No.16137
>>16134What does punk even mean anymore?
christian_communismChristian Communism No.16139
>>16137>>16138Nothing, it's basically archaic language at this point.
No.16140
>>16137>>16138>>16139the "punk" is a stereotype of a person who does not conform to the current system, a person who does not follow the rules and is very rebellious, etc…
All these literary styles that are called punk is because they propose a way out of the current society or because they have a character or characters that fit in the definition of punk that I have given before. Cyberpunk is a style that exists as a warning of what will happen if we continue to exist within the current system, and Solarpunk serves as a platform to imagine a future outside the system focused mainly on ecology.
But it is true that during the last years the style has been reduced to an aesthetic and has lost all its political significance.
anarcho-communismAnarcho-Communism No.16156
Does solarpunk even exist? Like it started as a post on tumblr and it existed just as that for a while, have any novels on this genre come out already?
No.16157
>>16156There are enough of them to consider it as its own genre, but it still lacks a work that will take it to the mainstream.
No.16158
>>16134>solarpunk<just solar technology with woketards walking around Where’s the punk again?
No.16168
The only "solarpunk" setting I can think of is Mobile Suit Gundam 00. The world's superpowers control access to all the solar power and everyone else lives in misery.
No.16171
>>16134I hate it; I hate everything about it. I especially hate the greenwashed, "sustainable" architectural renderings that people jack off to in Solarpunk literary circles—as if that aesthetic hasn't already been adopted by Big Tech! OP, your image
literally has one of the fucking Amazon Spheres in it! Have you seen their "Helix" design for HQ2? I'm just imagining cities using crop dusters to maintain their plant-covered skyscrapers, and residents getting mouthfuls of pesticides and fertilizer. These are monuments to the preservation of Capital's robbery of nature; simple as. One could almost be forgiven for thinking Solarpunk's anti-capitalism has always been surface-level. Its incessantly idealist, prefigurative politics caught the attention of some of the most obnoxious people I know. Their vision of the future can be reduced to a kind of Socialism with Chobani® Characteristics. I think Salvagepunk is a much more compelling alternative, although the folks at
https://salvage.zone/ droning on about the "Proletarocene" will never not be funny. Still, the future won't be as green as you hope for; best come to terms with that now rather than later. Actually existing sustainable housing projects like ZEDFactory's BowZED or public housing estates like Goldsmith Street are a far cry from anything tumblr artists were coming up with almost a decade ago, and all for the better. Eco-Socialists take note.
No.16205
>>16134It's the faggiest, tumblrite aesthetic in genre fiction. There isn't even anything 'punk' about it. It's part of a trend of retarded millennials and zoomers breaking down the meaning of any genre suffix they get their hands on because they're too lazy to educate themselves on anything.
No.16214
>>16135Hell yeah. Solar brutalism!
No.16227
ITT
>It’s bad because…BECAUSE IT IS
This is what happens when you have the mindset of an edgy pol faggot while pretending that you don’t
No.16243
>>16171>waaaaahhhh porky is co-opting this visually appealing aesthetic>that makes the archeticture bourgeois>instead we have to adopt something ugly to signal that we are really different from the capitalistsbrain worms
No.16244
>>16242Huh, I still like it. Looks neat.
No.16252
>>16227What
it is (i.e. a literary movement w/ a fetish for New Urbanism and greenwashed ornamentation, as well as Chobani® futurism or the "Ghiblification" of life under monopoly capital) is very different from what it
ought to be (i.e. a literary movement that seeks to interrogate the metabolic rift w/ theories of planetary urbanization all the while supporting a full-on assault against climate apartheid regimes). I think it's interesting how some of the original Solarpunk stories sometimes attempted to depict this, and mostly came from Brazil. It reminds me of a quote that often gets mistakenly attributed to JG Ballard: "The periphery is where the future reveals itself." I always saw a kinda of favela chic in both Solarpunk and Salvagepunk; but it was the latter that presented a much more grounded aesthetic commonality to me, speaking as someone who grew up in the Rust Belt. Of course, São Paulo or Rio are much denser than say, St Louis or Detroit but no matter what, it's hard to retain a childlike optimism for the future when you're surrounded by industrial blight that actively risks polluting your drinking water. I think recognizing that our world has been irrevocably structured as an apocalyptic wasteland that's gradually unfolding is a great reference point, and that the best future we can hope for now quite literally is a salvaged or repurposed one. There ain't nothing wrong with a little despair.
