/leftypol/ - Leftist Politically Incorrect

>>2503856
0.
98% of it is burgerLARP.

The treat-supply will not be disturbed, zigger 😤

0. You can tell because Kirk got shot and there were no revenge shootings from the Republicans. Then a MAGAtard shot up a place and there were no revenge shootings from the Democrats. Social media has totally pacified the country people will shout the worst things at each other online and then IRL will behave like normal to each other.

not anytime soon

I read that the population is too old for civil war

>>2503862
Tbh groypers hate Kirk and those are the animals who are most likely to commit mass shootings.

Liberals and leftists would be retarded to engage in civil war. This government full of morons will sooner or later implode. Liberals and leftists should engage in sabotage while right wing apes foam at their mouth on the sidelines waiting for a transperson to do 9/11 No 2.

>>2503862
Based and Academic Agent-Pilled

If there's a civil war it'll be between different factions of right wingers, a general attempting a coup type of shit. Most of the population views civil war like it's a sports event and sees politics in the same way. There's a good shot if it happened most normies wouldn't even truly care until after the US agreed to balkanize.

Democraps and republicucks are two sides of the same coin so they wouldn't attack each other.

>>2503874
Literally true, look at the average ages for all the countries having civil wars right now, they’re all under 30, most being under 20. Americans are all 50 years old and on 15 different medications to keep from exploding, that’s not a population willing to fight and die.

>>2503882
Literally who?
>>2503877
Spic Funforus is pacifist and coerces his tard fanboys to be non-violent as well.

The only people who will carry out targeted shootings in America are
A) Gang members
B) Schizos and the mentally ill
C) Scorned Husbands/Wives taking revenge on their lovers

Anything else is CIA/FBI. Like seriously has there been anyone over the past 30 years who did targeted killings who didn't fall neatly into any of those groups?

remember the chunk of the population that wants civil war the most wouldn't even put on a mask or get vaccines for a disease they themselves were convinced was a chinese bioweapon. Most americans couldn't even handle the wartime rationing of butter and gasoline seen in WW2 much less Syrian civil war like conditions. Not to mention despite all the talk about rural areas growing all the food with the state of modern agribuisness farming and simple fact that small towns are more like extensions of the urban landscape into the interior than self sufficient agrarian communities the small towns will starve just as much as the big cities when the trucks full of fertilizer,replacement parts, livestock feed, processed store bought food, fuel and pretty much everything else stop showing up. What I find to be more likely than a civil war is something like the rwandan genocide where roving bands of reactionaries go around massacring random civilians while getting hyped up by online propaganda and the tacit backing of the state.

>>2503856
I have a few thoughts on it. It's an interesting sci-fi scenario or a way for movie directors to take scenes from documentaries filmed in Iraq, Syria, etc. and set them in America to scare the shit out of people. But I think there are a few reasons why that's very unlikely.

Take shooters for example. They can be "political" or target "political" people, but often times the individuals involved have zero history of being involved in "politics" in any kind of organized way. Or maybe the person has some kind of grudge like the Shinzo Abe assassin in Japan. There's a lot of suffering and anomie and social atomization which I think is probably contributing to that (the assassin's mother had also been exploited by a cult that supported Abe), but it's a very fragmented sort of violence. It's not like my neighborhood is being attacked by organized guys from another neighborhood who show up in technicals with anti-aircraft guns mounted on them, but that happened recently in Suwayda in southern Syria.

Civil wars mobilize communities. The leaders of militias in civil wars are community and political leaders who people trust enough to lead them. I look around where I live, most people don't know any of their neighbors. If they do, maybe it's at church (if they go, although that is declining) and they rarely do things like cook for them. Kind of a blessing in the form of a curse. We're too atomized to fight a civil war. The main exception I see in that regard are immigrants from India who actually walk around neighborhoods at night as a family.

–

What if we thought about civil wars as part of the historical development of modern states. There are societies that are still going through this process, but it's less likely in many places because they already went through it in the 1800s or earlier (like the U.K.). Joshua Landis has described the roots of several conflicts in the world in countries as going back to collapsing empires at the end of World War I. (In the Middle East that is the Ottoman Empire.) I think in the U.S. it would take something extraordinary like being invaded by a foreign adversary that destroys the existing state (which the U.S. has done to several countries in the 21st century), but again, that's a sci-fi scenario.

