What has caused the harem to almost become the default relationship in anime?
Not a fan. Even with all the crazy shit I can accept in anime, this is generally a level of blatant wish fulfillment nonsense that just fully takes me out of it.
>>26850I don't agree, the plot is the most important thing, that's why in our childhood we were taught love stories where a prince would proceed to save his princess in spite of monsters and other obstacles. They could be just an another man and woman, but that wouldn't be interesting. Art appeals to aestetics, and familiarity is often uninteresting.
Many yuri, yaoi, cgdct are boring fanservice animes and even they are not usually popularized by how cute their female characters are, like 'Bocchi the Rock', I never watched it but the main premise of it is that Bocchi was not a cute girl, but an introvert first.
Vidrel, see how the church painter responds to crusaders questions of whether people will like to see his art!
>>26854not really. I made the analogy with porn precisely because the plot is not only irrelevant but often even omitted entirely. and it is the other way around, there is no such thing as aesthetics but acquired behavior, that's why every society has had different canons of beauty, thus a degree of familiarity is a prerequisite, not an obstacle
>are boring fanservice animesbecause you don't like anime. you are trying to find what you already know (western stories and cliches) in japanese animation. let me guess, you also think most anime are bad and fanservice mills
>Bocchi>not a cute girlok nvm you are just rattling my cage
>>26858>there is no such thing as aesthetics but acquired behavior, that's why every society has had different canons of beauty, thus a degree of familiarity is a prerequisite, not an obstacleEvery society had its inner discourse where aestetics were not in a particular sense accepted but a whole set of things were present, this is not only in the basis of society but the individual as well, child me and me now do not usually devour same things. See how many monarchies were toppled when the monarch was once the beloved father, how old beautiful piety, the influence of churches were replaced by wisdom of reason and state secularism.
>because you don't like anime. you are trying to find what you already know (western stories and cliches) in japanese animation. let me guess, you also think most anime are bad and fanservice millsI think so with your last claim, but I watch anime. Anime is just a drawing style which is used in reflections of the artist, at the end, I either consume it or not, but pretty sure it is more about how interesting the story is- like, in Fate series, it is the holy grail war and characters of different whims clashing which was interesting to see for me.
>ok nvm you are just rattling my cageThere I meant that her being introverted was more focussed by the audience than she being a girl ( at least from my observations )
>>26867because if you are clear from the beginning about the type of content you are producing the audience you gather will be the audience for that content. if you signal that your game is "unicorn friendly" (no male interactions) your audience is going to hold you up to those expectations. if you break that promise later on, the people that have paid money to play your game will probably get pissed. if you don't like the expectations, you should have been clear about it from the starts, and these companies know what they are doing:
they were the ones that created these tropes and culture in the first place>>26862funnily enough this is common in porn, be it manga or anime. there were some hints towards it like 15 years ago, I can't remember specific titles but one important disclaimer is that these weren't romance anime, the series that oscillated in this direction were normally edgy thriller, drama or terror, where personal relations weren't the focus but more like a plot device to signal the alignment or moral compass of some characters
chobits harem baits but at the beginning but kind of subverts it as the story develops
>>26884it's different though. take twilight for example, women self-insert as the female protagonist and there is a focus on romance, which means that in most cases the girl picks one of the male leads and the story ends. harem for men doesn't really have a self-insert component, and while there are some that eventually take a route, most tend to be either vaguely or explicitly inconclusive
in other words, "reverse harem" is just romance with multiple potential leads, regular modern harem is slice of life
>>26889>harem for men doesn't really have a self-insert component,Lol wut? Most harem stories are isekais nowadays, the most self-insert genre to ever exist.
>and while there are some that eventually take a route, most tend to be either vaguely or explicitly inconclusiveWrong.
>>26892>self-insert is rather rare nowadays and people have some confusion with the term. most male protagonists are plain and people not familiar with anime mistake that for self-insert bait, but there is little to no actual self-insert by the audience nor is that the intended effect by the author. the protagonists are plain mostly to avoid alienating viewers: he is not the point so there is nothing to gain by giving him a personality, but you might lose audience if they find him annoying. case in point it is extremely rare to see otaku talk about the interactions of the protagonist with the girls, everLol I love how leftypol has invented the argument technique of
>You are wrong>long ass paragraph of non-sequitrs>never say one word about how you're wrong>hopefully you got bored of my rambling and string of non-sequitrs before realizing I'm never going to backup my claim
>self-insert is rather rare nowadays and people have some confusion with the term. most male protagonists are plain and people not familiar with anime mistake that for self-insert bait,Want to take another shot at it?
>>26912Maybe the trick is to have the self-insert be mysterious and ambiently present, add characters the audience might relate with instead, and give the MC traits until the captive audience self-inserts into the characters they moreso relate to.
Arknights has a self-insert, the Doctor, that has near-complete amnesia and wears form hiding clothing and hood, and in the anime adaptation they're making an androgynous VA. By the time the doctor starts to get traits, like eating ramen raw packet first and pouring water in like in vidrel to make the ramen in their mouth, I had already started to strongly relate to Texas, and I've seen a lot of people online kin Lappland.
>>26889>harem for men doesn't really have a self-insert componentThat's ridiculous. Most harem protagonists have basically no personality and are drawn like generic Japanese teenage boys because they're meant to be easy to project onto.
>most tend to be either vaguely or explicitly inconclusiveYeah so that the viewers can just pick whichever girl they like the best without there having to be a "canon" choice that conflicts with what they want. The inconclusive nature of the romance is part of the self insert.
>>27074Its funny how the occult club has the nicest members in the show.
She had a nice va too, she was treat whenever she was on screen.
>>27128I read a story that had an actual harem ending, in modern times too
It was trash
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