A thread focused on discussing the parasocial relationships cultivated by the
Almighty Algorithm to generate profit off of our atomization and society's commodification of petty internet drama.
Brace through the hyper-real lacanian void together!Reminder That None of This Is Real!™
ɢʀᴀʙ ᴀ ᴘᴀɪʀ ᴏꜰ sᴘᴇᴄᴛᴀᴄʟᴇs
—————————————————–
CORE THEORY >The Society of the Spectacle (1967) by Guy Debord📖 •
https://www.marxists.org/reference/archive/debord/society.htm📺 •
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0blWjssVoUQ
<The Work of Art in the Age of Mechanical Reproduction (1936) by Walter Benjamin📖 •
https://www.marxists.org/reference/subject/philosophy/works/ge/benjamin.htm📺 •
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=blq9sCIyXgA
>The Culture Industry from Dialectic of Enlightenment (1944) by Theodore Adorno & Max Horkheimer📓 •
https://www.marxists.org/reference/archive/adorno/1944/culture-industry.htm📖 •
https://libcom.org/article/dialectic-enlightenment-philosophical-fragments-theodor-adorno-and-marx-horkheimer📺 •
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5hSLdd8R8mY
<Understanding Media (1964) by Marshall McLuhan📖 •
https://leftypol.org/edu/src/1782045945238-0.pdf📺 •
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=09ML9n5f1fE
>One-Dimensional Man (1964) by Herbert Marcuse📖 •
https://libcom.org/article/one-dimensional-man-studies-ideology-advanced-industrial-society-herbert-marcuse📺 •
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9ZCoLbEkAqs
<Discipline and Punish (1975) by Michel Foucault📖 •
https://theanarchistlibrary.org/library/michel-foucault-discipline-and-punishment📺 •
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s82uU4iRuko
>Simulacra and Simulation (1981) by Jean Baudrillard 📖 •
https://leftypol.org/edu/src/1782045945238-1.pdf📺 •
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1Yxg2_6_YLs
<Manufacturing Consent (1988) by Edward S. Herman & Noam Chomsky📖 •
https://libcom.org/article/manufacturing-consent-political-economy-mass-media-noam-chomsky-and-edward-s-herman📺 •
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=34LGPIXvU5M
>The Sublime Object of Ideology (1989) by Slavoj Zizek📖 •
https://leftypol.org/edu/src/1782045945238-2.pdf📺 •
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TtIckkHsUQ4
<Postscript on the Societies of Control (1990) by Gilles Deleuze 📖 •
https://theanarchistlibrary.org/library/gilles-deleuze-postscript-on-the-societies-of-control📺 •
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Hu4Cq_-bLlY
>Postmodernism, or, the Cultural Logic of Late Capitalism (1991) by Fredric Jameson📖 •
https://leftypol.org/edu/src/1782045945238-3.pdf📺 •
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_4k26xGx1zI
<Spectres of Marx (1993) by Jacques Derrida📖 •
https://libcom.org/library/specters-marx-jacques-derrida📺 •
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TJr0NwXWb6Q
>Capitalist Realism (2009) by Mark Fisher📖 •
https://libcom.org/article/capitalist-realism-mark-fisher📺 •
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6Cb5XJH4NMI—————————————————–
SUPPLEMENTARY MATERIAL
>Precursor Material to Post-modernity and Critical Theory📖 •
Karl Marx - Book 1, Chapter 4 of
Economic and Philosophic Manuscripts (1844)
https://www.marxists.org/archive/marx/works/1844/manuscripts/labour.htm📺 •
Why Marx Was Right: Alienation - PlasticPills
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gPRxxN4Kh30📖 •
Georg Lukács - Chapter 4 of
History and Class Consciousness (1923)
https://www.marxists.org/archive/lukacs/works/history/hcc05.htm📺 •
Marxism After Marx: Reification - The Marxist Project
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uZiI-QKxBKI 📖 •
Antonio Gramsci - Book 1, Chapter 1 of
Selections from the Prison Notebooks (1929)
https://www.marxists.org/archive/gramsci/prison_notebooks/problems/intellectuals.htm📺 •
Hegemony: WTF? An introduction to Gramsci and cultural hegemony - Tom Nicholas
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-LI_2-qsovo📖 •
Louis Althusser -
Ideology and Ideological State Apparatuses (1970)
https://www.marxists.org/reference/archive/althusser/1970/ideology.htm📺 •
Althusser's Concept of Ideology: A Discussion with Anthony Gavin - Acid Horizon
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gtOqXxkKwvw
<Documentaries•
The Society of the Spectacle (1974) by Guy Debord
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mjF6I6SYjgA•
Manufacturing Consent (1992) by Mark Achbar & Peter Wintonick, with Noam Chomsky
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Li2m3rvsO0I•
The Pervert's Guide to Cinema (2006) and
The Pervert's Guide to Ideology (2012) by Sophie Fiennes, with Slavoj Zizek
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FYuI4SFw4g0https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oBcFLmu_tlc•
HyperNormalisation (2016) by Adam Curtis
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4bv3Tr3jvZM&rco
>Easy-Bake Breadtube (for absolute beginners)•
We're All Fake Now - Wisecrack
