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 No.1195[View All]

Often when when talking about leftist fiction, it is in relation to speculative science fiction.I'd like to have a thread to discuss not only fantasy with leftist themes, but fantasy in general.So, read any good fantasy recently?
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Watched Green Knight yesterday becsuse it was recommended here. Honestly, it might just be that I just watched it and its fresh in my mind and all, but I think it might push out Stalker as my favourite film of all time.


Neato, sounds fun.


neat continutation idea: I imagine he's forced to apologize by saying she's a most deplorable temptress of the darkest pits of hell and she ends up becoming so smitten with him that she joins the party just so that she can seduce him. Her attempts don't work out, but the paladin doesn't want to upset her again so he begrudgingly lets her keep attempting, creating a weird romantic comedy.


Checked and based summary


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I'm trying to deprogram my tastes from the trappings of pop fantasy but it's been difficult. I was never interested in the usual race essentialism or great man politics but I still cling to worldbuilding/pseudorealism and magic systems.

It's like part of me can't enjoy a story unless I'm able to suspend disbelief and think of it as its own little internally consistent world which still operates like a world even if the rules differ from my own. Anything too mythic, surreal, weird or allegorical kills my interest, which is a shame.


Thought it was pretentious as fuck, especially after I learned the actual green knight story it was clearly attempting to "deconstruct".


Youtube algorithm popped this out on my reccs and I've glad to find such an interesting fantastical animation


Please Elaborate. I remember the original story and haven't gotten to see the film, so an outside opinion 'd be interesting to hear.




why should i watch this reaction video


It's the reason why that animation was probably favored by the algorithm. Skip to around the 29 minute mark if you don't believe me.


I don't quite see your point. Yes its a 3d character animation but how is that relevant to it getting recc'd to me? I haven't indulged in Nostalgia critic for a long ass time.


Ironically this is literally a minor thing in Fenoxo's Trials in Tainted Space that has Steph Irson do this kind of thing and get into sexual situations in each episode


Because Nostalgia Critic's review of The Wall was horrendously bad to the point that it garnered a bunch of attention.


Oh really? I honestly had no idea. Can you explain it to me? I don't think I've seen The Wall, let alone the review (in full) so please elaborate on his mistakes.


NTA but The Wall is a very famous and well regarded film / rock opera about very heavy and significant subject matter (post-WWII rot of liberal society), and the Nostalgia Critic's "review" of it is an obnoxious long-form parody of the movie and songs. But it's not just a Weird Al kind of parody - it's extremely disparaging of the content it's parodying, the original The Wall.

But it's bewildering because the people involved seem to have neither the talent to pull off the musical parody of anything nor even enough of a surface level understanding of the original material to be able to construct a parody of it that makes any sense. It's a little shocking how bad, confused, and ill-conceived it is, and it became a bit of a meme because of this.



Oh you mean like Pink Floyd's stuff? and damn that's cringe-inducing.


>Oh you mean like Pink Floyd's stuff?
>and damn that's cringe-inducing.
It might be the current high water mark for internet cringe.


Yeah, anyhow thanks for the reccs, gonna check it out.


Is it chddy to think black hobbits native to the north is weird?
Immigrant I get but native should be too mixed out by third generation, unless hobbits practice jim crow


No it's a reasonable question as it doesn't make narrative sense, following the world-building. The only reason it'd be 'chinletdy' is if your reasoning is "hurr blacks in de shire is bad" or some /pol/shit like that.


I think it's weirder for hobbits to be diverse per se than to have black hobbits. Black hobbits per se isn't necessarily odd. I vaguely recall descriptions of hobbits being brown, or maybe specifically their hands/feet looking brown. People tolerate drow being pitch black in the underdark even though logically they would be extremely pale.

Hobbits all having dark skin for some reason would be one thing, but having a small and famously sedentary group of people be diverse makes no sense at all - where do the different phenotypes come from? I guess you could have an explanation but there is a weird trend in fantasy lately to completely ignore actors' and characters' ethnicities even when it raises obvious questions. If you want black hobbits just make them all black or change what hobbits are so it makes sense. Occasional black halflings in D&D is fine because the lore is totally different and they live all over the world, but for what the lore is in Tolkien it's weird to have significant diversity in an area that's roughly equivalent to rural England.


