Always support anti-car policies Anonymous 2022-01-14 (Fri) 10:10:08 No. 690753
This is a thread more aimed at Westeroids, since those societies are heavily car-focused nowadays. The role of the proliferation from those polluting metal coffins after WW2 to further enrich oil oligarchs and the motorisation corporations is hopefully obvious. They influenced the politics in those places so much that societies, which have used different means of transport for centuries and more efficient ones like trains, that they transformed the entire cities to accommodate cars. Whenever there is any infrastructure project, it's for cars first and everything else second at best. After a sufficient amount has been built and is expensively maintained, cars can be advertised as the "ultimate" symbol of freedom™, since the consumer has supposedly the "freedoms" to go anywhere they like – where there are roads that is. It is purposfully omitted that without any proper roads, most cars couldn't move around at all. It is never mentioned that cars are extremely heavily regulated, in comparison to other means of transport, through specific traffic rules like speed limits and where you are even allowed to drive through at all, so that there wouldn't be constant accidents and chaos. This "freedom" for cars always comes at the expense at everyone, who doesn't use cars like for example pedestrians, who used to have all the space between buildings, but now are forced to snake around narrow often overcrowded sidewalks, since cars need a lot of space to navigate properly, so that they need very wide ways. There are plenty of before and after images of city streets before and after cars got introduced. It's shocking. Other means of transport are either left untouched or even intentionally underfunded, so that people are indirectly forced to buy more metal boxes. The shining example is, how the German government treats its Deutsche Bahn, the Krauts' national railway company. Cars' factor on climate change and environmental destruction for roads is obvious, so I won't dwell on it. However, the air- and noise pollution along with loss of space has gotten so bad in some cities in Europe that a slow policy shift has started, to get cars out of city centers. Barcelona's "super blocks" are an example of this or some cities banning cars altogether in certain areas such as historic city centres. Even when communists rule nothing in Europe right now, you should support any such policies for the aforementioned reasons, but also an additional one, which is always overlooked:Public uprisings! Cars are a remnant from the gigantic bourgeois war industry of the last major wars. The Autobahn, which's primary function was to move Wehrmacht vehicles around the country, were repurposed for cars, but still can be quickly used again for their original goal. Reducing such infrastructere would indirectly affect the efficiency the military can move around to say crush a workers' uprising. Housing blocks need a certain distance between eachother so that vehicles can easily pass through. Setting up barricades gets more difficult to outright impossible with wide roads. Since the modern police increasingly rely on vehicles (like water cannons) to quell unrest, it would make it more difficult for them to operate, when there are no straight big roads in cities anymore. I think, if there will be any proletarian uprisings in the West, they will be in cities.
junko !!9cfznBf./Q 2022-01-14 (Fri) 11:34:30 No. 690794
will we still have off-road vehicles
Anonymous 2022-01-14 (Fri) 11:35:52 No. 690795
>>690794 Everybody get fusion powered tank
Anonymous 2022-01-14 (Fri) 12:03:25 No. 690819
>>690753 >Cars are a remnant from the gigantic bourgeois war industry of the last major wars. The Autobahn, which's primary function was to move Wehrmacht vehicles around the country, were repurposed for cars, but still can be quickly used again for their original goal. Reducing such infrastructere would indirectly affect the efficiency the military can move around to say crush a workers' uprising. Housing blocks need a certain distance between eachother so that vehicles can easily pass through. Setting up barricades gets more difficult to outright impossible with wide roads. Since the modern police increasingly rely on vehicles (like water cannons) to quell unrest, it would make it more difficult for them to operate, when there are no straight big roads in cities anymore. I think, if there will be any proletarian uprisings in the West, they will be in cities. roads are pretty easy to blockade. with bigger roads, blockading is even more disruptive
Anonymous 2022-01-14 (Fri) 12:25:36 No. 690836
>>690819 idiot take; the infamous barricades of the french rev were effective specifically because of the narrow roads, which made the city easy to fortify against the military. Once the rev was over, the government began building wide boulevards explicitly to prevent effective ve barricading, and to facilitate troop movement and deployment through the city. In an age of tanks, drones, helicopters, etc (all of which require either load bearing roads or clear sightlines) this dynamic has surely been exacerbated, not diminished.
