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/leftypol/ - Leftist Politically Incorrect

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 [Last 50 Posts]

I think reading up about these guys should be mandatory because they are a perfect illustration of what not to do. They were without a doubt perhaps the most incompetent and embarrassing armed group that has ever existed. Everyone, White Working class union members, Black Panthers and feminists all made fun of them and thought they were embarrassing retards
All their members hailed from very privileged backgrounds and were university students, Not surprisingly, when they were apprehended, only a handful faced any consequences or retribution from the government. Their grand "revolution" against the United States turned out to be a decade-long spree of meaningless bombings and vandalism. Law enforcement dubbed them the "toilet bombers" due to their penchant for targeting government building bathrooms. The pinnacle of their incompetence was when they accidentally blew up one of their own safe houses. Some of their members managed to evade capture for years(cause no one was actually looking for them), only to be astounded by the lenient punishment they received upon surrendering. cause law enforcement simply didn't deem them worth prosecuting. the majority of them are still alive and continue to enjoy their wealth to this day and are college professors and social activists.

 


>Some of their members managed to evade capture for years(cause no one was actually looking for them), only to be astounded by the lenient punishment they received upon surrendering. cause law enforcement simply didn't deem them worth prosecuting. the majority of them are still alive and continue to enjoy their wealth to this day and are college professors and social activists.


Based perhaps

 

>>1816541
>White Working class union members, Black Panthers and feminists
Like those dont became the parody of itself and willing or uninformed henchman for the elite to keep worker drones in line, looking for racist bigots/gay frogs under their beds.

 

at least they weren't feds like the symbionese liberation army

 

>>1816550
Le heckin' proofs?

 

>>1816547
Very telling response

 

>>1816547
how dare those people not try to directly fight the US government and not immediately get arrested.

 

>>1816555
Truth hurts. Those who tried were supressed, arrested or killed, if you look under US history. Imperial core swiped clean any last possible internal threat from the left during early cold war/mccarthyism times, the humble beginnings of the vietnam era were stifled or beat to submission into nationalism or harmless and convinient ultra-liberalism. This is obvious to any outside observer from imperial periphery/second/third world, whatever you call it. Especially now.

 

>>1816564
they were smart about it, anyone who wasn't completely retarded understood that unless there was a period of complete chaos there was really no chance of fighting a developed country with a good military, but there was so much misunderstand with that what happened in Cuba and Vietnam, that they really thought they could defeat armies

 

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>>1816541
Intreisgnly there was another group operating during the same time period that was more successful and was considered a real threat by the police, yet it was much less well-known, The New World Liberation Front, which was seven people in northern California led by a small-time drug dealer named Ronald Huffman (a.k.a. "Revolutionary Ron") who carried out twice as many bombings as the Weather Underground. Ron was a violent petty criminal who murdered his girlfriend. The NWLF was also anti-queer and anti-Semitic organization bizarrely enough. They tended to target utility towers, also tried to blow up Diane Feinstein's house which is the reason she owned a gun (despite being anti-gun herself). when caught all their members were given lengthy sentences (they didn't receive a slap on the wrist for being annoying scamps like the W.U members) and either died there due to old age (Ron died in 1999 in California State Prison in his 50s) or if they were released, seemed to have disappeared

 

>>1816587
Fascinating. Do you know more of these non famous urban guerilla groups?

 

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Urban guerrillaism is the natural conclusion of the Western worker is a lost cause rhetoric. So the default becomes dying at the hands of some intelligence agency. I don't doubt many of these people wanted to change the world, but no one in the third world asked them to.
The Western world's strength lies in its state's resilience in that no one needs to be minding the store for it to defend/replicate itself. Planting bombs doesn't force people to see reality, just traps the movement. See Black Liberation Army and New Afrika Party for more examples. Both decried the Black Panthers are revisionist for doing community building, while without irony the BLA advocated as a last resort colonizing a piece of Nambia. Still got a soft-spot for the RAF, Gurdrun and Meinhoff were cute.

 

>>1816541
>WU thread
I will never understand what you people derive from having the same conversations about the same extremely niche things again and again and again and again.

 

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>>1816614
>but no one in the third world asked them to.
That's dumb aNon, the RAF, my wifuuu… was the OPEC seige just westernes un asked? and other groups had deep links with local radical groups and governments.

