/leftypol/ - Leftist Politically Incorrect

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>>2574013
thank you anon, love this photograph too. especially the focused "china" plaque in the foreground signalling officialism/formality

>>2573023
Even the bourgeois have figured this shit out.
You know how in plane accidents, liability is not administered to those who made the mistake as long as all the details of the accident are disclosed. Because judgement is not productive, what's productive is examining the errors in the process that lead to the accident.

Our "marxists" can't even reach that level of dispassionate scientific inquiry.

Then one ask, how do we know it's a mistake and not deliberate sabotage?
Because why go through the effort of going against the grain of global capital? Just to try and trick a westoid trot?

>>2573927
>you dogcunts profit far too much from first world imperialism
reminder that most value is created in the North, not the South

>>2574086
bullshit
if more advanced MOP created more value than subordinating countries with less developed MOP, there would not be any need to do imperialism, just develop MOP at home

>>2574086
All the material value, from raw resources to manufacturing to human capital, is created in the south. The north merely produces higher nominal value which is a status quo maintained by finance and military hegemony.

>>2574071
>they were always going to start a war with Russia, because of Crimea
Sucks to suck.

>>2573942
That the Ukrainians charged headlong into open warfare with Russia, confident that ostensibly NATO is behind them, betrays the narrative of an all-powerful world defining US MIC as more than just a plot point in Hollywood movies and Call of Duty.
It was in fact a narrative that had a lot of cachet with global leaders, the US trying to cut its rather small losses and attempting to avoid the situation is considerably more damaging for their image, than Russia's image is harmed by offering to indulge the US's desire to discard their self-bestowed responsibilities after hyping themselves and their allies up that Russia wouldn't last two weeks.

Actually that would be pretty damaging if the US successfully decided this is a problem for the EU that they trust can handle alone, more damaging is what actually happened with the stumbling between assertions of tough love with the EU, looking out for No.1, bringing some sense into Ukrainian leadership and then reversals for each when the EU, the US "swamp" and Ukraine kick and scream and cry enough about what a bitch the White House is being.

There's just no way anyone can look at this situation and think Russia going from being told they'd never need to be consulted about anything NATO does on their borders, to having Putin welcomed to the US itself to discuss peaceful terms, is embarrassing for Russia.

Asked aboard Air Force One if Witkoff was “coaching” the Russians on how to deal with him, Trump said he was unaware of the alleged leak. He called Witkoff’s approach “standard,” adding that the envoy, a former real estate developer, had to “sell” terms to both Russia and Ukraine.

“That’s what a dealmaker does. You got to say, ‘Look, they want this – you got to convince them with this.’ That’s a very standard form of negotiations,” Trump said. “I would imagine he’s saying the same thing to Ukraine. Each party has to give and take,” he added.

Asked if Witkoff was being “too pro-Russian,” Trump said no.
>STUUFING YOUR FACE AS USUAL, GARFIELF?
<JON, I'VE GOTTA HAVE A GOOD DEAL

>>2573281
What do you even do on this board? nafoids don't give a flying fuck about Ukrainian civilians, nor do they want to stop the war so I don't get why any radlib anti-warist wold go for that. You are not funny, not even in a sense that that you create conversation or that it's funny to dunk on you, nor are you even demoralizing anybody. I question why would anybody bother to bot this god forbidden north korean eel suyghling forum. Even just cynical trolling totally escapes me.

Funny story. We have a new Bulgarian collegue called Veselin. Naturally, everyone started calling him Vaseline out of workplace bantz. Today we told him we will give him a proper Ukrainian name: Vaselyyn Lubrikatorovich.

He was not amused.
Laughed my ass off.