–

One of the upsides of Americans' noticeable lack of historical consciousness is the difficulty of mobilizing people based on age-old historical grievances. Right-wing nostalgia for the 1950s isn't even the same thing as wanting to re-run Pickett's Charge which some Southerners fantasized about in 1910, although the actual civil war that happened may have inoculated the society enough to block it from happening again.

–

A sci-fi scenario that you might play with is the idea of new technological forms of violence (like drone warfare) that does collapse traditional boundaries which keep war "outside" of the territory of modern states, but that also goes on while the society continues to exist in a state of atomization and indifference. This would be a bit like Russia or some late 20th century cyberpunk novel in which there's a "war" but people don't even know that there is one, or why, or who it's with really; and while they're aware of sporadic drone attacks, but they're otherwise going about their lives without much concern for it, like it just becomes small talk, routine. They just see a bunch of burning cars occasionally or something. "The drone flew right at me! Man, I must be really brave, heh… anyways have you tried this new bourbon burger? *munch munch*" Like the notion that people are living through some kind of political or historical event is just completely lost on them.

the Civil War was about the right to rape slaves and transfer them across borders as commodity objects…but that's already the status quo thanks to neoliberals (lol PMC Breadtube anarchists are petite Jeffrey Epsteins who literally tweet their dreams of 'decolonized pagan sex temples where sex is freely given'…huh, so these liberal Zionists don't actually believe 'sex work is work', these degenerate socialists want slaves who willingly choose to be their servants?)

Civil War 2 is more like a CIA pedo color revolution. Look at the degenerate new age pedophile slave owning ruling class in Tibet if you want to see the utopia which millennial revolutionaries want to fight for

>>2503946
What?

I like this movie since instead of focusing only on the big name factions it gives screentime to these random gangsters and schizo retards who used the war as an excuse to kill people and establish their fiefs without understanding wtf is going on. When people think of an 'American Civil War' they instantly think of the actual, historical Civil War, with clearly defined borders, large scale battles like Shiloh and Gettysburg, etc. But a modern day civil war will completely destroy any sort of economy the US has in a way unimaginable to the 19th century, and when you have economic collapse and prolonged war you get warlordism with lumpenbourgs offering black market goods in exchange of loyalty

How would the borders be drawn? The division isn't between north and south or east and west; it's between urban cities and outer rural areas, between rich and poor, between white and black, between white and latino, etc. It's got very little to do with geography this time, more to do with culture, ideology, class, etc.

I don't think we're headed for something like the Civil War, I think this is just rot. The whole thing is just falling apart, the experiment didn't work. I think what will happen is something more like the Great Depression, only worse. Imagine The Grapes Of Wrath in the modern era, millions of people out on the roads wandering from city to city looking for work, constant strikes and war between strikers and strikebreakers, cities under martial law, police and military and militias and deputized redneck goon squads clubbing and shooting the starving restless proles, shanty towns springing up outside cities and getting torched by the cops, chaos and war and famine and destruction, etc.

>>2503862
yeah the internet is actually great for this because it allows the masses to vent in a digital space and sucks all the energy of the masses, both revolutionary and reactionary, out of real life. It's a void to scream into, but also a place to manufacture consent and despair.

>>2503862
>ou can tell because Kirk got shot and there were no revenge shootings from the Republicans. Then a MAGAtard shot up a place and there were no revenge shootings from the Democrats. Social media has totally pacified the country people will shout the worst things at each other online and then IRL will behave like normal to each other.
>>2504038
>yeah the internet is actually great for this because it allows the masses to vent in a digital space and sucks all the energy of the masses, both revolutionary and reactionary, out of real life. It's a void to scream into, but also a place to manufacture consent and despair.
An interesting thing about the Kirk shooting is to think about the animal-brained reaction that people had to this. It turns out that this guy was a bipedal mammal that was easy to kill. One minute he's there, the next minute he's gone. This scares the shit out of people, and it's why public executions used to happen (as a way to terrorize the population to not do what the poor bastard who is getting his head chopped off with a guillotine did). It's like CHOP or BANG (and you fire a gun) and people are like AYEEEEEE.

