>0 protestant countries with organic communist revolutions
It's truly over. Unless western culture is changed at the grass roots level AND THEN politically promoted, no communism will ever come to the west. You cannot build communism in a society where the "individual" is some weird fetish that is a fake parody of itself from renaissance thought of 600 years ago.
>inb4 counter examples of collectivist pockets in western societies.
>inb4 helping chinese paratroopers when they land in the midwest
>inb4 mamadani
you had a higher chance of building communism in ancient egypt with the pharaohs as stalin then you do now in the west
Genesis 41:25-57
>>2377055>Christian American SouthI have seen more Communism from there than other places. In general, rural America is friendlier to communism materially than urban centers. Just don't call it communism and you are fine.
>government run grocery stores in republican villages
>USSRDoesn't exist anymore and they had to compromise with religion when nazis invaded. Also Brezhnev, also Gagarin was a Christian.
>PRC>AtheistIn the 60s sure, now it's a hodge podge of confusianism and lord knows what else.
>>2377047Yes but you have to take an immanent critique of the spirit of capitalism. I might also recommend Eric Weed's "The Religion of White Supremacy in the United States", Richard Chapman's "The Empire of Normality" and Harry Braverman's "Labor and Monopoly Capital." The popular religion of today is psy-science/eugenics which is a poorly secularized Calvinist replacement theology. The psyche being a social construct mostly created through the design of the means of production by the professional strata who study the workers. The psyche is the assembly line and the assembly line is God.
So how do we go about escaping the system from within? I have to be honest but Deleuze and Guattari's "Anti-Oedipus" completely filtered me. But I think communists in the West have to look deeper into work on critical psychiatry. So IMO it's really far from impossible. It just requires carefully unpacking the real subsumption of labor and ruthless jihad against the intelligentsia labor monopoly on knowledge production. It's odd but I think free software and copyleft is a start towards fighting the intellectual monopoly rents which form the material base of the psyche.
>>2377219Those are not counter examples.
They are copes.
>>2377047Idk what you're considering the west OP, but in western / central Europe the majority is either non-religious or not practicing their religion.
In Czechia most people flat out identify as atheists.
And it's a long lasting trend that one generation after another more people abandon religion.
Expect that trend to accelerate in a revolutionary situation.
Also the proletariat has no fatherland, "western culture" is a reactionary dog-whistle and you should leave.
>>2377055>Some people (like a certain Ca1eb Maup1n) claim that the Bourgeoisie are Satanists … Why should Communists oppose a Promethian figure that wanted to bring enlightenment and progress to humankindMarx was a personal fan of Prometheus iirc
Some of the LaRouche-adjacent types were kind of getting into that idea too (the LaRouchies consider themselves to be Promtheans in the tradition of the Enlightenment) but the analogies to a Milton-tier Satan might be too much for them trying to push Christcuckery at the same time.
>>2377281>>2377529I should have mentioned that I agree with Tkachov in that article. Also paraphrasing it. Just read the first paragraph and watch Engels seethe.
>>2377562I am more enlightened than any communist who thinks capitalism is a stepping stone to communism. It's the opposite. There have been 0 protestant/capitalist countries that organically switched to communism. They have all been non-protestant in some form. Either orthodox, catholic (lib theo) or asian (Kerala, China) or muslim (Yemen, DRA). Yes, Afghanistan became communist when the USSR didn't want them to because of feudalism bla bla. But guess what. The pro soviet afghan government OUTLASTED the USSR by like 4 months. Think about that shit. Ghani fell while americans didn't fully leave yet and Assad bailed out faster than anyone. But a feudal pro soviet afghanistan outlasted the soviets.
Listen here you commiekids.
>MODERNITY IS A CAPITALIST AND PROTESTANT INVENTION. MODERNITY HOLDS BACK ANY COLLECTIVIST ACTION. IT VENERATES THE INDIVIDUAL. ANY SUCCESSES IN COMMUNISM ARE IN PLACES THAT DID NOT HAVE MODERNITY DESTROY THEIR FABRIC OF SOCIETY YET.PROTESTANTISM LEADS TO MORAL INDIVIDUALISM WHICH LEADS TO CAPITALISM WHICH LEADS TO MODERNITY WHICH LEADS TO ANTICOLLECTIVISM WHICH MAKES COMMUNISM DIFFICULT OR IMPOSSIBLE TO ACHIEVE BECAUSE THE CULTURE IS RETARDED.
Why are retards so dense to understand this?