In the Silmarillion, Men came wandering out of the east when they first encountered Elves iirc. I think proto hobbits also had a similar wandering period before settling down in the Shire. If I was writing the show, that's how I would explain it at least, that this community has picked up different hobbity folk in its history of travel. IIRC, Smeagol isn't a hobbit either, but his people are related to hobbits. I'd imagine that this group is also made up of not quite hobbits, before settling down into what will become the hobbit community.

Or you can just say that Eru works in mysterious ways.


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>Embedding error.
This fucking site…
Samurai Jack - Final Question (Season 2, Episode 2)


I’m still so mad they took the 9 hour edit down from YouTube.


Surprised to have not seen mentioned the black company serie here, which despite the fantasy background and evil wizards, very much likes to play with political themes and a materialist view of history
You basically start by following a band of mercenary reputed for their ability under the orders of the local big bad evil wizard, which reveal herself to not be that bad administration wise really, just ruthless and magically powerful.


skill issue
check this out


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Retard, I'm saying the Embeds are functional initially, but when there's some new update to the site or other /tech/ fuckery, a ton of the embeds are gone with "Embed Error" afterwards because the site's embed system is janky.

>black company serie
I personally didn't like it very much, it feels a little like GATE and just goes way to hard on the "realism meets fantasy" aspect that I've frankly found tiresome at this point. I'd rather just read the shitty isekai pennybacks from Russia, because those are at least funny and weird.

You mean the "one more step" YTP?


Well all fantasy shit now is just D&D schlock so it's to be expected


Yes, the “every time Sam takes a step further from the shire the scene where Sam says if he takes one more step it’ll be the furthest he’s ever been” 9 hour edit.


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Been looking at some obscure fantasy films of the past and found some that I remember from when I was a kid that are interestingly different.

First is The Black Cauldron - the almost forgotten Disney flop based on a trilogy of books that are themselves based on Welsh mythology, written by Lloyd Alexander.

The Second is The Princess and the Goblin, a story based on a 19th century novel of the same name.

Third is The Swan Princess, which is an interesting reinterpretation of the Swan Ballet.

All of them differ from the traditionally action-adventure genre of Swords and Sorcery fantasy that is commonplace and is instead more in the original vein of fairy tale stories. It's unfortunate they were not quite up to scratch of some more classic, well known fairy tale interpretations. Cutting out the graphic scenery was a mistake in Black Cauldron.
Frankly, other than the Black Cauldron I though the other 2 were Don Bluth films but surprisingly are productions of other animation studios that have essentially vanished in all but name - the producers of the third film have since only made 1 other decent cartoon - The Trumpet of the Swan - and otherwise focused on making terrible Swan Princess sequels and the shitty 3D Alpha/Omega series.
The creators of the second are an obscure Hungarian film studio that has made numerous unknown fairy tale films.

Cut scenes from the Black Cauldron (pic rel) https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BRzdVzeOBqk

The troubled history of Black Cauldron https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mIuK4OZCWbU

The Princess and the Goblin https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0fERWxl4c4s

Princess Swan https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6qqqi_M7ais review


I read a lot of fantasy growing up but the one that will always stand out is The Edge Chronicles. I'm amazed that no one ever mentions it. It's been so long and wiki claims it's a children's book so idk how the writing holds up but the world the authors created, complete with a lot of amazing artwork, is fascinating. They need to turn that into a TV show at some point.
Of the more mature works my fav was probably the Kingkiller Chronicle though that might just be recency bias as it was one of the last fantasy novels i've read. I was gifted The Fionavar Tapestry by an uncle that loves this stuff but I'd already grown bored with genre at that point so still havent read it. If I ever get back into it I'll start with that one


None of those are even in the ballpark of "obscure". Black Cauldron especially.


Ask any Gen Z kid what any of the three are or what they're about beyond the names, almost nobody below the age of 25 (that isn't a /co/fag) would even know of them, let alone their basic plots.


The problem with the black Hobbit is that it is part of a sort of "Disney Diversity." By which, I mean a kind of lazy and cowardly attempt at being more diverse by just race and/or gender swapping some characters. There is no new story about a tribe of black Hobbits, one of them is just randomly black. It's similar to how they fix the problem of their "elves" just looking like white people with prosthetic ears lazily slapped on their heads by having an "elf" that is a black guy with prosthetic ears lazily slapped on the sides of his head.


Disney Diversity is a good term for it.
But more than "how do I insert black people into Tolkien-based fantasy?" the way to actually do diverse media would be to do fantasy based on African folklore. There is plenty of material to work from.

