>>1857762I don't like him either, seems to just drone on over stock footage, but more left voices is always good
>>1857174>The new generation is getting more radicalizedPeople say the same thing every fucking decade. Then these "young radicals" inherit their parents' reserves and suddenly stop any "revolutionary" activity to the surprise of nobody who's marxist.
>>1857762It's like steampunkians but redder
>>1857765>Then these "young radicals" inherit their parents' reserves>parents' reserves<Well, son, it's time we had a little talk about something called "material conditions"… the good news is you'll never have to worry about me disinheriting you.
>>1857765the millennials haven't gotten more right wing as they get older. stfu.
>>1857776Because the economy is in the gutter. Can we please stop treating political consciousness as something that happens when you're good enough of a person and not subjected to your class position?
>>1857777yes obviously material conditions but propaganda/false consciousness also matters, people under 40ish have experienced a much different ideological life experience than boomers which does actually affect their political views
>>1857776i know we arent only communists here but the concept of left and right is so meaningless to me. ignoring that polls dont represent anything tangible in the first place, does "having leftist views" or even "being leftist" even translate into actual proletarian cohesion and organizing? i would say no
>>1857786thats their point i think. as people get older they CAN accumulate or inherit more resources and move up the social ladder. obv affected by the social mobility (ability to become petit-bourgeois) of the country but thats the reason many people who called themselves "leftists" end up becoming "right-wing" or "conservative" or whatever the fuck as the years go on
haz-tier take
tiktok is just another brain cancer app like snapchat. Its not a "revolutionary" form at all. And tiktok should be banned anyway for being a contributor to attention deficits.
>>1857793>Its not a "revolutionary" form at all.Reaching the correct conclusion with the dumbest line of reasoning possible.
>>1857793May as well ban imageboards for contributing to attention deficits with constant shitposts
>>1857777> not subjected to your class position?t. The uber faggot promoting generational theory and claiming younger proles will not or cannot develop class consciousness because having a home is your class now
>>1857813>generational theoryWhat?
>younger proles will not or cannot develop class consciousness because having a home is your class nowIf someone is still living with their parents I'm having a hard time thinking they fit the definition of the reserveless proletariat whose existence hinges solely on wage labor as they have their parents to fall back on if they ever got fired, assuming they're even working in the first place. If they aren't working, how are they even going to join the proletarian movement?
Also the petit-bourgeois can obviously join the communist movement, but it's an exception, not the norm, and many times they're wreckers without even realizing it as they push for interclassist reforms thinking that's what communism is about. And once again,
defining class position is not a moral judgement.
>>1857815>If someone is still living with their parents I'm having a hard time thinking they fit the definition of the reserveless proletariat whose existence hinges solely on wage labor as they have their parents to fall back on if they ever got fired, assuming they're even working in the first place. If they aren't working, how are they even going to join the proletarian movement?Guess every culture where people live with extended family is impossible to form class consciousness then i.e. everywhere outside the west and even in the west only from the early 20th century until 2007 or so.
>>1857813>having a home is your class nowif anything that anon has it backward sinces its home ownership i.e. ownership of an appreciating asset which actually instills small property owner and petit bourgeois analogous consciousness in proles which is exactly what happened to white unionized blue collar workers in mid 20th century north america.
>>1857819An owned home isn't a reserve to fall back on?
>>1857821>>forgets alot of older people live with relatives.Isn't this done out of desperation with all parts sharing expenses?
>>1857823But that's exactly the point I'm making. Maybe I expressed myself incorrectly.
>>1857824>But that's exactly the point I'm making.well not really because you're acting like the parents asset is the adult childs asset which isn't true. Its just a private/familial form of charity. An adult child living at home with parents doesn't make them any more a homeowner than if they were living in a privately funded homeless shelter.
>>1857147>India banning because idk muh ChinaDoesn't India hold the record for fucking with the Internet and social media in case of public unrest? Or is that just Kashmir?
>>1857828You don’t understand, le true proletariat is necessarily steps from being homeless, but it can’t be homelessness because their parents kicked them out when they did something they disapproved of, or are simply homeless cuz homeless r stinky lumpens!
>t. Workerist aesthetics fag
>>1857828The proletariat is that class which completely sells its labor power to capital to survive, without owning any reserves which it could use to stay afloat in bad times. Without the immediate demand for their labor they are chucked out onto the streets.
I don't mean to argue with "but Marx said so!". It's just that the marxist definition of a proletarian makes complete sense to me in explaining the current state of the world.
>>1857831I don't know why you're getting so emotional over this.
>>1857831a lot and i mean a LOT of things have to go wrong in your life to end up homeless, and once you do you kinda just give up on life. homeless people are lumpen cuz theyre unable to be part of the worker movement, not as a judgement on their way of life but their inability to attack capital as one movement
>>1857840Working class parents who rent and happen to have spare room for their kid when they fail to launch.
>>1857844Are you trying to make a joke?
>>1857832>The proletariat is that class which completely sells its labor power to capital to survive, without owning any reserves which it could use to stay afloat in bad times. Without the immediate demand for their labor they are chucked out onto the streets.The idea that to be proletarian one has to experience some sort of absolute impoverishment is frankly more a Lassallean idea than Marxist one. The idea that wages are just the price of directly and immediately reproducing labor is again, a Lassallean notion which Marx already rejected in volume 1 in favor of merely a tendency for wages to fall that level, there are counter-veiling tendencies which even Ricardo wasn't daft enough to ignore, that was entirely Lassalle.
again, I don't think you understand. You are confusing literal homelessness with not being a homeowner which are not the same thing. The reason an adult child living at home is not a homeowner is because they don't actually own the home. What makes someone a proletarian is lack of non labor income derived of surplus value (in the case of the landlord, indirectly appropriated through exchange).
