22nd century historians will know less about the 21st century for certain than 20th century historians knew about, for instance, the 10th century, because AI is going to pollute academia to such a degree that it will be impossible for future generations to sort out real stuff from slop … is what I would say if I actually thought AI was going to continue development and not become a hyperinflated speculative bubble and technological dead end and historical curiosity looked back on with a mixture of pity, confusion, anger, and disgust.
>>2437969 The thing that's bothersome is that a lot of comrades will extrapolate and apply the same kind of mythical, linear thinking to historical (and current) societies, especially when dealing with neolithic (up to medieval) history, our understanding of how people lived during these periods has changed dramatically. And in a good way too.
>>2437970My bad, thanks. My point still stands regardless though.
>>2438175Ofcourse, although we have to add that it also shows that these ideas came from Europeans in colonial time, so it bebcomes kinda icky, especially when these things still get repeated as truth.
>>2438234here you go anon. marxism and primitive societies is from the 70s so is a bit antiquated in some ways and not entirely up on the state of the contemporary field but its a great summary, highly recommend it. banaji is imo the gold standard for contemporary marxist historians, but since hes a professional historian working in the field his work is aimed at this more professional academic audience
>>2438216>we have to add that it also shows that these ideas came from Europeans in colonial time, so it bebcomes kinda icky, especially when these things still get repeated as truth.sure but a lot of that is repeated as straight up slander. its important to learn based on the materials available even if whats available is "icky", you need to use your own judgement and read critically. see attached Marx at the Margins, another anon started a thread with the image as the OP though i doubt if they read it. it is a very useful overview of the progression of marx's thought with regard to europe/wider world
>>2438329i do not recommend this book as an introduction or a serious text to consult. i really enjoyed reading it but it is very poorly sourced and argued, its more like a lengthy polemic on the subject. unfortunately graeber is just not a very credible source at all
see this marxist economist bloggers critique of his debt book and how badly it mangles the subject:
https://desperatetimes914496456.wordpress.com/2025/08/04/again-graeber/ >>2438339i will say that at the very least it is a very cool selection of various archaeological sites & unique anthropological phenomena that arent easy to come by on your own otherwise, let alone all in one place. i really appreciate it for that and i dont mind graeber & wengrows speculation, i just wish they framed their limited speculation as what it is instead of making firm arguments based on like 4 tiers of questionable conclusions strung together
and its not that the sources provided arent serious or credible, its that they often have very limited relevance to the claims they provided to defend. there were multiple times they described cultural qualities or historical features that sounded extremely interesting, and i looked for the source to learn more about it, and the source had either minimal or none at all details about the actual phenomena being described and was just a general overview of the culture/site etc. even more times theres something to their statements, but it becomes clear they FAR exaggerate the consensus around the interpretation of the phenomena or the significance of it in that context
but yes i will at least say i wont exactly DISCOURAGE reading it, and i personally enjoyed reading it and find it to be a great resource in spite of the overall arguments & the very mixed quality/relevance of evidence provided. i dont even DISAGREE with their overall thesis and in many ways agree with them that it seems more plausible, which makes me even more frustrated at an execution that i frankly think is undermined to a large extent by its intellectual arrogance
>>2438359he probably just means that people who find AI to be convincingly replicating human thought & behavior have a poor and superficial understanding of human thought & behavior, and see it as primarily a mechanistic means to an end
im inclined to agree in many ways but for the most part i think thats a bit unfair, considering the generative models are at the very least very sophisticated at imitating human writing in a recognizable way. i still find it very uncanny & "soulless" but i dont think everyone who finds it convincing is a sociopath. i do think anyone who believes it has any real potential for simulating actual human reasoning and interaction is either ignorant, delusional, or an idiot, often some combination of the 3
>>2437937Primitive communism =/= idyllic smurf village, Marx and Engels knew foraging bands and tribes also experience conflict and scarcity and hardship
>>2437969Marx’s theory of history =/= the Soviet Union’s mechanical interpretation of Marx, Marx’s theory of history was a fundamentally open one
>>2437937>the whole primitive communism thing is so laughable todayIts laughable because neoliberal subjects today are domesticated cattle and unable to imagine a society that engages in collective struggle and mutual aid. The only way an NPC can even think of such a thing is if a flood destroys all their infrastructure and forces them to be "primitive" (actually human!)
>>2438694>Are you a NEET? Get the fuck out of here parasite.Liberal is baffled by critiques of liberalism, the only way they can reduce their cognitive dissonance is this rhetoric. If you know anything about Marxism you would know Luddites were working class movement that wanted to avoid being disempowered and de-skilled, and ultimately enslaved as easily replaceable cogs in the machine. OP talked about a lack of human history, and indeed automated tech has been infamous for being extremely lacking in technical documentation so people can repair the parts or whatever. its almost impossible to find information for some private companies machine tooling. Why? Because the workers who actually built that stuff were disempwoered, de-skilled, and ultimately enslaved. Its typical liberalism to call people "parasite" for not wanting the technocratic Jeffrey Epstein PMC class to enslave your family and dispose of them when they are no longer useful
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