>>1853085Abolition of morality calls for a suspension of moral judgment. In the sense of self-sufficiency, it's "good", but having suspended moral judgment entirely, that's all there is to say.
>>1853529So we should suspend moral judgement if a woman is raped?
I defer to kant's literal "critique of pure reason" here, that Reason can only be preserved if it is self-limited. That is, Reason only has meaning as far as it is expressed in The Understanding by grounding our sensibility.
I think in the same way that the world "in itself" is meaningless, but society, history and whatnot, these are *real* in their revelation (which is more of a hegelian point). The absolute truth of a woman getting raped is that it is an inherently evil act. It cannot be given except by this fact.
The fallacy of "pure reason" is that it is still a Reason derived from our human sensibility. It is uncritical consciousness. And its only in History that objective conditions for such things can be considered as True in-themselves.
This is also my total critique of nietzsche; that nietzsche has not travailed the kantian bridge so still believes in the world of noumenon. The world of inhuman "objectivity". It doesnt exist.
Zizek has emphasised this point in a goid way where he says how many people position a gaze in the objective (like carl sagan's "pale blue dot"), but this gaze is still normative of a particular affection. People speak of a "coldness" which is not mere indifference, and people speak of an "indifference" which is cold. They see things through the devil's eyes. Capitalists do this all the time when they say "thats life, get over it". This to me is the uncritical consciousness of an "orthodox" materialism, which is always conformist. It beats you into submission. "You dont matter. You are just a speck" it says, and you believe it. How strange.
>>1853541>So we should suspend moral judgement if a woman is raped?Yes. Whatever the woman sees fit to do to the assailant(s) deserves no judgment.
>The absolute truthYour received conditioning is a mental illness, not a truth device.
>of a woman getting raped is that it is an inherently evil act.No it isn't, any more than any other act that reproduces the prevailing order.
>ZizekMeta-Modernists should kill themselves for being emotional whiners.
>>1853541>muh noumenawhy do phil undergrads still believe in this meme when hegel btfo'd the whole concept in like two sentences?
>>1853591>noumenaThey bring it up because they are ideological and want to believe in the sublime "other", like how aliens arrive in sci-fi novels to either save us or destroy us.
I bring up noumena to dispell it, since most materialists always want to zoom out of the human experience.. from within the human experience, or give deference to "matter" as our intrinsic *externality* when kant's point is that The Understanding grounds Reason in the sensibility of our subjectivity.
But see here again the paradox. German idealism is about redeeming the trusting of our senses, while "materialism" lives in this existential doubt, because its still operating in empiricism. This is the epistemological boundary of an uncritical consciousness.
>>1853579i mean, youre either an idiot or a coward. your choice. your mother being raped isnt evil to you? but again, see how a radical skepticism breeds stupidity.
>>1853643>not internalizing my historical situation and some dead guy's opinions means your stupidI understand how being indoctrinated into a myth makes one the slave of that myth, and how children exposed to too many video games interact with reality in a ritualistic, rudimentary way.
>>1853643>>1853692 (me)
>idiot or a cowardNah, just impervious to sentiment and uninterested in childish games that call themselves adult enough times to convince the stupid.
I mean, the fact that someone's forcing themselves on anyone else is a problem that needs to be prevented from happening again, but isn't the whole drama around rape really just a reason to spare some "lesser" crimes that happen to serve the reproduction of the bourgeois order?
>>1853692>>1853695rape has always been a moral evil, youre just pussyfooting with rhetorical strategy
Its funny you talk about ritual and illusion when you have let dogma blind you against reality
the real "ritual" here is the emptying of your reason by the transcendent idol of the sublime untruth
but like i say, this is the place of deepest ideology, so youre certainly not unique in this futility
>>1853712>rape has always been a moral evilNo, marriage legitimizes it.
No, morality, being an ideology, was created. Moral evil could not have existed before that. Didn't Marx tell you not to eternalize relations of production?
>Its funny you talk about ritual and illusion when you have let dogma blind you against realityIsn't that exactly what you are doing with your presentist appeal to "always been" above? Rape had no material reason to be proscribed until patrilineal inheritance developed.
>received emotions are reason if I repeat myself enoughYeah I get it, retard. Any lie that leaves a state for you to be boss of, I know how it is
>but like i say, this is the place of deepest ideology, so youre certainly not unique in this futility>love isn't ideologyThere is an error theory of love, too.
>>1853720*when* and *where* was morality "created" so you can enlighten me?
>didnt marx tell you-oh, right, i daren't upset my imaginary master. How's being a "materialist" suiting you when you are constantly looking over your shoulder for ghosts?
>emotions arent trueum…
>There is an error theory of love, too.idk you sound completely corrupted. Love is much more real than your deranged delusions. But i'll just chalk this up to a poisonous amount of autism on your part. Just dont shoot up any schools in the meantime, kid.
>>1853720>>1853732>theres a single moralityare you pretending to be retarded
>>1853737When did i say that?
Morality is a medium of our inherent sociality, not a law written on celestial tablets.
But you see how the anti-moral position has its appropriated inversion of the divine logic, where it is the morality of no-morality, written in the stars.
Here the link between the moralist and anti-moralist affirm the *object* of morality as a self-relation, either by its total presence or absense.
>>1853748
Morality is a bourgeoisie lie, it doesnt exist
>>1853732>*when* and *where* was morality "created" so you can enlighten me?Plato "discovered" virtue the same way Smith "discovered" capitalism, mid-1st millennium BC, Athens.