>>2377659lol, no
They were Catholics as well
>>2378081Too bad nothing ever happens.
Maybe they need a critical mass of white males to join their cause.
Someone should make an uncle sam poster with Xi face saying something deep and profound that would stimulate westerners.
SAVE US PRESIDENT XI
>>2377047>organic communist revolutions?
>Unless western culture is changed at the grass roots level AND THEN politically promotedpetit bourgeois moment
>>2378369I've done janitor work for a few tech companies, it's not that much of an exadgeration that they're prominent in tech. They're just not that wealthy because they do it where the cost of living makes that bigger number meaningless.
>millennial twitter usersGet off twitter, no one's exclusively on there anymore that's worth keeping up with. Even my grandma moved to bluesky after failing to figure out fedi.
>>2378755Uh actually op is right and you should give up and stop trying already
Even if op is right, we should be sabataging western infrastructure then
>>2377637Retarded exoticism
>>2377047terrible thread
>>2383249Based. The thread is based but so many replies are fucking idealists. The culture is shit and no theory-genuflecting will turn burgers to communism. Even the ACP fags have to change communism to make it more fashie so the burgers join. And even then it's not working.
In the minds of normies, communism will always be the ideology of losers or evil nerds. This is an uphill battle and the hill is a flat wall reaching into space. Our only hope is the chinese launching a red dawn style invasion and collaborating with them. I can't wait to rat out my shitty neighbours. I'll be the fucking chinese polizei collaborationist. The american population will have to pay with its blood for living off of imperalism. Iron felix was fucking right.
>>2384182I was gonna argue with you but you turned incoherent to the point of schizophrenia.
Average religion shill I guess.
>>2377659That has more to do with Slavic culture and Slavic race than religion.
You must compare how traditional Slavic tribes lived versus how traditional Germanic tribes lived
First of all, God isn't real and your psychologism/culture theory is just bourgeois pseudoscience.
Secondly, communism doesn't just happen by itself, it will happen through the conscious act of a communist party leading an INTERNATIONAL revolutionary proletariat and implementing a communist program.
The ICP -
https://www.international-communist-party.org/ is the party that will lead this international revolution.
>>2384236The truth hurts pussyboy. I'm an atheist but a realist. These religions are around much longer than communism because the fact is feudalism is very stable. There is nothing supernatural about this. There is too much infighting within communism and the whole ideology in the minds of normies is just: How do we stop excessive consumption of resources and have a more socially considerate population? Both of these can only be solved via culture so I agree with OP. I hate the idealistic morons in this thread. You imbeciles forgot that Che called out the soviets for being mercantile faggots. You forget the entire eastern block sold out socialism for levis and mcdonalds. Even china is a consumerist empire. The human being is a flawed piece of shit and out of millions of lame humans, only a small fraction are communism-worthy. My whole worldview is to support whoever will launch a war of annihilation against westoids. I want everyone to live in a stalker or fallout universe, maybe then people can curb their bullshit desires. Fuck people. We should have never evolved. I just wish the other apes killed the mutants to prevent this bullshit trajectory. Fucking prehistoric aktion t4 should have been done and all this shit would have been avoided.
Tldr;
>Humans are a fucking mistake of evolution.>Humans are mentally unstable unsatiable freaks.>Humans cannot create communist conditions>Human development is a fucking joke>I agree with the Neocons and WEF that It would be best for 99.99% of the human population to be killed with the remaining fraction tightly controlled and brainwashed on a reservation.>Maybe this newly evolved homo sapiens might create communism who knowsDear Idealists, Fuck you all. Communism is your god that failed. Whatever comes after will be some consumerist soul crushing communism mixed with crapitalism (china etc). Enjoy your weekend dipshit idealists.
Ps. I am an anarchist
>>2384919>a sizable chunk of your I.Q comes from your genes, that shit is not even for discussion anymore in academic circle is just straight up realitysource, please?
https://seanamcclure.medium.com/intelligence-complexity-and-the-failed-science-of-autism score-4fb17ce3f12
>>2384912Man I wish Grace was more active, I'm not a fan of monarchism but at least her conception of monarchism was made with intent to be compatible with communism.
Perhaps she made that neocities some anons suggested she make, but I haven't seen it yet.
>>2385227>thingnoticerismSpeak normal please.
>miliary furriesBecause I jack off to anthros and it's a common joke that all prominent furries are wealthy and work at like Google or Lockheed Martin.