>>16243Moronic post. To say porky is adopting the Solarpunk "aesthetic" is actually giving the subgenre and its artists too much credit. Big Tech was getting into sustainable architecture well before 2014; it's just a testament to how utterly unimaginative and ignorant of art history these tumblr artists were. What shreds of afrofuturist influence was at last somewhat interesting; but I rarely see that anymore. Also, BowZED and Goldsmith Street look fucking amazing. Again, that's what good, actually existing sustainable housing looks like—notice the lack of lawns on their roofs or jungles on their balconies; amazing! If all you're concerned with are simple façade changes, then you might as well become a trad architecture revivalist instead. Hell, you'd probably fit in with the New Urbanists.
No.16255
>>16252>Solarpunk is bad because it is hopeful and we should just accept life becoming irreparably shitPlease kys
No.16288
>>16205this drives me crazy. not to put down trans people but what the hell does transgender even mean? across gender? through gender? spanning gender? they just took transsexual, which accurately describes what it's meant to, and swapped sexual for gender to create a word that seemingly describes nothing. the english language is wonderful in writing (speaking not so much) and it's being massacred by lazy idiots. i now understand why the prescriptivists has such a stick up their ass in the late 20th century.
No.16956
>>16843Honestly the only real problem with solarpunk is that society is rarely reimagined in these paintings, just plastered with green everywhere
No.16983
Who are the great solarpunk architects?
No.16997
>>16956I mean TBF they usually portray neighbourhoods that look much more communal, residences close to shops and workplaces, little or no advertising, low or no carbon forms of transport, more walkable friendly commute, and so on, I feel like you're not looking hard enough
No.17007
>>16997no he's right, that's mostly dated / bad design with some green added
better than nothing i guess
No.17867
>>16171you should write an article on this.
No.17875
any GOOD solarpunk media
No.17879
>>17684Can someone scrub the company/ad aspect from this please
No.17885
>>16171So, soulless steel and glass shit and housing blocks?
>>16242I lived near it. Nothing but concrete, and it house a small mall.
>>16843While looking good, it's just an arcology.
>Trees>Without roots>>17008A bit better than the regular vertical sleep factory.
>>17684Dave, from the marketing department just mashed together all the things hipsters like. Please buy our shit now.
No.17889
>>16134mfw sociacucks actually believe in this xd
No.19386
>>16240>>16227It's an unrealistic grift at this point, and unlike Steampunk, who don't pretend it could or should be real, or Cyberpunk which is dystopian and based on future computer technology by default - people continue to try and promote solarpunk as realistic and positive, when its neither. Any PUNK aesthetic is linked to dystopias or post-apocalyptic scenarios or some kind of social conflict, that's why it's a PUNK setting.
No.19387
i like aspects of solarpunk but don't think it's cohesive or cool enough to work on its own, its best integrated into other things
No.19470
This is what I imagine r/neoliberal types get off to. Completely soulless glass penises with tacked on greenery.
No.24625
>>24624Cyberpunk is meant as a warning. Post-cyberpunk isn't as bleak viewed but probably more often panders to capitalist sympathizing instead of building on socialist ideals as far as I am aware but i could be wrong. Solarpunk looks more interesting when it takes on some Victorian design influence like Steampunk does which actually could make sense. Makes it feel less distant to be more like an alternate path we could have taken even in the past but clearly can still do today. I think while usually meant to be bleak i think biopunk can have some positive aspects to it though it's positive aspects would be too heavy on scifi to feel reachable. Im thinking like bioengineered microorganisms that produce electricity. Usually biopunk instead focuses on the dangers of manipulating people's genes.
No.24631
>>16255How the fuck does this shit
>>16843 inspire hope? If I lived in a solarpunk future the only thing I'd be 'inspired' to do is wear a bee suit all day, and cover my apartment with the world's largest mosquito net.