This kind of incident gets that animal instinct activated in people's brains. People are immediately plunged into confusion and chaos, and then the reaction is to either run, or go attack something just like cats suddenly panicking. But while there was a lot rhetoric online about attacking the left in retaliation, there's a trillion people saying all kinds of things (or that it was Israel or whatever) that it creates a lot of confusion. Do you stay or fight? People can't function. Sometimes the end goal of the post-shock / post-incident "narrative" is just chaos and confusion because it's monetizable. Like if you donate $5 to me then I'll make sure it doesn't happen again.

There is a subset of Americans who resolve things with violence. It happens every night at bars. But the other 85% of the population is not doing that. The left is not trying to kill the right. The right is not trying to kill the left either BTW. Trump doesn't need to wipe out the left because he's in power already, he just wants to escalate his power so he can be in charge and redecorate more government buildings with fake gold furnishings and give himself titles, and not have to deal with the political system. To do that, he needs to construct a narrative that the country is under threat.

He wants to be like Fujimori in Peru. That wasn't a coup, it was an autogolpe where you go through the existing mechanisms to seize control. Peru at that time actually had the Shining Path though. Trump needs to escalate and he's sending National Guard troops around, but if the other side doesn't match the escalation, there's probably a limit to how far Trump and the right-wing cabal around him (who don't represent the majority of the population) can escalate. It's like J6. That was an attempt to use force to take power, but the plan needed "antifa" to be there for it to work so Trump could be like "we have to stop these communists from stealing the election (stop the steal!)" so he could try to remain in power, and antifa wasn't there so it didn't work.

The MAGA far-right stupidly believing that America's downfall will be anything at all like the Civil War will probably bite them in the ass if it ever does come to that, similar to how the American soldiers marching off to Vietnam stupidly believed that they would be engaging in symmetric warfare with two opposing armies fighting on open ground. The war would be a war between a failing authoritarian military-police state using whatever means necessary to try to maintain order in the midst of constant riots and terrorist attacks and urban guerilla warfare. If it happens under a Republican president like Trump it will be MAGA militias siding with the police, military, etc. If it happens under a Democratic president like a more successful version of January 6, military and police would probably side with MAGA and they would overthrow the government and install an authoritarian MAGA regime and we would be back to MAGA militias siding with the authoritarian state against rebel Resistance groups, either left-wing or maybe some libertarians who occasionally break away from MAGA and switch sides as MAGA becomes increasingly authoritarian and repressive and every major city is under martial law with constant SWAT/military patrols and mass surveillance.

>>2504108
exactly the point i've been trying to make for the past year or so, people are trying to imagine this through the lens of more well known, but completely different events and trying to compare MAGA and the trump movement to fascist ones, but in reality, it has infinitely more in common with alberto fujimori, a man who was opportunistically able to ascend through the ranks of power, collaborate with the military, and lead a nice little authoritarian democracy, and who was infamous for so much stupid shit in a similar way to trump, trump is not hitler, he is the US version of fujimori, and the sooner you realize this the less effective his shock tactics become

Too old and fat for this.

>>2503856
only uyghas who play too much TFR HOI4, and rewatch the CIVIL WAR 2024 movie will think the civil war is comming

>>2503856
Civil war will only happen if people begin to starve, maybe that will happen in the future but its not happening on a grand enough scale rn.

>>2504832
A modern civil war in an developed country will look nothing like that A24 movie. It looks more like Ukraine 2014-2022

>>2504841
so like the civil war in The Fire Rises HOI4 mod ?

>>2504841
no, if a civil war happens, it will look like no other civil war, it will be a war on every level of society, at every town and so on, it will be extremely brutal, violent, and fraternal, brother against brother, father against son, and so on

>>2503862
The distance between threats on the internet and gloating about dead political opponents, and actual action is measured in missed meals, i.e. a massive economic downturn.

>>2504901
not really though, most civil wars are not on every level of society, imagine the worst civil war (for example, the somali civil war) except with modern equipment and across a continental landmass

It will be legally and economically legit, but larp in spirit.

>>2503856
A Civil War requires a real division in the elites. What would they even fight over? Whether the corporate tax rate should be 20% of 24%? Maybe there's a lot of frustrated people but it doesn't matter unless some Lenin or ᴉuᴉlossnW comes and scoops them up.