>>2385246>accept realitiy and actually move on to a productive debateIt's pretty clear that there's no "debating" with you. Whatever you imagine the genetic link to intelligence proves is to you firmly settled fact, and we've had these "debates" here on leftypol for years where some high idiot score brainlet comes along with
>hey fellow lefties what about uyghurs they're too stupid for communism>hey fellow lefties what do we do about mixed races living together communism can't work if you're not smart enough to appreciate rick and morty>hey fellow lefties what sort of eugenics programs are appropriate for communism we don't want the stupid untermenschen outbreeding us smart people rightAnd on and on. No one wants to "debate" you because we've heard your nazi shit all before. Your mensa wanker pseudoscience shit doesn’t matter and never will. Die mad about it.
>>2385246https://www.nakedcapitalism.com/2025/07/hayeks-bastards-and-the-rise-of-neoliberalism.html[…]
>In the minds of “race scientists” this was undoubtedly true. And in the “race scientist” Richard Lynn, the incipient alt-right found the link between their scientism and the think tanks they needed. A few years before The Bell Curve was published Lynn wrote to Herrnstein about his plan to rehabilitate eugenics:
<It seems extraordinary that basically sound principles that we need to find ways to correct genetic deterioration should have become so widely accepted in the first four decades of the (twentieth) century and subsequently have become lost…One of our most important tasks is to convince the people of the significance of heritability of intelligence and criminality, and of race differences for the social problems confronting the US. These Think Tanks have considerable influence on informed public opinion and on politicians far more than we in psychology do, and if some of them could be converted public understanding of these problems would be greatly advanced. [5]
>In the words of Quinn Slobodian, autism score-centrism the perfect excrescence of “race science” in the post-industrial age:
<It was built on mainstream concerns about the knowledge and information economy, national competitiveness, and analogies of human beings as information processors. Thriving on the craze for standardized outcomes, rankings, benchmarks, and indicators, autism score-centrism offers a simple and powerful story about the world that naturalizes and hardens existing hierarchies, reinforces folk understandings of difference, and disempowers efforts of collective reform. Perhaps most effectively, it does so with the elegance of a single number – autism score is a biologized credit score.
>Still, one might wonder in 2025 how autism score as a biologized credit score [6] will be useful in the Age of Algorithmic Intelligence, which might well have the same effect on the employment and life chances of high-neurocaste individuals as did the Great Depression that made an impression on Lewis Terman ninety years ago.
>The only problem with this “race science” is that it is not valid. The “basically sound principles” of Richard Lynn were nothing more than “folk understandings of difference.” Murray and Herrnstein constantly conflated genes with race, but in their own analysis in The Bell Curve racial status was based on self-identification rather than genetics. So, which is it? It has long been understood that genetic differences within so-called racial groups are greater than those between different groups; this has been confirmed by the recent science of the human genome. Therefore, these differences cannot account for the conclusions of these latter-day eugenicists. [7] The Genetic Lottery: Why DNA Matters for Social Equality (2021) by Kathryn Paige Harden is a recent restatement of the problem from the “gene’s perspective” using modern terminology. Her update to the continuo of conservative thought is reviewed here, with responses by Harden and others here. A large cup of coffee is recommended, but these links cover the relevant history well while giving voice to several common perspectives on the subject.
>Yes, individuals are different, even including identical twins who may have different epigenetic markers (distinct labels attached to their DNA at different places with variable effects on gene expression) in their otherwise identical genomes. But that is not the point. Aside from superficial heritable traits, race is now and has always been a sociopolitical construct and nothing else. This was recognized by the theologian, farmer, and revolutionary pastor Clarence Jordan (pronounced Jur-den) in the early-1940s when he established Koinonia Farm in the Southwest Georgia of Jimmy Carter. Karen E. Fields and Barbara J. Fields described the significance of race eighty years later in Racecraft: The Soul of Inequality in American Life (2022), where biology has nothing to do with race beyond the standard, and mistaken, “folk understandings of difference.”
>The question remains, “Why all this?” A large part of the answer concerns the true objective of The Bell Curve:
<The Bell Curve was never merely an academic undertaking. It was a counterattack on what the authors saw as the corrosive doctrine of equality as sameness, a doctrine Murray later wrote had its political roots in the ‘legal triumphs of the civil rights movement and the rise of feminism.’
