Anonymous 2022-01-14 (Fri) 21:31:00 No. 691471
>they need to give all the land back
Anonymous 2022-01-15 (Sat) 06:30:18 No. 692092
Russian imperialism should be opposed just like American imperialism. Both of them exploit the third world and help maintain corrupt capitalist structures that oppress workers like the regime in Kazakhstan. And China isn't very much different in this regard.
Anonymous 2022-01-15 (Sat) 06:33:53 No. 692093
shut up bitch
Anonymous 2022-01-15 (Sat) 06:59:19 No. 692105
liberal spotted. every single piece of land on earth has been stolen many times, since crimes are committed against individuals and not groups it doesnt make sense to "give it back" if it was stolen more than a lifetime ago (since you can't give it back to dead people). also russian/belarusian/ukrainian are somewhat mutually intelligible and arent all that different languages
Anonymous 2022-01-15 (Sat) 07:04:22 No. 692109
>>692092 A multipolar world is good for leftists. The US is the worst thing for leftists around the world with absolutely no comparison, not even near. Anything that reduces US power is objectively good for all types of leftism around the world. Russian and Chinese growth is exactly that. To oppose it is to oppose leftism.
Anonymous 2022-01-15 (Sat) 07:07:37 No. 692111
>>691468 4/10, ты заставил меня ответить
Anonymous 2022-01-15 (Sat) 07:22:15 No. 692118
>>692092 Neither Russia nor China are imperialist powers in any reasonable sense of the word. Russia's mild militaristic adventures on its own border are not even remotely comparable to even minor European imperialist powers, let alone the colossal, borderline omnipresent influence of the USA, which has 750 foreign military bases in 80 countries, overwhelming dominance of both the IMF and World Bank, economic embargoes on 20 countries, active military interventions in dozens of countries in the past 20 years, and the most sophisticated intelligence network in the world by far.
Anonymous 2022-01-15 (Sat) 07:22:19 No. 692119
>>692105 >Belarusian >Mutually intelligible Lolno
Anonymous 2022-01-15 (Sat) 07:28:30 No. 692122
tfw Mongolian irredentists deserve their soil back as the GOAT colonizers
Anonymous 2022-01-15 (Sat) 07:33:43 No. 692124
>>692119 NTA, но все там свободно владеют русским? Колюсь, я простой иностранец, а именно кто в Беларуси говорит по-беларски? То есть вне кухни.
Anonymous 2022-01-15 (Sat) 07:48:54 No. 692130
>>692118 I would really like to memorize a factoid like this as a response whenever libs insist China is just as imperialist as the US.
Anonymous 2022-01-15 (Sat) 08:02:44 No. 692135
>>692109 How about opposing American, Russian, and Chinese growth all together? All the superpowers are exploitative assholes and neither of them care about promoting leftism.
Anonymous 2022-01-15 (Sat) 08:04:22 No. 692136
>>692130 That should be pretty easy, anon. Pretty much every relevant fact illustrates very clearly that China and the US are not even in the same ballpark when it comes to assaulting the global proletariat.
Anonymous 2022-01-15 (Sat) 08:24:30 No. 692142
>>692118 You're right that America's imperialism is by far the worst, but that doesn't mean Russia and China are innocent. They also want to carve out competing imperial spheres of influence in places like Syria and Kazakhstan that are subject to Russian and Chinese capital interests, although on a lesser scale than the US.
Anonymous 2022-01-15 (Sat) 08:25:16 No. 692143
You will live in the Khanate Of The Golden Horde and you will like it
Anonymous 2022-01-15 (Sat) 08:33:26 No. 692144
>>692135 How about you engage in the real world and not to try and pick a position where you can pretend to be the moral victor without doing anything for anyone?
Anonymous 2022-01-15 (Sat) 08:34:40 No. 692146
>>692109 >A multipolar world is good for leftists. how? In what way will it not be just multiple capitalist superpowers competing to exploit the global proletariat?
>Inb4 because America bad Anonymous 2022-01-15 (Sat) 08:34:41 No. 692147
>>692142 Ok and? Mexico engages in genocides and massacres on its own people and migrants. Nobody gives a fuck because Mexico is in good terms with the US.