Imagine a hypothetical altruistic landlord that charged only $0.25 a month on rent for a room in a house. And a wage worker lived in a room rented by that landlord. That's essentially the same situation. The reason that doesn't happen with a normal landlord is because they don't care about their tenants, while a parent does. You wouldn't say a prole who had that deal wasn't "really proletarian".
What defines a prole isn't getting a good or bad deal on rent. It's deriving income from (underpaid) labor, as opposed to deriving income from appropriating surplus value.
>>1857847No, I'm showing the absurdity of "assets". Someone just judged someone proletarian or not based on whether the place their parents put them up during hard times is paid for through mortgage or rent. Flag waving bullshit, people need to either commit to abolishing the bourgeois order and transcending civilization, or just go drink cum and keep their stank outta the movement.
>>1857147I think text ai detection of dissidents is way more developed than people realize, glowies probably wordclouding us right now.
Tiktok has a large scale and data intensive content to analyze and break down into speech to text and them wordcloud for gommunism and [
*****]
>>1857295Slow down your orientalism there buddy.
>>1857998>>1857650>most socialist organizing in my third world country happens on fucking facebook and instagram, who careseat shit
>if you own your home you're actually bourgeois
Not this shit again
TikTok is technology which has arrived from the future, and N*ck might've been correct potentially quite in the end.
>can't censor people so easy on TT because we're visual creatures - banning a face hits different to banning wordswordswords
>can't monitor TT so easy because audio is harder to monitor than wordswordswords, or was harder
>can't control TT accounts as easy because it's not monetized so people don't care so much about their accounts or follower count
How difficult would it be to create a peer to peer uncensorable TT?
>>1858585the definition of proletarian is reserveless, is owning your house not a reserve now?
>>1860988What about family?
<My cousin has a sofa bed so now I'm bourgeois
>>1860988>the definition of proletarian is reserveless, is owning your house not a reserve now?I don't know if it's (present-day) useful to define the proletariat as reserveless, if full ownership of a house is considered a reserve - how does owning a house relate to the means of production. It's hardly capital which implies a petit-bourgeois relation. It's blurrier if that property is sufficient for industrial purposes, like farmland, but what meaningful effect does owning a house provide, beyond a one-off sale? (just like owning a car)
>>1861037The US public-private mortgage agency is dipping their toe into second mortgages now
>>1861050idk but I'm putting 10 on "conflating present-day asia with cyberpunk future technology because you can't yet digest that the West is not the cutting-edge any more", like with hong kong and neo-tokyo, and now with china
Where will Tikkers go to once their access is banned?
>>1861169china isn't making burgers dumber with tiktok but they should be
>>1857147>It seems like tech porkies in Singapore accidentally made an appmusically was initially china based
Russia stronk, gonna gas all the hohols and rape all the women and babies and farm animals, ha ha ha, you weak Western faggots can't stop us
Gayyy(USER WAS BANNED FOR THIS POST)
>>1861169All of the above
>>1857215I think the winning formula is basically that algorithms place you in a totally unique 'community', which overlaps with other people's unique communities (like real life), and this makes it so that information can travel very quickly all around. It's anti-silo.
The downside is that there's too much content and you end up doing lots of sifting to find good stuff (or some days its a jackpot every time! engagement-maximizing algos are the worst), and that means creators need to implement strategies to get engagement quickly in the first second or so so that people don't scroll away. This biases for attractive people showing their face and telling you something you probably already agree with. This isn't good for anonymously (aka safely) propagandizing and educating people in depth. They're not there for brain-hurty, they're there for brain-relaxing.
>>1860927video hosting is best when centralized, since you ideally want the videos to be available all the time, and also they take up lots of space that would either bloat clients a huge amount or make there a de facto situation of centralization via power users who host large amounts of videos, just not absolute centralization. At that point, why not just a web 'community' of socialist video hosting servers (and I only say community because the idea of decentralization is good for resilience and diversity of opinion when it comes to niche/ideological hosting) and a shared client. Like just cut out the middle man and obfuscating attempts and accept that most people have 0 interest in putting any resources into hosting video, so it's only going to be up to, A) datamining companies, B) datamining governments, C) grifters and wealthy/techy rejects banned from other social media, D) hosting for illegal video, E) committed political interests that don't have access to mainstream channels of communication or believe they need their own independent infrastructure - i.e. mostly socialists. There's no reason at all to work with these other groups, so federation might as well be just by and for revolutionary projects. Like I guess if you made a client and defined a protocol for servers to interface, it would be open to anyone, but no reason to cater to all of those relatively reactionary or just odious groups.
I think tiktok is what it is though because it's so mainstream (and fast, and equipped with capital-intensive AI, and with many filters, AI tools, etc. which are both very capital-invested and also apparently easy for tech savvy people to create for themselves, making for a fun multi-class playground - all for free to the end user, who is the product)
>9eyes: wtf tiktok is murdering our narratives
>Australian PM: We may ban under 16s from using social media
Unique IPs: 19