>>16983If you go by some of the influences seen in solarpunk concept art over the years that would be: Bjarke Ingels, Thomas Heatherwick, and NBBJ. All are
extremely 'problematic' for the lack of a better word.
>>17684I know it's been almost a year, but why would you post this again. This single ad has had me convinced that solarpunk fans dream of Ghibli in the same sense Disney adults dream of living in EPCOT.
>>17867Someone probably already has. I'm not well-versed enough in architectural and literary criticism to write a full length article on it yet. I still might give it a try though, perhaps later this year.
>>17879A 'decommodified' edition has been making the rounds since December 2021. I'm so tired of seeing people gush about it and the Oregon travel advertisements done by Sun Creature Studio too.
>>17885We need
sustainable and
affordable housing blocks; in practice they look
nothing like what passes for 'solarpunk' today. To use another British example, Peter Barber is another favorite of mine.
No.24633
>>24624What capitalism is 'structurally incapable of providing' is the boring and mundane—that is, everyone's basic needs should be met
without packing them into rooms like sardines. This became one of the main concerns of architects in the 19th and early 20th centuries (especially to those of a socialist persuasion) when the global population soared and the masses really started getting compelled by productive forces to live and work in cities. This relation, which is still new in the history of our species, continues largely unabated; and I don't think it will ever completely stop even with the prospect of imminent climate catastrophe. In my view, the most 'subversive alternative to solarpunk' is essentially: modernism, and a kind of instrumentalist one at that, for I think 'degrowth' is otherwise impossible. We see hints of this every time so-called 'solarpunks' take inspiration from capitalist fixations with 'smart cities' (see my many references to Big Tech). Their total lack of self-awareness is also why solarpunk has always struck me as a very bourgeois, Malthusian fantasy. It's not so much concerned with environmental conservation—and the violent restructuring of society that would entail, as it is in romanticizing life in the ruins of modernity. What apocalyptic crises that produced the ruins have long passed; now, there's only joy. It's like neoclassicism, but there's no ornament to speak of; all we're left with are images of people prancing around plant overgrowth. Again, it's why I mentioned salvagepunk because since the early 2010s it's served as a sort of transitional movement pointing to
something more politically useful than what Eco-Socialists have been parading for generations. It's basically solarpunk but with a marxist tinge, and technically predates it by a couple years. I'd be curious see a fusion of that with Andreas Malm's recent conceptions of 'Eco-Leninism' in all honesty.
No.24642
>>17879Can I have my marketing without the marketing, please? 😂
ideology doing ideologyless ideology oms
No.24643
>>24624>Cyberpunk is too pessimistic to be politically useful.To quote Fredric Jameson: "Utopia is not a positive vision of the future so much as it is a negative judgement of the present." Solarpunk is too much of the former and not enough of the latter. Cyberpunk began as a handful of stories about the crisis of modernity that, in the span of 40 years, was then transformed into an innocuous aesthetic for redditors to gawk at. Solarpunk on the other hand is all aesthetic without a defining work. People think it's punk simply due to its oppositional character (it has '-punk' in the name you see) so unlike Cyberpunk, it’s ground appears first and foremost
political. But the politics it advocates for is very often retrofit. To this day, I still associate the US-backed Kurdish experiments in northern Iraq and Syria with this pathetic excuse for a literary subgenre; all because solarpunk enthusiasts insisted on vague connections between real world and aesthetic. If derivative Bookchinist nonsense is the furthest extent Solarpunk as a
political project can go, then that is equally underwhelming.
No.24645
>>16156>Like it started as a post on tumblrNah Ursular Le Guin and Kim Stanley Robinson have been writing solarpunk fiction for years
No.24646
>>24631>How the fuck does this shit >>16843 inspire hope? If I lived in a solarpunk future the only thing I'd be 'inspired' to do is wear a bee suit all day, and cover my apartment with the world's largest mosquito net.pain is merely beekness leaving the body
No.24647
>>24633Is salavagepunk not malthusian and anti-modern?
I have not read the genre so this is not a rhetorical question, but this is what it seems like based on the aesthetic.
No.24650
>>16134I see quite regularly solarpunk being mentioned around here, but can anyone link actual solarpunk works?
