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/leftypol/ - Leftist Politically Incorrect

"The anons of the past have only shitposted on the Internet about the world, in various ways. The point, however, is to change it."
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mp4 is from: "WATCH rare tank battle in Donbass"
https://swentr.site/russia/610468-donbass-tank-battle-video/

Previous thread: >>2100275

—————————————————–

Evidence of the influence and origin of neo-Nazi groups in Ukraine
https://archive.ph/44B9Q
https://archive.ph/x1sRT#1323637
https://archive.ph/x1sRT#1323658
https://archive.ph/x1sRT#1323663
https://archive.ph/x1sRT#1323688
https://archive.ph/x1sRT#1323729
https://archive.ph/x1sRT#1323733
https://archive.ph/x1sRT#1323731
https://archive.ph/x1sRT#1323735
https://archive.ph/x1sRT#1323740

—————————————————–

ALWAYS APPROACH SOURCES CRITICALLY

Live maps and updates
DeepStateMap: https://deepstatemap.live
Events in Ukraine: https://eventsinukraine.substack.com/
SouthFront: https://southfront.press/category/all-articles/world/europe/ukraine/

Watch Together
📺 News/events: https://tv.leftypol.org/r/HappeningsviaKlash
📺 Hangout/chill: https://tv.leftypol.org/r/bloodcast

Watch By Yourself
>Video Essays / Historical Background
📺 • Ukraine: The Avoidable War - Boy Boy
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LL4eNy4FCs8

📺 • Ukraine's Nazi Problem - The Marxist Project
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4yZvWAwU5W4

📺 • America, Russia, and Ukraine's Far Right - Gravel Institute
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t0pyVJG7_6Q

📺 • Crimea vs Taiwan: Who Gets Self-Determination? - BadEmpanada
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1W_UH4fmyj0

📺 • The Nature of Putin's Russia and Its Causes (3-Part Series) - 1Dime
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o8d6Vzi7zYg
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zODWTfMwFGw
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2Zuygh9Mzuo

<Current Happenings

📺 • The Grayzone: https://www.youtube.com/@thegrayzone7996
📺 • DDGeopolitics: https://www.youtube.com/@DDGeopolitics
📺 • Defense Politics Asia: https://www.youtube.com/@DefensePoliticsAsia
📺 • The Duran: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCdeMVChrumySxV9N1w0Au-w
📺 • The News Atlas: https://www.youtube.com/c/thenewatlas
📺 • Military Summary: https://www.youtube.com/@militarysummary

—————————————————–

Social media
>Twitter
https://twitter.com/GeromanAT
https://twitter.com/plnewstoday
https://twitter.com/RALee85
https://twitter.com/MarQs__
https://twitter.com/KofmanMichael
https://twitter.com/IntelCrab
https://twitter.com/michaelh992
https://twitter.com/Suriyakmaps

<Telegram

https://t.me/milinfolive
https://t.me/hueviykharkov
https://t.me/conflictzone
https://t.me/vorposte
https://t.me/intelslava
https://t.me/grey_zone
https://t.me/AussieCossack
https://t.me/asbmil
https://t.me/Slavyangrad

🇷🇺🇺🇦
Thread guidelines:
• Please remember to add a spoiler to NSFW and extreme content such as graphic violence and gore.
• Try your best to not derail discussion too much from the main events and relevant places where the war is taken place, as well as other happenings, groups and public figures related to it.
• Meta discussion of the historical, philosophical and ideological background of the war is fine as long as its done in good faith and comradely.
• In the event the meta discussion overstays its welcome, participating users will be referred to take the conversation to the INTERNATIONALISM general thread: >>1944320
• Quality shitposting and original content is encouraged! Spamming glowie memes is low effort.
• this is /isg/ for people who treat geopolitics like shitty map games.

Russia will balkanize and slowly absorbed to NATO. Resistance is futile. Comply or perish.

simple as

Idg nafoids / cipso.

Your Kursk offensive is a joke, and Russia's gaining more than 600 sq km a month at an accelerating pace.

Dnipro's steadily exposed. What are you hoping for?

>>2104208
Reddit post

>>2104212

Oh we have time. Hopefully your beloved king last long otherwise I suspect some diadochi problems on the horizon.

>>2104244
I mean, ultimately it comes down to Ukraine's rate of loss.

30k troops are recruited every month, of which up to 18k desert (200k desertions last year), and around 12k+ are rendered casualties.

Ukraine has roughly 480k of land left, Russian advances accelerate at about 50 square km per month, Ukraine has roughly 40 months left.

What time?

File: 1736166909684-0.png (309.91 KB, 593x600, 17360886092240.png)

File: 1736166909684-1.jpg (4.94 KB, 200x150, 17360886092261s.jpg)

File: 1736166909684-2.jpg (237.28 KB, 1024x768, 17360886092261.jpg)

File: 1736166909684-3.jpg (232.68 KB, 1024x768, 17360886092262.jpg)

It's over puzzians. Here is some genuine footage of Putin's North Korean soldiers dying to superior Evropean Ukrainian might

>>2104208
People who comply get enslaved and exterminated anyway, like PA Palestinians. So no.

Obvious PS is obvious. I'm glad that you're out here shitposting instead of getting turned into corpses at the front.

Shall we post dead Ukies?

>>2104253
not only do North Koreans run from Ukraine tanks, but they are apparently inside a O'Neill cylinder

>>2104256
The future is now. Superior Evropa Civilization will find and destroy all asiatic hordes across all of spacetime since we are getting started on time travel as well.


>>2104251
We can always sent there the Poles to fight to the last one. Can your beloved king send all the Russians to fight?

>>2104263
Are the Poles ready to fight yet? End of the day, Putin's supported by BRICS, and the Poles won't fare better than the Ukrainians. I want to see more NATO blood in Ukraine.

File: 1736168133792.mp4 (3.35 MB, 360x360, 17305355701020.mp4)

>>2104263
True, we Evropaeans will be victorious. Just give more wunderwaffe and money plox

File: 1736168462415.jpeg (341.19 KB, 1024x807, Spacecolony3edit.jpeg)


>>2104263
>We
It's always so cringe when you kids do this. YOU are a nobody on an imageboard, you are insignificant. THEY might do that, but you're not included, hate to break it to you buddy.

>>2104268
[Verse]
Out in the cylinder
Where the sunlight's a dream
North Korean shadows run
Silent as a stream
They flee from the metal
From the earth's mighty hand
Ukrainian tanks roaring
Protecting their land

[Chorus]
Cowards in the night
Losing strength for the fight
Ukrainian steel
With a heart of iron might
North winds are blowing
Away their dark schemes
In the O'Neill cylinder
Where bravery gleams

[Verse 2]
Fields of green and gold
Not touched by their fear
Tales of courage echo
For all people to hear
Tigers on the prowl
Roaring loud through the air
Soldiers keep on running
Lost in their despair

[Chorus]
Cowards in the night
Losing strength for the fight
Ukrainian steel
With a heart of iron might
North winds are blowing
Away their dark schemes
In the O'Neill cylinder
Where bravery gleams

[Bridge]
Legends written in the stars
Of those who stand tall
A tale of tanks and valor
In the cosmic hall
No shadows can conquer
Where the brave hearts lead
Cowards keep on fleeing
From the righteous creed

[Verse 3]
Glory in the land
Where the sunlight's a dream
Heroes rise from ashes
Conquerors supreme
North Korean phantoms
Vanish in the light
In the cylinder's cradle
Dawn breaks the night
https://suno.com/song/a31020ee-6251-4daa-86af-bdec7399b869

two more decades

Get real, two more centuries!

>>2104267
>>2104259
Even if we don't pull off a successful revolution in our lifetime or if the maoists/leftcoms are right and this multipolarity shit is just a rearrangement of the imperialist global order. I'm willing to settle for seeing that shithole nazi peninsula get taken down a peg again. God knows we're due for it to happen again.

File: 1736174775774-0.jpg (112.49 KB, 720x382, 17361693241920.jpg)

File: 1736174775774-1.jpg (372.71 KB, 1280x591, 17361727705510.jpg)


>>2104208
So many people in history have asserted something like this before and it's very much still here. Westoids think that *this* time they'll do it and it's gonna be different *every time*, but don't actually learn from previous attempts.

>>2104255
>Obvious PS is obvious
Get with the time granps, it's the AI generated content era now

>2 more weeks
The goal has clearly shifted to getting the Dumbass region, and then claiming Victorious and signing a deal.

There's no victors, Ukraine didnt manage to maintain its full territory, Russia didn't subjugate Ukraine.

>>2104354
Ukraine is unable to replenish its losses, they're sending even hiv patients, by now only half of what they need can be drafted. I told you before, by may Ukraine will be begging for peace, if Putin doesn't cuck out, by July, Ukraine will be abandoning it's posts, by october, Ukrainian military will be a gang, armed with ak-47, sick, and drugged. They have more chance of turning on themselves, than turning it around.

>>2104354
Source?

File: 1736178968576.jpg (207.52 KB, 1400x788, 1_nTSWEp3F2D55_W-UZy6Yow.jpg)

>>2104362
(Ukrainian military in 10 months) watch as what is left of it dissolves like sugar in water in the second half of the year.

Leftism loses, hundreds of thousands of the working class are dead and many more will follow, you can support Russia or Ukraine, but nothing will change this fact

>>2104362
>Ukraine is unable to replenish its losses
we've been hearing this story for the last 2 years

>>2104375
How many more years though nazoid

>>2104331
fuck it, one struggle

MSM now claims that over 1000 North Korean soldiers have been killed or wounded, they report this as fact. Got banned from r/worldnews and other subreddits for doubting this claim (including nominally "left-wing" and "Marxist" ones).

Has there been any reliable evidence that North Korean soliders operate at least in Kursk? Any?

File: 1736181348614.jpg (Spoiler Image,284.08 KB, 1440x1036, OPEN AT YOUR RISK.jpg)

>>2104410
Content warning

>>2104368
you fsbots were already sperging about the volksturm three days into the smo but now it's in ten months sure

>>2104362
by that point the French, the Poles, and probably the Germans will be there if not even America

Russia should sue for peace immediately and try to keep Luhansk, Donetsk and Crimea.

>>2104415
posting senseless gore like that should be a bannable offence

File: 1736182009807.mp4 (3.57 MB, 480x848, 17360080307690.mp4)

>>2104419
>>2104430
I'm glad you recovered from this already

>oh no not the heckin' pupperino
animals are meant to be KILLED and EATEN and put in CAGES at the ZOO and kept as PETS at HOME
PS: humans are not animals, we have transcended into a higher state

>>2104437
You've long transitioned into higher estrogen level it's true

>>2104415
Reddit is the biggest proof of the power of western propaganda. Russia should just forget about niceties and "international law" and sabotage Europe as much as possible. In fact, if I were putin, I'd be financing terrorism in Europe right now, a pity he is a cuck :-( The USSR was a complete disaster for Russia though, not only it broke it in pieces, and made sure to handle over half of Europe to the US, but fueled Russophobia like nothing else (partially by it's own fault) with "gulags ! Statsi ! authoritarianism!" etc… created the image of a cruel, corrupt russia, that doesn't care about lives. what do the people who were in power in the USSR in the 1980s and put Russia in this horrible situation think of what they achieved ?

>>2104445
>created the image of a cruel, corrupt russia
yeah dude it's just an image LMAO

File: 1736182757308.png (368.25 KB, 732x581, 1727628362986.png)

>>2104445
>my retarded neocolonial state's propaganda that has nothing to do with reality is USSR's fault
Meanwhile your country is what, 30% down from the population it had in 1990?

>>2104410
it's really funny how "ukraine said it so it's true" is literally accepted as proof by the free thinkers of reddit. like whatever side you're on, you've got to realize that even the goodest of heckin good boys can have wartime propaganda, right?


>>2104455
russia will turn into a violent crime ridden shithole due to all the maimed war hardened drunktards coming back home with no future prospects, and a lot more central asian and islamized as a result of increase migrations to replenish all the obedient transhumanists that died for heckin based commie fashist putlerino

>>2104464
you have such violent fantasies bruh

it can't be healthy

>>2104464
the government apperently wants to limit immigration from central Asia but it may be too late

>>2104473
>fantasies
what's violent about it?

File: 1736184171710.png (7.13 KB, 268x89, ClipboardImage.png)

>>2104476
hit your head too hard, /pol/?

>>2104464
>Le drunk orcs
>muh asiatic mooslim migrants
>commietsar putler le controls the orcs
The cope from nafoids have been entertaining

File: 1736184253665.png (402.03 KB, 836x1300, more realistic.png)


>>2104481
>>Le drunk orcs
people pick up bad vices after service yes
>>muh asiatic mooslim migrants
it is a real thing but oh well

>>2104480
The word violent is violent to you uh
Overdosing on your daily estrogen intake again, I see
>>2104481
Cops and soldiers are obedient dogs by definition, gape harder, transhumanist.
russian village idiots indeed tend to be drunks, le orc thing is just your gaping wound spin from acknowledging reality.
Central asians are indeed asians and muslims

>transhumanist transhumanist transhumanist muslim drunk transhumanist asian crime transhumanist
ukraine lost, though

>>2104490
lay off the estrogen my man

File: 1736185110458.png (1.13 MB, 1360x765, ClipboardImage.png)


I love how they come here thinking they gonna own le commies, consistently get owned and dunked on, they leave, then can't resist coming back. It's literal cuck behaviour.

>>2104481
Germany is in a prolonged recession in the middle of industrial collapse https://infobrics.org/post/42921, threatening to take the EU down with it. From France to England, financial problems worsening. Meanwhile, Russia just grew 4.1% in 2024, and is re-industrializing through import replacement. After wars end, fertility rates always increase, russian fertility rate is projected to rise from 1.6% to 1.8% by 2029, that along with increased life expectancy + migration from an increasingly impoverished Europe, will solve the problem.

>>2104503
>estrogens infused ravings
>>2104504
hardly anyone from europe would ever move to a frozen hellhole to wage slave, get real(USER WAS BANNED FOR THIS POST)

>>2104482
Meh… as long as it doesn't collapse into 15 pieces, throws its population into misery and gives the US total hegemony, is still a better story than twilig… USSR.

File: 1736188555189.png (340.27 KB, 587x486, ClipboardImage.png)

WTF. Based CPM(K)!

>>2104464
>muh islamism
>muh migration
>muh transhumans
ok polyp

>>2104565
>>2104565
>immigration and islam dont real because muh /poltranshumanists
transhumanism is quite rampant around these parts

>>2104410
It's fairly reasonable; it implies they've taken between 250 to 333 deaths.

Wounding can range from losing a limb to a papercut, remember.

>/pol/-cels coming to /leftypol/ be like

>>2104503
I think it's hilarious honestly. We're not to be taken seriously but never enough that they leave kek

>>2104577
the kitschy music makes this vid

>>2104577
what's up with the smoke on the other side of the road at the very end of the vid?

Michael Roberts documents the crisis of imperialism quite well

https://thenextrecession.wordpress.com/2024/12/31/forecast-2025-roaring-or-tepid/

>2024 was the year of elections. There were 40 national elections, covering 41% of the world’s population and representing 42% of global GDP. And my forecasts for the outcomes in these were also pretty accurate. On the most important, the US presidential election, this is what I said: “there is no certainty about who will win; or whether Biden will actually stand again; or whether either Trump or Biden would even serve another full term.” So not very clear, but at least not wrong. Biden did not stand, Trump won (narrowly on the popular vote) and we don’t know if he will serve a full term.


>The results of other elections were much more easily predicted: the UK, India, Indonesia, South Korea, Taiwan, South Africa came out as forecast. The surprises were the victory of a leftist party in Sri Lanka and the victory of the left as the largest party in the snap election in France. Nearly everywhere, the incumbent governments lost vote share and/or were defeated; and voter turnout was down, revealing the disillusionment of citizens with all the mainstream political parties. That trend is likely to continue in 2025 with elections in Germany, Canada, Australia, Czech and Norway; and in Latin America too (Ecuador, Chile and Bolivia).


>What about the economy? 2024 ended with six out of the top seven capitalist economies either in stagnation or in outright recession, as measured on the basis of gross domestic product (GDP). And when measured on GDP per person, then even the US, the best performing of the G7 economies, did not do so well, while the rest were all stagnant at best. The reason for that was not an increase in populations through births and deaths, but through net immigration [my note: a band aid fix leveraging the privileged place in the world economy to deal with its hollowing out effect]. Immigration boosted the labour force and national output in 2024 in the US, the UK, Australia and Canada. The long depression that started after the Great Recession of 2008-9, resumed after the pandemic slump of 2020 and continued in 2024.


Post 2008 conditions and the crises accumulated will continue to merge and become more difficult to solve

>>2104419
>by that point the French, the Poles, and probably the Germans will be there if not even America
None of those countries are economically or politically capable of fighting a war like the one currently being waged in Ukraine. European NATO members have virtually exhausted their arms stockpiles just to keep Ukraine in the war as long as they have. The US could probably keep their own troops supplied pretty well but atm Russia is outproducing all of NATO combined and they're only on a partial war economy.

