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/leftypol/ - Leftist Politically Incorrect

"The anons of the past have only shitposted on the Internets about the world, in various ways. The point, however, is to change it."
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File: 1614278583075.jpg (95.89 KB, 640x480, censorship.jpg)

 No.94337

The tech media monopolies have been ramping up attacks on independent news media ever since the US capital riots, but they have really escalated censorship the last few days. Grayzone story getting tagged by Twitter as "material that may have been obtained through hacking", Analysis.news getting a video about the lack of police presence during the riots flagged by Youtube for spreading misinformation about election fraud, and Consortium News getting a video taken down for talking all about voter suppression.

https://theanalysis.news/commentary/google-bans-theanalysis-news-from-advertising-on-youtube/

https://consortiumnews.com/2021/02/24/youtube-removes-a-cn-live-episode/

https://thegrayzone.com/2021/02/25/as-leaks-expose-uk-op-to-weaken-russia-suppression-of-grayzone-reporting-backfires/

This is not a thread for discussion about what speech will look like after the revolution; this is about what we can do right now to help our allies escape censorship and keep public discourse open to our politics. How can we help each other?
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 No.94354

File: 1614279169679.png (110.37 KB, 1198x1080, fediverse.png)

I think a key principle for resisting censorship is decentralized federated communities. In the event that any one community goes sour and starts to censor its users, the users can simply move to another one with little pain of migration because they aren't moving out of the overall social federation in the process. The ease of migration itself should provide a strong incentive against any one instance going sour in the first place because nobody can assert monopoly control over the federated network. There are many such federated clones of centralized social media monopolies in the so-called Fediverse, including PeerTube (Youtube analog), Gnu Social/Mastodon (Twitter analog), and Friendica (Facebook analog). We know that Google feels at least somewhat threatened by it because it now uses a filter in Youtube comments sections that automatically deletes comments containing the Fediverse's main web URL "fediverse.party". The question is how do we get more people to switch over to them? There is a big opportunity now to really grow these platforms in this time of crisis.
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 No.94357

>>94354
Cannot get over how shit of a name this is lmao
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 No.94360

>>94337
Liberalism being a haven for free speech is basically just a small time capsule. Welcome to what the rest of humanity had to deal with since time immortal.
The fact of the matter is there will no be collapse or escape from liberalism, it is basically unironically the end of history and it will be hell.
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 No.94362

>>94360
Bruh…come on. Grow a fucking spine man
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 No.94368

>>94362
Tell that to your average right-wing prole.
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 No.94430

>>
Good stuff man. I keep these for communications with comrades:
IM: instead of Skype -> GNU Jami
Rooms: instead of Discord/Slack -> Matrix
Microblog: instead of Twitter -> Mastodon
Video host: instead of Youtube -> Peertube
Facebook-alike: none because that format was a mistake and the CIA's favorite gift from Silicon Valley (until dating apps maybe, but the majority are extremely integrated with Facebook specifically already so go figure)

Remember that Mastodon and Peertube links can be shared to people who aren't registered on the platforms as well, so there really isn't any barrier to entry there. Jami and Matrix are more essential for OPSEC with close associates, aka so you don't have a TNC building models on your private convos to potentially share with the police.
All already have lively international socialist presence (except maybe the first, idk how well-known / widely adopted it is yet in activist circles).
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 No.94432

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 No.94546

Censorship is actually based
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 No.94689

>>94354
>>94430
Yeah there is no alternative, some sort open source, decentralized, privacy focused, decomodified "federation" of websites must be built and/or populated. The big capitalist and imperialist platforms are to be generally boycotted and used only for agitation. Reminder that building our internet is basic per-revolutionnary.

It's really a problem that so much of the "left" depends on youtube, twitter etc. At some point you can't be a revolutionary and work with dystopian firms that steal everyone's data and strive to make the world a totalitarian hellscape. "Content creators" should give the example, breadtubers should switch to peertube for example.
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 No.94845

>>94337
After more than a decade on different image boards I have lost faith in humanity. People turn into violent animals when they are given anonymity and free peach. We would have Rwanda type genocides all around the world if platforms like Facebook would allow unregulated discussion. There needs to be moderate censorship and the party should regulate it.
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 No.94858

>>94689
>breadtubers should switch to peertube for example
https://watch.breadtube.tv/

If only beardtube would follow suit.
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 No.94862

>>94845
Sounds like Reddit is the place for you.
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 No.94866

>>94862
How original.
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 No.94868

>>94354
>The question is how do we get more people to switch over to them? There is a big opportunity now to really grow these platforms in this time of crisis.
the biggest barrier to entry with this type of shit, in my opinion, is the amount of choice it involves. there are just too many alternative platforms which you can pick any of, and not only that you have to pick between different servers which have their own set of moderators, and there's no guarantee that you will be content with that decision and you may have to switch yet again. people just don't like thinking about that stuff unless they're really willing to sacrifice the free time to study it and maximize their decisions.
what we really, actually, need. is a central institution that can be trusted to manage shit like this in a way that's conducive to human thriving. not the capitalist silly valley or the imperialist US state.
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 No.94870

