No.326068[Last 50 Posts]
My last thread reached 500 replies again. So I chose to make another thread since the last ones seemed quite popular. I will try to not make long-winded posts again and keep them brief instead. Unless I feel differently about it.
For the uninitiated, I give guys advice on how to get casual sex with women. Perhaps some of you are interested in that. I think even when you are aiming for a relationship you will generally need to know how to be sexually attractive to women and how to sexually advance with women.
That aside, here are my last two threads. I wrote long-winded posts about approaching girls at the club, flirting, physical escalation, inner game, etc in there.https://web.archive.org/web/20211217151615/https://leftypol.org/siberia/res/172363.htmlhttps://web.archive.org/web/20221021222639/https://leftypol.org/siberia/res/207044.html
Feel free to ask me for advice.
Stop doing this to yourself my dude.
All right, I need an advice. How and when do I "subtly" flirt with a woman? I understand creating sexual tension is important for relationship to develop into romance rather than friendship route, but being too open about sexual interest comes off as creepy.
If that‘s your question then I would rather say you should flirt explicitly with women in situations where it‘s socially acceptable to build sexual tension pretty openly like clubs. And then you incrementally work your way down to the situations that require more subtlety and social wit. You are probably too inhibited and just don‘t have the social intelligence to gage when and how much is appropriate. It’s very intuitive. You just can tell with enough experience. I wrote a long post on how to flirt in my first thread. Learn from my examples. And ditch your fear of being creepy. If you are afraid of being creepy then you are so far on the opposite end of the sexual aggressiveness spectrum that you likely aren‘t a real threat to women. It will inevitably happen that a girl will find your advances creepy. For example when she isn‘t into you or your social awareness has failed you. Stop caring about it. Inhibition will be your number one enemy when it comes to getting better at this.
>>326085>>326072>It will inevitably happen that a girl will find your advances creepy. For example when she isn‘t into you or your social awareness has failed you. Stop caring about it.
While being creepy is a real thing that happens calling someone a creep is often just a way of expressing disinterest in them. To avoid being actually creepy just be respectful and mind people's boundaries. Read the room to see what is appropriate. And if you unintentionally overstep, just apologize and if they're seriously put off just move on. The biggest actually creepy thing is not taking no for an answer and continuing to pursue someone after they have expressed disinterest. This is also part of why rejection can be "unnecessarily" strong - it's to ward of socially inept men who can't take a hint that she's not interested.
How do I stop feeling suicidal every time this topic comes up? (Not your thread, but the topic in general.)
learn to accept that women aren't the measure of a man
ngl seem like a cope
No, it's something necessary to understand, whether you are getting over being depressed because you're lonely or if you want to be successful with women. Nobody wants to be someone's self-worth lynchpin.
I understand low self-esteem is massive turn off for women, but you cant separate your own self-image from other peoples treatment of you, or broader social context. Ability to get women is one of the measures of mans worth, I dont like it either, but that is how it is in the eyes of society. The same goes for individual worth, person knows they are lovable because someone loves them, and vice versa. I know you mean well, but "just become an übermensch" is not really helpful advice.
I can only tell you how I coped with it and that was that I had faith that one day I would overcome my struggle with approaching women. And I have. I look back at my younger self and can't relate to many of the issues I had. This year I've dated the most women than ever before. Back then my lack of romance depressed me and being behind other men when it comes to women hurt my pride. But since I overcame my issues it has turned into a hobby of mine to just strike up a conversation with girls I find beautiful and move things forward with them. Two weeks ago I approached a girl at the mall, because I liked the way she was dressed. After some small talk we went to get coffee together. I gave her my number and this weekend we went on a date. It was a great date. She's 20, adorable face and has a goth girl look. Those are regular experiences of mine nowadays. I really started from a low place, mind you. I had severe social anxiety. I was irrationally nervous in all kinds of situations and stuttered even when talking to my friends. Being rejected by a girl, even a girl reacting negatively towards me, was a huge blow to my self-esteem so I tried to avoid that at all costs. It was awful as you can imagine. Nowadays rejection means nothing to me and I speak with a flow when talking to women. It's only about amusing myself now. If I managed to do it, you can probably do it too.
In order to become chad, you must first view yourself as one. That is, internalize the confidance (and the fact that you must be 'aggressive') of sex-havers within yourself – in the appropriate scenarios, of course.
For a woman to want your D, your must first feel worthy of giving it to them, and thus, put yourself out there. Otherwise, nobody will be interested in (or even notice) you, just like you don't pay attention (or care about) those lonely girls that are also too shy to make a move.
General advices for people here:
I) Friends - serve as a potential bridge for meeting interesting people or even helping you take initiative;
II) Alcohol - takes away much of inhibition we normally have;
III) Confidence - at the end of the day, you must make the move, otherwise, nothing will happen.
Sex Haver here with an issue
>Be with my gf for 3 years
>I love her and she loves me, we talk about our future together,have great sex ,fight at times but solve our issues with conversations
>Help each other through tough times ended up at the same uni
>Become organized and meet new people feel less of a fat looser for a fist time
>Start having second thoughts about her being my first and only relationsip for the rest of my life ,she had a bfs before when she was a teen
>I was the "insecure" one in the past(we broke up for a short time in the past) now tables have turned
>I still love her and see a future with her
>The last few days feel like shit cause i dont know if i am a jerk for wanting more experiances
Any thoughts comrades ,is it that we spend too much or too little time together or am i just a dumb man?
Go on holiday to Thailand
You are not a jerk, and none of these desires will go away. If you are really so close, just talk with her about your feeling. See how that goes.
I asked a woman out for the first time ever. She asked if she could have time to think about it, I said yes. I think this is worse than if she had just said no. I don't really have a question, I'm just dying. Everyone always said "just ask, the worst thing she can say is no." But fuuuuck, this is way worse.
she sees you as an option but wants to hold out in case someone better comes along. back off now the last thing you want is to get into a relationship and family and a decade down the line she secretly resents you because you were her 2nd (or 3rd or 4th etc.) option.
This. Anons here need to learn self-respect or they're just going to end up in a relationship worse than being alone.
at least she was honest, the vast majority of girls I asked out said yes! then made up excuses or ghosted
>inb4 this slowly transitions into a reactionary PUA thread
But i thought trans people were born that way?
Go to a psychologist >>327615
Give more info
Psychologists are typical normies that know jackshit about non-normies problems and how to solve them
Have no illusions, it meant no.
you do realize that "normie" is just a meaningless buzzword, right? you can either choose to go to therapy or not (if you can afford it, of course) but being a total mess is precisely the kind of person that a psychologist is supposed to deal with
>>327637>transitions into a reactionary PUA thread
These threads have always had an undercurrent of that ideology. The framing itself of "halp acquire women pls" is already somewhat problematic and ironically can be very counterproductive. I mean just look at what OP is saying here >>326939>This year I've dated the most women than ever before.
This is not a metric you want to target and maximize for most purposes, including casual sex. Sure, you want to have enough dates (or equivalent) that you have the opportunity to meet someone and get somewhere (wherever that is), but if you are concerning yourself with "how many women did I talk to?" or "how many women did I date (or get a second date with)?" or "how many times did I score?" you have your priorities in a silly place. If you are just interested in numbers and casual relationships/sex then you're better off just seeking hookups on an app or at a location people go for hookups (bar, party, club, etc).
If you're interested in relationships your priorities should be on finding someone compatible with you and getting closer to them. It's uncommon to pivot from something casual to something serious, because both of you (ostensibly) went into it under different intent than a relationship. A better route for most people is to expand their social circle (which is usually the real issue for "forever alone" situations). The boundary between friendship and romance can get blurry (especially these days) and one thing that's worth doing regardless is having more female friends (including women you've dated), because women often like to talk about relationships and play match-maker. Even if they don't, knowing them can make it easier to meet other women. The healthier and more effective way to increase your chances is to just socialize with women more in general
, not to think of them as points you rack up on a scoreboard. From the same post HH says>It's only about amusing myself now.
Which should be a bit of a red flag. Yeah, he's talking about random flirtations, but if socializing with someone in any context is just about amusing yourself, it's fundamentally one-sided and probably not going to lead anywhere. Even for a one-night stand, you are socially engaging with someone on a two-way street. You should be thinking about what they want too, because it can help both of you cooperate to find yourselves in a situation where you both get what you want. Even casual sex should not be thought of in terms of predator-prey, but in terms of cooperating. Women want sex too, they just have different things they are looking for. If you are considerate of their wants it makes it easier to give them what they want and get what you want.
People should ask themselves what they actually care about here. Do you just want to entertain yourself with talking to women or do you want to actually form relationships (of more than one kind)? Do you just want to fuck more or do you want to not feel lonely? Because casual sex won't do much for the latter. There's nothing inherently wrong with casual sex and hookups, but there is a tendency for hookup culture to be marketed toward people as the
answer when it's often not even an
answer to what they really want. The overwhelming tendency among incels and adjacent communities is to misdiagnose
their problem as lack of sex rather than lack of socialization. Sex is just one element of social life, to which socializing and self esteem is often reduced
, and the proliferation of hookup culture has contributed to that. It's much more common to lack community and sex than to just lack sex, and even people who get a lot of sex usually still lack community. The more connected you are with other people, the more opportunities you have to meet new people and to have sex, btw. This is a wide-ranging social ill that all of us on this website should be aware of consider as a systemic issue, not just a personal one.
Note also that as socialists it's worthwhile to get good at networking and meeting people, and having a larger social circle is beneficial to your activities>>326924>I know you mean well, but "just become an übermensch" is not really helpful advice.
That's not even close to what I'm saying. You should approach women as someone you want to spend time with (doing whatever it is you want to do) and not as a security blanket to fix your male fragility. That is exactly the kind of thing that will put a woman off you. What will
put off a lot of women is you being preoccupied with that stuff (because it signals you are self-absorbed, see women as points to acquire, and are trying to use women to fix perceived problems with yourself). Women don't particularly care how many other women you've been with - that's a standard imposed on men primarily by other men. Sure, give a fuck about it if you want to impress da boyz, but it's not going to make a lot of panties wet. Gender roles have components that are reinforced by the opposite sex and
by the same sex. Women can make the same kind of mistake too thinking they will be unattractive to men if they don't adhere to female-enforced fashion standards that 99% of straight men aren't even aware of. If you want to have positive interactions with anybody, it behooves you not to get psy-op'd into misunderstanding what they actually care about.
>>327824>A better route for most people is to expand their social circle (which is usually the real issue for "forever alone" situations)
Obviously having a social life and meeting people is the basis, but that just gives you more opportunities. You still need to be proactive in turning those into sex/relationship. Requires skill most people acquire by virtue of having healthy brain and normal socialisation. But some of us lack those, and therefore we actually do need a manual.
>Even casual sex should not be thought of in terms of predator-prey
And as you yourself said, gender roles are reinforced by both sexes. Realistically, the most I can expect a woman to initiate with me is friendly conversation. The rest is up to me.
>If you are considerate of their wants it makes it easier to give them what they want
This entire thread is about guys wanting to know what women want and how to give it to them.
>not as a security blanket to fix your male fragility
We are not talking about keeping a scoreboard of how many chicks you banged, but about loneliness, lack of intimacy. These issues get fixed by finding someone to be with.
It doesn't matter if its a "buzzword", someone who has not experienced social difficulties in their life can never understand what its like, no matter how many textbooks they've read about it
Not to mention the quasi eugenicist goal mental health care has which will only present me with copes so i can rot away quietly and not disturb the normals too much with my presence
Lol do you think most people have no traumas or mental issues lolololololollololo
not what i said, lying normoid
You want to be flirty not cause it maximizes the chances to fuck the girl/boy you flirt with but cause
1)Makes you seem social and confident
2)Actually improves your self esteem and social skills
I do weird studen union shit thats big in my country and really the natural way to fuck someone is
1)Make freinds with them(skip if you are already in a common freindgroup)
2)Flirt /talk to develop tension
All other bar -going tinder-swiping autism is degenerate>>327869>someone who has not experienced social difficulties in their life can never understand what its like
Yes, social dificulties, there are other mental issues other than that that normie psychologists can emphatize with and understand
Not being able to socialize is the sole issue normies are completely unable to comprehend
>>327871>You want to be flirty not cause it maximizes the chances to fuck the girl/boy you flirt with but cause
1)Makes you seem social and confident
2)Actually improves your self esteem and social skills
What is the difference? The point of improving my social skills and confidence is to get laid.
>Flirt /talk to develop tension
Which I dont know how to do, hence why I am here.
dont bother, normies do this thing so we perpetually chase our own tail, thay have no actual intention to help, why would they?
Why are normies so cruel to us?
I think they are trying to help, its just that their advice is geared towards other normies. Go out and vibe with people is a thing that does work for most people, just not for outliers.
I am a tall guy so all my extra kilos and social anxiety doesnt count according to your ideology
First get a social circle (join a party)
Second find some girl that seems to vibe with you ,no you arent going to find a normie girl you will find someone that likes people like you ,they exist ,if you are too insecure like me you will naturally feel attracted to not mainstream attractive girls.
Then find a way/reason to text with them ,my guess is that you arent ultra hot so you will have to charm them by talking about random leftist shit and your dreams and aspirations
Then hope she gives you hints to make a move
lmao you were spot on >>327897
its almost like this post was written just to fuck with us
Look, at the conceptual level I understand these things, what you have to do to meet women, escalate, etc. The specifics are problem. What do you say, how do you say it, what your body language should be, how to decypher her body language and words.
>>327878>What is the difference? The point of improving my social skills and confidence is to get laid.
Getting laid is not the point. Your goal should be making some kind of connection (temporary or permanent). Getting laid is just a consequence of that. Busting in a woman is not going to fix your mental health. Don't expect it to.>>Flirt /talk to develop tension >Which I dont know how to do
You want to stoke interest and desire in a woman, so give her something to be interested in. This is why it's important to pay attention to her and think about what she wants. Throw out some kind of bait, like a vague reference to something about yourself that she might want to follow up on, for an example. The tension there is the mystery. Or you can create tension over what your intentions are, by giving her attention and then waiting to see if she adjusts her behavior to be more flirty. Something PUA types usually never tell you is that most women (not unlike men) want someone to pay attention and listen to them. Even if its just some bullshit (and they know that it's bullshit), women like to vent and talk usually. If you just pay attention and provide validation and a little back and forth that can go a long way.