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RTW1mPOJJ_Y•
Are Cell Phones Replacing Reality? - PBS Idea Channel
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8AXIAM7dTTg•
The Cultural Significance of Cyberpunk - Cuck Philosophy
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Nvor7hhDKTs•
Introduction to Critical Theory for the 21st Century - Nathan Dufour
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e7stVZPGxIw•
The Work of Art in the Age of Surveillance Capitalism - Brendan Morris
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aNKiBJJFXZI
<Situationist Archives•
https://situationist.org/•
https://notbored.org/SI.html•
https://bopsecrets.org/SI/index.htm—————————————————–
RECOMMENDED OP-EDS•
I Don’t Want to Be an Internet Person by Ginevra Davis
https://www.palladiummag.com/2022/11/04/i-do-not-want-to-be-an-internet-person/•
Pluralistic: Tiktok's enshittification by Cory Doctorow
https://pluralistic.net/2023/01/21/potemkin-ai/#hey-guys•
Facebook's Threads is so depressing by Jason O. Gilbert
https://jogblog.substack.com/p/facebooks-threads-is-so-depressing>>2909701These clips aren't great but I'm not going to cast judgement until I see the whole segments.
>>2909824Oh look it's Terrence Howard 2.0!
>>2909923>These clips aren't great but I'm not going to cast judgement until I see the whole segments.They're infected with Nurgle and Slaanesh cultists. Maybe even the other two.
>>2909903God that's a lot of reading so I did not read, but you know what? You can buy consensually from lesbians!
*kiss* noice!
>>2909903I dont care for the radfem of what she has to say, but this is too larpy for my taste
>>2909903omg, are those pictures of nationalism in a very far away place where people look very different?! and from a long time ago too!??! friggin epic bacon dude!
>>2909933Wow the GPCR was just bourgeois nationalism. It couldn't have been anything more, like a world-historical advancement in the way class struggle is fought and a shining example for socialists all around the world to follow?? No, because people are Maoists only because of nationalism (or whatever pomo literary critique theory I have about the people being cattle), not because Maoist strategies are correct!
>>2909930>I dont care for the radfem of what she has to say, but this is too larpy for my tasteThe left is too idpolled to function so I just buy my privacy while I can. When I finally can't, I've got my known overdoses. I still daydream of a better more equal world though.
>>2909935This but unironically
>>2909694>>2908497third anon here, i can't really imagine giving a fuck about the historical accuracy of a hollywood movie. these people are scumbags and will never care about such things. the ruling ideas are the ideas of the ruling class, and the odyssey itself is ancient propaganda from the perspective of the Aegean ruling class, and was already being told 500 years after the alleged legend took place. regarding the aesthetic philosophy of adapting such material in general… I'd say the documentary approach of maximizing historical accuracy is nice to see, but very rare, very hard to pull off, and audiences generally don't care. As long as entertainment is made for profit you are never going to get the documentary style. The style of exaggerating things, changing things, and caring more about what audiences think looks cool than historical accuracy will probably always dominate; even in the period of the renaissance, the great masters made paintings of biblical subjects standing in renaissance italian clothing, and standing around renaissance italian buildings. Why? because these were for popular consumption, and both the church and the great artists knew that biblical propaganda would "stick" better if dressed in contemporary garb.
>>2909872A particular Muslim invented Algebra. Algebra was invented by Al Khwarizmi. The Latinization of his name was Algorithmus from which we get the word "Algorithm." He wrote "The Concise Book of Calculation by Restoration and Balancing" which in Arabic is called " al-Kitāb al-Mukhtaṣar fī Ḥisāb
al-Jabr wal-Muqābalah". From the words highlighted we get "Algebra". In latin the title of the book was "Liber Algebræ et Almucabola"
The book was a compilation and extension of known rules for solving quadratic equations and for some other problems, and considered to be the foundation of algebra, establishing it as an independent discipline. Prior to Al Khwarizmi, in the "west," the approach to problems we now think of as "algebraic" were dealt with using geometrical methods.
>>2909694>There's really no reason that Helen can't be black even if you "stick to the original" because there are black characters in the Iliad and Herodotus makes a big deal about the beauty and youthfulness of the Aethiopians.There's a bit of a plurality in aesthetic and beauty to be honest. Asian women just shake the background radiation for me. It's the Truth that I would surrender my marrow for and fuck the heretics and the disbelievers.