>>2104591
>In the first half of 2024, real wages remained lower than in 2019 before the pandemic in Germany, France, Italy and the UK, as well as in Japan and South Korea. Real wages were higher in the US, but only by 1.4% [my note: this is stratified by income level and carried a lot by those up the ladder]. Indeed, real wages in some countries—the UK, Japan and Italy—remain below levels recorded in 2008, the year of the Great Recession! By contrast, Chinese real wages were up 27% from 2019, while Brazil also recorded a big rise.

>>2104596
Between this and what I posted we can probably guess the post covid world has been one of political, economic, and strategic stagnation for the first world

I had a very prominent professor tell me recently, frustrated with my decline diagnosis, that America won the war in Ukraine because Russia reinforced its position as the primary security guarantor in the world. This is a funny way of saying it made the West never more united yet never more isolated, while completely undoing the sino Soviet split then making its ripples intersect with the global south's dissatisfaction and wavering. On net it means yes it's a security guarantor again - for an international system nobody outside of Europe believes strongly in. Israel only makes that worse.
In short, on the local level a strategic victory that exposes strategic bankruptcy in the big picture

File: 1736191841519.jpeg (242.86 KB, 1290x2211, v44hux4auebe1.jpeg)

bussyfication is the Ukranian word of the year 2024

>>2104605
>By contrast, Chinese real wages were up 27% from 2019
Yearly 5% real wage increase + deflation is insane. Add China's policy against speculation in the housing market and it's pretty much prole heaven.

File: 1736194464264.png (757.55 KB, 825x1086, ClipboardImage.png)

I liked the picture, didnt read the article but I will post it here so you can give me the synopsis

https://archive.is/PdHby

>>2104596
>European NATO members have virtually exhausted their arms stockpiles
>atm Russia is outproducing all of NATO combined
This is really delusional though

File: 1736195853761.jpeg (7.6 KB, 200x200, image.jpeg)

>>2104612
>bussy

>>2104612
besides the absolute tragedy of the forced conscription by Nazis, choosing bussyfication as the word of the year is hilarious.

>>2104659
Its projection.



>>2104253
ㅏㅏㅏㅏㅏㅏㅏㅏㅏㅏㅏㅏㅏㅏㅏㅏㅏㅏㅏㅏㅏㅏㅏㅏㅏㅏㅏㅏㅏㅏㅏㅏㅏㅏㅏㅏㅏㅏㅏㅏㅏㅏㅏㅏㅏㅏㅏㅏㅏㅏㅏㅏㅏㅏㅏㅏㅏ

>>2104716
>how long can we expect a Ukrainian collapse considering no more funding from the US?
>they're already in a collapse uh this is this is something that people don't seem to understand and I can't see why. the Ukrainian military is… how do I explain this… the Germans were in collapse after Stalingrad right, there was never a point after Stalingrad you could talk about, which they lost handily, where the Germans were not in a collapse heading backwards. the ukrainians are not in a position where they will ever be able to stabilize from here forward right .so I said the collapse started basically after avdiivka fell I thought avdiivka falling and then orchit falling and then uglidar falling all in succession. these are areas that theu krainians could not afford to lose and they're losing them while trying to maintain them. that is a collapse to me. moving into Kursk is again another sign that the ukrainians are collapsing. moving in a different direction trying to change the equation and now you're seeing the actual manifestation of this collapse int hese brigades that are just being built up deserting and being broken up and sent into different directions because they're not a combat functional unit anymore

>>2104730

Ukraine will not collapse. That is zigger coping huffing the potent russian bullshit. Ukraine is losing and has lost and will lose, as was expected by literally everyone everywhere from day one. But the US will keep funding them. Just as much as needed to make it hard for the Russians.

Its really that simple. For ukrainians who fell for the bullshit it is now existential. The leadership at best will get in jail for corruption, at worst it is going to get hanged. So they will continue bussification. The burgers will not give Ukraine to the Russians easy. Why would they do that?

>>2104651
bringin back orientalism

>>2104740
Ukraine doesn’t have enough men to lose without collapse. Your scenario is incoherent. The possible scenarios are the Russians give up, the war stalemates and returns to the ATO era intensity, the Americans force a settlement, or Ukraine collapses.

>>2104610
That professors analysis only applies to Europe though. No regime in Asia or the Middle East is worried about Russia like they were worried about communists. So Western Europe has been saddled with rising defence costs during a period of economic decline in order to make low value Eastern European countries feel safe.

>>2104416
Ukraine was literally handing out guns to whoever would take them three days into the SMO. Since then the Volksturm of middle-aged men has been the only thing that allowed Ukraine to hold on.

NATO analysts are constantly seething that the age of most Ukrainian units means they are only good for sitting in a trench. Recruiting children like the Nazis did would actually be an improvement in combat capability.

>>2104354
The claim that the objective of the SMO was the subjugation of Ukraine is an invention of NAFOids. It is completely at odds with the stated SMO objectives and the forces initially deployed by Russia.

Russia wanted a re-run of Georgia 2008 where the threat to the capital would bring negotiations and defacto acceptance of existing territorial occupation.

File: 1736209103052.webm (5.07 MB, 856x480, babushkano.webm)

>>2104923
and most of those who remain are old women and men. Like people who on average can't or don't want to flee, but don't procreate, are little use to the economy and the war effort.

>>2104923
>Less than 15 million people remain in Ukraine.
<Nasze szacunki wskazują na to, że za granicą przebywa 20-25 mln Ukraińców, a w Ukrainie - około 32 mln.
that's not what your fucking source says, buddy

>>2104957
I knew a retard like you would mention that, https://www.populationpyramid.net/ukraine/1994/ , population of Ukraine peaked in 1994 at 52m, it has declined ever since 25m + 32m = 57m. is the number
57 lower than 52 ?

>>2104964
there were ukrainian diasporas abroad in 1994, though

>>2104964
So just to understand, you provide a source, and you believe one number they give but not another?

>>2104943
>but don't procreate
procreating during war is pretty fucking evil


>>2104980
would you still make time to post your moral takes when there was genuine threat of a bullet hitting your skull or would you try to enjoy life while you still had it
don't bother answering; this is a materialist website

Some retard on this board laughed when I estimated the population of Ukraine as 17 million 1 month ago. now a polish publication reaches a similar conclusion; Ukraine has 25 m, of its pre-war 40m, living outside. https://wiadomosci.wp.pl/sprowadza-ukraincow-do-domow-jasne-stanowisko-wladz-7111328077040352a

About 6.5 million fled to the EU
About 9.5 million fled to Russia
8 million people live in the DPR, LPR, Kherson, Zaporizhia regions, which are under Russian control.
A million killed. Less than 15 million people remain in Ukraine. https://t.me/breege_time_20zz/42610 .

The only population census published by Ukraine is from 2001, at 48m, from 52m in 1994. Unlike Russia, Ukraine never managed to recover its economy or fertility rate, and continued to decline, accelerating after the civil war started in 2014. 2001 : 48m , 2013 : 45m , 2014 : 42m , 2021: 38m (according to Arestovich). According to dmitri-kovalevich, since Feb 2022, over 6m went to EU, over 7m to Russia, over 1m to other countries. Over 5m are in Russian held areas + over 2m died from natural decline worsened by the war, some 800k Kia = ~ 16 million left.

>>2104996
>Less than 15 million people remain in Ukraine.
<Nasze szacunki wskazują na to, że za granicą przebywa 20-25 mln Ukraińców, a w Ukrainie - około 32 mln.
that's not what your fucking source says, buddy

>>2105001
So just to understand, you provide a source, and you believe one number they give but not another?

>>2104980
Ok moralist who can't read, but the point was that most of those people who have left are not coming back, even doubly so for those who are dead. If after the war Ukrainians average age is like 55 years old and the young men left are without limbs, then the nation will pretty much die and the state will collapse because it only has mouths to feed and nobody working or reproducing the populous.

>>2104996
>>2104943
By 2023, the population of Ukraine had already fallen to 19 million, now all Ukraine has left are pensioners. https://en.sputniknews.africa/20231120/1063679001.html

>>2105015
one of yanukovich's ministers who's been living in Russia since 2015 isn't a super reliable source i'll be frank

>>2105015
You guys would walk into traffic if sputnik/rt were jingling keys accross the road

>>2104988
>i keel you
delusion

>>2105013
What makes you think Europe won't deport millions of them back? Plus import millions others to work the fields

>>2104997
Ok genius, but are you really as smart as you think? Cuz if u read more than one line of text, you'd see that the source of the '32M in Ukraine, 25M abroad' claim is the literal Ukrainian government. It claims there's 41M within 1991 borders and 31M within Ukraine as a state. Thing is tho, that nobody actually has good data on population, migration and refugees. I checked the sources for all the dumbass estimates and they all rely on doing gay ass insurance math on data that's years old. Both IMF estimate and UN one are just literal guesses. So it's all just mostly fantasy numbers.

>>2104851
I mean the 15 million calculations are overly optimistic / pessimistic. 25-30 million's a more reasonable figure for what's left.

That said, tbh, I'm still somewhat surprised the Russians haven't actually embraced democidal policies given Ukraine's demographic collapse.

The Ukrainian birth rate has collapsed and even with a Ukrainian victory, Ukraine doesn't have long for this earth as a consequence; Ukies take 500k non-military deaths a year.

>>2104507
so did losing all the steel mills two and a half years ago really do german industry in?

>>2104659
If it's delusional rhen why does Russia have such a vast advantage in material over the AFU?

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>>2105049
I would think Europe would want the cheap labor to depress wages in Europe, not help Ukraine after it has fallen, failed and been sucked dry. Those who will return will go to the Russian areas, because there will be more opportunity to build a life than in the western parts.

Remember neither Washington or Brussels actually care about Ukraine, like really care. They will loot the place if they can, but they won't rebuild it. Mostly because they cant's afford it and there will be no viable place for strong western minded Ukraine. Ukraine's industrial base and mineral wealth is lost or will be lost after the war, Russia will be sitting on it's transport artery of Dniepre and Ukraine might even end up landlocked. There is nothing but cost for the west. Only real reason to prop up rump Ukraine might be if they are deluded enough to think that they just have to split up Ukraine and they can get another cold war West- and East-German style win over Russia in 20-30 years. Just because western style liberalism is always bound to win and all they need is more time.

>>2105096
the current collective selfshitting of german automaking can be directly traced to it
construction continentwide was also somewhat fucked after covid and having no fucking steel to build with (fond memories of having to calculate how to build an office out of assorted cold rolled steel elements because ordering more was about impossible. shit was like a jigsaw puzzle.)
can't do solar panel mounting or wind energy or much of anything in terms of turbines without steel, neither. people just don't realize how bad it really is.

>>2105111
I really do wonder how close we are to revolution in Europe, even a internal porky coup, because the idealist politicians are shafting even the upper class interest right now. Like who the fuck even benefits anymore? The relatively small economically insulated intelligentsia that runs or supports the EU/Nato/liberal project to the hilt and thinks the world works by them wishing things into being and will have jobs and income as long as the institutions and bureaucracies stay put? Where is the economical beneficiaries to this anymore, since this road Europe is on will even eventually eat the bankers and other European FIRE sector fucks? Anybody who has any ties or interests to goings on Europe and who can't just get into a plane, move to US or wherever and forget the whole continent in a moments notice is feeling the heat right now.

>>2105111
I honestly don't get it. Germany has no tariffs on Chinese steel, and Chinese steel is in freefall due to the death of the property bubble in China.

What's killing Germany is high energy prices due to the Ukraine War, and Germany long-term can switch to Chinese solar + battery as a replacement for Russian energy.

>>2104253
Almost all of them look like unarmed WWII soldiers.

>>2105136
It can't, you have absolutely no idea how much energy oil or gas give in comparison to solar or any other green source. Energy intensive sectors like metallurgy cannot run on "green". either nuclear or fossil, no other way.

>>2105150
You can do it. There is no impassable technological or metallurgical hurdle. The jump just can't be done on a short to medium timescale and expect to remain competitive. The real energy policy retardation wasn't the renewables, it was the nuclear ban, renewables just aren't there yet. Also what the green doofuses don't really internalize is that when building green energy sector you need the dirty industry to build it in the first case. Otherwise it's just let China build it and then feeling high and mighty and pass judgement when they pollute for us civilized "green" westerners.

>>2105144
It's all AI generated.

>>2105150
In China, it's like 20 cents per watt or 1.5-3 cents per kWh of solar, and 1-2 cents for battery storage.

Germany doesn't have available empty land, and cost of installation is much higher, which is why I'm saying it's a long-term solution to break free of American Scylla and Russian Charybdis.

>>2105092
30 million ? You're an idiot literally paroting the number the Zelenski government gives.
Ukraine had 37m before the war (not counting crimea) https://www.worldeconomics.com/Population/Ukraine.aspx
Over 6m went to the EU https://www.frontex.europa.eu/media-centre/news/news-release/update-on-ukraine-more-than-6-million-refugees-cross-eu-s-borders-xgNX2Q Over 0.5m to other places, and over 5m to Russia https://tass.com/world/1704667. Over 2 million are estimated to have died from natural population decline ,worsened by the war, + KIA. The population living in russian held Ukraine is around 5m-7m depending on the source, let's say 5.
37 - 6 - 5 - 1 - 2 - 5 = 18 million.

>>2105181
I mean it's overly optimistic; accurate death tolls are opsec.

The UN estimated 42 million prewar, Russia annexed 5 million, 6 million refugees to EU, 5 million to Russia, about 26 million left.

Natural demographic decline is less than 1 million.

So, you can assume 20-30 million left in Ukraine.

>>2105183
Western sources for Ukraine population are often inflated https://www.worldometers.info/world-population/ukraine-population/
But let's suppose the 42m from UN, that's including Crimea - 2m = 40m. Ukraine natural population decline was 200k-300k per year, it worsened along with living conditions, due to war ~ 350k, that would give ~ 1m, Kia is 700k - 800k, total ~ 1.8m. 40 - 1.8 - 5 - 6 - 5 - 0.5 (neither EU/Russia) 21m at most, not 30m (even the Ukrainian Government only estimates 28m)

>>2105178
>getting dependent on Chinese solar panels and energy solutions is a long-term solution to break free of American Scylla and Russian Charybdis.

Hilarious

>>2105134
The European porky sure can. Europeans basically don't think they are separate from America at all. Hell, many people in Russia were like that and only SMO finally solved that problem in the cultural space, now we don't care about orange man anymore. Hegemony is one hell of a drug.

>>2105178
Germany is just shit for solar, to be fair. It's a cloudy place at high latitudes. China is unusually cloudy for their latitudes but at least they don't have much shorter days in winter. The greens are retarded since nuclear and coal are the only two energy sources Germany could rely on.

>>2105206
The Greens are the literal CIA/Mossad. We'll see them argue against Chinese Solar and for American LNG within this decade.

>>2105208
They already have. American energy is clean, and Chinese one authoritarian and undemocratic and also made out of uyghurs

>wake up
>cross off another day on my Wait For Trump calendar
Almost there now. Not long before the dumb cunt has to start owning US Empire decisions without his gaggle of simps pretending he's a change president.

Also, the Kremlinoids are unfortunately in a Wait For Trump mode, not because they're as gullible as the Trump simps who think Trump is going to change US foreign policy but because they've decided to let that narrative play out and crash before the eyes of Russian-friendly observers. And the sooner it crashes, the better. Then we might start seeing more brazen escalations from the Kremlin.

>>2105100
I remember reading something about North Korea outpacing western artillery production. Ok I found it;
https://www.nytimes.com/2024/05/29/us/pentagon-ammunition-ukraine-russia.html
>“Let’s say a year and a half from now both the U.S. and Europe are making, or buying, over a million shells each,” he added. “That’s still probably less than Russia is going to produce this year.”
https://koreajoongangdaily.joins.com/news/2023-11-06/national/northKorea/Expert-says-North-likely-to-ramp-up-production-of-shells-for-Russia/1907006
>the North can produce around 2 million 152-millimeter shells per year,” he said.
The fuck are they putting in western arty? Liquid gold? Liquid nitrogen to overclock a raspberry pi running a gyro?

>>2105224
Back in the days of WW2, Germans were /k/oping with their bad production rates by claiming that their tanks and shells were state of the art (meaning made by hand). While Russians and Americans were welding armor plates, Germans were using bolts and nails

This time, however, we have a situation where both Russians and Americans are using the same 50 years old Austrian metalwork machines, but Russians are outproducing USA 5-10 to 1

>>2105223 (me)
It might be a smart play actually. They can count on Democrats hating Trump, and they're going to let Trump's own base turn on him (as with the H1B shit), particularly the tech bros like David Sacks & co. who clearly have no love for the Zelensky regime.

