/leftypol_archive/ - leftypol archive

>>574155
No, I'm pretty sure you haven't

>>574150
Dengoids ARE anti-communists. All you can do is cope and deflect.

>>574157
You are not special
You will not save the world, hell you won't even save the girl

>>574158
What a projection.

>>574156
I have, this is directly from hegel
> The ultimate aim and business of philosophy is to reconcile thought or the Notion with reality
https://www.marxists.org/reference/archive/hegel/works/hp/hpfinal.htm

>>574159
haha

>>574157
this thread literally broke this autistic dengoid

>>574160
What do you think that means?

>>574056
To recap:
The ultras never understand this most simple logic (I don't believe in dengists existing, they are very obviously a chimera).
There isn't anything wrong with saying socialism doesn't exist in the real world. This is going all the way on the idealism and has internal consistency. Anything less than that is pathetic.

>>574094
If china was socialist enough then maybe us Western leftists would stop complaining about it.

>>574122
Didn't talk about the NSDAP but the SPD, which ruled during the Weimar Republic era.

>>574166
Oh you're upset. Like all the other little chauvinists.

>>574030
retarded infracel

>>574168
It's hard not to be a chauvinist when the "commumist" countries are tankie regimes.

>>574166
If revolution is so easy why don't you just do it?

>>574170
Dengoids are so desperate to find some "ultras" that they pose as one themselves.

>>574166
>Western leftists
oxymoron

>>574170
tag yourself

>>574173
western leftist: progressive-minded people suffering from main character syndrome, too well-off to be of any use to anyone in the main

>>574176
>iPhone making slaves
You mean workers of China that are cruelly exploited by their capitalist system?

>>574177
The world is a cruel place
Wise words from the prototypical liberal over here

>>574178
>fuck chinese workers
Gotcha

>>574179
What do you know about workers or work? Nothing

>>574180
t suburbanite burger projecting

>>574181
Keep believing that you infant. Remember what I said about not understanding anything outside of yourself. Maybe someday you will or maybe not.

>>574182
You have been beaten in argument by most of the anons here and the only way to copeis to pull jimmy noticer - stop reading and respond with some asinine crap. You are literally no different than mentally ill fuckers from /pol/

>>574183
Sure whatever that means, what a shame reality doesn't care about your hysterical argumentation

wait a second so op was making a stealth dengist thread? Lmaooooooo

>>574185
You know what the first sign of madness is? Paranoia

>>574030
>If private property, money, abstract value production, class society, and the state, are abolished prematurely, when the oppressive logic and power of capital still controls the entire world, China would become vulnerable to both external imperialist violence and internal reactionary sabotage (no doubt under the banner of “democracy”). The Communist Party would be immediately compromised by foreign backed elements; the country might be torn apart once again by civil war, and once again subjected to imperialist domination. The Chinese revolution, what so many millions fought, worked tirelessly, and sacrificed their lives for, will have been for nothing.
How does this explain the alliance between the US and China as well as Deng coming to power prior to the fall of the USSR? China itself has invited in or even cultivated these "internal reactionary" elements by its capitulation to capitalism. It doesn't even explain policy choices. Why, for example, did China allow for businesses within China (not simply multinationals or Western-created businesses) to be structured as traditional Western corporations rather than solely as worker-owned cooperatives? Why did China decide to save the US during the subprime mortgage crisis if the two are so opposed?

If the idea is that socialism is impossible so long as significant capitalist powers exist elsewhere, then socialism in China will for the foreseeable future be waiting for a socialist revolution in the West beforehand, but it's exactly contrary to what I'm told by Dengists. Instead, they hedge on constructs like "multipolarity" when this is actually wholly irrelevant to whether they continue to justify anything China does as "building socialism." If anything, the world is already multipolar, and it's been so for at least a decade if not longer.

I don't believe the catastrophism Dengists engage in during every single one of these conversations either. "Things could go wrong," but I'm not sure why this "things could go wrong" scenario is always treated as the more likely option when it's just as theoretical as the success scenario (this is equally true of the "success" scenario for Dengists: has communism ever been realized this way? obviously not, yet we're supposed to believe it to be more credible than any alternatives). And one can always predict "things going wrong" in some way and not act, then justify oneself on the basis of projected futility and catastrophe.