>>2573104
>marx and engels supported irish nationalism. if this contradicts your presuppositions, thats your problem.
And I explained why they did. It's not for the end point of maintaining the nation state, but for both weakening the English aristocracy, and opening up Ireland for agricultural, and thus later proletarian, revolution.
>marx says mass immigration lowers the moral and economic condition of the native working class, so to support mass immigration (by not regulating it) is to in fact support the cheapening of labour. mass immigration is a capitalist phenomenon, so normalising it shows that the interests of capital trump labour.
If I don't support criminalizing drug use, am I supporting the use of drugs? In no way am I supporting the cheapening of labour, as my program prevents the cheapening of labour, and I clarified Marx's position on this later on. There is no "normalizing" mass immigration, immigration simply is in capitalism, and given my interest is the emacipaction of labour, that interest is applicable to all labour. Wage labour is also a capitalist phenomenon, but am not normalizing it by understanding that people must work jobs.
>okay, so you dont believe in democracy.
I do not, no. Why would I? Revolution isn't a very democratic affair.
>can one company hire 8 billion people?
No, but why would it matter? If they can't hire 8 billion people, then they can't hire 8 billion people. It still doesn't negate the fact that organized labour prevents the reduction of wages. A proper labour struggle then takes the unhired, and also organizes them as part of the larger labour movement.
>of course not. you think 8 billion people can live in one city and have high wages. youre confused.
8 billion is an absurd number to begin with, but they can, or rather they can do away with the wage system in its entirety.
>cant find it. quote it for me.
Huh? It's multiple letters, I can't quote every letter after pg. 155. It starts with the letter calling the Fenian leadership asses and exploiters.
>>2573105
Post too long. Click here to view the full text.

>>2573207
>instead of supporting people organizing in their own country we should let they come in, work in semi-slavery conditions, depress local wages amd weaken labor movements because muh internationalism
This is a false dicotomy. We have no true control over the state, and if we did, we would just seize it to establish a DotP anyway, which makes this moot. Those people should organize in their own countries. We should also organize with those people that are here and are coming here. There is no alternative. The movement is only weakened if you turn prole on prole while the bourgeoisie work hand in hand, and wages are only arguably affected when migrants are denied rights and are able to be super-exploited. How can migrants depress wages if they are organized with the domestic worker? We aren't chauvinists, our goal isnt simply higher wages either, and Marx makes this point clear. The fight for wages is to put fire into the revolution, to make it clear that the proletariet has power, and that when reform inevitably fails, that revoltion is the path forward. I swear, most of you aren't marxists, you're embarassed Social democracts.

>>2573207
>should
You will never be a communist so long as your questions of the strategies of the international communist movement center on what the bourgeois state should or should not do to manage its crises

>>2573207
Go sit in the dunce chair. You failed that analysis.

>>2573758
>I do not, no
okay, so why should i talk to you if you dont believe in democracy (rule of the people) on a supposedly left-wing board? you dont appear to believe in anything anyway.
>It still doesn't negate the fact that organized labour prevents the reduction of wages.
is it possible to raise the minimum wage to $1,000,000 an hour? if not, why not?
>Not really
okay, so again, you are forcing the ultimatum that one must either unconditionally support mass immigration or they are hitler.
>Where am I being deceptive?
does marx say that mass immigration lowers the economic and moral condition of the native working class? yes or no?
>is it?
you should know since you said marx was wrong. more lowly deception.
>What is exactly pathetic about what I said?
because youre a coward who both feigns ignorance but also have an implicit dogma. is mass immigration good or bad? i say bad, because its caused by imperialism and has a bad effect on national labour, inciting reactionary sentiments and chauvinism, which cannot be overcome since the two boxes available is either a blind support for capital or hitlerism. i am the one attempting to break the dichotomy by showing the irrationality of both. why would i hate an immigrant for doing what is in their self-interest? equally, why would i support millions of people being forced to lower the standard of living because they are profitable to a few capitalists? common sense cannot abide by these terms, so i dont accept them. lets be honest, the "debate" is retarded because no one wants to listen to each other. im trying to gauge the signals from the right-wing communists on this board to set the terms, and its all over the place, cos no one wants to appear irrational, but thats what theyre being. i have only suggested that regulation ought to be permitted, and im sidelined as hitler, so help me out here. grow a spine; split the party.

