao Zedong than Xi Jinping to counter the trend of AUKUS/NATO encirclement of north/northeast Asia and spread the revolution to your home turf either way. In light of this the senseless praying to Chinese capitalists rather than doing mass-oriented, revolutionary proletarian work
hard work is extremely cringe-inducing and a distraction at best and counter-revolutionary at worst.
Anonymous 2022-01-01 (Sat) 01:16:37 No. 668740
>>668730 >In light of this the senseless praying to Chinese capitalists rather than doing mass-oriented, revolutionary proletarian work hard work is extremely cringe-inducing and a distraction at best and counter-revolutionary at worst. Promoting activities that undermine the authority of the CPC is counter-revolutionary.
Anonymous 2022-01-01 (Sat) 01:18:06 No. 668745
>>668719 Those who call China capitalist are also denying Lenin's theory of imperialism and are in fact embracing Kautsky's theory of ultra-imperialism.
Anonymous 2022-01-01 (Sat) 01:20:39 No. 668747
>>668740 No, they are simply in line with material reality.
China is thoroughly integrated into the imperialist world-system and the CPC has been captured by a counter-revolutionary clique of bureaucratic monopoly-capitalists, diverging it from its role as a leader in world proletarian revolution under chairman Mao.
Take off the CGTN glasses.
Anonymous 2022-01-01 (Sat) 01:23:34 No. 668749
>>668747 Your information is 10 years out of date. Read up on China's efforts to build domestic semiconductor manufacturing and it's renewed nuclear weapons program.
Anonymous 2022-01-01 (Sat) 01:25:34 No. 668753
>>668745 Blatant lie, revisionist China corresponds to Lenin's description of imperialism, they are exporting capital to the third world, monopolizing utilities and the bourgeoisie has long ago infiltrated the CPC. Markets are in command, planning has been sidelined and they are still continuously liberalizing areas (latest: Shanghai, from just some months ago).
Deng/Xi cultists are Bukharinites and reject Lenin. Anonymous 2022-01-01 (Sat) 01:28:23 No. 668756
>>668753 Chill out Kautsky, capitalism cannot raise 800 million people out of poverty, only socialism can do that.
Anonymous 2022-01-01 (Sat) 01:28:26 No. 668757
>>668747 >China is thoroughly integrated into the imperialist world-system which is why a lot of the west is currently engaging in a cold war with china as if china is the enemy
which is why a lot of existing communist or socialist parties that take over seek closer ties with china.
Anonymous 2022-01-01 (Sat) 01:29:26 No. 668758
>happy new year thread turns into another china-related shitflinging
Anonymous 2022-01-01 (Sat) 01:31:02 No. 668759
>>668758 there really needs to be a seperate board called dengpol
Anonymous 2022-01-01 (Sat) 01:32:35 No. 668761
>>668759 Would that be a pro-China or anti-China board?
Anonymous 2022-01-01 (Sat) 01:33:45 No. 668764
>>668756 capitalism raised billions of people out of poverty you brainlet, Marx even praise the bourgeoisie for being the unprecedented best force at developing the productive forces in the manifesto
Anonymous 2022-01-01 (Sat) 01:36:37 No. 668770
>>668767 Relegating pro-China opinions to a second board would be discriminatory and needlessly sectarian. Pro-China discussion should stay on leftypol.
>>668764 Yes, that was in 1848. Was that still true in 1900 or 1950? What about today?
Anonymous 2022-01-01 (Sat) 01:40:45 No. 668774
>>668759 How about we make two pol boards, one for the center and one for the periphery? In the center board you can have a safe space for abstract ideals, while in the periphery board we can discuss material reality?
Anonymous 2022-01-01 (Sat) 01:41:07 No. 668775
>>668753 If you think socialism has been established in China you are not only rejecting Lenin but also Marx.
Kautsky has way more in common with the revisionist cliques than you seem to realize.
State-monopoly capitalism. >>668757 >which is why a lot of the west is currently engaging in a cold war with china as if china is the enemy And as long as they keep to their liberalized market "socialist" WEP path (which Xi is hellbent on) this problem will not be resolved domestically in China, leaving the ball in our court outside the borders of China. Glad we see eye-to-eye on this reality.
>>668764 >Inb4 you get called an ultra by these cretins for actually reading Marx and not some capitalist roader simpleton. >>668770 >Yes, that was in 1848. Was that still true in 1900 or 1950? What about today? aaand we reached the point where they just concede to being blatantly ignorant to the capitalist system.