>>2909950>third anon here, i can't really imagine giving a fuck about the historical accuracy of a hollywood movie. these people are scumbags and will never care about such things. the ruling ideas are the ideas of the ruling class, and the odyssey itself is ancient propaganda from the perspective of the Aegean ruling class, and was already being told 500 years after the alleged legend took place.Fear of chaos and peace are the only appeals the booj ever had. Understand the wisdom of the cow and the sheep.
>>2909824>>2909839>>2909840I'm feeling like 10 things right now
- it tucker unironically a psy op to make anti-zionism look stupid by associating it with cranks who think knowing basic math makes you a "goy slave?"
- to answer the question, we use letters to encapsulate variables and constants, to show that a particular approach to a problem works even when you substitute different numbers. It's used to generalize. It's basically a way of saying "substitute this letter with any number you can think of and the problem will still work". It's like when you see a socket in the wall. "plug any compatible device here and I will give that device electricity." that's the power of abstraction and encapsulation. It allowed you to make statements that are very general but also very rigorous and true.
- yes i agree math is often taught very badly by people who lack the linguistic and social skills to simplify concepts or explain them in plain english. this is because hyperspecialization makes cripples of all of us. i can go into that more if you like.
>>2909957>I'm feeling like 10 things right nowThere's a matrix and factions are dumping tons of shit into it. Sorry but the early 2000's redpill was 100% right about things before it got invaded by the rightoids
>>2909889You fail to appreciate how far behind the average is when you get deep into subjects and rabbit holes. There's a word for it… "normie".
>>2909961>I'm feeling like 10 things right now>There's a matrixSamefag but… It's to do with the nature of knowledge. What we can do has surpassed what we can see without interference so there will be some rattling. For the record, I'm cishet and a material essentialist when it comes to organic beings. "Data beings" are something else whether they're digital or something else because I don't know them.
>>2909701The idea of a "fat genocide" makes me crack up, like how does that look like? People are just morbidly obese anymore and force too live a bit more healthy?!
>>2909965>The idea of a "fat genocide" makes me crack up, like how does that look like?Ask the people that represent the left by virtue of Academia, MSM and the social media.
>>2909965It's when you tell people not to be fat
>>2909975How fat is too fat?
>>2909976depends on the person
>>2909976BMI of 30 or more.
Japan has a fat tax for these people, it makes sense. With nationalized medicine fatties have more problems. They also most likely consume more calories than the equivalent amount of labor they did.
I am a fatty in the west. I know my ills, I will put the fork down inshallah
>>2909982No you won't. You'll lose your pelvis to gout before you do.
I know it's left/pol/ but is being unabashedly cishet just incorrect here?
>>2909982>Japan has a fat tax no it doesnt
>>2909595This is where I confess I didn't really like engaging in Kirk memery, the guy died in a truly horrific way. But seeing how flustered these guys get by having the exact same meme in their face for over a year makes me want to bully them.
>>2909718I like how the bottom guy implies he has studied the benefits of data centers deeply and isn't operating on terminal contrarianism
>>2910021>the guy died in a truly horrific wayHe died about as painlessly and trauma-lessly as it's possible to die. His soul left his body before he was out of the chair.
>>2909889Am I the only one who sees "being unfit and unhealthy is valid" as a totally transparent cope meant to make people accept not getting healthcare?
>>2909982>Be fat as fuck>Die early of heart disease >State doesn't have to sponsor the 30+ unproductive years of your lifeThey are brave warriors benefitting the welfare state just like smokers
>>2910032At best its cope by fatties who don't want to feel pressure to lose weight. At worst it's pushed by medical and food porkies to get people to consume more and be more dependent on medication. The idea that capitalism requires and demands physical fitness and disciplines those who don't conform is obvious nonsense. Were there any truth to that then America wouldn't be the fattest society in human history. Capitalism needs workers to be just healthy enough to do their jobs and consume for long enough to generate profits. Beyond that capitalism is at best indifferent to health since both obesity and fitness are lifestyles that facilitate consumption of commodities. Capitalism can accommodate both. The real stupidity of the whole "the more dysgenic the better" nonsense is in thinking that revolutionary struggle doesn't require physically fit people, or that it's not something society and individuals should strive for to the best of their abilities.
>>2910032>Am I the only one who sees "being unfit and unhealthy is valid" as a totally transparent cope meant to make people accept not getting healthcare?Money buys bro
>>2910031Chad to chad communication
>>2910028>I like how the bottom guy implies he has studied the benefits of data centers deeply and isn't operating on terminal contrarianism'merican degrees with majors and minors
Literally everything gets infected by chaos cultists… I'm dipping out of this reality. Bye guys.
>>2909897>I'm pretty sure that the guys hauling artillery and anti-aircraft guns up mountains at Dien Bien Phu had a modicum of physical fitness.It's funny you mention that because I got my ass kicked by a Vietnamese kid in the 9th grade. He knocked me out cold actually. But there's a point I'm going with this.
