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File: 1608525831675.jpg (269.19 KB, 800x1200, 813Y1IRlY1L._RI_.jpg)

 No.4483[Last 50 Posts]

Going off this >>4480 anon's point about post-apocalyptic films; how does such fiction reproduce capitalist ideology generally?

 No.4494

File: 1608525832607.png (706.74 KB, 1280x534, fury road.png)

It's not that it's easier to imagine the end of the world than to imagine the end of capitalism. The end of the world is indeed the end of capitalism. For many people the only way to imagine the end of capitalism is to imagine the end of the world. Post-apocalyptic media usually doesn't depict people rebuilding after the apocalypse, so much as fighting over the scraps left over. The conceit is that without the current system everything descends into chaos. Supposedly, if we ditch capitalism we will look back upon the current times fondly as the antediluvian golden age.

This kind of fiction is what some call "nostalgia for the present." Unlike the supposed role of dystopian fiction as warning or satirical, the point of disaster/apocalypse porn is to make us feel like things aren't so bad after all. What little good exists in these world is not built or discovered, but salvaged from the present. As commodities without capitalist production, these things are an ephemeral reminder of the supposedly great past that has been lost by human folly. They will all disappear eventually, and the best the characters in these settings can do is hold onto these artifacts for as long as possible. You hardly ever see anyone building new things, beyond jury-rigging some scraps.

But why shouldn't people in the post-apocalypse build anything? Sure, in a disaster the supply chain will break down in the short term, but it's not like it's impossible to reconnect the raw materials and the processing centers. And with a sudden halt in manufacturing there would be huge piles of materials at all stages of production just lying around waiting to be used. It's not exactly logical, but do you think bourgeois film studios and other gatekeepers of mass media are going to allow a story where the workers just start using the means of production of their own accord? That would mean that the capitalist class are totally unnecessary!

The illogical nature of the standard post-apocalypse extends even farther than this, to a truly absurd degree. It's unusual in, for instance, a zombie apocalypse that somebody builds a wall or a fence to keep the zombies out. This would be a practical solution generally speaking, but where it does show up (as the writers have more recently become aware of the silliness), it's guaranteed to fail. Not just for "dramatic effect" (you can find other sources of drama besides humans failing to deal with the situation), but because in these kinds of stories rebuilding effectively simply isn't allowed. It's not part of the genre. The nature of the story is that humans are necessarily reduced to wanderers, hunter-gatherers killing each other and salvaging what little is left of the old world. When capitalist production stops, building new things stops too. And worse, previously built things often stop working. It's a very common trope in apocalyptic fiction where things break constantly. Even things that logically should not break. Even very shortly after society breaks down. There's no reason that cars would just stop working a couple of months into the apocalypse. There's no reason buildings would start falling apart within a couple of years. But the point of these stories is that if the world comes to a stop, it's all over. If these things didn't immediately start falling apart it would undermine the vision being created. If buildings just stood on their own (like they always did) and the world kept turning without the status quo continuing, that makes people ask questions. Just look at how people have responded to the corona virus impacting the economy. Reality is being clarified, illusions dispelled. In order for the ideology of dependence to be conveyed, a massive dose of unreality must be injected. And of course it does. The ideology is ridiculous, so too is its rationalization.

The sheer volume of this kind of fiction should raise eyebrows, and so should its uniformity. This is the only vision of the future we are supposed to have, other than things continuing essentially as they are. The only deviation we are supposed to imagine is disaster, and we are supposed to imagine it often. We are supposed to be too afraid of the alternative to seriously consider it. This is why not just post-apocalyptic fiction, but sci-fi, fantasy, anything not set in the present has developed the tendency to be relentlessly bleak. Where we experience hope it's supposed to be in some version of the present, even if it's a heightened one like the superhero movies or a near future where the basic model hasn't changed. If people feel hopeful looking at any alternative to this world, they might develop some desire to change things. Post-apocalyptic fiction takes this illogic all the way to its conclusion, saying that if things change everything will go to shit and you will long for the world as it is now. This is the kind of mentality used by domestic abusers to keep people in line too: make people fear leaving the situation and grow dependent upon and comfortable with their abuse.

 No.4500

>>4494
FUCK, that is heavy. I want to know if you know of any genuinely uplifting stories about the post-capitalist future, other than Star Trek.

 No.4523

Don't we already have a dystopia/post-apocalypse thread, why is there another one?

 No.4536

>>4500
There’s plenty of it. The Noon, Culture are explicitly post capitalism.

 No.4577

I wonder if there's any pro-socialist post-apocalypse stuff out there

 No.4586

>>4577
A pro-socialist post-apocalypse story would just have the people rebuilding society and trying to preserve technology. It would be so different it was functionally a different genre.

 No.4872

>>4523
I guess Dystopia is more for an actual existing yet dysfunctional society, rather than the lack of a real society.

 No.5043

>>4586
>>4577
>>4494
This is why New Vegas is based. People literally complain it isn't apocalyptic enough, but it's pretty much post post apocalypse.

 No.5060

>>4494
I think you're kinda overthinking it anon, the post-apocalyptic setting without any rebuilding of civilization is just a fun and interesting setting, and it lets people escape the monotony and safety of everyday life by imagining themselves as a rugged, badass survivor fighting off bandits or whatever

 No.5068

>>4586
Would you say that perhaps Horizon Zero Dawn is such a story?

 No.5144

Am I the only one who disliked Mad Max Fury Road? I mean its effects were great and they had some fun moments of weird shit, but a lot of it made no fucking sense or was just plain stupid without actually needing to be. Also the increased use of CGI was a bit jarring coming off the older Mad Max films.

 No.5151

>>5144
What didn’t make sense in your opinion?

 No.5154

>>5151
2 examples
The massive water taps that Angry Joe or Tartan Joe or whatever controls. It just opens up from high up and then fucking splatters onto the ground, not even a fucking pool or a water-recollector but the ground where people like animals try to get a few bycket fuls from thsi mess.

The second example is more a nitpick but when Furiosa gets pinned down "Max" takes a conveniently hidden gun and shoots half a dozen rounds near her head… why? Why waste it like that?
1) a single bullet near the ear will already set it ringing
2) bullets are valuable resources
3) Why did he know the hiding spot of a hidden gun.

 No.5156

>>5154
>The massive water taps that Angry Joe or Tartan Joe or whatever controls. It just opens up from high up and then fucking splatters onto the ground, not even a fucking pool or a water-recollector but the ground where people like animals try to get a few bycket fuls from thsi mess.
It came from an underground acquifer, Joe had them fight like animals to dehumanize them and keep in place their dependence
>3) Why did he know the hiding spot of a hidden gun.
Just a cool moment
>2) bullets are valuable resources
Not his bullets
>3) Why did he know the hiding spot of a hidden gun.
Experience

 No.5157

>>5156
>an underground acquifer
That doesn't make it ny smarter to waste it on the ground, especially when the baking sun would evaporate a bunch of it. If he wanted to do the whole "dehumanize" shtick (which is pretty meh already), then do it at dawn or dusk, where the water wsted would just sink into the ground before evaporating.
>a cool moment
Alright, accepted
>Not his bullets
They are when he takes possession of them and has nothing else to his name. Bullets are a precious commodity in self-defense in the desert
>Experience
Ok I can accept that.