But the thing is, no amount of quick tips is going to go very far if you don't go into it with the right mindset. Think of it as a dance, a playful back and forth between the two of you. You are both looking for people you can have fun with and can communicate on the same wavelength. If you aren't that sure of yourself it can actually be a bit of an advantage if you learn to use it right - when you talk to a woman pay attention to her communication style and try to match her communication style rather than imposing yours. She may or may not like that, but the same goes for anything.>>327881>>327884
This is the advice thread. If you want to complain go make a sad nosex thread or something. If there's something unclear to you ask for clarification.>>327885>>327901
Do you actually have some idea of what you are looking for in helpful advice or are you going to claim anything you see is just advice for "normies"?
I wanted to reply to this, because in one regard I agree with many of your points and think you are misunderstanding me (not in bad faith, I assume), but I also see detrimental mistakes there. Let me explain myself.
Social intelligence regarding the sexual dynamics of heterosexual men and women, the mindset heterosexual guys need to exhibit sexual attractiveness and also frankly the knowledge when it comes to flirting and sex are subjects in the field of social skills that really stand on their own. In platonic interactions with both men and women, a man can be socially attuned and likeable, while still severely lacking in the aspects when it comes to sexuality. This is why these subjects need to be addressed on their own. Therefore the idea that it would be sufficient to merely be more social and then things just happen on their own is naïve, because it ignores the shortcomings of men who are struggling in that department and simply assumes every men already possess this understanding, knowledge, mindset and sexual-esteem that is necessary to end up having sex with women.
I will refer to this as "normie-centric". It's a perspective on addressing social maladaptiveness that is ironically founded on just assuming the person in question isn't socially maladapted. Not in a way that is explicitly said, but by giving solutions that already require the person to not be socially maladapted in the first place
. A good example is your own comment>If you are just interested in numbers and casual relationships/sex then you're better off just seeking hookups on an app or at a location people go for hookups (bar, party, club, etc).
Or this dude >>327871>2)Flirt /talk to develop tension>3)Score
You do realise that these men in question who are struggling in that regard can't just go to a party or club and get hookups, right? You framed it as a given that they could just have it. They can't. And some might still fail when it comes to the conventional approach of being set up by their friends.
Your solution is that they simply need more socialisation and that a lack thereof is the cause of the problem. I agree, but not fully. If you lack social intelligence and social skills in general, of course you will likely not have hookups or end up in a relationship. The problem is that you can develop your social intelligence and social skills in a platonic sense while the sexual aspect is still left uncultivated. Being more socially active and gathering your experiences in a platonic sense doesn't automatically lead to the sexual side of things being developed as well. There are actually many men out there who have male and female friends, who take care of themselves and work on their studies/job and still have no sex. You would not believe this to be true. Why? Because you are operating from a normie-centric viewpoint where you think ending up in a relationship or having hookups is a given as long as you put yourself out there and just be yourself. That stems from not being able to relate to men who severely lack in those departments. You just assume that your solution, which makes not being socially maladapted the prerequisite
, would be enough. These men need advice and experiences specifically regarding the sexual side of things and they specifically need it from the standpoint of heterosexual men.
Now why have I spoken specifically about heterosexual men so far? Because the dating dynamic varies from sexuality to sexuality and from "gender role" to "gender role" and hetero men are in a unique position. Gay men fuck like rabbits. As homophobic as that may sound, it's the truth and the gay guys I'm friends with and the few times gay men have hit on me have only reaffirmed this to me. Men in a gay dating dynamic really are in their element. Men generally are more direct and sexually explicit when they hit on the person they are interested in. That makes the gay dating dynamic when it comes to sex simple and straight forward. The ones who can relate most to heterosexual men are lesbian women with a more masculine attitude. Funnily enough, women who realised later in their life that they were bi or lesbian commonly say they've come to understand the struggle and complaints of men when it comes to approaching women. It turns out, it actually is fucking hard courting a woman, because you have to read women's subtle signals, which borders on expecting us to read their minds, and leading the courtship process, while the women generally is in a rather passive role where she merely gives off signals and awaits and receives the man's advances. And by the way, outliers were heterosexual women directly approach men and push the escalation process forward don't overturn what is generally the case. So the point is, playing the role heterosexual man have to is not easy. It gets easy once you understand how you do it and have gathered a lot of experience, but it's difficult when you haven't yet.
Guys who struggle at this usually don't get good advice at all. They either deal with guys who were lucky enough to be naturals telling them to "just be yourself" (which hasn't worked so far for these men), they deal with clueless guys who lie about their success and give bullshit advice (very common) or they get bad advice from women. It is crazy that despite the fact that women are on the receiving end of male advances, they are still clueless how hard it is for men to approach them, be a smooth talker and lead the escalation process. Women don't even begin to give men advice of that fashion because they just assume men already have these essential traits of sexual attraction or they just ignore that aspect. So you are left with useless advice such as be kind, be considerate, be a good communicator, which in all honesty you do not need to "get women". And you can have those traits and still have women not interested in you for more than a friendship. I'm not saying you shouldn't be considerate or a good communicator. Clearly, those are good for relationships. But these traits never come to be used in a relationship because you can't even get into one. The essential sexual know-how was missing.
Lastly, why do I stress the point of casual sex so much? Because cultivating your social intelligence and social skills in a sexual sense demands a lot of experience and only with time you get better at it. Being sexually attractive as a man opens a lot of doors when it comes to women, and by that I mean you get more options. If a man has no or rarely options, he tends to quickly fall in love with the next woman who shows interest. That isn't necessarily a good relationship because they might not be a sufficiently good match, but he took what he can get. His lack of sexual attractiveness and understanding when it comes to the sexuality of women and how to maintain her sexual interest will probably lead to less sex in the relationship than he is happy with. And lastly, he will likely end up in a position of little power in the relationship because he doesn't have options, which leads to conceding or fearful behaviour. The woman on the other hand has numerous options merely by being a woman and maintaining her looks. Massive disadvantage for the man. The best position to enter a relationship as a man is when you are already spinning plates (like women already do) and then you pick the best woman among them (like women already do). You only get that when you are a man of high sexual value.
I agree that male sexless is a systemic issue in the sense that people nowadays are more alienated and isolated than ever before and therefore lack social exposure and by extension develop poor social skills. But why is male sexlessness more prevalent than female sexlessness if we are equally affected by alienation and isolation in this society? Because women having poor social skills or poor understanding of male sexuality is irrelevant to them being able to attain sex or find a relationship. Meanwhile for men it is absolutely critical. And that is because the courtship process between heterosexual men and women is not symmetrical, but asymmetrical as I've described it earlier. I've grown up with egalitarian views on men and women and even read some feminist theory and support feminism, but what I learned in the last years is that gender roles definitely still exist when it comes to sex and women are not attracted to you if you don't live up to that role. I'm not talking about being the breadwinner or some Andrew Tate type of shit, but just how you communicate, how you behave, that you lead the courtship process and the necessary mindset you need as a man to authentically do all of that. And that makes this subject easily sound politically incorrect and misogynistic when you give men real advice.
>>327905>Throw out some kind of bait, like a vague reference to something about yourself that she might want to follow up on, for an example. The tension there is the mystery. Or you can create tension over what your intentions are, by giving her attention and then waiting to see if she adjusts her behavior to be more flirty.
Uh oh, the "be yourself" crowd ain't going to like that. Isn't that manipulating women since you are consciously doing something to get a certain response from her? He should just do what he has always done so far.
>Something PUA types usually never tell you is that most women (not unlike men) want someone to pay attention and listen to them. Even if its just some bullshit (and they know that it's bullshit), women like to vent and talk usually. If you just pay attention and provide validation and a little back and forth that can go a long way.
Bro, you know jack about what PUAs actually say, because building comfort is what they also talk about. "PUA" is just a boogeyman buzzword for you. You are not unlike clueless liberals who talk badly of "socialism" but are actually operating on a caricature in their minds, that doesn't reflect the real thing in question.
>>327908>You do realise that these men in question who are struggling in that regard can't just go to a party or club and get hookups, right?
Very few people do that ,you need a freind group and you arent going to find that in a club or a party , you need to find a place people hang out and socialize ,they obvious one for us is the youth group of an org .
People who act all autistic are depreesed not ill ,its victimization
Gender roles exist and thats why i for example know i am cis and not trans
The fundamental issue here is that lack of sex is not the real problem, just a symptom of it. The central point of my post is that acquisition of sex is setting the wrong goal and despite all your paragraphs you ignore that. Yes, you need experience to develop competence, but that applies to any social interaction, not just sex. The entire problem with the PUA attitude you have is that you're trying to skip over becoming socially competent to get to the sex part when that's not even the core problem. I'm not saying "just" do anything. Learning social skills is hard and takes a long time, but it's necessary for many things but especially to have any kind of successful relationship. Fixating on "sexual value," mythologizing women, and emphasizing "power in the relationship" is setting these men up for failure long term, even if it gets some short term results.>>327916>Bro, you know jack about what PUAs actually say
I have read a lot of PUA forums because you people fascinate me.> because building comfort is what they also talk about.
That's just a euphemism for lulling women into a false sense of security, not actually paying attention and giving a shit which is what I was suggesting, because that's often something women are looking for.
>>327957>im not saying "just" do anything>learning social skills is hard and takes a lot of time
And yet your only advice is "just vibe,bro"
Dont be surprised when people flock too PUA's when they are the only ones offering concrete advice
Serious as a brownlet, I really feel like white girls are racist af. Even the liberal fake progressive type radlibs seem to have no interest in a brown guy even if he looks better than your average white guy.
Should a brown guy even bother with whiteoids? Or does sticking to ones own ethnicity have more success? (Tho even brown girls thirst for white guys like some social mobility thing)
When I asked, she seemed at first a bit shocked, then happy, then confused, and she asked for time. She said she recently had a bad experience in a relationship and isn't sure if she is ready for one yet. She said she was very flattered that I asked. We then talked about other stuff for a while.
I have a math class with her at university. We have been flirting in it for a few weeks.
Idk, maybe this is just a way of saying no, but maybe its not. Idk, it still seemed like she was into me at the end.
Heterosexual romance is HEBEGYNOCENTRIC.
Meaning, women have the upper hand, as long as they're young, slim, feminine, docile.
Once a woman leaves her forties, has kids, is out of shape, has physical flaws, is not docile, nor feminine, it's over for her.
Also, as for brown girls thirsting for white boys? Yes it's real and it's social mobility.
However, they're not gonna go for just any white guy.
They want to go for the preppy/worldly handsome hunk white guy.
Think of all those action hero characters.
Face from A-Team, Micheal Knight from Knight Rider, Bruce Wayne, Clark Kent, etc.
Also, yea, white girls are racist, but not against other skin colors so much as differing "aesthetics".
If you are white male, white girls will still give you shit for not appealing to their prima donna instincts.
I also don‘t believe that sex itself is both the problem and solution. Sexlessness is a symptom. The point is, on your way to learn how to have sex you will learn and overcome your actual issues when it comes to why you weren‘t having sex. I‘m not advocating for not improving your social skills while only focusing on sex. You couldn‘t even have sex without social skills, unless you pay for it. I merely pointed out that if you work on social skills and being more social overall, that doesn‘t automatically lead to ending up in a relationship or with sex, because you could end up only developing your social intelligence and social skills in a platonic sense, while the sexual side of things remains uncultivated. So even if his platonic female friends set him up with another girl, he could embarrassingly fail at moving things forward sexually. You have not considered that because you are normie-centric and make not being socially maladapted the prerequisite of your solution. You can‘t relate to a guy who has a normal social life and still is severely lacking in sexual self-esteem, the know-how of how to flirt, how to escalate things and how to read the signals of women. After learning how to hold a conversation he just “needs to put himself out and then it will just happen”. No, you also need to teach those men specifically the sexual side of things.
>>328347>I agree that the common sense thing to do would be to "just go with the flow", the problem is that for me that would probably devolve into shitting on "allies" for using us as pets at best and meat shields at worst and talking about the class/race stratification within the local LGBT community.
Then just go with the flow but censor yourself? I mostly never get into arguments with people because I don't bring up, or even offer my opinion on subjects I know will trigger them, yet I'm still able to have interesting and deep conversations with them.
Yh, this is definitely just PUA thread now. I’m just waiting until someone decides to self-publish an e-books for sad desperate dudes.
The problem with PUA is misoginy and selling snake oil, not that they gove advice to desperate dudes
Will the book be in paperback or completely digital?
But they don't give good advice lmfao
Yeah, but nobody does, so you take what you can get.
Well, the time has come and so have I, wish me luck guys, I'll keep you posted about the date to please my ego and need of feedback
>>328419>>328447>nobody gives good advice so I'm going to take the worst fucking advice I can find>that'll show 'em
Whenever people try to give you guys good faith advice you complain that it's not helpful. The reality is 1. be attractive 2. don't be unattractive, but those are things you can improve about yourself. The whole point of dating is that both sides are trying to figure out who the other is and see if they can get what they want out of the interaction. If your focus is on techniques and facade more than actually being what a woman wants, she is probably going to sniff you out and lose interest. You motherfuckers don't seem to want to face that you need personal growth.
>>328999>being what a woman wants
Man sexhavers are all perfect people at the top of their fields and have flawless personalities and bodies. Not my dad or whatever. Unless you just think it is impossible for a decent guy to go sexless. We all have to be basement dwellers that have at most a GED to our names, cystic acne, morbidly obese, and literally can't even go out to do mundane errands like going to the DMV.
Uygha how the fuck do you have balls to criticize others for giving bad advice when this is what your bring.
