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/leftypol/ - Leftist Politically Incorrect

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Not reporting is bourgeois


File: 1755542803449.jpg (110 KB, 853x1280, GyfRYerWgAAATKq.jpg)

 

People would despise the shit out of Marx if he wasn't so giddy about natlib and democracy like he was, which was much to his detriment. Marx and Engels sacrificed their own conclusions for strategy they got swept up in false optimism, mistaking the early revolt of the workers and imperialist conflicts for revolutionary progress. They sent solidarity to national wars that were laying the foundations of capitalism because they thought they were helping communism. That was more cheerleading for democracy than anything remotely communist.

any examples?

>>2438119
>That was more cheerleading for democracy than anything remotely communist.

Communism is democracy without classes which comes after proletarian dictatorship which is democracy for proletarians and nobody else. Bourgeois democracy is democracy for the rich. When you say democracy you have to specify the class character otherwise you're just naval gazing.

>they were heckin natlib


in 1848 that was historically progressive in the Prussian system they were living in.

>>2438128
>When you say democracy you have to specify
There's only one existing democracy at the moment. Anything else is just ideals.

>>2438128
Marx never went beyond on TJQ when it came to critiquing the state so he never worked out a critique of democracy either, sadly.

>in 1848 that was historically progressive in the Prussian system they were living in.

They were still flawed strategies pandering to contemporary liberal academic tastes.

>>2438136
"At the end of every labour-process, we get a result that already existed in the imagination of the labourer at its commencement." - Marx

"The old world is dying, the new world struggles to be born. Now is the time of monsters." - Gramsci

>>2438140
Bourgeois revolutions overthrow feudal power structures. That is what was happening in Prussia. It would have been naive to get too ahead of themselves. Look what happens when you do:

>We made the mistake of deciding to go over directly to communist production and distribution. We thought that under the surplus-food appropriation system the peasants would provide us with the required quantity of grain, which we could distribute among the factories and thus achieve communist production and distribution […] brief experience convinced us that that line was wrong, that it ran counter to what we had previously written about the transition from capitalism to socialism, namely, that it would be impossible to bypass the period of socialist accounting and control in approaching even the lower stage of communism […] our theoretical literature has been definitely stressing the necessity for a prolonged, complex transition through socialist accounting and control from capitalist society (and the less developed it is the longer the transition will take) to even one of the approaches to communist society. […] Get down to business, all of you! You will have capitalists beside you, including foreign capitalists, concessionaires and leaseholders. They will squeeze profits out of you amounting to hundreds per cent; they will enrich themselves, operating alongside of you. Let them. Meanwhile you will learn from them the business of running the economy, and only when you do that will you be able to build up a communist republic. Since we must necessarily learn quickly, any slackness in this respect is a serious crime. And we must undergo this training, this severe, stern and sometimes even cruel training, because we have no other way out.


<Lenin, The New Economic Policy, 1921

>>2438119
Crypto-zigger thread. I won't bite the bait.

>why didnt marx and engels just screech and whine about breaking into the Capitalist Control Room and pressing the big red Abolish Commodities button

>>2438119
On the question national liberation, I don't know how can anyone view it as a defect of Marxism instead of it's primary strength after Lenin started emphasizing it and it only became ever more important since then, seeing as every single surviving socialist experiment is a product of a national liberation struggle and the biggest win of the communists movement were due to imperialist wars. In fact, if Marx can be criticized for anything, it's that he was too eurocentric and he only theorized how the pure form of capitalism worked that existed in England instead of fully incorporating into his theory the fact that industrial capitalism came to be as a result of European colonialism. As history showed, imperialist wars and open robbery of resources have remained a constant feature of capitalism instead of an "original sin" as Marx or today's apologetics of Western hegemony would describe it. Even then he was much ahead of his time as a great deal of his contemporaries in the burgeoning international worker's movement were open social-imperialists and/or anti-semites.

On "bourgeois" democracy, universal suffrage was a massive advancement for the working class that was mainly forced by the waves of unrest and revolution that sweeped through Europe after WW1. Feudal structures of the time enforced a joint dictatorship of capitalists and the landed aristocracy. It hasn't been that long time ago when feudal structures were used against the working class (see the dismissal Gough Whitlam by the royal governor of Australia). It's hard to chastize Marx, whose main activity was building political representation for the working class, just because was opposed to systems that made such a thing impossible legally.

mfw ultras discover marx and engels were filthy campists who supported indians, irish, american slaves and so on

>>2438320
Marx supported british colonialism against indianSS and american settlers against mexikkkans, Lenin said that imperialism should be defended against monopoly crapitalism because it's more progressive, now on your knees and sing the US anthem chvd

> People would despise the shit out of Marx
They already do.
>They sent solidarity to national wars that were laying the foundations of capitalism because they thought they were helping communism. That was more cheerleading for democracy
Capitalism only leads to a dictatorship of another type of class.

>>2438327
remember the algorithm lads

>bad thing happens

<this is good because accelerationism
>good thing happens
<this is bad because reformism

>>2438194
>instead of fully incorporating into his theory the fact that industrial capitalism came to be as a result of European colonialism
His theory of primitive accumulation can easily be extended to cover European colonialism, even if he didn't focus on it enough.

>People would despise the shit out of Marx
They already do, one of the most demonized people in history, as with all successful communists after him

why did you just start a new thread? tired of getting btfo in the old one?

>>2438327
Imperialism is monopoly capitalism you idiot

>>2438662
What about when a mid thing happens?

>>2438119
>They sent solidarity to national wars that were laying the foundations of capitalism because they thought they were helping communism.
Marx was pretty explicit that capitalism is a prerequisite for communism. Nationalism is also a prerequisite for internationalism.

I dont know where your idealist delusions come from but Marx was a materialist, he didn't just come up with something he thought was good and declare it to be so but actually analyzed how communism would develop from social relations and productive force. Its not "to his detriment" but precisely the core of his thought. It is what makes the difference between a communist and a social democrat or anarchist.

You would get a lot more traction and also actually be coherent and honest if you weren't trying to defend some abstract "communism" you invented and just rejected Marx and Communism fully, but you might actually have to read and figure out what it means first.

>>2438732
>Nationalism is also a prerequisite for internationalism.
why would anybody care about internationalism


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