 

>>1816617
New people will ask the same questions old pepole have asked.
We need to teach the same things again and again because generations come and go. That is why we have schools. :)

 

>>1816592
Probably the best book on the subject is Days of Rage - America's Radical Underground by bryan burrough. I'll summarize some of the movements. The groups that emerged from the universities, which were predominantly filled with white and jewish upper-class people (along with a few upper-class minorities), were often just LARPers, most of their "violent activism" were primarily acts of vandalism. In contrast, the actual Black Panthers and well-established Socialist groups were more cautious and they mostly did not advocate for warfare because they understood they could not win. The black groups that became more proactive were swiftly crushed and there were many petty criminals who took advantage of the situation. There is a theory presented that suggests one reason why some of these groups weren't caught in the first place is because the FBI intentionally hyped them up to secure a larger budget and justify their own existence

 

>>1816628
>There is a theory presented that suggests one reason why some of these groups weren't caught in the first place is because the FBI intentionally hyped them up to secure a larger budget and justify their own existence
It's interesting because wikipedia states that leftist extremism was the hardest type of crime to solve at the time, but there is not a single group i have read abou that hasn't been busted to the last in less than three years
>>1816614
>no one in the third world asked them to.
They were fighting for the german citizens of germany, for the third world as well of course, but why do they need random people from abroad to tell them they need to act?
>Gurdrun and Meinhoff were cute.
Can't fight you on that one
>>1816628
>Days of Rage - America's Radical Underground by bryan burrough
Thanks king

 

>>1816643
>They were fighting for the german citizens of germany, for the third world as well of course
I think k their actions ad writings show pretty strongly (at least from a fairly early point) that their project was more an anti-imperialist one than a revolutionary one, idk why everyone always wants to pretend otherwise for the cheap digs on this site.

 

>>1816668
I mean, they formed as a response to the West German governments support for the shah, but i would argue that their movement was born as a "reaction to reaction", as in they were a consequence of the countrys collective trauma from fascism. Ulrike herself stated that they were the generation taking up arms when their parents failed to. They saw the federal state as a continuation of nazi germany and blamed the US for putting the old nazis back in power. Therefore their anti imperialism was a lashing out against those who supported their former oppressors. They were vehemently anti police because they symbolized the brutality of the old system. So my belief is they were anti authoritarians first, and anti imperialists second, largely out of necessity as the "authoritarians" were US backed.

 

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>>1816541
>cause law enforcement simply didn't deem them worth prosecuting.
That's not true. The FBI self-owned while going after them in a hilarious fashion as there was a Wikileaks-tier scandal at the time (some monkeywrenchers broke into an FBI office that the agents left unguarded to go watch a Muhammad Ali fight) and liberated documents which exposed the FBI using illegal methods to pursue the WU and others which resulted in charges being dropped or brought down to lesser nonsense charges on several members. That also led to the Church Committee hearings and it was really embarrassing.

The WU being big dumb though is incontrovertible. Mark Rudd later said he regretted it and what they were doing had more to do with self-expression than anything else, and like getting way too high on their own supply, becoming enthralled by Che Guevara and wanting to copy him and just *assuming* that the students occupying college campuses at the time would follow their path, while being in no real condition or having the ability to wage guerrilla warfare with the U.S. government.

 

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>>1816628
>I'll summarize some of the movements. The groups that emerged from the universities, which were predominantly filled with white and jewish upper-class people (along with a few upper-class minorities), were often just LARPers
The origin story is rather interesting. The W.U. core were a group of Columbia University students who were actually good at organizing on campus. They also mixed (before forming the W.U.) with "red diaper babies" whose parents were CPUSA members and were all about "building the base." So they built this base of students, and a seperate black radical group occupied one of the buildings and made several demands – and in solidarity the white (and Jewish) students occupied several more. This turned into a kind of campus revolt and a lot of students who were uninvolved got swept up in it. Then after that, the W.U. types rejected the "base" strategy that red diaper babies were advocating and went off to form this schismatic underground army, somehow reasoning that the campus revolt could be directly translated – like if they could get a campus revolt going then they could also get an armed revolt going. Which was not the case. Ironically there was a much larger and national wave of student strikes against the war a few years later and they played no part in it because they were all on the run.

They also tried to crash the Democratic National Convention in Chicago in '68, but the number of "revolutionary youth" (as they called them) who they expected to turn up didn't, and they got their asses kicked by the cops. Several hundred people showed up when they thought thousands would do it. This seemed to have an effect of compacting them psychologically.