>>2909848>she makes the point that you shouldn't try to "get fit" because that's just playing by the beauty standards set by capitalism. the obvious counterpoint to this is … I'm pretty sure she paid more for that haircut that I paid for food last monthA lot of stuff in these arguments tend to revolve around aesthetics even if people aren't saying that. Because these people can actually play with their appearance in a pretty elaborate way. Then on the other end, you have communists who want to look big and strong and masculine because that's what they think hardass Marxist-Leninists should look like according to Soviet propaganda posters. But I'll just say the Vietnamese kid who kicked my ass was skinny as hell. He hit hard though.
It's hard to look like chad if you're Asian. But my point is that appearances can be deceptive. I think people are also probably way too neurotic about image now because of social media with cameras everywhere and people trying to be influencers. It somewhat reminds me of right-wing survivalist stuff where you need to have all this stuff to make it through the apocalypse and if you look bad and act bad then people will treat you as bad. But they would just be hopeless in a really tough situation compared to a Somali girl who is only carrying a toothbrush. Also the other point I want to make is don't fuck with Vietnamese people.
>>2909606>Why are right-wing accounts suddenly nostalgic for Puddle of Mudd, one of the worst bands of the 2000s? There's a right-wing meme that Nickelback losing popularity is a psyop by the CIA to demoralize white people. I couldn't believe it at first. Like no way, this is just too stupid. But it's a real belief among a very boomer, Q-adjacent chud. It's funny too because these bands were overplayed so heavily on the radio after corporate consolidation of FM radio stations. Also the music got toned down to safe-edgy after 9/11.
>>2910207>Nickelback losing popularityI never liked this soy commercialized post-grunge bullshit. All these bands sound the same.
>>2910207Nickelback was THE meme band to hate with imagine dragons and now cardi B lol
>>2909897All such discourse is abstract and pointless unless had in the context of concrete revolutionary organizing. "what do we as socialists mean by fitness" can only be answered in the context of what is rewuired for orgsnization
"What is fitness, like, geberally" is a bourgeois mode of inquiry because it implicitly assumes a kind of shared social milieu and ontology, a markeyplace of ideas, whatever you want to call it, as if we are all participants of this shared discourse about "our" society, when in fact we're just rearranging symbols within the bourgeois milieu.
>>2909701I absolutely believe this crap is CIA.
>>2909950>third anon here, i can't really imagine giving a fuck about the historical accuracy of a hollywood movie.I don't and you shouldn't, at least if it's not depicting actual historical events with the intention of saying "this is how it actually happened." None of the people pretending to care about the historical correctitude of Helen's heckin skin color really give a shit either. I was just pointing out that there isn't any textual or historical reason not to make any hot lady or femboy play Helen.
>>2909956Instead of randomly banning people for " sectarianism" for making fun of random irrelevant leftist tendency #42666, can wr ban this retard for being cringe instead?
I'm feeling so much fucking rage lately, I got in so many stupid arguments online today because of something shitty that happened at work, I just can't deal with the unfairness of the fucking world, the right keep winning and they're too fucking dumb to even appreciate it, I'm so tired
>>2910255They need to sell that merch
>>2910241>Instead of randomly banning people for " sectarianism" for making fun of random irrelevant leftist tendency #42666Ahaha, you too? Mods are on a roll.
Non-sectarian rule is retarded anyway, why should I be forced to never make fun of something that goes completely against something I believe just because they call themselves "leftist".
"Non-sectarianism" & "left unity" always means a victory for the most right deviationists
>>2910250"Junk food" not being a thing is probably true. Since your body doesn't care where nutrients, carbs, calories etc. comes from, but I'm not sure how they can argue that being overweight/fat isn't an inherent health risk? Also I would think consuming in moderation, AKA: Managing your weight would be anti-capitalist since you are literally controlling your consumption. Even though this entire line of questioning is useless since this is the most COINTELPRO shit I've ever seen.
>>2910262"Food is food" ignores that some foods have increased cancer risks associated to their consumption such as sausages etc
>>2910194you have reading comprehension issues. the point is not that she has an expensive haircut, but that she having a expensive haircut implies an admission that conforming to beauty standards can be useful for spreading a message
>>2909897and yet the vast majority of movements have given some attention to physical appearance. it's common sense, I don't think anyone in the left was saying that you have to be like clavicular to give a speech or join a union, but there is an "operational baseline" so to speak
>>2910262it kind of does though. one thing that you have to understand about chemistry and biology is that there is a lot of guesswork and simplification involved, it isn't like math or software where you deal with "pure" abstract objects. nothing is just the calories and the macros that you see listed on the packaging
>>2910262There is an entire science to junk food and making it as junky as possible so people eat as much as possible. This kind of discourse only makes sense if you pretend capitalism doesn't exist.
