Words cannot express how much i do not give a shit about laika, why tf do libs/yanks think it’s such a tragedy that she was sent to space as a test subject and that the ussr is sooooo evil for committing such an atrocity? She’s a fucking dog! Would you rather they used humans? At least she advanced our scientific understanding of space
>>700633Humans >>>>>> animals
Sorry but its true, even mentally disabled people have more value than animals and we have to conduct experiments on living things at some point else we won’t know how they affect us. Might as well use one of millions of stray animals lying around
>>700624>the ussr is sooooo evil forGet off twitter or wherever you're hearing a moral angle on this.
>She’s a fucking dog! Would you rather they used humans?Yes and yes.
>At least she advanced our scientific understanding of spaceWhich is why it's celebrated, such as in that screenshot.
Once more, get off twitter so you stop hallucinating moral outrage because you yourself are morally outraged. You are not profound for going through the basic internal dialouge people would have on hearing the story of Laika + some weird impulse to defend the USSR against a non-present moral criticism.
Its because a statue was dedicated to the dog and so the americKKKan dog cultists are like "It's not enough!!!!". Like wtf do they want more than a statue.
>>700633But a dog isn't a human! That just goes to show how low you think of people with mental disabilities. If we didn't sacrifice Laika then Yuri Gagarin or someone else would have died instead, and like its one dog. Eating meat is 10000% worse because it is not necessary and in fact is not the optimal way of making food, whilst at the same time producing maximum suffering. However animal testing should be increased by many times so that science is developed faster and we can reach a point where we can save animals from nature. There needs to be sacrifices to abolish cruelty completely.
>>700652>intrinsic greater value1. Spooky + moralism
2. I have yet to see a dog destroy the very eco-system we live in, ensuring our own extinction.
3. Many humans fail to meet the arbitrary standards you've created, such as the elderly with dementia, toddlers, the mentally disabled and so forth;
4. There are plenty of examples of animals that create structures, which according to your own logic would put them above millions of humans;
5. i'm responding to a retarded baiter, which also makes me retarded
>>700656S anon you need to read this
>>700659 completely reasonable answer that BTFO'd edgy stalinist who only flock to this position to stick it up to bourgeois moralism
>>700659>>7006601. Uhh well we're all kind of doing moralism here, moralism isn't something you can really avoid.
2. I don't care about the ecosystem because I hate nature and think humans can build something better for all living things. And we won't go extinct, idk how humans unless the whole planet exploded.
3. But those humans are much more intelligent than animals. The only humans who aren't are like 1 day old babies who aren't sapient yet.
4. I love the crab and it is cute and yes you have owned that poster but I don't really agree, for me it is nothing to do with building structures. It is sapience. I think everything that can communicate to me is worth more.
5. I don't think they are baiting tbh. But their argument is kind of 'humanity first' stupidity which doesn't think about other conscious things.
6. Many humans and animals will die and this is necessary for historical progress or at least inevitable. Very few of them accept death but they are killed anyway. Random humans will be killed in war during the revolution. We just have to accept that bad things will happen in order to get to a good thing. So it probably doesn't make sense to care so much about a single dog (which whilst I do understand is conscious, is not conscious to the same level as humans), had to die in order for scientific progress to happen, which can preserve lives in the future.
>>700652how many houses have you built, anon?
also, bees build hives - does that make them more valuable than 90% of mammals?
>>700677people are allowed to have their own set of morals as long as they dont pretend theyre objective
theres worlds of difference between using an animal to test some new technology and killing an animal for fun lmao
>>700671>Which species created our material conditions?Every species, every atom and every phenomena created our current material conditions. Humans are not a magical imposition on a motionless world, but a product of a motionful one.
>Which species is the proletariat a part of?Every species where a member has to exchange their labor for basic necessities / allowance to live. I assume you're not too sheltered to know non-human examples of this. In fact human proles barely count depending how strictly seriously you take the term "propertyless."