Yes, still to this day. That is why people have been specifying STATE-MONOPOLY capitalism since the fucking start in their critiques in this very thread.
Now go ahead and cite what socialism is as described by Lenin and Marx.
Anonymous 2022-01-01 (Sat) 01:46:31 No. 668779
>>668775 except the point is if China was indeed thoroughly integrated into the imperialist world-system then this problem of a cold war would not happen
but instead the capitalist powers are against china because china poses a threat to the imperialist system profit making ability to the point the west views china as a threat.
In other words even if we follow this logic that china integerated into the system paradoxically china is also causing the system to tear itself apart by causing the western imperialist powers to fight china into completely different spheres of influence.
Anonymous 2022-01-01 (Sat) 01:49:27 No. 668783
>>668772 This is a speech by David Harvey not Deng. Harvey was not quoting Deng.
>>668775 Socialism has never existed in China, not during Mao, not under Deng. Only a transition economy towards socialism has existed. It has always been, in your words, state monopoly capitalism.
>>668774 No, the user numbers (material reality) does not justify further splitting of discussion.
Anonymous 2022-01-01 (Sat) 01:52:41 No. 668787
>>668781 <comparing the german empire to china :l
:l
and inb4 but wouldnt that imply china, is imperialist since you are saying china wants to make a new imperialist order
mate what imperialist goal does china have
Anonymous 2022-01-01 (Sat) 01:54:40 No. 668789
Rightist China simps be like: 🎇🐉🚩PEACEFUL COEX- COLLABORATION WITH THE CIA🚩🐉🎇
Anonymous 2022-01-01 (Sat) 02:02:04 No. 668792
>>668787 >and inb4 but wouldnt that imply china, is imperialist since you are saying china wants to make a new imperialist order No im saying that a high degree of economic integration does not prevent Great Powers from getting into major confrontations. If anything, the massive volume of US-Chinese trade is the main reason why no hostilities have broken out between the two thus far. The fact is that China *is* integrated into the imperialist world system, and you only need to look at the sheer extent of their trade to see this.
Anonymous 2022-01-01 (Sat) 02:18:03 No. 668807
>>668792 >The fact is that China *is* integrated into the imperialist world system, yeah i was kinda concerned about you saying this let me explain my position
i recognize that china is integrated economically alot into the imperialist world system but what i meant is that in terms of politics its not. While china is a deep core of the world economic system, it doesnt seek to keep its designated role in the system. Instead its more ambitious than that and wants to dismantle the system or rather change it a lot to something more fitting in its interests. As a result, this is why we see projects like the chinese belt and road, why because they challenge and replace the already prexisting global order. And unlike the preexisting order i dont really consider the belt and road system to be imperialist
yes but my rebuttal is that in the case of things like wilhelm, the main reason that caused germany to go to war in ww1 was because it wanted to destroy and replace the preexisting global order. Aka it wasnt complacenet its role but rather wanted to change the system to something else
Anonymous 2022-01-01 (Sat) 03:21:18 No. 668877
New Year playlist up on the cytube. Come add anything and chat
https://tv.leftypol.org/r/HappeningsviaKlash Anonymous 2022-01-01 (Sat) 03:26:06 No. 668883
>>668877 Bumping because this stream looks interesting
Anonymous 2022-01-01 (Sat) 03:26:57 No. 668885
>>668594 Blessed thread and death to america of course. The ultimate anti-imperialist position is to support Chinese hegemony even if you are revisionist piece of shit who thinks China not real communism.
Anonymous 2022-01-01 (Sat) 03:39:24 No. 668901
>>668807 >i recognize that china is integrated economically alot into the imperialist world system but what i meant is that in terms of politics its not I'd agree for the most part, but their economic integration limits the extent to which they can diverge from it politically. Honestly their divergence only seems so great because basically the rest of the world is essentially in lockstep with the Washington-Brussels Axis. The extent of their opposition is atm far more limited and tame than the USSR during the Cold War.
>And unlike the preexisting order i dont really consider the belt and road system to be imperialist For the moment that seems to be the case, but it all depends on how China handles its emerging contradictions between labour and capital. As the rate of profit falls and China's markets become saturated, the CPC will have to choose between maintaining the current economic model or overturning it in favour of a planned economy. If they do the former then they will be compelled to squeeze their third world partners ever harder.
