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/tech/ - Technology

"Technology reveals the active relation of man to nature" - Karl Marx
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 No.23288

So you have this technology that is effectively electronic cash, you get to send any amount of money with all the benefits of cash and without all the problems of a centralized middle man service. but still after about a decade not enough people believe in crypto as a currency. the hate from the left is especially strange.
>muh energy crisis
YouTube alone is more of an energy blackhole than all of crypto combined. you think streaming 4K@60fps video 24/7 world wide is sustainable? or even 1080p?
instead of fighting the banks, normalfags keep voting for laws that restrict crypto, because of muh think of the children!

 No.23290

its value is too volatile

 No.23291

>normalfags keep voting for laws that restrict crypto
This isnt true. Normal people dont give a shit about crypto. Only porkies do this, as they want security

 No.23292

>>23288
I also support crypto but I'm not a leftist though, I'm just an egoist anarchist (dunno if I can be called a nihilist anarchist without being an insurrectionary/illegalist though). I have seen many contemporary anarchists opposing copyleft too which is pretty similar to this situation in my view.

 No.23293

>>23289
I'm just using anarcho-nihilist as a meme flag, I just like the name lol. im a lefty socialist/anarchist/commie, I lean left.
>should I remind you that many anarchists also oppose che libre software movement?
why? im sure they use libre software despite that.
>>23290
yea, it's too volatile because not enough people believe in it. fiat currency would also become volatile if suddenly most people stopped using it and believing in it.

 No.23294

>>23291
Yeah. Imagine electoralism working. You may not know this but this is what real anarchists believe in, trust me, bruh.

 No.23295

>>23293
I've reposted my message.

 No.23296

>>23291
it's because they don't see the immediate value of it. they don't understand that having all of their assets in banks is a bad idea since it can easily be abused by the government. and the poor fucks in third world countries that would and could use it are too technologically illiterate.

 No.23297

>>23296
I dont think they can afford crypto lmao

 No.23298

>>23297
They can't afford to put a hundred bucks in a Bitcoin/Monero wallet? im a turd worlder and I can do that. yes the value wont remain the same, especially with something like Bitcoin but in the long run it's worth it.

 No.23299

>>23298
this crypto-fetishism is uncanny

 No.23300

>>23299
im not fetishing it, it's an obviously useful technology that nobody sees or appreciates the value of.

 No.23301

>>23293
Some anarchists have an open hostility to Stallman and the FSF specifically, and that leads them to associate themselves with the OSI. Some say it's un-anarchist to cooperate with such a bureaucratic movement (because cooperation means active support apparently). Some think the libre software movement is too preachy (an exaggerated claim that doesn't really reflect reality). Some have a grudge against GNU/Linux specifically (which is just mean-spirited). And some are obviously idpol-obsessed so they complain about anything in the libre software movement they see as "problematic" (which lead to the "Ethical Open Source" and the Contributor Covenant).

 No.23302

>>23298
Why Bitcoin? Even Monero is less volatile than Bitcoin.

 No.23303

people don't use it because it is a hassle compared to debit cards and the prices for most cryptocurrencies are incredibly unstable. KYC/AML laws have made it even more annoying
finally cryptocurrency isn't a solution to anything besides buying drugs and guns online

 No.23304

File: 1707137078351.png (283.54 KB, 680x515, ClipboardImage.png)

crypto is not just a digital currency, but a specific kind there of. other digital currencies exist. china is making one right now.
so what are the problems with crypto as opposed to other digital currencies? firstly, it creates nothing whatsoever. It’s almost exactly as useful as reddit karma. or as marx said:
>fictitious capital could also be defined as "tradable paper claims to wealth", although tangible assets may themselves under certain conditions also be vastly inflated in price
​crypto coins are simply speculative gambling products that only create a massive set of negative externalities on the world. It is introducing artificial volatility into markets untethered to any economic activity and creates an enormous opportunity cost where the only investment opportunity is as an economically corrosive synthetic hedge against all productive assets. This is not innovation, this is technical regression and flirtation with ecological disaster in a time when we cannot afford to gamble our planet’s fate on pyramid schemes and dog memes.
only monero has some small use in evading sanctions or trading certain goods of questionable legality, but the new system that the axis of resistance is building, will do that.
<block chain is useful though.

 No.23305

>>23304
>china is making one right now
If it's proprietary then it doesn't matter.

 No.23306

>>23305
yeah im not really a fan myself, i just wanted to include an example done by a proto socialist country

 No.23307

>>23304
you're a brain rotted authoritarian commie, of course you won't like the concept of a decentralized crypto

 No.23308

>>23303
it's a hassle for sure, in terms of getting money into it and in terms of using it. but it's because the average human a retarded tech illiterate chimp.
it's a hassle for the same reason navigating a file system on a real computer is a problem.
we really really need to raise the average IQ of humans.

