Kazakhstan 6.0: A Happening With Belief Characteristics Anonymous 2022-01-09 (Sun) 00:08:05 No. 682439 [Last 50 Posts]
Come what may,
Glow or nay,
Who is to say,
Outbound Turanic Juche?
Please do view the statements by various parties on the subject. Infirmation is sparse but things aren't as clear cut as some present them to be.
Previous Threads:
>>>/leftypol_archive/489758 >>>/leftypol_archive/490907 >>>/leftypol_archive/491424 >>677933 >>680083 Anonymous 2022-01-09 (Sun) 00:13:58 No. 682449
Request for a mod to edit the op post to include full archived threads and links to various official statements by different organizations, groups and personalities.
Anonymous 2022-01-09 (Sun) 00:32:09 No. 682460
>>682455 I wish them the best. I think they have bigger problems than what randos on twitter think of them.
Anonymous 2022-01-09 (Sun) 00:49:07 No. 682477
Well, someone has some news
Anonymous 2022-01-09 (Sun) 00:59:03 No. 682483
>>682480 anti-vaxxers are so retarded holy shit
Anonymous 2022-01-09 (Sun) 01:05:56 No. 682489
>>682480 >>682485 Holy shit, I just remembered this theory.
PRESS B TO BELIEEEVE
Anonymous 2022-01-09 (Sun) 01:07:25 No. 682491
>>682489 Yet another reason why the thread theme is "happening with belief characteristics."
Anonymous 2022-01-09 (Sun) 01:09:34 No. 682492
>>682489 One note to everyone is that should be careful to keep themselves in a "wanting to believe state".
Anything more might result in a full blown premature belief all over the place, which nobody wants nor needs.
Anonymous 2022-01-09 (Sun) 01:47:51 No. 682524
Chin
Anonymous 2022-01-09 (Sun) 02:02:03 No. 682531
>>682530 Yes his video is very good saw it too. Great explanation
🍀 Shay 🍀 2022-01-09 (Sun) 02:02:27 No. 682532
>>682493 There's a flag if you want to use it :)
Anonymous 2022-01-09 (Sun) 02:03:42 No. 682533
>>682528 >still no clue what's going on don't worry about it. for now just vehemently denounce anyone who has a different take than you as a traitor and it will get sorted later.
Anonymous 2022-01-09 (Sun) 02:12:26 No. 682537
Chona?
Anonymous 2022-01-09 (Sun) 02:20:14 No. 682542
I'm a little dissapointed that no one paid any attention to the interview of Red Yurt (One of the communist groups operating in Kazakhstan) that I posted in the last thread. It gives a good background to understanding the situation even though it was conducted last year.
>>681859 >>681864 Sage !61KGLATVW. 2022-01-09 (Sun) 02:21:47 No. 682543
>>682484 It’s already a nato fucking friendly regime didnt you read the other thread?
Anonymous 2022-01-09 (Sun) 02:39:55 No. 682556
>>682543 Not really "NATO-friendly" given the region and their founding membership in CSTO, but they're compradors for Western porky and try to have good relations with everybody. So this is indeed NOT a color revolution. The most that foreign forces could achieve here is just a new face for the same politics to keep the status quo. But that will sorts itself out without foreign interference because the left doesn't seem to be that strong yet - for now. The protests could still be beneficial for leftist parties down the line.
Anonymous 2022-01-09 (Sun) 02:40:29 No. 682558
I fucking knew it. This disinformation bullshit about Hunter Biden color revolution is going to get thousands of like in tens of thousands watch. This is a Claremont institute fellow (paleconservseive American think tank who worships Trump) his last thread is already at 16000 retweets mentioning how Russian Christians fear that Kazakhstan Muslims will genocide them
These are the people shaping conversations. He writes a long thread so people think it's factual and informative
https://twitter.com/ClintEhrlich/status/1479927694674612230?s=20 https://twitter.com/ClintEhrlich/status/1479517836708040711?s=20 https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Claremont_Institute This guy had like 2000 Twitter followers 2 days ago. They'll have him up in the 30k in no time as a new right wing populist influencer
Anonymous 2022-01-09 (Sun) 02:44:19 No. 682563
>>682558 "Russia is just protecting the Christian Russian minority bros trust me! Let your Christian nationalism out and let's be passionate about it"
That's their plan
Anonymous 2022-01-09 (Sun) 02:47:42 No. 682566
Hopefully russia helps put down the socdem libtard protestors and reinstate law and order for their (and China's) trading partner.
Anonymous 2022-01-09 (Sun) 02:49:58 No. 682571
Zhonguo
Anonymous 2022-01-09 (Sun) 02:50:19 No. 682572
>>682566 Don't leave, we need more realist views here.
Buenaventura 2022-01-09 (Sun) 02:58:01 No. 682590
>>682558 Islamic juche soon inshallah
Anonymous 2022-01-09 (Sun) 03:02:05 No. 682602
>>682573 OP for 5.0 and 6.0 here. The archived old threads are posted but the links to official statements are not.
I can't collect them all at the moment but they would include:
CSTO statement
China statement
Cuba Statement
Zyuganov Statement
KKE Statement
Alt-Communist Party of Russia Statement
Socialist Movement of Kazakhstan Statement
The Kagarlitsky videos
The Yulin video
The Ben Norton Take
The Caleb Maupin Take
Just off the top of my head.
Anonymous 2022-01-09 (Sun) 03:02:08 No. 682603
>>682566 Good the less of you the better
Anonymous 2022-01-09 (Sun) 03:02:41 No. 682604
>>682439 why a so indecisive OP? its pretty clearly not color revolution but proles standing up and getting fucked
Anonymous 2022-01-09 (Sun) 03:03:58 No. 682606
>>682566 >I'm done with leftypol, just a bunch of 20-something larpers with no conception of multipolarity and realpolitik. Don't forget, you're here forever.
Anonymous 2022-01-09 (Sun) 03:05:09 No. 682607
>>682604 No it's not. It's more likely there are multiple things going on, a combination of protests over economic hardships, inter-elite conflict, and US sponsored regime change (albeit unsuccessful).
Anonymous 2022-01-09 (Sun) 03:08:18 No. 682613
>>682573 We should take note for future reference so when we start getting information about this or other events we can have a living-copypasta of links.
Anonymous 2022-01-09 (Sun) 03:09:47 No. 682616
>>682604 I try to write OP poem and description to be relatively broad and encompass the multitude of takes and contradictory nature of what is occuring.
My own bias should be obvious though: While this doesn't at all seem like the typical cuckdan/glowop, and there is definitely a working class character to the unrest, there is insufficient evidence to suggest either an attempted socialist uprising, let alone success.
So in humour I have said, but also sincerely take on the view that, and it bears repeating: I WANT TO BELIEVE.
Anonymous 2022-01-09 (Sun) 03:09:56 No. 682617
>>682603 Better for langley maybe
Anonymous 2022-01-09 (Sun) 03:13:55 No. 682621
>>682602 >Cuba Statement >Zyuganov Statement >KKE Statement >Alt-Communist Party of Russia Statement >Socialist Movement of Kazakhstan Statement Only ones worth anything.
Anonymous 2022-01-09 (Sun) 03:18:49 No. 682630
https://youtu.be/HrDPlbyyDjw Caleb Maupin is live on YouTube talking about Kazakhstan
Anonymous 2022-01-09 (Sun) 03:24:17 No. 682635
>>682528 It's simple: it's complicated.
People don't understand what's happening because multiple things are happening at once. The reason(s) for the uprising are one thing, and what people are using the events to do are other things. There are players from several sides who are involved, some more secretly than others, and so far it is not clear to many people involved (let alone outside observers) what is going on. This is known as the fog of war. We will not fully understand what is happening until after it is over, and maybe not even then. Depending on who wins and gets to control the information available afterward, we may get a heavily doctored or even outright fabricated story. We can make educated guesses about what's happening there based on events that we see, but that's about all we can do for now.
Anonymous 2022-01-09 (Sun) 03:29:59 No. 682640
>>682635 But the glowie dept of all countries must know whats going on. So why are we so slow to catch on? Leftypol intelligence unit is 6 threads in with no trooth
Anonymous 2022-01-09 (Sun) 03:32:51 No. 682642
>>682640 Each glowie department has a different set of facts. Even putting all those together would not give you the full picture, but none of them individually has probably even half of it. And they aren't gonna share information.
King Lear 2022-01-09 (Sun) 03:34:17 No. 682644
I critically support the Kazakh Workers in their heroic Revolution against the Comprador Kazakh Oligarchical puppet state and their U$, Russian, and Chinese Imperialist puppet masters!
>>682566 As a proud Marxist-Leninist-Maoist, I don’t give a Damn about “Multipolarity” and “Realpolitik” which are just Bourgeois buzz words for maintaining the Global Imperialist-Capitalist System with the Workers and Oppressed nations of the world corralled with Jingoism. The only geopolitics I support is World Protracted People’s War to overthrow the Global Imperialist-Capitalist System and usher in World Socialism that will transition into the final pinnacle of Communism. LONG LIVE MARXISM-LENINISM-MAOISM! DOWN WITH FASCISM, LIBERALISM, AND REVISIONISM! DOWN WITH U$, EUROPEAN, RUSSIAN, AND CHINESE IMPERIALISM! WORKERS AND OPPRESSED NATIONS OF THE WORLD UNITE!
Anonymous 2022-01-09 (Sun) 03:42:58 No. 682650
>>682640 If only leftypol had anons on the ground in Kazakhstan, but we don't.
Anonymous 2022-01-09 (Sun) 03:48:30 No. 682657
>>682650 If any of us were on the ground in Kazakhstan I would hope they would focus on the tasks in front of them rather than to feed our desire for happoonings. We can learn about what happened later.
Anonymous 2022-01-09 (Sun) 03:53:16 No. 682663
>>682630 The maup going off
Anonymous 2022-01-09 (Sun) 03:57:33 No. 682665
>>682663 Why watch these brainlets when you can watch Anwar Shaikh's 30 hour lecture on his new economic paradigm.
Anonymous 2022-01-09 (Sun) 04:07:08 No. 682669
Well there it is. OANN top reporter posted photo with a guy who was prime minister for all the years Joe Biden was vice president of the usa. Wow amazing proofs
Don't worry though this is going to get 70k likes and this is all evidence /Pol/ types need
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Karim_Massimov Anonymous 2022-01-09 (Sun) 04:11:26 No. 682674
It's telling that the usual tinfoilers (Leninhat, Sage and even fucking King Lear) actually have reasonable takes here
Anonymous 2022-01-09 (Sun) 04:12:16 No. 682676
>>682566 Give one reason why proletarians should give one fuck about realpolitik that isn't reactionary fascist chauvinist bullshit
Anonymous 2022-01-09 (Sun) 04:13:15 No. 682677
>>682676 It benefits the survival of your workers' state.
Anonymous 2022-01-09 (Sun) 04:22:36 No. 682681
>>682677 As if Kazakhstan is an actual workers republic instead of pro-zionist pro-western comprador state whose president openly states he will protect foreign investment (imperial capital)
The USSR under Stalin didn't pull anything near this shit until the socialist struggle in those states was almost entirely extinguished, and even then only to stave off an immediate genocidal invasion by a continent spanning coalition of fascists
There's no equivalent here with today's position of China or the CPC. Which is supporting compradors and imperialists against workers, just like it has the world over for decades now
Anonymous 2022-01-09 (Sun) 04:28:52 No. 682686
>>682681 Yes, thanks for conceding that realpolitik is critically important in international relations between states, including workers' states.
Anonymous 2022-01-09 (Sun) 04:51:18 No. 682712
>>682706 NGO-syndicates….
HMMMMM
Anonymous 2022-01-09 (Sun) 05:08:05 No. 682733
So far both the Socialist Movement of Kazakhstan and Communist Party of Kazakhstan have issued statements in support of the protests
https://lefteast.org/a-color-revolution-or-a-working-class-uprising-an-interview-with-aynur-kurmanov-on-the-protests-in-kazakhstan/ There's obviously an element of the protests that have been cultivated by a pro-NATO elite, but this element doesn't characterize the protests in the same way as they guided the Maidan coup. All these claims of color revolution by various Dengists and the apologists of Russian capitalism are ridiculous: there are no guiding Kazakh George Soros type funded group like the ones that snaked from Moldova to fucking Lebanon.
Anonymous 2022-01-09 (Sun) 05:15:08 No. 682737
>>682706 Zhanaozen revolts demanded to keep taxes from oil companies (American) in Mangystau region, up to the point of promoting separatism. Imagine that: American-dominated region of Kazakhstan wanting it's taxes to remain in American-dominated region of Kazakhstan.
Anonymous 2022-01-09 (Sun) 05:16:28 No. 682738
>>682733 It's not a color revolution but it's also not a worker's revolution due to lack of communist leadership. There's also an element of infighting between Kazakh elites using protesters as foot soldiers.
Anonymous 2022-01-09 (Sun) 05:17:47 No. 682740
>>682737 Damn, the workers in a region being polluted by American companies wanted reforms that brought oil wealth to them? Literal neoliberalism, gun them down mr. president.
Anonymous 2022-01-09 (Sun) 05:17:54 No. 682741
>>682733 >There's obviously an element of the protests that have been cultivated by a pro-NATO elite, but this element doesn't characterize the protests in the same way as they guided the Maidan coup. No, it totally does characterize it as Maidan coup. Afterall, Kagarlitsky-types were supporting both Maidan, Libya and all-all-all pro-US color revolutions in existence, waiving away all pro-NATO bullshit as if it was irrelevant and as if it isn't in control of the protests. Hell, Ukraine's Communist Party was SUPPORTING Maidan. And then got banned, huh.
So, fuck off, you are not actually voicing an argument in support of protests - it's quite the opposite
Anonymous 2022-01-09 (Sun) 05:19:44 No. 682742
>>682741 >Hell, Ukraine's Communist Party was SUPPORTING Maidan. And then got banned, huh. Oh shit really? That really changes things.
Anonymous 2022-01-09 (Sun) 05:19:46 No. 682743
>>682740 >region sends money to the central government <where american companies' lobby is obviously weaker than in Mangystau >wanting to keep money in Mangystau, where American companies will lobby taxes to be spend how they want it, is a pro-worker policy Ever wondered why China takes all the local money and redistributes it centrally? Why Stalin's USSR did the same thing, but Khruschev's was letting more autonomy?
Anonymous 2022-01-09 (Sun) 05:20:21 No. 682744
>>682742 No he's lying to you
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Communist_Party_of_Ukraine Anonymous 2022-01-09 (Sun) 05:21:39 No. 682746
>>682744 Looks like they wanted to have their cake and eat it too.
Anonymous 2022-01-09 (Sun) 05:23:32 No. 682750
>>682744 No, I've repeated whatever Kagarlitsky was saying on stream a year or two ago. Maybe I'm misremembering, though
Anonymous 2022-01-09 (Sun) 05:23:56 No. 682751
>>682738 True
>>682741 Sorry I'm not educated in the political opinions of a minor Marxist Russian, but you're right! The Kazakh communist party is totally following the Ukrainian Communist Party (a group which prohibited its members from fighting in Donbass and took the side of Banderist mobs) and they should attack the oil workers for striking! You are a genius.
Anonymous 2022-01-09 (Sun) 05:23:56 No. 682752
>>682746 >>682746 Here is the communist party of Ukraine stance on euromaiden
That poster completely lied to you. They called it a color revolution
Anonymous 2022-01-09 (Sun) 05:25:16 No. 682755
>>682751 (me)
>>682752 apparently the Ukrainians didn't even support the bandera guys protesting lol
Anonymous 2022-01-09 (Sun) 05:25:53 No. 682757
>>682479 Because they know the overall mindset of insane burger anglos. Like those of America, Canada, the UK, and Australia. Top Kek.
Anonymous 2022-01-09 (Sun) 05:28:20 No. 682761
>>682566 >I'm done with leftypol, just a bunch of 20-something larpers with no conception of multipolarity and realpolitik. Your shitposting efforts are greatly appreciated.
Anonymous 2022-01-09 (Sun) 05:36:17 No. 682769
>>682752 https://www.kommersant.ru/doc/676400 2006 - Communist Party claimed to be the first to have come to that Maidan
https://24tv.ua/ru/kpu_chastichno_podderzhivaet_evromaydan_n392610 2013 - CPU supports Maidan partially. Also, links to the explanation why CPU wasn't protesting dismantling Lenin statues
http://rabkor.ru/columns/left/2015/02/11/year-after-maidan/ Here's Kagarlitsky from 2015. Look at his prophecy for today's events:
Funny that he doesn't look in the mirror, but whatever, he knows what he's pushing for
Anonymous 2022-01-09 (Sun) 05:38:05 No. 682772
>>682743 >Ever wondered why China takes all the local money and redistributes it centrally? Because China currently has a capitalist economy according to it's own admissions? You can't pretend that oil workers demanding that they have wealth invested in their own region are somehow more capitalist than the ruling neo-colonialist cronies centralizing wealth in the capital under American/Russian finance. Khrushchev's decentralization of the economy just meant the destruction of central planning and the implementation of uneven capitalist development, with a vast majority of capital becoming located in certain centers of capital.
Anyways, how would that have given the US more power? Do you think the oil union men were covert secessionists?
Anonymous 2022-01-09 (Sun) 05:47:20 No. 682780
>tfw Leninhat is actually acting as a voice of reason for once
Anonymous 2022-01-09 (Sun) 05:48:06 No. 682783
>>682780 he's spitting facts ngl
Anonymous 2022-01-09 (Sun) 05:51:07 No. 682790
>>682780 A broken clock is right 2 times a day
Anonymous 2022-01-09 (Sun) 05:52:10 No. 682791
>>682769 Noone is arguing that these protestors in Kazakhstan are going to over throw the government and communism will be here
The debate people have here is if they are organic protest and if they have popular support not. Because if they do and their grievances are legitimate there is reason to show them support. If it is not legitimate then it not worth supporting.
If they are a real protest fighting back because of poor workers conditions and requesting better and you just repress them saying oh look china is friends with your country and Russia sit down and accept things how they are, you are not doing them much good.
That guy may be right (being charitable to him) at most in that the leftist could have joined the protest at first but they clearly appealed to international leftist that it is a color revolution in Ukraine and described it thoroughly so he's completely lying by not saying that and implying they said there is no fascist
Had to repost. Made typo.
Anonymous 2022-01-09 (Sun) 05:54:45 No. 682796
>>682769 You what a color revolution means, right? It doesn't start because burgers implant ideas into people's heads or actors are flown into the country, the protests are coopted. A communist party should try to capture the protests, of course they came to Maidan instead of sitting on their ass, and they were critical of it during as well. They declared it a color revolution after West-aligned opposition stole it, which is what turned it into a color revolution in the first place.
Anonymous 2022-01-09 (Sun) 06:09:20 No. 682816
I hope the Kazakh proletariat can overthrow their fascistic government.
Anonymous 2022-01-09 (Sun) 06:17:26 No. 682835
>>682816 fig1: ben norton posts a b8 on leftypol
Anonymous 2022-01-09 (Sun) 06:21:07 No. 682845
>>682752 They did support, in the beginning, the euromaidan, they drafted the resignation of yanukovich, they voted in favor of yanukovich's cabinet, despite they knew yanukovich was pushing for integrating ukraine into europe.
That poster was me, and I posted evidence of the claims but that post was deleted by mods.
Yep, UCP had no real plan to stop the things as they were, despite they had a significant power.
Anonymous 2022-01-09 (Sun) 06:23:14 No. 682849
>>682845 (me)
Also, they voted in favor, in the very first resolution, to join Ukraine with the EU.
Anonymous 2022-01-09 (Sun) 06:25:22 No. 682854
>>682845 So how much power do the Kazakh communists have? If they have no power their statements are rather meaningless.
Anonymous 2022-01-09 (Sun) 06:35:03 No. 682871
>>682602 what did cuba say?