Anonymous 2022-01-01 (Sat) 04:03:12 No. 668942
>>668901 >The extent of their opposition is atm far more limited and tame than the USSR during the Cold War. true but give it time. The us and the west foolishly decided to escalate the second cold war, and it doesnt seem to be stopping. Hell with trump coming to power probably at 2024, the escelation is going to reach an all time high.
the west foriegn policy is pretty much forcing china to have no choice but to escalate in return.
well i guess we have to wait and see since im unsure about that too
Anonymous 2022-01-01 (Sat) 04:18:19 No. 668967
>>668885 I do support China, I'll take them over burgerville. However they are the revisionists.
Anonymous 2022-01-01 (Sat) 04:20:11 No. 668970
>>668967 >orthodox xi jinping thought for a new era >revisionism You get to pick only one.
Anonymous 2022-01-01 (Sat) 11:11:25 No. 669165
>>668970 Correct, because they're one and the same
Anonymous 2022-01-01 (Sat) 12:31:26 No. 669193
>>669165 Revisionism has to attack classics and exclude them in one way or another - that's why it's REVISIONISM. It comes this way organically and historically - there's progress, and there's reaction to it, and leftist reaction to progressive communist movement is called revisionism, they try to deny that progressive movement is progressive, communist and should be followed by everyone. Trot/revisionist theories are centered around denying that USSR was communist during Stalin or that China is socialist today. All their theories do is trying to prove just that, they don't have anything except that.
There's Stalin, and then there's people who don't like him. Hence both Trotsky and Khruschev are the same kind of revisionists. Hell, Khruschev was trotskyist at some point officially, and Khruschev let out of gulags all the trots who were put there during Stalin.
Xi follows 2 less relevant rulers and Deng, Deng followed Mao, Mao followed Stalin.
Anonymous 2022-01-01 (Sat) 12:38:13 No. 669197
>>669193 That's only a part of it.
There's ultra right and ultraleft deviations.
Dengism (and its appendages) represent a right wing deviation, whereas leftcom Gonzaloids and Trots represent a left wing deviation.
Anonymous 2022-01-01 (Sat) 14:43:02 No. 669278
>>669270 >because it allowed for the reintroduction of capital accumulation and wage labour. Wowie good thing the Chinese worker has excellent conditions and there are no billionaires accumulating capital in China, right?
And all I'm doing is honoring the greatest hero of my nation, the leader of the free world and greatest statesman of the 20th century.
Anonymous 2022-01-01 (Sat) 14:44:45 No. 669279
>>669278 They are both revisionist states. A planned economy is necessary for socialism and market mechanisms will lead to an eventual drowning of socialism and simultaneous emergence of a new capitalist class.
Anonymous 2022-01-01 (Sat) 14:45:55 No. 669281
Isn't Chinese new year in like two months?
Anonymous 2022-01-01 (Sat) 14:47:04 No. 669283
>>669279 It only happened in Yugoslavia upon its collapse, while it's currently happening in China under the rule of the CPC.
>socialism is when soviet style central planning So Venezuela and every other country other than Cuba aren't socialist.
Anonymous 2022-01-01 (Sat) 14:57:59 No. 669296
>>668604 China? Don’t you mean Zionist occupied east Asia?
Anonymous 2022-01-01 (Sat) 15:18:21 No. 669317
>>669283 >It only happened in Yugoslavia upon its collapse Wealth disparity between different managers, firms, and regions started to occur from the beginning, it is a basic law of market accumulation and will occur in any market economy. later on wealthy firms and managers began to employ impoverished and unemployed workers that lost out in the game of capital accumulation to work under wage labour. The lack of state controlled enterprise meant that high taxes needed to be collected in order to fund state projects and social programs but instead yugoslavia just printed money and took out foreign loans, accumulating a massive debt from the IMF that of course demanded even further capitalist reforms. Yugoslavia was doomed when it refused a planned economy. China is no better and the fact they have outlived yougoslavia does not mean they are more socialist or were more correct in their line as an ostensible communist party.
>So Venezuela and every other country other than Cuba aren't socialist. Whether markets disqualify a country from being "socialist" semantically, no countries including Cuba are currently pursuing a socialist line of development or pursuing communism as a realistic goal i the foreseeable future. The one exception may be the DPRK but I'm not sure how they are going now and I've heard of them instating capitalist reforms in recent years.
Anonymous 2022-01-01 (Sat) 19:02:00 No. 669538
>>669537 Lmao, look at that expression of disappointment.
Anonymous 2022-01-02 (Sun) 04:04:07 No. 670098
>>669283 If you don't think Venezuela is socdem you are a blatantly illiterate newfag my guy.
Anonymous 2022-01-03 (Mon) 10:29:24 No. 671849
>>668640 what no theory does to a mf
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