Anonymous 2022-01-15 (Sat) 09:10:02 No. 692176
>>692146 >how? In what way will it not be just multiple capitalist superpowers competing to exploit the global proletariat? Read Imperialism: The Highest Stage of Capitalism
>Inb4 because America bad Yes
Anonymous 2022-01-15 (Sat) 09:32:53 No. 692194
>>692135 Being good for leftism =/= supporting leftism. Conflicts between great powers actually provide opportunities for leftists to do stuff, meanwhile the current yank world order just means they get to be world police until they collapse or we all die from climate change. If you're a yank, I don't know how you can't see that the conflict with China is the best thing that could have happened to American leftists like you. China has effectively put the US in a position where they have to either continue doing business with China and lose their ability to unilaterally dictate what the world does, thus letting the world pursue socialist projects without a fear of getting Allende'd, or move manufacturing and build infrastructure back home, effectively reversing the effects of neoliberalism and returning the proletariat class back to America and reviving the labor movement, basically making your job as a leftist a breeze. I don't get you "Neither Washington nor Beijing/Moscow" dudes, you can't oppose Russia, China and the US equally when the damage they are doing is nowhere near equal.
Anonymous 2022-01-15 (Sat) 10:27:41 No. 692211
>Nighas ITT taking a side between capitalist imperialist powers as always <Unironically shilling for people that would execute you and everyone you love without hesitation
Anonymous 2022-01-15 (Sat) 11:14:25 No. 692241
>>692211 the dismantling of the USSR literally involved ethno-nationalists who killed people and their loved ones without hesitations, and the dismantling of the RF would mean the same thing. not to mention it's fucking nowhere near as imperialist as western Europe or the US
Anonymous 2022-01-15 (Sat) 11:22:44 No. 692251
>NOOOO YOU CAN'T JUST HAVE MORE THAN ONE ETHNIC GROUP IN A SINGLE STATE >YOU HAVE TO ORGANIZE EVERYTHING INTO HOMOGENOUS NATION STATES LIKE IN EUROPE OTHERWISE I WILL CALL YOU A COLONIZER
Anonymous 2022-01-15 (Sat) 11:33:48 No. 692261
>>692241 >Nooooooo if you don’t side with this weaker imperialist state over the stronger imperialist state, clearly you support the weaker state being dismantled and massacred! t. SPD 1914
Anonymous 2022-01-15 (Sat) 11:42:07 No. 692265
>>692109 just acknowledge that competition is better than the alternative, dont get all weird with it
Anonymous 2022-01-15 (Sat) 11:48:39 No. 692271
>>692261 Lenin didn't foresee that ultraimperialism has the possibility to emerge if anti-imperialist forces put too much pressure on imperial capital. He was proven wrong by history. Even Stalin after WW2 thought that the imperialists won't stay united. He was hoping that another World War would start, now between the USA and Western Europe. He too was proven very very wrong.
Anonymous 2022-01-15 (Sat) 11:52:08 No. 692274
>>692176 I have read this book multiple times and nowhere does it support that "a multi-polar world is good for leftists". It might be a good idea to read it yourself, or present a quote that you think says this.
It's pretty clear that Lenin states that a multipolar world is a deterministic outcome of imperialism, as a counter to the incorrect idea of the possiblity "superimperialism".
Just fyi Lenin literally was a proponent of revolutionary defeatism, quite contrary with "supporting the weaker imperealist powers".
You are not in any way holding an "orthodox Marxist" or "Marxist-Leninist" stance, you're just posting drivel in support of a bourgeois state so as to go against "superimperealism" which Lenin literally states is not something that CAN happen in Late Capitalism. Perhaps actually read the books you tell people to read, lib.