 No.23309

>>23307
lmao dude wants an unregulated unstable as fuck market driven coin scandal-maxed and posts about it in a lefty board, to the gulag retard. Bourgeois crypto bros gonna save you when you can't even rent in your basic fucking job. It's like you're oblivious to the economic hardships and how a crypto currency amounts to more shit than our current system. Also not even that private.

 No.23310

>>23309
you stupid fucking faggot, im not arguing against communism. that's besides the fucking point you moron. how is having your money tied up in bourgeois banks a good thing? yes the idea of currency may or may not be a good thing in the long run, but in the mean time it's the only way to liberate people economically,

 No.23311

File: 1707139840972.png (721.71 KB, 1052x1200, ClipboardImage.png)

>>23310
>liberate people economically
how the fuck could literal gambling have any positive impact in this regard? spend a few nights in a casino and see how liberated you get.
crypto solved no problems and created a ton. fuck off to your liberal techbro friends.

 No.23312

>>23311
hey it liberated some people, and highly impoverished others

 No.23313

>>23296
You're infinitely less likely to get robbed or scammed having all your assets in the bank than having it in crypto lol

 No.23314

>>23313
Right, but that's your responsibility, crypto in theory can and is adopted into "banks" such as coinbase for example, but you can use it like cash if you want, but that's the point, the responsibility on is on you, just don't be a brainlet.

 No.23315

>>23307
>anarchist propagating petty bourgeois nonsense
many such cases
>>23308
>eugenics
wew

 No.23316

>>23315
>eugenics
yea no, because fuck trying to improve the human race right? nah fuck that, it's perfectly fine the way it is. just because nazis gave eugenics a bad name doesn't that we shouldn't try to improve humanity.
>eugenics = nazi race hater
retard opinion

 No.23317

>>23310
The only way to liberate people is to dismantle capitalism, and sent you and your crypto bros to the gulag.

 No.23318

>>23317
and why should I trust you for authority you retard? im not arguing against the idea of communism. im not pro capitalism, but to deny the usefulness of crypto is utterly retarded.

 No.23319

Dickblast takes nonsense like what OP is spouting to task

 No.23320

.neteen bagholder thread. Using it as a currency requires a willing recipient, when the whole point is to get someone else to hold the bag.
>YouTube's energy costs
YouTube's existence is burdensome, it only exists because of network effect, and federation is finally eroding that.
>4K@60fps video 24/7 world wide is sustainable?
Of course not, no one wanted hyperHD for anything but competitive gaming, to compensate for bad level design. Nearest neighbor scaling has been around for several years, possibly decades idk the wikipedia is a disambiguation list.

You're defending your bag by comparing it to things you know are just as ridiculous.

 No.23321

>>23307
it's emergently centralizing actually. It centralizes around those who can afford the most graphics cards, which is pre-determined by wealth before the 'chain even starts.
Please stop using that word for something that it doesn't apply to.

 No.23322

>>23321
Monero has measures against it though.

 No.23323

>>23322
It is more realistic to rely entirely on gift economy right now than to advocate the adoption of crypto.

Money exists to be solely to be taxed, because taxes exist to force the working class to work for those who own the means of production so they can meet the legal requirement of paying taxes. It is a threat of the execution of government violence against oneself if one does not work. Thus, the only purpose of crypto is to either assume this role, when the current money is superior at this role, for crypto largely owes what success it has to posing as though it's advantages are to be outside of it, or to be a second money in exchange for the primary money, which is only slightly less pointless.
It fundamentally fails to understand what money is or why it is used in the first place.

 No.23324

>>23323
>It is more realistic to rely entirely on gift economy
Gift economy? Where is it? Because I don't see any.

 No.23326

>>23325
Honestly, I don't even advocate the widespread adoption of crypto because it's just as realistic as a widespread adoption of libre software. Essentially, we're all fucked and I want to die. *cries*

 No.23327

>>23324
Exactly. You can't rely entirely on gift economy. That is the point.

 No.23328

>>23326
>it's just as realistic as a widespread adoption of libre software
No, because unlike crypto that already happened as is happening. Because libre software actually works and is functionally superior to the alternative in most current cases, which is what matters to the end-user. Materially libre software has the advantage over proprietary software, the only advantage the latter had was a head start. Don't pretend Blender and Krita don't exist.

 No.23329

>>23328
Libre software is stuck in a limbo, it cannot advance beyond what it has already achieved because proprietary software has just co-opted Open Source. Now Open Source works in service of bigger proprietary developers instead. It's because of the Open Source movement that libre software got adopted so fast and it's precisely because of it that it will die. Open Source has no principles, it's class collaborationist in nature. It's akin to introducing the welfare state to preserve capitalism. Despite what rightoids may claim, the welfare state is the opposite of socialism in that it tries to preserve the status quo by weakening class conflict.