>>2105200
Solar is build up front, extract energy for 25 years, batteries is build up front, extract energy for 10 years.

Compare Russian gas: if you cut the lines, it's gone.

>>2105208
I for one, fully support the greens and hope they win.
(That's the only way europe will ever learn.) >>2105229
Today I learned gas storage doesn't exist.

>>2105229
>solar panels don't need maintanence
I hope that people like you aren't running Europe's energy policies

>>2105237
Panels are solid-state.

The thing is, the 25/10 year lifespans are to 80% capacity, so you actually have extremely gradual degradation if supplies get cut.

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>>2105240
I mean I do have to deal with Russians and pro-Russians but industrial Germany's slapping on panels like crazy as it's cheaper than American frackgas.

https://www.google.com/amp/s/oilprice.com/Latest-Energy-News/World-News/German-Firms-Install-Solar-Panels-to-Cut-Electricity-Costs.amp.html

The only thing that Europe ever did good was investing in renewables, but of course retards stuck in the 19th century and fed russian selling bullshit would never get it.

Volkswagen fucking up, being a uncompetitive shit company and never investing in new technologies, leaving chinese ones take the lead, isn't the fault of high energy prices. Russian gas was still flowing in when the company was going down.

>>2104419
>by that point the French, the Poles, and probably the Germans will be there if not even America
>Russia should sue for peace immediately and try to keep Luhansk, Donetsk and Crimea.
There's been a lot of this insistent nafo delusion over the last few days. Who is the audience for this?

>>2104256
>>2104268
>>2104273
POSADISTS IN CONTROL

Watching old Soviet children comedy movies right now

>"Better dead than a scalper!"


Maaan. Boy was gifted elephants, camels, horses, hundreds of slaves, gazillion spices by a djinni, and first thing first he wants to do is to donate all the spices to local shop to distribute it, to donate animals to a zoo, and to free the slaves

Have the Russians given any estimates about how many Ukros remain in Kursk?

>>2104659
Literal western media says Russia outproduces all of NATO on shells by a lot, and at the very least it's outproducing the Yuros in terms of tanks and vehicles(it might also outproduce the US atm, but I don't know that for sure). The only delusional people here are chauvinists like you. You just apriori assume superiority, even if it's not there and also always underestimate your opponents because you never actually learn anything about them except whatever slopaganda you can still keep straight in ur head.

>>2105238
1. Yes, genius, we know. Just cuz they have no moving parts, doesn't mean they don't need maintenance.
2. Actually efficient solar farms have the panels track the sun to get the best angle, so there's your moving parts back in the equation.

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>>2105306
Westoids are in complete denial about their militaries. They think that because 100 billion €€€ have been dedicated to whatever state's MoD, they are now ready to fight Russia, when they are essentially just funding office workers. I saw someone make a comparison of European states to SS ethnic divisions, but I don't even think it's appropriate, not one of these countries has a battle-ready division for deployment, even on their own soil.

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Puzzians are already robbing bees for their drone construction materials. Putin is buzzt

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Also Berdin is already back under Russian control
"Last Hope" offensive lmao

>>2105315
It never was captured. Color on the map represents how far a soldier or a vehicle got, not actual control of territory

This week voluntary returns to Syria are resumed from Germany after 10 years. 300000 Syrians in Germany have temporary protection status. Guess whose protection status is not going to get renewed, which means returns to Syria.

Now guess which other people in Europe has only temporary return status, which can also been evoked whenever and means that they don't have the ability to get nationality papers despite living there for years.

>>2105293
Iirc most modern panels are bifacial static panels, because guess fucking what? Module prices dropped off a cliff courtesy China.

The problem is more the battery side, because the batteries for winter and nighttime use will only last 10 years, then rapidly drop off a cliff.

Still, IIRC, German projections showed that panels with batts are the cheapest source of energy for Germany in 2024, with LCOE in the 4-8 cents range.

American Natgas is in the 3.75 cent range, mind you.

>>2105322
That's what I meant in point 1. Like cool, the panel are solid-state, but everything around them that they need to do their job - cables, batteries, transformers, etc - still absolutely do need maintenance.

>>2105259
But when computed, the cost is very competitive with American natgas in Ameristan, and the nonpanel materials can be produced in Europe.

I mean, end of the day, there's likely another 50% price reduction incoming in module costs, and we saw battery costs drop by 50%, with another 50% drop probable.

Long-term, Chinese solar will eat American frackgas's lunch.

>>2105225
Russia went and bought a whole bunch of new manufacturing machinery for this.

>Russia’s advanced machine tool imports soar


>Elsewhere, the report also highlighted a significant increase in Russian imports of a class of advanced machine tools critical to Moscow’s military production since the start of the war.


>Russia imported $189 million of “computer numerical control” machinery between January and October 2023, according to KSE analysis. It marks an 88% increase versus pre-war levels, with the majority of these tools coming from Western coalition countries.


>CNC machines are automated industrial tools widely used in the aerospace, automotive and defense industries. Their applications can include the production of weapon hulls, aircraft parts, missile and drone components, and microelectronics.


>Such goods became the target of U.S. and EU sanctions in late 2023, making it more complicated and expensive for Russia to obtain them. However, new indications suggest that China may be stepping in to plug that gap.


>Chinese shipments to Russia of CNC tools have increased tenfold since the start of Moscow’s full-scale invasion of Ukraine, according to an FT analysis of Russian trade data released last week.


https://www.cnbc.com/2024/01/11/sanctioned-western-tech-is-still-entering-russia-and-powering-its-war.html
https://c4ads.org/reports/war-machine/

>>2105017
Kek I thought it was just him hiding out in Moscow. Did he bring his entire cabinet with him?

Wrt German industry getting rekt by US gas prices, this feels like just part of a wider effort since 2022 for the US to close ranks on its vassals in the face of this situation (de-dollarisation, multipolarity, attacking NATO interests, etc) because the illusion of freedom and choice for these nations depends on the US feeling little threat from any corner of the world which has now started to falter.

Germans therefore cannot be buying energy from anyone outside US influence, Sweden and Finland cannot claim to be neutral anymore and the UK electing a government that although really, REALLY isn't left-wing, it wasn't far-right, pro-US and pro-Israel enough to tolerate and hence Elon Musk, a-soon-to-be US official is actively trying to foment some kind of far-right coup via X.

Honestly, if there is some kind of European porky separatism at some point in the future, I think libs and NAFOids are going to need their own equivalent word for "tankie" as US tanks pour out of their European bases Prague Spring style.

>>2105380
yankee tankie

>>2105381
I suspect the term will come out of whatever the US claims it actions are, because when there's tanks on the streets of Hungary again, you know the explanation for why it's totally different and justified this time will be insane(ly funny).

<The Ukrainian Armed Forces report that Russia has already lost 800,010 soldiers since the start of the invasion, according to the newspaper Ukrainska Pravda.
https://www.pravda.com.ua/eng/news/2025/01/7/7492332/

<This number includes both the dead and the wounded.


<In the past 24 hours, Russia has lost 1,970 soldiers, according to Ukraine.


<The figures provided by Ukraine cannot be independently verified. The United States estimates Russia's losses in October to be about 600,000 soldiers, both dead and wounded, according to The New York Times.


https://www.nytimes.com/2024/10/10/us/politics/russia-casualties-ukraine-war.html

>>2105409
>Ukrainian Armed Forces report
>The United States estimates
Yawn.

Just look at the mediazona one you tard, it's the most accurate.

>>2105371
There was a video from an ammo plant in Russia, that used an Austrian metalwork machine. It was clean, white factory, with shells on conveyors and such

Then there was a video from a factory that was American pride or something. It was all gray-brown-green and rusty, it featured the same type of a metalwork machine, and shells were worked on by hand, lol

>>2105409
so what they really mean is Ukraine lost 800,000 soldiers. ok

Someone replace this with Zelensky or Biden.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hominidae#Behavior

>>2105456
not even pages about primates are free from NATO propaganda, wikipedia is so shit it's actually unreal

>>2105456
George W Bush, Trump, or Obama would be funnier.

>>2105435
When I heard they were scrambling to rehire retired munitions workers because they were the only ones who knew how to make the weapons required, in an age where both Russia and China have invested heavily in automation, other manufacturing industries have invested heavily in automation and the US is building shit by hand in a factory you'd be hard pressed to find in the DPRK that matches its decrepitation, it was obvious they're NGMI.

>>2105435
Post them

>>2105456
>We are winning on Wikipedia

>>2105499
The most important fight. Who cares if enemy was the one to win, if later generations will think that it's you who have won. Just look at Finland

winning


whoever post RT stuff, in threads about the Ukrainian-Russian war, is megaretard and should be banned…It like posting the Völkischer Beobachter to discuss whats happening during WW2.

Ahem…one of my pet peeves is when Twitter users I follow decide to reply personally to 500 people to return one-line greetings/thanks/wishes.

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>>2105134
porky have become global
europorkies dont really care about national industry and wealth anymore, because their capital is largely invested abroad now, and their local stock market is similarly dominated by foreign capital, so the country can crumble for all they care, their interests arent local anymore, they will just move their investment elsewhere
and apparently, ramblings about immigration are enough to be seen as an "alternative" and people are fine with getting fucked as long there's a scapegoat more fucked than them

It annoys me because I like reading people's Tweets & Replies feed for geopolitical commentary, and because of their damn return greetings, I have to scroll through hundreds of that shit.

>>2105640
Tf does this have to do with Z?

>>2105654
Russian Orthodox Christmas.

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>>2105655
Fair enough I guess. Do they use any gifs like this?

>>2105641
>porky have become global
ultimately the reason the west is both in conflict with russia (and china) yet losing to both

>>2105666
I haven't seen gifs like that, but I will say I'm mad that you got the Satan digits and I didn't.

>even in death the ukrop has to do the salute

From Kursk today.

>@leonidragozin
<Arestovych says that in 2.5 years he spent in Zelensky’s
<administration he hasn’t witnessed a single internal discussion
<conducted in Ukrainian - everything was in Russian. He was
<commenting on Zelensky’s refusing to speak Russian to Lex
<Fridman
Bazzed Agent Z.

>>2105639
>posting anti-nazi news is like posting pro-nazi news

>>2105100
>Russia is outproducing all of NATO and the U.S in terms of ammunition, rockets, and tanks
So NATO out produces Russia in all of the rest
>>2105099
>Russia has such a vast advantage in material over the AFU
As evidenced by the three villages they took last year

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>>2105703
>the anti nazi news

>>2105734
>dugin is a nazi
actual retard
>>2105730
>NATO out produces Russia in categories irrelevant to conventional war
also hopelessly retarded

bakhmut status?

>>2105734
Because as we all know, Nazism is when Russia has sovereignty and Nazis are huge advocates for the Russian nation and its people

>>2105743
yea but we need newspeak definitions of nazi so we can pretend the west is still fighting them. it's what neocons do

>>2105743
>The Holy Russian State has a right to secure resources and land from small and historically underdeveloped peoples, like the Malorussians, or as the gay West calls them, Ukrainians.

>>2105738
>dugin is a nazi
He's definitely a fascist.

>>2105759
Not all fascists are nazis. Communists can tactically cooperate with fascists, but not with nazis.

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>>2105734
Rasputin-ass

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>>2105761
>Communists can tactically cooperate with fascists
Come the fuck on man.

>>2105761
nice false flag kek
>>2105759
he's not a fascist either, he's a classic reactionary.

>>2105784
>he's not a fascist either, he's a classic reactionary
Distinction without a difference. Somehow I don't think it mattered to an Argentine trade unionist rotting in a ditch that their military junta was actually a classical conservative regime and not fascist per se or whatever. All anti-communist autocracies and those who advocate for them are fascist in practice.

>>2105787
if class struggle has polarized society, yea, the distinction means little. but this is looking at it in a very specific historical conflict where frankly even liberals and, if you're stalin, social democrats are on one side.

in the greater sum of history, dugin's ideas are nothing new and much more typical of the reactionary right that long defined it, well before socialist class struggle or capitalist modernity altogether. this is why these forces lost to fascists, such as in germany. if you consider dugin a fascist you're going to be confused why he's lumping together fascism, liberalism, and marxism in ramblings about modernism and how anti-human these ideologies are. this is very typical of a conservative reactionary.

these mistakes are related to why the left misdiagnosed neoconservatism as fascist due to leo strauss, although granted he actually had an idea of rebirth from decay via war.

>>2105703
>Capitalist state news being anti-nazi

Gulag yourself

>>2105805
>if you consider dugin a fascist you're going to be confused why he's lumping together fascism, liberalism, and marxism in ramblings about modernism and how anti-human these ideologies are
Evola said similar shit but I see no reason to distinguish him from other fascists.

>>2105734
>literally innocent talking points from a conference
>>2105757
>[it's about] resources and land
Have you been living under a rock the last decade?
>>2105764
Dugin is completely irrelevant to Kremlin policy making, fyi.
>>2105809
>all capitalism is nazism
oh, child

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>>2105809
>Capitalist news
i sleep
>STATE NEWS
REAL SHIT

>>2105703
>heckin nazerinos everywhere
easy with the estrogen senpai.

>>2105835
>>heckin nazerinos everywhere
me when i'm inside the ukraine and look at any direction

>>2105811
>Evola said similar shit but I see no reason to distinguish him from other fascists.

evola is another example to me, in fact he's key to how i read dugin, due his views of regressive devolution of the modern state, and restoration of some premodern caste system associated with theocracies and ancient empires rather than the state's rebirth through national supremacy and war. he didn't even believe in the nation-state, let alone its 'organic' corporatism, although it suggests similar views about the materialism of modernity. Fascists believed they represented democracy's transformation into Caesarism, a revolution against the revolution, conservative reactionaries like Evola believed in no such process. They didn't believe in historical progress at all and saw modernity, fascism and its mass politics included, as built on a bubble.

for the record liberal thinkers analyzing fascism like hannah arendt or jeffrey herf recognize the distinction i'm making and a popular way to see fascism is as 'reactionary modernism', essentially a synthesis meaning using the tools of modernity against itself (thus the syncretism unique to fascism), which is definitely not evola or dugin. these people are not interested in modern states at all.

in short, fascism is modernity's 'dark twin' found uniquely in a few places in the world, whereas reactionaries stretch across history and place, commonly representing regression to the mean of history and its short chapter of modernity.

missing these distinctions has a couple key issues including as it relates to the ukraine conflict
1. while this is nitpicking, you're not critiquing the bourgeois state and how it relates to history fully, therefore not completely understanding its crises. in party tactics this distinction means little because you club both, in writing that has to compete with other writings rigor is needed
2. you're missing why conservatives and nazis in ukraine do not fully align and why the threat of a third maidan came from the latter. when ukraine became an international training hub of the far-right, it was a kind of racial nationalism at work that is pretty distinct from the more basic euronationalist decommunizing politics of the west ukrainian conservatives. the west's primary reliance on the latter allows it to operate indirectly with ukraine's nazis with plausible deniability.
3. you're missing how europe put itself in a contradictory position of arguing russia simultaneously cannot become a european nation-state, in fact is a separate (mixed) race altogether, yet also practices a form of european racial supremacism (nazism) defined explicitly in contrast to russians (in ways that echo these views of russia as unable to form a european nation-state). the proof of this being dugin, a figure long overrelied on in an incoherent infowar that emerges after 2014 and now scrambles western internal politics

https://www.nakedcapitalism.com/2025/01/who-benefits-from-russias-war-in-ukraine.html
<Who Benefits from Russia’s War in Ukraine

>Yves here. This piece is a useful addition to understanding the practical effects of the war in Ukraine, as in who gained economically. The study determined that the sanctions were a big backfire in terms of one of the expressed intents, that of punishing the politically most influential Russians, presumed to consist largely of the very rich, so the would revolt against Putin. Instead, many made out well by being able to acquire Western operations at bargain prices, such as brand name franchises, and launch Russian clones using those assets. Indeed, a few are allegedly more successful than the former enterprises. The Russian McDonald’s successor Vkusno i tochka (which per machine translation means “Delicious and that’s it”) apparently has better tasting food (and perhaps also an improved menu). It also acknowledges that demand within Russia has increased since the war started, again favoring top businessmen.


>Mind you, that does not mean some high income Russians were not hurt by the sanctions. But my impression (and readers can correct me) are the ones hardest hit were professionals and small businesses that had strong ties to Europe, such as in had European clients or advised on Russia-Western business operations. This cohort would presumably be the most European-leaning of the Russian middle class. That group had long been problematic for Putin, since it was large enough for Putin to need its support. It was also generally Western-leaning (aspirational shopping, travel, and the Russian tendency to see itself as behind the West and its educated classes to see familiarity with European art and literature as a proof of being cultured). So having the most diehard Europe loyalists decamp to Europe and others witness the rabid outbreak of hostility to Russia across the US and Europe (such as barring Russian athletes and artists from performing) was another shock that worked in Putin’s favor.