Anonymous 2022-01-15 (Sat) 13:09:42 No. 692328
>>692274 Russia supports socialist states like Cuba, best Korea, China etc etc
USA blockades them
Anonymous 2022-01-15 (Sat) 13:54:21 No. 692355
>>692328 >DPRK Joined in UN oil sanctions
>China Dengism is revisionism, also supports numerous anti-communist states like Israel, Philippines
>Cuba Realpolitik. UK and US traded with the USSR, didnt make either of them anti-imperialist
>>692124 Старики и змагары лол
Anonymous 2022-01-15 (Sat) 14:06:03 No. 692361
>>692355 Not only that, but pretty much the entire fucking world trades with China
Anonymous 2022-01-15 (Sat) 14:13:09 No. 692364
>>692144 But that requires more than navelgazing and flamewarring online
Anonymous 2022-01-15 (Sat) 14:14:45 No. 692367
>>692144 And you’re doing what exactly?
Anonymous 2022-01-15 (Sat) 14:20:00 No. 692368
do you know what a "nation"state means
Anonymous 2022-01-15 (Sat) 14:20:38 No. 692369
nvm just realized this thread is a joke my bad
Anonymous 2022-01-15 (Sat) 15:55:53 No. 692438
>>692194 I'm opposed to any conflict with China. Seriously, fuck the military industrial complex and their thirst for war. But that doesn't mean I'm going to go ahead and start praising China as a model for leftists, which they're clearly not. The proletariat are also exploited in modern day capitalist China (read about suicide nets) and they haven't done anything to help spread socialism/communism. Instead they have economically buddied up with extremely corrupt capitalist governments like Kazakhstan and the UAE where workers get shit on and have had their own corporations profit from it. So yes, I'm "neither Washington nor Beijing" for good reason. I don't pick sides between competing capitalist powers that are exploiting the planet.
Anonymous 2022-01-15 (Sat) 16:26:23 No. 692510
>>692368 Russia is more of a multicultural melting pot rather than a national state.
Anonymous 2022-01-15 (Sat) 16:29:11 No. 692521
>>692438 >>692194 >muh leftism No one cares. This is the 21st century.
Anonymous 2022-01-15 (Sat) 16:31:20 No. 692526
>>692524 >haha ur pol this is why the "left" is losing
Anonymous 2022-01-15 (Sat) 16:40:06 No. 692553
>>692550 I think he's just new.
Anonymous 2022-01-15 (Sat) 16:55:34 No. 692593
>>692553 I'm new because I'm not some Dengist larper shilling for state capitalism? Lol ok.
Anonymous 2022-01-15 (Sat) 16:59:53 No. 692605
>>692593 You're new because you're the tired-ass anarcho-communist larper who think they have a unique opinion but don't realize they objectively align with U.S. Imperialism.
Anonymous 2022-01-15 (Sat) 17:01:40 No. 692610
>>692328 This is just like saying the US is good because it supported Rojava. Realpolitik and geopolitics are not reasons to support an imperealist bourgeois state, according to "orthodox Marxism-Leninism" the only reason to do that is in a war of national independence against imperealist occupiers.
This would be like supporting industrial capital against say finance capital because "industrial capital helps the workers" - it's fine if you want to hold a socdem position, but it's not the "communist" or "ML" position, and definitely not what Lenin supported.
Anonymous 2022-01-15 (Sat) 17:03:35 No. 692615
>>692610 >definitely not what Lenin supported. Imagine if Lenin did things because it was what Marx supported lmao.
You just don't understand the nature of science.
Anonymous 2022-01-15 (Sat) 17:10:46 No. 692629
>>692615 Please don't misunderstand the nature of the conversation, in
>>692176 , the poster is implying that Lenin (in "Imperealism") argued in favour of supporting a weaker imperealist power against another, stronger one. I'm simply explaining that this is not the case and that Lenin actually argued for the opposite.
I understand you might not have the brain capacity to read an entire book, but please read the thread which you are responding to - that is if you don't want to look like rather infantile defending "the nature of science" after being incapable of following 3 posts.
PS. This is not my personal position, I am infact quite on the fence about even supporting national liberation movements, I do not in fact hold entierly "orthodox ML" positions.
Anonymous 2022-01-15 (Sat) 17:12:54 No. 692634
>>692629 I don't think the "nature of the conversation" (did you mean the topic of it?) matters so much when it usually just devolves into dogmatism.