>>2910262>>2910309>"Junk food" not being a thing is probably true.i do think we should quadruple down on the "simple carbs" thing. like people really really need to understand our brain is wired for this shit instead of moralizing individual consumption and framing it as simple carbs is a better intuition than just saying "it's bad" in loose terms.
>>2910311yes and no; even in those circumstances you usually had the party cadres trying to uphold an image because it gives legitimacy. and this relates to something that I have seen some people here misunderstand and that is a more interesting topic:
joining a vanguard party means that you're willing to be a leader, even if just at a low level. now, given the current circumstances in most of the world, you most probably won't. but the mindset should still be that your job is to lead, so you should look and behave the part. this also implies, unfortunately, that some people aren't fit for being party cadres, even if they are sympathetic to the cause, and there is nothing wrong with being just a supporter
>>2910327It's not just the human biology part (though that is a factor). It's that food supply is controlled by businesses, and they make more money if they feed you nasty slop full of empty calories that gets you addicted.
>>2910255leftypol xitter shares content from *checks notes* leftypol
>>2910347I stole those pics from the 'gram tho
>>2909701I'm doing 50 push-ups right now while I ignore retarded shit like this
>>2909606why do people bitch and moan about underground concerts and music? there is still an underground scene you dummies, and if you think it sucks now I have news for you, it sucked before too.
>>2910380wrong. obeSSe ameriklans are the vanguard of Treatlerism.
>>2910380you can be fit and unemployed, I say this as a fit and unemployed person, you don't need to go to a gym just lift your own weight and go for long walks.
capital and work makes people fat, most workaholics I know are also big into food, big into overconsumption of media too, they need a dopamine release from the hell of work, you should take advantage of your unemployment and consume less, you don't need money to meditate, you don't need money to exercise, you do need money to get a 35 piece chicken bucket.
>>2909701>fat bodies>black fleshdehumanization, but woke
also I really fucking hate how wokies misuse the term genocide. "trans genocide", "fat genocide", "autistic genocide", "deaf genocide" etc as if people with these conditions are nations unto themselves. you might as well say "peasant genocide" like proponents of hoholdomor do
>>2910403We should enable chud genocide tho
>>2910404tru. total holochudor now
>>2910403TO BE FAIR marx said:
"Doubtless, Ricardo's language is as cynical as can be. To put the cost of manufacture of hats and the cost of maintenance of men on the same plane is to turn men into hats. But … the cynicism is in the facts, and not in the words which express the facts."
>>2910406I feel something is lost if you just say stuff that way without making a remark like Marx's here
>>2910408That is true, in marx there is an implicit immanent posdibility of man who is no longer hats, or man who could have been something but hats
In afropessimism there is no such thing, everything is flesh and body, from the perspective of capital, but apparently there is no other outlook but capital's
>>2910435he does mention jewish guys like lyor coen right off the bat in the video. But you cant deny the cia And mi5s involvement with this stuff either
>>2910325this is actually really well made lol
>>2910179>>2910176Can someone explain what is this shit?
Is this done on purpose like they specifically pick the dumbest motherfuckers on the planet to talk about irrelevant shit like fitness and body positivity to stir up some mud and drama or something?
It’s already an uphill battle in general because rightoids relentlessly spam anti-woke shit via hundreds of sloptube channels and now you gotta give them more ammo with your irrelevant hot takes about lifting weights. Damn.
>>2909074MAJOR
LACERATION
DETECTED
>>2910521>specificallyI meant deliberately
>>2910463Happy Kirkversary Frogan.
>>2910522>>2909074it's more like
MAJOR
BLOOD
LOSS
DETECTED
>>2910445wholesome recovery
>>2910521It's probably CIA Plants to make "Socialisim"/leftiism look bad. The "Socialist" parties in the USA has been infiltrated by feds for years.
>>2910730cool it with the felixite remarks
>>2910521>>2910730There's thousands of these people though. A whole cottage industry of writers and academics. I think it's way more "Portlandia." You sound like guys discovering feminist lesbians for the first time. They like to talk about being fat in really elaborate ways and are also drawn to socialist organizations like bees to honey. That specific conference called "Socialism 101" is a bit weird as a name because it's actually a publishing house called Haymarket Books, which used to be intermixed with the ISO, which was a socialist organization (and a very college student oriented one) but they dissolved seven years ago.
A funny thing that happens is it all gets jumbled up. Like if you saw this Republican midterm thing last night, they would show a rapid-fire image of someone at a protest holding a hamsick flag and a LGBT flag, then the ACP, then some Trots, then the CPUSA, and then finally *bam* there's the pic of Hasan in his underwear like he's the mastermind behind the whole thing lmao. Of course the people in those groups also dislike each other and they're plants to make the other ones look bad but in the right-wing imagination it's all just one big swirling morass of threats to the holy spirit.