The only way for the libre software to advance further is by following strict principles of the FSF but the Big Tech will not allow it to happen. Upen Source was allowed because the Big Tech saw benefit in it while copyleft is an active threat to it. They'll either cockblock all the GPL'd software (which is already happening with the BSDs and Alpine Linux) or buy out the FSF altogether, which will bring about the Dark Times.

 No.23330

>>23329 (me)
Essentially, what I'm saying is that both libre software and crypto are patchworks to the current system and are therefore not enough to bring real political change unless there will be a wave of pirate parties getting elected in multiple countries (let's be real: electoralism is a clown show, that will never happen).

 No.23331

>>23330 (me)
Regardless, both copyleft and crypto are tied to capitalism since copyleft relies on copyright just as much as crypto relies on cash. Without copyright there can be no copyleft because there's no copyright to subvert.

 No.23332

>>23288
You need to read Marx, and I don't say this in a mean way. He really does explain shit in a way that will make these questions answer themselves.

 No.23333

>>23314
How about fuck 'be responsible' to avoid the multitude of scams and just use a bank instead. If my bank goes bust or somehow gets stolen from I'll be fine up to like $250k, if my crypto exchange decides to steal all the customer money or I lose my wallet credentials I have nothing

 No.23334

>>23333
The idea of crypto is that your market transactions are private (not with Bitcoin, fuck Bitcoin, what a useless piece of speculative garbage).

 No.23335

i use it 4 one time purchases of unscrupulous goods
if i had to pay rent or buy groceries with it i would self-immolate

 No.23336

>>23333
This can be solved if real Banks accept and adopt crypto currencies.

 No.23337

>>23336
Pwease Sir I have this monopoly money. Can I get real money for it?

 No.23338

>>23337
not exchange for dollars. you know how your bank allows you to own other currencies? or even assets like gold? like that. from your bank's app you transfer 100 dollars to what ever equivalent of that to Monero. same way you exchange dollars for euros.
the whole point of banks is insurance, you can get that if banks adopt crypto.
and we already have "banks" that accept and deal with crypto, they're not real official banks but they function the same, more or less. eventually real banks will have to face reality and accept crypto.
because the technology is just too damn useful to be ignored, especially in times of crisis.

 No.23339

>>23338
Banks don't want to hold your shitcoins because it's nothing but a liability for them. They can't invest that money or do anything useful with it because of extreme volatility.

 No.23340

>>23339
It's a chicken and egg problem. but with time, as more and more people start to appreciate the value of crypto the volatility would dissipate.

 No.23341

>>23340
Can you explain what is the value is besides speculation? Bear in mind that if you used a bank your 'anonymity' would evaporate anyway.

 No.23342

>>23341
Right, but anonymity is not always the point, it's more like a perk of Monero. so im fine with storing my Moneros publically, most of the time. this is doable even with banks. basically my bank knows that I withdrew say a 100 Moneros but they have no idea where or what I did with those Moneros afterwards. sort of like how your ISP has no idea what you are doing after connecting to something like Tor, I can live with that.
the value is personal freedom, financial independence, simply put.

 No.23343

>>23342
So you're saying you want to be able to transfer monero from your bank to your wallet and then spend them rather than from the bank itself?

 No.23344

>>23343
NTA but yes.

 No.23345

>>23343
Yes, but not always. example, if I live in a country where weed is illegal, then I can't just use my bank to directly purchase illegal materials. but what I can do is withdraw my virtual fiat into paper fiat and purchase any illegal item without a record of the exchange. so why not just use cash? because Monero is essentially better than cash, it's electric cash.

 No.23346

>>23288
>you get to send any amount of money with all the benefits of cash and without all the problems of a centralized middle man
I cannot make sense of this, is this a shitpost? If you want the benefits of cash, my recommendation is cash.

You might not like that for any traditional state-currency system there are some people out there who have a special institutional advantage, but is there really a world of difference between this unfairness and the power in Bitcoin and similar schemes among those joining first? You might think the first-joiner advantage is somehow less unfair and just melts away over time. But before claiming that, you should try first to figure out first how unequal the distribution of this or that marvelous alternative currency is.

 No.23347

>>23346
>If you want the benefits of cash, my recommendation is cash
you do realize that physical currency has the con of liability right? from finger prints to DNA. also the time it takes to send cash. Monero is coin/cash 2.0. I can send a million bucks anonymously across the planet really fast. tell me how you can do that with any physical token? you can't.

 No.23350

>>23347
>I can send a million bucks anonymously across the planet really fast.
No you can't. You don't have a million bucks. You are bullshitting yourself with never-happening hypothetical situations.