No.24666
>>24645See this is exactly what I've been saying; even Solarpunk's supposedly foundational fiction is retrofit. I having nothing against Le Guin and Robinson (big fan of the former), and there's nothing wrong with identifying your influences or precursors; but come on, man.
>>24647No, Salvagepunk's big claim to fame has always been its desire to reintroduce considerations of class conflict to these post-apocalyptic environmentalist stories. I'm aware that
some Solarpunk short stories apparently do this, but that's never been
the emphasis.
No.24667
>>24649You either need to try harder or stop being so fucking dense.
No.31275
>>24633>It's not so much concerned with environmental conservation—and the violent restructuring of society that would entailThis sounds like operating on false hope that things can more or less continue as they are and that the violent restructuring of society is (A) avoidable and (B) not already something happening constantly under capitalism.
No.31276
>>24666>even Solarpunk's supposedly foundational fiction is retrofitThat's how genres work. Nobody who writes the foundational material for a genre goes "hmm today I will write a story in a genre that doesn't exist yet."
No.31277
>>31276My point was that Solarpunk enthusiasts love to claim that the subgenre is much older and more developed than it actually is. Cyberpunk grew out of the New Wave science fiction that was being produced all throughout the 1960s and 1970s (Le Guin being chiefly among them). It had a real immediacy and continuity to it (and within a single generation!); where is that in Solarpunk?
No.31278
>>31275I thought I was being clear in that I think the violent restructuring of society for eco-socialist ends
isn't avoidable.
No.31279
Solarpunk isn't a genre, it's an aesthetics tag for social media. It's a vibe. It's closer in concept to some zoomer's goblincore mood board than it is New Wave sci-fi or its actually-culturally-relevant forerunner cyberpunk.
No.31280
>>24631What absolute shit architecture design from aesthetic to efficiency. The housing blocs of the soviets and even brownstone housing projects in the east coast is more efficient than this absolute shit. At least the "solar punk" is inspired, these houses are nothing but over expensive rich people's real estate to just make money.
No.31283
>>31280Peter Barber is literally recognized for his novel social housing designs you moron. Also again, Solarpunk's approach to the built environment isn't inspired by anything but the most mainstream 'starchitects' fuck you.
No.31286
this is just modern architecture with hanging gardens added on top of them, not sure if it’s novel enough to have some special label for it
No.31308
Anarchists co-opting solarpunk is good. It enables a pretty aesthetics (yes, with rare exceptions its an aesthetic and its appeal is being an aesthetic) to be an entry into the recognition of green-washing and issues with capitalism.
It's like Bernie Sanders.
No.31315
It is neoliberalism complete with bourgeois psychology brainwashing trying to get their wage slaves to be "happy" with "positive thinking":
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Solarpunk< themes of do it yourself ethics, convivial conservation, self-sustainability, social inclusiveness and positive psychology are often present. <Self-sustainability, in which a person or organization needs little or no help from, or interaction with, others. Literally just neoliberal individualism for DIY anarcho-redditors alone in their apartment pods. Hard to think of anything less communist than this anti-collective-struggle response to crisis like a dying dog going off to die alone.
>literary genreSci-fi is idealist, not materialism for people learning actual science, a word not used a single time in this thread. You can tell it's a technocrat redditor genre because they don't care about plants and fungi/bacteria who already have perfected solar extraction over millions of years. Why reinvent the wheel? The answer is obvious: $$$$$$$
>very strong ideological content.Zizek disgusted
>>16140>the "punk" is a stereotype of a person who does not conform to the current system,<the word 'punk' meant prostitute in Shakespeare's time and now means prison bitcha utopia dreamed by rape victims? No wonder its so dreary lol
>called punk because they propose a way out of the current societySolar power is such a normal, non-edgy part of ruling class capitalism that Obama did corporate subsidies for some grifters. Is it "edgy" to demand we extract exponentially more rare earth minerals from the periphery for the imperial core?
>Cyberpunk is a style that exists as a warning Literally used as a how-to guide for every Silicon Valley neoliberal. Solarpunk must be a guide for imperialist resource extraction.
>the style has been reduced to an aesthetic and has lost all its political significance.Liberals have been saying "solar power will save the world when the market improves" since the '70s, it was idealist utopianism then.