>We can let the evils of civil rights and women’s rights just sit there for a moment before proceeding. What most frightens (and that is the proper term) those to whom The Bell Curve provides their world view is their belief that any increase in moral, social, political, and economic equality will destroy their ideal society and lead inexorably to “equality as sameness.” In their cramped vision, any increase in equality will lead to levelling. And the key for them is that levelling is always down, never up. This is a constant theme, sometimes stated outright, sometimes implied in conservative thought. For example, in The Conservative Mind: From Burke to Eliot (1985, orig. 1953), Russell Kirk in his discussion of Edmund Burke writes:
<All values are not the same, nor are all impulses, nor all men. A natural gradation teaches men to hold some sentiments dear and others cheap. Levelling radicalism endeavors to put all emotions and sensations upon the same level of mediocrity, and so to erase the moral imagination which sets men apart from beasts. “On this scheme of things, a king is but a man, a queen is but a woman; a woman is but an animal, and an animal of not the highest order.” When Burke wrote of how “learning will be cast into the mire, and trodden under the hoofs of a swinish multitude”…(he)…was simply paraphrasing Matthew 7:6; and he meant what some eminent socialist critics are coming to dread, that the mass of men, shorn of proper intellectual leadership, “all the decent drapery of life torn rudely off,” will be indifferent, or perhaps hostile, to anything that is not flesh.
>The identity of “some eminent socialist critics” remains unknown. […] >cultureCulture is a fake concept only by idealist liberals with zero historical materialism to sneer at people:
https://historiansplaining.com/myth-of-the-month-22-culture/<What is “culture”? And how did a metaphor from gardening invade social-science discourse in 19th-century Germany and America and then take the world by storm? We consider the myriad, often contradictory, ways that “culture” is deployed in current rhetoric, usually to sneak in hidden value judgments; then we trace how an ancient Latin term for gardening came to refer to the “cultivation” of good character, then to the shaping of society by high art and refined customs, and then ultimately, under the influence of German and American imperial politics, to a purportedly unified, organic whole encompassing the sum total of all learned behaviors in a given society However you define it, I make the case that it is the defining myth of our time, and that we should get rid of it. >>2385246soy PMC Contrapoints voice:
<"The majority of anti-Zionists just straight up shut down the debate about Palestinians being subhuman and deserving to be imprisoned in nazi ghettos"PMC settler socialists really can't help themselves but do Jeffrey Epstein praxis, their entire existence is defined by plantation slave management. Notice how the actual working class are never mentioned even once by these degenerates. The PMC will never factor actual humans into their Excel spreadsheet equations written by the class of soulless bugman redditors ("nooo that's not scientific to dehumanize ME!!! You would never be invited to the American Psychological Association like the Zionist puppet Richie Torres!")
its not a coincidence that Steven Pinker, the most egregiously neoliberal ideology guy who was aligned with Jeffrey Epstein, described the settler socialist hero Freddie Deboer as his "favorite Marxist". Class solidarity is real
>For a long time, "eugenics" has been a boo-word, almost always misapplied and misunderstood. Freddie deBoer (My Favorite Marxist) explains how this has recently gotten even worse: Perhaps Not Everything is Eugenics, by @freddiesubstackhttps://xcancel.com/sapinker/status/1483885141676068866 >>2377047It seems to me that really the communist revolutions have come about in the most reactionary and hyper-capitalist of countries like China and Russia.
You have to think dialecticlly. The Protestant countries were not capitalist enough for communist revolution to develop.
I still maintain that America is basically a feudal society that never had a proper bourgeois democratic revolution. America still basically has a feudal society of cowboy barons ruling over it.
If the periphery is semi-feudal then I would describe the imperial core as the other side of feudalism. It's really the semi-periphery which is the most capitalist society.
IMO the internal contradictions of the imperial core are tightest in the circulation and commodification of labor rather then wage labor itself. You have the international contradictions of labor monopsony and intellectual monopoly rent. Due to the imperial core's labor aristocracy, profit on enterprise is not the strongest internal contradiction. The strongest contradictions lies in the buying and selling of labor, so the hiring process rather than the firm per se.
Anyhow this commodification manifests in shit like psychiatry and a crushing conformity. Basically, LinkedIn is the central contradiction of the imperial core.
>>2392253>most reactionary and hyper-capitalist countries like China and Russia>The Protestant countries were not capitalist enough for communist revolution to developAnon, I wish I smoked the expired crack you are smoking. I am about to yell at you over the text box.
Russia and China were feudal (ultra-feudal) shitholes. They did not have developed capitalism. America and the west is hyper-capitalist. It's hyper-capitalist because it is universally utilitarian and individualist. Anon you make me want to kill myself. For real. All communist revolutions happened in countries with undeveloped capitalism or no capitalism. No developed capitalist country became communist, this is a historical fact.
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