>>2910521well the half black half jewish lady saying we need to make settler colonialism only about white people literally advertises herself as a freelance speaker and includes disney as a previous client so that's the caliber of people they have giving talks at this thing
>>2910809>video is a thinly veiled overview of the peter theil matrixyeah, nothing to worry about here, go back to sleep soyboy
>>2910913whatd you do this time?
>>2910913I too wish the internet gave me money for free, good luck with that
>>2910915Namefag here with an edgy left commentary website, erikhoudini.com. On trial for allegedly threatening Kaitlin Bennett, has-been rightoid e-celeb, with a tweet (I think) about Charlie Kirk.
I don't have any cash spare to donate to this, but I think if you do you should chip in. We should protect our own no matter what their specific left politics. Once upon a time we had a sprawling legal defense network, International Red Aid, that would pay the bail and provide free legal support for persecuted leftists; it fell apart because it started discriminating against first anarchists and then opposition factions in the CPUSA.
>>2911039>he thinks you can just change internet nicknameyou will never escape your old nicknames
>>2911039Sirs a second philosophy cuck has hit youtube…
>>2911039Ain't nobody calling bro anything other then nastyenchilada 🤣
>>2911039what's his next name? reactynada?
>>2910806He says it himself in the video but there's nothing else to really say about that circle, he's just repeating himself at this point.
Anyway, is Midnight Gospel good? I've had people recommend it to me.
>>2911349It’s also not as funny as when Redbar or Ben Avery hate on the austin scene and make all the same points
>>2911229This is a strange concerted campaign. That guy in your NBC news video has just appeared now, out of nowhere, suddenly is in every mainstream news live interview. Whoever is pushing this, they made it obvious. Why? I'm still trying to figure it out if it is just a diversion or if someone is about to present a project detrimental to the US AI project and the mainstream media will air something stupid based on what that guy is saying.
>>2911334how could you possibly interpret toughen up as the first meaning, what a retarded xeet
500 bushels of wheat or dinner with the King?
>>2911395How are you gonna carry 500 bushels home? I don’t the king or his knights are going to deliver it. Do you even have the storage space? A still to make liquor
>>2911334>Yet another TRVKE for suicide prevention month.Why isn't MAiD just common sense by now?
>>2911591The 3rd world is a mirror of the future of the USA
>>2911039Works well, good for him.
Looking forward to the Krauts and Ethan KKKleins
and Hasans of the tubes trying to seriously explain Yakub lore to their audiences.Then pedantically uphold calling somebody with a perfectly normal name which rolls off the tongue, "Bad Empanada" instead… Whom they autistically insist is the "real name" of the leader of an international "tankie" gang-stalking operation against them.
>>2911015Goodness yes, thanks anon!
>>2911039>>2911093>>2911416In wrestling you can make a goofy gimmick name work by usually shortening it or using a variation. Rocky Maivia became The Rock and Hunter Hearst Helmsley became Triple H. When a wrestler gives themselves a full name changes, the fans won’t accept it. I think he should have shortened the name to Emp or something.
Why do Western progressive leftists, and Progressive liberals focus so much on attacking on J.K. Rowling while avoiding discussions about the Israeli-Palestinian conflict and the problems caused by capitalism?
>>2911687What the algorithms pushes on your front page might not be fully representative to what people actually talk about.
>>2911268Lmao that's awesome
>>2911687What's about doing the former that stops you from doing the latter ?
>>2911334huge TRVKE, I will never lick the boot, I will never let a customer give me shit without talking shit back, I will never let my boss disrespect me, fire me, I dare you.
>>2911671its because he doesn't have a cuck mentality like Putin or Zelensky
>>2911671He's a world class schemer. Possibly the best at it and also probably the best at making himself as ominous as possible like you said. Just look at all the stuff he's implicated in without even covering it up. Just imagine the things he may be hiding?
>>2911394Some classcucks probably saying thoughen up when you dare complain about a job i guess.
>>2911842I mean it doesn't matter what was the original context. It was a poor choice of words and an irrelevant topic to discuss.That was also deeply unprofessional.
Right now you cannot afford to say random shit that might have more than one meaning. I get that she's probably is writing a paper on that topic, but come on, think of the bigger picture for once, not everything revolves around your PhD.
>>2911842The "context" doesn't add anything.
She still said that being dysgenic is good, actually.
Let her get clowned. Stop the white-knighting.
I think the proper take would be
>ableism is bad
>doesn't mean everyone should be dysgenic
>in fact we should research that shit find ways to fix genetic diseases to help those who suffer from them, and in the future prevent it from happening
>we should do that instead of promoting gymcel bullshit
>>2911849That's reasonable to most, but if you asked these disability activists whether or not they would cure their ailments, they would decline it. They derive their entire sense of personhood from their disability.
>>2911842I don't need to defend dumbass academiaslop just because right-wing reactionaries are shitting on it. I don't really care if people want to have talks for their stupid social science "research" where they've named some new oppression, but I will not take it seriously.