Anonymous 2022-01-09 (Sun) 06:40:10 No. 682878
>>682835 Not bait. Nazarbayev and Putin are liberal fascists who suppress their working classes. Why would you support their governments in any protest or revolution like the one we have in Kazakhstan now?
Anonymous 2022-01-09 (Sun) 06:41:37 No. 682881
>>682796 Dude, you are defending people protesting their average lives in favor of lowering their living standards - with Americans taking over their businesses. Those people are their own enemies. Why are you supporting color revolutions, you fool?
Anonymous 2022-01-09 (Sun) 06:42:06 No. 682883
>>682878 >Nazarbayev He's getting purged now, he blocked the deployment of riot police during the early stages of protests hoping to use the chaos to coup the government. Now he's fled the country.
Anonymous 2022-01-09 (Sun) 06:44:11 No. 682885
>>682772 American oil company makes their workers protest not that oil company, but Kazakh government and Chinese factories, which were supposed to be built there, and one of the demands on top of that is to make taxes remain in Mangystau. Have some critical thinking for once, ok?
Anonymous 2022-01-09 (Sun) 06:44:21 No. 682886
>>682883 Good. And soon, we’ll have a genuine socialist democracy in Kazakhstan. I have family that lives there and they’ve spoken of the backward horrors citizens have dealt with from the regime. They need some proper western values, BADLY, and soon they’ll have them. I’m happy for them!
(You can't glow this hard, its bad for our eyes) Anonymous 2022-01-09 (Sun) 06:46:05 No. 682890
>>682791 "legitimate grievances" doesn't necessarily translate into legitimate beheadings and legitimate regime change (to who knows what).
we heard the same shit in libya, syria, elsewhere: protests started with legit grievances and rojava's super cool, so therefore we should effecitvely support isis and the cia overthrowing assad. and muh russian and chinese imperialism, and proletarians, and oligarchs, and buzzwords!!!
until there's any coherent direction to this uprising, supporting it "winning" is really just supporting whatever faction has the coherent ideology and endgame to fill the vacuum, which will probably be some variety of Nato nutters and islamists. no sign of any coherent socialist direction.
Anonymous 2022-01-09 (Sun) 06:47:02 No. 682892
>>682890 >beheadings Funny how leftists who support the "revolution" keep silent about this, huh
Anonymous 2022-01-09 (Sun) 06:48:30 No. 682895
>>682890 There might be a chance the the underground communists have actually created a disciplined cadre over the past few years. But I'm not betting on it.
Anonymous 2022-01-09 (Sun) 06:49:31 No. 682896
>>682886 >Good. And soon, we’ll have a genuine socialist democracy in Kazakhstan. I have family that lives there and they’ve spoken of the backward horrors citizens have dealt with from the regime. They need some proper western values, BADLY, and soon they’ll have them. I’m happy for them! >western values >badly >mfw not sure if shitposting or genuinely retard. >>682854 Not that much I am afraid. No party at all, and if what Mark Ames
>>682706 posts are right (I regard him as a good source), some "NGO-syndicates" are co-opted, too.
Anonymous 2022-01-09 (Sun) 06:50:32 No. 682898
>>682886 Haha mods are fast tonight.
Anonymous 2022-01-09 (Sun) 06:53:25 No. 682901
>>682892 Regarding this, I've heard that the US was funding islamists but were planning on unleashing them sometime in the future. But the gas price protests caused the local islamists to jump the gun without US permission. So now the islamists are going to get cleaned up.
Anonymous 2022-01-09 (Sun) 06:56:57 No. 682904
Kagarlitsky said in one of the videos that the csto intervention was early and might backfire.
Anonymous 2022-01-09 (Sun) 07:05:49 No. 682912
>>682890 >until there's any coherent direction to this uprising, supporting it "winning" is really just supporting whatever faction has the coherent ideology and endgame to fill the vacuum, which will probably be some variety of Nato nutters and islamists. no sign of any coherent socialist direction. uygha, how do anons here support them? are anons sending weapons and money? no? so there's no harm in waiting to see what happens and hoping workers gain some power. btw, eu and usa have already sided with the gov.
Anonymous 2022-01-09 (Sun) 07:06:09 No. 682913
>>682905 >Falseflaggin this hard
Anonymous 2022-01-09 (Sun) 07:25:45 No. 682934
I HAVE HORRIBLE NEWS PUTINBOTS
The oil field wages have been risen by 50% now to meet worker demands in Kazakhstan so protest have been greatly reduced.
Must be painful to know the people's revolutionary enterprises that the president there loves so much have to pay a little more now due to unrest
https://www.trend.az/business/energy/3538345.html Anonymous 2022-01-09 (Sun) 09:26:28 No. 683032
>>682566 This is not an airport, no need to announce your departure.
Anonymous 2022-01-09 (Sun) 09:32:12 No. 683043
So, according to half the people in this thread, the only acceptable popular uprisings are the one which:>Are done with the leadership of an ML (not even all ML, but specifically pro-China ones) party >Entail no violence or shady shit >Start from the beginning with communist party at the head
Anonymous 2022-01-09 (Sun) 09:43:12 No. 683058
>>682934 This literally shows that class struggle works.
They started with gas prices doubled and they ended up with raised wages and gas prices back to normal.
Anonymous 2022-01-09 (Sun) 09:44:41 No. 683060
Lmao Kazakhstan government officials are busy warning foreign investors that they'll be safe continuing to drop money there and build
https://twitter.com/Kazembmar/status/1480112411344572418?s=20 This was just posted
King Lear 2022-01-09 (Sun) 10:03:22 No. 683085
>>683083 This is literally what Dengists/Revisionist “Marxist-Leninists” believe, LMFAO.
Anonymous 2022-01-09 (Sun) 10:09:05 No. 683089
https://kazakhembus.com/2021/12/08/president-tokayev-holds-meeting-with-representatives-of-international-investment-companies.html HOLY SHIT IMAGINE DEFENDING THIS LMFAOOOO
This is your kazakhstan president you are fighting over
Anonymous 2022-01-09 (Sun) 10:11:08 No. 683091
>>683089 >The management of Blackrock, Luxor Capital, Lugard Road Capital, Aberdeen Asset Management, Capital Group, Sands Capital, Alameda Research & FTX, and Kingsway Capital made remarks during the meeting. HAHAHAHAHAHA
Anonymous 2022-01-09 (Sun) 10:30:55 No. 683104
>>683101 >“It is important to follow the plan clearly. A tough Government position is needed here. Privatization should not be allowed to lead to the emergence of private monopolies, and, as a result, to public discontent. It is necessary to ensure transparency and fairness of the privatization process,” Kassym-Jomart Tokayev believes. Famous last words.
Anonymous 2022-01-09 (Sun) 11:13:40 No. 683161
>>683130 It's not really dengism that I see here, but rather just knee-jerk anti-imperialism from people who have no idea about the situation in any of these countries nor what it means to be ruled by compradors. China and Russia are a different case yet again, they have developed national bourgeoisie, which puts them in a better position vis-a-vis foreign porky.
Anonymous 2022-01-09 (Sun) 11:20:46 No. 683172
>>683142 <Some council like structures You can't give me hope like this. Gimme some proof kind anon.
Anonymous 2022-01-09 (Sun) 11:21:40 No. 683173
>>683161 Yeah I was generalizing a bit, but despite not all dengists reasoning like that all people that reason in that way are dengists.
Anonymous 2022-01-09 (Sun) 11:23:35 No. 683178
>China didn't do anything <REEEEEE, DENGISTS
Anonymous 2022-01-09 (Sun) 11:24:59 No. 683179
>>683160 This+Kazakh police/military dead would put the death toll at over 200 people.
This is not a low number for a country of less than 20 million.
With the same ratio in a place like India or China we'd be talking 14000 deaths.
Anonymous 2022-01-09 (Sun) 11:27:12 No. 683182
>>683178 <Implying Internet Dengists are any way shape or form related to real China and not a cringe cargo cult, and that talking about them is talking about China You're just a bunch of autists with cringe politics, no need to call upon China to avoid criticism of your behaviour.
Anonymous 2022-01-09 (Sun) 11:31:53 No. 683187
White house had some teleconference call today that rarely they posted transcript of. It was about Russia
They spent entire discussion talking about ukraine only
This is only comment about khazakstan in it. It's so low on their priorities
https://www.whitehouse.gov/briefing-room/press-briefings/2022/01/08/background-press-call-by-a-senior-administration-official-on-russia/ Anonymous 2022-01-09 (Sun) 12:22:25 No. 683229
>>683219 More than half the people ITT are not saying that.
Anonymous 2022-01-09 (Sun) 12:33:44 No. 683241
>>683219 Xi said they were foreign agents. Trust the plan
Anonymous 2022-01-09 (Sun) 12:36:23 No. 683245
>>682934 https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tengiz_Field https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tengizchevroil 20% owned by
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/KazMunayGas , so, Kazakh government. The rest is 70% American, 50% Chevron, some Exxon, some Russia Lukoil.
2011 protests:
The labor conflict resulted in the resignation of KazMunaiGas EP Chief Executive Officer Askar Balzhanov on 22 Dec. President Nursultan Nazarbayev also replaced the head of parent company KazMunaiGaz National Co., Bolat Akchulakov, and fired his own son-in-law Timur Kulibayev, who headed the country's sovereign wealth fund.[17]
Anonymous 2022-01-09 (Sun) 13:39:23 No. 683289
Pigs really fucked up on this one, they really should have done basic background checks on people they wanted to pass as scapegoats before parading them on media
Anonymous 2022-01-09 (Sun) 13:44:21 No. 683296
>>683263 >>683266 Judging by the constant country-cracking protests, in doesn't seem to work all that well, lol.
Anonymous 2022-01-09 (Sun) 13:47:32 No. 683299
>>682619 This webm is retarded as propaganda if you watch Lenin's speeches, he had Hitler energy
Anonymous 2022-01-09 (Sun) 13:53:36 No. 683303
>>683299 >an active body in your speeches is litteraly hitler. that does not make sense friend.
Anonymous 2022-01-09 (Sun) 14:01:04 No. 683310
>>683303 I'm not saying Lenin = Hitler
I'm saying Lenin's speech style is similar to Hitler's
Anonymous 2022-01-09 (Sun) 14:04:16 No. 683316
>>683306 as is typical for the eternal t*rk
Anonymous 2022-01-09 (Sun) 14:13:10 No. 683321
>>682934 >this is a revolutionary movement!!! <protesters go home as soon as they get a pay raise lel
Anonymous 2022-01-09 (Sun) 14:14:28 No. 683322
>>683321 color revolutions are when the workers get pay raises and the bigger the pay raise the more color revolution-y it is
Anonymous 2022-01-09 (Sun) 14:23:49 No. 683328
>>683322 Color revolution always grafts onto existing legitimate grievance. Paying people off is one way to try and get in front of things.
1. Existing contradictions
2. Crisis
3. Provocations (color revolution starts here - enter NGO's, deep diplomatic concern, mysterious equipment for protestors, and unidentified snipers)
4. Escalation (from snipers to IEDs and beyond, preferably defector units)
5. Regime change
Anonymous 2022-01-09 (Sun) 14:26:42 No. 683333
>>683328 Are the NGOs in the room with us right now?
Anonymous 2022-01-09 (Sun) 14:30:03 No. 683337
>>683328 >mysterious equipment for protestors There is nothing mysterious about their conscription army sharing guns with protestors. Its formed from common workers.
Anonymous 2022-01-09 (Sun) 14:32:08 No. 683340
>>683321 You, you realise that makes this a class-based conflict right? Oil workers went on strike and they drastically increased their wages.
Anonymous 2022-01-09 (Sun) 14:44:59 No. 683351
>>683180 Such people are fascists in the mould of Dugin. Plain and simple.
Anonymous 2022-01-09 (Sun) 14:46:41 No. 683353
>>683299 Hitler was hysterical in his actions and stood waiting for attention and adoration from the crowd, unlike Lenin.
Anonymous 2022-01-09 (Sun) 14:48:19 No. 683355
China
Sage !61KGLATVW. 2022-01-09 (Sun) 14:52:38 No. 683359
>>682619 >>682644 based
>>682674 Thats because to be actually informed you will come across as tinfoil.
People who scream skitzo and such are simply uninformed people who don't know what's doing on. Its kinda strange because they are happy to accept things like the Pinochet coup happened and the NED exists and Venezuela gets couped and Bolivia for example, but when you start to talk about the expanded historical context and implications of these events and institutions, suddenly you're a skitzo. Bizarre. In reality, people just assume things based on their feelings, then try to back them up, when they see new facts, they try to make the facts fit their assumed reality instead.
Its a strange mindset, the opinions haver mindset. Impossible to learn that way, and so they don't.
>>682686 It is. Kazakhstan is not a workers state and its workers have no obligation to sacrifice themselves for the capitalist class of some other state
>>682706 Mark Ames should feature more regularly on this board. Although the long intros he does at the start of his podcast drag a bit and can get into the weeds, he does the proper research. A good antidote to the eternal opinions haver.
>>682715 more proof if Kazakhstan's comprador status.
>>682737 truly inspired deng brain here. Imagine workers of a region wanting the revenues from the extra industry they work in to service the region they work in.
I suppose you think the government was intending to share the wealth across the country. Get fucking real bro you live in a fantasy where everything Xi touches becomes some saintly noble savage.
>>682741 >>682744 goids be lyin imagine my shock
>>682743 Stalin was a communist. Kazakhstan is a comprador bourgeois state. It is not at all the same thing. Also China doesn't even distribute the money centrally lmao. There is a bunch of different regions which have an element of self management. Please get to know something.
>>682746 looks like you had an opinion
>>682780 he often is, people get freaked out by the vaccine stuff as if large pharmaceutical companies are beyond question.
>>682901 >>683315 the source is, and remains "i've heard" I.e. he heard himself having an opinion
>>682934 direct action gets the goods.
>>683033 >>683060 >>683073 >>683087 >>683083 >>683089 >>683096 >>683098 >>683101 foreign investors? anon don't you mean productive forces developers?
Privatisation? You surely mean accumulation of the peoples profits into the hands of the peoples billionaires? No contradiction? Right?
ps well done for doing actual research and not just having an opinion, a rare sight beautiful to behold, this are some of the most worthwhile posts in this series of threads >>683153 based but also plz gib proof
>>683180 >waking up .jpg I might stop listening to the greyzone which is a shame because they are right about a lot of stuff
>>683219 its just the deng beetle infestation we got from that time we got drunk and fucked reddit with no protection. Anti revisionism should clear it up though.
>>683240 based anti imperialist NATO
>>683263 multivectorism or as i like to call it imperial bukkake party
>>683321 >revolutions happen all at once, with no prior build up ultraleftoid go home.
Sage !61KGLATVW. 2022-01-09 (Sun) 14:59:17 No. 683362
>>683328 >enter NGO's so where are they?
>deep diplomatic concern which is all for the existing comprador Kazahk government, from the US, China, Israel, the UK, Turkey
>mysterious equipment for protestors one example of some AK47's turning up in a former soviet country that sits next door to Afghanistan and China. Not very mysterious imo.
>and unidentified snipers The snipers are identified, they are Russian.
>4. Escalation (from snipers to IEDs and beyond, preferably defector units) do we see it? Not that i've seen.
>5. Regime change from who to who? In this instance?
This whole post is speculation in order to make the statement "striking workers getting a pay is part of a genera colour revolution strategy" seem to make sense, but the things you've said a) aren't connected logically to that and b) don't actually cohere to the reality of the situation.
In short, opinions were had.
Sage !61KGLATVW. 2022-01-09 (Sun) 15:01:00 No. 683366
>>683333 NGOS do exist and do do these things though, but also scat fetishists exist and do shit in each others mouths, that doesn't mean every instance of sexual contact is somebody shitting in somebody elses mouth though.
Checkd btw
Anonymous 2022-01-09 (Sun) 15:11:55 No. 683383
>>683339 Syria broke the brains of every Russian and Russian-aligned mouthpiece. Notice how the Greyzone jumped immediately to accusations of Western governments calling the protestors "moderate rebels". I've lost all respect for these chuckle fucks. Syria was a cause for supporting regular Syrians against literal jihadis, but these faggots think we're so gullible they can shove this shit down our throats. RT has also taken a massive right-ward shift since they know the American left is dead in the water, and they will try to merge the remnants with the massive right wing populists.
Anonymous 2022-01-09 (Sun) 15:26:31 No. 683400
Congratulations to the workers of West Xinjiang for winning a nice big pay rise
Anonymous 2022-01-09 (Sun) 15:57:47 No. 683442
>>683432 If burgers actually went and did what just happened in Kazakhstan in Washington that tune would change fast
Congrats again to the 50% pay rise btw workers in Kazakhstan
Very nice
Anonymous 2022-01-09 (Sun) 16:07:17 No. 683455
This is the most insignificant thread right now.
Anonymous 2022-01-09 (Sun) 16:09:34 No. 683460
>>683455 >The fact that we still have this thread just proves that you are an impotent idiot Who are you talking to?
Anonymous 2022-01-09 (Sun) 16:17:36 No. 683469
>>683362 0 reading comprehension. Paying the strikers checked the colour revolution. Not even going to reply to the rest, it's pointless to debate someone who cannot even read at my level.
Anonymous 2022-01-09 (Sun) 16:23:14 No. 683474
>>682484 >>682543 >>682556 >beign THIS delusional Kazakhstan is the "inner core" of the post-Soviet states together with Russia and Belarussia.
>>682558 >ethnic russians in Kazakstan Ok, not a surprise, but never heard about them. Maybe their well-being is only of interest when Putin profits from it?
Anonymous 2022-01-09 (Sun) 16:27:07 No. 683480
Does anyone have a link on if the workers got a pay raise?
Anonymous 2022-01-09 (Sun) 16:32:55 No. 683485
>>683482
Anonymous 2022-01-09 (Sun) 16:39:27 No. 683490
>>683455 What "geopolitical realist" is saying to move on? This is a consequential event for Central Asia and accelerates the moves of Russia and China.
Sage !61KGLATVW. 2022-01-09 (Sun) 17:04:38 No. 683517
>>683400 The population is like 1.2% Uyghur
Remarkable
Sage !61KGLATVW. 2022-01-09 (Sun) 17:07:46 No. 683521
>>683469 Except all the criteria yourself give for colour revolution have not been met.
The facts don’t care about your feelings, or your opinion.
>>683474 >they are in x region of the world So what, they are literally in a bunch of nato pacts and do training with the British army and are part of an Israeli lead “anti terror” allegiance.
>your opinion Anonymous 2022-01-09 (Sun) 17:20:13 No. 683536
>>683181 lol, they don't care…
lmao
You are being bamboozled.
Anonymous 2022-01-09 (Sun) 17:22:46 No. 683539
>>683536 They don't care for a government change. The president of kazakhstan has great relations with the usa and does plenty of business with them.
Anonymous 2022-01-09 (Sun) 17:30:31 No. 683555
>>683321 Yep. It is proven the violence didn't start from the workers.
>>682934 Good for them, honestly.
>>683333 read Aymes twit how NGOs managed to hide the workers killed in the oil protests of 2011.
Anonymous 2022-01-09 (Sun) 18:39:23 No. 683619
>>683491 Girl at the back is Kazakhstan. Didn't get on all the fun khokhols got
Anonymous 2022-01-09 (Sun) 19:34:57 No. 683736
>>683482
Anonymous 2022-01-09 (Sun) 19:38:13 No. 683744
>>683736 >Kazakhstan might become more of a colony of Russia. Well its imperialism but its based imperialism because Russia is doing it.
Anonymous 2022-01-09 (Sun) 19:38:56 No. 683745
Honestly if Russia was planning to invade Ukraine, this has certainly thrown a spanner in the works: having to move all the rapid reaction forces eastwards.