One funny story is that Rudd's grandmother I think hated cops. She wasn't even a communist or anarchist or anything, she was just a Jewish immigrant from Lithuania who distrusted them, so the FBI would knock on her door, and she'd be like "are you saying my grandson blew up a toilet in the Pentagon!!?!? I can't hear you!!! Get outta my house!!!" *slams door*

 

>>1816702
>"are you saying my grandson blew up a toilet in the Pentagon!!?!? I can't hear you!!! Get outta my house!!!" *slams door*

The porky fears the Chadma

 

>>1816723
I'm focusing on Rudd specifically but the whole story would make a good movie if the Coen Brothers directed it. But one of the biggest mistakes they seemed to make is believing that THEY in particular were going to become the leaders of a revolution which they believed was imminent, which was a fantasy.

Also, another clarification, some W.U. members did go to prison for many years. The progressive D.A. in San Francisco who was elected (and then recalled and ousted) a few years ago, Chesa Boudin, came from a W.U. family and his parents Kathy and Chesa went to prison for an armored car robbery which turned blooy. His mom spent 20 years. His dad spent 30 years, only being released in 2021. (Chesa was a kid at the time and was raised by Bill Ayers and Bernardine Dohrn… also worked briefly for a time as a translator for the Venezuela presidency under Hugo Chavez.)

 

>>1816738
There's an account by feminist Robin Morgan about her experience with these people, she was never involved with the group but an old friend of he's was. Basically they were on the run and she let them crash at her home, despite hosting them and not calling the cops, they were incredibly hostile towards her. They called her a breeder and a bourgeois (they were all from the same background, by the way). when they saw her breastfeed called her baby a white pig and spent the entire time ranting against each other and her and then left

 

>>1816765
>They called her a breeder and a bourgeois (they were all from the same background, by the way). when they saw her breastfeed called her baby a white pig and spent the entire time ranting against each other and her and then left

damn, they were leftypolers?

 

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>>1816777
>hello this is bernadine dohrn i’m going to read A DECLARATION OF A STATE OF WAR
A lot of it is funny but it's really not far removed. Like reading this stuff, it's remarkably familiar how much of the modern left traces its lineage to the 60s positive and negative and just fascinating when you think about it.

 

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>>1816830
>>1816738
What I'm still confused about is why there wasn't a single person with any sort of military experience who could have told these guys how retarded their plans were, there should have been tons of Vietnam veterans they could have used to train them and even if they couldn't find any ex-military guys, they could have read any book on guerrilla warfare. Mao lays it out that you should never confront an enemy if they are vastly stronger than you 'build up strength' as much as you can and avoid all confrontations with the enemy. Wouldn't these "thirdworld ant-imperialist's" have read his work at some point?

 

>>1816586
>but there was so much misunderstand with that what happened in Cuba and Vietnam, that they really thought they could defeat armies
There was actually another conflict whose narrative had an even bigger impact the Algerian War covered by Frantz Fanon, every modern leftist misunderstanding of guerrilla warfare comes from Frantz Fanon's Wretched of the Earth. I read it and it's not really any different from any other anti-colonial work and yeah he keeps on advocating for violence against the colonial state and how much it is necessary and that's fine, but unlike Marx or Mao he never gives specifics, it's just 'fight the state' And if that's your frame of reference, you will end up with clowns like the Weatherman

 

>>1816867
His other “amazing” book Black Skin White Masks is just him complaining about how black women marrying white guys. The funniest part is when he describes how Italian women preferred dancing with "local fascists" instead of the assorted African troops in the Allied Free French forces.(which was a defining moment of racism for him) It reads exactly the same as twitter thread by Tariq Nasheed or some other hotep.
As an addendum Fanon was recruited by the CIA who flew him to America to pay for his cancer treatment, Fanon at the time had been helping the FLN (Algerian independence movement) with bombmaking and propaganda and such in their campaign against the French.

 

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>>1816847
>>1816867
Yes. Fanon. From what Rudd has said, Che Guevara figured highly. Also Regis Debray. This is him:

>The way other leftists of the early to mid-twentieth century considered themselves Trotskyists or Stalinists or Maoists, I was a Guevarista, a member of the cult of Che. That meant not only putting up multiple posters with Che’s image on the wall in my room during college, but whole-heartedly accepting the theory that a small armed group could spark revolution by actually beginning military action. This central idea was transmitted to us via a small book which appeared in 1967, Revolution in the Revolution? by Regis Debray, a young French leftist intellectual who had conducted lengthy interviews and discussions with Che and Fidel Castro.


>Foco in Spanish means nucleus, the idea being that the future revolutionary army would grow around the core of the guerilla band. Along with being called Guevaristas, followers of Che, we in Weatherman and the Weather Underground were also called foquistas. Of course our enemies on the left, which included almost everyone outside of ourselves, called us other names, such as “Third Worldists,” “left-wing adventurists,” vanguardists, “infantile leftists,” “crazies,” and much worse. We didn’t care: we knew we were right because we were with Che.