One of these people said that fat people are being genocided by glp-1s, a completely ridiculous take that is maybe even harmful as leftists need to be able to clearly call out actual genocides happening due to imperialism without seeming like dupes who call everything genocide. (I notice he didn't cover this one.) The other one basically said that disabled people have revolutionary potential and should not be left out. An entirely obvious conclusion to anyone who spent 30 seconds engaging in mass politics, but nevertheless this lady has given a special extra silly name to this idea for her research. I don't think she's a bad person or anything, and probably genuinely wants to help people, but this just happens when you get way too into academia.
>>2911671He is really really boring. If he wasn't such a monster no one would give af about him
>>2911889It might be interesting if a show was made about the time he was a hot shot chemist when he was banging that one chick he was still lusting over later on.
>>2911229Silly Cone Valley is interested in hyping AI as the best thing and worst thing ever, trying to keep the bubble from bursting, is all.
>>2911889Gonna guess this is a prequel film taking place before Breaking Bad with young WALTHU
>>2911842>uhm, she never said that you shouldn't be fit<"The more dysgenic the better"ok bro
>>2909521>dysgenic behaviorsay what you mean by that
>>2911850>They derive their entire sense of personhood from their disability.yeah well if you're so mentally disabled you're shitting your pants and nonverbal at thirty I doubt you would derive a sense of personhood from it
>>2912182Gonna depend heavily on your perspective, some who were born deaf and get hearing aids will be blown away by listening to music for the first time but then later take them out to experience true silence again.
>>2911390>>2911229>>2911241Alright, AI companies are calling for a "slow down" (bernards framing, not exactly that) of the development of AI. It seems they are looking for a regulatory barrier, for Chinese AI, which they will describe as uncontrollable.
There. It was a concerted campaign as I expected. And we will see even bernard sanders saying that Chinese AI must be banned in the future and voting for it because the US ones "halted", while the Chinese didn't, despite he's proposing a Xi-Trump symmetric biding, arms-control style.
Let me explain, after the concerted campaign was issued Amodei proposed (read more than this:
https://www.bbc.com/news/articles/c14dpgm0rg4o):
The regulatory model Amodei is issuing don't address open-source models at all. The embedded-evaluator mechanism targets closed-source frontier labs by construction. You cannot embed an evaluator in a weights release. So if closed development paces and open development doesn't, the competitive effect runs entirely one way, and Amodei doesn't engage with it. This is intentional, so the plan here is to set up a FINRA-style regulatory framework and then ban open weights as intrinsically noncompliant with safety regulations
I side with LeCun and Casado: A protective ban of this type would be a defeat dressed as a defense.
It was too obvious.
the democrats where already on the verge of regulating big tech during the biden years. but then trump won and trump doesnt care about anything but making money so he is basically a tech accelerationist.
Regulating big tech or not will be a big issue in the 2028 election. Its a platform that makes democrats hype and feel like they are doing something
>>2910987Praise be to our Gabec.
>>2911842How exactly does the context change anything? Why would you defend these retarded-ass takes just because these people are nominally on the left? Fuck em
>>2912241<The market has priced in AGI. 2 trillion dollars have been poured into reaching AGI as the end game. Apple bowed out of the AI arms race because their research showed LLM models are fundamentally flawed and can’t do real independent reasoning. Now, if you’re one of the companies that have invested into AGI but found out it’s not possible. What do you do? Admit AGI isn’t possible, your company becomes worthless/bought out for pennies on the dollar? Or doo you continue to hype AGI and kick the can down the road? Of course the latter. The PR story is, we’re slowing down progress for “safety concerns.” Doing it slow and controlled to ensure safety. Very convenient storyline for a company desperate to continue to drive hype around AGI without having to show real progression. They need to keep this act up until they IPO. They’re working together to drive this narrative because they know it’ll all come crashing down if they show any sign of weakness/AGI isn’t possible.t. Some guy on tiktok, I think this is an interesting angle
>>2912245>because they just couldn't admit that china is socialist.And because all that energy that the 2008 butthurt crash was creating had to go somewhere. So the answer is to denounce the Tumblrinas and stuffy CIA intellectuals which by now were more like squatters on the ruins of the left they had wrecked. While exalting the Professional-Activist-Who-Does-Stuff.
The era of keeping people off class politics by denouncing "Stalinism" is over because the USSR is GONE. You cannot denounce the organizational structure, when none exist, without tempting the creation of one. It's time to provide the masses with an alternative framing for the compatible left and how to organize themselves in the least effective way possible.
It's okay to abandon class lines and collaborate with those "apolitical" Professional Activists. Because afterall,
it is all IN LE HEAD when it comes to defeating capitalism, so communists and WEF Progressives share one struggle towards "breaking the psyop".