Tolkien style fantasy races probably just shouldn't be done in live action. They ought to look different enough that you can't make up an actor to portray it. The humans shouldn't really look like IRL humans either. They're not going to have the same ethnicities and clusters of traits as Earth humans. Fantasy humans should look to us kind of like they're mixed-ancestry but you can't tell what.


The LOTR only really talks about one single part of the world and isn't supposed to be interpreted as literally true historical record anyway. There's big blank spaces that you could theoretically fill with practically anything you want. I mean, we're already in bullshit corpo fanfiction territory, so it's not like there's any actual concern for the integrity of the work itself, so why not go nuts? I bet there are plenty of talented writers that could come up with good shit about black elves or whatever. Sauron can't be the ONLY evil guy running around Middle Earth, so yeah show us the good guys and bad guys in fantasy tolkien africa or china or whatever. Take a fucking CHANCE, make something NEW, fucks sake.


In this thread niqqaz try to use race science on high fantasy. I hate fantasy fags. There's truly nothing worse


Ah yes the two genders of fantasy demographics - "completely ignore it" and "race science." Tolkien was extremely fixated on demography, which has left a major impact, but it's much older than his influence. Fantasy always has had lineage be an important element, right back to Gilgamesh being a demigod by ancestry.


sci fi chads on top!


It would be less weird if they were all black than to have them be mixed for no reason, or all black with one white hobbit, or there's some tribe of black hobbits we've never seen for some reason. If you have a race of people who predominantly look like one type of people and live in the same general region (middle earth is just a small corner of its world), it's unrealistic to insert random others into that group without some in-universe justification. What they should have done is hired more African and Middle Eastern actors and written in some Men of Rhun or Haradrim. But they don't want to do that because westoid diversity is simply diversity of appearance. They only want people who look different but think exactly the same, which is why whitoids are racist against Chinese people who keep their Chinese names but are happy to socialize with ones who assimilate into the Anglo monoculture.
But it's already been established by LOTR movies that in the Peter Jackson universe, Middle Earth's denizens are white Angloids and the only brown people are the foreigners who side with Sauron. Otherwise Gondor should all be Greeks or Turks because they're basically the Byzantine Empire, instead of looking like redheaded Irishmen. They made them all white already and try to patch it up by adding some token blacks, and end up just making things worse. That's not really representation, it's just advanced level tokenism.

I noticed this in Dishonored too, where Dishonored 2 has black people on Serkonos but they're just there, they didn't create another island with its own culture where they could have originated, even though the setting could have badly used a couple extra islands to add variety of cultures. Instead there's an Anglo island, Nordic/Slavic island, Italian/Med island, and weird Irish island, and black people just exist with no origin and uniqueness. That's worse than not having them there. At least in the Elder Scrolls, Redguards have their own culture and history instead of just being darker Imperials who pop up halfway through.


dishonored setting never truly made sense, all the islands are part of an empire, but the slav island is seemingly just le 1984 ussr cummunism. I don’t fully understand the complaint about there being black people since dishonored while based on irl world, isn’t really logical and also I am pretty sure dishonored 1 already had black people, black aristocrats, black bottle street gang members etc.

Honestly speaking I always found it funny how fantsy tards love complaining about black people in fantasy media, even if the setting is something like dishonored, I understand complaining about lotr, but dishonored lmao. You guys will believe in shitty roman empire rip offs existing side by side with elves, but not into the possibility of black people being around with whites in some magical continent, that was created by some god or whatever. Maybe I am just misunderstanding the complaint.


Black people in fantasy shouldn't just be tokens. There should be entire cultures and continents worth of different peoples. Unless individual characters are just popping into existence, they have to come from somewhere. If you have people with clearly distinct ancestry, it raises questions about who their ancestors are, where they're from, and why the different groups are separate and distinct from each other. It's good for stories to be diverse, but there should be actual thought put into how the world works. Diversity isn't just about faces. It's about culture and history too.

And seriously, there is enough fantasy that's lazily ripping off European history and culture. We could definitely use more stories based on the folklore in the rest of the world, that doesn't even have white characters in the setting.


Demography isn't race science, anon. People aren't just randomly born black.


>the dildo in the background
every time


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Interesting how you didn't notice black people in the first Dishonored game, when they were goons who you chocked out and threw into a dumpster afterwards. Really makes you think.


NTA but goons are meant to be forgettable by design.


must have seen that pic over a hundred times, never noticed the dildo. fucking swedes…


I've been getting into Discworld lately and it's pretty cool

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