Anonymous 2022-01-09 (Sun) 19:39:35 No. 683746
>>683161 >but rather just knee-jerk anti-imperialism These cretins couldn't even define imperialism. They're fascist apologists for bourgeois imperialism but think it's cool when it's not the USA doing it.
Anonymous 2022-01-09 (Sun) 19:45:19 No. 683755
So how come no one has talked about the protests position on the landback vs patriotic socialist debate? Can we truly be informed on the nature of the protests unless we know for sure if they're landchads or chadtriotic socialists?
Anonymous 2022-01-09 (Sun) 19:52:53 No. 683778
Restating a fact, okay?<REEEEEE, DENGISTS
Anonymous 2022-01-09 (Sun) 19:53:20 No. 683779
>ctrl+f kazakhstan <80 results >ctrl+f kazakh <102 results
Anonymous 2022-01-09 (Sun) 19:55:30 No. 683785
>>683765 Lmao, not a single mention of the striking workers.
These little nietzschean freaks who think all of history is elite power games are frauds, anti-communists, and class enemies of the working class.
I'll listen to Kazakh/Russian communists, cheers.
http://ucp.su/category/news/1620-aktivist-okp-arestovan-za-podderzhku-vosstaniya-v-/ Anonymous 2022-01-09 (Sun) 20:01:01 No. 683794
>>683746 >>683746 Yeah, you surely know what imperialism is pseud.
>>683785 How does it feel that you were exposed as a pseud when I told you that the madness of violence wasn't worker-class struggle related (no signs of such thing) now that has been published the article saying that that the concessions were met most of the violence stopped?
>>682934 You are more like any random western trotkyete.
Man, I feel so vindicated.
Anonymous 2022-01-09 (Sun) 20:12:13 No. 683811
>>683805 >but now it's being targeted at the workers, which I'm sure you'll like. PFFFF
ahahaha you moved your goalpost. See the article, workers stopped the violence with the concessions, and now you want to defend the thugs.
How would you like to call them, moderate rebels or freedom fighters? or better yet, now you decided to deflect, workers strugglers?
Anonymous 2022-01-09 (Sun) 20:17:53 No. 683819
>>683811 The bourgeoisie always have provocateurs and agents in the communist/trade union movement.
All this rhetoric about supposed terrorists is a byword for repressing the working class.
Do you think there were no workers involved in these protests?
Anonymous 2022-01-09 (Sun) 20:19:56 No. 683820
>>683819 Do you think there were no workers in the January 6th incident?
Get a job kid, a real job
Anonymous 2022-01-09 (Sun) 20:23:02 No. 683826
>>683820 The January 6 thing in America was a farce lol, as if American police just let people into the Congress. It was a spectacle.
I'll be in work tomorrow sadly.
Anonymous 2022-01-09 (Sun) 20:25:39 No. 683834
>>683819 I was always skeptical of the nature of the most violent part being worker-related, you were the one believing, idealizing things, that they were workers organized, somehow, with no party leadership, no story of socialist revolutionary violence in the past, no nothing.
I can tell when somethingng is worker-related, because I live in a country where a color revolution was tried, multiple times. Without any of the organization I said above, I can, 100% being sure, tell you workers do not go and violently try to intimidate reporters. Workers don't destroy everyone's else property because they live wage to wage and know the car of other could be the car of them. Workers don't go and take army bases, they know they are defenseless in a capitalist system and they need organization to minimize their deaths, and all of them are protesting for better conditions for their families, what would they gain if they thing they can be killed?. Workers do not go and decapitate others. Workers immediately calm down after they get most of their demands achieved.
You are pseud.
Anonymous 2022-01-09 (Sun) 20:29:32 No. 683843
>>683834 Never said that lol, but spontaneous outbreaks of violence do happen. Looting is one example of a crude, rudimentary protest, one lacking organisation.
And that's a problem. Unions have a habit of doing that, rather than raising the necessity of revolution.
Anonymous 2022-01-09 (Sun) 20:31:42 No. 683847
>>683843 yeah, act like you don't, you didn't post, you weren't that guy, you haven't been, you aren't, etc, etc, etc
Good I know when I am seeing your posts I can immediately know I am reading a child.
Anonymous 2022-01-09 (Sun) 20:32:27 No. 683850
>>683219 It's ridiculous lol, Kazakhstan is already a comprador regime, there is not the slightest reason for a Ukrainian style Maidan.
Anonymous 2022-01-09 (Sun) 20:35:27 No. 683859
>>683847 You're deliberately misinterpreting what I say.
Anonymous 2022-01-09 (Sun) 20:36:05 No. 683862
>>683850 They said no thanks to storeshittistahni military bases
Anonymous 2022-01-09 (Sun) 20:45:25 No. 683878
>The Karachaganak field is located in the West-Kazakhstan region, 140 km away from the city of Uralsk. It is one of the world's largest oil and gas condensate fields. https://www.lukoil.com/Business/Upstream/Overseas?wid=wid9nzQe74pbkybfWJ47RNDpQ <ExxonMobil <Shell <Transneft Foreign capitalists of all stripes have their fingers in Kazakhstan.
Anonymous 2022-01-09 (Sun) 20:46:49 No. 683881
>>683857 Why? I feel. I feel happy when I feel so in my theories, gathering enough information and seeing the in-real time protests-violence. get correct interpretations and expose pseuds.
>>683850 Like yanukovich wasn't a comprador regime…? His whole campaign was about joining the EU. He only stopped when he was told by the EU they weren't going to send economical assistance to ukraine to de-couple from Russia.
>>683859 >picrel You posted a bunch of links claiming other communists were supporting the violence, I clarified there were just siding with working class struggles and inmediatly you started to screech multiple nonsenses about 20th century references of violence=working class struggles, in which I tried to frame in the 21st century and of course we end up here proving that in fact the violence wasn't working-class related. Pseud x3.
Anonymous 2022-01-09 (Sun) 21:00:45 No. 683903
>>683881 Kazakhn communists have already said it's nothing like the Ukrainian Maidan which was dominated by liberal bourgeois nationalists and fascists organised by NATO/EU from Day fucking One.
https://www.idcommunism.com/2022/01/kazakhstans-uprising-isnt-color.html You seem to have a pure idea that protests never lead to violence, whether planned or not. Some people lash out, out of desperation.
The supposed violence is going to be used as an excuse by the comprador ruling class to attack the Kazakh workers even more.
Anonymous 2022-01-09 (Sun) 21:02:23 No. 683905
>>683847 You people are making LeninHat seem 100% lucid and coherent.
Just take the L.
Anonymous 2022-01-09 (Sun) 21:05:42 No. 683908
>>683903 I never said protests can't lead to violence, I said that the concessions were met, hence all violence beyond that wasn't sincere in the worker-class struggle. You just started to deflect saying there is some sort of invisible communist hand guiding this violence and was justified.
Sage !61KGLATVW. 2022-01-09 (Sun) 21:06:51 No. 683912
>>683905 If there is one thing dengoid cultists will never do it is take the L. They’ve still to admit that China funded the Afghan mujihadeen primarily with a small fraction of funding going to Maoists as a one time payment
Sage !61KGLATVW. 2022-01-09 (Sun) 21:08:15 No. 683915
>>683908 How isn’t it sincere class struggle just because some people kept going after the pay rise happened? If anything those are the ones not subdued by the pay off
Anonymous 2022-01-09 (Sun) 21:08:23 No. 683916
>>683903 The mere presence of agent provocateurs among the masses does not disqualify their actions.
That said at the end of the day what we can understand is that class struggle even in this crude ass form paid off for the working class, which had gas prices back to normal and for some of them wage hikes.
Anonymous 2022-01-09 (Sun) 21:08:47 No. 683917
…did we winned yet, fellow Rojava Kazakh comrades friends?
Anonymous 2022-01-09 (Sun) 21:09:34 No. 683918
>>683847 >when I am seeing your posts I can immediately know I am reading a child. You would know it "immediately" if you were watching anon through a window as they were writing the post. You can otherwise only infer it by the physiognomy of style, an unreliable device.
Anonymous 2022-01-09 (Sun) 21:10:55 No. 683921
>>683915 From what we know the pay hikes came 2-3 days AFTER the gas prices hikes were revocated, so the timeline should be:
1)Gas prices hiked
2)Protests started
3)Gas prices hike stopped
4)Protests escalated
5)Wage hikes were conceded
6) Protests subsided
This at least is my reconstruction of the events
Anonymous 2022-01-09 (Sun) 21:11:02 No. 683922
>>683916 >The mere presence of agent provocateurs among the masses does not disqualify their actions. Exactly.
Anonymous 2022-01-09 (Sun) 21:15:37 No. 683925
>>683918 Well, you are right, I should not dismiss him, but would not take him seriously completely.
>>683916 >>683915 As I said, you need further material evidence that those keeping the violence in extreme mode are worker-class related, not just some larper paid provcateur.
Sll my theories gravitated around real needs and questions merged with an internal fight between ruling classes.
At first I was 50-50% maidan, then I was 70% Bielorus, and now with lastest reports, 90% bielorus with more provocateurs for being a multivectorial government that wants to be in good terms with everyone.
Anonymous 2022-01-09 (Sun) 21:20:19 No. 683932
>>683925 The violence (At least the extreme parts of it) was ofc done by provocateurs.
This is a given.
The fact that people in their numbers came out and struggled even if crudely as fuck still stands.
Anonymous 2022-01-09 (Sun) 21:22:45 No. 683936
>>683925 >good terms with everyone Kazakhstan already was. Oil fields owned by foreign capitalists from Russia/Britain/America/China, massive foreign investment, workers gunned down in strikes in 2011, military and political elites trained by Britain, glorification of the nazi Turkestan Legion.
It really is telling how many people have had their brains addled by
>Elite theory/nietzscheanism >RT >Grayzone Or are just bourgeois class agents.
King Lear 2022-01-09 (Sun) 21:24:27 No. 683939
>>683765 "Moon of Alabama" is a cesspool of Dengist, MAGAtard, "Multipolarity" schizos led by some washed up German nutjob named Bernhard who have a worldview that is essentially a Orientalist version of Qanon, LOL. That shithole banned me and my friend Donkeytale for showing that Dengist China and Putinist Russia are fully integrated into the Global Imperialist-Capitalist System and thus won't fight World War III with the U$, and last time I went their they had purged anyone who even slightly criticized Trump, as Bernhard and his clowns believe Trump is "Le epic Based Anti-Imperialist who stopped Le ebil Democrats from Nuking Le precious Based Russia", LMAO.
Anonymous 2022-01-09 (Sun) 21:57:51 No. 683994
Has Assad said anything?
Anonymous 2022-01-09 (Sun) 22:03:54 No. 684007
>The British Army taught the public order training, an unfamiliar and often intimidating topic to many participants. However, as the week continued, the trainees' progression and confidence were noticeable. Walisko said at the training's onset, for example, a command to the Kazakhstani soldiers to draw batons and face the crowd was met by a hesitant Kazakhstani platoon commander's, "Are you sure?" Just days later, that same Kazakhstani officer led his platoon on the last iteration and arrived en masse with greater confidence in his understanding of higher-level commands and instructions from other countries. https://www.army.mil/article/223787/eight_days_in_steppe_eagle_19_participants_showing_progress_interoperability Bastards.
Anonymous 2022-01-09 (Sun) 22:07:03 No. 684011
>>683966 Who is this subhuman?
Anonymous 2022-01-09 (Sun) 22:08:54 No. 684013
>>684007 What's the deal with this "Kazakhstani" shit? It's Kazakh ffs, it should be clear by now.
King Lear 2022-01-09 (Sun) 22:25:33 No. 684037
>>684016 >>684024 >>684027 I wonder how Dengists/Revisionist "Marxist-Leninists" cope with fact that literal Nazi/"Third Positionist" fuckers uphold Dengist China as a Fascist state?
Anonymous 2022-01-09 (Sun) 22:33:36 No. 684058
>>684037 Same way as with literal Nazis who self-identify as communists - ignore them, when quelling them isn't an option.
Reminder Papa Stalin won't give you an ethno-state.
Anonymous 2022-01-09 (Sun) 22:38:30 No. 684065
>>684037 Coming to the conclusion that Deng may have been worse than Khrushchev tbqh.
Sage !61KGLATVW. 2022-01-09 (Sun) 22:42:15 No. 684072
>>683765 you posted this dog shit website a couple of days ago, its basically all the same "evidence" the gray zone gave, which is scant. The website by itself looks like dogshit, but lets get over that.
The kind of articles that primarily quote tweets is highly suspect.
The only other evidence they posited was US intelligence meetings which talked about how they wanted to influence the region. Well fuck! the US wanted to influence a region and destabilise the govts there! well I fucking never…
Oh as well as " the US embassy warned of protests"
What it completely lacked was anything specific connecting the things, no smoking gun, all tenuous conjecture.
This current article starts
No source, nothing. Why would Britains Mi6 do this? There is literally no motive, they have training the Kazakh military and Tony Blair did spin for their guy shooting striking workers. On top of that, they are the main supplier of Israeli oil, and I shouldn't have to go into the connections between Mi6 and Zion.
>>683811 workers are thugs for striking and fighting against the zionist oil well that their country has been turned into, but the UK trained military with the Zionist anti terror allegiance that is shooting them dead are not thugs?
KEK
>>683820 The January 6th incident was literally chock full of provable intelligence assets, literally all of the leaders, as well as a variety of other circumstances.
So far however, you have not managed to point to a single piece of compelling evidence beyond "china does business there"
>>683833 >in which a Tory MP barks on about being proud of the fact the British Army trained Kazahkstans ……. lol
>>683834 >I can tell when somethingng is worker-related, because I live in a country where a color revolution was tried, multiple times. >because of where i am from, my opinion is better idpol, also this is anon site, nobody is from anywhere. Everyone is lying. The rest of what you say is simply statements with no basis
you are the pseud
>>683878 there is literally no reason to do a colour revolution, the forces of imperialism literally could not ask for more than this cuck gives them.
>>683881 >Why? I feel. I feel happy when I feel so in my theories, gathering enough information and seeing the in-real time protests-violence. get correct interpretations and expose pseuds. why is it you people always just repeat this "i have destroy you I have won"
when everyone can see you flailing like an idiot.
>>683917 >when losing the argument at hand i'll just derail by bringing up something else I am seething about >>683921 seems all natural to me
>>683925 >As I said, you need further material evidence that those keeping the violence in extreme mode are worker-class related, not just some larper paid provcateur. you need any proof at all that they are paid provocateurs which you haven't at all provided. Given that, we should stick with the available evidence, which is as the above poster said, prices were hiked, wages were shit, people protested, prices were dropped, wages were raised. Given the intensity of how shit that admin is, some people have kept going.
I repeat again, you given not one piece of evidence, not one source, which proves at all their was provocatuers. Even if we aren't to rule it out, there may well have been, you have no proof of it, and you are basing your whole theory around it, over and above what there is actual evidence of.
t. learned the word multivectoral today
kek. Another pseud sign "look I used an uncommon scientific sounding word, multipolarity, multivectorial" I am v smart
>>683932 why is it a given? Where is proofs? Striking workers are often violent. Its a good thing.
>>684007 my country is a disgrace.
>>684065 I mean, in terms of Foriegn policy at least the USSR remained not on the side of imperialism
Anonymous 2022-01-09 (Sun) 22:44:58 No. 684079
>>684037 >if Nazi/"Third Positionist" fuckers say something it must be true disagreed
Anonymous 2022-01-09 (Sun) 22:45:39 No. 684080
>>684071 yeah and they arent right about china either. Like you can make an argument china is state cap, but state cap isnt fascism. Fascism has such particular beliefs of reactionarism, militarism, and extreme chauvanism. And while china has echoes of this its nowhere near the extreme levels of fascism nor does it have fascism as its guiding ideology. It still places communism as its guiding ideology, and politicla justification for its state(tho its a very revisionist marxism)
Anonymous 2022-01-09 (Sun) 23:18:19 No. 684114
>>684080 The main factor of fascism is anti-communism. China's trajectoy since the 1980s is towards the creation of a massive entrenched bourgeoisie and dissolution of planning, collective farms, full employment (iron rice bowl) and proletarian culture of the Maoist era. It may not be fascist, but it's clearly not pursuing communism and the Chinese proletariat are under the boot as much as we are.
>>684094 King Lear is not a pro-ethnostate nazi. Disgusting slander.
Anonymous 2022-01-09 (Sun) 23:19:12 No. 684116
>>684016 I remember stumbling into one of his videos once that was titled:
>Reclaiming socialism from the left Sure sounds like a retard.
Anonymous 2022-01-09 (Sun) 23:27:01 No. 684128
>>684065 China is still standing today bro, Krushchev started something far worse. Deng didn’t lead to the nation being split into multiple parts with child r*pe being common in the slums
Anonymous 2022-01-09 (Sun) 23:29:30 No. 684133
>>684128 The PRC is only the same country in name.
Anonymous 2022-01-09 (Sun) 23:37:25 No. 684149
CHINA
King Lear 2022-01-09 (Sun) 23:43:43 No. 684156
>>684094 You probably missed my post about this topic but I have recently taken a neutral stance on LGBTQIA+ issues after a period of self-criticism. It's also extremely misleading to accuse me of supporting "Ethnostates" when my position is applying the USSRs national delimitation policies worldwide according to the principle of Self-Determination for Oppressed Nations in a hypothetical Global Socialist Federation. I also have softened my stance on Covid-19 (I recognize it is a real threat to the Elderly and Immunocompromised that should be protected with targeted policies, and I understand why those groups would make a different decision then I did on the Vaccine) and Climate Change (I recognize that it is real, albeit a bit sensationalized by the MSM, and that it should be solved not with Electric Vehicles and synthetic/"Impossible" meat but by destroying Suburbia in favor of high-density, walkable cities with Mass Transit in which the population lives in Commie Blocs, Personal Car ownership is banned, and all energy is provided by renewable sources) as well.
In conclusion, I am perfectly fine with other posters criticizing my positions, but I will not stand by while others straw man and misrepresent my positions in order to paint me as something I am not (a "Red Nazi").
Sage !61KGLATVW. 2022-01-09 (Sun) 23:44:57 No. 684157
>>684128 No he just backed the child rapists in Afghanistan/Nicaragua/Angola/ All the rest already discussed. Current day China props up the Phillipino administration of Duterte, whose spiritual sensei is a literal sex trafficker and child rapist.
As for Zionist child rape, supported by current day China, well.. the name Effrey Jppstein comes to mind
Sage !61KGLATVW. 2022-01-09 (Sun) 23:45:16 No. 684158
and unless I'm not being clear, every dengist is a child rapist
Sage !61KGLATVW. 2022-01-09 (Sun) 23:46:21 No. 684160
>>684156 all sounds dope to me boyo
Anonymous 2022-01-09 (Sun) 23:50:11 No. 684167
>>683765 Thanks for posting this, good to have balanced headed analysis instead of ultra-left hysteria.
Anonymous 2022-01-09 (Sun) 23:52:00 No. 684171
>>684156 You're a DNC shill who thinks voting for biden makes a difference.
Sage !61KGLATVW. 2022-01-09 (Sun) 23:54:02 No. 684172
>>684171 >a red nazi >a DNC shill >anti vax >anti lgbt yeh… sure he is all of these things at the same time.. or maybe people just mag dump buzz words when they get confused.
Anonymous 2022-01-09 (Sun) 23:55:08 No. 684174
>>684172 He's a "proud biden voter".
Anonymous 2022-01-09 (Sun) 23:58:14 No. 684178
>>684156 >King Lear 20% less schizo Getting quite based.
Now you have just to stop using all that capital letters anon.
Anonymous 2022-01-10 (Mon) 00:00:16 No. 684180
>>684178 He needs to drop the ethnostate nonsense.