>>2105814
>>2105819

Alright, you did you stupid meme thing. Now please, refrain from posting Russian state news on the topic of how Ukraine is losing. It's like watching CNN news on how the US is spreading democracy or Kievpost on how Ukraine is winning. It is plain stupid, you look like and idiot and its like shitting the thread. thank you for your understanding.

>>2105943
We would be posting Ukrainian newspapers if they had a track record of being good enough sources of information. DeepState is, in fact, in the OP and people use it despite the obvious bias because it still tracks close enough to reality to be useful. Most other Ukrainian sources are far too invested into being wartime propaganda to be useful while the Russian state is content to keep it to talk shows and maintain separate channels for more serious news. That is only reasonable given the massive disparity between the ways Ukraine and Russia engage in this conflict.

>>2105814
>Dugin is completely irrelevant to Kremlin policy making, fyi.
That's why he is Rasputin-ass, and not Rasputin-like

>>2105943
>Now please, refrain from posting Russian state news
nope

>>2105761
>pleae commies tactically operate with me!!!
no. also Dugin is a Karl Schmidt enthusiast he's definitely a nazi

>>2106009
But he's Russian, Russians are genetically predisposed to be anti-Nazi

There are people here that unironically support the russian and Cucktin?

>>2106014
The majority, yes.

>>2105761
The zigger to fash enabler pipeline is real

>>2106025
>The zigger to fash enabler pipeline is real
found the guy using my flag

>>2105761
You are actually right. To bad the retards on this board will not agree to truth when it shoots them in the head. I for one agree to cooperate with fascist comrades against nazis.
Whos with me?

>>2106028
🏳️‍⚧️ ?


#justiceforintbrig

>>2106019
Why would people support a invasion of a peaceful country, beside no one is forcing entering NATO, they go willing, from my POV Russia is plain bad.

>>2106043
>a peaceful country
<Ukraine

File: 1736281232166.jpg (20.96 KB, 676x142, no.jpg)

>this is who we are allying with
https://i.4pcdn.org/pol/1736276415849959.png

>>2106043
>beside no one is forcing entering NATO, they go willing
Oof.

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>>2106043
NATO is the literal fourth reich, and you are an anti communist if you support anyone associated with them.

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>>2106046
who's "we"? those people are mostly fighting on the side of ukraine

>>2106043
NATO expansion (and relatedly regime change in Russia) was just a bandaid fix for postwar international systems failing to expand to post communist areas. Same story as Yugoslavia. That's fundamentally why the Ukraine crisis, while having a heaping dose of hubris, was not necessarily driven by malice. The West had no choice but to expand NATO as the international order frayed in the former USSR. They just never connected this decay to the transition to capitalism, they doubled down on it by blaming Russia and communism i.e. the echo of it undermining the spread of the postwar international system rather than it undoing itself and the West effectively trying to enforce it by the sword.

>>2106059
Also this effectively meant resuming the cold war in the former USSR, in the multiethnic borderland of Ukraine of all places which is heavily defined by the Soviet nationalities policy

Also membership in NATO isn't "voluntary" or "willing". Out of 32 members of NATO, 5 had referendums on joining it. It's usually a matter of having an unaccountable pro-atlanticist elite seize control of your country and then ram it into NATO. Ukraine's de facto alignment with NATO was especially not "willing": it required a coup by a minority, split the country in two and sparked a civil war.

>>2106067
Trust the experts.

>>2106067
A good rule of thumb is if European great powers rely on American security so they don't fight each other and therefore lack sovereignty, poor post communist states have even less say in European security.

>>2106067
This, imagine thinking Ukrainians getting kidnapped to be slaughtered wholesale after being sent untrained to the front to NOT join NATO, but with massive verbal encouragement to continue anyway by its constituent members because it protects their freedom and democracy when Russian soldiers die, suggests anything about this situation was voluntary on the behalf of the average Ukrainian.

>>2105734
>Latin America is no longer western colonies but rising giants
lol, lmao even
if you're latino country isn't gigacucked to american interests then it's under siege (and losing)

>>2106059


I wonder what it'll be like if a Thanos AI voice read intbrig's posts.


>>2106059
Why are you saying this to someone who clearly doesn't understand the supposedly Marxist meaning behind what you say and will fall back on the popular liberal nationalist definitions? Not one of the nerds, so to speak.

>>2106043
Read any American book on foreign policy and grow up lmao. Ukraine is almost entirely a vehicle for regime change in Russia, which is why the maidan regime is so ready to run the country into the ground instead of taking previous agreements that even fucking allowed for talks about giving Crimea to Ukraine in the future (insane cuckoldry on Putin's part).

Imagine exchanging this banger for some gay little poem about dying

>>2106165
Over the past 35 years has been non stop victory for the US, I once talked to a serb, who told me that the government of the republic of yugoslavia, was willing
to do everything the US told it, if only they were allowed to keep serb majority areas. During the 1990s, the whole world bowed to the US, NATO was bombing even when Lukashenko was there, and almost downed his plane. Milosevic was depressed because he knew no one could stand up to the US, and there would be no fair trial if the US didn't want it.

>>2106181
But hey! Gorbachev and his ilk really owned those Stalinists.

>>2106181
>NATO was bombing even when Lukashenko was there, and almost downed his plane
Real footage of Bat'ka Lukashenko dealing with US special forces in Serbia

>>2104331
I know who these people are, but what is the context?

>>2106197
Milchakov is a nazi, Alautdinov is a faithful muslim chechen, they met for a recorded talk where they didn't seem to overtly antagonize each other and basically said "fuck it one struggle". It's a little funny.

>>2106043
>no one is forcing entering NATO
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Category:NATO_membership_referendums

dont look up where euro politicians went to school

>>2106188
https://youtu.be/l0P4IZ_HyE4?si=BQv8VL4wIZcGA3Ko >>2106183
The collapse of the USSR was terrible for people in the west, since it ushered the creation of an orwellian society in the west, fueled by hubris from victory, and a sense of moral superiority, they (western elites)decided they were better not only than other countries, but than their citizens, abandoned whatever was good about the west, and creating a double speak/political correctness, justified by that.

File: 1736291431645.mp4 (2.05 MB, 360x640, videoplayback.mp4)

all of them seem expensive

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Speaking of Dugin, why is this shit on my youtube recommended?

>>2106311
What's the problem. Dugin and Haz are based. Enjoy.

>>2106315
>I take streamers seriously

>>2106318
He has a party you know. He is doing more than most.


>>2106264
Against cheap FPV:s only electronic warfare is really cost effective.

>>2106264
net launchers aren't all that expensive and jamming can be as simple as blasting them with broad-band EMF.
dunno about GPS jammers. Lasers are just used for a number of point defenses anyway.
There's also the shotgun method.

>>2106315
Based on fantasy yes we know

>>2106043
it's where my country's neo-nazis were trained, it's literally the mecca of nazism for scum all around the globe
death to cuckraine, no ifs and buts

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Misposted in wrong thread.
MULTI KILL

<Music

>Sometimes I like to pretend I'm playing Metal Gear

>>2106264
>>2106335
>>2106427
This thread had some interesting info on drones.

https://archive.4plebs.org/pol/thread/493095754/#q493104484
>About the drones.
>1. I use a drone detector and just hide in cover (bushes, trenches, etc.) when it starts beeping.
>2. We work only at night and only in pairs.
>3. I have a raincoat that hides the heat.
>4. Mavics are easy to shoot down with a machine gun. There are muzzle brakes on Kalashnikovs, so that the bullet breaks into fragments and it is easier to hit the drones.


>>2106527
>MULTI KILL
<shooting one guy surrendering and another fleeing
meh, not thrilled about this shit

>thread

<not even a timestamp proof

https://archive.is/9XyMQ

>The next few weeks will determine whether Ukraine can continue to exist as a sovereign state within its preinvasion borders, or close to them, with full security guarantees for its citizens — or whether Russian President Vladimir Putin will be rewarded and emboldened in his war of territorial expansion.


>Ukraine is also losing troops at a rate far beyond what it can sustain and continue fighting. The official casualty estimate of 400,000 killed or wounded is considered a vast undercount. Thousands of exhausted Ukrainian soldiers are deserting the front lines.


>Ukraine can hardly survive another year of this devastating war. But the haste to find a negotiated settlement could produce a bad one that would reward Mr. Putin for his land grab and guarantee he will launch a new attack for more territory once he has a chance to rebuild his depleted arsenal. A poor settlement would also leave Ukrainians bitter after seeing their homes, schools and factories destroyed, and friends and family members killed. Much of their anger would be directed at the Western backers who betrayed them. This is a fight America, and Ukraine, cannot lose, especially with a bad deal.

>>2106627
>meh, not thrilled about this shit
I don't recall asking how you are feeling right now, but thanks for letting me know.

>>2106651
why are there so many videos of 1v3, 2v1, 1v1? Do Slavs not know how to do military tactics?

legitimately feels like only like 1% of the army is even fighting the rest are shooting up heroin in a foxhole somewhere

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>>2106699
>legitimately feels like only like 1% of the army is even fighting the rest are shooting up heroin in a foxhole somewhere
That's how it is at every job. That's how this midget killed 240 Krauts.

>>2106527
Salty slovenian kek

>>2106699
>why are there so many videos of 1v3, 2v1, 1v1? Do Slavs not know how to do military tactics?
No, I don't think it's that, they adapted for this kind of war, as there are so many drones flying around, larger groups are easier to spot, and once they get spotted they all die. Better to go in small groups to try and rush a position really fast, or by using motorcycles, like motorized World War I stormtroopers.

>>2105811
>Evola said similar shit but I see no reason to distinguish him from other fascists.
>>2105903
>for the record liberal thinkers analyzing fascism like hannah arendt or jeffrey herf recognize the distinction i'm making and a popular way to see fascism is as 'reactionary modernism', essentially a synthesis meaning using the tools of modernity against itself (thus the syncretism unique to fascism), which is definitely not evola or dugin. these people are not interested in modern states at all.
I think it's splitting over hairs. But yes I think you're right to see similarities between Dugin and Evola. And doesn't Dugin draw heavily from Evola in his own philosophy? Evola was a Dadaist who didn't like rationalist and materialist bourgeois culture, but he never joined the fascist party in Italy and didn't like its statist qualities. I read he didn't place much emphasis on biological racism either (unlike the Nazis) but rather placed the emphasis on spirituality and culture. He was appreciated by radical fascists and Nazis in both Italy and Germany though, and it goes without saying he has had a lot of influence on post-war neofascists, radical rightists, etc.

With Dugin he'll say something like, science is bad, everything went to hell with Galileo and Isaac Newton… scum… they should've burned in the fires of the Inquisition. The theory of gravity is a vile Anglo-Saxon invention *stormy applause from the St. Petersburg International Economic Forum*

>>2106637
>Russian President Vladimir Putin will be rewarded and emboldened in his war of territorial expansion.
They still try to push this narrative huh

>>2106754
It's what happens to lines drawn in sand.

>>2106754
It's a funny way of saying
>we crossed a red line in pursuit of regime change in Russia and losing means the end of both, which signals another nail in the coffin for liberal imperialism

>>2106780
>>2106754
>if Ukraine loses, Putin will be emboldened and rewarded for bad behaviour!
<meanwhile Trump on Panama, Canada, Greenland:

>>2106788
>haha fuck yeah, democracy expands!

>>2106704
He was great in Beverly Hills Cop

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>>2106788
Reversed USSR

>>2106803
Canada is a fake country, anyway

>>2106803
Also, remember how libs have claimed that Russia started warring Ukraine only because of internal crisis, and that tyrannies always attack neighbors for land when they can't solve their own problems? So fucking funny that Trump just like waltzes into the office and immediately declares plans for Canada and Greenland

>>2106699
>legitimately feels like only like 1% of the army is even fighting the rest are shooting up heroin in a foxhole somewhere
This is how war largely is. Most men will do the bare minimum to defend themselves. Some "big men" will actually attack to kill and carry out heroics. Some of those know how to inspire others to attack and kill. This is why nobility forms out of groups of armed men cowing civilians into paying for protection.


>>2106806
It's quite disappointing that libs won't ever see the irony here since they see the west as inherently superior on a fundamental level. They won't stop to think that for a second even with the seething about orange man. Rules are for thee, not for me.

canada belongs to the US anyway, it only doesn't due to royalist holdouts :)

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The second Kursk attack already failing, Events In Ukraine is going to do a post about it on his Substack tomorrow

>>2106831
Glory to King George!

>>2106788
Nah, not the same. Even to me. Libs raised a stink about militarily redrawing country borders. So you're better off comparing with Israel.

>UN Charter

>Chapter I
>Article 2
>4. All Members shall refrain in their international relations from the threat or use of force against the territorial integrity or political independence of any state, or in any other manner inconsistent with the Purposes of the United Nations.
You can argue over those referendums freely, but it's clear that between International Court and UN, the liberal world order is kind of eating shit right now.

>>2106803
America would get away with it while certain "multipolar" countries just go to the UN (on American soil, remember) and whine about hypocrisy or some such, as they usually do with their 19th-century info capabilities.

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Russians have gotten noticeably closer to Sudzha while the the Ukrainians' offensive to the northeast of it is going nowhere lol.

>>2106637
All noise. If anything, Trump is going to try ramping up aid to the Zelensky regime, allowing Moscow swarms, etc. He's not afraid of Putin's wagging finger and sees him as a bluffing buffoon, so all that remains to be seen is whether Ukraine's antics fail as badly as they have so far.

>>2106843
Well, yeah. But they're America. They're the hegemon. The sole hegemon. They make the rules, and they break them at their leisure, and the rest can cope and seethe. That's why they can support ICC against Russia, and threaten it against Israel. All while not recognizing its authority at all and threatening it with invasion, if Americans get tried.

But when someone else does it. Explicitly against America. And gets away with it. Exposing the "hard power" behind this "soft power" to be fallible. That's when others start to smell blood in the water.

>>2106850
>He's not afraid of Putin's wagging finger and sees him as a bluffing buffoon
Nah, Trump wants to be friends. Trump is a massive bluffer and respects the game. He doesn't want to appear weak though so unfortunately the libtard fantasy of Trump just abandoning Ukraine on Jan 20th won't happen.

I'd say at least six months of the US trying to push Ukraine forward and then Trump will call it. Any plan to axe Iran could shorten that time frame.

>>2106855
>Nah, Trump wants to be friends.
lol

>Trump has to be another DC warmonger so he doesn't appear weak and let the deep state win
>Art of the (Ghostwritten) Deal
That will be the MAGA cope for four years as Trump rides roughshod over the globe.

>>2106859
The man went to the DMZ to play handsy with Kim Jong Un. He admires "tough men", but has to do his own America First tough man schtick.

>>2106861
I'd prefer Trump over someone competent, desu. With what artillery shells, anyway? Dumbass will probably get a carrier sunk by Houthis.

>>2106863
Kim is tough, tho. Same with Xi.
Or, at least, they aren't observably weak.

>>2106832
>The second Kursk attack already failing
Correct, and it doesn't matter. Trump doesn't care about such operational details. All he's going to do is ask himself whether he'd allow an adversary to sit around with > 50,000 troops in Texas for over half a year. He's going to convince himself that Putin has become soft and conduct American foreign policy accordingly.

Trump will just sign what his subordinates give him lmao, he is senile and famously didn't spend much time at the white house at all the previous term.

File: 1736327175051.jpeg (17.57 KB, 480x270, IMG_4087.jpeg)

>WAIT FOR TRUMPOVSKY, WAIT FOR TR-AAAAAAAAAACK!! 🥶🥶🥶🥶🥶🥶🥶

>>2106651
His feelings are VALID and HEARD, you ugly ugly troglodyte!

Downvoted 👎

uh oh new Wait For Trump fuel dropped
>Trump says he understands Russia's feelings on Ukraine's inadmissibility of joining NATO

>>2106859
kek
>Russia in the 60s:
<Ha you place missiles in Turkey? Watch us place nukes in Cuba bitch
>Russia in the 21st century:
<p-p-please save us incoming American president :(
I support multipolarity and ziggerism because watching other nations constantly cucking to America is embarrassing for everyone.

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>>2106751
>Evola was a Dadaist
Man, his paintings sucked.

>>2106890
They usually trot him out with that fuel when Ukraine is about to do something escalatory. Then the Kremlincucks protest that the Biden adminisration is trying to thwart the efforts of MUH TRUMP.
Less than two weeks of this coy nonsense remaining.

>>2106890
>be drumpf
>deepthroat both Putler and Xi at the same time
>threaten to invade closest allies like Canada and Denmark
Multipolariat bros… you won.

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>>2106863
>The man went to the DMZ to play handsy with Kim Jong Un. He admires "tough men", but has to do his own America First tough man schtick.
Trump is full of empty promises and is transactional in nature. He told Kim he'd relieve sanctions if he gave up his nukes, which was the same bargain the U.S. made with Gaddafi to close down his nuclear program, so Kim walked out.