>>24624>what exactly is the subversive alternative to solarpunk? It should be something that capitalism is structurally incapable of providing.Very easy answer:
<collective struggle<class consciousness<literally just any politics outside of individualist consumer aesthetic subcultures No.31316
>>31315>You can tell it's a technocrat redditor genre because they don't care about plants and fungi/bacteria who already have perfected solar extraction over millions of years. Why reinvent the wheel? Because we can't live inside a literal plant
No.31366
>>16288Did you bother looking it up? Fucking retard. Can't a person read a fucking architecture thread without being slandered? It means across gender and transsexual generally means they had a sex change operation and is a term more popular in the past. Transgender is more inclusive since not all trans people are transsexual. Literally nobody brought up trans people but somehow "solarpunk" convinced you to write a transphobic rant, pseudretard
T. Trans person
No.33368
>>33365>>33366>twitter determines my politicsThis is why we need solarpunk, so there will be grass for you to touch.
No.33369
>>33368You think if someone touches grass, then they'll see the light of Hitlerism and Volkisch ideology just like you already do?
No.33370
>>33369Maybe you'll stop hearing nazis in your walls.
No.33372
>>16134Wouldn't the better word be SolarCore? SolarPunk implies there's something dystopian about it.
A solarpunk dystopia would be an interesting concept tho.
No.33373
>>33372>SolarPunk implies there's something dystopian about it.The -punk part of fiction usually is in reference to punks or rebels in the setting. At this point it's become kind of a perfunctory suffix though. The "punks" of solarpunk would essentially be people buliding communes and doing guerilla gardening within capitalism, but that doesn't fit the format of how the word is constructed.
>A solarpunk dystopia would be an interesting concept tho.Yes it would.
No.33374
>>33372>A solarpunk dystopia would be an interesting concept tho.Isn't that just Chernobyl lol
No.33375
>>33368Touching grass isn't gonna do anything about the metabolic rift, anon.
>>33370If they aren't Nazis then they're Jehovah's Witness, which somehow might be even worse. I wanna say it's almost like people's recurring fixations with Solarpunk is symptomatic of a much larger yearning to return to the very utopian communal experiments that dominated America throughout the 19th century.
No.33376
>>33375Maybe people just like trees?
No.33377
>>33374Probably something like that copypasta that reactionaries post about Avatar where the humans are the good guys because they have the technology to go to the stars, while the ayys are lame because having all their needs met means nothing motivates them to supersede themselves. Idk how you could do it in a way that isn't right wing unless you just decide that the solarpunk world is capitalist. Maybe do a version where it's just greenwashed capitalism instead of eco-socialism.
>>33375>Touching grass isn't gonna do anything about the metabolic rift, anon.Smoking some might make you care enough to do something about it.
>If they aren't Nazis then they're Jehovah's Witness, which somehow might be even worse.Idk how JWs are worse than nazis but go off queen.
>I wanna say it's almost like people's recurring fixations with Solarpunk is symptomatic of a much larger yearning to return to the very utopian communal experiments that dominated America throughout the 19th century.Or maybe people are noticing the effects humans are having on nature and want to make dealing with that a major plank of future political projects.
No.33378
>>33377Maybe solarpunk world is facing some imminent world crisis that can't be fixed by the labour of small independent communes? But that's more a criticism of anarchism generally
No.33379
>>33378Urbanism is central to solarpunk so that's not even the same genre (and part of why the chobani ad is a bad example).
No.33380
>>33379Yeah I guess.
I guess you could also say that solarpunk may be likely to amuse ourselves to death, ie. without adversity and higher purpose beyond hedonism humanity will slowly die out
No.33381
>>33372'SolarCore' would be a lot better.
>>33373>The -punk part of fiction usually is in reference to punks or rebels in the settingNo, the '-punk' adjective always indicated an aesthetic reflection of the crisis of modernity. This is what made post-punk, cyberpunk, etc so compelling from their outset. Solarpunk isn't concerned with that; if it did, then that would betray its 'optimistic' premise.
>The "punks" of solarpunk would essentially be people buliding communes and doing guerilla gardening within capitalism, but that doesn't fit the format of how the word is constructed.How is this any different than nearly every recent-ish anarchist group ever? It just goes to show that y'all haven't changed much since Fredy Perlman joined Fifth Estate's editorial board like 50 years ago.