The opposition between the possibilities of success and failure won't be resolved through argument anyway, because one can always add more speculations as to what might or might not happen. It's more important to look at this catatrophism's practical function for Dengists: a psychological crutch for a belief system, used to justify the distance between the radical professions of faith and the existing state of things, much like the related "historical necessity." In this sense, they're no different from the "left communists" they hate, just less self-aware.

>>574186
A paranoiac is someone with all the facts

>>574187
>I don't believe the catastrophism Dengists engage in during every single one of these conversations either. "Things could go wrong," but I'm not sure why this "things could go wrong" scenario is always treated as the more likely option when it's just as theoretical as the success scenario (this is equally true of the "success" scenario for Dengists: has communism ever been realized this way? obviously not, yet we're supposed to believe it to be more credible than any alternatives). And one can always predict "things going wrong" in some way and not act, then justify oneself on the basis of projected futility and catastrophe.

China is at the same avoiding confrontation by not implementing a single socialist policy internally and fighting US/NATO/whatever domination by creating a multipolar world. If you are not achizo enough to accept it, you are just an ultra westoid nafo.

>>574187
>hey're no different from the "left communists" they hate, just less self-aware.
oof

>>574189
That's right
but remember to have fun or it's pointless

>>574191
Self-awareness is a funny thing
I think it can be forced into people. I will run an experiment with all the (messianic) cultists here

>>574130
>specifically when it abided by the comintern policy of the popular front which saw it abandon the american labour movement in favour of working in bourgeois electoralism
why was the american labour movement obligated to listen to the comintern? why didn't they analyze their material conditions themselves and come up with policy tuned to their own situation? was the comintern going to come to america and purge them?

>>574142
>privatization is rampant
in heavy industry or light commodities? these are different and capitalism still exist in underdeveloped socialist nations.

>>574187
>If the idea is that socialism is impossible so long as significant capitalist powers exist elsewhere

thats not the idea, its a relative comparison. socialism is impossible while capitalist powers are stronger than socialist ones and china is still underdeveloped given its population size. once chinas GDP is overwhelmingly higher than the usa in one or two decades the construction projects and media that they are currently working on will serve as global propaganda for people to adopt their development method as they transition to a more socialist society people will see their success and start nationalizing key industries to follow their example.

they have to wait until they have the industrial equivalent of the top ten navies or whatever britian and the us did before so that their rise is unopposed and they don't risk a nuclear tantrum from the imperialists


>>574082
> the incontestable truth that US empire is the single true global hegemon
it really is the great satan. its significantly WORSE than people here go on about. the US is the fourth riech.

>>574170
False flag, all the anarchist posters on here touch too much grass to talk like this.

>>574112
Because of the pernicious effect ultra narratives have on the left, and on our collective ability to organise

>>574200
The narratives are repulsive anyway. I don't think anyone is going to fall for "socialism has never been tried".

>>574200
The "ultras" are powerful enough to dictate the direction of the left now?


>>574201
Do you really think most people wouldn't find Marxism-Leninism "repulsive" if it weren't for so-called ultras? It's ridiculous how you blame everyone else for the manifest mistakes and failures of your own tendency, then cry about how others are too sectarian and "ultra" to accept "actually existing socialism," but it's par for the course here.

>>574200
you speak like a fucking liberal blaming ultras for everything while at the same time acting like theyre irrelevant, so which is it?

>>574202
>Do you really think most people wouldn't find Marxism-Leninism "repulsive" if it weren't for [propaganda]
Oh absolutely. But the point is saying "socialism has never been tried" makes you a lying liar.
>blame
Everyone that has ever done anything has made mistakes. This is boring beyond what is tolerable.
The way you misunderstand so hard the causality makes it clear you are an unreflected ultra. It's not that ultras have any power or are responsible for anything. That is exactly the point. They are easily cowed into nothingness and doing nothing. This is their character fundamentally.
It's not that I blame them for anything but that they are of no use to anyone. That's just a simple fact. Blame doesn't factor into it.
Evil is a word used by the weak and cowardly.

I don't see how it's all the 'ultras' fault that Marxism-Leninism fucking failed

>>574205
If you are hungry, eat.
If are unable to see, open your third eye.