I already said this before, this is just standard gaslighting
Normies get a kick out of manipulating social outcast and messing with their heads, makes them feel powerfull
Depends on the woman obviously, but some core things include<being emotionally available<knowing how to make her cum (or being able to figure it out)<having a stable life i.e. not being broke or in danger of becoming broke<an enjoyable person to be around
There's no tricks or shortcuts to these things.>>329140>Unless you just think it is impossible for a decent guy to go sexless
When decent guys go sexless they call it a "dry spell" and focus on other things, instead of constructing some elaborate mythology about how there's a conspiracy of women not fucking them.>>329144
If you think "advice" is going to help with this you have the wrong approach. Neither the personal problem of having trouble attracting women nor the societal problem of social alienation is going to be fixed with "advice." That is a snake oil pitch created by scammers trying to sell you books or other commodities in perpetuity.>>329145>gaslighting
Telling someone their ideology is fucking them up isn't gaslighting.
Yeah, considering the comment above I think he is just fucking with us (or genuinely retarded).
Lol, it’s so obvious you are an inexperienced average dude with few successes.>>329113
You need to understand that there are two categories here. The short term (lover) and the long term (boyfriend). Depending on how the girl perceives you, she will put you in either of the two categories and treat and evaluate you based on that. The lover is for sex and the boyfriend is, obviously, for a relationship. Women apply different rules to these two different kinds of men and treat them accordingly. Hence why you could be waiting a month or two before she even let‘s you undress her, while the same innocent seeming girl would suck some other dude‘s dick within 10 minutes of meeting him. What makes a guy a lover is that he‘s physically attractive, masculine, dominant, playful, sexually uninhibited, nonchalant, detached, he’s a risk taker, other girls desire him and he puts her on a roller coaster of both positive and negative emotions. The boyfriend is always friendly, educated, politically correct, has resources to show for, careful to not offend her, a good listener and always attends to her needs. Men also evaluate and treat women based on similar two categories. Men want a sweet innocent angel to be their girlfriend, yet they would also love to fuck a hot nymphomaniac slut. Men want to turn the sweet innocent angel into their personal slut in the bedroom (which they usually don‘t manage to do, because she’s not that kind of girl), but they don‘t want the slut to be their girlfriend. He just can’t see her that way, because she can‘t be an angel anymore if she was a whore for other men. Women want to tame the lover into their boyfriend (which they usually don‘t manage to do, because he’s not that kind of guy), but they don‘t want their boyfriend to be their lover. She just doesn‘t see him that way and the whole point of getting with him was long term security.
If you ever wondered why women give men bad advice on how to get women, it‘s because they are telling you what they wished their previous lover was. Be kind, be a good listener, pay attention to her. Obviously the lover can‘t be those things, otherwise he wouldn‘t be the sexually exciting lover who keeps her hooked and her emotions on a rollercoaster.
Of course, women have differing tastes. There’s variance. But there are still generalities. When it comes to the lover, women of all subcultures and socioeconomic classes are turned on by the general characteristics of the lover, regardless what his specific background is. When it comes to the boyfriend however long term compatibility matters. So it becomes more important that you are from compatible subcultures, have compatible lifestyles, have compatible views, etc. The boyfriend ends up having to jump through more hoops, he has to wait longer for sex, she will be less excited to have sex with him and only a narrower set of women are available to the boyfriend.
>>329145> Normies get a kick out of manipulating social outcast and messing with their heads<proceeds to guzzle PUA nonsense
I mean I despise PUA shit as well, but end up reading it anyway, cuz I am kind of autistic and gasping at straws here.
wrong on both claims. dead bedrooms are very much a "50 year old boomer not getting a divorce for the kids" type of thing. And they only want a divorce because they both got fat and ugly, but mostly fat. The reality is that most people who are dating have pretty good sex lives and plenty of girls are fairly kinky. you would be surprised by how many girls want to be pissed on for example. The reason you have this misconception of so-called "alpha fucks, beta bucks" is because the redpill communities you took these ideas from are populated by middle-aged divorced dads, who are necessarily the "beta bucks". You won't run into many happily married men with healthy sex lives on said communities.
you are also incorrect about so-called "lovers" (although you should have just called them "alphas" because you are repeating verbatim ideas I read a half decade ago on theredpill). Although it is obvious that women are attracted to more attractive, fit, witty, well-educated men(has anyone in this thread disputed that?) they do not have a seperate preference for boyfriends. You even acknowledge this yourself when you claim that "Women want to tame the lover into their boyfriend". At all points, women prefer attractive, fit, witty, well-educated, etc. etc. men.
What one can deduce from this is that if one seeks to attract women, one should seek to display those traits. Another thing you should realize is that women actually want to have sex. The only reason they put up "hoops" as you say is not because they do not want to have sex but because they are trying to select for a man who will stick around - which has nothing to do with any of the traits you've described other than the fact that the most attractive guys, who tend to have many options and are less likely to stick around, won't jump through them.
Therefore if you would like to get pussy, improve yourself physically, aesthetically, etc. and make male friends, but don't fall into the trap of thinking that reading Rollo Tomato, wearing a bright pink pimp hat, and asking girls in the supermarket if their pussy is as tight as their shirt, or whatever, is some kind of "shortcut to success", or worth anything at all, really.
Well bros, she said no. Time to move on to the next one I guess. At least I know I can ask now.
>>329170>Lol, it’s so obvious you are an inexperienced average dude with few successes.
"ur inexperienced" isn't a card you should be playing if the big win you're describing earlier ITT is no longer being crippled by social anxiety and able to go on dates. Glass houses.
>You need to understand that there are two categories here. The short term (lover) and the long term (boyfriend). […]
Do you really think that you are going to reform some incels into the kind of guy who's "lover" material as you describe? It's not impossible, but what makes those guys effective in that way is precisely the kind of social skills the guys ITT lack. Pointing out what they would need to learn to fix that causes these guys to complain about "fucking with" them. But more to the point, what these guys are most lacking is social connection and being a womanizing chad is neither an achievable short/medium term goal nor the solution to that problem. The "lover" men usually have well connected social circles that fulfill their social needs (and serve as a strong basis for the confidence and social skills that make them successful) and they engage in casual sex for other needs (namely physical pleasure). Just having casual sex is not a good solution for people whose main problem is being lonely and alienated.
Becoming the "boyfriend" type is much more achievable and much closer to what they actually want (and your description of that role is over the top and reductive as a way to make it look worse than it is). More to the point the "boyfriend" role and skillset helps to fulfill the social needs they're expressing (including outside of romance by being friends with and spending more time around women to gain confidence) while also building foundational social skills they would need to be a successful "lover" type. In a best case scenario some of them might keep going all the way to womanizer mode but some would realize that casual sex wasn't actually what they were after.
What's most wrong about this post/approach is thinking that people divide neatly into dichotomous categories like this. A healthy sex life involves both of the elements you're describing, and a good partner or date is someone who can be both sides of the coin. The social competence you are trying to get these guys to adopt is the more advanced of the two and really should be learned second. Regardless, restricting yourself to one Type is reducing your prospects for little reason - you can be different things to different people at different times.
Moreover, the underlying issue with incels tends to be a neurotic view of women that undermines any social performance they might have, boyfriend or lover, which is why they need to first get more comfortable with women at a more basic social level. Some guy without that baggage could skip over the basic stuff, but if he isn't "boyfriend" material he will likely have trouble getting out of the fuckboy box (and probably have a dysfunctional relationship if he does). I don't think that these guys only want to be that to women, even if it was achievable.>If you ever wondered why women give men bad advice on how to get women, it‘s because they are telling you what they wished their previous lover was. Be kind, be a good listener, pay attention to her. Obviously the lover can‘t be those things, otherwise he wouldn‘t be the sexually exciting lover who keeps her hooked and her emotions on a rollercoaster.
People can have fun and be spontaneous while also being stable and responsible. These are modes that you can switch between not Types of Person. Reducing people to simplistic categories like this is a big part of social alienation and the way that people often see each other in reductive ways. You can't fix someone else having that attitude, but you can recognize it and move on and you can work on it where it exists in yourself. Getting caught up in this alpha vs beta kind of nonsense is taking your head out of the world in front of you and putting it into the clouds.>>329238>The reason you have this misconception of so-called "alpha fucks, beta bucks" is because the redpill communities you took these ideas from are populated by middle-aged divorced dads, who are necessarily the "beta bucks". You won't run into many happily married men with healthy sex lives on said communities.
Fucking this lmao.
The PUA mentality among millennials and zoomers is a similar phenomenon to boomers being out of touch with the job market. They are basing their understanding of things on memories of an older generation's experiences.>>329247
That sucks, but good for you and good luck next time.
And yes you're right it's worse to say "let me think about it." Sounds like she was trying to let you down easy or something (the correct way is to just politely say no). And there's much worse she can say than just "no," but if she does it's because she's an asshole and you shouldn't take it personally.
I dont have social needs, the only reason i want friends is to gain social proof so women will want to fuck me
If i could get that while being a loner i would be doing exactly that, and i suspect thats the way for alot of other men
Sex not being the endpoint is a bunch of bullshit
I used to think that too but that's actually just what people end up thinking when they haven't had male friends for a long time. It is stressful to you now so you don't enjoy it. Once you are used to it, you will enjoy it.>>329272
Health and fitness:
* Regular sleep schedule
* Some form of consistent employment
* Consistent exercise: If you do not lift, start lifting. Something like Starting Strength is a good start..
* Diet/nutrition: Sufficient protein + no junk food. Oats, pasta, whole wheat bread, rice, etc as staple foods. Above all no fucking soda, drink either water, milk, or some kind of nut milk.
* Skin: If you have acne, get a cleanser and a moisteurizer, apply cleanser in shower, scrub, wash, put moiseurizer on outside of shower. there is no reason for you to look like a pimply teenager. dont waste your money on expensive bullshit. personally i use cerave sa cleanser and cerave moisteurizer because they are cheap and you can get them anywhere.
* Hair - find a haircut that looks nice on you. If you don't know what looks nice on you go to a proper barber(not greatclips or whatever) and work with them to find something. It costs more but they know what they're doing. If you still don't know you will probably look alright with hair buzzed to a #2.
* Beard - if you can grow a proper beard then grow one and keep it trimmed. if you can't, keep it shaved. if you're not sure one way or the other, keep it cut to stubble. whatever you do, don't let it grow out on the neck.
Simple but well fitting.
* Single color t shirts - make sure it's not too loose around the waist and the arms aren't too long. typically heavier cotton shirts are less silky, and thus, fit tighter
* Jeans - pretty simple
* Muted color shoes - Converse and a lot of zero rise shoes do this well, maybe even an all black tennis shoe. no bright primary colors
* Glasses - if you wear glasses, think deeply about whether you look good in them or not. Contact lenses aren't that expensive if you do monthlies and they can make you look nicer.
Have a friend group that you hang out with semi regularly. If you do not have one, find one through a hobby. If your only hobbies are on the computer, any kind of sport or martial art will do. you can still meet people at bars and yes you can meet friends through leftie orgs as well though please don't bring relationship drama into that, it's very wreckerish.
At some point if you have a developed friend group, hobbies, and some level of social life, you will inevitably encounter women through these and will be at least conversational enough to talk about whatever you're both doing and make small chat, and if you hit it off, continue from there. But ask her out quick because otherwise she'll become your friend and tell you about some other guy she's trying to date, which is miserable.
Hope this helps :D
>>329248>”ur inexperienced" isn't a card you should be playing if the big win you're describing earlier ITT is no longer being crippled by social anxiety and able to go on dates. Glass houses.
That is in the past, while you are still clueless. I will point out as much as I like that you are a chump.
The rest of your post is the same strawman that pretends I ever advocated for guys to not work on their social skills in general while only trying to hit on women. I never did. If someone struggles with socializing as a whole, by all means, work on that. My point is, you can end up developing your social skills only platonically while still completely lacking in the sexual domain. Ergo, it’s a subject to address on its own. The reason why the others are saying you are fucking with them is because your advice are the usual platitudes. What is this shit >>329328
. Your advice is to wear plain T shirts and jeans..? That‘s the groundbreaking insight you provide? When it comes to actually approaching and hitting on girls you didn‘t give any details. That part is vague and nebulous because you are inexperienced when it comes to that. It‘s obvious. That‘s why I‘m calling it out.>>329238
No, it‘s not the alpha male/beta male dichotomy, because a friendly, educated man whose selling point is long term security for the girl can still be an “alpha” by displaying leadership qualities and being at the top of his social circle, respected and assertive, but would fall into the boyfriend category of what I‘m speaking of.
>Although it is obvious that women are attracted to more attractive, fit, witty, well-educated men(has anyone in this thread disputed that?)
I didn‘t claim anyone of you disputed that.
The point is, depending on how the girl perceives you, she will treat you differently. There are discernible patterns when it comes to that, that are essentially a dichotomy. You are perceived a certain way based on the traits of attractiveness you display. They either make you seem attractive as her lover or her boyfriend. You can display attractive traits of both sides, but you will still be treated as either the lover or boyfriend. It’s the defining start of your acquaintance. And this isn’t entirely static. That was just your misunderstanding. You can be the lover who she wants to become her boyfriend later on, but you don’t become the boyfriend and then she wants you to be her lover. And if you think being the lover just means having kinky sex, then you don’t understand what the lover is. And to generalize it as “just be attractive overall” leaves you not understanding your outcomes or you perpetually have the outcomes you didn‘t want.
>What one can deduce from this is that if one seeks to attract women, one should seek to display those traits.
Ah, okay, Albert Einstein. Good thing we settled that.
>Another thing you should realize is that women actually want to have sex.
Oooh, what..? What a great revelation
>The only reason they put up "hoops" as you say is not because they do not want to have sex
I never claimed that was the reason, lmao
>but because they are trying to select for a man who will stick around
That‘s quite clearly exactly what I was talking about..? Is there a sales on strawmen, what‘s going on?
>which has nothing to do with any of the traits you've described other than the fact that the most attractive guys, who tend to have many options and are less likely to stick around, won't jump through them.
Men with abundance will tend to not stick around, I agree. That still doesn‘t explain why women don‘t make some men jump through hoops. It could be because she was simply in the mood to have sex, but it‘s not just that. There‘s also a type of man who is interesting for her in specifically the way the lover offers. This man is put under other standards and gets different treatment.
>but don't fall into the trap of thinking that reading Rollo Tomato, wearing a bright pink pimp hat, and asking girls in the supermarket if their pussy is as tight as their shirt, or whatever, is some kind of "shortcut to success", or worth anything at all, really.