>>2106905
Obama made pretty much the same offer. Except he only sent a CIA flunky instead of going to the DMZ.

Yeah it is idiotic to take Trump at face value but anyone who thinks he is just doing exactly what the deep state want is even more of an idiot.

>>2106918
>anyone who thinks he is just doing exactly what the deep state want is even more of an idiot.
/ukr/ + /chug/ horseshoe was a mistake.

Ahahhahahaha

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>>2106934
Last I checked Greenland was in America not Europe. That's it. I'm 110% behind this war if it means we get to kill French people. The Krauts were too soft on them. The fact that they've been one of our longest standing allies is our greatest shame. We should've fought with the Vietnamese against the French.


Ukrainian mercenaries captured in Venezuela – Maduro
On Tuesday, Maduro said that the group included two Colombian hitmen captured “in different places” as well as “three mercenaries who came from Ukraine, from the war in Ukraine, to bring violence to the country.” Caracas also arrested two “very high level” US citizens, he added, later describing them as “two important mercenaries.”

According to Maduro, those arrested had planned “to carry out attacks on the leaders of the revolution,” employing the rhetoric of Bolivarian socialism popularized by his predecessor Hugo Chavez.
https://swentr.site/news/610573-ukrainian-mercenaries-captured-venezuela/

Broken arms and cocked guns: Ukraine’s forced mobilization escalates (VIDEOS)
One soldier is seen kicking the man multiple times in the knee. After a severe beating, the draftee ends up in the vehicle, and his further fate is unknown. Responding to a public outcry, the local recruitment office claimed the man was eligible for mobilization but did not have any ID documents. The military said it tried to take the would-be conscript to the local recruitment office, but he refused and lashed out at the officers, leading to a clash. The office also said those involved in the encounter have been suspended.

Another clip released on Sunday shows the moment Ukrainian recruiters attempted to arrest a man in Kamenets-Podolsky, in western Ukraine, reportedly breaking his arm in the process. The video features an officer sitting on top of a struggling man, while two policemen stand nearby. The man cries out in pain and says “My arm!”

A similar incident took place on Tuesday in the central Ukrainian city of Dnepr, where recruiters attempted to arrest a 45-year-old man at a train station. According to Ukrainian officials, the would-be conscript refused to show his ID papers and pulled out a knife, injuring a service member and a police officer.

Another encounter took place in the port city of Odessa, where a civilian armed with a knife was seen attempting to chase away two service members. It is unclear how the encounter ended.
https://swentr.site/russia/610567-ukraine-mobilization-violence-escalation/

>>2106939
Where is he hiding? I remember listening of what he was doing every day, his plans, his efforts etc and suddenly he stopped doing stuff.

>>2106948
they stopped pumping meds into him to keep him talking, they're saving it for the next corpse with trump

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>>2106948
he's just having a good time while he shits things up for trump. he doesnt give a fuck anymore.

>>2106850
Why would Trump bother with Ukraine when he can troll Canada, Greenland and Panama?

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Oh god please make it stop. Russians made a drone to carry an anti-tank mine

>>2106991
oh god… i'm gonna… i'm gonna… I'M DROOOONING AAAAAHHH

Look who found a new job.

>>2106984
As putin said Israel has a right to defend itself

>>2107013
>McCain
>Kissinger
Perhaps she'll win the Victoria Nuland award for her loyal service to the institute


>>2107013
this is massively discrediting

>>2106890
im pretty sure the russians see trump like they see erdogan, unstable and unpredictable. only point in talking to him is due to rigidity of the international system and its blindspots for latter day issues beyond the core of europe

>>2107039
To who? Her supporters don't think the US and any of its think tanks and non-profits are capable of regime change, they merely just help people in other nations achieve what everyone obviously wants which is to integrate with the US, so taking a position with this particular institute is surely a logical move.

>>2106934
i apologize to euros for my presidents

>>2107043
it's more evidence to the world that the issue is georgia was not a pro-russian tilt of its non-aligned government. yanukovych was successfully labeled post-hoc as a pro russian dictator, kind of hard to do that when an isolated president has such extensive ties to france and america while relying on protests that lack momentum.

with europe so blatantly meddling in georgia, it undermines the balancing act it's engaging in between geopolitics and its philanthropy of human development/pro-democracy reform initiatives, exposing the weaponization of soft power rather than its natural rise and displacement of old, rigid regimes. i was stuck reading a paper about how this balancing act is being strained in the wake of covid, alienating partners in africa who in turn see the EU as not capable of being inclusive

Rosrezerv oil storage status?

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>>2107070
You tell us. I'm not fluent in current NAFO fantasies

>>2106938
You're still my American prole buddy monsieur, you can slaughter the French bourgeoisie with me though

>>2107070
Did hohol terrorists blow up another 2 barrels of oil and pretend that's a lot?

>>2107070
Kek they're completely reduced to asymmetric war cope
Donbass and Kursk status? 🤔

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>>2107085
>2 barrels of oil
what loosing two barrels of oil does to a gas station with nukes

>>2107141
>Ukraine caused $3.2b gazprom losses
citation needed

>>2107013
She has crazy eyes and looks possessed. I'm scared of her now.

>>2107320
>when she gives you the neoliberal stare

>>2106934
>Macron desperate to boost his approval ratings
>Pledges to defend Greenland with military force if Trump invades
>Trump invades since he thinks Macron is bluffing
>Macron detonates a nuke hidden on Greenland days before the inauguration in order to counter the American forces
>JVPITER becomes eternal president of France
>EU collapses anyways because no cheap Russian gas + now the Americans stop exporting LNG since they're mad at Macron
Please it would be so funny

>>2107440
The French gave America freedom
And they can take it away

>>2107440
I remember in early 2024, someone on youtube claimed germany's economic problems were temporary,
and it would soon return to stronger growth than pre-covid, while Russia would just "fall along the way".
https://tradingeconomics.com/germany/manufacturing-pmi , https://tradingeconomics.com/germany/factory-orders , https://tradingeconomics.com/germany/construction-pmi , https://tradingeconomics.com/germany/industrial-production-mom

>>2106938
>Last I checked Greenland was in America not Europe.
It’s an overseas dependency of Denmark or something like that. Iirc it’s not fully independent.

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So is Trump just trying to boost his popularity with clay acquisition or is he doing some big brained global warming real estate securing?

>>2107563
He’s trying to get the chuds hooting. That’s it.

Ukraine is Molvania.


How come these holopiggies searching for and seizing draft dodgers don’t go and fight at the front?

>>2107606
If they fail to provide an offering regularly, they will be the offering.

>>2107585
That's just every Butthurt Belt state

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>>2107563
>big brained global warming real estate securing
was thinking this. we will know for sure if he starts talking about nuclear icebreakers.

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Well, at least some of the libs are consistent

>>2104577
>that calm ass reaction after they saw one of their own or even a relative/friend get leg status’d
Zionists are fucking robots

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War Winners are out there, let congratulate on their's success.

>>2107881
The Ukranian should be restored to the orange territory, hundreds millions Ukranians packed together like dogs, die off quickly as punishment

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>>2107887
Congratulations and success on future endeavors.

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>>2107909
herded into the containment zone and nuked, hoholland being irradiated for the next 400 years.

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>>2107887
What a genius.

>>2107957
Average post russiagate liberal kek

>>2105272
remember watching that too. Lovely stuff

>>2105738
sorry intanon but Dugin IS a retard

hes a schizo, yes he has some ok takes (the naval vs land states but even that is propably a copy of Goebbels ideology) but he unironically believes in reptile men and all that stuff. Theres a reason he wasnt on free foot in the USSR
Thing about Dugin is that nobody in Russia cared. His name was mentioned so often from the outside that ony then some rightoid losers started to think about him. Hes completely manufatured by US & EU media.

I say that as somebody who continued to support the Russian war effort even when it was at its absolute low in terms of popularity. Lost my best friend to that and his zionism. Im neither traitor nor a fed. But sometimes the domestic view from inside of Russia helps sorting things, especially with Dugin.

If you want to have somebody whos edgy but also incredibly funny, read about Zhirinovsky

>>2107977
>but even that is propably a copy of Goebbels ideology
that's just hearthland theory

>>2107977
>Lost my best friend to that and his zionism
kek what happened? You mention you support Hamas one day and he flipped out on you and started yelling about the goyim?

>>2107977
>Zhirinovsky
Wasn't he one of those nationalist retards shouting about how Russia could take Ukraine in a week? Unfortunate that he died before he could be exposed as a complete moron. Would have liked to see what copes he would have come up with.

>>2107985
Zhirinovsky predicted the SMO almost to the exact day, and said that it will go on into 2024-2025. He also predicted a new war in Palestine. Have some respect

>>2107988
Did he want to expel the Palestinians to Turkey tho

>>2107988
so it will end this year? did he predict what the outcome ?

>>2107991
he also wants to detonate a nuke so Istanbul sinks under a 10m high wave!

Hes from a Jewish family and a violent antisemite! Truly a man of many colors

And how can he be anti Ukraine when he wants to give them a much bigger land back?
> He wants to forcibly take back Alaska because it’ll be “a great place to keep the Ukranians.”

Its dialectics, brother

>>2107977
I think you're criticizing beliefs I don't have. I don't consider dugin relevant. We were sold that he is the court ideologist of putin and coordinating some international alt right network of Russian agents. In reality he's a arch reactionary crank who showed up on the radar of western intelligence because he visited donbass and Crimea in 2014 and blown up, like malofeev, into an infowar threat like malofeev despite lack of state connections

Zhirinovsky has long been more relevant and also was isolated in the state as de facto controlled opposition that made putin look like the sane choice

These are distractions from the real issue the West has. After medvedev and the Russian reset, putins voter based shifted to becoming more 'silent majority' i.e. based on rural, small town, provincial, and/or older vote. It reflected how russia was divided by globalization, especially after 08, due to incomplete integration into the neoliberal european order (which was informing wars and color revolutions elsewhere). This was associated with a shift from being the strongman of a liberalizing transition in 2000 to some sort of national conservative. It was seen as russias deep state turning against the West as it started to do under yeltsin and Yugoslavia. Conversely this division of russia was western leverage for influencing post putin succession

This is similar to the voter base of PiS, Brexit, Trump, etc. with a key difference, rejection of neoliberalism and embracing of state ownership rather than devolution + undermining western supremacy rather than reinforcing it. This is due to how it was divided by incomplete integration and blamed for globalization stalling in the former USSR, which is how Ukraine's crisis and derussification was read. Very much a semi periphery issue

Crimea and Russian spring then solidified this vote's dominance and putins high approval in the country. This deep state and the people were now completely in tune, to the point donbass seps were led by retired security and military officials going way ahead of their (because a large fraction of donbass was more militant than putin and Russians, wanting federalization or outright annexation)

Western meddling and carving up the region provoked popular Russian nationalism because it meant resuming the cold war insofar international capitalism stagnated. People like dugin barely factor into this, much bigger titans at work

>>2107998
n truth hes just a clown like most other Russian (or world wide) politicians but at least hes a funny clown!

>>2108000
youre very right then. I feel like i have to tell some of those ACP guys cause they think hes actually Putins Rasputin, which - like Zhirinovsky, but much less funny - is as you already say just theatre, spectacle.

I do have the feelings that the average Russian knows that much better than many Westerners, which are still glued to Netflix. I cant even show a good Mosfilm child movie with them cause they think its secretly implanting Stalinism into their brain. And those are - well, were - faux radical leftlib types.

The war sadly made some people true believes again. At least it feels like it. On the other side, but also sad cause it has costst the lives of so many 100 thousands: I think the war also showed both the state and the people how much more prestigious and ready-for-action the Soviet system was. Nobody is rly scared of Medvedev tweets, while Brezhnev just needed to raise an eyebrow and his red emergency telephone rings.

But sadly looking into the past, and i rly lost myself in it, does propably not bring us forward. I am just drowing in nostalgia to keep my humanity intact. Either way, nuff oversharing. Keep up he struggle of cause. It gets brighter once it was the darkest, hopefully.

>>2108002
>I cant even show a good Mosfilm child movie with them cause they think its secretly implanting Stalinism into their brain. And those are - well, were - faux radical leftlib types.

This sounds dystopic. Do they refuse because they don't like colors or because you are forceful with trying to share "the gospel" with them?

>Nobody is rly scared of Medvedev tweets, while Brezhnev just needed to raise an eyebrow and his red emergency telephone rings.

Soviet system was much like Chinese one today - every official word of any official's mouth, any tweet or any article, all of that is held as the word of the state. They aren't just stating their own opinion, they always state their country's official stance. Medvedev allows himself crazy talk because he isn't an official mouthpiece of the state. That's the difference

>>2108006
>This sounds dystopic. Do they refuse because they don't like colors or because you are forceful with trying to share "the gospel" with them?

It seven a Ukranian one, the one with the old dog and the wolf and helping each other out. You know

No they just watch Chernobyl and every other Netflix slop, they think everything out of Russia is Goebbels like state propaganda TV. Meanwhile thats what US media rly becomes.

I advise everbody to give this 10 min beauty a watch https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OF5vh7zFXKI

>>2108010
There's nothing openly communistic in that cartoon, lmao. The only valid reason I can think of to refuse is that it's aged

>>2108014
I know but people dont know cause we know the numbers and stuff, but for many younger people there was nothing but gulags and bread lines in the USSR. Its this thing we dont think about anymore cause were deprogrammed

https://gorbachev.rt.com/ ,
https://digitalarchive.wilsoncenter.org/document/chancellors-helmut-kohls-meeting-russian-president-yeltsin-thursday-21-november-1991
What if gorbachev had succeeded in creating the union of soviet sovereign republics ? What would it be like in the 21st century ?

>>2108079
>President Yeltsin says that there were about 6 million Russians in Ukraine who would be voting against Kravchuk in any case. The aim of these Russians was to join Russia. They prepared a referendum on the Crimea which was aimed at joining Russia. Moreover, the Russians in Donbas and in Kryvyi Rih declared that they did not want to live in independent Ukraine. One faced a dangerous nationalistic development and an adventure, fearing that it might turn into bloodshed.
even the drunkard understood

>>2108079
>>2108083
Six million strikes again

>>2108079
Like modern China but on decline

>>2108079
>>2108100
More like RF but bigger. Also, with islamists in Central Asia instead of merely Chechnya in the 90s

>>2108022
There will be a purge of the youngfags in the new USSR. Those retards are hopeless. Fuck them.

File: 1736442362449.jpg (425.96 KB, 1120x1600, Fancy Show.jpg)

>>2108079
A gigantic retardation. Basically Hunch's plan was to turn the country into Yugoslavia so in 2022 it would be russia fighting everyone instead of just ukraine. Decentralization doesn't work. Even russia today suffers from inherent autonomy in the non-russian parts of the country. Centralization with (only) cultural autonomy is the way to go. Decisions are made in the center but minorities can make their territory dress up however they want to.

There is a good show (kinda good, the authors had a pro-socialist outlook where the east germans call out the soviets for abandoning communism with the liberman reforms) called GDR (a non-pozzed version of Deutschland 83) where Gorbachev's stupidity and Shevernadze's treachery is exposed. Im happy there aren't breadline or supermarket scenes, everything tries to look legit, even tho its happening in 1989
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vM-e-vo4k6U
>picrel

File: 1736445734426.jpg (288.46 KB, 500x717, 989910.jpg)

>>2108140
So the nazification of Ukraine was unavoidable ? Wouldn't this new USSR limit American influence/nationalist party reach ? How much of a problem would the central Asian republics be for Russia ? wouldn't they be more developed and secular ?

>MSNBC channel host joked about Ukrainian war refugees "Are there any men in there? I think I only saw 1 man in there and 25 women, that is a lucky guy right there" & she burst out laughing after her colleague commented that almost all Ukrainian men died in the war.

>>2108180
It's over, tankies have taken over Western medias. The alliance of Trump, Xi and Putin must be fought or the West will be doomed by dictatorships, autocrats and redbrowns. (This is what most western eurotrots think btw)


File: 1736451359796.webm (1.24 MB, 640x360, 1735192954645-1.webm)


File: 1736455574805.gif (254.86 KB, 300x240, 1721333904610.gif)

>>2108222
Commemorating this solemn moment

>>2108180
How will Hohols deal with their massive sexpat problem after the war is over?

New post from Victoria nuland's husband at the shatlantic

<Trump Is Facing a Catastrophic Defeat in Ukraine


>If Ukraine falls, it will be hard to spin as anything but a debacle for the United States, and for its president.

>By Robert Kagan

https://www.theatlantic.com/international/archive/2025/01/trump-putin-ukraine-russia-war/681228/

>>2108300
are they really gonna try put the blame on fucking Trump of all people?