Anonymous 2022-01-10 (Mon) 00:02:44 No. 684182
>>684178 It's because he's german, that's how they do it
Anonymous 2022-01-10 (Mon) 00:03:48 No. 684183
>>684180 If he's arguing for the USSR model (as I seem to understand, maybe I am wrong) he's saying that there would be autonomous administrative SUBDIVISIONS of bigger federations, while usually ethnostates should be more along the line of fully independent and segregated states.
sage sage 2022-01-10 (Mon) 00:04:30 No. 684186
>>683939 Lear being retarded example #230752085
Moon of Alabama is anti-imperialist social democratic their only writer (since it's just one guy) admits as much.
Saying they're in favor of Trump is a lie and outright slander.
Anonymous 2022-01-10 (Mon) 00:04:47 No. 684187
https://www.indianpunchline.com/kazakhstan-turns-into-graveyard-for-us-diplomacy/ Kazakhstan hosted US biowarfare labs which be getting purged in the current crackdown.
Anonymous 2022-01-10 (Mon) 00:07:04 No. 684190
>>684156 Wtf, character arcs on /leftypol/.
Anonymous 2022-01-10 (Mon) 00:07:34 No. 684191
>>684183 Carving out a chunk of Syria, Iraq, and Iran for Kurdistan is not going lead to a happy population. But it's a moot point, it's not like some internet schizo is going to be running the national policy of USSR 2.
Anonymous 2022-01-10 (Mon) 00:07:38 No. 684192
>>684186 MoA is good but in a 2D way in a sense (with liberals having 1D vision and communists seeing things in 3D).
Usually they see all the picture but their analysis have no depth.
Also their userbase feels mostly boomer-tier at least judging by how they write.
Anonymous 2022-01-10 (Mon) 00:08:18 No. 684193
>>684186 >anti-imperialist social democratic Social-Democracy is the moderate wing of fascism.
Anonymous 2022-01-10 (Mon) 00:08:40 No. 684194
>>684191 I can see where you came from and indeed the national question is VERY tricky.
I would lie if i said I had the universal response to it.
Anonymous 2022-01-10 (Mon) 00:10:11 No. 684196
>>684192 I like the fact that it's boomers, gives a different perspective than mostly young anons on leftypol.
Anonymous 2022-01-10 (Mon) 00:12:31 No. 684198
>>684196 In a sense they're childish in what they write.
They seem genuinely enthusiastic for the future in a way that my mind cannot comprehend, and which reminds me of how i felt when I was a "baby" leftist.
sage sage 2022-01-10 (Mon) 00:12:32 No. 684199
>>684193 nice thought terminating cliche
Anonymous 2022-01-10 (Mon) 00:14:08 No. 684200
>>684186 MoA is a Ben Norton type of retard.
Anonymous 2022-01-10 (Mon) 00:14:23 No. 684201
>>684198 They grew up during a more hopeful time and are probably in a better economic situation than a 20-something today.
Anonymous 2022-01-10 (Mon) 00:14:52 No. 684202
Sites like Moon of Alabama, RT, Grayzone would call the October Revolution a Judeo-German-Subhuman plot like every reactionary did at the time.
Sage !61KGLATVW. 2022-01-10 (Mon) 00:16:11 No. 684206
>>684199 I mean in this instance the supposed social democratic is simping for an imperialist/zionist comprador state against a population rebelling against working and living condition degradation via a trade union struggle. So it is accurate. Even if we are to say China is a fully socialist state and the BRI 100% saintly act, it wouldn't excuse every other aspect of the Kazakh administration and their other dealings.
I must say though I find this Sino-Kazakh-Zionist through line extremely intriguing.
Wonder how much Kazakh oil comes through the Haifa port.
Anonymous 2022-01-10 (Mon) 00:17:52 No. 684209
>>684206 Do we know if the crackdown is directed at all protests or only those in Nursultan and Amalty?
Anonymous 2022-01-10 (Mon) 00:18:00 No. 684210
>>684206 Hilarious since MoA supports the Palestinian cause and can in no way be defined as "ZIonist" but keep throwing out those buzzwords revealing that you don't actually read anything you retard.
Anonymous 2022-01-10 (Mon) 00:19:55 No. 684214
>>684199 It's a Bolshevik statement of fact.
Social-Democracy is a rotten cancer that serves to pacify the working class on behalf of the bourgeoisie and the labour aristocrats who benefit from imperialism and bribery.
It's done nothing but serve the bourgeois exploiters for 100+ years and is the ideological twin of fascism. Communism and Bolshevism means the smashing of Social-Democracy in all its form.
Anonymous 2022-01-10 (Mon) 00:21:03 No. 684216
>>684206 How about you actually read before criticizing something you don't even understand you brainlet. You're probably the most retarded lenin hat wearer to ever grace this forum even more than that anti-lockdown guy.
RT is opportunist and cultivates a broad spectrum of opinion which can be summed up as anti-West in any format so you have anti-Covid articles side by side with socialists agitating against Western imperialism.
MoA and Grayzone support every AES state.
You have no real argument. kys.
Sage !61KGLATVW. 2022-01-10 (Mon) 00:26:52 No. 684227
https://2017-2021.state.gov/countries-areas/kazakhstan/index.html here is some pretty enlightening stuff direct from the US state department
https://2017-2021.state.gov/the-united-states-and-kazakhstan-conclude-annual-enhanced-strategic-partnership-dialogue/index.html Anonymous 2022-01-10 (Mon) 00:28:14 No. 684228
>>684216 Lmao RT is the Russian equivalent of the BBC. Its domestic articles endlessly serve the interest of the Russian bourgeoisie and promote vaccines and attacks Russian proletarians at the same as it postures as opposing those in foreign countries. It's all ops, all the time.
Grayzone defending Dengist China means absolutely nothing as it's a dictatorship of the bourgeoisie and has been for thirty years minimum. Yeah woo fucking Jack Ma, muh multipolarity.
I am the anti lockdown one BTW :)
As I've said people have had their brains addled so badly by places like RT it's unreal.
Anonymous 2022-01-10 (Mon) 00:30:36 No. 684232
>>684182 >It's because he's german Ew.
- Mark Twain
Sage !61KGLATVW. 2022-01-10 (Mon) 00:32:02 No. 684237
>>684210 Nowhere did I say MoA was zionist. Give the quote retard. What I said was, they are simping for a an imperialist/zionist comprador state. Which is what Kazakhstan currently is. Which is an objective fact, if you had read the other thread, wherein I posted evidence of the israeli prime minister writing a fawning article about Kazahkstan, a state which gives Israel a quarter of its oil, and has a strategic "anti terror alliance" with, and has its military trained by the zionist british military. But continue to ignore these facts and just make shit up if it suits you man.
I do actually read a lot, and clearly more than you and your worthless unsourced blogs which say things like "i
presumed it was the CIA, but now its probably Mi^"
no source, nothing my thoughts on this claim I already gave, why would the UK coup their staunch ally?
>>684216 this is just a big rant full of nothing, until you get to here
okay, cool, is Kazakhstan AES in your opinion? No, clearly its not unless you are actually a dribbling idiot in the midst of a k hole.
I have no real argument? I've posted them over and over, keep simping bruv, you, tony blair and the former president of israel can form a club
Anonymous 2022-01-10 (Mon) 00:34:50 No. 684240
>>684220 Economic growth under capitalism means essentially nothing for workers except increased exploitation on our backs. A society working us to death as slaves would also have high economic growth. What matters is who it enriches and improves the lives of. And this must be done in the Bolshevik fashion as laid down by the Five Year Plans.
There's a tiny difference anyway. Workers in social democracy in 1950 were exploited just as much as we are today. I don't give a fuck about scraps.
Social Democracy served and enabled fascism before ww2 and does so today. Nazi gangs act on behalf of social democrats and have done since 1919. They're bourgeois lackeys and reactionaries who prefer being the barking dogs of the bourgeoisie.
Anonymous 2022-01-10 (Mon) 00:35:47 No. 684242
>>684228 Doubt it since the anti lockdown guy actually engages with arguments.
>>684237 You're a bot I don't even have to talk to you but I'll bite you should tell your handler to not give you such a visible post ID. Here's just a sample of NED funding for opposition movements but please tell me more about how Amerikkka supposedly loves this government.
Anonymous 2022-01-10 (Mon) 00:36:30 No. 684243
>>684240 Read Cockshott. Social democracy almost lead to revolution in the UK, but the working class was not sufficiently strong and Thatcher defeated them.
Sage !61KGLATVW. 2022-01-10 (Mon) 00:36:52 No. 684244
>>684228 worth noting Abbie Martin left RT because of its cuckery even though she is a China enjoyer
Anonymous 2022-01-10 (Mon) 00:37:58 No. 684246
>>684216 >MoA and Grayzone support every AES state. They also support comprador states against local workers and leftists. Doesn't seem like it's based on Marxism or anti-imperialism but on rebelling against their daddy Biden. Even more hilarious in this case since Kazakhstan compradors are so explicitly and self-admittedly subservient to Western porkies, and the Western powers also explicitly approve of their crackdowns.
Fortunately these clowns' activities are limited to larping on twitter so it all works out in the end. It's just tiring being attacked as a "Western glowie" by Western larpers because you fight against Western capital in your own country.
If you want to see Gayzone's bipolar bubble being popped by Russian leftists, in real time:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UJX9pmr1I3E King Lear 2022-01-10 (Mon) 00:38:00 No. 684247
>>684171 I voted for Biden because he is a lesser Evil to Trump, not because he is a saint, LOL. For those who say this contradicts my Marxist-Leninist-Maoist ideology, it surprisingly dose not because I don't believe Protracted Peoples War is applicable to the current material conditions in the U$ (it won't be applicable unless World War III breaks out, something unfortunately highly unlikely no matter who is elected due to the integration of Dengist China and Putinist Russia into the Global Imperialist-Capitalist System), and I don't support the vulgar accelerationist view that Republicans will collapse the U$ as the evidence shows that their Economic and Foreign Policy strengthens Wall Street/Silicon Valley/the MIC while efficiently crushing the Workers and Oppressed Nations of the World, compared to the Democrats who despite being Bourgeois Imperialists as well don't have quite the same level of Sadism. Basically, I take Sisons approach to the Core countries, and Gonzalos approach to the Periphery/Semi-Periphery Countries.
>>684183 That is exactly what I am advocating for, but unfortunately many here couldn't avoid smearing my position of upholding the USSRs National Delimitation Policy as supporting "Ethnostates".
>>684186 Thats not the impression that I had their, just check out their article on Rittenhouse, LOL.
Anonymous 2022-01-10 (Mon) 00:39:41 No. 684249
>>684242 I can promise you I am the British Leninhat, who has been anti lockdown/pass for 18+ months.
Sage !61KGLATVW. 2022-01-10 (Mon) 00:39:42 No. 684250
>>684242 totalling… $460,000. Piffling. Wonder how much 25% of Israels oil input is worth lmao. Probably eats that in an hour. This like the salaries of 4 or 5 diplomats lmao
Anonymous 2022-01-10 (Mon) 00:42:03 No. 684252
>>684250 Hence why the NED assets failed.
Anonymous 2022-01-10 (Mon) 00:42:26 No. 684254
>>684250 The problem is you think voting makes a differences.
Anonymous 2022-01-10 (Mon) 00:43:37 No. 684256
>>684247 >Sison approach to the core and Gonzalo to the perifery So like…Sison's approach?
Considering that the only difference between the two is that Gonzaloids want to start Walmart parking ppw whereas Sison at least is a bit more grounded in reality.
(Btw I suggest to you to abandon all Gonzalo shit: is 100% harmful and whatever can be found there prolly can be found expressed in a better and saner way in Sison, which has a series of problem but at least is not unhinged).
Anonymous 2022-01-10 (Mon) 00:44:49 No. 684261
>>684243 The closest Britain has come to proletarian revolution is 1919. Labour after WW2 never brought us anywhere near revolution.
It's not that we aren't strong. In a real civil war, with Bolshevik organisation and mass class consciousness we'd crush the bourgeoisie. When the bombs and bullets stop flowing we'll see just how tough they are. The problem is the presence of social democracy and British imperialism which makes the proletariat satiated and promotes ideological backwardsness and political ignorance. The Labour Party is a vehicle for blocking revolution and waged fascist war on Korea and Malaysia in the 1940s/1950s.
Anonymous 2022-01-10 (Mon) 00:46:10 No. 684263
>>684246 /leftypol/ is getting infiltrated by scripted bots.
Notice how this bot says:
>Gayzone's bipolar bubble being popped by Russian leftists, in real time And yet the youtube video is a Grayzone discussion talking about Navalny, who isn't even Left.
>>684249 If you support Belarus and understand NED funding of the color revolution then you should have no objections.
>>684250 >Forgetting about differences in relative strengths of currencies What a hilarious bot.
Anonymous 2022-01-10 (Mon) 00:47:57 No. 684265
>>684261 This is vulgar accelerationism, claiming that welfare robs the working class of their class consciousness. Do you advocating for impoverishing workers to bring about revolution faster?
Anonymous 2022-01-10 (Mon) 00:48:40 No. 684268
>>684264 lenin hat i expected you to be eastern european, since that would make a lot more sense on why you have your certain views
but you are an anglo and thats fucking suprising
Anonymous 2022-01-10 (Mon) 00:49:50 No. 684269
>>684263 >And yet the youtube video is a Grayzone discussion talking about Navalny, who isn't even Left. You must be illiterate. In the video Russian leftists attack Navalny, Putin, American empire, and criticize the idiocy of Western leftists, while the host gets visibly uneasy.
Anonymous 2022-01-10 (Mon) 00:52:36 No. 684272
>>684263 Your analysis is completely retarded you are essentially arguing that any country that has any funding by NED groups within it their protest must be opposed and are not real.
This isn't evidence for it being a color revolution and you calling everyone bots on this post isnt honest debating.
Anonymous 2022-01-10 (Mon) 00:52:51 No. 684273
>>684268 If he writes colour, instead of color, labour, instead of labor, most likely it is brit.
What a clusterfuck thread.
Anonymous 2022-01-10 (Mon) 00:53:27 No. 684274
>>684263 It's nothing fucking like Belarus. Read this and the statements from Kazakh communists.
>>682516 Fucking "colour revolution" is an inane term in any case. As I said it would be applied to the October Revolution if it happened today because none of these people think workers are capable of revolution.
It's BOURGEOIS COUNTERREVOLUTION and fascist takeovers that events like the Ukrainian Maidan or the attempt in Belarus in 2020 should be called.
Also Navalny is a fucking nobody. Russia already has the system he wants. Stop buying into fake geopolitical drama, old Putin was put into power by Yeltsin to continue the project and huge swathes of the Russian economy are already owned by foreign capital as it was before 1917.
King Lear 2022-01-10 (Mon) 00:55:37 No. 684276
>>684202 This, the Dengist/Duginist/MAGAtard "Alternative Media" bubble is extremely nauseating, LOL.
Sage !61KGLATVW. 2022-01-10 (Mon) 00:55:55 No. 684277
>>684252 Failed to do what? What was their Goal? To overthrow the government? I'm asking you why? Because the government is an ally of the west, particularly Israel, the US and UK. Do you admit that or do you deny it?
Less than half a million dollars isn't enough to subvert an entire country in this day and age, its chump change.
Also, you haven't even shown where that info comes from, its just screen shots stating numbers, I would like to see.
>>684263 >differences in strengths of currency oh wow this guy has been reading his basic economics guys. Doesn't fucking matter. A country of 18 million people, less than half a million isn't enough. It would barely be enough to buy off one general.
By comparison, the US recently gave 125 million to Ukraine in military aid, which is just the most recent deal. The money we are talking about is just miniscule in comparison, even given Ukraine has twice the population.
How much do you think the US/UK spends on Operation Steppe Eagle? How much do you think Israel spends on the "anti terror alliance"
if anything, this tiny sum confirms that they are an ally, because if they weren't, it would be massively more amounts of money. Its a token amount so they can say to libs "look we are doing the human rights" meanwhile
https://www.usarcent.army.mil/Steppe-Eagle/ https://kazakhembus.com/us-relations/security-cooperation/steppe-eagle-exercises what more do you need?
Anonymous 2022-01-10 (Mon) 00:56:40 No. 684279
>>684265 No I don't want to impoverish people.
It's not poor proletarians who are the main beneficiaries BTW but the richer well paid sections of the working class and petit bourgeoisie who love their generous universal welfare and health systems that countries in Latin America or South Asia don't have.
Most poor workers don't even vote!
Anonymous 2022-01-10 (Mon) 00:56:45 No. 684280
>>684269 Mate is not unease, are you retarded?
Anonymous 2022-01-10 (Mon) 00:59:24 No. 684282
>>684277 Failed to install an Anti-Russia regime like in Ukraine. The riots in Almaty and Nursultan were of different character than the protests elsewhere.
Anonymous 2022-01-10 (Mon) 00:59:42 No. 684283
>>684280 Watch the whole video, the interviewees resist his simplistic spins. And Mate is better than the rest, imagine Ben Norton in his role lol.
Anonymous 2022-01-10 (Mon) 01:00:08 No. 684284
>>684268 Why?
Communism, Marxism-Leninism, is not "eastern" or "western".
Anonymous 2022-01-10 (Mon) 01:00:57 No. 684285
The thread has degenerated into an autistic contest of personalities as always. Has anyone here tried to do some digging to see what activists and demonstrators in Kazakhstan are reporting? Is it possible with the blackout? Media orgs are not doing investigations so information is still high-level and sparse.
Anonymous 2022-01-10 (Mon) 01:01:53 No. 684286
>>684283 I watched the whole video by the time it was published, he was never unease, lmao. He acknowledges Putin's problems, but the the difference between Putin and westerner politicians is that most of the populations DO vote and participate in the voting process, and Putin is pretty much liked by most polls in different regions.
Anonymous 2022-01-10 (Mon) 01:02:09 No. 684287
>>684284 because your identification with lenin, your past comment that you were 60 percent lenin, your extreme defense of the soviet union and etc
I dont hear this from anglos, i hear this from eastern europeans
Anonymous 2022-01-10 (Mon) 01:02:53 No. 684288
>>684285 Internet is back in KZ.
Anonymous 2022-01-10 (Mon) 01:03:19 No. 684289
>>684288 So where are the reports from locals?