Anonymous 2022-01-14 (Fri) 12:36:41 No. 690842
>>690836 honestly, any supposed "strategic" advantages given by urban design/architecture is still very neutral. à propos,
>There was only one armed uprising in Paris after Haussmann, the Paris Commune from March through May 1871, and the boulevards played no important role. The Communards seized power easily, because the French Army was absent, defeated and captured by the Prussians. The Communards took advantage of the boulevards to build a few large forts of paving stones with wide fields of fire at strategic points, such as the meeting point of the Rue de Rivoli and Place de la Concorde. But when the newly organized army arrived at the end of May, it avoided the main boulevards, advanced slowly and methodically to avoid casualties, worked its way around the barricades, and took them from behind. The Communards were defeated in one week not because of Haussmann's boulevards, but because they were outnumbered by five to one, they had fewer weapons and fewer people trained to use them, they had no hope of getting support from outside Paris, they had no plan for the defense of the city; they had very few experienced officers; there was no single commander; and each neighborhood was left to defend itself. <Rougerie, Jacques, La Commune de 1871 , (2014), pp. 115–17 Anonymous 2022-01-14 (Fri) 12:48:07 No. 690846
>>690819 >roads are pretty easy to blockade How do you get this conclusion?
I'm not talking about a big protests blocking a road at best for a few ours with their own bodies. I'm talking about blocking an invading militaristic force for days, weeks, months or even years. Roads that are dozens of metres wide need a lot of material to block even basic cars physically, let alone military armored personell carriers and especially tanks. They won't just politely stop at traffic cones, as peaceful protesters would. When you need to move a lot of material, you need a lot of people, which need organisation. Such wide roads also tend to be very exposed and therefore easy targets from air attacks. Narrow city roads are another story, since they also increase the probablity for a mechanised force to hit regular civilians and therefore further delegitimise said invading force politically.
Say, which picrel is naturally easier to defend?
Anonymous 2022-01-14 (Fri) 12:50:51 No. 690849
>>690846 Narrower streets are easier to defend in most cases sure, but I doubt they would actually be the decisive factor in any revolution
junko !!9cfznBf./Q 2022-01-14 (Fri) 12:51:19 No. 690850
>>690846 Is this why France is always rebelling in the streets
Anonymous 2022-01-14 (Fri) 13:00:36 No. 690855
>>690849 >but I doubt they would actually be the decisive factor in any revolution Let's have a little mental exercise. Do you think the Bolshevik Revolution would have survived if Russia had big roads at the time, as opposed to railway tracks, which can be easily destroyed in comparison?
Let's go even further to WW2. Do you think it wouldn't have been a huge factor for the invading Wehrmacht if they could have conducted logistical operations through local highways during mud season?
I'm not saying it's dicisive on its own, but definitely a factor among others, which, if where can, make things more difficult for the reactionary force to operate properly.
Anonymous 2022-01-14 (Fri) 13:11:51 No. 690860
>>690846 >Narrow city roads are another story, since they also increase the probablity for a mechanised force to hit regular civilians and therefore further delegitimise said invading force politically. Tanks without infantry support in urban environments are sitting ducks. just ask the Russian tank crews in Chechnya.
Anonymous 2022-01-14 (Fri) 13:12:01 No. 690861
>>690753 Can American cities even recover from the dismantling of public transportation by their car industry?
Anonymous 2022-01-14 (Fri) 13:27:00 No. 690876
>>690860 Theoretically yes, when the defending force has anti-tank weaponry at hand. Otherwise, tanks would still be big trouble. It's safe to assume that any proletarian uprising won't get weapons funnelled in from a foreign country as your regular jihadist group gets.
Most weapons will either come from looting staches and/or improvised.
Better keep the tanks outside with barricades.