 No.23351

>>23350
That's not the point. the point is that Monero has that benefit, it doesn't have to be a million dollars.
and some do have a use for that, such as online drug cartels, they deal with that amount and they do use Monero, it's not just a hypothetical.

 No.23361

So how's OP feeling after the latest XMR dump due to being delisted from exchanges?

Anyway, the reason why "the left" doesn't take crypto lolberts seriously is because the whole thing is just a non-sequitor and doesn't have to do with anything when it comes to abolishing capitalism. You're not gonna change anything by just switching the medium of exchange.
>YouTube alone is more of an energy blackhole than all of crypto combined
For fuck's sake, people really need the words "per capita" jammed into their brains, don't they? Crypto being this small but somehow comparable to fucking YouTube isn't a good thing for it at all. Can you guess the energy usage compared to Youtube if people began using it at the same scale? What about when compared to Visa when 6 billion people worldwide begin to use it (which is what you want)? Do you see how dumb you sound now?

 No.23362

i use it to buy bathtub estrogen and nothing else

 No.23363

>>23361
Maybe they just don't like the regulations instead of wanting its widespread adoption. Kinda like GNU/Linux elitists who don't want GNU/Linux get widespread adoption because it'll ruin it.

 No.23366

>>23351
You know what's even faster? Just sending a good/performing a service for another good/service.
disclaimer for smoothbrains no I don't believe ancient peoples did this.

 No.23367

>>23288
I like they my savings dont change value by double digit percents every month. I also like it when my payment goes through in microseconds rather than having to wait 5 minutes even with low load.

>YouTube alone is more of an energy blackhole than all of crypto combined.

Youtube is useful, crypto shit had no benefits. Just use a normal database bro.

 No.23370

>>23288
i XMR to buy drugs all the time though?

 No.23373

>>23362
Bourgies get outta here! Real proletarians use dogecoin to get toilet estro.

 No.23377

>>23367
no, jewtube streaming at 4k is not "useful". it's filled with mostly bullshit anyways. an anonymous currency on the other hand is useful.

 No.23378

>>23377
>jewtube
Good job being crypto, tard
Are you forgetting where you are again?

 No.23379

>>23378
what is this, kindergarten? we're not allowed to say no no words?

 No.23380

>>23379
I just think it's amusing you "people" think oppression is when it's socially required to not sperg about jews or blacks for 5 minutes.

 No.23381

>>23380
but im not a racist, I just like to use 4chans lingo.

 No.23382

File: 1707385357739.jpg (25.49 KB, 540x504, 1685207815593.jpg)

>>23381
>i'm not racist I just use racialised insults for everything

 No.23383

>>23382
that's fair, but I again assure you that im not a racist.

 No.23384

>>23383
Well then delete your 4chan bookmark and allow yourself to chill in spaces that won't make you accumulate that sorta stuff. Make a fedi, make a website, learn to use RSS, etc… At least 80% of 4chan's traffic is just AI trained on /pol/ posting at each other to trick advertisers into thinking they're getting more eyes than they really are. I know, I tried using /g/ for a while when shopping for a split keyboard.

 No.23385

You are a Crypto Fascist

 No.23396

>>23379
>we're not allowed to say no no words?
I'm not against saying the N-word but the """insults""" /pol/tards use are just stupid. As stupid as using the N-word as an insult.
>JEWtube. Getit? It's controlled by the J00Z… And J00Z SUCK!

 No.23413

>>23385
The stereotype of the "Jew" however, is evil.
scummy sleazy greedy back stabbing humanoid.
while of course this is just a racist stereotype, the people that run YouTube do have the characteristics of the "Jew", JewTube fits the stereotype, simply put.

 No.23415

>>23290
This. You're only into crypto if you have money to burn or you're retarded. Probably both.
OP is yet another delusional petite, per the flag.

 No.23421

>>23415
You guys are unbelievable, I'm pretty sure at this point that 99% of humanity is utterly retarded.no wonder no one values crypto.

 No.23423

>>23421
>You guys are unbelievable, I'm pretty sure at this point that 99% of humanity is utterly retarded.no wonder no one values crypto.
Hasty-generalization fallacy.
Appeal to common belief fallacy.
Ad hominem fallacy.

 No.23424

>>23300
it is literally just a shittier form of money lol

 No.23426

>>23423
suck my uyghur dick fallacy, you dumb cum guzzling faggot.
keep using fiat currency, keep losing. crypto chads will keep winning.

 No.23427

>>23426
post your gains then

 No.23429


 No.23430

>>23427
the gains are privacy and anonymity.
keep getting spied on, faggot.

 No.23445

>>23427
Crypto "gains" is itself misnomer, as they can't be (legally and especially reliably) solidified. It's one big ball of obfuscation. See OPs kneejerk response to the advertising being poorly received.


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