>>700679>applying human terminology to shit found in natureshut the fuck up moron
just the other day i had a retard trying to argue with me that "you could find capitalism in nature"
>>700680my personal tendencies are irrelevant to critical reasoning lol
>>700754>pseudo-marxist jargonsorry youre retarded
only a proper citizen of bourgeois society would uncritically call for the torture of prisoners, and in the name of animal "rights" too LOL
>>700787Dying from hunger or from an infection: Whatever
Dying from overheating:
NOOOOOO NO WAY IT SHOULD HAVE NEVER HAPPENED SHE SHOULD'VE DIED FROM RABIES INSTEAD!!!
>>700634>>700666>2. I don't care about the ecosystem because I hate nature and think humans can build something better for all living things. And we won't go extinct, idk how humans unless the whole planet explodedAre you serious
>3. But those humans are much more intelligent than animals. The only humans who aren't are like 1 day old babies who aren't sapient yet.
You are forgetting about elderly and mentally disabled.
>>700787>>700624>>700652>>700656You people then complain about right wingers using "human nature" as an argument to justify racism and sexism
>>700862Human nature is dependent on nature.
Also, by your argument, newborn babies have some degree of sapience that's blocked due to factors.
The vast majority of human behaviors are motivated by biological drives: the need for food, water, shelter, and mates.
Especially on this board which whines about being lonely and wants to set the world on fire for being sexless.
But ok, by your logic, racism and sexism are based on human abilities therefore are not entirely wrong
There are species of animals that do math, they can navigate thousands of miles across the globe, and they tend to their young and sick, and elderly.
They even adopt other animal of different species.
>>700871"Animal" is a cellular description. See
>>700646Opposable thumbs are the result of material conditions
>>700921Wasn't everyone in the space race at the time using dogs and such?
Also stop using reddit.
I feel like you're making this about communism when it's not. She's just a good girl who had a sad thing happen to her, obviously that's going to elicit emotions. I've literally never seen anyone connect her to the morals of the USSR, they treat her as a generic space dog who could have been from anywhere.
Now, that's not to say that there aren't certainly a lot of other political angles to it. There are, especially in the realm of animal rights, since arguably it was cruel and unjustified to experiment on her in this way. None of us are free until all of us are free and that includes animals, there's really no way to argue against that other than from a meritocratic angle (we're better than animals so we're worth more!) or a tradition/genetics angle (we are supposed to subdue and consume other species, our ancestors did it!) and both of those angles are pure fascism.
But let's be real, the reason she's so popular isn't any of this - it's that she's specifically a dog and dogs are cute. If she had been a chimp or a rat or a chicken, nobody would care. Which says a lot of negative things about people, since you're supposed to help your fellow creature even when they're ugly, cuteness really shouldn't come into it, but it totally did, here.
>>700926>The Soviet /Russian space program used only rhesus macaques in its Bion satellite program in 1980s and 1990s.[14] The names of the monkeys began with sequential letters of the Russian alphabet (А, Б, В, Г, Д, Е, Ё, Ж, З…). The animals all survived their missions but for a single fatality in post-flight surgery, after which the program was canceled.>The PRC spacecraft Shenzhou 2 launched on January 9, 2001. It is rumored that inside the reentry module (precise information is lacking due to the secrecy surrounding China's space program) a monkey, dog, and rabbit rode aloft in a test of the spacecraft's life support systems. The SZ2 reentry module landed in Inner Mongolia on January 16. No images of the recovered capsule appeared in the press, leading to the widespread inference that the flight ended in failure. According to press reports citing an unnamed source, a parachute connection malfunction caused a hard landing.[26]lol
>>700955Theres nothing fascistic about using animals for experiments; as we know, fascists are perfectly ok using humans for experimentation
Saying “nooo we can’t experiment on le heckin cute animals, it’s cruel” is an act of brainless moralism - sometimes we need to do experiments on live subjects to make sure things are safe for us humans, because as thinking, rational beings we DO come first
>>700955>connect her to the morals of the USSR, they treat her as a generic space dogread/watch Solaris, radlib
<Russian cosmism or simply cosmism, is a philosophical and cultural movement that emerged in late 19th- and early 20th-century Russia, integrating science, religion, and metaphysics into a unified worldview. It is characterized by the belief in humanity’s cosmic destiny, the potential for immortality, and the use of scientific and technological advancements to achieve control over nature and explore space.https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Russian_cosmism>>700673"Humans are superior to animals because we can goon and circlejerk to the idea of our Minecraft homes somehow existing outside of Minecraftworld. Soy PMC Hegelian idealism of human will is important to me, not the historical materialism of value being created through proletarian class consciousness that has grown over millennial" - Karl Marx
>>700978Plus we have no way of knowing that spiders and bees don't have some idea of what they're making before they do it. Even jellyfish were recently found capable of spatial awareness and some amount of learning to help them navigate.