>>94845
>We would have Rwanda type genocides all around the world if platforms like Facebook would allow unregulated discussion
Facebook has already been implicated in genocide in Burma. If anything imageboards are safer since one can't leverage their IRL social capital to bring others to the genocide. (Ask yourself, who's more likely to get you going around killing your neighbors: Your best friends and close family members, or some dickhead on /pol/?)
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 No.94895

>>94868
I literally went through the entire official index of PeerTube instances myself before finally decided on where to migrate all my video content off Youtube. I wouldn't wish that on anyone. At the moment I think there are too many anti-social instances that have lots of other pluses but have the extreme negative of not following or being followed by a large community of other instances.
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 No.94899

>>94868
Centralization invites top-down control and censorship when their power is threatened. There are things that can be done to make things more convenient (like having a "clone profile" button to easily migrate from one server to another), but we really need to elicit a behavior shift in users to make federated communities more acceptable.
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 No.95386

File: 1614317177497.jpg (57.76 KB, 800x599, urooj rahman.jpg)

do y'all know of any blog hosting sites that won't shut me down for talking about controversial stuff? anti-capitalism, insurrectionary theory, conspiracy theories etc. I know the best long-term solution is making my own server and website but I'm too tech illiterate to do that currently

I don't think the fed-verse is a good solution tbh. I have a problem with the whole idea of social media, aside from encrypted messaging and video chatting I guess. These platforms encourage bad infosec even when they're decentralised, imo. I think you can make an argument for limited engagement just for the sake of outreach but I definitely don't think they should be used for organising (except for protests which are mostly useless anyway). there are so many orgs in my city that don't have much outreach outside of facebook and I resent being forced to participate, give my data to big tech

I think we've also seen during the lockdowns that social media increases people's tolerance for dubiously imposed isolation and alienation. Sure it's nice to chat with people you couldn't otherwise, I recently made a friend from rural Georgia, but I do think it enables technocracy at the end of the day
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 No.95558

>>94899
and I explained why there's a massive barrier of entry preventing people from regularly using it. it's not about what's "acceptable", it's about how these sites present themselves to people concretely, even if they accept them in the abstract. you stated some social problems with top-down control, but I'm telling you those things will be passively accepted unless something concrete affects someone's day-to-day so much so that they're forced to switch to your "federation".
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 No.95560

>>95386
isn't there one hosted by some people from leftypol? multitude or medium or something like that.
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 No.95588

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 No.95632

>>95558
>you stated some social problems with top-down control, but I'm telling you those things will be passively accepted unless something concrete affects someone's day-to-day so much so that they're forced to switch to your "federation".
Then we should give up on socialism until capitalism collapses of its own internal contradictions. Same self-defeating logic at work.
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 No.95641

>>95632
I'm not saying you have to give up on it, but there are clearly internal problems with your alternative if it's not growing yet. it's a non-solution that is kind of blind to what the average every day person wants out of an exchange with his or her computer, and to me seems more or less like a return to a pre-corporate model of the internet that brings back the same conditions that gave it room to centralize in the first place.
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 No.95650

>>95641
Do you have an alternative to present while you're sowing these doompills?
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 No.97111

Bumping important thread
Mods please be in on this, we need a jump on at least Mastodon and most of all Peertube; for example we should have the latter as a place to archive leftypol OC webms and mp4s
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 No.97181

One important thing to consider as well is payment, a lot of even decentralised services will still require money to pay for a server at some location even if they are migratable. In which case it doesn't matter how easy it is to use an alternative service if the credit/debit card mafia decide to impose restrictions on donations and payments (both for the community and for the server hosting itself).

For that reason we also need decentralised censorship resistant payment channels. The only true easy example of this (beyond cash in the mail) would be Monero where its a decentralised cryptocurrency that also has censorship resistant properties that the likes of open ledger cryptocurrencies like Bitcoin and similar do not. With open ledger cryptocurrencies you can be blocked at fiat on/off ramps if your coins touched a wallet deemed undesirable or just via mining groups agreeing to censor transactions involving certain blacklisted coins (as we already seeing for bitcoin) while for regular payments you have visa/mastercard just being able to say "no".
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 No.99795

File: 1614565341434.jpg (153.58 KB, 899x1330, EvP0n6sXMAECvVZ.jpg)

I'm glad someone already made this OP because this shit is SERIOUSLY going nuts. Every day there's some new insane censorship by twitter. I'm not a WSWSfag but their article about WaPo was nothing but quotations of the liberal establishment contradicting themselves, and yet Facebook pulled it for "misinformation". They're getting fucking brazen at this point. What do we do bros? Is it too late?

Alternative media, in my mind, should be pursued only in combination with a social-media-centered pushback strategy. the BBC being biased and twitter blocking people from liking the tweet is the juiciest bit here and easy to explain, especially to liberal Burgerfags who rank the BBC above Jesus - just spam quotes in liberal and leftist circles (god knows leftists have been abhorrent on this issue) about how this is 1984, Orwellian, et cetera instead of giving up on mainstream networks entirely. and don't let people just mumble about Chomsky, manufacturing consent etc - ask them what they would DO about it. push for regulation, or a boycott, or whatever, i don't care - but we can't cede this ground for free.