No.33382
>>33380Hmm yeah the idea of collapsing birth rates continuing might work. Like the opposite of Malthusianism lol.
>>33381>How is this any different than nearly every recent-ish anarchist group ever?You are asking why bending over backward to make an inappropriate term make sense yields kind of stupid results. There's nothing necessarily anarchist about solarpunk.
No.33383
>>33376There's nothing wrong with that
per se, but the alignment of boulevards down to yes, the placement of trees, have historically been used by city planners to justify discriminatory policies! Just look at the confluence of the 'City Beautiful' and 'Progressive' movements during the rise of Jim Crow here in America! I'm tried of being met with a chorus of impressionable people yelling, "What's so bad about trees?!" when, to treat them charitably, they likely haven't dug beyond introductory readings on social ecology and the right to the city to begin with.
>>33377>Smoking some might make you care enough to do something about it.I'm more into amphetamines if I'm being honest; which is funny seeing how much I think Solarpunk is Hitlerite nonsense at worse.
>Or maybe people are noticing the effects humans are having on nature You're forget that America has long, storied history of utopian communal experiments under its belt and any political project (socialist and otherwise) with as lofty aims as Solarpunk will almost certainly, unfortunately, revert back to that state. Americans need to reckon with with the legacies of Owen, Rapp and Amana
>and want to make dealing with that a major plank of future political projects.I'll have uhh, one Green Five Year Plan please. Maybe a reconstituted Civilian
Conservation Climate Corps on the side, with college student conscripts wearing Adidas track suit uniforms or something.
No.33384
>>33383Wtf does any of that have to do with solarpunk. Yes I'm aware that richer neighbourhoods are usually more leafy and green, that's because those qualities are desirable, therefore maybe we should extend them to everyone??
No.33385
>>33382>There's nothing necessarily anarchist about solarpunk.People have been bending over backwards trying to make the case for Solarpunk as a
political project for almost a decade. They absolutely want us to think it's anarchism. They have wanted us think it's the Kurdish experiment in Northern Syria, and even Exarcheia. As the climate crisis deepens, any 21st century anarchist movement will be coded as Solarpunk. Seeing at how the subgenre hasn't produced a foundational work yet, that has been its lasting impact (to me anyway).
No.33388
>>33383>but the alignment of boulevards down to yes, the placement of trees, have historically been used by city planners to justify discriminatory policies!capitalists used urban planning to discriminate against people before
therefore trees are bad
No.33389
>>33387*insufficiently, fuck
No.33390
>>33388look if you're satisfied with new urbanist / yimby shit like "more trees = good" and "more market rate housing = good" then quit whatever socialist org you're in and join your local chamber of commerce; i don't know what else to say
No.33391
>>33385>People have been bending over backwards trying to make the case for Solarpunk as a political project for almost a decade. They absolutely want us to think it's anarchism.Yes, people will try to make the case that appealing things are related to their politics.
>As the climate crisis deepens, any 21st century anarchist movement will be coded as SolarpunkWhy is that anarchist specifically? Why not solarpunk Stalinism?
No.33392
>>33390Yeah solarpunk is definitely "more market rate housing and trees in rich streets"
No.33393
>>33391>Yes, people will try to make the case that appealing things are related to their politics.I don't think Cyberpunk suffered from that within its first 15 years at least.. It wouldn't be until the 'Post-Cyberpunk' era of the 90s did Silicon Valley techies mistake satire for sincerity.
>Why is that anarchist specifically? Why not solarpunk Stalinism?Well it just speaks to the state of the left in the global north and its historical relationship to environmentalism ig since Marx and Engels' time. As much I like the sound of Eco-Stalinism, we barely have Eco-Leninism formulated and made palatable yet.
No.33394
>>33392Okay, you understand how laughably easy it is to greenwash Solarpunk as its currently theorized as a political project. Good.
No.33406
>>33383interestingly in some cities there also now exists a disparity in trees and some types of plant life in general with more affluent areas having more trees and older trees.