>One gets the impression, viewing The Weather Underground documentary, which appeared in 2003, that there was no theory at all to our actions, that we reacted purely emotionally. Our motivation for violence, as depicted in the film, appears to have been the frustration we felt that the war didn’t end after years of protesting. I admit that there was an element of frustration in the choices we made: we had no idea at the time that the anti-war movement was actually having an enormous influence on the war planner’s policy options. With the characteristic impatience of youth, we ached to “take the struggle to a higher level.” (To learn about the actual effect of the anti-war movement on policy makers, see Tom Wells’ The War Within).


>Our dominant emotion, however, was not frustration. On the contrary, it took an enormous quantity of optimism, combined with a strategic theory, to believe that this country was moving toward revolution and that our actions could play a role in that development.


[…]

>Like Che, we believed that U.S. imperialism was in the process of crumbling to pieces. The military defeat in Vietnam was the prime indication of its weakness, the key to recognition that live-or-die revolution was already underway within this country and around the world. And Che Guevara’s foco theory, certified by Fidel, was the way to push it along. The revolt of black and other third-world people inside the U.S., led by the Black Panther Party, demanded white allies.


>To my eternal shame, I was part of the leadership of Weatherman which scuttled SDS, the largest radical student organization in the country, in 1969, at the height of the war. A small group of less than ten people made this suicidal decision believing that with SDS dead we would be free to build an underground guerilla army, organized into focos around the country. Each foco, through its exemplary armed actions, propaganda, and contacts with the above-ground mass movement, would attract recruits to expand the incipient revolutionary army’s military capabilities, Ever Onward to Victory (Hasta la Victoria Siempre)!


>One thing we hadn’t stopped to notice was that Che, in October, 1967, using precisely the same strategy that we proposed to use, had already been defeated and killed in Bolivia while trying to spark a continental revolution against U.S. neo-colonial domination. Wandering futilely around the jungle, much more alien to the campesinos and indigenous people than even the Bolivian army, his band was isolated and smashed. Che, in 1965, had tried the same strategy in the Congo in Africa, only to be driven from the continent. A guerilla foco in Argentina, Che’s own home country, had been wiped out, as would more guerilla focos in Uruguay, Brazil and several other Latin American countries. Blinded by my love and admiration for “the Heroic Guerilla,” as Fidel had dubbed Che, I didn’t want to see that there was a fatal flaw in the theory. It didn’t work.


>Oddly, it was the success of the strike at Columbia University—of all places—that furnished the slim evidence which convinced my friends and me that the foco theory would work in this country. In April, 1968, the Columbia SDS chapter, a small, militant group on campus, took action in concert with a group of black students; hundreds and then thousands of white students joined us in the building occupations and the subsequent strike. Our own militancy was the key, we thought, but we willfully ignored the years of concerted organizing that had gone before at Columbia. We also didn’t acknowledge the impact on people’s psyches of a cascade of historic events that occurred in rapid succession that spring: the Tet offensive in Vietnam, the abdication of LBJ, and the murder of Dr. Martin Luther King, Jr..


[…]

>My comrades and I recognized that imperialism imposes a violent status quo: it is a system which rules by force. From this it followed that imperialism won’t give up without a fight. Didn’t Mao Tse-tung himself write, “Political power grows out of the barrel of a gun?” Who were we to say differently? Cuba, China, Vietnam, the ongoing struggles in the Portuguese colonies of Africa, all showed us the way.


>The Wretched of the Earth, by Franz Fanon, an explication of revolutionary violence as the means of decolonialization, was on all of our bookshelves. We accepted as gospel the psychological necessity of violence as a necessary stage of decolonization. Fanon was a brilliant psychiatrist from Martinique who treated French colonizers by day and Algerian revolutionaries by night. In those pre-feminist days, it made sense to us that the colonized and humiliated would take back their manhood through violence.


[…]

>Having successfully (in our minds) united revolutionary anti-imperialism with Che’s foco theory, a role suddenly appeared for us: we would be guerillas “in the belly of the beast” (a much over-used metaphor). As white people, we would have certain advantages in mobility and access within this society that nonwhite people didn’t have. In a reverse double-whammy maneuver, we could use our white skin privilege to overthrow the structure of racist privilege. It was like being secret agents. For this reason alone we believed it was our revolutionary duty to take up armed struggle. In fact, in discussing what we were doing among ourselves, we often called our role “agents of necessity.”


