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Not reporting is bourgeois


File: 1738808249482.png (2.65 MB, 2009x942, tenchi then and now.png)

 

What has caused the harem to almost become the default relationship in anime?

Not a fan. Even with all the crazy shit I can accept in anime, this is generally a level of blatant wish fulfillment nonsense that just fully takes me out of it.

consumer preference aka money

I think its because its easier. You don't have to try to create interesting characters when its a harem.

because you watch anime for the female characters, not the plot or anything else. it is to the brain what porn is to the penis. good authors have gone a step further and removed the male character entirely, this is called "cute girls doing cute things" or cgdct, the ultimate anime genre

>>26846
>What has caused the harem to almost become the default relationship in anime?
It has not become the default.

>>26851
Hence my use of the word "almost."

>>26850
I don't agree, the plot is the most important thing, that's why in our childhood we were taught love stories where a prince would proceed to save his princess in spite of monsters and other obstacles. They could be just an another man and woman, but that wouldn't be interesting. Art appeals to aestetics, and familiarity is often uninteresting.

Many yuri, yaoi, cgdct are boring fanservice animes and even they are not usually popularized by how cute their female characters are, like 'Bocchi the Rock', I never watched it but the main premise of it is that Bocchi was not a cute girl, but an introvert first.

Vidrel, see how the church painter responds to crusaders questions of whether people will like to see his art!

>>26850
I love Mary

>>26854
not really. I made the analogy with porn precisely because the plot is not only irrelevant but often even omitted entirely. and it is the other way around, there is no such thing as aesthetics but acquired behavior, that's why every society has had different canons of beauty, thus a degree of familiarity is a prerequisite, not an obstacle

>are boring fanservice animes

because you don't like anime. you are trying to find what you already know (western stories and cliches) in japanese animation. let me guess, you also think most anime are bad and fanservice mills

>Bocchi

>not a cute girl
ok nvm you are just rattling my cage

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>>26858
>there is no such thing as aesthetics but acquired behavior, that's why every society has had different canons of beauty, thus a degree of familiarity is a prerequisite, not an obstacle

Every society had its inner discourse where aestetics were not in a particular sense accepted but a whole set of things were present, this is not only in the basis of society but the individual as well, child me and me now do not usually devour same things. See how many monarchies were toppled when the monarch was once the beloved father, how old beautiful piety, the influence of churches were replaced by wisdom of reason and state secularism.

>because you don't like anime. you are trying to find what you already know (western stories and cliches) in japanese animation. let me guess, you also think most anime are bad and fanservice mills


I think so with your last claim, but I watch anime. Anime is just a drawing style which is used in reflections of the artist, at the end, I either consume it or not, but pretty sure it is more about how interesting the story is- like, in Fate series, it is the holy grail war and characters of different whims clashing which was interesting to see for me.

>ok nvm you are just rattling my cage


There I meant that her being introverted was more focussed by the audience than she being a girl ( at least from my observations )

>>26850
>because you watch anime for the female characters, not the plot or anything else
Cringe but perfectly explains why anime has gotten so much worse. Worst of all is that people who think like this genuinely consider themselves the "true fans".

>>26858
>because you don't like anime
lol I should have read the rest of the rest of the thread first, there it is. If you don't like retarded slop you don't REALLY like anime, you stupid westerner!!!! If you expect anime to be anything but trash you're not a true fan!!!!

I wonder if this harem stuff will disolve into polyamory. Like instead of making the MC THE load bearing drywall you could have much more interesting dynamics if the characters were into some of eachother and not others, but were still generally in the same friend-group with benefits.
This would mean making the cast majority bisexual, but that's easy to get away with.

>>26862
Fans won't go for poly stuff. The mc has to be male and all the characters have to like him only. Girls frontline had a npc male express gratitude towards a female character and they went ape shit

>>26864
>a guy is being nice to a girl
>people get pissed off
What in the actual fuck?

>>26865
Yuri idiots and the saddest kind of waifufag who gets jealous of their imaginary girlfriend possibly liking an imaginary boy.

>>26864
Honestly I'm surprised by all the stuff that other gachas get in controversy for while Arknights's fandom remains peaceful despite doing basically everything those others were doing and beyond. The game must have made it's rent lowering gunshots early enough to dodge all that.