This ofc means working class areas dont get any of the benefits associated with trees such >biodiversity
>erosion control>reduced heating/cooling costs>positive mental health benefit from plant life/green spaces>shade(which other than being good for pedestrians can reduce UV ray damage to concrete and asphalt)>some trees are very good at reducing air pollutionurban heat island bad tree good
No.33407
>>33406Another big one is controlling water. More vegetation absorbs more water (and slows the flow) which reduces flooding.
No.33424
The biggest thing I fault "solarpunk" for is that it's utopian communism. We've already been through this and thinking about future societies while ignoring development is ridiculous. Solarpunk is a fantasy based on real world scientific understanding on the development of agriculture and other forms of working the soil in more sustainable systems. Things like permaculture and there is another one I think which is kind of new and based on real research which is sustainable especially for feeding local populations and making alot smaller the necessity of large scale agriculture for export. This isn't solarpunk, this is science and isn't based on some fantasy of the future but something we can do right now.
No.34327
>>34326stone bros stay winning lmao
>>24631 No.34328
>>34326>concrete buildings😑
>concrete buildings with TREES IN THEM🤯 WAAOOOOW
>>34327the people complaining about
>>24631 being ugly are like libs going le depressing soviet architecture. just slap some paint on them if it's so ugly
function trumps form every day. formfags are and always will be libs
No.34346
>>34328Bosco Verticale also weirdly comes up every time people talk about "Brutalism with trees" which is just hilarious. Unless it looks like Alt-Erlaa I sleep.
>>34328Peter Barber's output has interesting formal qualities too! His sketch/draft work clearly takes inspiration from ancient Middle Eastern cities like Shibam.
No.34347
>>34346I just find the concept of building stuff from cut stone rather than concrete interesting. why don't we do that more? is cutting limestone particularly expensive? while not as strong as reinforced concrete you can compensate for that with more limestone, no? this is assuming granite is impractical to work with, but maybe diamond saws make it practical
No.34348
>>34347Stone isn't very recyclable or renewable is it?
No.34352
>>34348we're not running out of bedrock anon, and any stone used gets turned into new stone over geological time. plus used stone can be crushed into gravel
No.34354
>>34347>why don't we do that more? is cutting limestone particularly expensive? I imagine it's very expensive to transport and assemble? Much of the contemporary construction industry relies heavily on de-skilled workers to assemble prefab structures on-site. We could, in theory, have buildings made up almost entirely of prefab stone/brick wall panels for example, but that would require having the necessary tools, logistical outlay and access to materials that we either no longer have, or just don't have the will to do.
No.34355
>>34354but you could cut stone into standardized shapes
No.34356
>>34355derp I only read half your post. yeah probably suitable MoPs have to be developed
No.34359
>>34347Concrete is more uniform, and adding more mass isn't always a good option.
No.34360
>>34359the point is that you don't need to waste energy on calcinating limestone to make cement. while the CO2 emitted does get reabsorbed eventually, the coal used in calcination adds extra CO2
No.34364
>>34360But still you can't really use masonry for everything, as an example pile foundations would require massive amounts of digging if not for concrete. You should ask an expert about it, like if doing a lot of extra work to avoid burning lime is worth it.
No.34365
>>34364that it a question that is only possible to answer under a global system of planning
No.34366
Solarpunk is unironically fascist.
No.34399
>>34366As opposed to ironically fascist?
No.40755
>>40754This is not Reddit; if you have nothing to post other than stale bait screenshotted from other sites, you should just fuck off.
No.40768
>>16134eco-fascists gargabe
No.40769
>renewable energy and green space in cities is fascism
the fatsocs are still malding about this and bumping this thread?
No.40813
>>40769There's nothing inherently wrong with those things, but why's it called solar punk and why is it rooted in Tumblr scifi and consumerism (seen here
>>16171 )
No.40816
>>40813>but why's it called solar punkIt's like cyberpunk… But with no punk… and with barely any cyber… You know, people used to call that "utopian fiction" back in the day.
It's like with goblincore, it has nothing to do with hardcore punk or even hardcore techno but normies like to appropriate le funni suffixes to sound cool without understanding what they mean. It's not even Goblin Slayer porn.