[…]

>Fighting cops in the streets and undertaking guerilla warfare was not what the Panthers or the Vietnamese or the Cubans actually wanted or needed. In the summer of 1969, Weather people had met members of a Vietnamese delegation in Cuba who urged us to unite as many people as possible against the war. Instead we did the opposite, attacking the anti-war movement as not being revolutionary enough and organizing the Days of Rage in Chicago, in October, 1969, as a hyper-militant fight-the-cops action. Fred Hampton of the Chicago Panthers trenchantly criticized the Days of Rage as “custeristic,” while the Cubans sent word to us through informal channels that they thought the planned action was a terrible mistake.


>Completely ignoring what we claimed was our “Third World leadership,” we insisted that we would be the heroes, the tough guys. I became a ranting, raving hard-core lunatic, brandishing a chair leg at the first Columbia SDS meeting in the fall of 1969, bragging to the hundreds present, many of them former friends, “I’ve got a gun! Now go get yours!” I talked incessantly during that period of the need to “get serious.” My ability to maintain this revolutionary posturing only lasted at most six months, until the act just collapsed of its own weight, thank God. By the end of the next year, 1970, I was out of the Weather Underground Organization, still a fugitive, but no longer an official cadre, or member.


>In our arrogance, we had refused to look at the actual conditions within the U.S., including especially the isolated position of the Black Panthers and other non-white revolutionaries who were under terrible attack by the government’s repression. Insanely, we gave up on actually organizing other white people to supporting anti-imperialism: only we Weathermen would be the good whites. That attitude reached its highest expression in the bombings planned by a clandestine Weather collective in New York City against a non-commissioned officers’ social dance at Fort Dix. Tragically but fortuitously, the bombs went off prematurely in the West 11th Street townhouse explosion of March 6, 1970; we killed only three of our own people, not the Fort Dix civilians.

https://www.markrudd.com/indexf571?violence-and-non-violence/che-and-me.html

 

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>>1816882
<In our arrogance, we had refused to look at the actual conditions within the U.S., including especially the isolated position of the Black Panthers and other non-white revolutionaries who were under terrible attack by the government’s repression. Insanely, we gave up on actually organizing other white people to supporting anti-imperialism: only we Weathermen would be the good whites
Jesus Christ, how do you even get like this?

 

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>>1816926
He sums it up as being about (.gif). Look at me, this is what I believe in, and not only that – I'm willing to ACT on those beliefs. So join me!

 

All I hear is
>Yabba Gabba dap dap Dada.
>A-yao bowo yabba Da dappa dooio!

 

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Might be a fun read

 

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well it's not like delusions about military capabilities still don't exist,
The entire freaking Arab world couldn’t beat Israel but a militant group in a country half their size could totally solo them

 

>>1816541
>Everyone, White Working class union members, Black Panthers and feminists all made fun of them and thought they were embarrassing retards

As if these people of that era didn’t do anything that different or better. Especially the white working class ala Hard Hat Riot.

 

>>1817449
>The entire freaking Arab world couldn’t beat Israel but a militant group in a country half their size could totally solo them
<A surprise invasion by Israel against it's neighbors is comparable to a prepared invasion by a country
<Sizes in military matter more than military tactics
Well firstly, watch GDF's video The Conflict Based On A Lie. And secondly, Google the Battle of Thermopylae.

 

>>1817451
it's their fault for being cringe
>>1817460
Read on Protector Warfare my Mao.

 

>>1817464
You mean the white working class? It is okay they got what they deserved by foolishly electing Reagan.

Now their small towns and factories are rusting away to poverty and irrelevance.

 

>>1816877
> is just him complaining about how black women marrying white guys.
Having actually read that book, this is a misrepresentation. He was attempting to examine the sexual relationships between the colonizer and the colonized from a psychological standpoint. He does the same with relationships between black men and white women from the metropole. There are issues I have with him methodologically, but the book is also 70 years old. You also forgot to mention he only left for the U.S. after he was sent there on insistence from his comrades and doctors in the USSR. He wasn’t “recruited”.

 

>>1817493
I just think that he attributed many of his life's challenges to his race, rather than acknowledging that they were more likely due to his autism and unconventional appearance.

 

>>1816738
> THEY in particular were going to become the leaders of a revolution which they believed was imminent, which was a fantasy.
This is the common thread I see across all these groups. They misunderstand the historical moment they are living in and are no longer catering to peoples present interests. It’s a weird kind of narcissism about the future I can’t really pin down. Sometimes it manifests into cults but it’s almost always there regardless.You can see it in the Austin Red Guards or Black Hammer.

