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/leftypol/ - Leftist Politically Incorrect

"The anons of the past have only shitposted on the Internet about the world, in various ways. The point, however, is to change it."
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Not reporting is bourgeois


File: 1746291941907-0.jpg (662.42 KB, 972x1005, lenin-change-da-world.jpg)

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So Lenin's most important contribution to revolutionary Marxism, in defense from revisionists like Kautsky, Bernstein and Co. is his detailed study on capitalist imperialism and petty-bourgeois corruption within the workers movement leading up to the inter-imperialist war (part 1) where these corrupt leaders chose a "lesser evil" side of imperialism to support. Turning the imperialist war into a civil war, culminating in the successful October revolution, a world-changing event.

The Marxist movement then splits into two:
1. people who side with Lenin's concern on the side of the international revolutionary workers movement
2. the bourgeois elements in the leadership positions within the bureaucratic-reformist cancer metastasizing upon the workers movement that side with welfare gibs / their imperialist bourgeoisie / ethnic chauvinism etc.

Lenin dies prematurely and shortly after self-described Leninists of numerous tendencies then go on to take completely contradictory positions with a proclivity to picking sides, in the inter-imperialist war (part 2).
Notable examples: the left-communist "ultra-Leninists" around Bordiga, the left opposition "Bolshevik-Leninists" around Trotsky, the "Marxist-Leninists"* around Stalin.
Bordiga, Trotsky and Stalin believe the Axis imperialists are to be critically supported almost until its too late (i.e. for several years leading into WWII relying on this "Leninist analysis").
Stalin then flip flops after almost having Moscow sacked by Nazi Germany and concedes to figures like Dimitrov, who argues in favor of picking the Allies side of the imperialist war and injecting the domestic Party and movement with millions of liberal-bourgeois elements*. "Marxism-Leninism" from this point on goes on to contain a blatant antagonistic contradiction at the heart of it that keeps erupting in a variety of ways continuously throughout the 20th century within the ideological disputes of Communist Party leadership.
* Mao and the CPC adopt the later Dimitrovist position of "Marxism-Leninism", diluting the domestic communist movement with these "progressive bourgeois" elements from the start, which will become a critical issue in domestic tumult later down the line.
By the mid 20th century, "Marxism-Leninism" erupts towards an overt social-imperialist deviation after the Khrushchevites seize power, introducing a slew of reforms towards the right and an ideological offensive against scientific socialism. A sharp international contradiction between this turn and a Stalin-doctrinaire dogmatist position (which subliminally elevates Dimotrov's positions over both Stalin and most notably Lenin) emerge, which will escalate to the point of warring hostility in numerous national contexts and time-periods.
Lenin has at this point been completely removed from the equation as the first era Leninist tendencies is coming to a close and the ICP and Trotskyists aren't achieving much in the real world, leaving this ongoing internal conflict within the "Marxist-Leninist" movement to continue on until the present day.
By the late 20th century bourgeois elements are so overpowering in "Marxist-Leninist" communist parties and countries that they dissolve the "vanguard party, chief organ of proletarian power" in several "people's democratic republics" and "socialist republics", in a turn towards "Perestroika (Eng: Restructuring)" / "Reform and Opening Up" / "Euro-Communism" / "Market-oriented socialist economy" which then replace the theory of Marxism and Leninism, being replaced by positions traced to the likes of Bukharin, Bernstein and Lassalle.

Here we are, in the 21st century and "Marxists", "Leninists", "Marxist-Leninists" still barely grapple with this and most often just show a political engagement that amounts to another flavor or bourgeois political "team sports" tendencies of vocally supporting this or that policy or party verbally, sometimes engage in police sanctioned civil disobedience, just vooting, or the aesthetic delights of some supposedly pure party somewhere remote, mediated to you by ideologically supercharged media produced by their public relations departments, digested and regurgitated uncritically.

This is not a good situation. Why the isn't this issue dealt with more frequently and seriously in the movement or even on here, a space where we can discuss the problems of the movement without "tarnishing the reputation" whatever of whatever sectarian org we have chosen for being the least worst IRL / over identity-based social media?

Do you not think the issue of capitalist imperialism or proletarian revolution for communism is important? Then engage in the materialist dialectic. Study, critique, dialogue, contradict.

>>2252376
But you are a glownonymous, a tor poster

There’s nothing to be done

>>2252383
That's called an ad hominem. Also I've probably posted here longer than you lil bro
>>2252384
Stop

>>2252387
Yeah sure i was bored. Its not like this thread will reach bump limit any time soon so its not like my "le funny" made things worse for this discussion

Are you asking us "why are there ziggers"?

>>2252387
>Stop
Why? Nepal literally had a protracted people’s war that was WON and they ended up with liberal capitalism and communism disgraced in the country. If winning outright can’t change anything other than the political superstructure then there’s genuinely nothing to be done, you can struggle but you’re struggling for it’s own sake, not because you’ll win or change anything for the better

>>2252384
Not even organising?

>>2252414
Organize because it makes you feel good, do not expect a result

>>2252417
Organising isnt about result. Its just something communists do. It is work. Working sucks.


>>2252376
I dont understand how defending yourself from invasion by Nazis is "picking sides in an imperialist war". Was Stalin supposed to start a civil war in the USSR instead?