 No.5609

>>4494
What do you think about the new TLOU2

 No.5923

File: 1608525992775.jpg (248.95 KB, 1200x874, pripyat.jpg)

>>5043
The funniest part of FO:NV is that the barrenness of the setting makes sense because it's the fucking Mohave. Las Vegas is only not a barren desert now because people set up a city there. Meanwhile Fallout 3 is set in the DC metro area with the Potomac cutting through the map and basically nothing has regrown since the bombs fell. Like with inanimate objects no longer working (often for no reason) you never see the fucking plants regrowing. Look at Pripyat or the Bikini Atoll. Massive radiation and explosions fucked things up for a while but it was only a few years before the life came back. Shit, the bikini atoll has probably suffered more from climate change than from nuclear testing, what with ocean acidification causing coral bleaching.

 No.6312

I think Mad Max sort of loses charisma without Mel Gibson as the lead.

 No.6416

>>5609
You mean The Last of Us 2 right? Pretty shit in terms of story but not as bad as the trailers seemed.

 No.7830

I'm surprised there are so little entries in this thread.

 No.10318

List the best (and worst) Post-Apocalyptic films and books you know.

 No.10323

>>5923
>Pripyat
>The preserved ur-example of late stage USSR collapse
>Still looks a hundred times better than any burgerstani city I have seen
>Would be a pretty comfy place to live if not, you know, the radiation

 No.10333


 No.10334

File: 1608526554934.png (210.95 KB, 800x757, bethesduh wasteland.png)

>nobody posted it yet

 No.10397

File: 1608526562169.png (118.97 KB, 805x643, demoniccapitalism.png)

>>4494
>If these things didn't immediately start falling apart it would undermine the vision being created. If buildings just stood on their own (like they always did) and the world kept turning without the status quo continuing, that makes people ask questions. Just look at how people have responded to the corona virus impacting the economy. Reality is being clarified


Yes this is related to the point one of our writers makes about the age of 'coronacapitalism'. In order to respond humanely and save lives we have to rethink what purpose of the economy is/should be. However Capitalism as an autonomous system reacts against this new ontology and thus the only avenue left to it is to demand death instead

https://newmultitude.org/demonic-capitalism/

I've been following the conversation about Snowpiercer and thought it was a good one, especially the debate as to whether the train is capitalism or the state. Would like to put up an summary article about it. Will do it myself unless someone here wants to do it.

"The capitalist realism of post apocalypse fiction" is also good, anon. Would you be interested in having this published on the site? If so, and you want to develop your essay more, just make it a pastebin, or if not, just let me know what your name is so I can credit you.

 No.10422

>>10397
Put it on the multitude, fam!

 No.10576

Book of Eli

 No.10577

>>10422
What a waste of epic quads

 No.10580

File: 1608526583599.png (210.43 KB, 871x900, christchan.png)

>>10576
Speaking of Christianity and Christian Communists;
We're vastly outnumbered and have to avoid talking politics with 90% of our fellow believers so I feel that the latent frustration will probably force all of us off the grid by the end of the decade, joined up with whatever Amish commune or traditional Christian community that is still active.

You guys can enjoy the hopeless fight against the liberals. Also as a very visible ethnic minority I can confidently state that the mainstream church isn't racist and hasn't been for a long time. America may be an exception since they're uniquely retarded and the legacy of the civil war still hangs over them but I've been to multiple churches in different countries and my most recent church provided for and hosted refugees from Syria even though they were muslim. And this church is in a solidly right-wing voting district so it's not like they're heretics or universalists or whatever. Atheist perception of the church is about as informed and honest as the rightoid perception of communism/socialism/etc.

Also in regards to modern cyberpunk-tier developments like neural implants;
I've been thinking about this, and if this becomes mainstream, I will become a hard core Christian, not because I actually believe in the shit, but for legal protection. I can likely get out of being micros chipped by my job for a religious exception, weirdo evangelicals are against micro chipping and considering their political influence they might win a supreme court case about it.

 No.10639

>>10580
>Christcucks would rather join a reactionary community, as long as it believes in the same delusion as them, then fight for a better world
Further proof that there are no commie christians and christianity is an inherently reactionary ideology.

 No.10641

File: 1608526592965.jpg (135.84 KB, 600x432, Hippy jesus beat it.jpg)

>>10639
>completely misunderstanding the post and its point
&ltMuh christ cucks
Stay mad
>christianity is an inherently reactionary
&ltBeing seclusive and avoiding government indoctrination through loopholes is "reactionary"
Ok buster, try reading the bible before blabbing your mouth
>join a reactionary community
The fuck are you talking about?
>fight for a better world
And yet Christians, Muslims and other religious people have been parts of socialist revolutions and movements… but you'll ignore that because it's convenient to be a "New Atheist" contrarian edgelord.

 No.11174

>>11172
Post-Apocalyptic adventure movie, worth watching.

 No.11180

The Dead Don't Die is a pretty funny post-apocalyptic/zombie movie. Thought I might suggest it.

 No.12463

Mad Max Fury Road; an Allegorical America
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cCIyq0ikaSw

 No.12822

File: 1608526879408-0.jpg (30.3 KB, 500x358, plankton.jpg)

File: 1608526879408-1.jpg (376.97 KB, 673x1024, BP's all porky.jpg)

>muh doomsday scenario
Capitalist elite will inherently have more survival chances in any scenario(search "neo-feudalism"), even if half the plankton goes extinct(plankton : the primary source of oxygen in the atmosphere).
https://earthsky.org/earth/how-much-do-oceans-add-to-worlds-oxygen

As the pollution(microplastic) and CO2(ocean acidification) start killing off plankton in large amounts, the percentage of oxygen will begin dropping,
which will start killing animals, starting with less efficient lung-less supply system - sort of a "canary in the coalmine", such as insects( we live in a world with 'dwarf insects' because larger insects died off due inefficient oxygen supply system. https://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2010/10/101029132924.htm ) (human might create a "bottled air" economy or domed cities to prolong civilization) and eventually life on the "unprotected" surface will either die or adapt to low oxygen levels(think spacesuits and oxygen balloons):
populations which can't afford to buy bottled oxygen will slowly choke to death and die from anoxia. The elite might survive with robotic industry and automation in some way, but there will be no "consumer economy" or grand-scale civilization with billions.

The future is not looking good, even if you stop most CO2 the pollution in the ocean will takes decades to clear off(microplastic is especially vile stuff that poisons the marine food chain
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/sciencetech/article-4420992/Shocking-photos-reveal-plankton-consuming-microplastics.html )

The scale of pollution, the plastic-filled oceans is not known, the microplastic is invisible, tiny specks.
Here is how the marine food chain collapses:
Plankton eat microplastic.
The fish bio-accumulate plastic by eating plankton.
Sea predators eat plastic-filled fish.
They all receive a hefty dose of endocrine disrupting chemicals and various plastic-bound toxins( https://www.mdpi.com/1660-4601/17/5/1509/htm ).

Now trees: you see articles everyday about forest fires, amazon burning, but it doesn't occur to you its oxygen-generating capacity burning off: the "oxygen capital" of entire planet is systematically wasted and destroyed. With no trees and no plankton, the planet dies.

Find a flaw:
1.plankton produces oxygen
2.plankton eats microplastic
3.plankton dies. Plankton breed less due acidic, warmer water and chemicals in plastic -filled water.
4.Trees produce oxygen.
5.Trees are burned off.
6.Remaining sources of oxygen are insufficient to sustain the current ecosystem.
7.Mass extinction of oxygen-dependent life begins.
8.No economic solutions will stop the process.
9.Oxygen becomes a commodity product.
10.Hyper-capitalism develops where oxygen is a currency.
11.Oxygen producing factories become critical industry.
12.People need to live in domed cities and use spacesuits to travel.
13.Eventually the elite class holds the entire(remaining) population on stranglehold by monopolizing oxygen supply and controlling society with Strong AI.