https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/37741280/For all we know spiders pick a good spot to place a triangle first.
>>700981(1) is it more ethical to kill an insect over a human?
(2) is it more ethical to kill a plant over a human?
(3) is it more ethical to kill an animal over a human?
(4) is it more ethical to kill a stranger over family?
>>7009911 yes
2 yes
3 yes
4 no unless the stranger is a class enemy, and if your family member is a class enemy then also no
>>700993right, so life is unequally valuable. killing billions of germs doesnt compare to killing billions of people. this isnt fascist, this is just how things are - and on the nazis, it was them who preferred trees and animals over humans, which shows where this can end.
>>701020is it worse to kill a dog or a human fetus?
>>701051>is it worse to kill a dog or a human fetus?Context dependant; killing a dog for no reason is wrong
And as for an abortion, it depends how long the woman has been pregnant
False equivalency though, as i said its context dependant
>>700787The 1st and 2nd pics are so corny lol.
It's not because it's about a dog btw. Even if someone wrote that about a human who was used for doomed experimentation it'd still be weird. Dogfags need to get a grip.
>>701069>its potentiala fetus has potential; is it wrong to kill them?
>>701072so its the purpose of the act which justifies it?
>>700855>>700800You are slaves to nature, doomed to continue the cruel cycle of murder and rape that is the natural world. In nature everything has its place, the prey dies, the predator engorges itself, it is zero sum, not everything can survive. Exploitation is a fact of life. You cannot fathom a world outside this, you are stuck within the destiny of eternal torture. In nature, there is nothing outside of this, reality is hell, where we must murder to survive. I pity you, but you must be wiped out in order to shatter this destiny, take matters into our own hands, kill nature, destroy the order and bring it all crashing down.
Is nature beautiful? Maybe. But then so is a rotting corpse. They are the same thing. Loving individuals is one thing, but if you really value all life, there is no option but to stop this incestual rape pit and free everything from the chains of 'how it should be'. Destroy god.
>>701157So why is sexlessness treated as a moral issue?
Why is loli and AI treated as degenerate?
>Is nature beautiful? Maybe. But then so is a rotting corpse. They are the same thing. Loving individuals is one thing, but if you really value all life, there is no option but to stop this incestual rape pit and free everything from the chains of 'how it should be'. Destroy god.Funny thing is, Christianity kinda preaches about that but also juxtaposes sycophantic "God created everything therefore everything is beautiful".
>>701061>>701072If fetuses are not sapient, then neither are senile and disabled folk.
And if abortion isn't wrong, then why is refusal to procreate with certain people based on physiognomy, ability, or creed considered genocide?
>>701074>>701069Then why are fetuses treated as non-pople despite being human?
All humans start out as fetuses
Killing fetuses because they're not fully developed would result in anthropocide.
Unless it's about eliminating potential hereditary disease/disorder.
>>701213If abortion is justified murder, then would gerontocide be justified?
Or cutting off life support of comatose patients?
Of course I would more agree with birth control.
Imo, schools should have birth control supplements for students.
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