Extremely unlikely because the fat rightoid Civil War RPGers and keyboard warriors pacify themselves with their Greek/Roman statue fetish.

>>2503917
Hit the nail on the head, civil war is impossible because community in America is dead. There are no clans, tribes, villages or religious communities, there is only the self.

>>2504975
it could still happen in spite of that, it's just genuinely very unlikely due to the fact that america will not go out with a bang, but a whimper, for better or for worse, unless the conditions rapidly change i don't see anything else being possible

>>2504979
The only possible way it could happen is if certain ideological groups that actually go out and do shit IRL, like Patriot Front or those various small neo nazi groups, actually launched a military operation and took control of some city district or something and attracted loads of similar-minded people online to join them. But rn that's unlikely, because those people online are living very comfortably and will most likely just cheer them on uselessly over the internet. The economic situation has to get worse.

>>2504981
it's more like if a riot turned into an ideological battle, which rapidly spirals into a low level war in a city, which as both of us mentioned, is unlikely, as it would require a significantly worse economic downturn than now (which is a busted, although still technically healthy economy), then it would require a crisis (most likely a war going badly) and then maybe i could see it happening, but those seem to be unlikely within even the next 5 years

>>2504984
True, if we had another BLM/"leftist" riot and then rightist counterriot it could happen, but I think that's more likely to simply make that particular city devolve into anarchy for a while since there won't be any organization or central command for most of the people on either side. IMO those groups like atomwaffen or whatever that go out to shoot targets in the woods or hang flags on buildings with groups of 20 people stand a better chance of forming an actual faction.

>>2504988
It would be a chaotic free-for-all more akin to gang warfare, like bloods vs crips but political. No "new order" and low possibility of spreading to the rest of the country

>>2504108
>The right is not trying to kill the left either BTW. Trump doesn't need to wipe out the left because he's in power already
You do not understand right wing psychology. They absolutely are a sadistic evil creatures who do want to rape, torture and kill.

>>2505020
the desire to do something is very separate from the ability or will to carry it out, they might desire all of the above, but do they actually want to? could they even do so?

>>2505033
They are already doing it to plenty people. No, the demented 70 year old suburbanites are not going to fight on front lines, but they sure wish to live up their sadistic fantasies vicariously through others doing them on their behalf.

>>2505033
fuck it, im writing a zine and starting a workers council

>>2503961
IMO the movie is novel in that the images we see are things the media shows e.g. bodies hanging from bridges but in an American context, something which is chilling if you believe "it couldn't happen here"

>>2504845
A common theory is that a civil war 2 in the us would be more low level, like the troubles. If you believe this to make sense, then you could argue we're already in it to some extent.

>>2503856
0%
cibl w0r is just isekai for right wing americans were they imagine how they will reinvent themselves and society in a different world.

>>2510088
Cue to the monologue of General Bethlehem in The Postman, where he talks about being a nobody suit before the apocalypse.

>>2510088
not just right-wing. it is the political version of the zombie apocalypse fantasy where your bullshit job doesn't exist anymore and instead they have to survive using their agency and subjectivity, something that they can't really do in real life. modern production is too streamlined to allow for individual expression

>>2511334
You are right, as less stable countries where political violence is even more common (for example the Philippines has multiple semi-active insurgencies and similarly charged rhetoric from politicians that result in targeted attacks but still is stable enough to see a decent bit of tourism of both the normal and sexual varieties) have not descended into the open brutal warfare that people fantasize abt but regarding rw fantasies specifically it's especially dumb because nearly all fascist 'revolutions' have come from within the political system. Even in Spain it started as a failed coup.

>>2503856
It 1000% entirely hinges on whether or not people are starving, homeless and without entertainment. If people have these things, they will tolerate Larry Fink raping their mothers in front of them.

Even in the extreme case it moved past the larp stage I would imagine the military has multiple contingency plans to nip anything in the early stages.

>>2504108
>Trump’s ex wife said he had mein kampf on his nightstand and Trump’s father was arrested at a kkk rally. Trump’s seething that Obama was president and had mocked him is part of the reason of the Empire’s rapid decline into madness
I think Trump really wishes he was Hitler.