Sage !61KGLATVW. 2022-01-10 (Mon) 01:03:54 No. 684290
just to set all this info down in one post:
>Land reform is an extremely sensitive topic in Kazakhstan. In 2003, when the Land Code was introduced, legalizing the notion of private property for the first time in Kazakhstan, people protested and the controversy forced Prime Minister Imangali Tasmagambetov to resign. With 43 percent of the workforce residing in rural regions and 18 percent of the workforce engaged in agriculture, modifications to the Land Code directly impacts a significant portion of the population. Plus, Kazakhs possess an intimate relationship with land; they fought against warring, nomadic tribes for hundreds of years to secure the territory, and view land as the source of all life. There is a Kazakh saying, “land is mother, and you do not rent out your mother.” It appears, that the presidents mother is for rent, a whore
In the interests of neutrality, i will post the dubious partnerships of this paper, the diplomat,
"The Diplomat has entered into formal partnerships with influential public policy and news organizations. One of the most prominent is the Center for Strategic and International Studies (CSIS). Through a partnership with CSIS's Pacific Forum Young Leaders Programme, The Diplomat provides insights and analysis from its staff and collaborators.[citation needed] The Diplomat also maintains partnerships with RealClearWorld, ENN Environmental News Network, the Foreign Policy Centre, The Interpreter, Danwei, ChinaHush, Institute for Defence Studies and Analyses, Global Radio News, International Affairs Forum, the Atlantic Sentinel, China Talking Points, War Is Boring, East–West Center, Foreword, and the Vivekananda International Foundation."
however, they also said in that article
"Dossayev’s announcement of supposedly sweeping land reforms took the country by surprise, prompting individuals in major metropolitan to gather in the streets to protest the bill. They (falsely) claimed that the law that would grant foreigners the right to purchase land. The backlash ultimately forced Dossayev and Agricultural Minister Asylzhan Mamytbekov to resign."
so again, although this has washington think tank fingerprints, it doesn't really come down on the side of the protestors, and the actual facts it talks about, land reform and so on, are repeated in other source
https://thediplomat.com/2021/04/kazakhstan-moves-toward-ban-on-sale-rental-of-agricultural-lands-by-foreigners/ here is also a more up to date article from this year, it appears that the president has bowed to protests, and the moratorium on selling of land to foriegners has been expanded indefinitely, it is worth noting the author of the article in the diplomat appears to be against this decision, favouring privatisation. Although it says a bill has had its first reading, it does not say if it passed
https://www.world-nuclear.org/information-library/country-profiles/countries-g-n/kazakhstan.aspx this is an article which details of the international relationships of Kazakhstans uranium mining, which include Russia, China, Japan, the USA, Canada, France, India and Iran
"In April 2017 Kazatomprom announced the formation of a Swiss-based trading subsidiary TH Kazatom, to bring greater liquidity to the uranium market from late in the year. It will buy and sell on the spot market as part of its corporate transformation to align its pricing mechanism with “the way our customers want to buy”, especially in European and US markets."
https://www.trade.gov/energy-resource-guide-oil-and-gas-kazakhstan https://www.nato.int/cps/en/natohq/topics_49598.htm (this one courtesy of the pre eminent leninhat)
>Kazakhstan’s cooperation with NATO is mutually beneficial and includes: >Kazakhstan plays an active role in both hosting and participating in PfP training and exercises. Since 2006, in cooperation with NATO Allies and regional partners, >Kazakhstan has hosted annual military exercises called “Steppe Eagle”. >Kazakhstan’s PfP Training Centre (KAZCENT) was accredited by NATO as a Partnership Training and Education Centre in December 2010. KAZCENT offers annual courses open to Allies and partner countries on military English and NATO staff procedures, and a familiarisation course on the history, economy and culture of Central Asia and Afghanistan. Moreover, two United Nations courses were certified in 2018. >NATO’s Defence Education Enhancement Programme (DEEP) began working in Kazakhstan in 2007 with the Kazakhstan National Defence University, helping ensure that programmes and methodologies meet international standards. Cooperation was later expanded to include KAZCENT, the Non-Commissioned Officer Training Centre and the Army Defence Institute. DEEP programmes in support of KAZCENT, the Non-Commissioned Officer Training Centre, and the Army Defence Institute have all successfully concluded, while support for the National Defence University remains ongoing. >Since 2014, under the Partnership Interoperability Initiative, Kazakhstan has participated in the Interoperability Platform, which brings Allies together with 23 selected partners that are active contributors to NATO’s operations. >Wider cooperation >Kazakhstan is enhancing its national civil preparedness and disaster management capabilities in cooperation with NATO, and through participation in activities organised by the Euro-Atlantic Disaster Response Coordination Centre (EADRCC). Kazakhstan participated in five consequence management field exercises (2003-2012) and the country hosted the EADRCC’s “ZHETSYU” exercise near Almaty in 2009. Kazakhstan also offered assistance to Allies and partner countries affected by natural and man-made disasters, following eight urgent EADRCC requests for international assistance. >Kazakhstan has been actively engaged within the framework of the NATO Science for Peace and Security (SPS) Programme since 1993. At present, the leading areas for cooperation include environmental security and defence against chemical, biological, radiological and nuclear agents. >Increasing public awareness of NATO and the benefits of its relations with Kazakhstan is also an important area of cooperation. https://www.jpost.com/opinion/israel-kazakhstan-celebrating-30-years-of-cooperation-opinion-688968 freindship with USSR ended, now Israel is my new best friend
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ehud_Olmert the author of this article i.e. former israeli prime minister
https://www.jpost.com/Business/Kazakhstan-seeks-to-increase-oil-exports-to-Israel Anonymous 2022-01-10 (Mon) 01:05:02 No. 684293
>>684285 It's another form of idpol and must be opposed.
Anonymous 2022-01-10 (Mon) 01:06:57 No. 684294
>>684284 >Communism, Marxism-Leninism, is not "eastern" or "western". Maybe in some abstract space where imperialism doesn't exist. In reality Western """MLism""" is very different.
Anonymous 2022-01-10 (Mon) 01:07:34 No. 684296
>>684037 They go to that conclusion because they only listen to western propaganda portraying it as such.
Sage !61KGLATVW. 2022-01-10 (Mon) 01:07:35 No. 684297
>>684285 idk, i think it is one of the better threads, a robust debate, sources posted. So long as sources are being posted, contested, accepted and declined, the thread is good IMO, that way people can actually learn.
Anonymous 2022-01-10 (Mon) 01:07:52 No. 684299
Juan Guaido has proclaimed himself as the interim president of Kazakhstan
Sage !61KGLATVW. 2022-01-10 (Mon) 01:08:42 No. 684300
>>684299 its another clue that nobody did this, the west didn't have a preferred candidate, or movement, etc etc, they all backed the government there.
Sage !61KGLATVW. 2022-01-10 (Mon) 01:10:34 No. 684302
>>684282 Specifically who was trying to do this, who were they trying to install, and how were those other riots different in character? They all seemed to be about the same thing to me, oil prices, living conditions, specifically wages and prices.
Anonymous 2022-01-10 (Mon) 01:10:41 No. 684303
>>684287 >because your identification with lenin, your past comment that you were 60 percent lenin, your extreme defense of the soviet union I don't "identify" with Lenin personally, I just use the hat because I think it's a good symbol, I am a Marxist-Leninist and I think he was the greatest revolutionary genius. Reading him I just know he was right and the hatred he inspires among capitalists only makes me like him more. Don't know what you mean about 60% Lenin and why wouldn't I defend the USSR? It was a great bastion that inspired hundreds of millions of proletarians to stand up on their own feet and shook the world. 1917 completely changed the world in every way and we need to finish its goal of world communist revolution.
Anonymous 2022-01-10 (Mon) 01:11:43 No. 684304
>>684298 Is there more detail on the arrest of the interior minister?
Anonymous 2022-01-10 (Mon) 01:15:20 No. 684308
>>684304 I think earlier in the thread some conspiracy theories, mixed with some reality, were posted, which the pictures of the arrested ex-minister were posing with Joe Biden. But then again, le posing picture meme is not conclussive.
Anonymous 2022-01-10 (Mon) 01:18:46 No. 684314
>>684294 lol here we go with the Duginist drivel about the natural superiority of the pure east over the decadent west.
Revisionism is a problem among communists of all lands. Nobody blames Khrushchevite revisionism or Dengism on a mystical inherent nature of the "east" do they? Despite originating in "eastern" lands. It's idealist bullshit from the cold war.
The victory of world communism cannot come without the victory of revolution in all lands, western Europe and North America included. All great Marxist-Leninists knew this and considered proletarians of all nations their comrades.
In any case, communists today in Britain and Russia are both in the same situation. We both live under the boot of capitalists. And the solution is the same as it always has been.
Anonymous 2022-01-10 (Mon) 01:19:02 No. 684318
>>684303 you long time ago said a comment that you were 60 percent lenin character wise except that you arent bald
i remember it and you said it to a guy you were fighting with
Anonymous 2022-01-10 (Mon) 01:21:27 No. 684322
>>684303 >why wouldn't I defend the USSR? also its not that you are defending the ussr that makes you like eastern european. its how you defend the ussr, and how extreme you are defending it. the way you defend it usually comes from eastern europeans, and not anglos and because of that i thought you were eastern european
Anonymous 2022-01-10 (Mon) 01:22:10 No. 684326
>>684302 One possibility, NED backed groups trying to install the interior minister or Nazarbayev. The evidence is that Tokaev was not able to deploy secret police when the protests started. Obviously the plan was half baked and failed. The beheaddings and the attacks on military armories in the capital and Almaty did not repeat elsewhere but we don't know for certain if the head choppers and NED backed rioters were one in the same. I would say the protests in the whole country were predominantly economic protesters, but in key centers of state power, there were NED plants, and possibly even islamists. However the majority was worker's protests.
If we believe all protests to be one general movement then it's possible that the interior minister was /ourguy/ and a communist trying to turn protests into revolution. Given that he's the only government official getting arrested. But it doubt that given
>>684308 Anonymous 2022-01-10 (Mon) 01:24:15 No. 684332
The PCUSA General Secretary sent out this email. I copy and pasted it for you guys:
Anonymous 2022-01-10 (Mon) 01:24:29 No. 684333
>>684300 The US government may be shutting up because their plans may be foiled. Look at all of the color revolutions in the past few years. Most of them were run by Republicans and most of them ended up being a flop. If the (smarter) Democratic feds were quiet this whole time, and if this thing ended up flopping against their favor, they will just shut up and pretend to be competent.
Sage !61KGLATVW. 2022-01-10 (Mon) 01:25:27 No. 684334
>>684326 so, one thing we have not seen anything of, which you would expect to in such a situation, if it was a colour revolution against a popular leader, is any counter protestors whatsoever.
Where is the Kazahks for Tokaev? Haven't heard a peep from them
Anonymous 2022-01-10 (Mon) 01:27:06 No. 684335
>>684318 Can promise you I've never said that lol.
Anonymous 2022-01-10 (Mon) 01:27:09 No. 684336
https://www.ned.org/region/latin-america-and-caribbean/colombia-2020/ Look at all the NED groups in Colombia.
Oh wait why does Ben Norton and moon of Alabama and such not bring that up EVER!! Oh right because won't fit their argument since they want Colombia government removed so they don't want to argue that protestors were backed by NED
GUYS THE PROTEST IN COLOMBIA WERE A COLOR REVOLUTION BY NED AGAINST THE COLOMBIA. GOVERNMENT!!
see why this argument is retarded? You need to display actual evidence protesters are being backed
Anonymous 2022-01-10 (Mon) 01:28:02 No. 684338
>>684336 And you don't want the Colombian government removed?
Sage !61KGLATVW. 2022-01-10 (Mon) 01:28:15 No. 684339
>>684333 >thinking the feds change when the bloo or red changes they don't.
their plans are going smoothly, that is, until this protest movement, i say again, and now I am going to focus on nothing else, you pro colour revolution posters must answer to all of this:
>>684290 everything contained in there, operation steppe eagle, the israeli connection, Tony Blair doing spin, the NATO drills, all of it.
Sage !61KGLATVW. 2022-01-10 (Mon) 01:28:58 No. 684340
>>684338 Columbia, the israel of latin America.
Anonymous 2022-01-10 (Mon) 01:30:11 No. 684343
>>684338 Yes i do. I'm showing that NED funding isn't the defining cause of what is or isn't a color revolution. There is NED funding in over 90s countries and far more NGOs of other types as well.
They use this NED shtick only when it fits their argument they want to make and don't bring it up when it's something they oppose
Anonymous 2022-01-10 (Mon) 01:32:02 No. 684348
>>684322 Perhaps it comes from Eastern European Marxist-Leninists, rather than Eastern Europeans in general?
What is it I say that makes you think that?
In any case I hope you realise there are plenty of genuine communists outside of Eastern Europe.
Anonymous 2022-01-10 (Mon) 01:32:52 No. 684349
>>684334 Tokaev is not popular though. Why would anyone risk their life defending him?
Anonymous 2022-01-10 (Mon) 01:37:07 No. 684353
>>684340 >>684338 Ben Norton has brought up NED funding in Colombia ZERO 0 TIMES
Yet brings it up for every country he opposes. Why is that? Because he only uses it when it fits his argument
Anonymous 2022-01-10 (Mon) 01:37:56 No. 684355
>>684336 The problem is that Colombia government is a lackey towards the U.S., not like Kazakhastan which is more weasely towards what they want. Fuck, Kazhak agreed to share stuff with sanctioned/embargoed Cuba.
Sage !61KGLATVW. 2022-01-10 (Mon) 01:38:08 No. 684356
>>684349 leading me to believe its people rioting against their shitcunt, no good, imperial puppet president none of them like, who has driven the country into the ground for his own enrichment, even his armed forces bailed on him, so he had to call in Russia.
Anonymous 2022-01-10 (Mon) 01:39:39 No. 684359
>>684353 You don't see Colombia wanting to share stuff with Cuba, either way.
Sage !61KGLATVW. 2022-01-10 (Mon) 01:40:13 No. 684360
>>684353 I'm with you man, although i do indulge in the grayzone I have to admit, I think he is possibly wrong on the Kazahk thing, and in general he is a snarky cunt and quite one note.
Although he does speak out against the columbian government a lot and they don't need to NED it because they have simply had control of the legislature for like the last 80 years or whatever. (hence why FARC are based)
Sage !61KGLATVW. 2022-01-10 (Mon) 01:41:05 No. 684362
>>684355 Mate if you do the NATO drills, form an anti terror alliance with Israel, etc etc, you're a lackey.
If you're not a lackey, Tony Blair won't do your spin.
Anonymous 2022-01-10 (Mon) 01:42:31 No. 684367
>>684356 That's an irrational conclusion not backed by evidence because the evidence doesn't exist yet. Let's be patient.
Anonymous 2022-01-10 (Mon) 01:42:37 No. 684368
>>684360 I'm just looking to lay out this fallacy. If protestors are angry and rightfully so and people find that some NGO group is in their country suddenly they can eat shit because now they are tied to that group by it existing where they live.
People need to actually find ties to protest leaders being part of groups, being funded by people, being part of foreign committees, being featured on other state interviews, calling for regime change by them etc.
Not just blame them for what happens to exist in their country.
Anonymous 2022-01-10 (Mon) 01:43:24 No. 684370
>>684362 Russia and China have shared drills with NATO members in the past. There are different degrees between co-operation up to the point being a sub-servient cuck.
Sage !61KGLATVW. 2022-01-10 (Mon) 01:45:03 No. 684371
>>684367 I mean, there is proof of the shitcunt, no good, imperail puppet part, and he has driven the country into the ground for his own enrichment. All of that I wouldn't consider up for debate, the nature of the protests sure, but the lack of any popular opposition to them at all, not even one he can conjure up and parade on TV like the infamous gweedo, makes it seems true
Anonymous 2022-01-10 (Mon) 01:46:05 No. 684374
>>684370 There are also different levels of NATO membership, Turkey for example is kept out of NATO's more secretive meetings.
Anonymous 2022-01-10 (Mon) 01:47:20 No. 684375
>>684370 Yeah cos they're both capitalist states, 1 ruled by open compradors, the other not so open.
Sage !61KGLATVW. 2022-01-10 (Mon) 01:49:09 No. 684376
>>684370 Yes China has even shared the occupation of Afghanistan with Israel/US etc before, I am aware, you will see people screaming at me about it from time to time. There are certain notable countries which do not participate in NATO drills. Which are these? The undeniably based.
Although yeh, perhaps there is context to do NATO drills, in certain situations, but is that context here in this situation? You tell me what unequivoal evil, a threat shared by all, comprador and communist alike, which must be vanquished, that Kazakhstan faces? For which they must ally with NATO relectantly to defeat this foe?
Anonymous 2022-01-10 (Mon) 01:50:08 No. 684378
>>684349 https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2019_Kazakh_presidential_election I don't know what poll have you seen, but Tokayev, with a turn out with 77.% held 71% of the votes, he was a popular candidate. Although you see violence by the time of the voting. I would lie to understand if this is related to ethnic Rssians.
Anonymous 2022-01-10 (Mon) 01:50:13 No. 684379
>>684232 German is a nice language. It sounds very pleasant. It's also the language of Marx, Engels, Bebel, Liebknecht, Luxemburg, Thaelmann, plus Ernst Busch songs are class.
If anything German is THE communist language (not that such a thing exists) given the history and I always liked the word Genosse.
Anonymous 2022-01-10 (Mon) 01:52:29 No. 684382
>>684277 >It would barely be enough to buy off one general. Again exposing your ignorance. The US doesn't go for the "top level" officials in the opening stages of a color revolution, they need to generate the appearance of a grassroots movement so they target AVERAGE PEOPLE for bribes and for leading opposition protests.
The average monthly wage of a Kazakhstan worker is 249349 KZT. In 2020 it was around 200000 KZT.
Translated into USD that's 575/month.
Let's also assume for the sake of being a retarded contrarian that these bribed opportunists don't have their own jobs and relied solely on NED funding instead of just treating it as a just a side gig and also didn't defray their own labour costs through advertising on their media outlets and other sources of non-recorded income (all scenarios which are highly likely!) so multiply that by 12.
575 x 12 = 6900 USD/Year divided by approx. 1M USD (where they fuck did you get the 400k number from; I literally said in my post that my screenshots were not even the full extent of NED funding) is enough for 144 full-time "activists" working around the clock while being paid a premium by USG and not anything else.
For reference, Nexta in Belarus which was the main project in charge of coordinating opposition activists was a blatant skeleton crew with like 10 people max feeding off volunteer contributions. The opposition Belarusian "Coordinating Council" had around 60 staff. You can do a lot with small staff numbers if you can seize on discontent and ride the wave. And Nexta is even being reused for Kazakhstan fucking amazing!
Anonymous 2022-01-10 (Mon) 02:03:23 No. 684394
P1: All ”protests" outside of the imperial core are Color Revolutions. (For example, Belarus, Cuba, Hong Kong, Venezuela)
Sage !61KGLATVW. 2022-01-10 (Mon) 02:05:00 No. 684397
>>684382 >1M USD (where they fuck did you get the 400k number from by adding up all the numbers shown in your post. Where did you get 1m from? Some other source you haven't shown? Okay. Show it?
Of course, if you double the available numbers, they will seem higher…
Given the information you have shown, we will therefore account for 72 full time activists.
Belarus also has a population of 9 million people, Kazahstan has twice that.
Nexta is a media outlet of course the staff is low.
Also, of the selection you gave, a large number of these are legal aid, so it won't be your average salary, it will be people earning a lawyers salary at least.
You also, again, haven't given the source if this, which I asked for
Anonymous 2022-01-10 (Mon) 02:05:01 No. 684398
>>684394 4/5 correct, pretty good heuristic.
Sage !61KGLATVW. 2022-01-10 (Mon) 02:06:02 No. 684400
>>684398 ah, so when venzuelans protest against imperialism for maduro, thats a colour revolution. Anti Anez protests were also a colour revolution.. i see.
Anonymous 2022-01-10 (Mon) 02:11:14 No. 684406
>>684382 Reducing Russian influence by getting Russian troops sent there immediately. Right.
Unlike Belarus which had an election that liberals got mad about when Lukashenko won, the same didn't happen in Kazakhstan, plus the demonstrations started among oil workers over prices and the country already works with NATO regimes. Kazakhstan is a much bigger country than Belarus as well so that money if it was sent wouldn't do much.
The logical endpoint of the "colour revolution" mentality is that no protest can ever happen in a non- NATO country without the USA somehow being involved, that workers are dumb sheep who can't oppose their own national bourgeoisie that exploits them because the USA might get involved somehow, that everything is orchestrated by elites, that it's better to do nothing because someone might try to exploit chaos. Well fuck that, it's a demoralisation tactic aimed at paralysing the will of the proletariat to fight. The Bolsheviks knew full well that their revolution would lead to a civil war, but they overthrew the bourgeois provisional government anyway.
USA and Russia aren't rivals. That's something people always assume axiomatically but it's false. The bourgeoisie always close ranks when it comes to fighting the bourgeoisie, and that's what drives them. They want to win the class war for good.
Anonymous 2022-01-10 (Mon) 02:13:06 No. 684409
>>684400 Alright, we're down to 4/8. Maybe not so good. Which means the criteria need to be improved.