Lol. What a dishonest depiction. Lord of strawmen.
>>329374>Your advice is to wear plain T shirts and jeans..? That‘s the groundbreaking insight you provide?
I'm not the same anon you responded to originally, but you seem to have skipped most of the post, actually, and It's all very basic and straightforward instructions which provide a baseline of hygiene, fitness, and basic social skills which are NECESSARY if you want to even have a chance with women. A lot of people on this thread are autistic and are not necessarily going to figure this shit out immediately on their own, it's more helpful to spell it out, which is what this uygha >>329272
seems to want.>When it comes to actually approaching and hitting on girls you didn‘t give any details. That part is vague and nebulous because you are inexperienced when it comes to that. It‘s obvious. That‘s why I‘m calling it out.
Again, not the original anon. But the post you're responding to is vague on the topic of "approaching and hitting on girls" because describing the exact details is completely pointless if the person in question is going to attempt to use that advice as a stammering, unwashed man child.
Yes, I could write some Wikihow script out to "How to Approach A Girl" like "Go to a bar (if in metropolitan area, don't know if girls go to bars as much in the suburbs or rural areas) with a male friend to wingman. Approach pair of girls according to your preference (they typically travel in packs or at least pairs at such locations, so going alone is an added challenge). Strike up conversation about whatever comes to mind, try to avoid charged or "heavy" topics. If you aren't good at this initially, tag along with a more experienced friend and learn the ropes."
The problem is that if they don't have male friends and they smell bad and dress bad and are out of shape and pimply, this is a total waste of time that will at best be ignored and at worst actually attempted in a sort of half-assed, cringing manner which can result in nothing but suffering. That is why I stress the foundational elements before all else. Essentially a less retarded "Monk mode" to use your lingo.
>What one can deduce from this is that if one seeks to attract women, one should seek to display those traits.>Ah, okay, Albert Einstein. Good thing we settled that.
Yeah, actually, it is good we settled that, because you seem to think this step can be skipped. You seem to be under the impression that people can just type in the epic cheatcode and skip the necessary self improvement.
>Another thing you should realize is that women actually want to have sex.>Oooh, what..? What a great revelation
It is. If you approach women with the mentality that you have to fight to get a crumb of pussy and that women are mean stacies only interested in epic alpha chads, it harshes the vibe. You need to approach with the mentality that you're fuckable. And that requires you to 1. have actually improved yourself and 2. understand that real life is not like the dating apps and the canned studies and most women actually find most guys attractive when they're sat down talking to them.
The rest of your comment is just getting triggered that I didn't go through your comment chain and respond exactly to your discussion or your gay ass generic redpill beliefs, etc.
I'm not going to dignify your kayfabe because the shit you are saying has a very familiar ring to me.
Here's the thing, cunt. I was involved in that community, 2017-ish. And I personally missed out on opportunities because I put too much trust in some of the advice on there. I missed out on at least 2 girls who openly wanted to fuck me because I put too much weight on shit advice from there.
Yes, they had some good advice. I've repeated most of it, actually, the stuff about the importance of fitness and body fat management, basic tips about staple foods, clothing that won't make you look like a retard, etc., and other shit that will help autists improve themselves, the basics of how to socialize into a friend group for a giga autist, etc.
The rest of it is dogshit. It's a mush of angry divorced dads, grifters, fakes, liars, and clueless idiots who think that they can find the cheatcode. There isn't one. At the risk of sounding like your high school coach, there is no substitute for hard work. Work through the basics I described. Make yourself decent, get in shape, eat healthy, make friends. You'll know where to go from there.
>>329384>I'm not the same anon you responded to originally
>but you seem to have skipped most of the post, actually,
I read the entire thing.
>I was involved in that community, 2017-ish. And I personally missed out on opportunities because I put too much trust in some of the advice on there. I missed out on at least 2 girls who openly wanted to fuck me because I put too much weight on shit advice from there.
..If missing out on two girls is a big deal to you, then you can‘t possibly have made a lot of experiences so far. You want to blame it on advice that you generalize to be “PUA” or “redpill”. It‘s a big community with varying subsets. You either mingled in the clueless subsets or what I find likely, if losing two girls is a big deal to you, is that you barely put the knowledge into regular practice and therefore made no real progress. Knowledge without praxis is ultimately useless.
>A lot of people on this thread are autistic and are not necessarily going to figure this shit out immediately on their own>The problem is that if they don't have male friends and they smell bad and dress bad and are out of shape and pimply
You shouldn‘t just assume that. Inquire what specifically their situation is and go from there. That sounds incredibly patronizing to me.
>You seem to be under the impression that people can just type in the epic cheatcode and skip the necessary self improvement.
No. It took me years to overcome my previous hurdles and I stated in my previous threads multiple times that anyone else struggling can expect to put in a lot of work as well.
I just want to say I internalized some of your earlier advice, Helping Hand, and was actually able to finger a girl in a club I met from Tinder. It didn't turn into sex because of unfortunate events involving her roommate; but, your advice is gospel. The central point everyone should take is "escalation".
Summary of the process?
>>329416>The central point everyone should take is "escalation".
I would like further elaboration on this as well. Specifically how do I escalate in different contexts:
a.) Club/party where music is too loud to talk (and it goes without saying I am a shit dancer as well)
b.) More casual setting where you meet a woman and are currently having standard getting-to-know-eachother conversation
c.) With a friend I know for some time and are hanging out with
I matched with her on Tinder, and after confirming she wasn't a prostitute, I arranged for us to meet. We didn't really message or text much prior to meeting. If I had to guess, we probably exchanged like 10 messages in total. We met up at a lounge and I sat by her on a couch.
Basically we were just talking about normal stuff. Like we're both currently working overseas, so we were talking about the country/our home countries. I didn't really verbally flirt that much, but I did build tension with questions like "What are you looking for on Tinder", while working my hand closer to her pussy, moving closer to her, and eventually feeling her up. I also tried my best attempt at a drunken seductive stare accompanied with strategic silence, if that makes sense. But yeah, I was basically just working my hand up her leg while not sperging out verbally. No fancy pickup lines or anything like that.
I think its a lot easier with girls you meet on Tinder though because you already know they find you attractive. At least for me, it limits my overthinking. I was so surprised when she let me feel her up and explicitly asked if I wanted to "go inside" her leggings. We're in the Middle East, for reference. Obviously not too conservative of a ME country since we're in a club, but that's relative obviously. Prior to this I had only had sex with a prostitute, which I didn't know was a prostitute until I was too drunk to care. But since I didn't know she was a prostitute, I actually spent time trying to woo her like I did with the most recent girl. I basically did the same thing though, and it (unsurprisingly) worked! So much so she slept over my place that night and we fucked multiple times.
>>329475>a.) Club/party where music is too loud to talk (and it goes without saying I am a shit dancer as well)
Idk about loud music, it would be a challenge. Where I was the music wasn't that loud. I suppose it would be a good excuse to get up close to her though. It would probably be best to just choose a more ideal location to try things.
Also, I'm a shit dancer too. We actually joked about it. Just be confidentbro(tm)/drunk enough to not feel self conscious about it. This reminds me, the first time I tried to kiss her she turned away and it was pretty cringe. I just ignored it and kept drinking lmao. Like Helping Hand mentioned, I did kiss her later that night. So don't be too discouraged or embarrassed if things don't work out all that well initially. I think of it as trying to "activate" the woman sexually. Like warming up an oven, haha.
Also, I think it would be good to take dancing lessons, I plan on doing it some day.
>b.) More casual setting where you meet a woman and are currently having standard getting-to-know-eachother conversation
That's outside of my realm of expertise really. I'd probably just drop sexual innuendos and try the hand and proximity thing.
I‘m happy to hear that, nice
For the others who haven‘t seen it yet: I posted a guide on physical escalation in my last thread >>285207
I also wrote a guide about escalation in general in my first thread. It‘s archived.
>>329494>guide on physical escalation
Interesting to have it once spelled out. I never paid any attention to what I actually did to "physically escalate" (interesting term btw) my impression was always that it just happens
or it doesn't however when I examine my behavior retrospectively your advice is pretty on point. Which now allows me to consciously replicate my behavior.
Did not come here expecting to actually learn something.
>>329397>You shouldn‘t just assume that. Inquire what specifically their situation is and go from there. That sounds incredibly patronizing to me.
It's a baseline. If they've already done something on that list, they can just skip it. But if they're missing something on it, they should look into it.
>You either mingled in the clueless subsets or what I find likely, if losing two girls is a big deal to you, is that you barely put the knowledge into regular practice and therefore made no real progress. Knowledge without praxis is ultimately useless.
Putting the "knowledge" into practice is what screwed me over in those cases the first place.>>329406
social skills are learned behavior. this is why i am telling you to make male friends first. obviously it doesn't transfer over 100% but being in social situations in general will improve your confidence and basic social ability. anyone ITT who thinks you can skip friendship and just go straight to the girls is NGMI.>>329486
good stuff. although im not sure i understand the prostitute part because they usually bill by the hour so i feel like you would have figured it out quite quickly unless she just ran up the bill or something? lol.
How to make male friends without the social skills that i still need to learn
as said, do any sport, hobby, martial art, or organization that involves meeting people in real life. ideally one with events outside of just practices, for example, most sports will have matches, most martial arts will have tournaments etc. With group activities you will be able to watch how others behave and learn from that. Most sports will also have social events, for example, martial arts clubs will get together to watch UFC fights or Olympic stuff, etc. Those are basically house parties. So your key is to learn by imitation how to not act like a complete sperg, make a good enough impression on others (by being cheerful, hard worker, not annoying) that you are invited to group chats or social media groups, and from then social events and parties. You will gravitate towards certain guys in your group during this process, and through doing things together (going to the same events, doing the same things, doing favors for each other like catching or giving a ride to some event, etc) you will learn about them and become friends. You will know you are friends when you feel comfortable asking them to hang out outside of the main group activities. To give a random example, I own guns, so inviting people to go shooting with me fulfills this role. But you could invite your friends to do anything, from the interesting- "x band/musician is going to do a concert here next week, let's see them"(if you like the same music) to the totally mundane - "hey bro i'm allowed to bring a guest to this new gym im working out at, you interested?". The important thing is to not be a drag or a bore(learn what they dont like to do or arent interested in and dont push it, also, try not to be repetitive unless you're both having a good time at whatever. you know what else you could do with a single heterosexual male friend? "Let's go to x bar". And now you have a wingman.
I don't know if I can spell out possible strategies much more than this, sorry
Well, I'll spare everyone the long drawn humblebragging about the date and simply ask a simple yet troubling question.
How is one to reconcilliate differing political beliefs early on?
From the first date it was clear that she was a run of the mill MtF LGBT lib with anglophile tendencies while I am a Jungle Gang thirdie bifag, and this gap, unsurprisingly, stems from class positions and consciousness, with her coming from a wealthy background and me being from a proletarized former petite bourgeois family now nearing the poverty line.
After leaving the sushi bar and walking down the street on our way to the hotel room she ranted about how she wouldn't step aside on the sidewalk for gringo tourists to shit on them for having white privilege. I was about to go off about how it isn't just about white privilege but rather about Imperialism as a world system and the usage of racism to justify division among the subjects hence the need to challenge Capitalism and race as a spook, but instead self-censored to not ruin the mood.
Once we were in the hotel room with both of us being slightly tipsy, she pulled out a blunt to take a few hits, went off a rant about how she would become a dictator to fix our country by purging all political parties, giving autonomy to indigenous people, investing in education, industry, military, heavily raising taxes for the rich and killing them if they stepped out of line while still upholding Capitalism. The day after she went YAAAS QWEEEN SLAAAY because a Thai bourgeois trans woman bought Miss Universe.
I just want to push her potential without alienating her or being too combative, specially since we have another date in a couple of hours.
yes I did lie about sparing you the humblebragging but I had no clue of how else to illustrate the context and yes I did hit the blunt after her to try it for the first time
Sorry, in real life the Discordian gets the girl.
after reading that,I'm not really jealous.
Why are so many of you fucking transgirls lmao.
Excuse me sir, this is a bifag majority board.>>329927
Thx bro, I'll take that into account when we are sober enough to discuss that, rn I'm habing a blast on the beach though.>>329938
Fair enough, it's a bit complicated to handle but I would say it's worth the work.
Also sorry but tbh I'm getting hard carried by my looks despite being bald and having a nascent beer gut
I really would like to see what does a face capable of hard carrying bald out of shape man look like.
>>329907>How is one to reconcilliate differing political beliefs early on?
You're using the wrong flag.
>>329990>I'm getting hard carried by my looks despite being bald
I will preface this by saying you can‘t build a deeper bond with everyone, if they just don‘t have much in common with you or don‘t want to. In the past, I spent years trying to make deeper friendships with people who weren‘t my type and weren‘t that interested either. A waste of time. So, meeting the right people by meeting many people is important. That aside, you develop a greater bond merely by regularly and frequently having long periods of contact. And lacking that also makes it proportionally harder to build a bond. Additionally, you develop a greater bond by becoming more intimate over time. Yes, that‘s also the case for platonic relationships, not just romantic. You do that by for example sharing more intimate information about yourself. For example a friend of mine came out as bi curious to me yesterday and he experimented by looking at gay porn, which means he trusts me a lot to not judge him and be cool about it if he shares that with me. So genuinely listen to people and don’t seem judgmental and they might make the steps to build more intimacy. But personally, I prefer to be the one who takes the initiative by sharing something more intimate first, instead of waiting on others. It encourages them to share something as well. What you share should be calibrated to the level of friendship that you have. What also creates a greater bond is to have the same goal that you passionately work on together.
If I were you, I would work on building a large social circle for now to find the right people instead of trying to force something that is not meant to be. Also, coming from a background of having your own life and having your social needs met just makes you less needy and more secure. You also have the opportunity to invite people into your life, which is another form of creating more intimacy.
Or you can just lie and tell people what they want to hear
Sorry man, I just want a stable relationship where we can have threesomes, swinging, cuckquean action and do drugs together as she already said on our second date
Yeah bro, you definitely will have a stable relationship with all that
Nothing is bigger turn off for women than insecurity. If the conversation comes to politics, dont censor yourself, but also, dont go full schizo.