>>26867
because if you are clear from the beginning about the type of content you are producing the audience you gather will be the audience for that content. if you signal that your game is "unicorn friendly" (no male interactions) your audience is going to hold you up to those expectations. if you break that promise later on, the people that have paid money to play your game will probably get pissed. if you don't like the expectations, you should have been clear about it from the starts, and these companies know what they are doing: they were the ones that created these tropes and culture in the first place

>>26862
funnily enough this is common in porn, be it manga or anime. there were some hints towards it like 15 years ago, I can't remember specific titles but one important disclaimer is that these weren't romance anime, the series that oscillated in this direction were normally edgy thriller, drama or terror, where personal relations weren't the focus but more like a plot device to signal the alignment or moral compass of some characters

chobits harem baits but at the beginning but kind of subverts it as the story develops

>>26865
The presence of males other than the mc interacting with the harem is netorare according to them

I think it's one part wish fulfillment and another part marketing, where you can market merch to various shippers if you don't explicitly state a "winner."

>>26870
That's unimaginably pathetic.

>>26873
It must be incredibly exhausting to see yourself getting cucked over things like that daily.

>>26846
Male fantasy

>>26875
>Male fantasy

>>26875
>fiction is not real
holy shit!!

File: 1738953255361.png (2.61 MB, 1920x1080, ClipboardImage.png)

>>26875
How come every single female story is a reverse harem?

>>26884
>How come every single female story is a reverse harem?
Based females.

>>26884
More holes

>>26884
it's different though. take twilight for example, women self-insert as the female protagonist and there is a focus on romance, which means that in most cases the girl picks one of the male leads and the story ends. harem for men doesn't really have a self-insert component, and while there are some that eventually take a route, most tend to be either vaguely or explicitly inconclusive

in other words, "reverse harem" is just romance with multiple potential leads, regular modern harem is slice of life

>>26889
because no one wants to hangout with men, they want only women friends

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>>26889
>harem for men doesn't really have a self-insert component,
Lol wut? Most harem stories are isekais nowadays, the most self-insert genre to ever exist.
>and while there are some that eventually take a route, most tend to be either vaguely or explicitly inconclusive
Wrong.

brother we marxists speak in terms of trends and categories, not cherrypicking

self-insert is rather rare nowadays and people have some confusion with the term. most male protagonists are plain and people not familiar with anime mistake that for self-insert bait, but there is little to no actual self-insert by the audience nor is that the intended effect by the author. the protagonists are plain mostly to avoid alienating viewers: he is not the point so there is nothing to gain by giving him a personality, but you might lose audience if they find him annoying. case in point it is extremely rare to see otaku talk about the interactions of the protagonist with the girls, ever

but with reverse harem you have a very strong self-insert. if you read twilight you are literally bella and edward loves you. the protagonist is plain but in a completely different direction, she interacts, or rather, has an actual dynamic with the romantic leads. I don't remember bella ever having an actual conversation or exchange with edward, you are just carried forward by the story. I think that's the main difference between plain and self-insert

>>26892
>self-insert is rather rare nowadays and people have some confusion with the term. most male protagonists are plain and people not familiar with anime mistake that for self-insert bait, but there is little to no actual self-insert by the audience nor is that the intended effect by the author. the protagonists are plain mostly to avoid alienating viewers: he is not the point so there is nothing to gain by giving him a personality, but you might lose audience if they find him annoying. case in point it is extremely rare to see otaku talk about the interactions of the protagonist with the girls, ever
Lol I love how leftypol has invented the argument technique of
>You are wrong
>long ass paragraph of non-sequitrs
>never say one word about how you're wrong
>hopefully you got bored of my rambling and string of non-sequitrs before realizing I'm never going to backup my claim

>self-insert is rather rare nowadays and people have some confusion with the term. most male protagonists are plain and people not familiar with anime mistake that for self-insert bait,

Want to take another shot at it?

>two paragraphs is too long for me
I accept your concession
not to mention that I was talking about modern harem and you brought up something from 20 years ago. kind of weak trolling

ways to tell a story a harem story is a self-insert for men:
>main character is a incel loser virgin who gets some lucky break:
<his grandfather left him a bathhouse to run
<his uncle left him left a girl's dormitory to run
>main character is a incel loser virgin usually who has lived a full long life of being a loser incel virgin and dies at the age of 40+ or something
<and is now given a second shot at life to hopefully not be an incel loser permavirgin this time
<cue harem

You can tell a self insert because the main character is an incel loser permavirgin for no other reason than the average reader of these softcore pornos are incel loser permavirgins.

