Can socialism ever be achieved democratically?
Just wondering if you might have to work outside the law because the other side sure as hell does.
yeah, sure. why not?
would've unironically happened if the CIA didn't rig elections every time it was close
No, as socialists we wish to abolish the state as we see it as a product of class society. Democracy is a form of capitalist state governance, and the most effective on at that. To work within it would be contradictory and would keep said governing structures alive; thus keeping the alienating nature of the state where individuals cannot independently appropriate their environment, and by keeping the division between decision makers and executors and the division between the majority and minority.
Every "socialist" that has ever been elected into government through liberal democracy has never put forward any policies that lead towards communism, but instead made the state interfere more with the market, and as the state is a tool used by the upper classes to mediate class struggle and to implement their laws in order to preserve their privileges, this makes 0 difference on how things are run.
The revolution will occur when the material conditions have ripened and have made it possible for the revolutionary proletariat to seize the means of production, to abolish the state and when it allows them to abolish commodity production and when it allows them to replace capitalist socioeconomic relations with communist ones. These can't be achieved by electing another demagogue that will inevitably betray the working class, and who's policies will be reversed in the next election or economic crisis.
>>717347no. porky learned from the past. they wont allow anyone who can actually change into positions of power or the decision-making structures.
firstly, they get a call from obama telling them they have a lot of potential and you don't want to be throwing it all away. in five years, you could be in a govnorship. ten you could be president. if it doesn't work out then you can go into the revolving door of the private sector. if you dont accept then all sorts of bad things will happen.
>>717375the true response from any scientist and/or marxist