>How's being a "materialist" suiting you when you are constantly looking over your shoulder for ghosts?I mean, if
you presume to "be" a Marxist, one would expect you to commit to his method and to the history of thought more generally, not some crypto-capitalist perversion of it. If names are to mean anything I don't think that's an unreasonable confession to hold you to.
>idk you sound completely corruptedGood, "corruption" is a religious ideology and "purity" has done nothing but generate the classes that cause the problems. Sounds like you're some bourgeois leech who's pissed off that someone's making their magical workings impossible.
>Love is much more real than your deranged delusionsYes, errors are very real, and they're problematic.
>>1853737The concept of virtue ethics will never
not generate class or a state.
>>1853755>Morality is a medium of our inherent socialityExistence is not a warrant.
>But you see how the anti-moral positionThis sounds like the bourgeois moral neurosis in which making no choice is itself a choice.
>>1853769It was invented by capitalists?
>>1853772Yes, it is not the duty of the dictatorship of the proletariat to deal with revisionism, specially the worst kind of revisionism, the "think of the children" revisionism
>>1853771>Plato "discovered" virtue the same way Smith "discovered" capitalism, mid-1st millennium BC, Athens.Ha! Its funny ofc since socrates was killed by the moralists of the time who wanted to maintain the status quo and saw socrates as a subversive atheist. But ofc what is socrates' point in apologia? I AM a subversive, but i subvert the good with a greater good. This to me is the definition of progress. Like luther reforming the church
Also, adam smith wasnt a thinker of "capitalism". Marx is the first thinker of *capital* proper. Thats why his famous book is called "capital".
>I mean, if you presume to "be" a Marxist,I never said i was a marxist. I am a fan of marx but so what? Also did you know that marx once said that if anything, he himself is "not a marxist". This ties into my point about true belief. The true believer is the untrue believer, and the founder himself is the unbeliever! Same way jesus himself wasnt a christian.
>love is a lieI wonder where things went wrong for you
>This sounds like the bourgeois moral neurosis in which making no choice is itself a choice.Well yeah, negation is positively-negative, like how minus-1 doesnt get swallowed back into zero. Its called dialectics. Think of a popular example, the person who says "im not political" - are they political? If not-being is being then you agree with me.
>>1853777>morality was invented by capitalistsHmm…
>>1853769we aren't libertarians faggot, morality exits
>>1848559Because they were synonymous with technological development and law while the pagans lived in mud huts, worshipped clay sculptures and didn't even have soap. It was a stage of development for most countries. Monotheism also makes more sense than polytheism so with all of above, it didn't take much to convert people to it.
I mean they did commit atrocities too but overall, it was a stage of development. Even Buddhism was born out of poor, polytheist social conditions.
>>1853792>morality exitsi agree, it exits the entire frame of material reality (cuz it doesnt exist)
>>1864196undialectical materialism
>>1864182monotheism centralises organisation, while polytheism expresses the pagan city state with its patron deities. In catholicism these particular spirits are sublated for saints and the (god)head of state retains its sublime authority.
>>1864301Kant's qualification of his own "empirical realism" is that the "external world" must still be internalised. And through this filter of human subjectivity does it become its own "human" essence within Reason, grounded within "The Understanding" of spatio-temporal causality, against the "transcendental" categories of "things in-themselves" (like how Time is not necessarily causal, but encompasses past, present and future in its concept - therefore Time must be self-limited so as to give meaning to itself, such as Reason, which is Kant's principle "critique").
>>1864182>Another leftypol racistImagining bashin the head of a racist self-proclaimed socialist just to see what makes their brains tick
at first because of political expedience, later because of military conquest
>be religion
>Be based on ancestor worship/being the chosen ethnic group/local spiritual rituals
>Meet religion that promises salvation to anyone regardless of who they are
>Everyone who convert to the universal religion is lost for you, but nobody converts to your side
>Get into war
>If they get conquered they stay universalist
>If you get conquered your people convert to their faith
It's that simple. It's not just abrahamic religions, it's Buddhism too. Hinduism and other forms of polytheism have little converting power, ancestor and nature worship like in Japan and Chinese folk religion has no converting power. Universalist religions such as abrahamic ones, Buddhism, or even sciencetology just win out by the sheer fact people are more likely to convert to them than the othet way around. A universalist either becomes a sifferent universalist, gets killed like in Japan after 1600 or becomes an atheist.
>>1892256Why do you post the amazing Atheist? He is actually based now.
>>1892259>[x] is discredited>shows no evidence howJames Frazer's book "the golden bough" is a fascinating example of the anthropology you loathe, where he correctly sees how first it is "magic" as primitive science, then religion as appeal to nature, and then finally practical science which affirms human will.
>>1892295Now, yeah, but he still spearheaded reddit atheism in it's early years.
>>1892304>idpoling this hardalso he draws decent smut
>>1892308So he's not just physically revolting but also a porn addict
Good to know
>>1892297Did you even watch the video from the phD in religious studies I posted
>>1892364No, i was responding to your comment
The video i assume just describes animism, which is based on the symbolic science of magic that precedes the rise of organised religion.
>>1892353
You're not going to trick people here into watching a Agent Kochinski video.
>>1892363I just want to point out how colosally retarded the roman soldier using Jesus as a swearing word given what he's doing.
>>1892373he was directing that thought at jesus obviously
>>1848582>Most atheists are "reddit atheists" - that is, they don't actually think about the consequences of atheism or what an atheistic model of the world would mean. neither does the majority of most belief systems?
>>1892373anachronistically using "jesus" as an expletive while talking to and crucifying jesus himself is the joke
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