>>2253132
Stalin got cucked by history and material forces, its not his fault


bump

>>2253748
Bordiga vindicated once more

>>2253748
>reject the United Front
gotta join hands with the groups that in first instance were okay with hitler or were shitting on the communists, it would totally work, just like he offered to join forces with brittain and france, look how it worked out, with munich and partition of czechoslovakia between poland and germany, and pretty much the open rearmament of germany.
>didn't collaborate with Nazis
guess he should've just let nazism take all of poland and get attacked soon after for the sake of european snakes.
gotta bring general hindsight over here.

>>2253748
You are lying because the Soviet Union and Stalin were constantly trying to create an anti-fascist front, including in the defense of Czechoslovakia and defending the Spanish Republic with aid and weapons, while the capitalist countries were blocking the country, pretending to be neutral, or directly helping the nationalist coup plotters in Spain, while liberals and capitalists were financing fascism with the intention of using Germany and reactionaries as cannon fodder against the Soviet Union and the communists, while the Soviet Union was doing the opposite. This plan only failed when British hegemony began to be threatened by German capitalist hegemony.

I consider it beneficial if capitalists try to kill each other, since communists are the greatest threat to capitalists, and only the competition between the petty interests of capitalist states makes them conflict with each other so that they offer a concession instead of focusing on going against communists.

I will post a link to clear up your ignorance in wanting to co-opt communists and workers for capitalist imperialism that you probably defend as a "lesser evil" than voting and organizing in a revolutionary workers' party independent of the bourgeoisie with non-negotiable principles of an anti-imperialist position against any financing from the bourgeois state for foreign intervention that feeds financial capital, therefore it is necessary to have internationalist socialist solidarity with the workers of the world.

https://msuweb.montclair.edu/~furrg/research/mlg09/did_ussr_invade_poland.html

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>>2253748
>wilsoncenter.org
fucking lol as bad as victims of gommunism foundation. I remember a North Korea thread with a debate-me guy claiming the Kims are deliberately keeping their population near starvation level to better control them, and that the Dear Leader personally said that to a diplomat. Source: The fucking Wilson Center. The actual quote was just the complaint that young people don't grasp what they have and how hard it used to be, with a comment by the article writer giving you that "interpretation".

Next time you want to share a link to something like Hamburger Freedom Institute, keep it to yourself.

Nobody ITT so far has engaged with the thesis of the OP

>>2267133
He is asking us why there are ziggers on leftypol, simple as

File: 1747161854223.mp4 (9.48 MB, 540x540, amadeo_bordiga AMV.mp4)

>>2252384
Amen to that.

>>2267154
No, you're dishonest, illiterate and/or intellectually lazy.

>>2267193
True. So whats hes saying?

>>2259255
notice how they didn't reply to this

>>2253748
>if he didn't reject the United Front
Ultimately that proved to be correct, but it's not like the SPD was rushing to form alliances with the communists either. Moreover they had shown by their betrayal of the revolution in 1919 that they would side with fascists to preserve bourgeois democracy rather than allow a socialist revolution to take place. While only a United Front could have stopped the rise of the Nazis, the social democrats had given the communists every reason to mistrust them. It's simply not fair to lay all the blame for the failure to form a united front at the feet of the Comintern.
>didn't collaborate with Nazis, etc.
That's an absurd mischaracterization. The Soviets tried numerous times to put together an international anti-German coalition and were constantly snubbed. In hindsight they maybe could have simply attacked Germany during the Battle of France, but nobody expected the French to fold so quickly, including the Germans. The Soviets understood that their non-aggression pact was only a delaying tactic that would buy time for the USSR to prepare for war.
>>2267133
It might help if OP clarified what they think is the authentic Leninist position on contemporary questions of imperialism and geopolitical struggle. Even when Lenin was alive the Soviet Union formed alliances with national bourgeois movements in Turkey, China, etc., so I don't see for example how the 3rd Internationale's position on these issues is such a deviation from Leninism.

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>>2267156
Christopher Moltisanti?

>>2267193
defending yourself from imperialism is not imperialism OP is wrong its that simple. National liberation has been progressive going back to Marx no Lenin Stalin etc did not come up with it.

>>2267217
>Even when Lenin was alive the Soviet Union formed alliances with national bourgeois movements
>in [Ottoman/Republic of] Turkey, [Republic of] China
Could you please give tips on precise search terms for me to research in relation to this? Would appreciate it.
I know a few years later under stalin the USSR /COMINTERN gave the Chinese communists such catastrophic advice that they nearly got them all wiped out and is one of the central pillars to breaking with Leninism itself into Maoism, or at least Mao Zedong Thought, for a fuckton of communists.

bump

>>2252376
>History then splits into the heroic good guys and the vile spawn of satan
Leninist “scientific materialism” in real time

>>2252376
Lmao it was his shittiest piece of theretical work and we live with consequences now when so called communists support literal islamists or fascoids in the name of anti-imperialism. It was great propaganda during cold war to get anti-colonialists side with USSR but there is no Warsaw Pact anymore.

Truly embarrassing display of /leftypol/ ITT

>DURR HURR MUCHO TEXTO
<MAKE IT IN HASANABI FORM PLZ???
>TL;DR BUT WHAT SIDE SHOULD I PICK THO?
<SILICON VALLEY CAN YOU SUMMARIZE THIS?? MAKE IT SHORT

>>2271125
Truth!
Imagine treating a propaganda pamphlet as a rigorous scientific work. The failure to advance beyond the Leninist theory of imperialism, is the main reason I can't take MLs serious.

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