No.16250
>>16247For what reason on earth would personal communications be happening on the same forum as whatever signal system we'd be using for demand and production signals?
No.16251
>>16250Are you suggesting OGAS should use a dedicated intranet?
No.16252
i begin to commit industrial sabotage
No.16253
>>16251personal communications are obviously different from demand signals, the fact that online advertising doesn't work and has not worked for 30 years should be proof enough of that
No.16254
>>16247IDK you can plan an entire national economy with extremely limited computing power and to the extent that long-term stuff requires planning it's basically just iterations of the monge-kantorovich problem with some slight variations on time-sensitive goods, it's legitimately not an algorithmically complicated problem
No.16255
>>16254You still need reliable data from the local enterprises. This exercise is about securing the transfer of economic data not about economic planning itself.
No.16256
>>16253Are you suggesting OGAS should use a dedicated intranet?
No.16257
>>16255legitimately how is that a complication, every single enterprise that uses data right now deals with this every day, why would you expect there to be some global communist technosolution to the problem of "garbage in garbage out"?
No.16258
>>16255If you want a single example of technological data transfer about production statistics over time, that's been done repeatedly both under GOSPLAN and cybersyn, the algorithms to do all of this are comparatively well understood and as long as we can get fascists to stop killing our economic planners the workers economy will mostly be fine
No.16259
>>16257Consider you have a general store where you can turn in your labour credits for provisions. How does the store report the inventory gained and the inventory "sold"
not really sold since customers use labour credits during its day-to-day operations to the planning office? How often should the store report this data? What steps can be taken to ensure the reports are accurate?
No.16260
>>16259I get that you're pretending to be smart here, but you've obviously not engaged with the literature because this is literally just adding a noisy signal to the support for a transport plan in the standard monge-kantorovich problem
there's a specialized variation of the algorithm that deals with input noise, you're not getting some gotcha out of this just showing you don't read any of the operations research literatiure
No.16261
>>16260Correct, I've not read any of the literature you're referring to. How about posting some pdfs?
No.16262
>>16261what you want me to handhold you through "baby's first linear programming exercise" and pretend that you have something worthwhile to say about economics at the same time?
No.16263
>>16261how about you kill yourself instead of me wasting time on that?
No.16264
>>16262>>16263All you have to do is post some pdfs. It's not much work.
No.16265
>>16264pdfs of what this is literally like asking to post a pdf proving 1+1=2, it's basic linear algebra stuff that anyone with a competent background in economics should know out of hand
No.16266
>>16264the fact that you don't know what a linear program is is absolutely on you if you're somehow opining on political economy
No.16267
>>16265There's quite a gulf between linear algebra and it's application in economic planning.
>>16266It was not my intention to discuss political economy in this thread and I don't believe my OP was making any prescriptions on political economy. I wanted to discuss the security of OGAS from a software system perspective, hence why this thread is posted in tech and not in edu.
No.16268
>>16247Computer network can be secure enough that it takes extraordinary determination to breach them.
That limits the mount of malicious interference to the point where you set up enough booby-traps and honeypots to catch all the hackers and make them work for the people's IT service.
No.16270
>>16267
> There's quite a gulf between linear algebra and it's application in economic planning.In fact there is not, almost all modern production planning is based either directly or indirectly on linear algebra, and the only mathematically significant variations other than knapsack type stuff are what's called "optimal transport" problems (aka the monge-kantorovich problems, after the soviet economic planner leonid kantorovich)
the "gulf" is relatively small and anyone with a cursory background in industrial engineering will say as much.
it's mostly pointless imo to ask about security questions because they usually require an implementation or context, which is not and may never exist. The optimization problems can clearly be discussed in the abstract as mathematical entities, but that's clearly not the case for security questions so it's pretty pointless to ask
No.16271
>>16268What are examples of very secure networks? Stock market? Military?
No.16272
>>16271Actually existing computer networks that have really good security are pretty rare. Most IT security experts think our IT infrastructure has terrible security in general.
For good security you need audited open source and a "no insecure configuration option paradigm".
No.16274
wtf a good thread in /tech/
No.16277
Cockshott came up with one idea; Basically, you'd randomize binary codes for various instructions, so 0001 might be a mov instruction on one machine and it might be 0010 on another. Obviously, you'd need a new compiler for every machine you have as part of the network, or at least have some kind of seed you could add as an argument, but it'd mean that in principle viruses and other malware would have to be custom tailored for every machine.
No.16378
>>16247IDK but the first thing that comes to my mind is implementing OGAS in Rust.
No.16379
>>16277Cockshott once again proving he talks about more things than he understands.
No.16380
>>16379404: Argument not found
No.16381
>>16380How about we keep pirating vidya without needing to transpile it every time, since this does nothing but weakly enforce open source.
Certainly a good thing, but one of the essences of the freedom of software includes freedom of distribution, so maybe not limit consumer side, but enforce producer side…
No.16382
>>16277ngl that sounds pretty retarded
No.16396
SSH and PKI
No.16397
>>16277It's security by obscurity taken to the logical maximum. One environment per computer.
No.16398
>>16277formal verification is much better than a half-baked idea like this. that and going back to Harvard machines
No.16399
>>16381>since this does nothing but weakly enforce open sourceEncrypting the chip architecture makes it much harder to put backdoors into hardware, and you can scale down microchip-fab security from ultra paranoid to regular paranoid. If you combine this with virtualization and make it so that the virt-host and virt-guest system run on processor cores with different hardware encryption keys , it will become next to impossible for malware to break through virtualization layers.
Security patching will also become more economical and faster when malware has to distribute it self as source-code, because the step of reverse engineering binaries can be omitted.
The only real downside to this is that each piece of software gets compiled billions of times, and that's wasting a lot of compute cycles, and energy for battery powered devices. Adding something like a hardware accelerator feature for compiling software is necessary.
Current Computer security designs are getting better at preventing weaknesses in memory allocation , so the next target is going to be weaknesses in software logic, and this architecture encryption might be good at mitigating that.
No.23068
bump
No.23069
>>23068why did you bump this shit? how is this even a thread? is everyone here retarded?
only
>>16396 mentioned pki and tls and he got ignored. why does everyone here like writing and talking about shit they are completely uninformed about
wtf is this, it is embarrassing. mods please delete this thread
No.23071
>>23069Blah, SSH and PKI are obvious for encrypting a computer network
Don't blame anons for trying to spin something interesting out of a boring prompt
No.23091
bump
Unique IPs: 13