>>26895
>not to mention that I was talking about modern harem and you brought up something from 20 years ago. kind of weak trolling
And you have 0 examples. I'm not trolling, you're just denying the obviously reality that all these softcore porno animes with loser MCs are self-inserts.

I don't care enough to throw examples, but you have a pop understanding of anime, vibes you picked up from internet memes and not the actual content. it's like when people think they "know about history" because they like countryball memes and video-essays. the people that either follow seasonal anime or have an honest interest in it already know these things I'm verbalizing. feel free to come up with an honest argument

>>26896
>You can tell a self insert because the main character is an incel loser permavirgin for no other reason than the average reader of these softcore pornos are incel loser permavirgins.
It's true. But it's not necessarily a bad thing. The bad thing about harem anime is that it's boring and unfunny, watching porn is much more exciting.

I don't think it's even about guys wanting 10 girlfriends. I think it's about wanting to sell your anime to 10 different guys, all of whom have different tastes in waifus, so you give your MC 10 girlfriends so that all 10 guys in your audience will like at least one of them.

If your MC only had one girlfriend, you risk displeasing everyone in your audience who was more interested in someone else.

>>26900
Is the MC even necessary at that point? Seems like you could cut the literal middleman and make each girl bi and interested in eachother.


>>26902
I mean, it does sometimes seem like the harem is a lesbian polycule that a guy wandered into by accident and he can't find the exit anymore

>>26904
in recent series the male protagonist often isn't even such, they are instead either an animal or a literal object like a sword or a hanbaiki. the most prominent harems these last seasons have been basically hamefura clones, so male demographic with a female protagonists and a harem with both male and female romantic leads

>>26902
They need a male mc to self insert as

>>26912
Maybe the trick is to have the self-insert be mysterious and ambiently present, add characters the audience might relate with instead, and give the MC traits until the captive audience self-inserts into the characters they moreso relate to.
Arknights has a self-insert, the Doctor, that has near-complete amnesia and wears form hiding clothing and hood, and in the anime adaptation they're making an androgynous VA. By the time the doctor starts to get traits, like eating ramen raw packet first and pouring water in like in vidrel to make the ramen in their mouth, I had already started to strongly relate to Texas, and I've seen a lot of people online kin Lappland.

>>26903
K-On is so tame though, it was even shown on Disney Channel. Does this series pander to moefags or something?

>>26913
There will be no self-inserts under communism.

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>>26915
>implying there won't be self insert isekai after the revolution where the mc gets sent back in time and joins the bolsheviks

>>26926
you mean like a remake of "A Connecticut Yankee in King Arthur's Court" but in revolutionary russia instead of medieval england? the funny thing is that it should end the same way: despite the protagonist best efforts, the revolution ends up collapsing into a bureaucratic mess and repressive policies like it did in real life, because it didn't depend on the actions of one individual, but on the material and political conditions of the moment

>>26889
>harem for men doesn't really have a self-insert component
That's ridiculous. Most harem protagonists have basically no personality and are drawn like generic Japanese teenage boys because they're meant to be easy to project onto.
>most tend to be either vaguely or explicitly inconclusive
Yeah so that the viewers can just pick whichever girl they like the best without there having to be a "canon" choice that conflicts with what they want. The inconclusive nature of the romance is part of the self insert.

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>>26934
Yes but then theres a plethora of books about the successor states and warlords just like in hoi4 mods, all power fantasy isekai like today but soviet and communist themed

>>27067
She was my favourite, it was so cute when they did that ritual and she started having fun.

File: 1740387237750.webp (18.55 KB, 400x335, aa24.webp)

>>27074
Its funny how the occult club has the nicest members in the show.
She had a nice va too, she was treat whenever she was on screen.

>>27113
She looks funni.

But even harems are rarely ever real harems. The main character always winds up with either no one or only one person not a poly relationship

>>27128
I read a story that had an actual harem ending, in modern times too
It was trash

>>27128
hamefura ends with wholesome bisexual polycule

>>27137
Harem animes been popular for decades

>>27137
>I have yet to see that.
bro is blind :skull_emoji:


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