That's your choice, there is no objectively correct answer. I always keep it on the down low and say "I am skeptical towards capitalism". Not out of shame, but people are programmed to shut down and think of caricatures when they hear socialism or even communism. It's more intelligent to water it down and breadpill them step by step.>>332042
Pretty sure I wrote a guide to that in my first thread. Just look it up and search for the word friends.
>>332047>https://web.archive.org/web/20211217151615/https://leftypol.org/siberia/res/172363.html>Technically this is possible anywhere, but we want to maximize our chances in meeting people that are open to befriend us and people who are a match for us and make us happy. So we are looking for these factors:>1) Places where being social is the point>2) Places that speak at specifically your interests and joy
So should I approach people at bars if I want to make friends? Is approaching groups better than approaching lonely people there? Do you have any experience doing this?
I don't have any hobby beside going to the gym (if that count) and I don't particularly feel like approaching people there, I don't want to bother them while they exercice.
>>332065>So should I approach people at bars if I want to make friends?
You can, but I would rather aim for something where you know people will have things in common with you that are important to you and that it's somewhere where you will regularly see them. Like a club for a hobby.
>Is approaching groups better than approaching lonely people there?
It really depends how open the people are to meeting new people.
>Do you have any experience doing this?
I never went to a bar to make friends. Occasionally, I got into a conversation with someone and we exchanged contacts if we vibed well.
>beside going to the gym (if that count) and I don't particularly feel like approaching people there, I don't want to bother them while they exercice.
It's a real psychological phenomena where we expect a negative outcome or expect a negative reaction from someone, but it's just a projection of our own insecurities or negativity. You should first do something before you tell yourself that it will definitely be like the way you imagine it to be. When I started working on my social anxiety, I regularly approached people at my gym. Almost everyone reacted friendly and it was easy to make friends. Just ask them for tips or what exercises are good for a specific muscle group. Many gym heads love being in the position of the teacher.
>I don't have any hobby beside going to the gym
It's your life, man. You should figure out what makes you happy and what inspires you. Surely, there are more things that interest you then going to the gym. Like, I would expect you to be a socialist if you are here, so you could look for a Marxist study group or an org. You could try new things and maybe discover that you like them. Making music, painting, kayaking, dancing, whatever.
This doesn't have to do so much with relationships but more so with interacting with women. I cannot look at them or be near them in public. I am perfectly fine talking with them or interacting with them in any other setting - at work, at uni, at parties (although nothing goes further than platonic conversation thanks to autism).
But in public I can't do this, I turn into a robot npc trying my best to ignore them, deathly afraid of coming across as a creep. In the gym, if there is are women around I constantly look at the ground or my phone. If I am walking by them, I never turn away from them (as that would look too obvious) I lock my eyes on one thing in the foreground.
Even on public transport, if women were to sit or stand near me I get nervous. My breath feels too heavy, I feel as though I'm radiating some unconscious aura, I feel like they know that I'm trying to ignore them, and things spiral. There have even been situations in the past where I'd have to get off public transport because I needed to catch my breath after holding it for too long if women were too close to me.
What can I do about this? How do I get over this irrational fear that if I have one bad interaction with a woman in public I'll die?
no I should specify that it's largely reacting to attractive women
So you are OK with creeping out old ladies?
What do you think the reason is?
Matched with a girl that lives 1,5 hours away by train. If she doesn't let me stay at her place then I'd have to go back the same night.
Really not feeling like it but it's been quite a dry spell? She has already re-schrduled two times and I don't really want her to flake on me while I do all that effort.
2 things I think. The first is that I don't want to endanger the social safety in which I have in these places - this is especially prevalent in the gym which has been a cornerstone of my life for many years. I feel that if I fuck up in one of these areas then it would hang over me and make it harder to regularly go to these places.
The second links to the first, if I get myself into an embarrassing situation then that would haunt me beyond these places.
Naturally, both of these are linked to deep insecurity within me about the lack of romantic experience ("this woman who I could embarrass myself in front of could be a potential romantic partner.") and is probably bolstered by a porn addiction (invasive sexualisation, turning the woman into an object, which makes me want to look at her more). Which build up the issue more than it should.
>>332394>>332404>I am perfectly fine talking with them or interacting with them in any other setting - at work, at uni, at parties>(although nothing goes further than platonic conversation thanks to autism).
Which makes me believe that even in those settings you aren't perfectly fine with interacting with women if moving beyond the platonic doesn't happen to you.
>What can I do about this? How do I get over this irrational fear that if I have one bad interaction with a woman in public I'll die?
Do the exact opposite of what you've done so far. First, there is something that triggers your anxiety (as you said that women in public perceive you as a creep) and then second, there is some sort of compensatory measure against that (that you micromanage your behavior to avoid some imagined catastrophic outcome). But that very measure actually helps maintain your anxiety. I've dealt with comparable issues when I struggled with my social anxiety. It's kind of a self-sustaining problem that only vanishes when you, ironically, do the exact opposite of what you want to do. So, in your specific case, think about how you would behave if there were no women around and then behave that way. Of course, your anxiety will still be there, but you have to embrace the feeling and let it linger. You will have to expose yourself to that anxiety causing situation over and over again and simply not resist what is causing your anxiety. Not resisting it means not engaging in your compensatory measures. This will take time. I don't know how long, but expect it to take time. Don't force it to go away either, that just redirects your focus on the anxiety. Pretty much simply accept that your anxiety is there, embrace the things that cause your anxiety and do so without these measures you've used so far to mitigate this imagined outcome. Even if what you imagined happens. Your problem will improve with time and if you relapse in your progress don't give up. Relapses can happen, just continue as I've told you.
Another thing that can help here is meditation. There are various types of meditation, but when it comes to self-consciousness I recommend you shift your focus outside of your body. Take 15 minutes out of your day to meditate and do so by not engaging with your thoughts, letting them pass, and directing your focus to everything outside of your body. Don't pay attention to the feeling inside of your body or of your body, but direct your focus solely on your surroundings. This helps with overcoming self-consciousness and that is a big component of social anxiety. I don't think merely not engaging with your thoughts is enough, because if you still focus on your physiological responses that might still further your anxiety. And focusing on your breath may uphold micromanaging yourself.
>The first is that I don't want to endanger the social safety in which I have in these places>The second links to the first, if I get myself into an embarrassing situation then that would haunt me beyond these places.
I think you need to leave your comfort zone and do the things that you think will lead to this fatal embarrassment and then realize it won't have any devastating consequences after all.
>Naturally, both of these are linked to deep insecurity within me about the lack of romantic experience
Fair enough. From my experience merely engaging with that on a mental level is not effective in actually overcoming this. You definitely need to get those experiences and personally I think your negative mental state is the unavoidable consequence of not having that. Some might advocate to cope with it by not caring about it, which is silly imo, because intimacy is a core human need. Others may engage with it by changing how you think about yourself to improve your self-esteem. That is better than nothing and you should do that in the meantime, but ultimately, merely tackling this issue from a mental level will not make you overcome it. I'm a very introspective person and understand my psychology very well. All the thinking only got me so far. In the end, my psychology changed the most through experiences. Nowadays it's obvious to me that I am desirable and a sexual and romantic option, because I had those experiences many times by now.
>and is probably bolstered by a porn addiction (invasive sexualisation, turning the woman into an object, which makes me want to look at her more).
Yeah, I advocate for not watching porn either. You can still masturbate, but avoid porn.
I have this problem as well. But this is limited usually to young women, especially if they're white.
Although if it's after dusk, I keep away from even older white women because I don't wanna incur any Jim Crow instinct in them.
I had this fear even as a kid.
Now, in this era of metoo politics, I doubly stay away.
>Naturally, both of these are linked to deep insecurity within me about the lack of romantic experience ("this woman who I could embarrass myself in front of could be a potential romantic partner.") and is probably bolstered by a porn addiction (invasive sexualisation, turning the woman into an object, which makes me want to look at her more). Which build up the issue more than it should.
I don't have this problem as much. I do have a pirn problem, but I don't ogle at women IRL.
But I think what you're experiencing is due to stranger danger epidemic along with neurodivergence which has made many impressionable youths depressed and depraved.
Alot of our grooming cases nowadays are toxic codependency where the victim willfully pursued the perpetrator.
In fact, the perpetrator is often the more vulnerable one.
Or, there has been cases of isolated asocial harmless men getting arrested for "child" porn.
These guys aren't predators in anyway.
There's also women whom are parasocial that end up being camwhores with weird fetishes and end up in medical crisis.
All I can say is: innocence is deadly.
It's not a virtue.
It especially doesn't help with all the reckless promotion of romantic love.
yeah I dont think she's that into you bud
Thank you for your reply, I have made another plan now, maybe I will report back about it later…
Anyway, do you know about the /htgwg/ (How to Get Women General) general on 4cuck /adv/? If yes, do you think they give good advices?
I haven‘t been on /adv/ for years. I used to frequent there. The problem on there is that you can end up in a „the blind leading the blind“ kind of situation and you wouldn‘t even be able to tell. Something that sounds plausible isn‘t necessarily correct. You need this exchange between theory and numerous praxis. It would be better to find specific people you can trust and follow their advice, which is something you can‘t do when everyone is anonymous. Find a friend who is good with women or someone who offers mentorship online. For example I liked The Natural Lifestyles on Youtube when I got started.
I appreciate your determination, but if you lack communication skills overall, I would work on building that in a general sense first. That aside, I do advice for guys to do cold approach when it comes to building courage and charisma with girls. (You can ignore anyone who says otherwise but never tried it themselves. They don’t know what they are talking about.) The frequent exposure makes you take leaps in comparison to only limiting yourself to approaching girls every once in a while in socially acceptable situations. Additionally, once you have cold approaching down you can hook a handful of pretty girls to date every week. When you overcome the learning curve (and the learning curve is tremendous) it becomes adventurous and exciting. I like it far more than the soulless swiping on Tinder.
>I saw 1:400 on some website, is this realistic?
When a friend and I started out, the realistic worst case for us was 8 approaches for a number, 8 numbers for a date and 2 girls to have sex. That is 128 approaches. Nowadays for me it‘s 3 to 6 approaches for a number, 1 to 2 numbers for a date and 1 to 2 girls to have sex. That‘s at worst 24 approaches. As said, that’s the realistic worst case. Sometimes the first girl of the day is a hit and sometimes it takes me 10 approaches for my first number of the day. How much it will take you depends on what your specific issues are and how much effort you will put in to overcome them. At first, I was too afraid to approach, so I only approached 0 to 3 girls per session. Then I was too afraid to ask for the girl‘s number, so I rarely did. Then I was too afraid to get physical on dates, so a bunch of girls weren‘t feeling it. So keep in mind that you will meet hurdles and how much effort you put in will determine how fast you will make progress.
>I consecrate 3 hours of cold approach every Saturday and Sunday.
Going on Sundays is a waste of time. Almost no one is on the street. Also, walking around for 3 hours sounds tiring. One and a half hours is enough. Personally, I daygame under the week and nightgame on weekends. Both have their benefits. Daygame is more chill and you will meet “girlfriend material” type of girls more frequently. Nightgame is good because in good clubs most girls are hot and you can learn to rapidly escalate.
I posted my daygame guide in my previous thread.
>>335206>Common internet wisdom says that unless you escalate with a girl soon after meeting her you end up locked in a friendzone.
It happened a few times to me that a girl I didn‘t make a move on was still interested in me for more than a year before she lost interest. So no.
Also, I don’t like the term “friendzone”. She either sees you as a sexual option or not, and that‘s entirely dependent on how attractive you are. Also, if you listen to women then many of their relationships actually start out as friends first. What women mean by that is that there was some guy who entered her social circle, they occasionally seen and spoken to each other on social gatherings, and after weeks or months the guy (or sometimes her) asked the other out. You end up in “the friendzone” because you are simply unattractive to her. The big difference between men and women when it comes to sexual attraction is that women care about your looks but much more about your behavior. Given that you look at least average, what fucks it up is when you simply don‘t behave like a confident guy and a sexual being. If you only interact with girls in a platonic fashion, because you are afraid or inexperienced, she will not see you as a sexual option (unless your looks severely compensate it).
>Should I stop trying to get to know a woman before attempting to sleep with her?
Besides exceptions, you will have to get to know her, because building comfort is a necessary part to have sex. That means you have to build some emotional connection and that comes from sharing stuff about yourself and inquiring about her.
>Should turning friendship into friendship with benefits be even attempted? If yes, how?
The girl needs to see you as a sexual option and you do that by being sexually attractive. Have a playful and flirtatious personality, be non-judgmental about women being sexual, be nonchalant, let the girl know that you are fucking other girls. That will let you stay a sexual option in the girl‘s head, instead of deteriorating as this sexless entity in her mind.
>>329140>We all have to be basement dwellers that have at most a GED to our names, cystic acne, morbidly obese, and literally can't even go out to do mundane errands like going to the DMV.
Even a guy who's exactly like you described can get laid by just playing the field because of the huge number of girls from 18 to early 20's years old with daddy issues or fat ugly bastard fetish like in their porn or hentais. Guys like this could also hit on girls from the AA meetings or check themselves into a psych ward for suicidal depression and talking to the psych ward girls who they spend a lot of time with in the ward and getting their numbers. There's lots of different ways to get laid for even drug addict fat unemployed men with "just fuck my shit up" tier lives. But the real problem is love, not sex.
Go download a pitch app right now on your phone and see what pitch you speak at.
Madonna vs where complex
Same for gentlemen vs badboy complex.
It all goes to show that heterosexual romance is a vast comical tragedy.
Everything is about sex, but sex itself is psychological.
And they have the nerve to look down on friendship as limp wristed?
She basically fucked a new guy every fifth day lol
Stacy in that Cupcakke Grindset.
I genrally like Hands advice, but from my experience women dont really make such dichotomies. The boyfriend type is just lover+. The reason it appears like those are two different types of men is that women can fuck any guy they want, but dont neccessary have the same options for commited relationship.>>335456
Got any recommendations on how to train your voice? There are bunch of youtube videos of course, but I dont want to accidently end up following vocal version of bonesmashing.