Anonymous 2022-01-10 (Mon) 02:23:07 No. 684416
>>684394 >protests" outside of the imperial core are Color Revolutions. (For example, Belarus, Cuba, Hong Kong, Venezuela) Lmao, and what of protests in India, Chile, Iraq, Greece, Colombia? Russian communists protesting last September against election fraud and arrests of communists a colour revolution? Protests against lockdowns in Guadeloupe?
Anonymous 2022-01-10 (Mon) 02:26:50 No. 684420
>>684406 can't believe i'm agreeing with leninhat on something but it's true
Anonymous 2022-01-10 (Mon) 02:31:57 No. 684429
>>684416 Keeping the conclusion, those countries are becoming part and are therefore part of the imperial core.
sage sage 2022-01-10 (Mon) 02:39:15 No. 684439
>>684397 It's taken from the official NED website which is a literal google search away you lazy ass. People IN THIS THREAD have already linked to it for other countries. Just google NED Kazakhstan.
I even said:
>>684242 >Here's just a sample of NED funding for opposition movements >a sample >a sample And you treated two screenshots as the be all end all of funding when I explicitly made clear it was only a small selection.
>>684400 So when The Grayzone and MoA both defended Maduro in Venezuela and MAS/Morales in Bolivia against America were you still complaining about how they're "zionist" "fascist" "defending comprador bourgeoisie" and the other bullshit you've hurled out in this thread alone? When Maduro himself was interviewed by The Grayzone and Anya was resisting the embassy closure were you screaming about how muh socdems are the twin pole of fascism?
>>684406 With this retarded logic WW1 should have never happened because the bourgeoisie were all united. The fact of the matter is that the bourgeoisie do not comprise of one sole outlook and there are multiple factions.
Anonymous 2022-01-10 (Mon) 02:41:39 No. 684443
>>684439 You ignored my post about NED funding in Colombia. Read my post below if you can and respond
>>684336 >>684353 >>684368 Anonymous 2022-01-10 (Mon) 02:43:44 No. 684446
>>684443 NTA, but I responded you, here:
>>684355 and here
>>684359 Anonymous 2022-01-10 (Mon) 02:55:35 No. 684458
>>684439 >>684443 Reminder NED is also funding the elected Chilean president, Gabriel Boric, too.
sage sage 2022-01-10 (Mon) 03:15:46 No. 684498
>>684458 Nice easily debunked lie.
>>684443 >>684446 has already pointed out the difference. Columbia is the staunchest ally of America in the entire Latin American region while Kazakhstan has been willing to engage with both Russia and China. In addition every color revolution seizes upon some genuine grievance.
Solidarity was a fucking trade union made up of workers who were supposedly pushing the Communist authorities "from the Left". If "genuine grievance" is all you need to support something then you might as well join up with the Ukranians.
Anonymous 2022-01-10 (Mon) 04:19:16 No. 684613
>>684427 That's why americans are keeping silent - they fear getting blasted the fuck out of Kazakhstan like from Afghanistan (+ property of american companies getting nationalized).
Anonymous 2022-01-10 (Mon) 04:22:07 No. 684619
>>684437 >russian economy slows down It's not degenerating, unlike some, though.
Anonymous 2022-01-10 (Mon) 04:35:51 No. 684650
>>684220 What the fuck, how dare you attribute those gains won by the (revisionist) USSR for the whole world (by the virtue of providing alternative market to the West's) to socdemery?
Anonymous 2022-01-10 (Mon) 04:40:59 No. 684657
>>684650 >USSR >Revisionist u better not come in this neighborhood talking shit again bucko
Anonymous 2022-01-10 (Mon) 05:03:43 No. 684686
U.s embassy to Kazakhstan says Kazakhstan has always been a trusted friend of the United States
Also says nothing negative about government doing any killings. Best friends stand together against those dirty protestors messing with enterprises!
https://twitter.com/USembassyKAZ/status/1480396231566401538?s=20 Anonymous 2022-01-10 (Mon) 05:07:03 No. 684692
>>684498 Ukraine communist party themselves called euromaiden a color revolution.
You are poorly informed about what is going on and what happened then
Anonymous 2022-01-10 (Mon) 05:09:40 No. 684697
>>684686 Blinken did say something about the shooting without asking about policy. Perhaps they are being smarter is not screeching their stuff and getting immediate backlash.
>>684692 In the beginning, they supported the maidan, this info is repeated in this same thread.
Anonymous 2022-01-10 (Mon) 05:13:27 No. 684701
>>684697 Yeah blinken said saying you will shoot civilians is bad. That's it.
If Russia sent 3000 soldiers into Ukraine the usa would be going ballistic and crazy all over media and demanding sanctions. They hardly comment on this
Usa has great relations with Kazakhstan government financially and in relations, they are fine with this president.
The Communist party of Ukraine quickly when they saw what the euromaiden was demanded that all international leftist parties condemn it as a color revolution and refused to support it. Read statement above
Anonymous 2022-01-10 (Mon) 05:56:24 No. 684760
>>684709 Russia doesn't talk about Kazakhstan ever either. Central Asia, except Afghanistan and Iran, is a completely silent place with zero media coverage, usually. Ukraine in comparison is brought up constantly. There being silence about Kazakhstan is barely a metric of anything, really.
Anonymous 2022-01-10 (Mon) 06:08:34 No. 684776
>>684760 Disagree completely because right now there is an event in Kazakhstan and Russia media will not shut up about it posting non stop trying their hardest to shit on protestors from any angle they can.
Meanwhile the usa officials are giving short comments on focusing on other matters.
Anonymous 2022-01-10 (Mon) 06:10:29 No. 684779
>>684732 You claimed the NED funded Boric and now you shifted the goalposts to "they funded a think tank that didn't even participate in the election or ran any candidates".
Btw the NED search went for the past 3 years meaning there was zero funding for the past three years for even this think tank.
And then you circle Luksic Group which again is not the US government but Chilean business.
The Chilean Left is a coalition not a Communist-only electoral vehicle it's a given that there will be figures of dubious trustworthiness on the margins (assuming that this think tank even poses as "left") but the Western press was shilling against Boric hard the entire campaign.
Anonymous 2022-01-10 (Mon) 06:14:06 No. 684782
>>684779 >Western press was shilling against Boric hard the entire campaign LMAO what. There is so many glowing articles about him praising him in western media
Anonymous 2022-01-10 (Mon) 06:23:39 No. 684791
>>684787 Mises is a right wing libertarian think tank. This is like linking me fox news shitting on Biden and saying that means something.
Anonymous 2022-01-10 (Mon) 06:26:05 No. 684796
>>684787 The major papers see boric for what he is. A harmless socdem. That is what is desired
Usa is never going to sanction this guy
https://apnews.com/article/business-elections-caribbean-chile-santiago-a34155914d0051720a23faf3de661e48 Anonymous 2022-01-10 (Mon) 06:34:42 No. 684805
>>684803 BBC news also has nothing but praise for boric. Great guy to them
.
https://www.bbc.com/news/world-latin-america-59694056 Anonymous 2022-01-10 (Mon) 06:56:42 No. 684826
>>684776 Yes, and before that there was no news about Kazakhstan ever - even during Zhanaozen protests it was merely a sidenote. Same approach as USA takes today.
sage sage 2022-01-10 (Mon) 06:58:38 No. 684828
>>684791 >Ignoring every other source to focus on one guy AlJazeera is a major newspaper
JerusalemPost is a major newspaper
One of the articles has a guy working for the Council of the Americas which is as porky as you can get and a visible arm of US influence in the entire region.
Even the Fitch credit ratings agency is pissed.
>US is never going to sanction this guy If Michelle fucking Bachelet had to deal with credit rating manipulations then Boric will get fucked as well.
>>684805 >>684803 >>684796 Notice how these were all AFTER the election victory when the scale of his victory became clear and it was obvious there was not much popular support for the Right.
Meanwhile, both The Economist and NYT were scaremongering and painting people as super conflicted in the lead up to the election.
And the FT is firmly against Boric as well.
You say a guy from Mises shouldn't be trusted, well let me tell you something CNN and AP are nothing compared to The Economist and FT, which are the most consistent voices of the global bourgeoisie.
Anonymous 2022-01-10 (Mon) 09:14:07 No. 684916
>>682934 Ngl, a 50% raise would improve my life dramatically. Happy for the guys.
Anonymous 2022-01-10 (Mon) 09:32:47 No. 684926
Some of the big brains in this thread seem to entertain this convenient Cold War fantasy that all capitalist governments are perfectly aligned with each other
Anonymous 2022-01-10 (Mon) 10:06:41 No. 684951
So is that it? Is it over?
Anonymous 2022-01-10 (Mon) 10:50:35 No. 684984
>Colonel of National Security Committee Azamat Ibraev was found dead in the courtyard of his residence in Nur-Sultan. >Reportedly had fallen out of the window(suicide)
Sage !61KGLATVW. 2022-01-10 (Mon) 12:56:35 No. 685112
>>684984 "falling out a window" is literally in the CIA assassination handbook
Sage !61KGLATVW. 2022-01-10 (Mon) 12:57:20 No. 685113
>>684951 Yes, now it joins board cannon and every month or so we have this exact same thread, then a mod gets BTFO in a discussion and it becomes banned for a bit
Anonymous 2022-01-10 (Mon) 12:59:42 No. 685117
>>684984 Move over Czechs, Kazakhs are the new champions of defenestration.
Sage !61KGLATVW. 2022-01-10 (Mon) 13:13:53 No. 685128
>>684439 >It's taken from the official NED website which is a literal google search away you lazy ass. which I have now done, still doesn't matter lmao, post your sources don't just post random images. It is not my fault if you don't name a source.
So yes, now I have done this, well done, just over a million dollars from the NED in Kazakhstan.
… its still chump change.
By contrast, Venezuela got 3.2 million from the NED, population 28 m so 10m more population, 3 x the funding, and they have an actual socialist in power
no, lol. I also, haven't said either of those things, but you can't fucking read, what I said was, Kazahkstan is a zionist comprador state, which it is, which there is lots of evidence of. Which has been posted in this thread.
Anonymous 2022-01-10 (Mon) 13:16:21 No. 685134
>>685128 https://www.ned.org/region/latin-america-and-caribbean/colombia-2020/ Use spends $2.3 million on NED funding in Colombia
Ben Norton crew WILL NEVER EVER SAY THAT. Doesn't fit their narrative.
Sage !61KGLATVW. 2022-01-10 (Mon) 13:24:37 No. 685145
Vijay Prashads takes
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=icdAA_pqbR4 >supposedly bitcoin miners angry at energy price rises, doesn't dwell on it >says many people have been angry for years >head of state is a proxy for former head of government >not exactly sure where this is going to go >government has long history of using brute force against any kind of uprising >they have shut down the internet and shut down the energy grids going to bitcoin miners >neighbouring Afghanistan >some people are talking about colour revolution, not sure what that means half the time but that phrase is in circulation >its an enormous uprising, government has resigned Anonymous 2022-01-10 (Mon) 13:39:54 No. 685162
>>685134 >Doesn't fit their narrative. Why not? NED can do just as much "good work" fortifying a client as it can undermining an opponent.
Anonymous 2022-01-10 (Mon) 13:45:30 No. 685166
>>685162 Ask Ben why he will he never make such a case. I could answer it for you in my view
It would damage the veracity of him being able to instantly claim to onlookers who don't even research these websites that NED exist in over 90 countries on top of so many other NGOs
He loves that he can just link "this exist in this country" and that's it he now has hundreds maybe thousands depending on how viral his post goes change their position on a dime and adopt the view he wants
The reality is that you are correct. Correct for the same reason Ben is wrong. Ned can be used both ways and can be entirely irrelevant at all, the protestors can be entirely separate from it and never even heard of these groups. They can also be helped by them or be opposed by them
But people like Ben Norton do not want to get into all that nuance, they want to quickly target people and movements harshly so they can push their agenda.
Anonymous 2022-01-10 (Mon) 14:03:04 No. 685180
>>685179 He dosent ignore Colombia at all. He covers what happens there and does it well. He deserves praise for that for sure
I just take issue with the selective use of Ned funding argument.
Anonymous 2022-01-10 (Mon) 14:12:36 No. 685184
>>685140 Does Tokayev actually exist? He looks like a CGI. Is there any real evidence of him meeting other people in person?
Anonymous 2022-01-10 (Mon) 14:32:06 No. 685195
Here is your anti imperialist president Putin bros lol
https://twitter.com/TokayevKZ/status/1480523801918160904?s=20 (This is president of Kazakhstan)
Anonymous 2022-01-10 (Mon) 14:39:47 No. 685201
>>685128 >VZ NED That money probably went directly to Juan Guaido
>Kazahkstan is a zionist comprador state, This wouldn't necessarily be evidence of much. USA could still say it's not enough. CTSO etc. Not all porkies on same side
Anonymous 2022-01-10 (Mon) 15:16:31 No. 685233
>>685112 Yeah, nobody else knows how to throw a guy out the window.
Anonymous 2022-01-10 (Mon) 15:44:40 No. 685262
>>685184 He has the deadest eyes I've ever seen on a politician. Like a Central Asian Zuckerberg.
Anonymous 2022-01-10 (Mon) 17:13:37 No. 685345
>>684926 They 100% are when it comes to fighting the proletariat, and 99% of the other time.
>>684911 Based
Anonymous 2022-01-10 (Mon) 17:16:08 No. 685349
>>684439 >With this retarded logic WW1 should have never happened because the bourgeoisie were all united. The fact of the matter is that the bourgeoisie do not comprise of one sole outlook and there are multiple factions. When it comes to fighting the proletariat they act like a hive mind.
It's not 1914 any more. They got a rude awakening in 1917.
And even if it fucking WAS, it would nothing, because communists don't take sides in imperialist disputes.
Anonymous 2022-01-10 (Mon) 17:16:21 No. 685350
>>685339 >Now Russia is ready to continue the Eurasian Reconquista, that is, to finally kick out the pro-American networks, including the liberal-oligarchic traitor-compradors, from our entire zone of influence. Wow dugin is calling to kick out the president of Kazakhstan
Anonymous 2022-01-10 (Mon) 17:17:09 No. 685351
>>684926 In the case of Kazakhstan it's pretty clear that the various major centres of capital are behind the government.
Anonymous 2022-01-10 (Mon) 17:18:09 No. 685354
>>685350 >kick out the liberal-oligarchic traitor-compradors Not gonna happen lol, pure delusion.
Anonymous 2022-01-10 (Mon) 17:18:47 No. 685355
>>685350 Dugin is such a fascinating person
Anonymous 2022-01-10 (Mon) 17:19:37 No. 685356
>>685354 It's a very optimistic and utopian read what dugin wrote on that telegram. I wish it was real. He's good at writing
But its like qanon people too thinking Trump is going to accomplish all their dreams when Putin doesn't appear to have those goals dugin states at the moment
Anonymous 2022-01-10 (Mon) 17:21:26 No. 685358
Alexander Dugin, leader of the international Eurasian movement, editor-in-chief of the Katekhon portal, especially for Nezygar.
Anonymous 2022-01-10 (Mon) 17:22:30 No. 685360
Imagine thinking comprador leaders like Putin are going to go to war with NATO lmao.
Anonymous 2022-01-10 (Mon) 17:25:14 No. 685364
Protests, demonstrations and strikes in Kazakhstan are an expression of the resistance of the people and the working class to oppression and exploitation, which causes lawlessness, poverty, inflation and unemployment. The Kazakh regime, formed after the collapse of the USSR 30 years ago, ignores the needs of the people, denies democratic and social rights and uses violence against all resistance. Over the years, strikes and protests have been repeatedly suppressed, workers have been killed, trade unions have been banned, and the Communist Party and Socialist Movement of Kazakhstan have been illegal. Here the imperialist powers, including Russia, the United States, China and European states, collaborated and collaborated with the Kazakh regime around Nursultan Nazarbayev and his "successors" and henchmen with economic and geostrategic interests.
The resistance that is now erupting in offensive actions is legitimate and necessary. The Austrian Labor Party declares its solidarity with the Kazakh people and the working class, as well as with their illegal organizations and parties. The class struggle against the political and economic system, the national oligarchy and its imperialist allies finds our internationalist and solidary support.
The Austrian Labor Party demands:
an end to police and military violence against demonstrations, the withdrawal of the army from cities;
the release of political prisoners and arrested demonstrators;
the granting of workers' rights, including the right to strike and assembly, and the free formation of trade unions;
cancellation of the legalization of the Socialist Movement of Kazakhstan and the Communist Party of Kazakhstan;
no military and / or political interference by the imperialist powers, neither the United States, nor the EU, nor Russia, nor China;
the end of the authoritarian and repressive regime in Kazakhstan, which still consists of Nazarbayev's confidants;
for a peaceful transition to a democratic system in which the rights of the people and the working class are expressed;
for the transfer of Kazakhstani wealth, industries and resources into public ownership under the control of the working class.
http://socialismkz.info/?p=26859 Anonymous 2022-01-10 (Mon) 17:27:14 No. 685367
>>685345 >>685349 So the Russian, Iranian and Venezuelan porkies are all on the same side as the Western ones 99% of the time? So simplistic
>>685351 Sure, but that doesn't mean they are all aligned. The problem with most situations like this for anglosphere lefties is 1) this is the first time most of us have analyzed Kazakhstan in our entire lives, and 2) sometimes seeing behind the scenes of the Great Game is impossible
Anonymous 2022-01-10 (Mon) 17:28:57 No. 685370
>>685367 Kazakhstan seems a rare case in which Porkies from the whole world are sharing responsability for the plundering of the country.
Anonymous 2022-01-10 (Mon) 17:30:42 No. 685374
>>685367 >Russian, Iranian and Venezuelan porkies are all on the same side as the Western ones 99% of the time They have a shared interest in throttling the working class and enriching themselves at our expense. See
>>683878 Networks like the WEF exist for a reason.
Anonymous 2022-01-10 (Mon) 17:33:52 No. 685380
>>685367 >Sure, but that doesn't mean they are all aligned. On this issue it really seems like they are.
>this is the first time most of us have analyzed Kazakhstan in our entire lives Excellent point, which is why I recommend deferring to Kazakh comrades on this, and they back the protests.
Anonymous 2022-01-10 (Mon) 17:34:15 No. 685381
>>685374 Yes and their methods for doing so often put them at odds with each other. Not sure why that's so hard to admit
Anonymous 2022-01-10 (Mon) 17:40:04 No. 685387
>>685381 Not really.
There's no great competition between the USA and Russia. Their capitalists are tied by a million threads.
https://www.rt.com/business/461859-us-biggest-investor-russia/ Anonymous 2022-01-10 (Mon) 17:45:55 No. 685396
>>685375 Yeah, that is why the only side we should back in this are Kazakh communists.
On an unrelated note: Nato-Russia talks are taking place in Geneva and could be pretty important with regards to what will happen to Ukraine (and Georgia).
I invite some anon of good will to open a thread on it if possible.
Anonymous 2022-01-10 (Mon) 17:50:06 No. 685399
>>685387 it's not a binary whether countries (generalizations already) have or don't have oppositions and contradictions between each other. But if the fall of the USSR can't stop you from this fantasy then nothing will
Anonymous 2022-01-10 (Mon) 18:19:00 No. 685430
>>685396 If CSTO leaves Kaz before 'le cringe momento' can be manufactured in the Amazon Post tarring Russia, Putin looks reasonable in Ukraine.
'See, my armed forces are quick and humane unlike those monsters in (looks in rolodex) pick a country America has occupied/couped and replaced with unpopular right wing dictators/actual nazis in the last 100 years.'
I'm curious how China will respond vis Belt and Road but I am sure they are talking.
Anonymous 2022-01-10 (Mon) 18:19:42 No. 685431
>>683941 Source? This is important
Anonymous 2022-01-10 (Mon) 18:27:09 No. 685440
>>685364 >Protests, demonstrations and strikes in Kazakhstan are an expression of the resistance of the people and the working class to oppression and exploitation, which causes lawlessness, poverty, inflation and unemployment. Which started at American companies, resulted in Kazakh-owned Gazprom not forming, with the spoken aim of Chinese factories not getting built. Have some critical thinking, ffs.