 No.12823

>>12822
You are a massive faggot who consumes pop culture depictions of robots and climate change. Guzzling down children's movies and Arnold Schwarzenegger films is bad for your mental health, I'm surprised.

Plankton aren't the most important thing determining the health and temperature of the ocean. They are an incredibly important part but a decent portion of them sying won't be world ending. It'll make things worse but it won't fucking suffocate us if some shrimp get killed in the waters solely around the USA pollution zone.
Trees aren't all going to magically burn down or get cut away. People are trying to stop that shit and if the people ruing forests don't, they will die when the are flooded or otherwise suffering as a result.

Automation has it's logical limits. Saying robots will take over is both technophilic and against the theory of capitalist technological stagnation. Falling profits coincide with enviroment self destruction, is this not clear? There is no logical reason technology would even advance under dire circumstances, dire circumstances would mean a return to human slavery since you wouldn't have to intricately design and fuel the thing.

You are not even a leftist. This is malthusian neoliberal reddit talk that you are parroting verbatim.

 No.12824

>>12823
Most water pollution is disproportionally American and western (as are all types of pollution)
Once the contradictions between the polluting west and third world occurs, most of the world will safe from breathing or drinking poison.

https://www.ecowatch.com/amp/malaysia-plastic-waste-2644881004
https://www.reuters.com/article/amp/idUSKCN1T10BQ
https://amp.cnn.com/cnn/2019/07/18/asia/cambodia-rejects-trash-intl-hnk/index.html
https://www.weforum.org/agenda/2019/12/plastic-waste-indonesia-pollution-health/
https://www.theguardian.com/environment/2017/mar/29/western-consumers-fuelling-tens-of-thousands-of-air-pollution-related-deaths

Countries that still pollute and ruin ecosystems will have to pay the price. Backlash will come from both people and the earth.
Take Brazil for instance. They intensified the destruction of the rain forrest and have allowed every type of pollution. They are on fire and drowning in smog amidst unprecedented social decay and unrest. Brazil is now on fire and engulfed in riots and all of south America is building towards an actual revolution against the right wing.

The United States has even turned to suicidal wars in the middle east because it doesn't want to face the domestic backlash of exploiting it's own land. They aren't willing to implement massive fracking operations and they aren't willing to tear down forests to sustain urban growth. The result is cities on edge that will riot if the power goes out and need to fight abroad. Once America is in dire need you will see a breaking point in the death cycle we are in.

 No.12825

>>12823 (me)
>>12824 (me)
Marxism-Maoism-Kaczynskism is the science that guides proper theory

 No.12826

>>12823
>Guzzling down children's movies and Arnold Schwarzenegger films is bad for your mental health
>I'm surprised
SO much random bullshit where only 1-2 lines are even remotely relevant
>This is malthusian
The fuck are you on about? How is pointing out the current tendency of our own self-destruction Malthusian? Utter dolt.
>You're not leftist
As if you are

>>12824
You're just stating facts about the environment that I neither disputed and are in fact confirming my point… to what purpose besides information?
>>12825
Good luck with that.

 No.12827

>>12824
You mean American and Chinese while everyone in the southern hemisphere must deal with its effects.

 No.12828

The Crazies remake is a pretty good film

 No.12837

>>12826
Where did you get the idea that we are going to buy air and or be ruled by machines, were else but movies.
The idea of a feedback loop was popularized by malthus. Population and development would keep growing forever despite any imminent reason to stop.
The stuff you said is ridiculous and pushed by psychopaths idk.

>>12827
The Chinese don't pollute to ridiculously disproportionate levels.

 No.12846

File: 1608526883006-0.png (403.07 KB, 686x768, India Oxygen bar.png)

File: 1608526883006-1.jpg (411.61 KB, 600x2267, corporate psychopaths.jpg)

>>12837
>The Chinese don't pollute to ridiculously disproportionate levels.
They do, but it's being cleaned up and unlike the USA, they are developing and growing, so the amount of waste is expected. Still they're far worse than the USSR in many environmental regards.

>>12837
>The idea of a feedback loop was popularized by malthus
That does not intrinsically make it untrue or Malthusian. The bible holds lines that are similar to Communist theory, that doesn't mean Communism is Catholic or Catholicism is Communist. Positive and Negative Feedback loops are observed in biology and are undeniable.
>Where did you get the idea that we are going to buy air
1) If you were a bit more aware, there is plenty of cynical humor common discussions that, after water and everything else is turned into a sold commodity, the next will be clean air/filters. FFS, even the shitty Lorax movie portrays this (also the Celestial Dragons from One Piece). It also has precedent in real life, given the toxicity of the current air. In India there are Oxygen 'bars' (pic related).
>From movies
No actually. My work is environmental science, and a common discussion for policies is the allocation of resources, with serious ideas about making water only a sold commodity to "reduce wastefulness" with discussions involving. Films and books reflect reality, not the other way around, The writings of Huxley and Orwell did not dictate the current progression of capitalism, they reflected the then future prospects.
>Population and development would keep growing forever despite any imminent reason to stop
Exponential Growth metrics come to a hard stop because of carrying capacity. If a species does not adhere to the capacity (or in humanity's option, raise said capacity), they will rocket up exponentially past it, and then crash just as hard, and given that Porky always benefits from crises, what do you think will happen?
>The stuff you said is ridiculous and pushed by psychopaths
No, it's reality, while everyone else struggle, Porky will sit high and dry, and use the strife and misery to profit more, to control more, to solidly make the lower-classes wretched, afflicted people who serve their own oppressors, forever. Psychopaths? Corporations and the 1% have no single face, but if they did, it would be that of a psychopath indeed.

 No.12848

>>12846
>with discussions involving
*involving Air/oxygen commodification as a future concept. The easiest way to control someone is to not only control a vital resource, but also convince them that you control it rightfully, a la the head of Nestle, who stated that water ought not be free, but controlled (by corporations) all while Nestle is abusing water supplies far more than any city population.

 No.19371

>>10580
>force all of us off the grid by the end of the decade
Doesn't sound like the worst thing judging by Kibbutzes.

 No.19430

File: 1630680545682.png (2.13 MB, 795x1280, ClipboardImage.png)

If you want a real original story about climate change etc. turning into a pre-apocalypse check out Ben Elton's novel "Stark" it was written back in the 80's but now it's starting to look ahead of it's time. It even had a TV series
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stark_(TV_series)

It's themes include
- Air pollution
- The Campaign for Nuclear Disarmament
- Displacement of Indigenous peoples from their land
- Far right politics
- Finance
- Global warming
- Nuclear power
- Racism
- Recreational drug use
- Unrequited love
- Uranium mining
- White supremacy

 No.19433

File: 1630689267319.jpg (161.25 KB, 1000x600, battlefield-earth-2.jpg)

I always thought the post apocalyptic look of Battlefield Earth was cool. I know the movie wasn't the best, but frankly I really enjoyed it, and think it's extremely over-hated. Travolta is such fun as a character, the alien designs were humanoid yet still distinctly alien (somewhat like the Yautja) and each alien and character had a distinct face and look rather than being generic as fuck, even the mooks were memorable to me. Sure there is some gung-ho Americana (like the Jets vs Alien fighter-craft scene) but it's based on a book written by an American, what are they supposed to write? Frankly if this movie had some problems ironed out (and maybe a few good one liners from a famous actor playing the protagonist), I think it would probably have gotten the same cult-following that Independence Day did, especially since it has a very similar cheesy tone. John Travolta is plays his role excellently and the Psychlos are very fun villains and the movie over-all has a lot of personality.