Maybe you should learn that you're not gonna have any shot with women.
Maybe most men don't really have it made with women amd vice versa.
Maybe humas overestimate sex drive as the engine for romantic relationships.
Maybe you needed a trusted female acquaintance from childhood to have a relationship.
Should I just kill myself?
Just be interesting
Interesting in what way? As a case study for psychologists?
Yes. Maybe one female psychologist will take amusement to you and nurture a "relationship " with you.
*cough* Harley Quinn *cough*
>>335508>Got any recommendations on how to train your voice? There are bunch of youtube videos of course, but I dont want to accidently end up following vocal version of bonesmashing.
Yeah I dunno, just look up normal voice coaching, acting/singing kind of stuff. Just in general from my non expertise: It's known guys speak in a higher pitch voiced when they speak to a man that they're being submissive towards. I guess catch yourself when it happens and don't do that. Also if you're being emotional or excitable it can happen. Or being nervous.https://qz.com/1019414/we-speak-in-higher-pitched-voices-when-talking-to-people-more-important-than-us
I guess it can be considered "cute" to some extent, but I'd advise against it. I think women prefer the Barry White from a sexual standpoint (even if they also like the tenors) tbh.
You dont have to have a particularly deep voice for girls to like your voice. It's more your speaking pattern and personality and behaviours. While some girls go for just a very deep voice it also can make some of them feel in danger. Im pretty soft spoken and girls like it because it's soothing and assuring sounding.
I am trying to gain more range though so i can more easily use my deeper voice if i want or need
>>335615>While some girls go for just a very deep voice it also can make some of them feel in danger.
Danger gets the panties wet. You can speak with a deep voice and seem non threatening too. Like a guy who's a giant hulk of muscles can come off as a "gentle giant."
I think women talking in a higher pitch with cutesy inflections is annoying.
There's differing kinds of high pitched voices.
Truly humans overestimate their own rationality. Everything in sex/romance is just aesthetics.
Also, men whom force their voice to be deeper in singing are annoying.
>>335657>Everything in sex/romance is just aesthetics.
No duh. Why do you think people post pictures of people they find sexually attractive? For their personality?
It's one thing for flings.
But in terms of romantic love, it's something else.
In fact, I think romance is worse than last.
Last is honest amd brief.
Romance is flippant and imposing. It seeks to dip the earth in a stasis box to relive the same moment of elation over and over again.
Sometimes it doesn't click. Doesn't matter if you had fun tho.
Slav girls prefer conservative men. They despise weakness.
Not from what ive seen
>>336182>going out with a lib who fled her country
Women are not stupid enough to confuse pretension of masculinity with actual strength that can increase the living standard of their offsprings
So what you're saying is women are shallow but not in terms of physical appearance but in how they only think in terms of monetary exchange? No wonder Jesus remained single even he didn't want anything to do with that mess.
Yeah they wouldn't go for a dork like you. If you think "conservative" means pretension of masculinity then you've spent too much time in anglo sphere internet where the spectacle has indeed eroded any real strength. For slavs conservative masculinity means exactly that: strength, confidence and will to dominate the highly competitive social ladder.
It's a shame that society condemns male singlehood.
It doesn't necessarily mean monetary value. Ownership of the MOP, good genetics, or simply being born to privilege are what women seek from potential mates.
Things like masculine honour and duty and, indeed having a conservative ideology are things that appeal to other men,not women. This is why Gorky made his famous "exterminate all homosexuals" quip because fascism is inherently homoerotic; it only aims to please fellow men
saving of your Jing would lead to full communism
You gotta have less expectations for this kind of shit. Treating it like you will literally kys if the girl doesn’t go get a drink with you is part of the problem.
For slavs it means being an ooga booga caveman. Never met a slav who wasn‘t a low life.
>>336236>For slavs it means being an ooga booga caveman. Never met a slav who wasn‘t a low life.
Slav women are way classier than westernoid women.
I agree. I don‘t have a problem with slavic women, just the men are cavemen.>>336352
I‘m not American.
t. eurocuck bullied by Russian exchange students while in school.
No, I had Russian friends. Russians are funny. Still slavs are regressive people and the men are like cavemen. Middle Easterners as well, only that they aren‘t funny.
t. self hating Slav LARPing as non-Slav
I don't think slavs are self-aware enough to hate themselves. Do slavs even pass the Mirror Test?
are you kidding Egyptians have a great sense of humour
Half the Slav men I see in the man on the street videos look metro as fuck.
Also fuck Russian women are beautiful.
Gender imbalance and short life expectancy of Russian men means the women have to try a lot harder to get a family of their own. In the West on the other hand they have it much easier with all the simps hence why Russians who get green cards quickly divorce and start behaving just like western women.
Didn't mean to start /int/-style shitstorm on Slavic women. Btw, woke up this morning and haven't left my bed for 8 hours yet haha.
They look like elves.
She wants BOC, which isn‘t surprising given that slavic men are basically orcs.
>>335206>Common internet wisdom says that unless you escalate with a girl soon after meeting her you end up locked in a friendzone.
Back in HS this girl that I had a crush on and started talking to since freshman year made a move on me and kissed me, got all handsy with me one night the summer after senior year ended. Apparently she had a crush on me all those years too, she told me as much that night. Anyway, no it's no true. There are no hard 100% "always" or "never" rules when it comes to human relationships.
>>336842>There are no hard 100% "always" or "never" rules when it comes to human relationships.
There is one: I will never be in any.
You will be if you really want to. You just have to believe that you can. It's not something you really have to work for that hard if at all, contrary to what a lot of anons itt will say. I'm not gonna tell you that you need to build yourself into some fit, social butterfly chad or whatever because in my experience it's really not true. When I had romantic experiences with girls in my youth I wasn't that at all, quite the opposite I was a shortish-to-average height, skinny-to-average, mostly quiet autist with an unremarkable face, not model tier or whatever. If you want to connect with a girl just talk to her and ask her questions. Display interest in her life, genuine interest in an emotional bond and she'll probably grow to like you back even if she doesn't at first 7 or 8 times out of 10.
But if you just want to have casual sex with a bunch of girls idk, you can follow other advices itt I guess they probably know more on that. Although I've been openly propositioned for sex, sometimes in subtle way like "you should sleepover in my dorm room, anon" quite a few times in my youth too. We don't live in 1940's era anymore where all women are just passive and always expect guys to make first moves or whatever. I think the real problem for most guys is that unlike in HS or uni, in adult life there are far fewer opportunities for social interaction with girls around your same age than back in school days where everyday you are surrounded by hundreds if not thousands of girls your age on the same school campus everyday. So as adult you have to actively seek out opportunities to talk to girls rather than those opportunities just kind of happening to you by default.
You better start believing in relationships, comrade.
You're in one.
>>336846>>336847> it just naturally happened to me so it must naturally happen to everyone else
I'm sick of your bullshit
I mean I had to talk to the girls except for the super forward horny ones who just jumped on me or asked for sex. All I'm saying is that you can go way further with just simple talking to a girl and asking her questions than you think. You don't need to turn talking to girls into a Machiavellian grand strategy of showing (or convincingly faking) yourself as being an "alpha chad" with high position on social hierarchy with all kind of mind games or stuff to succeed romantically or sexually.
You don't have to, that's for sure. Unfortunately, some of us are not so lucky.
Why do you even want a gf? To not be lonely, to have somebody to talk to and be intimate with in different ways? That's exactly why most girls want bf's too.
Would you like a girl who plays mind games with you, is flaky or leads you on? Neither do most girls.
Reflect on this and you will save yourself a lot of mental anguish from no longer needlessly overcomplicating how to date or hook up with girls.
No, the other guy is right in pointing out that what you said isn‘t useful advice. Look, the way you feel, think and behave is the product of your psychological makeup. Your psychology is made up in a way that you feel, think and behave in some fashion that is in alignment with how it generally happens that guys and girls head towards something sexual. For you “it just happens” without much awareness. Not because you are Chad or alpha or some nonsense, but you essentially have sufficient amounts of social intelligence and your mental landscape is made up in a way that you feel, think and behave in a way that things simply work out intuitively. Some people are not like that and these people will need guidance where they are spelled out the things that are obvious to anyone who isn‘t struggling. In that regard it‘s simply reductive to say “just talk to the girl and ask her questions”. Believe it or not you can do that and still have no semblance of romance and sex in your life. Yes, even when you did so with genuine intent and no nefarious motives to get her to sleep with you. Even if girls have displayed interest in you, you can still end up with nothing romantically or sexually because you didn’t know or where unable to move things forward. If this is incomprehensible to you then you are simply unqualified to give advice. You simply don‘t grasp the issue. It‘s also inappropriate to claim of yourself that you are autistic. I know that on imageboards this is said in gist, but still, you are conflating your perhaps mild struggles with socializing with their possibly much greater struggles, therefore indirectly downplaying them. “I’m also basically autistic haha but it worked out for me! Just ask the girl questions”
I‘ve overcome the issues that I had and nowadays a lot of the things I‘ve struggled with are not relatable to me anymore. Looking back they are downright ridiculous to me now. I imagine someone who never had these issues to begin with will especially not understand them, hence why “normie advice” usually boils down to something simplistic that always overlooks the actual sticking point that the person is struggling with.
From experience I know that you can develop your social skills in a platonic sense and be socially successful while the sexual side of things is still underdeveloped. Hence why it is a subject that should be addressed on its own. If you don‘t struggle with that and things just happen on their own for you then I‘m happy for you, but you aren‘t helping anyone here by saying that. I’m not advocating to “fake being alpha” or to “employ strategies to trick girls”, but by framing it that way you are stigmatizing my approach and possibly turning people away from the only thing that might actually help them. I can tell them how to get over their anxiety of approaching girls, how to overcome their inhibitions to be sexual, how to flirt, what the signals of interested girls are, how to develop your social intelligence in regards to the sexual dynamics of men and women, reframe their understanding of such social dynamics, point out and overcome harmful mindsets, etc. There is much to learn that even men who aren‘t struggling could benefit from. If you don‘t need or want that, cool, but your advice quite simply isn‘t useful to them and comes of as humblebragging or downplaying.
I was at a club last weekend and got normiesplained by a gay dude on how to talk to women. I guess he was just trying to help, but being treated like a child was annoying to put it mildly. degrading.
I picked up dancing a while back which I recommend others in here to do. I can't dance at the moment however due to medical issues
Everyone is playing their stupid games all the time. I guess if playing along comes as a second nature to you, you will have a harder time to notice, but it is very apparent to those of us who failed to pick up on the rules.
No, I am a literal autist. I advise to talk to a girl, ask her questions and genuinely show interest in her because it works. Occam's Razor is a useful heuristic. As is KISS: Keep It Simple Stupid.>>336885
To expand on what I said here >>336842
, there are no hard 100% "never", "always" OR "everyone" rules when it comes to human relationships.
Really? You have been diagnosed with autism? Not even high functioning autism, just plain autism? Did you get your diagnosis as a child?
As an adult. "High functioning autism" isn't a diagnosis. It's just autism.
Usually it‘s pretty difficult to get an autism diagnosis as an adult. It all sounds unusual to me. But good for you if you managed anyway.
>>336875>To not be lonely, to have somebody to talk to and be intimate with in different ways? That's exactly why most girls want bf's too.
We know, but that doesnt mean she wants it from me.>>336889>I advise to talk to a girl, ask her questions and genuinely show interest in her because it works.
I am at my last year of college in an overwhemingly female programme. I hang out with women, talk with women, make friedships with women, and yet still terminally unable to get into anything romantic or sexual. And I cant event chalk it up to ugliness, because I look fine.
how do I find a cute virgin to marry after being friends for a number of years
Thanks for your reply!
Also, how many girls do you approach in one and a half hour on average?
I'll post some report here after my first try
I think you will only frustrate yourself if your goal is to find a virgin. And then also one that will wait until marriage.>>336968
I go for 10. Good luck!
>>336935> an overwhemingly female programme.
Lucky! My programme had 4% women out of the hundreds of students.
Church, the library, community college or the gym. Take your pick.
fuck I love fat tits
The fact that you guys try out social clubs for the sole purpoe of getting coochie is exaclty why women can wrap you around their finger and leave you dry.
Im sorry but you gotta de prioritize pussy.
Or, at least go for the sexually needy girls whom arent that good looking.
Listen, women are nothijg but trouble. Especially the under forty crowd. And if theyre ghetto black, its even worse. Those kind of girls have no life nor knowledge of the greater world. All they know is gossip and bumming off others for money and drugs.
>>337307>women are nothijg but trouble.
that's why I became RevCel.
wow I can do all of that at once
I have a book coming out the middle of January next year. It will be $20.00 for soft cover and $5.00 digital. In it, I will give an overview of the most common pratfalls men make when talking to women. I will be a dropping an Amazon 5% off discount code in this thread before newyears.
Starting to think about the beams in my mansard bed room again. How durable and strong they look and how they easily could support the weight of a person.
I’m not selling anything. I‘m using this tripcode in the future.
why would you lie like that, lad?
Quit impersonating me.
why would someone do something as horrible as impersonate this guy who is talking his time out to help incels get laid?
It really is a travesty.
What a tragedy
Such a calamity
Oh the humanity
After the first date we messaged every day, now after the second one she hasn't replied in 2 days. I can unmatch and forget her now, right?
Yeah, doesn't look good. Have you sent only one message since then? In that case, you can still try one last time. If you guys are on Tinder the truth is people will still see others in the meantime and she might simply be distracted.
It's on Bumble, we are technically following each other on Insta but have been messaging on Bumble up until now. Good but short first date, then 1 week of consistent messages every day, 2 date fell kind of flat with virtually no escalation and yesterday I sent her a message. I'd just unmatch and maybe unfollow on insta too. I can see that she has been online on insta…
See pic related
She could eventually message you back but that’s not a given. For example, my mind goes back to a girl I left long years ago who told me “just hold on loosely but don't let go. If you cling too tightly you’re gonna lose control.” Sometimes giving them space and time draws them back in. I would continue to live your life and see who else is out there while she makes up her mind. >>337345
This is really getting ridiculous.