Anonymous 2022-01-14 (Fri) 13:32:43 No. 690883
>>690876 maneuvering a tank around a city even with wide streets is still fucked up and combined with the low morale that comes from forcing conscripts or anyone like that to put down a popular uprising, a lot of them can straight up be abandoned
Anonymous 2022-01-14 (Fri) 14:03:32 No. 690903
>>690876 Tanks are bad for urban conflict, because even improvised weapons used in ambush attacks can damage tank-treads and turn it into a pill box. Once the tank is immobilized it's possible to go after the main gun turret, by jamming something between the turret and hull, or by lasso-ing the gun barrel with 2 steal cables that lock it in place. The tank crew will eventually get bored sitting in a tank and go home. You can raid the abandoned tank and use it's ammunition to make mortar grenades. Tanks have very weak protection in the top, and if you drop a mortar on it from a building-roof it will blow up.
Anonymous 2022-01-14 (Fri) 19:19:33 No. 691259
I'd recommend the book "Fighting Traffic" by Norton for anyone who believes that automotive society developed organically. It did not, and it was resisted to the last man.
Anonymous 2022-01-14 (Fri) 19:27:01 No. 691267
I can't imagine being a good civil engineer and seeing these decisions being made by retards that create more congestion and ruin entire neighborhoods except for the extreme wealthy and eventually cause massive debt down the line. I would blow a gasket.
Anonymous 2022-01-14 (Fri) 19:50:43 No. 691303
>>691293 Based heritage foundation poster. The bourgeoisie just want to force us into trains and bikes when cars are the most proletarian thing in the world. One of the strongest proletarian organizations are Exxon Mobil or BP.
Anonymous 2022-01-14 (Fri) 20:15:51 No. 691338
>>691303 Some local "anarchists" unironically attacked a worker co-op shop because of "muh gentrification."
There is no way people, who believe this shit →
>>691293 , aren't feds. I myself literally was forced to move into the inner city, because I couldn't afford to live in the suburb, I grew up in, anymore. Afford a car? Absolutely ridiculous. I don't have boomer-age wages and I won't get into debt to consume car culture.
Unfortunately, my local comrades refuse to consider glowie infiltration, because they are idealist white Westeroids and still have radlib tendencies leftover. Frustrating…
🍀 Shay 🍀 2022-01-14 (Fri) 20:16:52 No. 691340
>>691293 The solution to gentrification and high urban rent prices is this
1; become a real estate agent and evaluate properties at a very low price every chance you get
2; form a real estate devaluation organization which purposefully commits vandalism and disturbances of the peace, such as exploding fireworks so it sounds like gunshots, plus gangstalking middle-to-upper class people and engaging in harassment, giving off the appearance of skyrocketing crime
Anonymous 2022-01-14 (Fri) 20:28:03 No. 691349
>>691338 I was obviously responding to that post sarcastically. Anyone who says what that poster said is completely retarded and very much a heritage foundation oil magnate supporter.
Anonymous 2022-01-14 (Fri) 20:29:23 No. 691351
>>691338 Anarchists are all feds or useful idiots, this shouldn’t be a surprise
Anonymous 2022-01-14 (Fri) 20:29:30 No. 691352
>>691340 slumlords already do this…..? dhishduihdi
Sabinyak 2022-01-14 (Fri) 20:31:25 No. 691353
>>691351 then what would that make you?
Anonymous 2022-01-14 (Fri) 20:31:32 No. 691354
>>691352 then eventually when they've squeezed it dry, they force all of the inhabitants out and bring the gentrifiers in
Anonymous 2022-01-14 (Fri) 20:32:19 No. 691356
>>691353 An actual socialist and a functioning adult
Anonymous 2022-01-14 (Fri) 20:35:42 No. 691359
>>691356 A socialist that supports big pharma, the oil industry and companies that make highways that congest traffic even more? How are those things pro Socialist?
S 2022-01-16 (Sun) 02:00:35 No. 693348
I've been thinking about the best way to replace cars in rural areas or deprived countries. Build a small gauge railway to every village, with many small cars which you can take off the track at stations as well as a number of larger trains for commuting. Trains will all be really light with electric engines, or possibly steam engines if necessary. If the central government can't handle maintaining the railway then each commune can take care of a certain stretch.
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