A sequel could have finished the story and would have been great with all the additional species. There is always talk about how terrible the movie was, but that's just in comparison to the book, which is always the case. The differences were to make it possible to make a movie. It is unrealistic to compare movies to books, they rarely hold up.

https://archive.ph/2EFiI
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battlefield_Earth_(film)

 No.21110

Book of Eli has a lot of good ideas but kinda undermines it using dumb shit.

 No.21147

Is Tom Hanks' "Finch" a decently good post-apocalyptic movie?
https://kinogo.la/35353-finch_2021.html

 No.24813

>>12846
>Pic 1
Literally the Lorax movie

 No.25808

>>4494
>It's unusual in, for instance, a zombie apocalypse that somebody builds a wall or a fence to keep the zombies out. This would be a practical solution generally speaking, but where it does show up (as the writers have more recently become aware of the silliness), it's guaranteed to fail.

Like in land of the dead where humans have a mostly secure (capitalist) society that fails because they didn't know that zombies can just walk across the bottom of the fucking river.

 No.25809

File: 1654627960130.mp4 (565.64 KB, 534x400, reddit.mp4)


 No.30975

>>25809
silly but relevance?

>>4483
Terminator Salvation is post-apocalyptic technically

 No.34891

>>10397
Surprised nobody has mentioned the SnowPiercer thread ITT >>4441

 No.35033

File: 1688523415559.png (577.88 KB, 500x682, ClipboardImage.png)

A dystopian film that I think everyone forgot because it was so boringly nonsensical - Oblivion
In spite of having Morgan Freeman and Tom Cruise as famous names on board, the film was just boring and full of symbolism that doesn't mean anything really and is just there for it to appear "deep" and meaningful. The main "antagonist" just feels like every generic robot overlord villain. The clone twist was generic a decade before its release. It even steals a line from Escape from New York about dying right at the end.

Also the drones from the Sonic live action films belonging to Eggman appear very similar to the ones from Oblivion.

https://archive.ph/L14eY
https://archive.ph/nb8wi
https://www.patheos.com/blogs/filmchat/2013/04/some-of-the-many-sci-fi-films-that-oblivion-borrows-from.html

 No.35045

Modern day Robinsonades, which Marx compared Smith and Ricardo's cartoonish, idyllic views of the beginning of class society to

 No.35046

>>35045
More precisely, it's the post-Industrial Revolution culture's attempt to reconcile that individualist view of the beginning of class society with its own situation, where nature began to become more and more untouched and all of these industrial goods would still be laying around even if the society that produced them went to shit.

 No.35047

>>35033
I started watching that recently and I stopped maybe 10-15 minutes in because the plot made zero sense and like you said it was boring as fuck. I think most movies where there's only a handful of people tend to be terrible and I wasn't interested in watching just Tom Cruise and literally who have video game dialogue for an hour. Didn't even realize Morgan Freeman was in it.

 No.35058

>>35047
I really don't get Tom Cruise's popularity outside of being a pretty face. At least a comparably famous action actor like Harrison Ford emotes well, has actual charisma and isn't just the same pretty-boy jock Burgers have been salivating over for years. He was shit as a young actor in that slog Top Gun and he's still just as shit now.

 No.35059

>>10323
now that you mention it if you imagine that area without radiation and fully functional buildings(keep the fully formed forest) it would be a sweet ass place to live

 No.35060

>>35058
>I really don't get Tom Cruise's popularity outside of being a pretty face
It's his energy and willingness to push limits on stunt work.

 No.35061

>>35060
Ok I'll give him the stunt-work part, kinda forgot about that TBH

 No.35405

>>35058
He's insane so it's really easy for him to disconnect from reality and slide into whatever role he's playing, whether it's lawyer or ball handler, superspy or Jew.

 No.35808

>>4494
Very good post. I would also add that post-apocalyptic fiction is heavily tied to the idea of the state of nature. It's a thought experiment designed to discover the true human essence hidden behind the veil of society. In fiction, Robinson Crusoe is one of the first of such works, coinciding with the first great theorists of liberalism. Post-apocalyptic stories are basically Robinson Crusoe stories, just with more people.

Liberal ideology bases its view of society on the assumption that it is first made up of abstract individuals who then go on to create society, establishing a social contract between themselves.

Such works of art can be seriously problematic, irrespective of whether it romanticizes being outside of society or tries brighten our views about day-to-day reality by showing us what supposedly lies outside of it. For the most part, it never manages to show what humanity really is, it only lays bare all the political bias and every single unknown assumption the author has. Here is one very simple example: if the Last of Us series came out about 20 years ago, I'm almost entirely sure there wouldn't have been any gay characters in it. The reason why it never gets us any closer to the real humanity is because trying talk about society by imagining a world without society makes as much sense as trying to light a campfire with a bucket of water.

It's a very political genre with very little political imagination. It's very unsurprising to me that only the Russians managed to make work. I'm talking about Metro 2033 which is basically a microcosmos of Russian civil society after the Soviet collapse. Maybe the only problem is that the Americans produce these works.

 No.36077

File: 1693371735776-2.png (3.28 MB, 1920x1080, ClipboardImage.png)

A Quiet Place can be called Post-Apocalyptic, at least locally. I'll discuss it more later. What I wanted to talk about right now is the monsters of the movie. The alien creatures called Death Angels or The Listeners are blind, with strange inverted front limbs and extremely good hearing. Their faces spread apart in a horrifying mass of teeth and they look vaguely grotesque. All in all an interesting design that combines the Future Predator from Primeval with the Demogorgon from Stranger Things. I'm fairly sure of this because even the trope such creatures belong is fairly underrepresented

https://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/SenseImpairedMonster
https://a-quiet-place.fandom.com/wiki/Death_Angels
https://primeval.fandom.com/wiki/Future_Predator
https://strangerthings.fandom.com/wiki/The_Demogorgon

 No.36078

Semi-Reposting my old post from the old film thread
Watched Love and Monsters and it was great. For a low-budget cheesy monster movie, it has good plot, fun characters, fairly good CGI and practical effects and a nice message. The monster designs are creative and really carry across the whole "mutant" idea, and reminds me of some other works of science fiction with similar premises. It's a shame it didn't go to theaters.

Paramount's own trailer description is the best nonspoiler summary,
Seven years after the Monsterpocalypse, Joel Dawson (Dylan O’Brien), along with the rest of humanity, has been living underground ever since giant creatures took control of the land. After reconnecting over radio with his high school girlfriend Aimee (Jessica Henwick), who is now 80 miles away at a coastal colony, Joel begins to fall for her again. As Joel realizes that there’s nothing left for him underground, he decides against all logic to venture out to Aimee, despite the dangerous monsters that stand in his way.

I enjoyed it the same way I enjoyed Pacific Rim and there's a lot of good stuff to find, with plenty of worldbuilding and effort behind the cheesy action and monsters. It's available on fmovies.wtf (Have uBlock Origin and Popupblockers) and is plenty of fun to watch. A similar film though not as campy or fun is Monsters (2010).

 No.36079

File: 1693379878337.jpg (422.01 KB, 1920x1080, apocalypse.jpg)

The notion of the post-apocalypse gives the illusion that "history" is merely a series of events and not the fulfilment of socialism.
The idea that the world can "end" (because capitalism ends) is part of the ahistoricism of the age, and the unconscious fear of socialism, as a reaffirmation of class struggle present under current fukuyamaist conditions.
Liberalism of course strives to perpetuate a discourse of "human nature" as selfishness, combined with its darwinist dogma of "might is right", which is the whole spirit of the post-apocalypse: liberalism without liberalism, a total naturalising of capitalist relations.
HOWEVER, the context of a world in ruin also signifies the current environment and speaks to the opportunity we have to see it for what it is.
If we stop thinking this is possible and realise this is what we are living in, we can begin to change it.