I know that when it comes to dating as well as politics you should always leave your options open and don't do hard cuts in cases where nothing crazy happened but I'm personally very bad with dealing with those states of ambiguity and would rather break off everything prematurely when there is a negative outlook than to fester and hope for a positive turn.
It's up to you man, but there have been several times where I felt like giving up on a girl because she seemed less interested than before or I felt like I fucked up the last date. Then I wrote her anyway and aimed for another date and they agreed. I always try twice. I also spoke to a girl who had around 900 matches and told me how overwhelming it was to try to get back to everybody.
>then 1 week of consistent messages every day
In my opinion, I don't think this is good. You also have to pull away sometimes to make your presence more valuable. To me, texting is only to set up a date (If you are on dating apps you initially will have to text quite a bit to build rapport), and once a date is set I perhaps text the girl every second or third day to keep me in her mind. You should also not text the girl too much, because being a mystery is more intriguing to her. If you lay down all your cards early, it gets more boring.
Well, she already agreed to a second date very early and 'consistent' here means every day but we obviously didn't message each other immediately after every response. I spaced it out a bit, so I already did that.
sometimes women do be busy. toss another message or two in the convo maybe
Im like early thirties is it ogre for me? Id want a hot mid 20s chick, but I'm so tired of this cycle of dating, and breaking up. Nothing lasts and Im too burned out to even try going on the wheel again
People be weird nowadays, my friend who I haven't talked to in a few months hit me up yesterday. I told him about my new job then I asked him what he's been up to and then no more messages. I can't be bothered to figure this shit out anymore. I guess that's why I like this bullshit where I don't necessarily expect a reply.
This is why people shpuld start dating in their teen years. Irony is, dating game is ls stable after thirty because people are already set in their ways.
Probably nothing happened and he felt bad hearing all the cool stuff you did so he cut off contact until he had something cool he could share
>>337360>She could eventually message you back but that’s not a given.>Sometimes giving them space and time draws them back in. I would continue to live your life and see who else is out there while she makes up her mind.
I can’t stop you from impersonating me, but it just irks me that the other guys might fall for your clueless advice. She likely won‘t message him back. In the initial phases it is normal that the guy will have to show initiative and be persistent to a degree. If you give up because the girl‘s interest seems to wane, with that attitude, you will end up blowing a bunch of chances in the future due to defeatism and lack of confidence. That she might reach out again is more likely if they already had a relationship, but given that they know each other from Bumble and went on two dates, that‘s likely not going to happen. It‘s up to him if he wants to go through the effort or if her interest is too low for what he desires, but I‘m merely pointing out that not retrying again and just hoping she will reach out is misguided in that type of situation. On principle you should always try twice. Instead of giving up after the first attempt. That‘s just a part of the game that men have to be persistent to a degree. And after you‘ve been sexual and spent more time together the dynamic reverses and the girl becomes very invested. It‘s just how it works. Not saying the girl couldn‘t be very invested from the get go, but if you make yourself reliant on that then you will miss out on numerous chances.>>337361
(Read my above replay as well.)
You have to think about this long term. With that kind of mentality you will be far less successful in dating and relationships. Ambiguity will be a reoccurring problem and as a man you deal with it with confidence and being the directing force of the situation. Dealing with it and embracing it will make you stronger, it will make you more attractive and it will make your future relationships more secure. Growing insecure or sad if the woman pulls back her interest or things start to look uncertain will be the reason why your future relationships will fail. Generally, women in relationships will look to you to lead them or assess the situation which is why this mentality of being the directing force is so important as a man and it is founded on your confidence. That means know what you want, go for what you want and do so in a manner that is authentic to you.
It is possible that she lost interest, I‘m just saying that‘s not the mentality to go and you can take this opportunity to practice persistence, which benefits you for the future. Unless you genuinely believe she is not worth the effort.
Maybe he wrote to you to vent about how much of a failure he is and when you started bragging it just made him even more suicidal.
lower your standards
He’s not the real Helping Hand. Pay attention to the tripcode. And no, it isn‘t over for you, lol. Early thirties isn‘t too old to still get a hot woman in her mid 20s. We just have to figure out whatever you are struggling with. That aside, if you feel burnt out from dating, this should be the first thing to tackle. Maybe it‘s rather about a fear of reliving bad things that have happened in the past?
Go for hot 18 to early 20's chicks instead, a lot of them have daddy issues and lust for older men
I had a 18yo approach me at a local punk place which felt weird as shit
You will get used to female attention eventually. Hopefully becomes more normal for girls to approach guys. How do people even find these kind of places though?
do you randomly go to these places
nah I'm a member and sysadmin
>>338161>Unmatched + unfollowed now
you or her?>The worst thing is if you meet someone have a good time, have chemistry, maybe meet again and then you say something, do something or don't do something that gives her the ick completely ruining it, even worse when you can't put your finger on it and have to suspect that something else happened or someone else entered the picture but don't even know. Ah yes, life.
like dust in the wind
Honestly, you should start attempting to create resiliency in yourself. I know that's easier said than done, but there are some decent psychology books on this topic I can recommend. Start meditating so you don't become fixated on mistakes or potential mistakes with people. When you learn to accept ambiguity and thrive in it, dating wont just become easier, but many other social situations as well. Bouncing back from disappointment is a skill not only useful for attracting women. You can practice with the less potentially romantic ones by chatting up strangers or friends.>>337676>>337694
That's a nice addendum to what I already said, but I am the real helping hand.
It's far from over. Can't definitively promise you a mid 20s chick, but you can probably still find someone you share mutual attraction with. If you're tired of dating it's perfectly alright to take a break and come back when you're feeling better. In the mean time, you could potentially look at what specifically about dating is burning you out, and work on the underlying cause of that fatigue.
>>338170>I know that's easier said than done, but there are some decent psychology books on this topic I can recommend.
He doesn‘t need psychology books, he needs to be in those situations and bear them. Everyone wants to be comfortable and solve their issues in the realm of theories and ideas. This will not produce substantial change, experience will. And given how simple the actual solution is, reading about it is redundant.
>Start meditating so you don't become fixated on mistakes or potential mistakes with people.
No, meditation won‘t work for that. He needs to practice self-forgiveness, letting go and stop being judgemental.
>When you learn to accept ambiguity and thrive in it, dating wont just become easier, but many other social situations as well.
Which doesn‘t explain what to do in situations of ambiguity. He will likely default to orienting around the other person if you don‘t explain what to do besides „accepting it“.>>338176>Can't definitively promise you a mid 20s chick
Because you are a chump and attracting women of various age groups lies outside of your reality. So it seems unrealistic for someone like you and you project your inability towards others.
>>338179> And given how simple the actual solution is, reading about it is redundant.
You're putting a lot of words in my mouth that I didn't say. If reading about it is redundant, why is anyone even looking at this thread? wtf lel
>He needs to practice self-forgiveness, letting go and stop being judgemental.
Maybe you're not aware of this, but you can reach that state through meditation.
>He will likely default to orienting around the other person if you don‘t explain what to do besides „accepting it“.
Accepting that ambiguity is a part of life doesn't mean inherently orienting yourself around another person. He said it was about a "state" of ambiguity, which has more to do with the experience of it. He can still be proactive towards his goals while realizing there are ambiguities.
>Because you are a chump and attracting women of various age groups lies outside of your reality.
You seem real upset about someone just trying to help people reach their goals.
I'd be real upset too if I weren't so amused by how you went through the trouble of stealing my name and aping my posts. Maybe go take a cold shower and stop posting for a bit?
>>338187>If reading about it is redundant, why is anyone even looking at this thread?
Not reading itself, but reading books about it is superfluous when solving his specific issue is that simple.
>Maybe you're not aware of this, but you can reach that state through meditation.
No, like that you will merely keep these thoughts at bay through perpetual effort. The things that I have listed make it seize being a problem as a whole.
>Accepting that ambiguity is a part of life doesn't mean inherently orienting yourself around another person.
I‘m not saying it does. I‘m saying your solution is insufficient and if he’s insecure then what I’ve described will be the left over problem when accepting ambiguity is all you do.
>You seem real upset about someone just trying to help people reach their goals.
The problem is that you are a clueless and you are leading them astray, which they won‘t be able to tell. The things you say are wishy washy and cliché, which I am familiar with since I‘ve dabbled with self-help and pop psychology for years.
Why is suddenly everyone called Helping Hand in here?
>>336847>I think the real problem for most guys is that unlike in HS or uni, in adult life there are far fewer opportunities for social interaction with girls around your same age than back in school days where everyday you are surrounded by hundreds if not thousands of girls your age on the same school campus everyday
Pls stop Romanticizing school life. Co trary to popular belief, its way harder to engage a girl in high school than in adulthood. In school, you're locked into social castes and surrounded by teachers and parents. And girls only want money and attention and escapades. If you have neither of those, you're good as dead.
ItsOver, might as well be an uber driver at this point
>>338179>He needs to practice self-forgiveness, letting go and stop being judgemental.>Because you are a chump and attracting women of various age groups lies outside of your reality
Is cuffing season real? I never do well on dating apps but I'm getting destroyed right now. I get the feeling gals are too busy with family n holiday prep n shit around this time. Is there a good time of year were women are a little loose? Maybe really loose even.
they don't need to understand what it's like from an experiential pov, that's like saying you can't be an oncologist if you've never had cancer before literal standpoint theory libshit
>>327861>Not to mention the quasi eugenicist goal mental health care has which will only present me with copes so i can rot away quietly and not disturb the normals too much with my presence
How committed to remaining a loser do you have to be to invent such elaborate fancfiction about a field of knowledge you know next to nothing about
Just had a date with a Chilean chick I matched on Bumble. Due to getting burned a lot recently (yes I'm the dude with the Belarusian chick that has posted ITT a bunch) so I went slower. We really had great chemistry, I taught myself fluent Spanish which impressed her a lot but I didn't really go for the kill and escalated much. Then I messaged her for another date and she tells me that she was only looking for something casual and that she doesn't really want to meet for other dates.
FML, I'm unironically KMS. AHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH
another one on the way to taking the RevCel pill… don't worry comrade, you'll get there eventually.
That sounds like progress though, anon. If you've managed it twice, you'll manage it again, and eventually one of them will stick around. Just give it more time.
Feeling really bad right now, I could cry. Getting drunk on cheap wine.
I'd cry too if I had to drink wine.
It's some leftover crap and I'm broke.
From my experience it‘s mich easier to pull girls in the summer.
>>333759>4chan has a info general called "how to get women"
Male heterosexuality is really cringe
So what do you propose, should they just commit suicide due to loneliness
As a bi man myself, I dont think its getting any better for hetero men wanting women.
Unless youre born a cool kid, youre not gonna get any pussy.
Its over. Instead of paying for dating apps, invest in VR or sex androids.
I don't like talking to women. But I also don't like talking to people in general. It's not a "too shy to talk to girls" thing. It's a "I like peace and quiet and get annoyed by people trying to fill the void with words words words" thing. I'm practically mute by choice unless I need to talk to get something done. I also don't like the idea of sharing a bed with someone, no matter how physically attractive they are. I need my space and I don't like feeling crowded.
My ideal relationship would be sex and then doing our own thing.
you've already pretty much taken the RevCel pill there comrade. Just enjoy a quiet life instead of getting burned out wasting time on silly apps, trying to bone some cuban chick who ghosts you after one date
but aside from all those things, do you want to have sex with them?
By not sharing a bed with someone I meant literally sleeping together, not "sleeping" as a euphemism for sex.
At that point, why not just jerk off?
In that case you just have to fake it till you make it, and hope she doesn't freak out too much once your reveal your true self and kick her to the curb
not as satisfying as sex
I wouldn't kick anybody to the curb. I'm as monogamous and pairbond-pilled as most non-poly/non-promiscuous guys. I just simply don't have much interest in the whole "talking a lot" and "sleeping in the same bed" and "spending most of the day" together thing that a lot of couples seem to be into. Not that I'd be hostile to a girl talking. If I had a gf and she wanted to talk to me about how her day was or how she feels I'd listen to what she has to say and pay attention, I just simply wouldn't tell her much about myself in return, or how I feel or how my day was. Like I said I don't like talking.
This. A friend with benefits I mad is always asking me hows my day, asking me about my perabal life. She mans well, but shes kinda immature and her own friemds amd famiky are annoyed with her.
Yeah, I don‘t think a lot of girls like emotionally unavailable guys in relationships. Guess you will need a girl with an avoidant attachment style. Have you ever been in a relationship that you know for certain that‘s what you want? I learned unexpected things about my preferences and affinities from dating around.
Emotional expression does not necessarily equal talking. Body language is 95% of communication.
>>340563>Body language is 95% of communication.
It isnt. But anyway, unless you are super hot, that level of emotional detachment is going to be deal breaker for literally every woman.
If I pull my weight in putting food on the table and pull my weight in doing household chores like washing dishes, cleaning, laundry, yardwork, I don't see why talking a lot is necessary. It's actions vs. words. The bread and butter
Niga women have jobs and know how to do their laundry, they dont need you for that. They keep men around for the sake of physical and emotional intimacy. From what you described you are willing to give them like half of the former. So again, either you are so hot that would be enough for her, or not, in which case she is gonna fuck someone who is.
Ex just contacted me again, 2.5 months later.
She lives 1-2 hours away and dumped me over text message(the distance being the excuse), giving me a long-winded speech over how much I have helped her and how important I was because she recently moved here but that she doesn't want a relationship anymore but just stay friends because of doubts she had or something. Then we had a 5 minute call where she just gave me the typical it's not you it's me speech yadda yadda. Told her friendship wouldn't work out and basically ghosted her after that call because I was pissed off over the texting break-up, the annoying standard break-up formula and the friendzoning. She messaged me the next day and then once again 4 days from then (which I ignored) and then radio silence up until now. Then also blocked her on a few apps.
Following month was pretty rough, birthday party where I had to tell my friends that she won't attend after announcing she would come pre-break-up then quite a dry spell with some spectacular dating failures on my part.