>>2504108
>wants to be fujimori
Trump is a giga retard. I doubt even Stephen Miller wants to be like a Peruvian dictator if he even knows about it. It’s Prussia larping all the way down by the trashiest people in existence.

>>2511334
>your bullshit job doesn't exist anymore and instead they have to survive using their agency and subjectivity, something that they can't really do in real life.

What's funny is they don't need to wait around for society collapse to do that. They could quit their shitty jobs right now and become homeless vagrants and live the exact same kind of life they would be living if society collapsed, with the added perk of dumpsters to eat out of.

>>2516411
Then they would be part of the enemy that needs to be contained. Trump hates homeless people.

MAGA 100% believed that the election was rigged and the vaccines are a forced sterilization plot and they still didn't do anything. They're going to suddenly go up to bat now because of what? People talking about Epstein too much?

>>2516415
I don’t think Trump or his cult was going to go quietly into the night if he lost again. He’d probably flee to Florida first before demanding Biden and Kamala be overthrown.

>>2504975
Just be because community is currently non-existent doesn’t mean it can’t come back. If electricity and food become unreliable most people aren’t going to sit in their dark houses and starve. Also community in America isn’t completely nonexistent anyways, more like severely atrophied.

oliver stone had a pretty good idea what it would look like

The left would not be part of the war

I believe that a civil war is possible only if significant numbers of regions (note that I didn't say cities) rise up against the feds. There are a number of ways that could happen, but I think one of the most likely vectors is if people in one area succeed in storming an ICE detention center and breaking people out. During the earlier part of the year when people were protesting in Los Angeles, I saw video of people surging towards the detention center, only to be stopped by some Instagram social justice influencer – the usual type of college educated, ethnic, pretty, well spoken person who works at an NGO. I think that in Austin a few months back people also tried to get into the ICE detention center but some organizers in the crowd convinced people to turn around.

I think that people are considerably more willing to clash with security forces now, and we're seeing it. I also note that some of the hardest hit communities have been agricultural workers in the California, and that the only known instance of someone at a protest shooting at ICE was during one of their raids at a farm, and as far as I can tell no one turned him in and the guy is still out there.

If people actually did storm a detention center, even if they didn't succeed, I wouldn't be surprised if onsite security forces shot into the crowd. Successful or not, I don't think that Trump and his sycophants could emotionally accept such an outcome and would invariably overreact with the dumbest most brutal measures they could think of.

The problem for them is that the United States is awash with guns, and the fascists in DC think that the average person opposed to them is as much of a fucking feckless simpering coward as the median Congressional Dem staffer who has made it through the counterinsurgency selection process by being really good at punching left.

Actually many ordinary people in the United States look at what's happening as a fucking outrage against human decency, and with every passing day that more horrifying footage comes out of a woman screaming while being torn away from her children by some out-of-shape human potato who can't even wear his fucking plate carrier correctly (just under the jugular notch) more and more decent people turn against the regime.Without legions of NGO counterinsurgents talking them in circles, I think we could see much fiercer resistance.

The other thing that the fascists are counting on is their belief that "only the cities oppose us." Because they are blinded by the false consciousness of white supremacy they don't even see who is doing the work in agricultural areas. It sure isn't the white guys in the Raptor pickups carrying their $5,000 2011 condition 1 in an appendix holster. Those might be the managers or the owners of the farm but the people doing the work are overwhelmingly from the Global South and of that, overwhelming from Mexico. And while some of those folks may have supported Trump for reasons, that's deteriorating. Before TikTok had to cut a deal with Trump I watched a ton of livestreams from the immigration protests in rural California and it was overwhelmingly either Latinas whose previous topics were hair/beauty/fashion or Latinos who were into sports or cars/trucks/motorcycles. When ICE was getting run out of motels all over the Central Valley and getting their tires slashed, it was almost certainly b/c someone who worked at the motel snitched them out to someone. Because who works cleaning those motels, on average? It would get very difficult for the rest of the nation of the farmworkers and people in the central valley of California rose up because that's where most of the fruits and vegetables consumed in the US come from. A lot of staple prepared foods needs those fruits and vegetables as inputs.