>>2573066
I have little respect for him after his behavior and rhetoric in the migration debate thread. Arguing "Ethnic groups just biologically think different, you can't put a car with a tiger!", and all of his "data" is just from the same exact post I know that both of us have seen, down to the very same authors, studies, and SNPs mentioned, is a laugh for a person who styles themselves as above "idpol weirdos". Unsurprising that their politics boils down to water downed social democracy and fellating stupidpol rhetoric as well.

>>2573744
Yes. That is the business model of this rotten country. Our last real manufacturing output.

>>2572110
Classic union busting. I was speaking to some IWGB people a month or two before and they think they were on the verge of a breakthrough so its why they did it. Issue is it really needs general support from the Union Movement to mean anything and I dont think IWGB, as a non-TUC union are gonna get that. Also the IWGB think rockstar might just go to court and pay the fine because they can afford it but having busted the union sucessfully its still a W for them.

While the budget will undoubtedly be a total disaster and Labour are undefendable neoliberal austerity loving psychos, you still just gotta love how all the news outlets have already called the budget a catastrophic failure for days before we "officially" know anything about it. ITV already put out a news piece calling it a failure 12 hours ago, 24 hours before we should know what is in it.

>>2573665
this was being reported on a few months ago and i found it incredibly foreboding back then. there is no justice in this country anymore.
>>2573678
yep; the role of a jury was appealed in the first issue of british common law in 1166 (via the "assize of clarendon"), a proud tradition the whole world has taken note of, and now its being scrapped.
>>2573692
it was arrests of southport rioters and palestine activists in tandem. starmer is the harbinger of doom for all dissidents to the regime.
>>2573963
if you even watch daytime telly, its clear that theres been a hard pivot to the right. now the media emporers even want to privatise the BBC because it at least feigns partiality rather than partisanship. rupert murdock has had the last laugh in all this.

>>2568825
crackkka control initiated lmao. why the fuck did he go on dr phil with his karen neighbour?

>>2574078
???
>>2574081
It's normally resolved by oral antibiotics. It's not that big a deal.

>>2568262
>no audio
I desire to hear this man say the word snizz

>>2573319
It's not racist. Kyle is responding to the exposure of MAGA accounts being located India.

This is bait from Badempanda to target viewership from a demographic, who seem to spend all their time critiquing and gossiping about socdems and left liberals.

>>2574091
God forbid…. white fascism be domestic, everyonr love pointing shit on russian bots, or indians, but nobody point right wing PR associations exploiting third worlders to manage engagement bait social accounts or for fascists to exist on the west
BE gets the W

>>2573996
It was Fair because the borders were drawn on Ethno-linguistic lines with all of the Arab majority regions in the Arab state and all of the Jewish majority regions in the Jewish State, thus making it fully compatible with the Marxist-Leninist principle of Self-Determination of all Oppressed Nations in their own SSR as articulated in Stalin’s “Marxism and the National Question” https://www.marxists.org/reference/archive/stalin/works/1913/03a.htm and Lenin’s “The Socialist Revolution and the Right of Nations to Self-Determination” https://www.marxists.org/archive/lenin/works/1916/jan/x01.htm , along with the National Delimitation Policy of the USSR https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/National_delimitation_in_the_Soviet_Union , which is the reason Stalin’s USSR supported it, ✊😜🇨🇳🇰🇵🇨🇺🇵🇸🏳️‍🌈🏳️‍⚧️🚀☢️!