 No.36081

>>36077
the design is neat, but it doesn’t really make any sense. in my opinion the movie would have been more logical and probably more interesting if the beasts were much more intelligent and capable of proper thinking, like imagine these blind things baiting people into making sound trough trickery and baits.

 No.36082

>>36081
The radical othering of external threats is typical in today's culture. Its what lends itself to fascist reaction.

 No.36088

File: 1693443582389.png (1.04 MB, 1600x800, ClipboardImage.png)

>>36081
The design makes sense for creatures that live in eternal darkness like the Bioraptors from Pitch Black of the Riddick chronicles (although their sensitivity to light and "wave" tactics was a bit asinine).
What you describe is essentially closer to the Future Predator from Primeval which had ape-like intelligence, while the Death Angels were typical movie monsters.
>imagine these blind things baiting people into making sound trough trickery and baits.
Yeah, terrifying to be honest.

Now that I think about it, Xenomorph aliens are a decent representation of the functionally blind concept, since they have no eyes.

 No.36089

File: 1693444659794.png (570.68 KB, 700x339, ClipboardImage.png)

>>36082
>The radical othering of external threats is typical in today's culture. Its what lends itself to fascist reaction.
What the flying fuck are you talking about? How is that word-salad at all relevant to a monster creature design?

>>36079
>The notion of the post-apocalypse gives the illusion that "history" is merely a series of events and not the fulfilment of socialism.
This idea of "history inevitably leads to socialism" is dogmatic nonsense. At least Manifest Destiny isn't as conceited as to think humanity must go to a singular point. There's a reason the slogan "Socialism or Barbarism" exists, because it is the actions of humanity that determine if historical material dialectics will lead to socialism or not. Marx predicted the transition as a result of economic and social conflict, comparable to the conflict in feudalism that led to the formation of capitalism as a dominant form of socio-economics in the Post-Renaissance West, however this course is not set in stone, it wouldn't be a class struggle if it was.
>Liberalism of course strives to perpetuate a discourse of "human nature" as selfishness, combined with its darwinist dogma of "might is right", which is the whole spirit of the post-apocalypse: liberalism without liberalism, a total naturalising of capitalist relations.
Post-Apocalyptic media is no more liberal than the ones creating a specific film/book/etc. Human Nature and humanity is contradictive, we naturally are competitive and arose from hominids that had loose hierarchies where might did make right, but simultaneously these hominids evolved to socialize in complex manners and cooperate and gain the ability to empathize with others. Because every society is made up of individuals (I paraphrase Stalin here) you cannot have a society that only prioritizes the community at the expense of the individual, or vice-versa.
In a theoretical Post-Apocalypse there will absolutely be rule of the strong over the weak because the institutions that equalize us will not exist formally and at best be informal communities like in the distant past. But even the strong will form communities, and even as some humans commits atrocities, others commit acts of great kindness. Humanity is not one great giant conglomeration of homogenized ideas or actions, they are a society of many-faceted individuals making up a collective whole that may have majorities and minorities, may have acts of evil and good and may either destroy or create, to go with their feelings and instincts or act with rationality and cold logic, they can choose to do either and the unpredictability of this on a macro scale means that humanities future is indeterminate and that the theorem of socialism being the next stage of social development is only a theory based on the predicted direction of past material dialectics, the future remains as unknown as it ever did.

 No.36117

>>36089
Making your enemy a soulless alien monster is the politics of fascism
>This idea of "history inevitably leads to socialism" is dogmatic nonsense.
I dont mind being a socialist dogmatist
>Human Nature and humanity is contradictive
Transcendental error
Everything human comes from human nature
As we also come from the larger spectrum of nature itself
Again, only darwinists (capitalists) posit nature as this cruel merciless anarchy that humans have conquered, and that we need to defend against by "inventing" morality and so on. Its nonsense.
We are already in a post-apocalypse, thats my point. The fantasy of a "real" post-apocalypse is reactionary, thats why they both love accelerationism and primitivism, since technocapitalism is able to unleash their excessive desires.

 No.36119

File: 1693516169941.png (782.75 KB, 660x673, Hewl-Tanky.png)

>>36117
>Making your enemy a soulless alien monster is the politics of fascism
No anon, that's not how dehumanization (which you clearly refer to) works. To dehumanize something, you must take a human(oid) and represent them as evil and vile. A monster is in many senses a force of nature or a reflection of humanity depending on how deep the monster in a film is being. This "every monster is fascist dehumanization" is utter nonsense and typical over-extrapolation based on loose ideas. Godzilla was symbolic of the atom bomb tests and was originally possessed by the souls of the Japanese killed in WW2 angry with Japan because they were sent to die by the Emperor's decisions. The Xenomorph from the Alien franchise are horror of alien lifeforms with an emasculatory method of propagation, Pennywise is a creature that preys on the fears of children and so hunts children. These movie monsters are different aspects of the emotion of fear and terror. They are inhuman and so not as mundane as your average serial killer, even movie slasher villains and serial killers have aspects unique to them that make them supernatural.
>I dont mind being a socialist dogmatist
Then you're a foolish ideologue looking for things that aren't there.
>only darwinists (capitalists) posit nature as this cruel merciless anarchy that humans have conquered
Neither of these things is true.
1) Darwinism relates to a proven theory of Evolution; survival of the fittest, which does not mean what you think it means. It means that those that survive and propagate are those that are the fittest in one aspect or another and their traits are passed down to their children more or less.
2) The idea of Nature being conquered and fighting with humanity is as old as humanity itself, to somehow claim this as a capitalist idea is ignorant ahistorical rubbish.
>we need to defend against by "inventing" morality
What the fuck are you even on about? You seem to be conflating Nature itself with the concept of Human Nature. Going by instincts there is no civil dialogue or discussion in the case of high tensions and emotions, without morality, ethics and cold logic which belongs to sapient creatures like humans, we would likely have never reached the level of material development we have now. Violent atrocities that are immoral could not be defended against because such actions are "human nature" going by your schizophrenic logic.
>We are already in a post-apocalypse
You clearly do not understand the meaning of APOCALYPSE which is a very serious event resulting in great destruction and change. The fall of the USSR was not an apocalypse, WW2 and WW1 are as close to an apocalypse as we have seen in recent times. For Greece the Dark Era was their apocalypse when written language and cohesive governments were all but lost and the population lived in isolated communities with significantly less development than in centuries prior.
>The fantasy of a "real" post-apocalypse is reactionary
No it is not. Fantasizing about living in one and having slave girls and what all isn't reactionary either, even if it is a scummy fantasy, that's not the meaning of reactionary.
>they both love accelerationism and primitivism
I've never seen any fascist be pro-primitivist or accelerationist, primarily because fascists have an obsession with authoritarianist dictatorship like that of Nazi Germany, the aesthetics of which would be wholly contradictive to the libertarian ancapistan fantasy that Post-Apocalyptic living would lend itself to.
Then your next statement
>since technocapitalism is able to unleash their excessive desires.
completely contradicts your point and confirms my own.

Furthermore within the genre of Post-Apocalypse the hero is often the person that rejects the brutal rules of the post-apocalyptic world, that fights against the harsh "strong oppress the weak" lifestyle. Guts, Kenshiro, Mad Max, Tank Girl, Spike Spiegel, Joshua Graham, Joel Miller, Solid Snake, Lionel Verney, Nausicaä, etc. are all positive characters that reject the descent into barbarism that the apocalypse threw them into.

What we live in now is a dystopia, simply less techno-punk than what films and books imagined it as. A dystopia is not the same as a Post-Apocalypse, even if one can exist with the other. We have not HAD an apocalypse occur for our society to be Post-Apocalyptic.