Anonymous 2022-01-15 (Sat) 18:23:24 No. 692794
>>692634 I'm not entierly sure what exactly you're trying to say apart from the fact that you didn't read the posts you were responding to, and neither why you're clinging onto some phrase I misused in response to your comment. You didn't put the time into reading what I was saying, so I'm certainly not going to re-read my response and make sure it's grammatically correct.
I've explained I'm not holding a dogmatic position, I'm explaining Lenin's position which the poster is misuing in their argument.
Anonymous 2022-01-15 (Sat) 18:36:50 No. 692814
>>692605 Ha ha good one. My objectives must align with US imperialism just because I don't think the US is the only imperialist power in the world. They are the biggest one for sure, but that still doesn't give the other ones a pass.
Anonymous 2022-01-15 (Sat) 18:45:42 No. 692827
>>692821 >If burger must simp for non-burger bourgeois Cringe
Anonymous 2022-01-15 (Sat) 18:50:02 No. 692832
>>691468 Fuck Ukraine, Crimea river
I'll be laughing so hard when Russia cracks Ukraine like an egg
If Russia plays it's cards right theirs a good chance they can also crack NATO like an egg and remove 🇺🇸 power from most of Europe
>>692135 >How about opposing American, Russian, and Chinese growth all together? Fag leftism.
This kind of both sidesism pretends the three are "equally bad"
Only one of those countries supported Nazis back into posts in West German government, stopped Japanese from being tried for war crimes, supported multiple..multiple antisocialist massacres and fascist dictatorships
Only one of those countries voted against a UN resolution condemning Nazism because they literally support and arm Nazis in Ukraine
Anonymous 2022-01-15 (Sat) 18:52:51 No. 692835
>>692827 >simp I hope Chinese and Russian porkies shit themselves and die ASAP, but I'm thinking the American bases in my country might have made me kinda biased as to which country I hope shits itself first lol
Anonymous 2022-01-15 (Sat) 18:57:17 No. 692840
>>692629 I'm the anon that recommended Lenin's Imperialism. I'm on mobile so forgive my brevity but my basic point is multi-polarity is preferable to American unipolarity as it inevitably forces imperial powers to jostle on the geopolitical stage, thereby chipping away at the capitalist front/hastening their demise and widening potential for socialist revolution either within the imperial powers or possibly abroad. Shit's more complicated than that of course.
Anonymous 2022-01-15 (Sat) 19:45:31 No. 692881
>>692840 Sure, but this doesn't mean communists can side with one imperealist power or the other.
Anonymous 2022-01-15 (Sat) 20:01:20 No. 692886
>>691468 cry about it chmo
Anonymous 2022-01-15 (Sat) 20:03:59 No. 692887
>>692850 Sounds much better than what we have today
>>692629 Lenin did make a remark (revolutionary defeatism) that people of imperialist nations should do what they can to make their own countries lose wars, no matter who they are fighting, and try to turn them into internal class wars. And many of us are burgers. Now none of us are actually doing anything, but that also goes for the purists who are similarly considering only what movements to argue for or against and are probably not helping the causes they are talking about either. Imperialist wars aren't even fought by very many people these days, just a small class of fighters specialized in futuristic technology, and usually against much poorer people. So there isn't much revolutionary potential. But I think it still does mean that greater powers losing/wasting lots of resources is a good thing, however small.
Anonymous 2022-01-15 (Sat) 20:21:06 No. 692900
>>692832 >The current Russian government is the same one as the USSR, actually Wow
Anonymous 2022-01-15 (Sat) 20:29:38 No. 692908
>>692840 >it inevitably forces imperial powers to jostle on the geopolitical stage, thereby chipping away at the capitalist front/hastening their demise and widening potential for socialist revolution Dunno how to tell you this bro but that's gonna involve nuclear weapons now
Anonymous 2022-01-15 (Sat) 20:52:23 No. 692932
>>692814 On your subjective level, maybe not, but you are objectively complicit. You are only an individual.
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