Anonymous 2022-01-10 (Mon) 18:29:26 No. 685446
>>685364 Also,
China getting labelled imperialist is a sure sign that their opinion is bullshit.
Anonymous 2022-01-10 (Mon) 18:36:56 No. 685456
>>685440 Oh no poor Chinese billionaires. BTW they already own shitloads of oil in Kazakhstan and Kazakstan already has a GazProm called KazMunayGas, that was involved in the massacre of Kazakh workers in 2011.
https://www.yicaiglobal.com/news/--china-oil-and-gas-giant-wins-bidding-for-massive-oil-gas-exploration-block-in-kazakhstan That they started at American companies is also significant, in that Kazakh workers likely don't want American bourgeoisie robbing them.
Anonymous 2022-01-10 (Mon) 18:41:34 No. 685461
>>685456 >That they started at American companies is also significant, in that Kazakh workers likely don't want American bourgeoisie robbing them. But somehow as the result of the protest KazMunayGaz suffered setbacks, but not American companies. But in CURRENT protests, when Russia entered troops into Kazakhstan, suddenly it's American companies that had to increase wages. HUH. Really makes you think, doesn't it?
Anonymous 2022-01-10 (Mon) 18:50:16 No. 685481
>>685461 Lmao yeah sure vlasovite troops are the ones Kazakh workers have to thank.
Anonymous 2022-01-10 (Mon) 19:06:12 No. 685502
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fbJT_tvVa6U Yet another proof that protests were ALLOWED. Three high ranked Kazakh military/police officials were suddenly found dead. Meaning - you guessed it - they straight up allowed this shit to boil, thus they were removed as fast as possible.
Anonymous 2022-01-10 (Mon) 19:07:02 No. 685503
>>685481 Don't be ridiculous, it means that American corporations lost this time - due to Russian interference which was absent previous time.
Anonymous 2022-01-10 (Mon) 19:16:07 No. 685508
>>685502 I’m pretty sure they were murdered by the state for fucking up. Reminds me of the 90s where this happened all the time, at least that’s what I got as the jist with Putin’s interview with Oliver Stone
Anonymous 2022-01-10 (Mon) 19:21:53 No. 685513
>>685494 Don't threaten me with a good time!
>>685508 I think it's more indicative of an internal / palace coup. One faction of the ruling elite using protests and violence to eliminate another, or trying and failing and now being purged.
Anonymous 2022-01-10 (Mon) 19:33:29 No. 685527
>>685513 > Don't threaten me with a good time Are you a polycule on Facebook? I agree with your statements on this but that phrase is really common with Facebook sexpests.
Anonymous 2022-01-10 (Mon) 19:40:01 No. 685534
<More than 500 heads of state bodies and companies in the processing industry, agriculture, chemical, mining, and financial sectors, as well as metallurgy, alternative energy, logistics and digital technology sectors, attended the forum virtually. The Kazakh delegation was led by the country’s Foreign Minister Mukhtar Tileuberdi. https://astanatimes.com/2020/10/london-and-nur-sultan-host-virtual-investment-forum-explore-mutual-investment-opportunities/ Kazakhstan was already a comprador regime, Dungtards.
Capitalists of the world are united. From America to China, Britain to Brazil, Russia to France.
Anonymous 2022-01-10 (Mon) 19:41:46 No. 685537
I should say that I pretty strongly disagree with leningat on the issue of capitalist hive mind vis-a-vis the proletariat.
Anonymous 2022-01-10 (Mon) 19:50:17 No. 685545
>>685534 >Capitalists of the world are united. From America to China, Britain to Brazil, Russia to France. 10000% this.
Anonymous 2022-01-10 (Mon) 19:50:18 No. 685547
>>685537 >if we refuse to admit to and analyze the antagonisms and conflicting interests among the bourgeoisie we deprive ourselves of the possibility of exploiting these divisions for the movement's benefit In order for this to be viable people would have to stop screaming "colour revolution" at every outbreak of unrest in a non-Western aligned country. If multipolarity among capitalist powers like Russia and the US really is a desirable goal, then this is precisely because it allows them to be played off against one another to the benefit of our movement. The entire point of this is lost if we actually take sides in these conflicts between porkies instead of making cynical use of inter-imperialist opportunism. The entire advantage
of multipolarity lies in the fact that comrades in Moscow-aligned countries can make cynical use of Western support and vice versa, like the Bolsheviks did with the Germans or Viet Minh with the Americans. There's literally no benefit to multipolarity if you are so spooked by the potential for colour revolutions that you refuse to actually make use of it. Frankly, if Kazakh communists were to buy American rope only to hang the burgers with it later, there would he nothing wrong with this.
Anonymous 2022-01-10 (Mon) 19:57:00 No. 685551
>>685537 >invading the young soviet republics were each seeking to maximize thier share of the spoils That didn't stop them invading together and working together. The white Vrangel campaign of 1920 was deliberately launched together with the attack of the Polish whites towards Kiev.
Capitalists have never been more united today and there is frankly no real divisions among them. The Bolsheviks won because they raised the banner of class struggle, and that is ultimately the decisive factor in history, and what we need. Not stupid cheering on of differing groups of bourgeois because Dugin-addled idiots think they're anti-imperialist.
Anonymous 2022-01-10 (Mon) 20:04:54 No. 685557
>>685551 "Capitalists have never been more united today and there is frankly no real divisions among them"
The bourgeoisie by definition is a class divided against itself. What capitalism as a system is precisely logics of the competition between individual capitals for relative individual profit and market share.
After all its not like we live in planned economy run by a cabal of people called capitalists.
Anonymous 2022-01-10 (Mon) 20:07:42 No. 685561
>>685547 >The entire point of this is lost if we actually take sides in these conflicts between porkies I don't like Putin either, he's an anti-communist reactionary, however him and Xi are right now the only geopolitical entities that prevent the Anglo empire and NATO/OTAN from taking over world hegemony.
Anonymous 2022-01-10 (Mon) 20:19:32 No. 685573
>>685561 >however him and Xi are right now the only geopolitical entities that prevent the Anglo empire and NATO/OTAN from taking over world hegemony So? Leaving Xi and China aside for a moment, why is Putin and Russia any better than NATO? Because they're weaker? Our enemy isn't any particular capitalist empire, it's the capitalist system itself which inevitably produces imperialism. You could smash NATO and the US empire tomorrow, but it would make literally no meaningful difference if capitalism remained the dominant mode of production. Western imperialism would be replaced by imperialism based around some other coalition of states. If you are going to support countries like Russia against the US because they are a "bulwark against American Empire" then you might as well support small business against mega-porkies. If these so-called "anti-imperialist" states are capitalist then they are merely the imperialists of tomorrow, especially when it comes to major powers like Russia who are debatably already imperialist in their own right.
Anonymous 2022-01-10 (Mon) 20:28:46 No. 685585
>>685583 side with the protestors, the proletariat against the compardor regime
Anonymous 2022-01-10 (Mon) 20:30:14 No. 685588
the reddit astroturfing campaign has begun
Anonymous 2022-01-10 (Mon) 20:31:12 No. 685589
Kazakhstan started implementation of the new overall plan of privatisation. In 2021-2025, the state is going to sell by auction or place into trust to investors over 670 facilites.
https://cabar.asia/en/kazakhstan-style-sale-or-why-does-government-of-kazakhstan-sell-state-assets Anonymous 2022-01-10 (Mon) 20:32:37 No. 685592
>>685534 >Kazakhstan was already a comprador regime, Dungtards. This. Actually this is the least retarded I've seen you in a while lenincap, congratulations
Anonymous 2022-01-10 (Mon) 20:34:44 No. 685598
>>682558 > opposing CIA-backed petrodollar coups is racist and right-wing, real workers will die for monsanto This is your brain on libleft
Anonymous 2022-01-10 (Mon) 20:37:35 No. 685601
>>685598 The us government has fantastic relations with Kazakhstan government. You need to do some reading
Anonymous 2022-01-10 (Mon) 20:42:30 No. 685607
>>685603 >Did not come up in discussion. Usa continues to give 0 shits about the protestors or well being. They want them ended so their companies can get back to business making money in the capitalist hell hole of Kazakhstan
Same as turkey, Israel, use, UK and so on who have all condemned the protestors
Anonymous 2022-01-10 (Mon) 20:44:48 No. 685612
>>685605 Usa has no conflict at all with Kazakhstan, no sanctions, 50% of gas companies there are owned by usa and the president regularly meets with the us. The president of kazakhstan is also advised by imf and world bank who visit his country for economic advice
You really need to research what Kazakhstan is instead of have delusional image in your mind that it is like syria and Assad who is against all of this
Anonymous 2022-01-10 (Mon) 20:48:48 No. 685626
>>685616 No, I'm saying that combating imperialism can't take the form of backing one Great Power over another. Doing so without attacking the foundations of imperialism is an exercise in futility. Rather the only way to combat it is through building worker's power, even if this means indirectly helping an imperialist power in the short term by overthrowing or weakening one of their capitalist rivals. This means that if there is an opportunity to strengthen the worker's movement, it needs to be seized upon, even if it weakens an anti-Western government.
Anonymous 2022-01-10 (Mon) 20:49:05 No. 685627
>>685410
Anonymous 2022-01-10 (Mon) 20:51:29 No. 685629
>Kassym-Jomart Tokayev expressed hope this conversation will provide a good opportunity to exchange views on the possibilities of increasing the inflow of foreign investments to Kazakhstani markets. He also noted the need to hold meetings of this format on a regular basis. “Currently, a large-scale campaign is being carried out to privatize more than 700 state-owned enterprises in various sectors of the economy of Kazakhstan, including oil and gas, energy, infrastructure. We consider it preferable to place shares of the largest companies on national stock exchanges” the President of Kazakhstan said
Imagine defending this shit. The ones defending this country in such a dedicated fashion i guarantee none look into economics of country and foreign relations.
https://www.eureporter.co/kazakhstan-2/2021/12/07/international-investment-companies-meet-with-kazakh-president/ Anonymous 2022-01-10 (Mon) 20:52:10 No. 685630
>>685626 These faggots will literally support nazoids like Milosevic if they get bombed by Shartland.
Anonymous 2022-01-10 (Mon) 20:53:10 No. 685634
>>685619 Yes, our movement being the communist movement, not cheerleaders for capitalist comprador states. Obviously as far as we in the West are concerned, our task is simple: combat and frustrate any and all imperialist/interventionist designs by our governments. However when it comes to international solidarity, this should only be expressed to communists or at the very least left-leaning nationalists like those in Venezuela or Bolivia. If an anti-Western capitalist government is opposed by the bulk of the communist movement in that country, we owe our loyalty to our comrades, not their government. Anything else is chauvinism which presumes that we know more about that country than the comrades who live there.
Anonymous 2022-01-10 (Mon) 20:53:23 No. 685635
>>685626 >I'm saying that combating imperialism can't take the form of backing one Great Power over another Yes it can retard. divide and conquer
Sage !61KGLATVW. 2022-01-10 (Mon) 20:58:22 No. 685640
>>685613 He also literally came in as part of a CIA coup
>>685630 This is correct though
Anonymous 2022-01-10 (Mon) 21:00:46 No. 685644
>>685597 Top post on the worldnews subreddit. "Ukrainians give support to Kazakh protesters" or some shit. Absolutely disgusting.
Anonymous 2022-01-10 (Mon) 21:01:18 No. 685646
>>685635 And how do you expect that to work if we don't take action against the imperialist system as a whole Anon? We can leverage inter-imperialist rivalries to our own benefit yes, but only as a means of defeating the imperialists of all nations. If you leave the basis of the system intact then you accomplish nothing apart from a changing of the guard.
Anonymous 2022-01-10 (Mon) 21:04:56 No. 685655
>>685612 Um, what? US is in constant conflict with Russia and China, Kzahstan's closes allies.
American glowies wanted to give Russians payback for humiliating them with Ukraine, but accidentally created a live training exercise for CSTO at NATO's expense.
Anonymous 2022-01-10 (Mon) 21:09:27 No. 685660
>>685655 Do you have a proof it is NATO tho
Anonymous 2022-01-10 (Mon) 21:12:03 No. 685662
>>685655 >Um, what? US is in constant conflict with Russia and China, Kzahstan's closes allies. Yes but the US is not often in conflict with Kazakhstan itself. On the contrary they often collaborate on economic and military issues. The Kazakhs are playing both sides of that geopolitical divide, which is why both Washington and Moscow have thrown their weight behind them.
Anonymous 2022-01-10 (Mon) 21:49:43 No. 685717
First of all, I wanna thank everybody ITT for having substantive discussion. A rare thing lately.
That said I believe that both sides in this discussion ("you have to play the imperialists one against the other" vs "the working class has to organize alone and independently against every Porky") are right.
This is because imperialism is a pyramid in a sense: There's always one Empire on top and other competing to take its place.
The role of Communists (and here comes the MASTERMIND of Lenin) was to understand that this perpetual squabble creates OPENINGS for the people to gain benefits or to do Revolution outright.
That is why it is good to play imperialists one against the other (so the anon in
>>685635 is right).
That said, to make such a manoeuvre even possible in the first place you need to organize the people OUTSIDE the competing imperialist camps and on the basis of an independent communist force.
(And this is where SaboCat anon is right).
Sorry for the convoluted post I just wanted to express my take on this discourse because this is high level stuff for once.
Anonymous 2022-01-10 (Mon) 22:16:32 No. 685734
>>685195 Absolutely disgusting. Western media is already trying to sweep this under the rug.
Anonymous 2022-01-10 (Mon) 23:42:37 No. 685862
So bros… is it ogre yet?
Anonymous 2022-01-10 (Mon) 23:48:10 No. 685877
>>685527 You should be more discerning about the company you keep. It's a normal phrase.
Anonymous 2022-01-11 (Tue) 00:07:03 No. 685910
>>685877 It’s not. Only Facebook fags use it
Anonymous 2022-01-11 (Tue) 00:24:18 No. 685931
>>685583 Side peaceful protests. Violent protests were unwanted. Now the internet is back, you can check multiple interviews of people rejecting the violence.
Anonymous 2022-01-11 (Tue) 00:26:19 No. 685933
>>685364 >China >imperialist >opinion discarded Your brain in britbongs.
Anonymous 2022-01-11 (Tue) 00:27:09 No. 685937
>>685145 He knows as much as we do.
Sage !61KGLATVW. 2022-01-11 (Tue) 00:32:24 No. 685945
>>684926 It might not be on purpose, but all capitalist governments have the same basic interests
Sage !61KGLATVW. 2022-01-11 (Tue) 00:34:06 No. 685947
>>685717 Its basically correct. The idea that multipolarity by itself its a good thing that a lot of people have is off, its certainly helpful, but it means literally nothing if there isn't a proper communist movement to take advantage of the situation.
Anonymous 2022-01-11 (Tue) 00:38:03 No. 685955
>>685862 It was over before it began
Sage !61KGLATVW. 2022-01-11 (Tue) 00:41:02 No. 685961
>>685358 Dugin thinks its a colour revolution, ironic for a guy who supported the collapse of the soviet union. I'm saying the opposite of this retard
Anonymous 2022-01-11 (Tue) 00:51:15 No. 685978
>>685195 Wait, he did never say "shoot, don't ask"? Some Blinken questioning such policies…. is?
Anonymous 2022-01-11 (Tue) 00:55:46 No. 685986
>>685339 This guy is an unironic russian imperialist and I think, he wouldn't even feel insulted if you called him that.
Anonymous 2022-01-11 (Tue) 01:34:55 No. 686068
>>685364 >leninhat shares trot website lel
Anonymous 2022-01-11 (Tue) 01:37:38 No. 686076
>>686062 I know this guy, he was formerly known as "Land Destroyer" and he's a russian glowie.
Anonymous 2022-01-11 (Tue) 01:41:28 No. 686087
>>686068 They’re the same thing
Anonymous 2022-01-11 (Tue) 02:10:28 No. 686158
https://www.dw.com/en/kazakhstan-putin-says-russia-will-not-allow-revolutions/a-60377370 So now the adjective color is gone, Putin says there will be no revolution period and that the people responsible are islamists and international terrorists.
Kazakh soldiers were also reportedly seen wearing UN uniforms with blue helmets which is expressly forbidden and a dick move to say the least imho.
King Lear 2022-01-11 (Tue) 03:16:56 No. 686281
>>685446 If you want to educate yourself with the truth about Dengist Chinas role in the Global Imperialist-Capitalist System read this analysis by the Communist Party of India (Maoist)
https://www.revaim.org/uploads/booklets/China%20-%20A%20Modern%20Social-Imperialist%20Power.pdf .
>>685534 This. Organizations such as the IMF, World Bank, WTO, and WEF prove the unity of the Global Capitalist Elite and the collusion of U$, European, Russian, and Chinese Imperialism against the Workers and Oppressed Nations of the World.
Anonymous 2022-01-11 (Tue) 03:18:43 No. 686285
>>686281 >reeee >not with the U.S. >not with CHYNAH reee Goshly, where did I hear that…
Ah, yeah, literally CIA funded "anarchists"
Anonymous 2022-01-11 (Tue) 03:22:02 No. 686289
>>683491 I am so confused…
What is this from?
King Lear 2022-01-11 (Tue) 04:23:59 No. 686338
>>686285 Why don’t you click on the link I posted and inform yourself on the truth about China?
Anonymous 2022-01-11 (Tue) 04:29:57 No. 686342
>>683491 lol the girl in the back is 3rd wheeling so hard
>tries to lift the dolphin's tail >fucks up the grip on the front >lets go and jus tdances awkwardly Anonymous 2022-01-11 (Tue) 05:01:14 No. 686359
>>685573 >So? Leaving Xi and China aside for a moment, why is Putin and Russia any better than NATO? Because they're weaker? Yes, because they are desperate enough to ally with communists - China. One of the reasons, anyway. The other one being that Russia's interests (short term, at least) is multipolar world order in opposition to USA's US-dominated one. While Russia MAY attempt to become the hegemon in some point in time, it's both unfeasible and FOR NOW it's resulting in USA losing positions.
Anonymous 2022-01-11 (Tue) 05:04:14 No. 686362
>>686338 >>686281 Oh yes, the party which never managed to achieve anything try to inform us about the evils of CPC which both murders USA and lifts hundreds of millions of people out of poverty. No, I won't read their shit, it's pure cope and pro-imperialist bias ala Trotsky.
Anonymous 2022-01-11 (Tue) 05:36:23 No. 686390
>>685945 Yes, and they are willing to fight each other over the limited resources to accumulate wealth with
Anonymous 2022-01-11 (Tue) 05:43:48 No. 686400
>>686338 >bis >reeee not with the U.S. >not with CHYNAH reeeee Goshly, where did Igear that…
Ah, yes, from literally CIA-funded 'anarchists'.