 No.36123

>>36119
"Humanity versus nature" has been a discourse for milennia because it is idealist and sees man as more than an animal, thats what "humanitas" refers too on the first place, one distinguished as part of a "free" polity, as opposed to women, children, slaves and animals.
The powers of reason, morality and so on have ALWAYS existed, and have NOT changed - so what changes is material conditions, which are progressed by labour power.
>APOCALYPSE which is a very serious event resulting in great destruction and change.
Global capitalism IS this
People have commented before on the condition of japan after 2 nukes being incomparable to the destructive power that liberalism has on the planet. Same with the conditions of WW2 being a simple drop in the bucket - difference with ww2 is its anthropocentric discourse.

 No.36124

File: 1693525144386.png (149.06 KB, 478x328, ClipboardImage.png)

>>36123
Now you're shifting goal-posts and brushing past your dogmatic assertions being incorrect.
>"Humanity versus nature" has been a discourse for milennia because it is idealist
No, it is based on material dialectics and the formation of human societies and cultures.
>sees man as more than an animal
Because we are more than our physical selves and instincts, that is what makes us sapient, sentient beings and not just smart animals.
>one distinguished as part of a "free" polity, as opposed to women, children, slaves and animals.
That is not how humanitas is defined, not then and certainly not in the current age. The lack of rights for women, children and slaves was because of the general nature of Ancient Societies, that have been almost universally male dominated. That was based on the material realities of the time which was caused by the material development from prehistory into the first civilizations. Thus etymology reflects this male-centrism for the most part.
>Global capitalism IS this
Fantastical nonsense. Global capitalism is not an event, it is a socio-economic environment.
>People have commented before on the condition of japan after 2 nukes being incomparable to the destructive power that liberalism has on the planet
And?
>Same with the conditions of WW2 being a simple drop in the bucket
WW2 and WW1 were the end of the British Empire as we know it, the losses of 100s of millions of people and destruction of social, economic, political and other structures on a scale never seen before, all within a few years. WW2 was in the grand scale of time, an event… an event, which the occurrences within would shape the direction of history. To say it is just a drop in the bucket is to be utterly ignorant of the scale and meaning of WORLD WAR.
>its anthropocentric discourse
They're both human related, human caused, how is WW2 NOT anthropocentric when socio-economics and politics are the cause of it, just as liberalism IS a political socio-economic ideology.

 No.36125

>>36124
Our "higher" qualities are just human instincts is my point. Man is born a reasonable animal the same way a bird is born to fly. Aristotle is as smart as any thinker today.
>male domination
This only occurs after slavery is introduced, following from primitive communism. Before this there was general equality among the sexes.
I will agree about the "event" view of concentrated violences as opposed to the "environment" of a distributed violence. I do think events are ways to point to things which appear to be "outside" the system though, when they are just eruptions from within. A view that we live violent lives is a more proper critique than than the spectre of an isolated "apocalyptic" event though; "We live in an apocalypse", hence the semantics.

 No.36126

>>36125
>Our "higher" qualities are just human instincts
No they are not. Humanity was not born with that capability. While our instincts allow us vague concepts of competition and cooperation, the ability to be reasonable and logical and ignore emotion is much harder
>Aristotle is as smart as any thinker today.
Aristotle
A) Would be an outlier, he is not representative of the entire human population of his time
B) Is an individual, the general levels of intelligence has grown over human history because WE have grown and improved and become more or less more civilized, even if it isn't unitary.
>This only occurs after slavery is introduced
Absolute fucking ahistorical burger revisionism. Human social dynamics, including male dominance arose from natural material realities - hominid males are sexually dimorphic, being stronger, more aggressive, larger etc. Which meant that they took charge of their groups and over females, thus in early hunter-gatherer societies women were almost exclusively gatherers and homemakers, while the males were the ones hunting and killing, because that was the more physically taxing work. This sort of dynamic can be seen in Native American societies prior to Western Colonization diluting their culture. American Indians did not have slavery, or most of them did not, but they still had this male dominated society and while women could hunt or otherwise act in roles traditionally held by male Braves and chieftains - the exceptions to the rule. Native American societies were male dominated as were almost all human societies until the past few centuries, because human rights can only exist in a society developed enough to actually care to enforce entirely metaphysical rules on the treatment of others. Callousness and rudeness only have meaning, because society as an existance gives them meaning for example, just as any other forms of manners, it is an unspoken rule we created to keep a civil tongue in our heads.
Similar to Native American Indians, numerous African tribes remained tribalistic hunter-gatherers for a long time, and most of them still had male dominated societies. In some rare cases things were more equal, more out of the lack of resources and very small size of their communities than anything else. There is a wild-tribe on a remote Indo-Pacific Island that hasn't had contact with the outside world for centuries. Their warriors are all male, females all live in small, barely existant villages they live in.

>following from primitive communism

Right… primitive communism, with hierarchies! The most basic ape groups have hierarchies with a dominant male and several other top-males under him who dominate other males and females and adolescents. There is anthropological evidence to suggest early hominids were also like this and so were the first Homo Sapiens. A trait that further went on to continue into the first societies and civilizations that arose.
>events are ways to point to things which appear to be "outside" the system though, when they are just eruptions from within.
A Nuclear bomb is not an eruption from within a system unless you want to play at some pseudo-philosophical waxing about mankind destroying itself. A human society falling into chaos is a sort of apocalypse, but humanity while on a decline hasn't fallen yet.
>A view that we live violent lives is a more proper critique
In what sense? This liberal expansion of the term violence has made violence itself lose meaning, like many other words reinterpreted by various liberal ideologues and demagogues.
>"We live in an apocalypse", hence the semantics.
We'll be living in an apocalypse when the government begins to fall apart. "We live in a dystopia" is the correct term.

 No.36128

>>36119
>Pic
Speaking of Tank Girl, does anyone have that leftyb edit where it says Tankie Girl in the comic's style of text? This was back on 8ch and I never found the pic since.

 No.36146

>>36126
>>36126
>While our instincts allow us vague concepts of competition and cooperation, the ability to be reasonable and logical and ignore emotion is much harder
I disagree. Humanity's general and specific intelligences seems to be a genetic fact - where else does this "divine spark" arise from if not the already-existing cognitive and environmental conditions of early humanity? They say we havent evolved as a species in around 100k years, so i doubt we just got "smarter" once we left the jungle.
>human rights can only exist in a society developed enough to actually care to enforce entirely metaphysical rules on the treatment of others.
And where does this "care" come from? Look at children, they are sentimental - its an inborn quality, the same one we had before civilization. If you look at animals, particularly mammals, they display the same feelings.
>violence
Violence in its most basic terms, such as the murder of animals, the exploitation of humans, the destruction of plant life, the destroying of the ozone layer, etc. All for the vanity of market excesses. Violence is part of life but it is overdone today - the same you can violate the laws of war.
>dystopia not apocalypse
Again, semantics, but youre right.

 No.36150

>>36146
>Humanity's general and specific intelligences seems to be a genetic fact
It is not. Nurture over Nature is a fact. Humanity was not suddenly intelligent, our intelligence came with learning and passing on our knowledge and learning more each generation.
TL;DR: We have the POTENTIAL, but without nurturing by our fellows, without education the ability to know and grow is limited by our cognitive capability to interpret.
>They say we havent evolved as a species in around 100k years
Who is they? And that is incorrect, humanity has changed both physically and genetically over the millenia. Neanderthals are just one of the subspecies of Homo Sapiens and were absorbed into the population of humanity along with all others. Physiologically we do not look like early humans and Homo Sapiens evolved immensely from Homo Erectus just as Homo Erectus evolved significantly compared to Australopithecus.
>Look at children, they are sentimental
They can also be cruel, stomping on ants, it's all up to the individual and also up to the nurturing of parents who in turn were nurtured by their own.
>where does this "care" come from
An evolved/developed sense of right and wrong that came about through the development of (a) society over history
>Violence is part of life but it is overdone today
Agreed, definitely
>the same you can violate the laws of war
Elaborate.