 

>>1816877
>As an addendum Fanon was recruited by the CIA who flew him to America to pay for his cancer treatment, Fanon at the time had been helping the FLN (Algerian independence movement) with bombmaking and propaganda and such in their campaign against the French.
This your head canon or fanfiction or what?

 


 

>>1817623
>2022 documentary
Did they dig up and recruit his corpse for this documentary?

 

>>1817623
If traveling somewhere for treatment is evidence of recruitment he was recruited by the USSR since he traveled there first. This clearly means he became a double agent for the USSR and therefore always remained a loyal Marxist.

 

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>>1817683
that's the point, men like him , Starte and Foucault didn't even realize they were being used, their existence was just to make the western left well retarded and cringe and it worked just as planned.

 

>>1817691
>Western left blah blah
I'm used to cranks who believe everything is a CIA psyop to sway naive leftists from the true path (defending China online) or how Fanon invented wokeness, but Fanon wasn't really a "Western leftist." Like everything is about the Western left but you go to Martinique and there's just a high school named after him. Just as the CIA planned.

 

>>1817532
I think you have nothing productive to add to this subject.

 

>>1817704
cam you name me a single guy who liked Fanon, Starate or Focault who wasn't a pretentious moron?

 

>>1817774
Stokely Carmichael

 

>>1817783
oh no some guy who was an activist.

 

>>1817791
Oh no, hand-waving reply.

 

>>1817774
Is that relevant

 

>>1817774
>Fanon

you are actually a drooling moron if you somehow think fanon is a purely academic thinker lmao

 

>>1816877
i made a effortpost a few months ago responding to some similary retarded misunderstanding in a thread about fanon, i hope somebody screencapped it because i do not really feel like reiterating everything

 

>>1817683
>>1817618
Anon that guys being trying to spread this retarded headcanon here for years, don't even bother, just for your own sake.
He's got a bunch of fruity autismo conspiracies about basically every remotely famous modern philosopher too iirc.

 

>>1816546
>Achieve nothing
>Paint the left as weird, misguided and disgusting
>Alienate masses
>Receive no actual punishment
>Get cozy and prestigious positions in universities
Do you not know the term "controlled opposition"?

 

>>1818169
its worse, they didnt even need to be controlled

 

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I really wanna know how these third-worldists reacted to Mao and the CPC siding with the US, specifically with Richard Nixon, who was like the devil to them.

 

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>>1816867
Algeria is perhaps the single worst example of the use of revolutionary violence. Early revolutionary violence almost ended their movement because they kept being arrested, interrogated and more members were subsequently arrested. Leaving the cities was the smartest decision the FLN made. After that they became more cautious and organized, and would lead the French Military on wild goose chases. It was not about "winning" the war but Ben Bella understood the political situation in France, he knew the war was unpopular and costly and thus it became a slog of retreating to rural regions or neighboring Libya or Tunisia until they built up their strength and then ambush and retreat, also it's best leaders were men who had previously served in the French Army and knew enough about military discipline and how the French Army functioned. but when independence was finally won, Bella and Boumédiène (who due to their history, were Francophiles by habit) took power. They immediately came into conflict with Algerian society. During the war there was some Islamic support from France because the French bothered to create a head religious authority for the region and they had to be removed this angered the religious conservatives, then there was the issue of the Berbers and what was to be done with them, all of these decisions led to various minor conflicts

 

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>>1818169
>Receive no actual punishment
Again, I gotta bust this myth because some of them did go to prison for an armored car robbery. A few of them got away free because of the COINTELPRO scandal. (It's amazing people will cite COINTELPRO and don't know its disclosure is why the Weather Underground members were not charged.) It's very common among right-wing conservatives in the U.S. too and spinning theories of how the U.S. has been compromised by ~communists~

>>1818666
Fire up google and marxists dot org erol

But most Maoists didn't make the break with China until Mao died. There were some at the time that claimed the U.S. was the lesser evil vis-a-vis the USSR (because that was the line sent to them from China) and came around to supporting the U.S. and NATO.

>During this period, one of the most controversial debates within the pro-China forces in the New Communist Movement concerned the issue of what role, if any, U.S. imperialism could play in the international struggle against “hegemonism”. In the late 1970s, I Wor Kuen warned the U.S. against “appeasing” Soviet social-imperialism and by 1980, CPML chair Mike Klonsky was stating that the U.S. has a role to play in the worldwide anti-hegemonic front, while The Call was writing about a Soviet “master plan for conquest.” The question was posed most starkly by the Communist Unity Organization, which published the pamphlet Sooner or Later in 1980. Sooner or Later called for an alliance with U.S. imperialism in the “world anti-hegemonist front,” and illustrated the consequences of its position by opposing “appeasement” and the withdrawal of U.S. bases from the Philippines or Puerto Rico, while expressing support for a strengthened U.S. military.