I don't know if alternative platforms ought to be purely leftist or if we should try to get them generally popular - I think both ideas have benefits. I'm far from the person with all the answers here but i will say that this seems to connect with the "dual power" idea i've seen espoused on this board concerning circumventing the media and the internet when it comes to organizing, and replacing people's media diets with less mainstream ones. would this involve getting people to stop reading reddit and twitter for their news? i can't say for sure, but it's certainly tempting to want to circumvent the entrenched glowie power of the twitter radlib bloc. it will be difficult to find the answers, but hiding in our bunker certainly isn't one of them. if we can't unite on theoretical matters or on physical praxis, we should at least unite on online praxis. otherwise we literally prove ourselves to be weaker than stormfags.

>>95650
>>95632
>pointing out shortcomings = "sowing doompills"
[NTA. Does it matter?] Grow a pair buddy. Everyone in this thread shares your same end goal, so why not argue your point instead of implying someone who disagrees is a fucking wrecker? if you support this federation idea, then it's on you to explain why the average person should sign up of their own accord, let alone how you would resolve the specific user-end issues supposing they even decided to try.
Am I putting all the burden for this on you? of course not. should you at least defend your own suggestion instead of calling people doomers while ironically doomposting yourself? i would say so.

>Then we should give up on socialism until capitalism collapses of its own internal contradictions. Same self-defeating logic at work.

the more accurate analogy would be: we believe capitalism is not in people's interests, but clearly it would be silly to just larp like the Austin Red Guards and shout at the workers about upholding anti-imperialism and maoist-gonzaloist-thought. we prefer instead to figure out what people want and what we can offer them that bourgeois politics can't. likewise, if you believe that centralized media is untenable, then you have a duty to prove that your decentralized version can and will work for people.
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 No.99819

>>94337
The technology exists to circumvent these attacks. Distributed systems, website mirroring, proxy servers. The problems are with scale and access. Even if there was an infrastructure that was protected from big tech censorship, it won't do much good if nobody knows about it and for that you have to run through the social media monopolies.

The technology to resist censorship from non-state actors is there, what is missing is the community drive to publicize whatever platform might be build out of it. And to have a platform that scales, you would probably have to buy server space from one of the established players, which means you risk getting censored. And to raise awareness you have to shill the site on big platforms that will probably blacklist and flag the url.

So the problems are less technical and more about the power dynamics surrounding the fact that the internet is not a free space or public utility but private property carved up like real estate between a few major corporations.
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 No.99820

>>99819
>risk getting censored
deplatformed I mean
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 No.105907

important thread. bump
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 No.109294

I am a little disturbed by some of the more prominent PeerTube instances that are ostensibly committed to free speech but have inane rules against politics they disagree with ("no nazis", "no commies", etc).
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 No.137193

>>97181
Any cryptocurrency that gets popular enough is going to be used as a zero-sum game by speculators, revealing that they aren't in fact currencies.
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 No.138495

>>94337
I can promise you retards that I will never ban you on my website unless you post literal shit that would get the FBI knocking on my door
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 No.138499

>>97111
my brain is small, I can't figure out how Mastodon works
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 No.138546

>>138495
fuck off
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 No.138692

We should be anti-censorship in capitalist countries and pro-censorship in socialist countries.
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 No.138897

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 No.151823

Blump
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 No.151839

File: 1617513572404.png (337.94 KB, 692x847, tori.png)

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 No.151842

File: 1617513956982.jpg (53.39 KB, 616x513, twitter block.jpg)

>>94337
Also, if you aren't using social media like Twitter as some kind of personal outlet (i.e. you don't have friends on there, you're not using it to vent or anything that REALLY matters to you other than political engagement), become a rogue element.

Break rules as much as you please. If you are banned, just evade and continue. Mass systems like Twitter or really anything can stop a certain percentage of undesirable (in their view) content, but they can't stop all of it.

Keep in mind this may drag down people who follow you or people who you follow however, if my understanding of Twitter's algorithms are correct. This is why you'll see people get fucked over by the algorithm just for following too many people who are shadowbanned for example.

I wish I could just be an absolute troll on that website but I have some roots laid there, friends I speak with and don't want to lose certain things like my lists or following.
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 No.158796

>>151842
>Also, if you aren't using social media like Twitter as some kind of personal outlet (i.e. you don't have friends on there, you're not using it to vent or anything that REALLY matters to you other than political engagement), become a rogue element.

what the fuck retard. you're viewing twitters ads from twitter's sponsored shill accounts, you're generating posts for twitter and keeping people coming back for a rush of dopamine. you are helping twitter by using it.
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 No.158802

>>95386
>do y'all know of any blog hosting sites that won't shut me down for talking about controversial stuff?
There are basically none. Blog sites are totally consolidated, and they're consolidated into the hands of big tech. You'll have to learn how to host yourself.

Unique IPs: 17

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