 No.36152

>>36150
>>36146
This whole conversation is wildly idealist and displays profound ignorance of evolution. Nature and nurture are not a dichotomy, the entire basis of evolution is that nurture shapes nature - in the darwinian sense by the environment shaping which traits become dominant in a population and in a lamarckian/epigenetic sense as well by changing individuals and their descendants more directly.

>Humanity's general and specific intelligences seems to be a genetic fact - where else does this "divine spark" arise from if not the already-existing cognitive and environmental conditions of early humanity?

>Nurture over Nature is a fact. Humanity was not suddenly intelligent, our intelligence came with learning and passing on our knowledge and learning more each generation.
We do have a much much greater capacity for intellect than other species, which is obvious from looking at brain anatomy or behavior. But the nature is not enough. You need both - feral children who grew up in the wild without having the proper nurture to make their brains develop fully are unable to acquire language or many other normal human behaviors. But at the same time you can't raise a chimp to be human. You need both "nature" and "nurture."
>They say we havent evolved as a species in around 100k years
All species are continuously evolving. What you're referring to is anatomical modernity (which has been pushed back as far as 300k years btw) in which the remains of homo sapiens sapiens that we find are not significantly different from modern humans. That doesn't mean there's no difference, just that the differences are relatively small and we couldn't really separate these humans from modern humans based on their physical traits alone.
>Physiologically we do not look like early humans and Homo Sapiens evolved immensely from Homo Erectus just as Homo Erectus evolved significantly compared to Australopithecus.
Homo Erectus is much older than anatomical modernity, although they continued to live among various human lineages until quite recently. We diverged from them more like 1.5MYA. Of course we have evolved more in that time than 100k years, that's 15 times as long.
>Violence is part of life but it is overdone today
There is no "correct" amount of violence. All sorts of species (not even just animals) kill each other for food or other reasons. The significant impact humans are having at the moment is causing global climate change and a mass extinction event, which is mostly not caused by direct violence.
>They can also be cruel, stomping on ants, it's all up to the individual and also up to the nurturing of parents who in turn were nurtured by their own.
Empathy is both a trait that is found across many species and something that humans have evolved a special capacity for. There is evidence all over our physiology for this, from all the extra face muscles to make our feelings easier to read to our mirror neurons that are literally a specialized type of cell that promotes empathic cognition. Like other cognitive abilities, humans have evolved at a physical level to specialize in empathy and a sense of "morals," but one needs the proper environment to promote their development. Fundamentally it's really not that different from needing to train muscles or your circulatory system. Humans also evolved to be exceptional long-distance runners, but even an animal that's really bad at that is going to do better than a human couch potato who gets winded from standing up too fast.

Both of you are arguing from a position of ignorance on these subjects and your time would be better spent reading about it.

 No.36153

>>36150
>Nurture over Nature is a fact
I disagree in terms. All nurture comes from nature. I think in terms of general "knowledge", all which has transpired (outside of natural science) is just the switching of words themselves - in humanity, concepts are eternal, since our brains havent changed. God has a thousand names, and so on.
Not violating the laws of war is a common sense that we developed naturally - thats why i say morality is inborn, not "nurtured" into us, either way. In war you can do anything yet we dont just kill surrendering soldiers.
Some would like to, but they are rare, as psychopaths usually are.

 No.36155

>>36152
>There is no "correct" amount of violence.
There is an incorrect amount however
>The significant impact humans are having at the moment is causing global climate change and a mass extinction event, which is mostly not caused by direct violence.
The system itself is violent

 No.36156

File: 1693539284485.png (781.74 KB, 640x800, ClipboardImage.png)

>>36153
>All nurture comes from nature.
The ability and need to may be from nature, but how it is done is based on the environment. A mother in the 1580s is going to be nurturing their child very different to one in the 1980s.
>our brains havent changed
But we have. Not significantly enough to make modern humans a subspecies, but enough that physiologically we have changed, this is readily apparent in examples such as height or brain chemistry compared to human populations of the past.
>Not violating the laws of war is a common sense that we developed naturally
True, but without relying on any specific dictats of written law, the general consensus on inhumanities in war become muddied and less concrete, because your natural instincts may interpret the concept of eliminating a threat in a very different way than you would imagine as a hypothetical when not in combat.
>In war you can do anything yet we dont just kill surrendering soldiers.
And yet this happens rather often, many only restrain themselves from doing so because of the written social law of war-crime, and if there was no governmental body holding them accountable would not flinch in committing such a crime.

 No.36157

File: 1693540051242.png (1.37 MB, 1200x800, ClipboardImage.png)

>>36152
>This whole conversation is wildly idealist
Projection
>Nature and nurture are not a dichotomy
Never stated such, there are aspects however that come from the former or from the latter rather than both.
>the entire basis of evolution is that nurture shapes nature
>in the darwinian sense by the environment shaping which traits become dominant in a population and in a lamarckian/epigenetic sense as well by changing individuals and their descendants more directly.
Not the ENTIRE basis, but yes, this is more or less correct.
>We do have a much much greater capacity for intellect than other species
>feral children who grew up in the wild without having the proper nurture to make their brains develop fully are unable to acquire language or many other normal human behaviors
>You need both "nature" and "nurture."
Correct and agreed, most people in developed or developing society receives education and is nurtured by family that pass on their knowledge, so that the individuals grows new knowledge and understanding on top of that which the previous generations passed onto them.
>Homo Erectus is much older than anatomical modernity
I understand that, it was a more understandable example of what I meant by physiological changes in humanity
>There is no "correct" amount of violence.
Not from an evolutionary view perhaps, but from the aspect of civilization as we know it, excessive violence and especially misdirected violence has cost the human whole a lot. After all we are not JUST animals.
>The significant impact humans are having at the moment is causing global climate change and a mass extinction event
In the apocalyptic sense, yes.
>Empathy is both a trait that is found across many species and something that humans have evolved a special capacity for.
Yes, agreed.
>Like other cognitive abilities, humans have evolved at a physical level to specialize in empathy and a sense of "morals," but one needs the proper environment to promote their development. Fundamentally it's really not that different from needing to train muscles or your circulatory system.
This, this is my point
>Both of you are arguing from a position of ignorance on these subjects
I've been reading about evolution of mankind and anthropology since I was 7 and that was decades ago. Most if not all that you've said has been exactly my point, which is why most of what you've said is essentially the same as what I have said, simply more or less long-winded and worded differently.

 No.36158

>>36156
As things change, the more they stay the same
Thats all i can say

 No.36166

>>36158
>As things change, the more they stay the same

 No.36513

Cyberslav has gotten its first updates in 5 years, I'm hoping it gets released soon
Most recent trailer https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oSR3jDjjJoM

 No.38077

File: 1702342825894.png (Spoiler Image, 57.43 KB, 620x609, Aida_Plasma_NipCup_GroinP1.png)

Accidentally posted this in the wrong thread >>38053 A.I.D.A. a Fallout parody.