Thing is she is in the top 3 or even 2 of the hottest women I have ever dated in my life and sex was great and experimental and she accepted that I was kind of a loser turned late bloomer. Used to have a great connection at least in the beginning but there was some cultural gap because of different national backgrounds.
Should I respond for sloppy seconds?
>>341146>Should I respond for sloppy seconds?
Probably not, you definitely shouldn't take her back whatever you do. It will only end worse the next time.
But I'm thirsty for a good fuck, ahhhh
this is supposed to be a thread for incels to help get laid and talk to women, not chad's problems.
No offense mate, but no, you should not respond, because from that post of yours you seem like kind of a cunt.
You've been gone now almost a year
And you ask me to forget and forgive
Catch you on the rebound
You didn't even write me or drop me a postcard
Now you want to come back and make a new start
Catch you on the rebound
Oh, you were the first love that I ever had
But you've been gone so long now I don't feel so bad
Catch you on the rebound
I was hopin' and prayin' that I'd see the day
When I could tell you to your face
Catch you on the rebound
>>340548>Like I said I don't like talking
Unironically go to therapy or something. Talking is basically the core of what it means to be human.
Is it? Everyone wants a great listener, nobody wants a great talker.
I mean, typically when you are "talking to someone" you each take turns listening and actually talking. Talking and listening implicate each other.
Being a great listener is usually going to involve saying a least a little bit at appropriate moments - at the very least as a show that you are listening.
Truth is people love the sound of their own voice.>I don't be stressin' 'bout none of these uyghas>When they be talkin', I don't even listen>Tellin' me secrets, I probably forget it
Life is easier when you realize it.
Thisis especailly true when deaing with ghetto girls. Thats why black girls are notorious for writing long messages filled with motivatoonal cliches.
They fancy themselves as preachers.
I mean, we are talking. But okay.
We also have no relationship to each other whatsoever. I could say:
"Yeah you're so right"
and you'd probably like me more for it, but what would it matter?
Ok I responded, she just tried to friendzone me again, lol. Said something along the lines of 'how she is sorry, how I'm still important to her as a person and how she always would be there for me as a friend', so more empty words. Then in the most friendly way possible I basically told her how from my perspective I basically pulled most of the weight in the relationship from the beginning (I basically organized everything, made some sacrifices and more, I know that it doesn't work like this but I couldn't help myself from saying that) only to get dumped via text, right before my birthday party where she was expected to appear and whether she still expects me to talk to her, my ex, when I'm in a new relationship and that I don't really see all of this as a good base for an equal and symmetrical friendship. I basically view all of this as a shitty attempt to keep me in her orbit and benefit from all the things I have been doing for her without her having to commit for a romantic relationship. Again she didn't verbalize any concrete reasons for the break-up. She could have fucked some random dweeb off Bumble for all I know. In general I'm extremely allergic to how so many girls apparently consider failed relationships or even a shitty hook-up dates followed by a rejection to be a great mechanism to recruit 'friends' or a base for a durable friendships, lol. I have healthy boundaries here and there is nothing from with imposing them.
Then she thanked me again and I deleted the chat.
I shouldn't have responded and just ghosted her. Now I got basically dumped and friendzoned a second time. Cool.
Sorry I don't have any specific advice for you anon but it seems to me like you need to get more comfortable with success and trust yourself more to take good care of things and make life enjoyable.
>>341767>I shouldn't have responded and just ghosted her. Now I got basically dumped and friendzoned a second time. Cool.
You live and you learn.
>when I'm in a new relationship and that I don't really see all of this as a good base for an equal and symmetrical friendship.
Kinda shitty for you to be trying to take side offers if you got someone though.
I'm not in a new relationship. I was talking about the future. I was basically asking whether she imagines us to still be 'friends' talking to each other behind their backs while we both have new partners. Like, how is this not going to interfere with any new relationship? Lmao. That's what I meant by 'keeping me in her orbit'. I'm apparently to stay a celibate monk or something to maintain this one-sided friendship or what? Isn't this incredible narcissistic? lol
Anyway. Just blocked her everywhere now
>>342012>I'm not in a new relationship. I was talking about the future. I was basically asking whether she imagines us to still be 'friends' talking to each other behind their backs while we both have new partners. Like, how is this not going to interfere with any new relationship? Lmao.
Oh my bad. You're good then. Yeah that's exactly my line of thinking.
I think if you in the friend zone it's>Maybe they want you to make some kind of stronger play to win their affection. Do the baby "I can't live without you kind of thing" sweep them off their feet
or>Using you like an "emotional tampon" as they say>Using you as the backup plan
Last two often mixed together.
Either way forget them. Have some self respect.
I'm not going to say men and women can't be just friends, but a lot of these women aren't good friends to begin with. I've had some women that were good friend material. Kind of friends that made me feel good about myself, seemed like they actually gave a fuck about me and cared about me. But then again, these also seemed like kind of women who probably had latent feelings romantic feelings for me as well. So it felt like maybe I was friendzoning them. I dunno.
But yeah, don't waste your time or energy on this chick.>>342040>Anyway. Just blocked her everywhere now
Good, just leave it like that. I don't think it's a good idea to retread ground. Move forward, start fresh with someone else. Even if you two did get back together right now, odds are the relationship would only end up worse. How many relationships that started off wonderful that went bad after years have you heard vs. relationships that were bad for years that ended up wonderful?
Consider it dodging a bullet.
Christ alive, why do adults waste so much time on romance when all they talk/think about is sex?
Why do men always obsess over beinf a womans first time?
Even if all women you met were first timers, youre just a stepping stone.
In fact, in a way, it would be more chaotic.
Having more partners indicates a diminished potential of participation in a long-term relationship. It's like asking why employers discriminate against drug addicts. Because they're unreliable and prove it through their actions. This goes both ways btw smart women know that men with a high body count can't be relied on either.
>>342258>Having more partners indicates a diminished potential of participation in a long-term relationship.
Source? Hard mode: No sources with a religious background.
You will have to elaborate how that proves what you previously said, because I don't see an immediate connection to your claim at all. We don't know anything about how many people they've had sex with before the first marriage. And whatever lower propensity there is to get married another time can be explained away with age and how difficult it becomes to find another partner.
>>342334>Having more partners indicates a diminished potential of participation in a long term relationship>Here are statistics from the CDC showing that the vast majority of marriages are first-time marriages, and that the percentage drops drastically as the number of marriages increases>This is an example of how having more partners indicates a diminished potential of maintaining long term relationships>You: NOOOO THIS CAN'T BE TRUE AHAGOAHEOGUAHEHG
ok whatever no sense in continuing the discussion when you willfully deny the stats. The only way you could launch an actual counter is if you claim that the majority of people in marriage stay abstinent/sex free the entire time which is ridiculous.
>>342339>>Here are statistics from the CDC showing that the vast majority of marriages are first-time marriages, and that the percentage drops drastically as the number of marriages increases>>This is an example of how having more partners indicates a diminished potential of maintaining long term relationships
That doesn't follow at all, lol. Roughly 50% of the people asked have ever been married. 20% of these 50% were married, but aren't right now (also not making any statement on whether or not they are currently in a relationship. But for simplicity's sake let's say they are all single). Then 80% of these 50% are currently married with roughly more than 3/4th in their first marriage and roughly less than 1/4th in their second or later marriage. People with more than one marriage are shoehorned into one category. Beyond the first marriage we don't know about the propensity to stay in the marriage or get a divorce. Divorce rates may decrease per marriage or increase, the point is that we can't tell from this statistic. Additionally, we don't know if the people who have been married but weren't at the time the data was taken aren't currently in a committed relationship. And as I've already said, we also don't have any data regarding how many sex partners these people had before their first marriage. I sincerely doubt their spouse was their first sex partner and every subsequent spouse was their only next sex partner. You can have people who have had 10 sex partners before their first marriage, but never getting a divorce, while you could have someone with 2 sex partners getting a divorce and staying single. A failure to get re-married may also be due to the increasing difficulty of finding a partner after divorce, rather than an inability to stay in a committed relationship due to past promiscuity. The statistic simply doesn't prove what you are saying.
>>342230>Even if all women you met were first timers, youre just a stepping stone.
To what? Bitching on the internet about guys that don't want you?
You say that, but young women are at the peak of their desirability. Some men complain about how unrealistically high their standards are, however young women actually can get men who meet those standards. Its not a princess syndrome if you actually are a princess, thats just knowing your worth.
It turns into entitlement once they get older, and expect the same treatment while no longer being the hottest stuff on the market.
t. woman or male model
>>342407>peak of desirability
Not exactly. Only in terms of looks.
>Some men complain about how unrealistically high their standards are, however young women actually can get men who meet those standards. Its not a princess syndrome if you actually are a princess, thats just knowing your worth.
Those unrealistic high standards is due to lack of self inititice in wanting to make your own bread/profit/legacy by your own merit rather than rely on the approval of others all the time.
They can just hop from catch to catch without considering the amount of investment that was given to them.
>It turns into entitlement once they get older, and expect the same treatment while no longer being the hottest stuff on the market.
Lots of that nowadays wi/h the ghetto fab generation. Women in their mid forties still dressing up like they're high school bombshells having to use twice the makeup to cover flaws and already "raised" some kids out of wedlock.
And they have no capital bor skills of their own. They still bum off friends amd family.
Damn, it's almost like being in a romantic relationship is the only way for the overwhelming majority of people to be able to experience intimacy.
People just want to get their genitals wet and have happy feels and a sense of ownership of sentient beings.
And that is bad because?
Not exactly asking for advice, but I just need to get it out of me.
I've met this supposed lesbian girl on the internet and talked toher for the last 2-3 years, from the very beginning I've always thought she was beutiful, and as we talked I got geniunely interested in her and ended up falling in love. Since covid was happening we didn't met many times, and she would always invite other friends of her (mostly men) to come together. Also, she would seem reluctant to have physical contact with me. I was always competely open about my feelings for her, but she consistently affirmed her sexuality, and thus I had given up on any romantic prospects with her. After all that, she invited me to go to her birthday party at a nightclub. Once I got there she was quite drunk and much more open than she had ever been. After sometime she asked me for a kiss, and so we kissed, later we sat on a table and she started fondling my face while saying she would date me, if she was into guys. Right after that she kissed a complete stranger that sat next to her, and then went up to make out with her friends (I didn't actually saw her doing it, but she herself said it the other day).
That was basically the worst blackpill I've taken in my life. It feels like I was a much more confident, focused and organized man before her. Now I'm currently trying to completely forget her, while also improving myself, though I feel like I simply cannot trust people anymore
>>343294>I feel like I simply cannot trust people anymore
She didnt break your trust in any way thought.
This is 100% on you for letting yourself develop feelings for a lesbian. Women usually don't see stuff like making out and other forms of physical affection as inherently sexual the way a lot of men do. Straight girls will get drunk and make out with their girl friends.>I feel like I simply cannot trust people anymore
You need to get over yourself. If you tell a woman you are into her (repeatedly) and she tells you she likes women (repeatedly) and you think she will "relent" at some point, you just delusionally think you're entitled to (change) her. The fault is with you and you alone, and reality will continue to kick your ass until you pull your head out of your ass.>>342258>>342314
Number of marriages and number of partners is not the same thing, nor is relative body count the same as virgin vs non-virgin as asked by >>342230
The reason (some) men have a fixation on virginity is because of a desire to control a woman and specifically to prevent her from making any comparisons that might lead her to try to… (horror!) try to get something better out of a relationship. It's hard to realize how awful your partner is at sex if you have nothing to compare to. That's the bottom line. They don't even want to get good at fucking to keep a woman's interest; they just want to own a woman like property so they can treat her as a thing to fuck.
>>343321>Number of marriages and number of partners is not the same thing, nor is relative body count the same as virgin vs non-virgin as asked by >>342230
The reason (some) men have a fixation on virginity is because of a desire to control a woman and specifically to prevent her from making any comparisons that might lead her to try to… (horror!) try to get something better out of a relationship. It's hard to realize how awful your partner is at sex if you have nothing to compare to. That's the bottom line. They don't even want to get good at fucking to keep a woman's interest; they just want to own a woman like property so they can treat her as a thing to fuck.
Women do the same thing in a way. Romantic relationships are all God complexes.
>>343321>letting yourself develop feelings
How do you prevent that?
Controlling your emotions is a basic skill dude.
When you start to feel something you shouldn't, you are supposed to recognize it and either let go of the feeling or (if you can't do that) remove yourself from whatever context is causing those feelings. In the case of catching feelings for someone, direct your attention elsewhere. Don't pursue someone if you know it won't go anywhere. Instead, go look for women elsewhere or just go jerk off instead. But if you're continually trying to get with a woman who's made it clear multiple times already that she's just not interested, there is probably a more basic issue with not recognizing that your feelings and reality don't match. It's normal to develop feelings that won't be reciprocated. What's not normal is to refuse to accept that. Move on to doing something else and the feelings will fade.
It also sounds like a lack of experience with relationships. If you've actually had feelings reciprocated and developed in a relationship before, this kind of pining for someone you can't get with will be put into better perspective.
So the solution is to just ghost that person?
It's to put more (emotional) distance between you if you get these feelings around them and to distract yourself when you get these feelings thinking about them when you're not around them. If you've already said (again, multiple times) how you feel, then she should understand if you say that you need to be more distant because you don't want to have those feelings. If she has a problem with that, then that's her problem. But if you're not interested in being her friend and only around her because you have romantic feelings, then you
are the one leading her
I'm not a lesbian lover anon, sorry for the confusion.
The answer applies generally, so I'm answering as if I was responding to the same person.
So I met this unmarried 35 year old Japanese woman on a language app that works as a teacher in a neighboring town and we had a ONS. She lives 2 hours away from me but then I entered a 4 months relationship with another girl that later fizzled out. We re-established contact again and now we are going out on Saturday. She's still quite cute, has a great milfy figure for a 35 year old (I'm 6 years younger) if it just weren't for the typical crooked Japanese teeth. I have a Japanese school girl uniform that I have made past hook-ups/gf wear. I have never had a negative reaction so far. Should I take it with me? It won't hurt to ask, right. All she can do is say no, and this is not going to develop into a relationship anyway, so I can risk being upfront about being pervy.
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