https://www.marxists.org/history/erol/ncm-5/index.htm

 

>>1817468
>its okay for the working class to suffer because theyre DAMN KKKRAKKKAS
no socialist movement reached those people and now theyre becoming fascistic again. their lack of consciousness is not their fault

 

>>1820237
Another interesting point is that the more educated and "Europeanized" Algerians were the biggest drivers of independence, while the more rural ones were a bit ambivalent and again many had served in the French Military for two three generations at that point, it was something they saw as duty, . They were doing a good job of pacifying inside of Algeria itself, but the issue is that every country around Algeria had just become independent, and all of them hated the French so much that they were letting the FLN set up for cross-border raids, De Gaulle simply couldn't be bothered to keep troops there until the end of time to prevent the inevitable from happening.

 

>>1820423
bsdfhsd

 

>>1817704
they wanted to get in on the ground floor with the new Algerian government that was about to come to power - they used their ties with Fanon to get an in with the FLN leadership

 

>>1816926
not too different from third worldists today tbh

 

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>>1816541
>>1816586
>>1816847
For the past 150 years, it seems that a recurring issue has been young leftists not familiarizing themselves with military manuals and harboring delusions about guerrilla warfare.

 

>Their grand "revolution" against the United States turned out to be a decade-long spree of meaningless bombings and vandalism.
I think there's a real place for deniable harassment campaigns, rather than bombings and fancy vandalism. Do gangstalker shit to class enemies. Give them Havana Syndrome. Zombify them. But don't give them anywhere to send cops to. Don't take credit. Create a sustainable campaign of accidents and coincidences.
The point is that it's low-risk collective direct action. All it takes is a small cell.

 

>>1844735
>wow people aren't reading books, educate yourself
>[proceeds to not post any PDFs]
/leftypol/ has fallen.

 

>>1844735
>twitter
go back to reddit

 

>>1844747
literally what damage does it to other then costing the government some government office bathroom property damage that it be payed for by local taxes

 

https://youtu.be/I-pdWG8YkZ8?si=j0dajZCdA4j5IH8J
what do you guys think of this video? it talks a bit about how these groups where divorced from the masses and their history

 

>>1816541
The global right it's iching for a new terrorist communist/leftists/ecologist terrorist group. The moment they appear, they will use it as a excuse to kill the internet.

 

>>1816541
Larping as revolutionaries and spokespeople for minorities and then taking up prestigious academic positions afforded to them by their own ethnic connections while also claiming persecution is peak praxis

 

>>1816877
Yes more people should know this. The FLN were anti-communists they killed the members of and banned Algerian Communist party. His close friend Holden Roberto was directly on CIA payroll as well.

 

>>1851764
The FLN were an explicitly Arab nationalist party and they held some negative attitudes towards Berbers and black Algerians

 

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>>1851764
>>1851907
don't forget this, Boumédiène was a racist ultra-nationalist

 

>>1851764 (me)
Its also why the French Communist Party stayed neutral on war, because the Algerian Communist party had started out as a section of the PCF and was being attacked and suppressed by the FLN. (not because the French party was 'opportunists' like you see some leftists claim).

 

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>>1856116
People who's 'politics' are just who they are 'supporting'/cheerleading and their gay little purity spiral nonsense like picrel should be shot.
It makes NO material difference who thry support. denouncing and attempting to create divisions in the Palestine Solidarity project from l

 


 

>>1856116
He’s entirely correct, radlibs support an idealized liberal version of Palestine that doesn’t exist outside of their imaginations, crying bloody murder when you so much as imply that Palestinians aren’t a bunch of free love hyper liberals who fly pride flags as much as their own flag

 

>>1856116
>Why don't you support the 10 year old with disabilities against the ferocious, steroid-fueled champion?

 

>>1856214
I don't have any special wisdom here but I think it can be both true that Palestinians in the main have no problems with Qassam Brigades shooting at Israelis, and that making that the focus of your messaging in the U.S. might be counter-productive compared to centering slogans like "Cease Fire Now." During the Vietnam War, this was also true, it involved different causes and factions (some more radical than others, the W.U. emerged from one of the most radical), and even some internal tension. But one message everyone could get behind was "Stop the War!"

There are some people who think protesters should focus on something more like that so as to expand the number of people involved. The more Americans and Brits and Canadians you bring into the pro-peace tent, the bigger the audience you can try to engage about the plight of Palestinians – a U.S.-supported and U.S.-subsidized oppression that most of your potential audience still have little real awareness of. But when you Qassem your protests up, that might just scare people away. It's like using the phrase "global Intifada," which connotes something like an anti-imperialist revolution on behalf of all the planet's oppressed peoples, but that not be how the phrase goes down.

