Porn is extremely addictive. The dopamine rush a man gets from porn and the cravings for it are similar to other life-damaging addictions. Porn destroys natural healthy relations between men and women, increases misogyny in men, and makes it impossible for men to have true solidarity with women. Every time I look at it (and I've never even intentionally looked at hardcore porn, so this is just nudes) I feel like I'm in a retarded brain fog after. And I feel guilty because I know I've let down the women in my life I've cared about. Every actually existing socialist state has banned pornography, so why are leftists so quick to defend it and flip out about PornHub bans?
>>665804Honestly why would anyone want a wife if you can't even watch porn with her, like the fucking prude in
>>665788 is just terrible, who would willingly get married to someone like that?
Another thread where OP gets bludgeoned for being uncomfortably right—the same way that weed smokers seethe whenever you tell them they're addicted. I can't believe that threads like these even have to be made; its basic fucking intuition that every leftist should have.
>>666067"Moderation" in this context is so inconceivably arbitrary that I don't even know where to start. Some think that once every day is in moderation, once every two days, a week, a month, or 'whenever you really really feel like gooning'. People believe that they moderate the intervals in which they consume porn because they just "feel" like it, entirely oblivious to the underlying deficits at play. The reality is that the majority of porn users are addicts, that's literally it. You can't enforce some arbitrary time on whether or not porn is moderated as it's highly addictive & corrosive to the mind and the better would just to outlaw it, like most AESG do. It's absolutely unrealistic to judge it on the small handful of people actually capable of treating it like an avoidable passtime like eating shrimp
>>665769Porn is a product and tool of capitalist alienation.
>why are leftists so quick to defend it and flip out about PornHub bans?Because they defend freedom within capitalism, not freedom from capitalism. Their framework is petty-bourgeois, not proletarian.
Porn itself is indefensible if you're a communist, but bans and censorship do nothing to address the issue. Censorships and bans can be used as suppression against the working class.
>>666173I should've specified.
Cave paintings aren’t comparable to modern porn at all.They existed in entirely different social and material contexts, with very different purposes and meanings.
The fact that something “existed before capitalism” doesn’t erase how its modern form is shaped by capitalist dynamics.
>>666175(me)
Early human societies were largely based on matriarchal or matrilineal clan property relations as the social base, not the patriarchal family property relations that later emerged with class society.
>>666175>>666178so we have moved the goalpost from
>Porn is a product and tool of capitalist alienation.to
>actually porn has always existed but it's fine when prehistorical and matriarchalthat's a significant retreat from your original position
>>666224the human trafficking element is indigenous to capitalism though
forcing war refugees (like ukrainians for ex example) into prostitution when they could be doing any other number of less degrading jobs if society gave half a shit is unique to capitalism
>>666259this is cope. if you don't consume porn you won't be interested in a gf to begin with, you are socialized into being horny, it isn't innate. all the guys I know that can't stand being single also love porn and masturbate multiple times per day. I have practically no libido and haven't masturbated or had sex in months - these two things go together
imageboard users like to imagine that there is a difference and so if they make an effort and not masturbate they will become more successful in general. it is a fantasy and peasant brain: something is hard, therefore it must carry a big reward. and the protestant mentality: something feels good, so it must be bad
>>666224There's no goalpost shift, only historical development. Saying porn is a product and tool of capitalist alienation isn’t negated by the existence of sexual imagery in communal, pre-class societies. That’s like saying modern war is the same as tribal conflict. The form, function, and social relations are different.
You’re collapsing all representations of sex across thousands of years and different modes of production as if they have the same content and social meaning. My point stands: modern pornography as commodified, alienated, mass-distributed content is specific to capitalism and tied to patriarchal family property relations, not clan-based communal life. You’re the one dodging historical context.
Catharine MacKinnon on the relationship between porn and sexual crimes against humanity in wartime:
https://www.femrevolt.com/tekstovi/turning-rape-into-pornography-postmodern-genocide.html
>inb4 muh Serbs did nothing wrongIsrael also uses porn has a form of psych warfare against Palestinians
>>665769I want the anti-porn people to defend this by saying pork =/= erotica
(Even though here it would be treated the same)
>>666343Because the only way you've ever gotten off was using porn, and you've made a rule of following every sexual urge you have.
Without porn you would be a rapist.
>>666391you are really being crazy here.
define "porn"
>>666178There is no evidence patriarchy and matriarchy are even an actual thing beyond assumptions of who is at the top of a gender hierarchy if there even is one. Often it is different roles and especially true today we do not live in some patriarchy where men are top of everything, rather it is a case both sexes have benefits to the roles and it takes cultural shifts for them to be willing to give up their special privileges so they can get rid of the down sides they face. There also are matrilineal societies that are clearly unequal.
https://www.dw.com/en/india-khasi-men-rights/a-55704605We live in a society and indirectly name dropping patriarchy is not a real argument here. Different individuals still have their own goals and motivations and there is pros and cons for everyone in terms of gender norms.