>>2108298
They won’t have any young women left anyway

>>2108339
Well SOMEONE has to be blamed

>>2108300
>Vice-president Elect J. D. Vance once said that he doesn’t care what happens to Ukraine. We will soon find out whether the American people share his indifference,

"What? Whokraine? Buddy, I can't even afford eggs."

File: 1736459606719.jpg (20.02 KB, 500x333, 1344397534012.jpg)

>>2108180
And for a brief moment, I actually felt sorry for the neo-nazis that want so badly to be "Western" they attempted genocide and suffer 90% casualty rates.

The bourgeois are not human.

>>2108079
He couldn’t have. After the disastrous economic reforms and the breaking of trust in the Communist party the loss of at least European SSRs was inevitable. Too many opportunists wanting to use independence to fill their pockets. If it wasn’t Yeltsin and co dismantling the USSR then it would have come after the first new elections.

This plan would be like the Nazis trying to reform industry when the Soviets had taken the Seelow heights.

>>2108111
Most analysts I've read , even pro-Russia ones, tell the same thing - the USSR was doomed no matter what. The economy was stagnant since the early 1980s, data fiddling, plus misallocation of resources, led to a "ghost economy" and shortage of many consumer goods, with tbh was never a strong point of the USSR, and unlike people here claim, Gorbachev's reforms were widely supported at first.
Even if the USSR survived into the 1990s, it's economy would continue to decline (both the collapse of oil prices, and the crisis started by the alcohol ban, showed it was deeply unhealthy) but even worse would be the civil war that would start, like it did in Tajikistan, but more widely spread, local militias vs central government/Moscow troops, which again would lead to economic damage and discontent.

>>2108173
The USSR having multiple SSRs leave was inevitable after about 1985 except if the KGB and army had backed the “hardliners”. They’d have had to kill so many people that something like the made up Tiananmen massacres would be forgotten by liberals.

>>2108382
>fake massacres of libs replaced with very real massacres of libs
Good.

>>2108378
No there was support for reform. Most of Gorbachevs were idiotic but he blamed the party and the new liberal press attacked critics of the reforms which worked for awhile. But those reforms sparked discontent and fuelled nationalists which lead to Gorbachevs clumsy crackdowns which lead directly to the events that dissolved the USSR.

>>2108385
Unfortunately many good proles would have been caught up. After cutting state orders 50% and blowing up the COMECON there was economic chaos and no leadership from the anti-Gorbachev faction.

The August coup faction were all Gorbachev's men. Either it was orchestrated at his request and he got cold feet, or they were trying to make him see the USSR was about to be destroyed.

>>2108000
Dugin blew up in the West originally around Georgia 2008. I can’t remember exactly but it might have even been late Chechnya war where it was clear the Russians weren’t going to let the US peck away at the RF.


>>2108079
It would have failed. Gorbachev was not the reformer needed in the 80s it was Andropov. If Andropov died in 1992 the reforms he enacted would've at least stabilized Russia,Central Asian SSRs and the Caucasus at minimum.

>>2108300
Cope. He'll just pin it all on Biden and everybody will agree because he'll be right.

>>2108608
Perhaps he would've held it back a good number of years, but was the prominence of Gorbachevs and Shevardnadzes not a sign that such rightism would have been victorious eventually? As far as I know, Andropov was most active against corruption and bureaucratism, which would've been helpful against the rhetoric of the rightists who claimed that it was only markets which could solve those problems, but even without that point the rightists were still in high positions and he wasn't targeting them.

File: 1736471004305.png (918.54 KB, 894x1928, 1736446721119.png)

>>2105759
LOL!
This is what ACTUAL fascists say about Dugin. Hint: they are not impressed

>>2108627
>Hitler killed the Strasserites therefore they weren't fascists

>>2108616
>but was the prominence of Gorbachevs and Shevardnadzes not a sign that such rightism would have been victorious eventually?
It wasn't because their cliques victory was not inevitable. Both Andropov and Chernenko were the old guard who wanted to do reforms. It was sheer luck that both died so quickly that Gorbachevs clique was able to gather support in the party. Andropov also did not want to purge the rightist yet in 1983 because of how close we were to nuclear war and how critical the situation was. From the American airline shot down to Lebanon, it was heightened tension and Reagan was a cold war crusader expanding the US military. Therefore, Andropov wanted to reform slowly as well to keep stability but its just tragic how everything went to shit

>>2108629
Strasserites also believed that bolshevism is inherently jewish, you retard. They were just more keen on nationalization than Hitler was
NO Strasserite under ANY condition would call his party a "traditional communist party funded on a system of bolshevik values". I repeat: NOBODY

>>2108632
Yeah man it's almost like fascists can hate and even kill each other and still be fascists. Dugin isn't any less of a fascist because he recognizes and incorporates Russia's religious and ethnic diversity. He's just very cleverly taking account of Russian conditions. He's a supporter if anti-communist autocracy.

>>2108616
>>2108630
My question is whether that country could be held together/survive, and what it would look like in the modern era and geopolitical order. whether or not it would be socialist/left isn't really important. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Union_of_Soviet_Sovereign_Republics

>>2108635
He CLEARLY says his party is a bolshevik party
He is not an anti communist, that is my point

>>2108641
No, he lays claim to Soviet strength as some kind of metaphysical expression of the Russian spirit. He retroactively writes it into his nationalist project. Tell me, where does he call for the abolition of classes and the state? For the proletariat to seize power and expropriate the bourgeoisie? Where does he endorse class struggle?

>>2108645
Have you seen the source in my image? Look at point 3 of his party declaration on wikipedia. He literally says it apparently. Communist. What else does communist mean?
Dugin is a real communist or at least pretends to be one. His influence is just so insignificant in Russia that it doesn't translate to actual policy

>>2108646
>He literally says it apparently. Communist.
He says it's a "traditionalist communist" party which is an oxymoron.
>What else does communist mean?
Whatever he wants it to since he's just making up bullshit. It's the same thing Hitler did with the word socialism.

>>2108646
Dugin thinks that the USSR was a "retvrn to tradition" in some regards (ie collectivism, rejection of western influence, following a grand narrative etc) but he doesn't think communism or diamat are sufficient on their own, just that Soviet communism reflected a part of the "Russian spirit". That's why his theory is called "the fourth political theory" and not "betterer communism".

>>2108645
Is the Bolivarian Republic Fascist? Was Green Libya fascist? It's a slippery slope to say Dugin is a fascist because he has not call for the abolition of classes and the state. This is more of a fair assessment >>2108655 than Dugin is a fascist and anti-communist

>>2108627
>actual German supremacist neonazis hate Dugin
>that means!
Shut up. Literally reactionaries are permanently five seconds away from eating each other.

>>2108180
seems to be fake:
original news segment: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-iX3w_3nEPM
laughing clip is about old people: https://youtu.be/7exfGOzheB8?si=Vv75NLyCOCm96jjG&t=194

>>2107977
>the naval vs land states but even that is propably a copy of Goebbels ideology
It apparently (?) traces back to the British geostrategist Halford Mackinder's "heartland theory" and some say the Nazis were influenced by it but that's not clear either.

>Hes completely manufatured by US & EU media.

I think you're correct about that too. I would like to read about more influential Russian theorists who exist right now, they can be conservatives, whatever. But I'm just hearing about the meme guy all the time.

>>2107988
>Have some respect
This guy is kind of dumb but he quotes Zhirinovsky in a funny way at 7:45

File: 1736483105570.jpg (118.68 KB, 828x627, scale_1200.jpg)

>>2108655
>Dugin thinks that the USSR was a "retvrn to tradition" in some regards (ie collectivism, rejection of western influence, following a grand narrative etc) but he doesn't think communism or diamat are sufficient on their own, just that Soviet communism reflected a part of the "Russian spirit".
It's just philosophical argle bargle and he really does say crazy shit about reptiles like DDRanon said. More fundamentally he believes that modernity is bad that we must RETVRN. He believes in creating a magical, but brainless and illiterate feudal-like caste society which recreates conditions of serfdom. He has proposed only recently to depopulate Russian cities because they're breeding grounds for "degeneration, alienation, and madness," so people will go back to villages where there are strong Orthodox families who have a lot of babies. Divorces (don't even mention abortions) will be banned. It's forbidden and that's it – you get married, you live like that until you die. "Fornicators" will be burned at the stake (this is what he says) and thieves will be hanged in public. Blasphemy against the Tsar? Eternal hard labor. This is how he talks. The October Revolution? A betrayal of religion, Orthodoxy and the Tsar. Then he'll say the Soviet Union, as you point out, had certain special features and it was bad to betray that, but anyways Russia must RETVRN to the ideals of the church and the principle of the "aristocracy of the spirit." Basically everything lost over the past 100 years. (Don't mention the Decembrists, they were further back.)

>>2108756
>The October Revolution? A betrayal of religion, Orthodoxy and the Tsar.
He goes back and forth on that.
<The Marxist model cannot be called “traditional” in the normal sense, but in comparison with the liberal model it has incomparably more features of a traditional society. And when it comes to historical choice, this distinction takes on a special great meaning. (…) Lenin smashed the brain of the layman, razed stock exchanges and banks to the ground, brought the pre-revolutionary sleepless worms (the Gusinsky and Berezovsky of that time) to the clean, overturned the cadre, alienated, Late Romanov Russia, built on the corpses of Old Believers, mortgaged to the European nobodies…Lenin mobilized the nation for a total shock. Yes, it was bloody — but the birth of everything involves blood. Yes, it was allegorical, but the ideological discourse of the Tradition has been forced for many centuries to dress up in dubious compromise formulas, otherwise Kali-yugic humanity simply will not hear anything — it has become stupefied and desecrated beyond measure.

>He has proposed only recently to depopulate Russian cities because they're breeding grounds for "degeneration, alienation, and madness," so people will go back to villages

Based

>>2108680
>Is the Bolivarian Republic Fascist? Was Green Libya fascist?
Those were/are social democracies operating more or less within a liberal-democratic framework, whereas Dugin explicitly rejects this and supports shit like monarchism.
>This is more of a fair assessment >>2108655 than Dugin is a fascist and anti-communist
That assessment is agreeing with me, at least on the key points. He doesn't actually like or support communism, he just shills the USSR as an expression of Russian national greatness. At best he may express some sympathy with the Soviet system because it kept Russia from being liberal and gay, even though it was very socially progressive for its time. Stalin would have shot him as a reactionary.

>>2108771
>Based
The stuff I like from him is when he's talking about being disgusted by surfers or something. I find that stuff funny.

>>2108627
actual fascists are not "racialist" they are monopoly capitalist

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Trump pushes back Ukraine war deadline in sign of support for Kyiv
https://archive.md/x47xa
>US president-elect Donald Trump has pushed back his campaign pledge to end the war in Ukraine in “24 hours” to several months, in a shift European partners have interpreted as a sign that his administration will not immediately abandon support for Kyiv.

File: 1736492134484.png (477.31 KB, 680x522, ClipboardImage.png)

>>2108819
<water for LA fires
>money for Zelensky's coke habit

>>2108792
I prefer Risk

>>2108819
Who believed Trump was gonna abandon Ukraine?

Trump has a teenage bully/schoolkid mentality. If you don't act like an absolute thug in complete control of the situation he will think you're weak and hit you hard. By continuing to stalemate in the war and even being embarrassed by a Ukrainian invasion of Russian territory, Cucktin dispelled his "alpha male" image from Trump's perspective and thus Russia must now pay the price.

>>2108881
Hes like a unpredictive child. Impossible to say what he is going to wreck next.

Who cares what Trump thinks? Only a full American intervention can save Ukraine at this point.

The US throughout post-WW2 history has had the doctrine of massively over-reacting to even minor or irrelevant (from the US's perspective at least), labelled as being either a show of force, shock and awe, madman theory, etc as a deterrent that signals that if that US will create rivers of blood over something tactically meaningless to the US, then when you DO cross them meaningfully then it's all the more welcomed by the US for the chance to turn that river into an ocean. This even permeates throughout US culture with ideas like "that's what you get for messing with America" and the demon wojak meme, Trump is just continuing the doctrine but relabelling it as some kind of opening bolshy gambit that is part of the "art of the deal", it's nothing new or different IMO. If anything, the schizophrenic Biden attitude towards Ukraine where they couldn't make their minds up over what is or isn't escalatory for them to do shows a certain kind of seriousness to the situation, that this imminent switch to the usual boasting bravado about willing to pursue total war over irrelevancies suggests is in the past, it's a deterrent for Russia going beyond Ukraine either in Europe or more likely the Middle East and Africa.

>>2108969
Minor or irrelevant conflicts*

File: 1736516398952-0.png (913.59 KB, 894x1928, 1736516311310.png)

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>>2108959
No, that cannot save Ukraine either, because then China will get involved as well.
They can however give Ukraine tomahawks which will certainly increase Russian civilian casualties and prolong the war, kill more Slavs, which is of course the end goal of the American regime, because Slavs are the ones most nostalgic for communist time (excluding Poland)

>>2108997
>citation needed

>>2108997
Because "traditionalist communist" is incoherent nonsense of the same ilk as "national socialist".

>>2108959
>Who cares what Trump thinks?
I do. It's funni.

>>2109015
communism is already over 200 years old in theory and over 100 years old in practice. It is traditional by every means.

Libertarians are the new liberals with their color revolutions (1991) and because of that communists often identify as conservative, traditional
Personally I dislike the usage of these words entirely so I am just communist, nothing else. But I don't seethe at my fellow communists for doing so

Yeah I'm a tradcomm marxxmaxxer.

>>2108997
>citation needed

>>2109031
>>2109012
Notice how none of the points have citation, yet only this one is marked. Why do you think that is?
It is because this point, more than any other, destroys the vile western propaganda of Russian fascism

File: 1736521417057.png (255.01 KB, 989x649, ClipboardImage.png)

Lithuania hints at claim to Russian territory
Moscow has ridiculed a suggestion by the Baltic state’s president that Kaliningrad should be called Karaliaucius
https://swentr.site/russia/610680-lithuania-president-kaliningrad-name/

Kremlin responds to Baltic state’s territorial comments
Dmitry Peskov has called Lithuania “an unfriendly state” after its president referred to Kaliningrad as a Lithuanian city
https://swentr.site/russia/610681-peskov-hostile-state-lithuania-kaliningrad/

>>2108997
Idiot. Dugins flirtation with socialism ended decades ago and was never sincere

>WaPo: The official casualty estimate of 400,000 killed or wounded is considered a vast undercount.

>Kagan: Ukraine will likely lose the war within the next 12 to 18 months


Oof

>>2109078
that is not true. retards just assume that because Putin is not a socialist, Dugin cannot be either
Newsflash, DUGIN IS NOT PUTINS BRAIN, only retards ever said that

>>2109085
Or neither dugin nor putin are socialists

>>2109087
Dugin claims to be. He rarely talks about the economy though so it is hard to say. But he is promoting socialism either way

>>2109080
They are desperately trying to portray this as Trump's defeat in hopes to manipulate that narcissist into changing his mind.

>>2109092
>Dugin claims to be
He doesn't, thus tradcom. Socialism is second position, he is 'fourth position' i.e. mixing the three positions in a cultural mix you can retvrn with

His nazbol split is histrically to the right of limonov.

>>2109080
>will undermine U.S. credibility
I dunno, Trump's retarded expansionist threats already did that

>>2109117
I'm starting to wonder if it really did since it got everyone's attention that he's serious about a great power sphere

>>2109106
First positionism: socially left, economically right (liberalism)
Second positionmism: socially left, economically left (Communism)
Third positionism: socially right, economically right (fascism)
Fourth positionism: socially right, economically left (Duginism)

fourth position is just third position and you’re retarded if you can’t see that
just because the number went up doesn’t mean that it’s actually different this time around, “neither communism nor capitalism” is always capitalism

This isn't the "Famous Philosopher, Alexandre the Great Dugin" thread, you guys.


Can you fuck off with this lib obsession shit? thx

>>2109123
The positions refer to historical positions in sequence, not political compass quadrants.

>>2109106
Hola Leonardo

File: 1736525234839.jpg (198.51 KB, 800x1200, IMG_20250110_170654.jpg)

"Don't die in vain. Surrender is the way to survival."

Ukros made these for North Korean troops.

>>2109130
they are historical yes, but each position also has a different ideology to the rest. I never mentioned political compass

>>2109137
It has never even been proven that the NK troops are fighting, why do they waste government money on this possibly useless crap? Is Hohol government retarded, genuinely asking

>>2109137
their troops actually buy their made up propaganda and act on it

it's an amazing waste of effort

>>2109137
>Don't die in vain. Surrender is the way to survival
So they're printing these for themselves. Lmfao

>>2109117
burgerreich has no credibility left to undermine.

>>2109137
even as propaganda, this is retarded. how does one "surrender" to a drone when the gamer sociopath on the other side of it just wants to drop grenades on your leg stumps until you bleed out?