A situation where a mass of demonstrators breaks into an ICE detention center, triggering a massive overreaction by Trump is the kind of thing that could explode across the United States. It's hard to tell where it all sorts out after that. Democratic governors like Newsom and Pritzker will try to tell people to obey the rules and blah blah blah try to send out their city cops and state police to shut everything down, while Trump tries to surge NG units and likely active duty military into the hot spots. Total chaos.

I expect that the various fascist vigilante groups will try to take action, and wouldn't be surprised if the Trump regime handed out Deputy US Marshall status to a bunch of them, and tried to do some Radio Rwanda type shit enabled by social media to hit whoever they possibly could that they view as responsible for the uprising. If the uprising is big enough, and some (but not all) regional security forces break with the regime, then some regions will have de facto autonomy, and there you have it, civil war.

A civil war needs two sides to fight it at least and the fact is that The Left doesn’t have a mass base. So the only two outcomes that could lead to civil war would be a coup attempt by the military that Trump escapes, or him being retarded enough to start rounding up Democratic politicians extralegally because he genuinely sees himself as being in a war with them rather than Kabuki theater. So while it’s possible, I don’t think it’s all that likely right now.

Assuming neither of those two things happen, then you could maybe see a breakdown of federal power and different militias all duking it out, a lot more gang activity. Maybe something like the cartel wars in Mexico rather than an actual ideological conflict.

>>2503856
read all about it

>>2503897
>Most of the population views civil war like it's a sports event
"I don't follow Peter Thiel, the neofeudal lord whose platform I am a camp follower for is Elon Musk" oh ok haha
>most normies wouldn't even truly care until after the US agreed to balkanize.
Michigan guys vs Illinois guys…whoever wins, we lose

>>2503917
Just because people are disconnected that doesn't mean collapse won't happen, infact thats a pretty good sign of social collapse.
There are a decent number of millitias in the US too on both sides of politics, its just most arent as high as they could be. But if trump keeps raping the US even more then it has people are gonna be forced into mutual aid instead of exploiting eacho other, and seeing all the political shootings against the rich they won't be safe easier.

The US is in a class war, not like states or communities fighting eachother, its small groups and people attacking the state whether its ICE or the rich.

>>2503913
Disagree, the idea that a younger population causes civil wars is a misleading oversimplification. civil wars are driven by deeper factors like ethnic or religious divisions and economic instability.
Tunisia and MENA had a young population (at the time) but remained relatively stable since the Arab Spring, On the other hand, Yugoslavia broke into brutal civil wars in the despite having an older population at the time, besides now every region in the world has a declining birth-rate and is steadily approaching below replacement

>>2518953
interesting but do you have this as a PDF instead of a big ass image

It is absolutely burger larp, only the most imbecilic around you want it
>be me
>retarded pedocon
>paint myself as the victim while inciting for civil war because le trans

>>2518953
This specific American brain pattern needs to be studied, because while the author of this text is a right-wing Vietnam veteran, his view on militias defeating 'bloated Armies' is exactly the same as the perspective you'd hear from a leftist college student who has never even made a fist in his life. Both views reflect a similar pattern of overestimating militias and insurgencies and scoffing at formal organised military systems

>>2520796
This isn't a niche opinion; it goes to the heart of American cinema. The militia/insurgent is so deeply fetishized in the American psyche that only a small group of Military officers seem to truly understand how warfare works and yet they're often undermined by junior NCO's and political superiors whose minds are still stuck in that Zeitgeist.

>>2518953
Chud as hell

>>2520780
yes just internet search for the title

>>2520796

Didn't Castro abandon the revolution to become a dictator

>>2503856
The USA's dissolution might end up being similar to the fall of Spanish america where a war cuts off the head (Napoleon in Spain's case, nukes in America's case) and as a result since the structure has no real foundations below it like China it'll fall to pieces.

>>2521325
Unlike* China

>>2521321
Irrelevant to the conservation, whether ​​Castro's betrayed the Ideal of the revolution has no baring on the fact that Batista's Cuba was a deeply corrupt and divided country, where large parts of the capital were run by literal mafia members, others by American companies, while Batista purged Army officers he believed were undermining him. Had Batista been in any way competent, the revolution would have failed.