No.40817
>>40813>>40816It's like steampunk and dieselpunk, you can blame them for following trends but it's not like they invented it. I don't know about goblincore but maybe it is a play on cottagecore? Idk where the "core" stuff comes from, but it does not have to do anything with music. The "punk" in cyberpunk does not have any direct connection to music either, it's just a word for young troublemaker.
No.40821
Zero material analysis, purely vibes based, nothing about stopping imperialism.
It's settler socialism.
No.40831
>>40821It's a style, not a political theory.
No.40842
>>40840>my ideology? le cool aesthetics of course!lmao is this drivel supposed to prove the other poster wrong??
No.40843
>>40842there's nothing wrong with cool aesthetics. or unsocialist for that matter
No.40844
>>40840https://medium.com/solarpunks/on-the-political-dimensions-of-solarpunk-c5a7b4bf8df4Engaging prose, meh content.
<It is a dark truth of environmentalism that wind farms, solar arrays, hydroelectric dams and other triumphs of sustainability require completely engineered landscapes. Building them means ripping up the ground and installing massive amounts of metal and concrete.I agree that's true but I don't see what's dark about it.
<In light of their power, overthrowing the mega-rich is a dicey project, and one perhaps left to a different kind of political aesthetic. Instead solarpunk can challenge the capitalist status quo by nurturing alternative economic arrangements at a community and network level. Encourage resiliency that insulates towns and neighborhoods from economic shocks. Forge mutal aid pacts that protect members from fiscal predation. If we can prove that we don’t need them or their money, the chokehold of the plutocracy will loosen.Without freely available land, how would that work? I don't need the landlord in the sense that I don't need that person to exist for the house to exist, but I must pay rent to a landlord and there is no practical way of sneaking out of this except for a tiny minority. The only thing that could do away with landlords is class struggle. There is a lot in the text about doing this or that in a sneaky way (growing food on land you don't own), all of these have to be niche activities or they cease being sneaky.
>debt jubilee>tax on extreme wealth>the regulation or even abolition of usuryNot gonna happen without taking state power.
<vertical farmsInefficient.
<As Vaclav Havel explained: “Hope is definitely not the same thing as optimism. It is not the conviction that something will turn out well, but the certainty that something makes sense, regardless of how it turns out.” Havel, an artist turned activist turned statesman who led his nation out of a time of crisis, in many ways embodies the transformational power of ideas and aesthetics — and thus the potential of a movement like solarpunk to do real good in the world.Strange source of inspiration. Coming from an ultra-rich family of real-estate moguls, Havel was unsurprisingly pro-capitalist. Havel was also for expansion of NATO into Eastern Europe and was in favor of the NATO attack on Yugoslavia and the Iraq war.
This was the most serious text. The other two have barely anything to say.
https://solarpunkmagazine.com/what-would-a-solarpunk-government-look-like/<Solarpunk has a lot of dreams for a future we’d like to live in. Cultural and racial diversityDiversity isn't good or bad in itself so I don't see the point of having a pro or anti diversity position.
<Isn’t there room in solarpunk for imagining, not a nanny state, but a state whose honest purpose is to support people to live the best, most meaningful lives as possible?Which government would not say that about itself? Super lame article. The comment by Joel Spector is more interesting. He shills for proxy voting that can be redelegated at any time (calling it Positive Proxy, it's usually called Liquid Democracy) and that laws should expire. Though I don't know how Spector got the idea that German law is some sort of open-source process (
Reichsgerift isn't a proper German word btw.), it appears to be an online hobby project and not something that politicians actually look at.
https://www.re-des.org/es/a-solarpunk-manifesto/<it avoids steampunk’s potentially quasi-reactionary tendenciesAh yes, very important point. I was going to throw my support behind the steampunk party (they also have a strong presence in my union), but now…
For calling yourselves solar you punks have produced a lot of coal :P If you solarpunks vibe with what you call anti-authoritarian socialism, my advice is to stop shlicking to that yogurt commercial and seek out the Parecon people.
No.40845
>>40843>unsocialistlmfao its neither socialist nor unsocialist, its just baby shit for petit bourgeois with too much spare time
No.40957
>>40840Who's gonna mine the material needed for the solar panels?
>Anarch-hobbitAustin TX ass ideology
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