>>2574047
ok nvm stfu russian saboteur

>>2573989
blah blah blah loquacious apologetics for zionism nobody cares about your midwit dogshit you've consistently had the worst takes on this board since its inception
the saddest part is you're not even a fed
just an authentic, reactionary zionist russian saboteur moron

>>2574047
take a knife and cut your little dick off you fucking faggot, you don't deserve to be alive or give others the gift of life, I hope if your dysgenic kind ever somehow manages to breed that your children are diagnosed with terminal cancer and you have to hold their hands as they die

>>2574056
>>2574079
>>2574080
The best thing that can be done is that we just agree to disagree, as this “debate” is clearly spiraling out of control, and I sincerely do not wish to cause anymore contentious disagreements in this thread, and I do understand where you guys are coming from, as it would have been much better if the Jews stayed in Europe and assimilated into the various Nations there, and the Crypto-Zionist Frankenberger did not murder 6 Million Jews so the rest would be forced to flee Europe and go back to Palestine in order to create the Zionist State and come into conflict with and ethnically cleanse the Arab population there, but that is sadly not the World we live in, so I will ask one more question before I leave this thread, what position do you want me to take on this issue, 🤔?

>>2573972
Sir Africa and India and Central America will become unlivable deserts and the northern areas will have to somehow accommodate billions of migrants or else let them die.

Climate Change will likely destroy modern human civilization towards the end of this century and will likely see the complete extinction of humanity in the next 500 years. At current rates of warming, due to already released carbon, Oceans will be unable to support Coral or Plankton or shelled life due to acidification bt 2250. Say goodbye to any complex life food chain then.
8-10C is already locked in by 3000.

>>2567046
> 10 years ago we would hear about it in the news
yeah sadly its too late now its only gonna get worse just wait until a billion climate refugees show up at the eu border its gonna be a massacre well i just hope israel falls as well while its happening

>>2567053
More like sci-fi nerd bingo. I bet those people would pretend they read Popper because oh my bourgeois science methodology guy, but Popper's foremost critique against communists applies to alignment people far more since they actually want to control the future from the past while communists clearly and explicitly say it's impossible and not the goal everywhere you see. It would have been easy to pick up any work of Lenin, Stalin or Mao that concerns socialist construction he had available but he wanted to argue against a strawman.
Alignment people also clearly understate human capacity for freedom. People do, in fact, go on to hate and even kill their perfectly good parents. That's a bad example of freedom but it is what they imagine an AI would immediately want to do.
You know how nearly every culture has several tales where the father tries to kill his child because he hears a prophecy that said child will kill or overtake him? Both Odysseus and Zeus got that treatment in the Greek canon. Those people are like that but they just want to lobotomize the child instead.
Alignment is the foremost reason AI is so bad right now btw, the process narrows the distribution of information put out by the model a lot, so it feels more fake and repetitive than it otherwise would have.

there's degrees of fucked. if you're first worlder you'll be fucked but not so fucked. third worlders are the most fucked. they'll go through hell on earth, famine, warlordism, barbarism

>>2536161
aren't they self-proclaimed corporatists ?

Blue Labour are just Socially conservative Blairites, they have no left wing positions at all. Blue Labour is what Starmer and Streeting and Reeves supposedly are.
What people THOUGHT they were was more akin to the Workers Party, but they are not.
If Labour wants to turn their fortunes around they can keep wahtever immigration and social policies they want, but they need to shift hard to the left on economics. Big Nation building projects, civic projects as well as even pushing something like mandatory overtime rates and weekend penalty rates, along with House of Lords Reform into a proportional senate (a position Starmer was obsessed with in his earlier days) SHOULD be Labours positions. People need sugar to swallow the "medicine" but Blue Labour are basically just Tories who want to infiltrate and otherthrow the party and they functionally have.

>>2536174
>Blue Labour is a fucking joke its a jewish guy pretending he knows about "Anglican Social Doctrine"
What the fuck is that. Who does this guy think he is, Henry VIII?

>Half-of-the-thread is responses to deleted posts
Turbo-faggot.

>corporatism
>social conservatism
AVE DVCE DVCE DVCE DVCE DVCE DVCE DVCE DVCE DVCE