i just want to ask if there's any outright benefits to porn versus just having sex, in optimal conditions. And I'm not talking about prostitution - theoretically in a perfect world, it'd be basically applied a la the Dutch, wherein women are just given extra nice shit to have in exchange for [obv. within consent] sexually pleasing the otherwise physically unattractive. Morally, I think that's a fair exchange. There's people out there that not only would outright enjoy that, but let alone feel comfortable doing that as "their thing" in an optimal currently-theoretical communist society. But… like… what's the point of porn? For real, what's the point? What does it specifically *do*?What does it offer over outright legal prostitution? Because like, at the end of the day, the fucking is still happening, right? But, in one, it's permanently recorded and given the ability to be spread. So the fucking carries on, with relatively zero of the pleasure thinly spread. like can someone explain
>>666491>There is no evidence patriarchy and matriarchy are even an actual thing beyond assumptions of who is at the top of a gender hierarchyThis is factually wrong from a historical materialist standpoint. The claim assumes that patriarchy and matriarchy are simply ideological or symbolic hierarchies, when in fact they describe concrete social relations of property, kinship, and class rule that develop historically through material changes in production.
Frederick Engels, in The Origin of the Family, Private Property and the State, outlines the transition from matrilineal/clan-based societies to patriarchal, class-divided ones:
> “The overthrow of mother right was the world-historic defeat of the female sex. The man seized the reins in the house; the woman was degraded and reduced to servitude.”(Origin of the Family, Ch. II)
>different individuals have their own goals and motivations… there are pros and cons for everyone.This is liberal individualism, the belief that social structure is just a sum of individual choices.Class society isn't built on "choices." It’s built on material relations: on who owns, who produces, and who rules.
>Some matrilineal societies are still unequalCorrect but not relevant to my point. The Khasi may preserve matrilineal customs, but their society is fully subordinated to capitalist relations: private property, money economy, wage labor, state rule, etc. These determine the material basis of social relations including gender roles, not their residual practices.
>>666885this
porn is bad but it isnt a psyop, there just happens to be a lot of low 1q males who jerk off all day and capitalism did what it does best by capitalizing on it
>>666762What's the point of relationships then? It's thinly veiled prostitution. All the talk about "needing someone" isn't profound. It's just hormonal satisfaction.
And irony is, people get ruined more from relationships than from porn.
>>665773Porn is made by adults for adults tho
>>665779He's probably on the more "respectable" vices.
>>666913 >>667005Truke.
>>666913Gooning is the high autism score move. That's why only high autism score animals do it. Highest-tier is using tools to make pocket pussies.
>>665769Women hate porn because they know that without gooning or prostitution, a man will do damn near anything, and put up with whatever bullshit and pretend whatever annoying inanities they have to say are interesting just to get a glimpse of pussy.
>>667011>You forget also that there's men who exist as porn objects for female gaze?dude where is it i can't fucking find it
do you have any idea how hard it is to find a video of a woman genuinely enjoying herself
>>667101Take 3.
>>667101>blaming shoots.*bdsm shoots
>>667112I think that under communism until it becomes possible to produce humans in labs, we should make it illegal to have straight
sex, all reproduction should be done by surrogates via artificial insemination, and children should be raised collectively by the state. this would fix all the problems being described here.
>>667125>This is your brain on porn>You guys think porn addictiin isn't realIf you're gonna waste all this time on people jerking it to erotic pictures, why not focus that moral energy on real affects like gambling?
>>667111>>667112Wrong. Men are motivated by idealism. Men may have stronger sex drive than women. But, even without sexual function, men would still be men.
>>667109Wrong. Morality isn't the problem.
Idealism is.
Most morals are motivated by idealism.
Hence why we have obnoxious neopuritans trying to shut down sexuality.
>>667204Big dick doesn't mean better sex.
>>667159>They definitely have that flirty meanness to them, but I like it.😔
Are you only able to appreciate female companionship when they start being low-key flirty with you?
>>667129>Men are way nicer and interesting in general. In terms of topical diversity yes. But anyway the rest of your post is hot garbage.
>>667142Actually, coomer addiction is less giving attention to women unless you mean only Fans.
Women would do without coomers
But they cannot do without white knights.
(Although white knighting and coming sometimes go hand-in-hand)
>>667224>all this timetakes 5 seconds to post an image someone else made
>why not focus that moral energy on real affects like gamblingpoint me to the threads on leftpol dot org where people try to justify gambling addictions and I shall
>>665804These are more butthurt neo-boomers here.
>>667246You must have missed the past three months. There was a gambling general thread on here.
Random posts/threads about how to strike it big in casinos.
>>667239Men are like that too. It's just that society wanna "overprotect" women. Listen. The only way to appreciate
people is to look at them beyond their biological gender.
Stop constantly viewing people from the lens of potential mates, especially when viewing their flaws.
Just view them as complete individuals.
>>668396>It's amazing how you managed to take what I said in the most cynical bad faith way possibleBecause I'm tired of the simping. I get that we as men are horndogs but that doesn't mean we have to philosophise the persons of our sexual desires in patronising ways.
>Yes I like hanging out with my friends even if we aren't flirting.I dont doubt that but still.
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