>>2109158
There was still that one little field of transatlanticist euroids coping about the US being a steadfast ally to the EU no matter what. Now Trump is shattering even that.

>>2109174
What do you mean? The Greenlander people have made a decision to be AMERICA. Who are eurobitches to resist that? They will love it, in fact, since that would piss Russia off

>>2109160
I suppose you raise up your arms and drop your weapon. They would kill you anyway, but they assume North Koreans are so poor and uneducated and desperate that they would fall for everything.

>>2109224
Didn't Denmark go from "Greenland is rightful Danish clay" to "um well i guess the greenlanders will decide."

>>2109160
>how does one "surrender" to a drone
this happens all the time. they are easily guided to a pickup location

>>2108747
>>2108756
Kill yourself retard.

>>2109140
Yes it is. It's retarded.

>>2109224
The biggest mistake Russia made, was not smashing Europe into pieces when it had the chance. Europeans always looked down on russians, and low-key loathed them. The USSR got nothing out of Eastern europe/Warsaw pact, while the US profited from rhe war, and uts imperialism. the USSR should have extracted rent, and exploited Warsaw pact's surplus, they should have built mines in Africa and used cheap labor to siphon everything to the USSR. Socialism would mean power and equality to the proletariat in the USSR, and slavery to everyone else.

>>2109535
☝ This is what "socialism in one country" should have been.

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>>2109535
Edgy boy

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>>2109535
would have been way more hardcore to make africa into a second russia.

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>>2109631
I remember this movie. It got stuck in my mom's minivan DVD player. The only movie we could watch on it.

>>2108608
First of all, Andropov was from the same gang as Khruschev-Brezhnev, second of all, Andropov's idea to solve labor shortage issue was to implement a third shift at factories while searching every nook and cranny for people who supposedly were absent from work. And it didn't do anything, because OBVIOUSLY, the problem was labor shortage due to lack of automatization, not people refusing to work. What is the next logical step from those kinds of policies, lol?

>>2108079
https://www.nytimes.com/1991/11/15/world/7-soviet-republics-agree-to-seek-new-union.html ,
I wonder whether the Kosovo war, Iraq invasion or Ukraine war , would have happened…salute to the country that never was.😥
https://countrycreate.fandom.com/wiki/Union_of_soviet_sovereign_republics


>>2109862
Even if there was a new union the resulting state would have been so weak it would have either followed American policy like Yeltsin did, or been too weak to resist. The Atlanticists also wouldn't have ceased their undermining.

A best case "new union" would just have seen Belarus, Ukraine, Georgia and some or all of the central Asian SSRs incorporated into the Union State. The resulting Union State economy might have looked more like Belarus though.

>>2109137
I have yet to be convinced that the North Koreans in Ukraine if there are any in the first place aren't just a handful of technical specialists and advisers hanging out in the rear.

>>2109892
Central Asia would have stayed in the Union. Their nationalism was more like Bashkir or Yakut nationalism. Caucasus, however, already was warring with itself, Armenian-Azerbaijani conflict happened when both of the republics were still in USSR

>>2109862
I'm not sure a partial compromise with nationalism and liberalization would have frozen the breakdown

>>2109897
Breakdown happened because local elites wanted a piece of formerly everyone's property. Eltzin came to power as a result of a kind of a coup against the center trying to keep everything to itself. If by some miracle center was kept as the owner of the whole country (like it's today in Russia basically, Moscow owns everything), collapse wouldn't have been needed

>>2109137
>Ukros made these for North Korean troops.
>made
Let's not hand out too much credit for AI generated slop

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>>2109897
You gotta give credit to the US, on how effective is their propaganda is, not only does it influences global south people/governments but even in the former USSR, where people can speak Russian, they still manage to change their minds. I've talked to global south people through the net from across the world, from Argentina to Vietnam, from Nigeria to Indonesia/Brazil, they all told me the same : most people would support the US over Russia, sometimes by a lot, and while a few consider the US a bad or evil country, half or more think the same of Russia.

>>2109917
Vietnamese being such cucks for America always blows my mind.

File: 1736586561392.png (217.88 KB, 1577x822, ClipboardImage.png)

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kuril_Islands_dispute
When will Russia return the Kurils?

>>2109919
Wait till you learn that 40% of Americans have a positive opinion of China, and the younger the positiver

>>2109926
China didn't foment a multi-decade civil war and bomb and poison half of America.

>>2109927
Dude, those polls aren't representative of anything. Besides, do you think Russians after WW2 had a severely negative opinion of Germans?

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>>2109917
I wouldn't rely on e pen pals

https://www.politico.eu/article/america-popularity-waning-worldwide-russia-and-china-gain-on-us-global-stage/

>America’s faltering popularity, combined with Russia and China’s improved standings, means the latter are now viewed as positively as the U.S. in most Middle Eastern, North African and Asian countries surveyed.


Also it's not propaganda, it's just the bias of the global system towards the US allows freedom to behave in a more diplomatic and commercial way based on soft power rather than opaque state interest calculus and bilateral dealings

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Before, speaking Ukrainian and gloating over defeating ruZZians
And after, speaking Russian and claiming that he was busified and forced to fight

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>>2109932
The article still says that America is perceived net 22% positively while for China it's only 5% and Russia is perceived net negatively at -14%.I don't know if I'd trust the "alliance of democracies", but if we do, that data is still bad.
Also, what is this

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>>2109956
This graph is also kinda funny

This looks so stupid, but is it Iranians being stupid or is the survey in some way flawed?

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War status? Haven't followed last week.

>>2109973
One more week (until the inauguration).

>>2109973
>Russia took Kurakhove
>Ukrainians launched a new offensive in that little Kursk salient (they managed to actually lose ground during this and gained nothing)
>Toretsk is about 90-95% held by the Russians, will probably be fully captured some time in the coming week or two
>Russia also established a beach head across the Oskil river north of Kupyansk, which is gonna be useful for taking that city later on
>Lastly, Russia put one of the highways leading into Pokrovsk from the west under fire control

That's about it for january so far

Russian pyrrhic victory

>>2109956
There's a couple things to keep in mind

1. The poll is political but the answers are mostly not. The vast majority of people do not have much of a political opinion of states, polarization over them is the exception not the rule. Sharp favorables/unfavorables better show politicized opinions. People mostly answer based on their interactions with states. Russia and China are comparatively irrelevant internationally, whereas you may have a favorite American show or movie.

2. In the multipolar period measured here, China and Russia have positive growth (especially Russia, look at Latin America) whereas America is stagnating or declining. This actually may suggest opinions of these three countries is A) getting political B) becoming a matter of weighing America versus Russia and China

>>2109972
I don't know how reliable their Iran figures are. Foreigners in Iran need state approval and are supervised IIRC. Respondents may be a self selecting group as a result, but I'm just guessing

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One of the guys Ukrops are claiming is North Korean POW. Doesn't look Korean to me.

>>2109959
The word "minority" is worthless here. People saying that include anyone against the status quo, and it could be for wildly different reasons.

>>2109974
that's 9 more days, dog

>>2109987
Did you measure his skull?

>>2108639
>My question is whether that country could be held together/survive
Nah, because neither the liberals nor the "hardliners" as Wikipedia calls them were interested in such a compromise, as evidenced by the use of the pre-Soviet nationalist flags used by the former and the coup attempt by the latter.

>and what it would look like in the modern era and geopolitical order.

Probably like the modern Russian Federation but presumably bigger, the 90s and 2000s possibly would have had more separatist insurgencies and terrorism, the US would have still boosted the liberal wing of its political system and the CPSU likely would act the same way the KPRF does today.

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More fake shit regarding the "North Korean troops". I don't know but I am increasingly getting angry about how the media keeps reporting this as a fact, not even subjunctively, even though there is still zero evidence while everything reported about this turned out to be fake.

Are liberals so dumb that they don't even realize that there are Asia-looking minorities in Russia. Like, a lot. Even ethnic Koreans in the far east (Koryo-saram).

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The vultures are assembling over the rotting corpse. Who's next?

Romania, Moldova, Hungary, Slovakia, Poland, Balts?

>>2110075
There's naturally an interest in avoiding a narrative of NATO nations ganging up against a single nation, not because that'd moralistically sound like it's unfair, westerners think the fact that so many nations would gang up on a single nation is proof of how evil/dangerous that nation is, but rather they don't want NATO's failure to protect the integrity of Ukraine's 1991 borders to be from failing to collectively crush a single nation's military capacity to the point they're sent fleeing back over the border unconditionally.

So inevitably when a piece of Ukraine gets signed over to Russia in a peace deal (regardless of how much that ends up being) the narrative will be that NATO had met its match in a definitely real opposing military alliance between Russia, China, Iran and DPRK. Factor in the fact much of the world is entirely neutral to the conflict, NATO will probably claim the odds were even against them and that whatever Russia doesn't get in the peace deal will because of a David vs Goliath-tier victory.

>>2109977
Alright, thank you!

>>2110084
Yes that will be some of the other copes
>NATO wasn't serious about protecting Ukraine, if they DID get involved then it would be very different!
>Russia won, but only eventually!

>>2110088
German factories are closing down and thousands of workers are being made redundant over NATO's response and involvement in Ukraine, I don't think any factories have closed or any worker lost their job in Russia over it. So if you're Hans the recently sacked Volkswagen worker, you're going to feel a lot more involved in and affected by the conflict than Sergei the Russian factory worker who's bemoaning the cost of Bananas these days.

>>2110092
Russia wasn't prepared for the war. Proof is eventual mobilization, which ran counter to trying to fight the war with contract soldiers only, without backup divisions or anything. That initial army blitzkrieged to Kiev, though, but Russia, again, wasn't prepared, and didn't have second echelon to push forward over such a wide frontline (meaning that the same units that were breaking through were also the same units that held the breakthrough; that's not how it's done)

BUT the big difference is that Russia has managed to outproduce the West and even did an army reform in the middle of a conflict, while NATO and Ukraine to this day are doing the same shit and only throwing replacements into the meatgrinder.

Meanwhile, Russian military technology has proven to be superior to Westoid technology, what's up with the West being unable to intercept missiles, lmao, and still having no hypersonics. Javelins? Absolute logistical nightmare, and didn't work as intended anyway. Bayraktars? Didn't even show up except for first couple days when those were shot down. Western tanks and APC at best no different than Russian counterpart, and at worst straight up unuseable in a real conflict, for example, Bradley's door just gets stuck, and a slightest drone hit roasts people trapped inside alive. Patriots? Can't defend anything, missiles targeting Patriots just hit patriots. Himars? No better than Russian counterparts, and lancets reduced Himars count to single digits

Situation is so dire for Ukraine, that THE ONLY thing that they want by this point is drones, and they use those even to try and to target aircraft or missiles with those. No NATO technology has survived reality check

>>2110102
>Gamechangers
>For a game they're not playing
Yeah nice try.

>>2110112
You're claiming NATO aren't involved, but they are because they claim the stuff they send to Ukraine are "game changers". You can't change a game you're not playing or at least disrupting, whether you're playing the game or disrupting it, "changing the game" is involvement.

I gave you the terse version of the post first because apparently that's your preference for "cope".

>>2110131
>buying shit or just production rights from Iran and the DPRK is the same as having your entire economy propped up by the west and only providing men to fight with nato equipment
cope

>>2110100
I think they were prepared, but they thought Ukraine wasn't gonna last this long. Or better put, that Ukraine wouldn't take so long to start negociating.

>>2110131
>estrogen induced definition

Are you a wm refugee?
Latest Kursk offensyiv status?

>>2110131
It hasn't been confirmed that DPRK troops are in Kursk or Ukraine and it was never confirmed that Iran sent anything other than a license to produce their drones, it's always claims made to justify NATO's involvement.

But in any case, you've already backpedaled from "not involved directly" to "directly involved but less significantly than Russia" and even then it's because for all the NATO arms, training, tactics, recon, funding they're nevertheless using Ukrainians instead of NATO soldiers. So when inevitably the war ends and magazines and newspapers start coming forward with heroic stories about the secret deployment of NATO special forces under the guise of volunteer combat medics, confirming what Russia has been reporting the entire time, you'll then backpedal again to "directly involved, significantly so, but they didn't send grunts as stand in for Ukrainians".

>>2110140
if ukraine's entire budget wasn't just welfare checks from the west and its debts weren't frozen, it would have simply defaulted years ago, that's probably the most important thing. as it is it basically doesn't have to obey the rules of economy at all, the hrivnya is still frozen at pre-war value when by all rights they should be having weimar-tier inflation

>wake up
>spend all day thinking of two things: transhumanist and ruzzia
>sleep and repeat next day
some people “live” like this, grim

>>2110146
Absolutely, the fact they're also taking money off the tables of their own civilians (i.e not just using taxes but also economic warfare that sacrifices the livelihoods of NATO civilians) to prop up Ukraine's economy proves how deep this economic involvement is.

But anon is probably a fascist by the sounds of it, so he sees war as solely an expenditure of blood with the expenditure of capital being an irrelevancy, thus as long as NATO claims not a single drop of their blood has been dropped, they aren't "significantly directly involved".

>>2110151
>and by any means significantly less than russia
I know what the first part of your post says, but then this immediately contradicts it and is a backpedal.

>>2110147
that's just a rapefugee from 2ch's /wm/, quite possibly a hohol too

>>2110147
pretty funny, ngl

>>2110152
Most nato in Ukraine are "mercenaries", although many advisers have been killed in missile strikes too. Nato losses, counting both, are about 15k now, with Poland and UK losing the most. Anyway, Russia should treat the EU as the criminal entity it is, and finance terrorists against it, sabotage german economy into implosion. Once euroturds are poor, they'd migrate to Russia, increasing it's population and bringing whatever skills they have.

>it's russia that's failing to take on little russia one to one conclusively
this premise is completely false, you can write "estrogen" as many times as you want, that doesn't change the fact that without NATO the ukraine would have no materiel to fight with and no economy whatsoever. Russia is fighting the combined economic and industrial potential of NATO, and the only thing the ukraine is providing are the men. you can look at how VSU fared against ragtag militias on t-34s in 2014 to see how it would go with no NATO involvement

>>2110165
>I was pretending to be retarded
Lol you wish, but the fact is you compared "no direct involvement" as being "significantly less" than Russian direct involvement, which isn't a comparison you can make. It's either "no" or "less", not "no" and "in any case less".

>>2110175
>this premise is completely false
if by false you mean factually correct but it makes you upset
>without NATO the ukraine would have no materiel to fight with and no economy whatsoever
nobody is denying that
> Russia is fighting the combined economic and industrial potential of NATO
if nafo was directly and fully involved, which it isn't
>and the only thing the ukraine is providing are the men.
so the most fundamental component?
>>2110176
>assuming your argument to be true is to pretend to be retarded
can't say you're wrong

>>2110177
>if nafo was directly and fully involved, which it isn't

Grossly misleading to the point of lying. Ukraine has de facto the largest army in NATO outside of the US, and reliance on proxies is typical for a late empire. It was built and sold as Europe's shield, so no Russia is not simply struggling against Ukraine. But whatever helps you cope with this wash of a war on Russia.

>>2110177
no, it's arguably the least fundamental component compared to economics and industry, if ukraine was fighting "one on one" with its pre-2022 army and production levels it would have collapsed in a couple of months even if it conscripted ten gorillions of men to do suicide charges in ww2 era greatcoats wielding rusty mosins

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>>2110165

>>2110179
>Grossly misleading to the point of lying.
notice how what follows doesn't refute the premise. typical transhumanist rhetoric
>>2110181
> least fundamental component compared
the irony of a commie arguing for this. like saying labour is the least fundamental component, absolutely ludicrous. would like to see artillery firing itself and tanks driving themselves and empty trenches stopping anyone

>>2110192
go back, /pol/ack.

>>2110191
>notice how what follows doesn't refute the premise
It does, you're making a distinction without a difference. There's no reason to believe the Ukraine war merely evidences Russian power against Ukraine. It's much more international in scope and it actually represents the greatest collective action NATO has ever done. You can lie and cope, but NATO officials call this war existential for a reason.

>>2110191
it's perfectly in line with marxist thought, production and economics is what decides wars, not the quality or quantity of human material

>>2110191
You just need to listen to what European leaders are saying and not be coping. Actual on-duty European generals were killed in strikes on Ukraine. That doesn't happen if you're not directly involved.

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>we've captured a korean (with buryat documents) but sadly he can't speak korean because his jaw is broken

>>2110205
Why didn't they just commission some South Korean actor at this point.

>>2110209
they've probably learned from the time they made an edgy poster to scare "north koreans" but used the south korean dialect and ended up threatening south koreans

>>2110211
True but they could just prepare that actor with lore-appropriate information, like if this was a history movie.

>>2110205
surprised Putin didn't torch his face!

