I spent 4 hours last night laughing with my organized Iraqi comrade about MLs, their infantile belief in the state, support for the most batshit reactionary groups in the region and their Lassallen tendency. We also had a laugh about Hakim's blatant chauvinism, inaction and grift.
Good times. Thanks for making my week bros. The real movement will crush all, promise.
333 posts and 60 image replies omitted.>>2296693Even China doesn't consider itself Communist.
This is according to Professor Cheng Enfu, President of the Academy of Marxism at the Chinese Academy of Social Sciences (CASS) and Director of the Academic Division of Marxist Studies of CASS.
China divides their transitory timeline into 5 stages. These are:
>Modern Capitalism>Primary Stage of Socialism>Intermediate Stage of Socialism>Advanced Stage of Socialism>CommunismChina considers itself to be in it's "Third Era" since the end of New Democracy, but also they still classify this Era to be within in the aforementioned Modern Capitalism stage.
They plan to enter the Primary Stage of Socialism by 2035, and the Intermediate Stage by 2049.
They have no timeline for the Advanced Stage, or for achieving Communism.
Note that China doesn't plan to begin transitioning awat from commodity production and wage labour and into a socialist mode of production (as according to Marx) until the Advanced Stage, which they have no timeline for.
So no, China is not "Communist". It is ruled by a party that labels itself as a "Communist Party". According to China.
Anyone who is in the first bit serious about studying Chinese politics and economics should at least know this much.
As for being a DotP, we can argue over the criteria and I'll doubt we will convince each other. To me the DotP is as Marx called it - worker control of the means of production, worker control of the State.
China has a Vanguard Party which has formed itself into the new ruling elite. The economy is still run by the bourgeois capital owners. To me that doesn't meet the criteria of DoTP.
>>2296703What the fuck does it matter who dropped the first turd, when the ass that shit the most was Schachtman's?
>A year into the debate, a special convention was held in April 1940. After the April 1940 convention of the SWP, when Shachtman and his supporters on the new Political Committee refused to a vote on a motion pledging each member to abide by the convention decisions, they were expelled from the party.Especially since he was
expelled from the Trots, but is, somehow, responsible for every single Trotskyist stereotype.
>>2296813Communist China is in the primary stage of socialism. The Communist Party of China resolved
https://www.idcpc.org.cn/english2023/tjzl/cpcjj/PartyCongresses/202307/t20230727_157825.html that the primary stage of socialism is a phase of Communism therefore China is fully Communist.
>>2296862>capitalism is when wageWrong. Wages in socialist economy are by their very nature quite different from wages under capitalism. Since labour-power has ceased to be a commodity in socialist society, wages are no longer the price of labour-power. They express, not the relation between the exploiter and the exploited, but the relation between society as a whole, in the shape of the Socialist State, and the individual worker who is working for himself and for his society. Since under capitalism wages are the price of labour-power, they usually fluctuate, unlike the price of other commodities, below value. They do not always enable the workers to satisfy even the minimum of their requirements. With the abolition of the capitalist system of hired labour, the capitalistic law of value of labour-power has completely lost its validity as the regulator of wages. The basic economic law of socialism necessitates the maximum satisfaction of the constantly growing material and cultural requirements of the whole of society. The emancipation of wages from the limitations of capitalism enables them to be extended "to that volume of consumption, which is permitted on the one hand, by the existing productivity of society … and on the other hand, required by the full development of his (the worker's) individuality". (Marx, Capital, Vol. III, Kerr edition, p. 1,021.) Real wages constantly rise in accord with the growth and perfecting of socialist production. The requirements of the basic economic law of socialism with regard to stimulating production and raising the well-being of the working people are given effect through the law of distribution according to work. In accordance with this law, each worker's share in the social product is determined by the quantity and quality of his work. The Socialist State holds all the levers affecting the material welfare of the working people and applies a policy of systematically raising real wages.
>>2296868Wrong we are different people. I answer with Marxist line to the liberal who denies Communism.
>>2296881Wrong. You are anti-Communist.
https://www.marxists.org/reference/archive/deng-xiaoping/1987/60.htmThe Thirteenth National Party Congress will explain what stage China is in: the primary stage of socialism. Socialism itself is the first stage of communism, therefore China is Communist.
>>2296920I should've put /s at
>>2296914 because I'm not the anon you were replying to lol.
>>2296896The war on drugs is People's War.
>>2296916Money fundamentally changes its nature in being applied to the needs of the development of socialist economy. Under capitalism, money is turned into capital and is a means of appropriating the unpaid labour of other people. In socialist economy, on the other hand, money is a weapon of economic construction in the interests of the mass of the people in accordance with the requirements of the basic economic law of socialism. It is an expression of the socialist relations of production.
>>2296920>but the state appropriates surplus value from workers under the primary stage dotpWrong. Expanded socialist reproduction and expanded capitalist reproduction are opposites. Extended socialist reproduction requires the constant renewal and increase of the production of both means of production and articles of consumption, in the definite proportions laid down by the national economic plan.
In its value the social product is divided into: (1) the value of used-up means of production, which has been transferred to the product; (2) the new value which labour has created for itself; (3) the new value which labour has created for society. The social and economic nature of each of these parts of the value of the social product is essentially different from its nature under capitalism. In the process of socialist reproduction, national economic funds function in place of constant and variable capital, and the net income of society takes the place of surplus-value.
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