I find these demonstrations by Palestinian guys as showing a lot of bravery and courage, and people might be completely right to celebrate their bravery in the context of the protests in Western cities, but tactically "wrong" in the situation. That's an inner contradiction that just exists. Does that make me a coward? Maybe.

On the other hand, I can understand why protesters might decide not to listen to to me… and not do that. Every protest movement has been like this. People who take to the streets – and keep doing that even after being arresting – tend to be young and unruly, and the incentive structure within such groups often rewards people who extend the frontiers of radicalness. For better or worse, Calla's position is to some extent part of the natural dynamics of mass dissent over an intensely contested issue, and even if her approach is suboptimal, well… that's better than no protests at all.

The radicals saying "Victory to the Viet Cong" in the late 60s could say, well, if you don't like our unruly and radical demonstrations, then stop sending an unending stream of American boys to their deaths in Vietnam! Were they wrong?

 

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>>1856340
>tend to be young and unruly
Calvinoid fascist detected

 

>>1856116
Where were the protests when the Syrian government and islamist fighting lead to 600,000 deaths? 377,000 deaths in Yemen, same thing. The fact that Palestinian refugees aren't being taking my surrounding countries due to PLO murdering their leaders in the 70s?

 

Japanese red army killed 12 of its own members in a "self struggle" incident

 

>>1816541
>Everyone, White Working class union members, Black Panthers and feminists all made fun of them and thought they were embarrassing retards
das rite
signed, black identity movement extremist nibba

 

>>1856214
what the fuck are you referring to anon?

 

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>>1816541
Weather Underground literally sounds like some avant-garde boomer-era pretentious rock band. You would expect a group with that name to put out some album with a single forty-five minutes track played awfully but somewhat considered as new classical music and an unparalleled feat of artistic genius by whole generations of hip "music critics".

>>1866218
>Boomer "veteran" in constant need to shove down everyone's throat he somewhat participated in the aggression and attempted genocide of the Vietnamese
>Historical falsification depicting Burgers and not the Red Army as vanquishers of Hitler
Frankly, someone need to organise some serious effort to balkanise and wreck that bloody place as soon as possible without any mercy at all. Let them descend into a Yugoslavia multiplied by ten thousand and the only few good ones there, please leave as soon as you can.

 

>>1866250
>Weather Underground literally sounds like some avant-garde boomer-era pretentious rock band.
It was, they took their name from a Bob Dylan lyric. They changed it from Weatherman though to be gender neutral.

<Keep a clean nose

<Watch the plain clothes
<You don’t need a weatherman
<To know which way the wind blows

 

>>1866250
WW2 soldiers were greatest-generation, most wee in their 40's and 50's during Vietnam

 

>>1816541
Didn't the panthers beat the shit out of them for trying to get with black women?

 

>>1816541
>cause law enforcement simply didn't deem them worth prosecuting. the majority of them are still alive and continue to enjoy their wealth to this day and are college professors and social activists.

No, it's not that the government didn't want their asses. They were rich kids who had connections that allowed them to get off scott free. They also had the national lawyers guild covering their asses too.

 

>>1866267
>They changed it from Weatherman though to be gender neutral.
the eternal libshit

 

Fuck the haters.

 

>>1868208
don't be mad they had chicks in the group and got laid.

 

>>1817449
I guess the native americans just didn't believe in freedom hard enough then.

 

>>1871413
>accomplish nothing
>invite more government reaction and public support for antiterrorist surveillance measures
>get arrested and spend 90% of your time trying to rescue former members of your militant group
fuck the haters maaaan

 

>>1877068
>accomplish
Rightoid dog whistle, stopped reading

 

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>>1816882
Reminds me how modern activists are projecting Palestinians as their ideals

 

>>1816541
CCK Philosophy did a pretty great video about this crew recently.

 

>>1881690
>Fidel avatar
Fidel was actually a two-state solution guy. Well, they tend to see Israel as monolithic. I was watching a travel YouTuber who went to Israel soon after the war started, and he came across an anti-war demonstration where there were communist symbols, and there was also a big counter-protest crowd of hotheaded jingos. It's at 1:00 in this video. The anti-war left seems pretty marginal in Israel, but to rule out even communication with these people because they're Israeli doesn't seem rational. It also seems self-defeating and might contribute to their further marginalization. Like, don't they want to divide the enemy? That's basic tactics.


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