>>2110202
>It does
>There's no reason to believe the Ukraine war merely evidences Russian power against Ukraine. It's much more international in scope and it actually represents the greatest collective action NATO has ever done. You can lie and cope, but NATO officials call this war existential for a reason.
all of this is true and yet none of it refutes nafo non direct involvement. you can keep repeating it does over and over, have fun
>>2110203
but what is fundamental, knucklehead? try having a war, production and economics with no human material, commodity fetishist
>>2110204
>Actual on-duty European generals were killed in strikes on Ukraine.
there's about as much evidence for this ultimate projecting transhumanist cope as there is for korean troops

>>2110177
>assuming your argument to be true
That's not what happened, you tried to both commit to no direct involvement while also relenting to the fact there is direct involvement, that's backpedalling while pretending you're not.

>>2109920
Do you support Fascist Japan?

>>2110221
okay transhumanist, that's what happened
you feel better now(Rule 14c - of an overly derisive and mocking nature)

>>2110225
Actually yes, thanks for asking.

>>2110218
production, economy, technology and logistics are fundamental, which is what nato is providing to ukraine. without those you don't have an army no matter how many men you have. well you could conduct gorilla warfare but that's not what ukraine is doing or has the means to do

>>2110229
absolutely moronic, production, economy, technology, logistics don't exist without labour or manpower. neck yourself immediately, fetishist

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they'll call it the "nazi pipeline" while in fact it's the "economically sensible pipeline"

>>2110232
Funny thing is that the "game changing wunderwaffen" narrative is also presented both within NATO and Ukraine as something that intentionally de-emphasises the need for men, because the super weapons supposedly do all the actual fighting while the troops can enjoy eating their airlifted burger king from safety.

>>2110232
They do in Ukraine's case since they're given western money, equipment, other resources.

>>2110232
>production, economy, technology, logistics don't exist without labour or manpower
in ukraine's case these are 99% powered by NATO country labor. therefore, it's NATO's war. qed

>>2110238
moronic nafoid narratives aren't reality and in fact every wnderwaffle has been an absolute non factor except for maybe himars very early on
>>2110244
yes nafo is indirectly involved, that's not disputed.
also refrain from pulling numbers out of your transhumanist wound

Boo wrap it up, this show is boring now

>>2110251
It's boring because your side (Ukraine) us losing.

>>2110250
It doesn't work as well as they'd hope, but when there are doctrinal ideas like technological overmatch, claiming that Soviet stuff is bad because they're cheap and launching wars with false confidence because the nation they're attack is poor, it's certainly the NATO perspective that economic and technological support for Ukraine is both direct and more meaningful than sending men.

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>>2110250
whether nato involvement is direct or not by your metrics is irrelevant when it's the only thing propping ukraine up into the third year of the war. Russia is fighting NATO economies and industries wearing Ukraine as a puppet, that's just fact.
(besides your first post said that Russia is fighting Ukraine one on one, lol.)
>picrel is what Russia would be facing exclusively if NATO wasn't involved, ISIS-tier shit
consider dilating

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>>2110257
After the war ends, azovs along with the rest of the prisoners, should be used in katorga slave labor. work non-stop to rebuild infrastructure, sewage, industry, that way they'd pay for their crimes while helping with Russia's lack of workers. Better than just sitting in a cell costing tax payers their wage, hope putin does that much at least.

>>2110250
is transhumanist some insult that doesn't translate into english properly?
genuinely why are you using it so much, what part of this argument is even remotely related to transhumanism

>>2110386
Word filter, he's actually using a word for transgender people.

>>2110386
by transhumanist he means uyghur russian saboteur Agent Kochinski caleb maupin, got it?

>>2110403
>that last one
wasn’t it supposed to filter into “speaker, writer, whatever the fuck…”? fucking mods fix it -_-

>>2110257
>whether nato involvement is direct or not by your metrics
my metric is objective reality, correct

>>2110386
it means you gulp down estrogen for breakfast, which of course is a great thing as radlibs proved
>>2110394
no i'm using the word transhumanist, it's more demeaning than tгanny, it shows all varieties of commies are radlib at heart


>>2110203
>production and economics is what decides wars, not the quality or quantity of human material
Rubbish. Production and economics can overcome disparity in quality or quantity of human material. Plenty of wars have been won by the less economically advanced side, which has lower production of military material. Just look at Castro taking Cuba.

>It turns out that the French did not train the Ukrainian Armed Forces for free, they took 7,000-10,000 dollars for training each soldier. This is the kind of help from the West.

>But that is not the whole problem, the problem is that the training does not correspond to the realities of modern warfare and these newly-minted fighters, according to speaker Denis Yaroslavsky, are trained a little better than the musketeers.

- FRWL

https://x.com/Zlatti_71/status/1877844614788616489

>>2110463
>>2110450
COLLAPSE IMMINENT

>>2110465
The collapse is happening. We're watching it happen.

>>2110467
that's what i'm saying

>>2110463
It has been noted since before the Great Counter Offensyiv that NATO trainers clearly had no idea about large scale war let alone modern war. It is like having veterans of the Boer war train soldiers for WWII.

>>2110472
Oh and the Ukrainian troops never got a full length NATO training course AFAIK. It was basic training and a little bit about room clearing and trench assaults.

>>2110100
The initial assault didn't stall due to a lack of a second echelon but because lack of traffic control meant they jammed up the roads and ran out of supplies. The attack was then halted to reorganise forces and begin negotiations with the Ukrainians.

If the Russian commanders had been competent at moving forces around in real life and not just on a map sheet they'd have reached the Dneper and been able to create a bulge or even pocket of the Ukrops in the Donbas.

>>2110469
Oh sorry, I thought the emphasis was meant to be sarcastic in the "2 more weeks" sense.

>>2110472
Yeah, even initially the nato mercenaries tapped out early with comments about how this was totally different than fighting tribals in Afghanistan or whatever.

>>2110473
Training seems inconsistent across the board, with reports of people being shipped to the front same day and then "elite nato trained units" getting what seems at most 4-6 months, which Scott Ritter referred to as criminal.

>>2110479
>Training seems inconsistent across the board
Yeah I was referring to just the units trained by NATO outside Ukraine. This wasn't full NATO training, and even that is considered the bare minimum for soldiers to join a line unit and receive further training.

I wouldn't be surprised to see a lot of Ukrainian nationalists turn away from the West due to them realising how false most of its aura of superiority is.

>>2110476
I don't think there was Russian intent to push up to the Dnieper.

I see the initial stages of the assault like the Sino-Vietnamese War. The Chinese struck with heavy, albeit clumsy, force, and reached the passes to Hanoi. Then they withdrew to avoid getting embroiled in a brutal guerrilla war, and launched border skirmishes that dragged down the Vietnamese economy.

I think that's the same logic with the Kyiv attack; Russia was never going to capture Kyiv, but they wanted to put it under threat to force favorable negotiations.

They will have to take Donbass, of course, but the objective is a grinding, grueling fight until Ukraine makes like Vietnam, which acknowledged that given the force disparity with China, it had to acknowledge its northern neighbour's needs. The Russian objective's similar, it has to send a message to NATO, and it has to convince Ukraine it has to be neutral or Russia-aligned.

The difference is that the attritional skirmishing and the mass assault phases have been merged; Russia bleeds Ukraine (and NATO) fighting over Donbass.

>>2110465
Putin, plz stop grinding Army XP and just cap victory points.

>>2110488
>I don't think there was Russian intent to push up to the Dnieper.
Wasn't really talking about their intent. Just the military facts that what stopped them was their own forces jamming the roads not numerical inferiority. If it wasn't for that the Ukrops would have had to pull of a minor miracle to pull units back to hold the sides of the Donbas bulge.

>>2110459
Isn't that kind of explained by the fact the advanced side is spending a lot to attack a side that barely even has infrastructure, actually balances the economics of war in favour of the side that has everything jerry rigged with duct tape anyway? Like if you take Vietnam, it was hugely expensive to send all of that hi-tech (for the era anyway) shit and operate it that far from home that then got unleashed on pretty much nothing other than peasants who become economically active as children anyway and thus (speaking brutally) easy to replace. As soon as the Vietnamese were able to shoot down B-52s with foreign supplied AA on the reg, then it was over for the US, the war was expensive enough fuelling and arming the bombers to attack targets that nowhere near match the value of, without now even losing the bombers and thus requiring replacements.

This no doubt inspired them to hand over the then new stinger missiles to the mujahedeen, which then achieved basically the same effect in making it economically unviable to be losing helicopters regularly in attacks against targets considerably cheaper and easier to replace than said helicopters. This in turn has inspired the era of drone warfare where now the AA weapons are too expensive to be firing at drones that cost a tenth of missiles that previously were economically efficient when used against aircraft that cost ten times more.

>>2110495
I mean the Russians could have been more effective and more successful, but Luhansk was taken by the Russians quite effectively as a result of the Kyiv / Sumy feints. In 2021, and people don't want to talk about it, the LPR only comprised a third of Luhansk oblast. Now it's nearly completely "liberated".

>>2110473
If NATO actually got directly involved and lost enough professional soldiers and resorted to conscription then that would be the standard of training for western mobiks as well. All of the training professional NATO troops receive is to improve/protect their investments in those willing soldiers with training them to manooover and outsmart untrained troops, in attrition warfare that's not a good investment if you've already lost the people with years of training in a matter of months because they couldn't manooover out of the way of a guided bomb, it doesn't apply as well to people you've snatched off the streets of questionable health and motivation and the front is moving now and not in a couple of years time.

People get trained just to sit in a trench and fire in whatever direction their CO tells them to, because that's the only economically viable way men are expended in attrition (aka real) wars.

>>2110512
No. America and the Soviets over spent on counter-insurgencies due to bad strategy and soldiers who weren't up to the task of fighting those conflicts.

The argument also wasn't that a more advanced opponent could be forced to spend more than their opposition, but that economics and production were determinative in war.

Training, morale, and leadership of men all matter. The Soviets knew this even when they were cranking out N T-34s for every Panther.

>>2110529
Yes troop quality would go down but even in WWII elite formations like paratroopers got extended training. Regular units were also leavened with long service soldiers and veterans and usually given some months to train together. Even WWI trench-sitters were getting rotated out for RnR and more training.

What is killing the Ukrops is the hand to mouth nature of replacements. Instead of making the politically painful decision to increase conscription ahead of losses they've been just doing enough to hold while hoping the next round of Wunderwaffe/sanctions would break Russia.

>>2110534
Based and true post. Really you shoud send no soldier out to the frontline until they're spiritually ready.

>>2110531
>Training, morale, and leadership of men all matter
>>2110534
>WWII elite formations like paratroopers got extended training
These skills cost quite a bit to teach in soldiers, hence why "elities" receive the training and operate separately for more specific tasks than
>Objective one: retain current clay
>Objective two: claim new clay
While field experienced soldiers are trained as they've got the acumen to survive up until that point, and then they're assigned as NCOs to a squad of not-so-trained troops in the hopes that cheaper investment in a sergeant also compensates for the expediency of getting those troops to the front quickly.

>What is killing the Ukrops is the hand to mouth nature of replacements.

Indeed, but technically speaking every one of them will have a gun and do pose a threat on the battlefield who will need to be attacked anyway, it's not as though Russia can just choose not to bomb them on the basis that they probably wouldn't be very good in a more dynamic combat situation, because they're still sitting in a trench and firing at advancing Russian troops which is difficult to overcome even with training.

The next round of Wunderwaffe and sanctions no doubt provides hope of reversing their fortunes, but for desperate defences, nothing beats forcing trained soldiers to risk being shot by an alcoholic, or better yet forcing the use of a missile or bomb to attack someone who cost nothing at all to field.

I'ma point out again that America was never lacking in advisement of hand to hand kills. Ok fuck it, you don't got your gun, kill that Kraut uyghur.

>>2110542
The Ukrops issue is they are currently advancing rearwards due to troop shortages, and low quality of the troops they have. If this was seriously an existential war for them and they weren't relying on Wunderwaffe/sanctions hopium they'd have been conscripting 18 year olds as soon as they could organise the training.

Also I think another formal round of conscription is being avoided for other reasons than it's politically painful (as if anyone in politics will remain in Ukraine after this)
>Clearly, whatever is left of Ukraine will require gargantuan amounts of labour of decades to rebuild, 18-25s are invaluable to this end and with demographics as poor as Ukraine's, the economic value they represent is pretty extreme to just expend in attrition
>If they're being trained properly to increase their chances of survival, they will probably be sent abroad, where they may go AWOL. This apparently is enough of an issue that NATO is now considering the risk of sending trainers to Ukraine instead.
>Thanks to drones making movements of any kind pretty risky, it's actually kind of working for Ukraine that infantry are spread out, a big conscription drive will inevitably create larger groups of infantry that will be easier targets for bombs, missiles, drones, so piecemeal conscription to maintain a presence that prevents Russian soldiers from advancing without concern, but not big enough to have a single bomb wipe out an entire squad's worth of equipment is quite efficient

Overall though, discussing people as commodities that are either difficult or easy to replace depending on how guaranteed their death is, is why war is awful and a peaceful (i.e a communist) world is desirable because war is just about economics and expending capital.
The angle that war values more the skill, leadership and valiance of individual soldiers, rather than the ratio of what it costs when they die compared to what amount of expenditure they can cause beforehand, is to delude one's self that generals and politicians will value the lives of soldiers over capital in a way they don't when they were civilians employed for wage-labour and thus trick themselves into thinking there's something glorious about war. It isn't, you either die in the service of capital, or rarely, you die in an unwelcome necessity for self-defence because fascists didn't like your socialist project.


>>2110558
>If this was seriously an existential war for them and they weren't relying on Wunderwaffe/sanctions hopium they'd have been conscripting 18 year olds as soon as they could organise the training.

Fallout from the 90s leaves a big crater where the 18-23 demographic should be. Even assuming a best case scenario that's going to be disastrous.

>>2110558
>dude, 8 million bayonets, lmao!
Lack of meat and cannon fodder isn't Ukraine's real issue.

>>2110564
>The angle that war values more the skill, leadership and valiance of individual soldiers, rather than the ratio of what it costs when they die compared to what amount of expenditure they can cause beforehand, is to delude one's self that generals and politicians will value the lives of soldiers over capital
Nah the point is that war is far more complex than just tallying up the "correlation of forces". Even when tallying the "correlation of forces" the training/morale/leadership of the opposition must be accounted for. The Soviet Army aimed for 10-1 local superiority for breakthrough attacks to try and eliminate the variance of human factors.

>>2110613
Shameful strawman.

Ukraine doesn't even have enough troops to rotate units out every few weeks as was the norm in most wars. Even if they couldn't afford to mobilise more men there is a reason most 30+ year olds in WWI/WWII weren't assigned to the infantry.

The Ukrops deployed a deliberate strategy of burning up Homo Sovieticus in the belief that Western aid/sanctions would end the war soon.

>>2110625
They had no strategy at all. They didn't expect Russia to have the balls to intervene in the first place.

>>2110635
False, if you saw that old Arestovich interview he was talking about a war with Russia in like 2019. The Donbass front was being fortified for years as well.

>>2110476
>but because lack of traffic control meant they jammed up the roads and ran out of supplies

Are you with that stupid column thing again? Lmao, Ukrainians to this day believe that they ever damaged it?

Russian tactic was pushing forward, abandoning broken vehicles on their path, all this kind of thing. They broke through, and that implies a second echelon to guard positions and roads. There was no meaningful second echelon. Road jams is nonsense

Like, imagine slicing Ukrainian defences like knife through butter, and then doing whatever you want in their rear. But you don't have ANYBODY to hold the ground behind you

Come to think of it, this SMO was designed much like an anti-terrorist operation

>>2110684
The first elements broke through and captured the outskirts of Kiev but the assault broke down because the roads were jammed and they couldn't move up artillery.

The roads were jammed. We could see it on CCTV and satellite. I don't know how you think there could be all that traffic and no "second echelon". Were they all bread trucks or something?

>>2110649
Yeah. The Donbas front. Not the border with Russia. Not anything else. And they lost four provinces for it.

File: 1736675503489.png (66.26 KB, 1192x475, ClipboardImage.png)

>far right wins in germany
>they rebuild nordstream
>trump bombs it anyway
what would this mean to the EU far right?

File: 1736675700916.png (560.96 KB, 1255x883, ClipboardImage.png)


>>2110691
Nobody ever given any explanation. Nafo ran with the story that it was 1000 km long and was bombed to shreds (no photos tho). Satellite imagery isn't real for such events, as we have learned from Bucha forgeries, Oreshnik hitting Yuzhmash and similar incidents

Like, what do you think was in those trucks? I suspect it was humanitarian aid mixed with some troops and ammo. Russia was trying to give out humanitarian aid, and there were hundrends of thousands of people living in occupation, with supply lines disrupted.

>>2110805
The real reason is much simpler, Russia never entered with enough from the north to storm Kiev.

>>2110732
AfD is like Merkel, but against immigration


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