 No.38079

>>38077
Sure, post the zip, sounds alright

 No.38080

File: 1702343981926.png (281.67 KB, 820x461, ClipboardImage.png)

>>38079
Here, zipfile is larger than I can post as a file and I don't have a Mega. You can download it safely from the download links, I did.
https://new.lewd.ninja/game/85196-aida-v051-zem

 No.38241

>>38077
>>38053
spoiler images the lewds

 No.38243

File: 1702869224906.png (9.94 KB, 1280x720, MarkRR.png)

>>38241
Don't be a prude, one barely has some side-nip and the other is literally covered up with metal covers. Also it's a robot.

 No.38245

>>38243
>Don't be a prude
>metal covers, not metal tits
I use the /sfw/ boards for no promotions, if you want to post a promotion then post in /alt/ or just spoiler

 No.38247

File: 1702872912274.png (858.91 KB, 1380x720, Wasteland_Sky6.png)

>>38245
>hen post in /alt/
This IS an /alt/ board and I'm not promoting anything, it's related to the topic at hand - post-apocalyptic media.
>not metal tits
Did you miss the part where its a robot? Or the fact that this is an imageboard?

 No.38250

>>38247
I just want to browser /sfw/ anon
pls stop bait

 No.38251

I like threads

 No.38286

>>38250
And I just wish you weren't an underage bitch, but here we are.

 No.38296

>>38286
Rude.Νν

 No.38783

>>38296
No you, interfering n00b.

 No.40750

File: 1711505507591.png (16.72 MB, 3840x2160, ClipboardImage.png)

>>36166
>>38077
Speaking of Fallout, Amazon Prime is going to be making a TV series out of it and the trailer looks promising.

 No.40760

>>40750
Isn't it the one with terrible makeup? Or is it a different one?

 No.40822

>>40760
No, its this one, and from the trailer makeup is the least of its problems. Literally every aspect of it looks comically cheap.

 No.40825

>>36119
>No anon, that's not how dehumanization (which you clearly refer to) works. To dehumanize something, you must take a human(oid) and represent them as evil and vile.
huh? coming up with a super special definition of dehumanization doesnt even rebut or address anything that that other anon asserted

 No.40827

>>40822
Then the phrase "the trailer looks promising" doesn't really make much sense.

 No.40828

>>36117
>Making your enemy a soulless alien monster is the politics of fascism
Kinda. But then again, we have all kinds of parasitic organisms here on Earth so stuff like xenomorphs doesn't seem like a projection. Also, our own ruling class is imperialistic so it's obvious that people have a habit of extrapolating this to aliens as well. I'd also mention Lovecraft since the creatures that are way more incomprehensible to us than black people or even androids may or may not have a disregard for human life because our conceptions of morality are entirely irrelevant to them. I'm more concerned with the portrayal of the orcs in fantasy. The main reason why the orcs are evil is that they're "made that way" which is… uh… what?

 No.40846

>go to libgen.gs
>download Black River comic
>experience bleak so authentic it ends interest in the postapoc genre

 No.40915

File: 1712077572591.png (396.44 KB, 560x357, ClipboardImage.png)

A strange Post-Apocalyptic series that came out around the same time as the Hunger Games and other book series about teen heroes throwing off the system, is City of Ember and its sequels. Strangely enough I found the books to be quite interesting in their attempt to portray human conflict, the fear of the unknown and the unpredictability of even the best laid plans. Some of the story was a bit silly but it wasn't beyond suspension of disbelief. The film was a bit weak but I found it was pretty unique and interesting in its own right, and the child actors weren't terrible.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/City_of_Ember?useskin=vector

 No.40917

>>40915
I never saw the movies but the books did a pretty good job of portraying biases of tradition blinding people to reality. Dramatic irony works pretty well for that, but that's nothing new for YA dystopian stories. The conceit of a Fallout-like vault but nobody in there knows there's anything outside is pretty interesting.

 No.40922

>>40846
Oh yeah, Black River really sucks all the fun out of the postapoc idea.

 No.41174

Not quite the right thread but its the most relevant given the semi-apocalyptic nature of these films:
Recently I discussed the 2023 film, ISS - a mediocre film but the story was an interesting space station isolation concept - in the Chernobyl thread and it's plot, (stranded, partisan inhabitants of a Space Station placed at odds with one another because of the grander scale of societal conflict). Afterwards I was reminded of Roland Emmerich's 1984 feature-length film and graduating thesis work, Das Arche Noah Prinzip (translated: The Noah's Ark Principle) which along with some of his other works demonstrates to me that Emmerich was not untalented in film, but I digress.

The film's plot is quite interesting where-in its 1997, nukes have been abolished and the world is at peace. In space there exists a peaceful, civilian satellite called ARKLAB capable of changing weather and averting some natural disasters. It becomes a topic of renewed Soviet-US conflict because the Euro-American satellite also has the potential to INFLICT natural disasters onto an area. The English summary of the film is misleading however, as the Soviet 'paranoia' of it being used against them is not unfounded and the true threat and conflict within the film is not foreign Cosmonauts, or traitor-Astronauts, but US glowies sent up to force the Astronauts into following orders in using the platform for military use, after they refused orders before. For context A conflict escalates in the Middle East in 1997 and US citizens are held as prisoners, the USA wants to create a storm in the area from space in order to send soldiers under a camouflaging shield to free the hostages. The team in the satellite refuse. The unknown factor of who's the spy creates tension and drama ending in the sabotage of the satellite and deaths of most of them. It's an interesting reflection of human conflict and not seeing the forest for the trees, and how in this day of technology it can lead to deadly, and even apocalyptic consequences. As a side note, 2017's Geostorm blatantly ripped off large portions of Noah's Arc Principle, only with a heap of 'Murica! shoved into it.

As a criticism of the film and really many of Emmerich's works; It is noticeable how well he manages to find the right image sections and combine action and atmosphere with dynamic editing. The latter is the strength of the film, the paranoid story that is told is reflected in claustrophobic images of space station corridors. However, the story is told very weakly, although the plot is interesting, Emmerich is far too invested in the atmospheric superficialities. The novel based on the film by Martin Eisele is even worse - only here can you really find out where and what is currently flashing, where a noise can be heard from and exactly which numerical codes are being entered into the computer.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Noah%27s_Ark_Principle?useskin=vector

https://ru.wikipedia.org/wiki/Принцип_Ноева_ковчега?useskin=vector

 No.41331

File: 1713112857803.png (1.13 MB, 659x1000, ClipboardImage.png)

>>36128
I remember that, it was an edit of pic rel I think, with "tankie girl" and a hammer and sickle on the helmet or something

 No.41360

What an absolute masterpiece Fallout series was.

 No.41361

>>41360
yup i love the 1-2-NV trilogy that absolutely didnt have any other entries

 No.41362

>>41361
Ive been diving deep into the fallout fan community on places like No Mutants Allowed and RPG Codex lately and there are even folks that dont like anything that came after Fallout 1

 No.41364

File: 1713233351843.jpg (469.08 KB, 2560x1440, falloutTV-HD-scaled.jpg)

>>41361
I was talking about the new TV-show that I just finished watching. When talking about the games New Vegas was my least favorite. The game was just too silly for a post-apocalyptic hell scape with all the legionaries and gambling cowboys. Best one imo was Fallout 3 with special mentions to slaver DLC. First time getting out of the vault was something I still remember.

 No.41370

>>41362
that doesnt mean anything, you can find any kind of person on the internet

>>41364
>The game was just too silly for a post-apocalyptic hell scape with all the legionaries and gambling cowboys
<the best one was the game with 99% mindless raiders
butt scifi

 No.41372

>>41364
>>41360
bait used to be believable (not even gonna bother getting the image)

 No.41481


 No.41482

File: 1713556179550.png (16.92 KB, 178x67, Face_1.png)


 No.41510



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