Anonymous 2022-01-11 (Tue) 05:58:21 No. 686409
>>686362 >pro-imperialist bias ala Trotsky. Trotsky was actually very dedicated to anti imperialism to the point of supporting fascism in a very glowzone like fashion
<In Brazil there now reigns a semifascist regime that every revolutionary can only view with hatred. Let us assume, however, that on the morrow England enters into a military conflict with Brazil. I ask you on whose side of the conflict will the working class be? I will answer for myself personally—in this case I will be on the side of “fascist” Brazil against “democratic” Great Britain. Why? Because in the conflict between them it will not be a question of democracy or fascism. If England should be victorious, she will put another fascist in Rio de Janeiro and will place double chains on Brazil. If Brazil on the contrary should be victorious, it will give a mighty impulse to national and democratic consciousness of the country and will lead to the overthrow of the Vargas dictatorship. The defeat of England will at the same time deliver a blow to British imperialism and will give an impulse to the revolutionary movement of the British proletariat. Truly, one must have an empty head to reduce world antagonisms and military conflicts to the struggle between fascism and democracy. Under all masks one must know how to distinguish exploiters, slave-owners, and robbers! http://www.marxists3va6eopxoeiegih3iyex2zg3tmace7afbxjqlabmranzjjad.onion/archive/trotsky/1938/09/liberation.htm Anonymous 2022-01-11 (Tue) 06:14:19 No. 686417
>>686409 Damn I am now a trot
Anonymous 2022-01-11 (Tue) 06:32:13 No. 686430
>>686359 China is capitalist and anti-communist
Anonymous 2022-01-11 (Tue) 06:45:34 No. 686439
>>686430 >china is anti communist You can call them a lot of things but this is stupid and you know it
Anonymous 2022-01-11 (Tue) 08:43:18 No. 686517
>>686513 I noticed that too, I think it may have been a machine translation error, any one got an idea what party it's referencing specifically? The "Austrian Labor Party" doesn't exist
Anonymous 2022-01-11 (Tue) 09:01:09 No. 686527
>>686281 >>686338 Link's not working for me Lear, any other ways of seeing it?
Anonymous 2022-01-11 (Tue) 09:29:10 No. 686550
>>686409 This is unironically true though
Anonymous 2022-01-11 (Tue) 09:38:11 No. 686563
>>686517 Partei der Arbeit is known as Party of Labour of Austria which is apparently a break off from the PKO by Marxist Leninists
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Party_of_Labour_of_Austria Anonymous 2022-01-11 (Tue) 11:09:32 No. 686617
>>686359 >Yes, because they are desperate enough to ally with communists - China. You mean like the US did in the 70s and 80s?
>While Russia MAY attempt to become the hegemon in some point in time, it's both unfeasible and FOR NOW it's resulting in USA losing positions. No, it's not a question of "may." Read Lenin ffs, capitalism and imperialism are literally inseparable, the former ALWAYS produces the latter. Any decline in American power opens space for Russia to expand its own imperial influence, just like the decline of a major corporation only opens space for smaller ones to eat up their market share. As with the companies, the problem isn't this or thay monopoly or cartel, but the system which produces them. The same is true of empires. Taking sides in disputes between big capitalist powers is like running on a treadmill, the only solution is independent working class organization against all bourgeois states.
Anonymous 2022-01-11 (Tue) 11:22:16 No. 686635
>>686617 >You mean like the US did in the 70s and 80s? There never was an alliance. China exploited contradictions between her enemies, that's all there was to it. Russia today is very fucking different to USA of old in that Russia is not a fucking pretender to hegemonic power.
Right, USA and, say, Japan are competitors of the same scale as Britain and Germany of 19-20th centuries. Stop being a retard.
So we need to safeguard American hegemony in order to achieve socialism, apparently. :D
Anonymous 2022-01-11 (Tue) 11:26:05 No. 686638
>>686635 is the American hegemony with us in the room right now?
Anonymous 2022-01-11 (Tue) 11:26:35 No. 686639
>>686409 >>686411 >1938 Ah, so he wrote it after he started to conspire with fascists, lol.
Check this shit out
https://www.marxists.org/archive/trotsky/1939/04/ukraine.html where Trotsky was arguing for the independence of the Ukraine - because promises were made to fascists to give Ukraine to Germany
or this
https://www.marxists.org/archive/trotsky/1939/09/aboveall.htm piece full of rage and disbelief at Stalin for outplaying everyone and making Hitler commit to the war against Britain.
Anonymous 2022-01-11 (Tue) 11:27:38 No. 686642
>>686638 Are you butthurt about people asking you that, but with "dengoids" instead of "American hegemony"?
Anonymous 2022-01-11 (Tue) 11:29:50 No. 686644
>>686639 The one big thing that Stalin outplayed is the 27 millions of soviet comrades who died in this war.
Anonymous 2022-01-11 (Tue) 11:40:56 No. 686658
>>686635 >There never was an alliance I guess it was just a coincidence that China and the US were on the same side of basically every geopolitical conflict from 1975-1991 then, just as they started trading with each other.
>Russia today is very fucking different to USA of old in that Russia is not a fucking pretender to hegemonic power. All major capitalist states are hegemons in waiting. This is the nature of the capitalist system as Lenin proved.
>Right, USA and, say, Japan are competitors of the same scale as Britain and Germany of 19-20th centuries. No, since Japan is a satellite of the US. Russia is not of course, but it is still governed by the same material forces which produce the worst horrors of American imperialism.
>So we need to safeguard American hegemony in order to achieve socialism, apparently No we need to form independent communist organizations, build worker's power, practice revolutionary defeatism, and show solidarity with communists around the world. This goes for communists living both America's and Russia's spheres of influence. Russia will not solve our problems, and the exact second it begins to seriously threaten US hegemony is the second it will begin to become a bigger threat to our movement than America is. Clearly then, taking sides in conflicts between capitalists is futile. Instead all comrades must work to bring about the removal of their respective bourgeois governments and smash their respective empires from within, and we must do everything possible to aid in this endeavor.
Anonymous 2022-01-11 (Tue) 11:44:17 No. 686661
>>686658 >I guess it was just a coincidence that China and the US were on the same side of basically every geopolitical conflict from 1975-1991 then, just as they started trading with each other. tbf im starting to realize this was the right call looking at the utter disaster of maoism, gonzaloism and the collapse of the eastern bloc and etc.
the chinese got out of a sinking ship and now they are strong because of it
Anonymous 2022-01-11 (Tue) 11:50:47 No. 686667
>>686661 >the chinese got out of a sinking ship and now they are strong because of it They actively helped to sink it. But hey, it's okay because they are making vague promises of socialism decades from now, so that makes it fine that they helped to destroy actual socialist planned economies and usher in the era of blackest reaction.
Anonymous 2022-01-11 (Tue) 11:59:56 No. 686682
>>686667 mate the reforms happened post 1978 china.
at that stage the soviet union was doomed to collapse, the capitalist entrenched themselves in asia, the eastern bloc was bordering to collapse alongside the soviet union, and the leftist movement in western countries were dying.
at that point the ship was already near sunken, and china kicking it to sink further was barely a dent in anything. At that point what option did china really have? Go back to maoism which heavily discredited itself during the cultural revolution, or go to a soviet style planned economy even tho that type of economy was collapsing right in front of chinas eyes. Like i can understand china should be criticized for its certain actions but looking at chinas situation its understandable why they went the route they did
Anonymous 2022-01-11 (Tue) 12:30:17 No. 686705
>>686682 >at that stage the soviet union was doomed to collapse That's bullshit, there's literally no evidence to support that claim. Certainly nobody at the time felt that way, even in the 80s the collapse came as a surprise to most people. The Soviet Union was still a superpower at that point, and while it's rate of growth had slowed they were far from being in a crisis point.
>go to a soviet style planned economy even tho that type of economy was collapsing right in front of chinas eyes Yes we get it, socialism is bad, planned economies don't work, capitalism is the only way forwards. Maybe you'd feel more at home on r/neoliberal.
>At that point what option did china really have? Ally with the world's leading socialist state against imperialism, instead of doing, y'know, the exact opposite of that.
Sage !61KGLATVW. 2022-01-11 (Tue) 12:51:07 No. 686721
>>686658 It went beyond 1991, the phillipines and Israel and Saudi Arabia/ Yemen are happening today
Sage !61KGLATVW. 2022-01-11 (Tue) 12:54:31 No. 686727
>>686638 Is being in the room with us right now in the room with us right now?
Can people stop this thing where you just imply somebody is a skitzo instead of actually making an argument it’s boring as hell and not productive
Anonymous 2022-01-11 (Tue) 13:07:52 No. 686734
>>686638 there's definitely no sign of intelligent life in your room right now
Anonymous 2022-01-11 (Tue) 13:11:08 No. 686735
>>686644 See this shit? All the lies about USSR and Stalin are tied in together, and destroying one myth leads to the fall of all the mythology. No, 27 millions Soviets didn't die in the war, only 7 millions TOTAL, military and civilians. Stalin said as much, USSR was reporting this number to the UN at the time, and on top of that all the planning agencies in USSR operated off figures supporting Stlain's claim. You don't like it? You are spouting a Nazi propaganda, it's shit very close to what they were printing on their leaflets to the Soviets.
Sad times for antistalinists, eh? It turns out that left wing deviations unvariably become the right wing ones.
Anonymous 2022-01-11 (Tue) 13:17:12 No. 686740
>>682528 market price for oil is too expensive for the average person in Kazakhstan to purchase so the government brings the price down with subsidies. Government decided to remove price controls on new years and sell oil at market price domestically which doubled the price of petrol overnight. Riots ensue in response. Das it.
Anonymous 2022-01-11 (Tue) 13:17:26 No. 686741
So what's happened? The Russians assumed direct control?
Anonymous 2022-01-11 (Tue) 13:18:38 No. 686742
>>686705 What the fuck, why is it China's fault that Khruschev started destalinisation, and China didn't follow? Like, what the fuck are you talking about? USSR in 1950s, while China was still friendly, was still run in a lot of ways by stalinists, so, they forced the transfer of technology to China. As well as did Cuba's missile crisis, as well as squashed fascist uprising in Hungary. Khruschev at every opportunity did the opposite, he surrendered the opportunity to put missiles in Cuba and set naval bases there, he was "waiting" in Hungary, he was becoming friendly to fascistic Tito - against Albania, even. It culminated under Brezhnev in crazy anti-China propaganda like retarded shit about backyard furnaces and Chinese killing all sparrows and getting forced to import them from USSR, lol, as well as more real shit like USSR trying to conquer Damansky island, as well as USSR supporting AMERICANS-STARTED TRADE EMBARGO OF CHINA, depriving China of market access when China was doing it's industrialization. Imagine fucking that, what imperialists did to USSR in 1920-30s, when USSR had to beg for fair trade with the West, USSR did the same shit to China in 1960-80s. Guess fucking what, China escaped this shit with opening up to USA. Why the fuck NOT SURRENDERING to USSR's pressure - denial of markets, propaganda, etc etc - is now a sin?
Anonymous 2022-01-11 (Tue) 13:24:31 No. 686745
>>686658 >China and the USA on the same side Lolno, go and read history books.
So what? In waiting is not the same shit as being one. Utilizing contradictions between capitalists is a valid tactic, as shown by both Lenin and Stalin and Mao as well which allowed communists to achieve gains. Supporting weaker capitalist nation to expose capitalism itself and to win victories is totally fine.
Oh wow, "satellite"! Does that mean you will support a US satellite trying to win it's freedom from USA? Or are you going to mistakenly keep quoting Lenin saying that both are the same shit, and free Japan will just become the new hegemon?
Your reasoning is this fucking thin. It doesn't take much effort to deconstruct you.
Yes, that's what I said - safeguard American hegemony. You will be destroying USA's competitors while leftists in USA will fail at everything, as always. So, the result will be as expected
Anonymous 2022-01-11 (Tue) 13:45:40 No. 686757
>>686742 >What the fuck, why is it China's fault that Khruschev started destalinisation, and China didn't follow? It's China's fault that they allowed ultimately minor disputes to critically endanger the entire socialist project. The Soviets contributed to the split as well, but it was the Chinese who formalized it. Ultimately the entire dispute was pointless and moronic. The only people who benefitted were the Americans, especially when China started actively helping them.
>As well as did Cuba's missile crisis, as well as squashed fascist uprising in Hungary. Khruschev at every opportunity did the opposite Wtf are you talking about? Khruschev was literally the one who suppressed the uprising in Hungary and put missiles in Cuba in the first place.
>he was "waiting" in Hungary Him and the entire politburo, however it was actually him who pushed them to reverse this policy and take decisive action against Nagy. It's all crystal clear if you read the politburo's meeting notes from that incident.
>he was becoming friendly to fascistic Tito Ah yes, Tito, famous sympathizer with fascism. He was famously friendly with the Ustase, he even gave them all a comfy place to live at the bottom of a coal mine.
>It culminated under Brezhnev in crazy anti-China propaganda As opposed to in China, where they only offered sane, measured critiques like how the USSR was "a regime of the Hitler type."
>Why the fuck NOT SURRENDERING to USSR's pressure - denial of markets, propaganda, etc etc - is now a sin? <How is actively aiding US imperialism to destroy the USSR and Eastern Bloc a sin? >>686745 >Lolno, go and read history books. The both backed Pinochet, the Mujahideen, Khmer Rouge, UNITA, etc. They were objectively on the same side in most confrontations after 1975.
>Utilizing contradictions between capitalists is a valid tactic It is, but that isn't what I'm criticizing. Independent communist organizations can leverage inter-imperialist rivalries to their benefit sure, but this can only be done with the understanding that all capitalist powers are our enemies. The Bolsheviks took German money, but they weren't under any illusions that Germany was less of a threat to socialism than the Tsar was. They still actively called for and wherever possible worked towards the destruction of the German Empire. They didn't go around running cover for German imperial interests or the German bourgeoisie.
>Does that mean you will support a US satellite trying to win it's freedom from USA? I would, but only insofar as such a thing would benefit the communist movement. That's a separate issue from how contradictions within anti-Western capitalist states should be handled and approached by communists. If worker unrest erupts in a non-Western capitalist state, then our loyalty is to the proles, not the local bourgeoisie. Or at the very least we should defer to local communists on the issue.
>free Japan will just become the new hegemon? Once Japan is free the bourgeois Japanese government will become just as much our enemy as the US. It would have been reasonable for communists to support Japan's modernization in the 19th century, and it's efforts to resist Western encroachment. It would have been insane to support Japan's own imperialist designs in the early 20th century on the grounds that it was displacing the European colonial powers, or for Japanese communists to practice anything other than revolutionary defeatism.
>You will be destroying USA's competitors while leftists in USA will fail at everything, as always. So let's get this straight. Revolution in the imperial core is impossible because first world leftists are impotent, and revolution in the periphery is also impossible because doing so would empower American hegemony. So in other words, you're just a defeatist and capitalist realist. You're just making excuses for SPD-tier opportunism.
Anonymous 2022-01-11 (Tue) 13:55:02 No. 686763
Well over the course of 6 threads and thousands of replies, opinions were had.
Anonymous 2022-01-11 (Tue) 13:58:10 No. 686766
>>686763 i love how everyone here is so detached from reality that they can't even identify why the riots are happening despite the fact it's painfully easy to find out. Mfs out here saying "why is this happening" when everyone and their dog is screaming in the streets about how the price of oil doubled overnight.
Anonymous 2022-01-11 (Tue) 16:39:10 No. 686888
MOVE OVER MAOTARDS AND DENGTURDS THE REAL ANALYSIS BEGINS NOW Fucking hell, I hate youtube for triying to choke me with imperial socdem shit
Kazhakstan- the evolution of the Russian narrative:
By Adam something, Brussels lover extraordinaire
2nd of January: Kazakhs start protesting due to the gov't increasing fuel prices, which quickly turns into a general protest against corruption, the one-party system, president for life, etc.
5th of January: the Kazakh dictator asks for foreign (Russian) military intervention.
Putin's spokesman denies this: "No. We are convinced that our Kazakh friends can solve their internal problems on their own. It is important that no one interferes from the outside."
6th of January: Russian forces arrive to Kazakhstan to "stabilize the situation". In exchange for their help, the Kazakh dictator agreed to the following:
- recognizing the annexation of Crimea
- restoring Russian as the second official language
- providing Russia with military bases
- autonomy for Russian minorities
Thus Kazakhstan becomes a quasi-puppet state under Russian control. Old habits die hard.
Sources (right click > translate):
https://www.pravda.com.ua/news/2022/01/5/7319551/ https://www.unian.ua/world/u-kazahstan-pryamuye-kontingent-odkb-novini-svitu-11663347.html https://www.unian.ua/world/u-kazahstan-pribuli-pershi-rosiyski-viyskovi-zi-skladu-odkb-video-novini-svitu-11663881.html https://www.yeniakit.com.tr/haber/rusya-yardim-etmek-icin-4-maddelik-sart-sundu-bir-tek-kazakistanin-tapusunu-istemedikleri-kaldi-1614414.html Anonymous 2022-01-11 (Tue) 17:16:33 No. 686951
>>686513 it's a Marxist Leninist party.
Anonymous 2022-01-11 (Tue) 17:17:22 No. 686955
>>686068 It's in the IMCWP same as your beloved Dengist Party of China if you're playing that card. not a Trotskyist.
Anonymous 2022-01-11 (Tue) 18:41:17 No. 687063
>>686888 >6th of January: Russian forces arrive to Kazakhstan to "stabilize the situation". In exchange for their help, the Kazakh dictator agreed to the following: >recognizing the annexation of Crimea >restoring Russian as the second official language >providing Russia with military bases >autonomy for Russian minorities And for a moment I was starting to believe that feline retard or schizohat about the possibility of a "Russian imperialism" ever existing post-1917. Well, here is your Russian imperialism: Poootin will come and…. make Kazakhs speak more Russian! Muhahahaha!!!
Any seizure of assets? You know, like privatization. The thing that the Americans were able to achieve from the other side of the world with a couple of well-placed agents and sufficient glowmoney in an another formerly semi-sovereign post-Soviet country (Ukraine).
The era of competing imperialist powers is long over. Everything that can be seized has been seized a long time ago. Imperialism is maintained by America through its leadership of the global financial system with the EU imperialist bloc only existing as a complementary part of it. Russia is a loser in this system and all Putin can do is to use one of the remaining assets of the glorious USSR (a strong army) to engage in some nationalist dickwaving that will boost his approval ratings with little additional benefits and maybe keep the communists out of office a little bit longer.
Anonymous 2022-01-11 (Tue) 21:19:30 No. 687232
So do we have a group consensus yet on whether this is a color revolution or not?
Anonymous 2022-01-11 (Tue) 21:56:31 No. 687277
>>687232 Fuck you group consensus. Read the threads, the sources and make up your own conclusion. I personally believe it was an organic uprising out of legitimate grievances
Anonymous 2022-01-11 (Tue) 22:35:39 No. 687361
The Socialist Party of Latvia expresses support and solidarity to the labor collectives of Kazakhstan, who once again spoke out against the endless rise in prices, mass layoffs, repression against activists of the labor and trade union movement.
The workers' movement of many thousands has embraced hundreds of mining and metallurgical enterprises in a number of regions of the country. In the course of rallies, pickets and strikes, which began in December of the past year, workers present to the authorities perfectly justified economic, social and political demands that have been accumulating over the past thirty years.
We categorically protest against the one-sided and tendentious coverage of events in Kazakhstan by the official media. The picture presented to the public of the orgy of marauders, murderers and pogromists unleashed by provocateurs deliberately hides rallies, pickets and strikes, in which thousands of workers participate with clearly formulated demands.
The authorities ignore the opinion of the workers. The ruling regime banned the Communist Party, the Socialist Movement of Kazakhstan, liquidated independent trade unions, and imprisoned the most active representatives of the left, workers' and trade union movements. The working people are deprived of the opportunity to fully, on legal grounds, seek the realization of their interests, to influence the adoption of political decisions.
We are in solidarity with the demands of the workers of Kazakhstan:
- To dismiss the incumbent president and all Nazarbayev officials
- Release all political prisoners and end repression against workers and trade unionists
- Abolish anti-labor and anti-union laws that deprive workers of the right to form independent trade unions and political parties
- Satisfy a package of economic and social requirements, including increasing wages, ending the practice of mass layoffs of workers, ensuring the safety of workplaces, reducing the retirement age
- To nationalize, under the control of labor collectives, the entire mining and large-scale industry of the country
- To lift the ban on the activities of the Communist Party of Kazakhstan and the Socialist Movement of Kazakhstan
Power to labor, not capital!
http://socialismkz.info/?p=26845 >>687063 >Russian imperialism" ever existing post-1917. The Russian Federation isn't the RSFSR, get fucking real.
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