So go get your philantropy bags and your marxoid grants and welcome to the reopened market with a high demand for compatible leftoids.
>>2912256>high demand for compatible leftoids.Not much more is "compatible left" for capitalism then china is
>>2912245if china is socialist, what about singapore, malaysia, poland, germany, france? is socialism when the government does stuff?
>>2912245>if you read about Vietnamese or Afghan historyafghan history is positive towards china the retard running this account forgot that it was america and the ussr and not china that invaded afghanistan lmfao. as for vietnamese history why not cambodian history? the dispute between china and vietnam generally falls down to cambodia and pol pot. it was vietnam that invaded cambodia and china that intervented defensively in response. this is the equivalent to running to americans to hear their side of the Iraq invasion instead of the iraqs. yet again leftypol mods proving that they're chauvinist imperialists.
>>2912283wrong. if that were the case western states would not spend so much money and time smearing china and telling everyone to hate china.
>>2912284yes. literally read the communist manifesto you brainlet.
>>2912284No it's when socialists are in charge of the government and the ruling class is the working class.
Singapore, france are ruled by technocratic oligarchy and financial elite
Malaysia is a monarchy
Germany is ruled by the transnational capital
Poland is ruled by the comprador elites (just like Ukraine) - essentially it's neocolonialism. Poles can cope as much as they want but the fact is that they have some of the largest factories in their country like Bosch and Siemens.
I've never heard of a Polish brand of washing machines or Polish cars, have you?
>>2912299Marx didn’t consider socialist commodities
>>2912299The first two screenshots are literally arguments against considering China to be under a socialist mode of production. The second is an immediate program of reform to rally around in 1848. Though I will admit that the Chinese model of land ownership is pretty much better and closer to socialism than pretty much the entire rest of the world
>>2912299How the hell do you read the first two and think it supports the China=socialism thesis
Is Microsoft socialist because it's in competition with Apple? China being a threat to American hegemony does not mean they are doing socialism, neither does doing protectionist state capitalism. Capitalist classes fight each other all the fucking time, so by that metric Iran is socialist, so is Russia, loads of LatAm too I'm guessing, sprinkled with some EU states even. We have worldwide socialism after all! X is true because America says Y! Is absolute cuckbehavior.
I don't care that much about china try to have a very "guess we'll see" mentality toward it, but all this dickriding of online leftists just stems from the hope that somebody will do the revolution for them without them having to lift a finger. All want socialism and owning the means of production, but actually sacrificing anything at all for it is too much. At this point Western leftism is as meaningless as a T-shirt with Che on it, a meaningless subgroup identifier.
>>2912324This is the most bizarre thing I have EVER seen
>>2912336marx was not a genetic determinist (especially within the assumptions of the video) and the recounting of historical materialism offered by the creator of this video is vulgarized. if i heard someone say that the movement of history is the struggle of phenotypes claiming it to be marxism irl i would smack them with a slipper
>>2912338Nowhere does Biological Realism claim to be "Marxism"; it is using a Marxist conceptual framework. The content creator is a Darwinist, and Marx anticipated Darwinism in his own writings.
>Marx was not a genetic deterministGenes were not yet discovered in Marx's time, so he couldn't be one.
Nonetheless, Marx saw that it is material conditions which are the basis of all ideas. In Dawkins' notion of extended phenotypes, the gene acts as the primary material substrate of all further cognition.
>>2912245whoever runs the leftypol twitter is a fucking retard
>>2912241Part of that same "slowdown". They (chatgpt, anthropic, grok) can't catch up with open models (Chinese models) so, they are not going public for the same reason. Still, make no mistake, they are at the top of the AI market in the US are US AI models markets. The are losing the technological battle, so they, the winners, want what winners usually do: lobby for barriers to entry in the same market. They want a segmented market, as much as the auto industry is.
It was insane how that whistleblower was everywhere.
>>2912245the NAFO left strikes again
>>2912346le alt-right was never dadaist
Reminder that the red-blue alliance known as the western/NAFO left starts with the FDR/Stalin situationship, cope and seethe tankiddies.
>>2912375stalin never supported nato thobeit
nato was only formed after ww2 to counter stalin
>>2912331>Politics can only be understood in light of its biological basis<There are millions of examples of families (which you would think would have the most similar genes) having sharply diverging political viewpoints though?>um well um um uhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh there I saved everyone from watching a 31 minute of video full of cope that cannot counter that simple point.
>>2912388A contradiction of the essentialist view is also that they attribute a type of brainwashing to all people who disagree with them; ideas are seen as inherent, so anything else must be nurtured. The contradiction in the video is that it attributes no agency to nurture, but only to genetic programming. The hypothesis hinges on the notion of environmental factors having no precedence in determining activity, yet divergence must be explained by external causes, as you write. It's a deductive issue. The person who takes an either/or position fails.
>>2912398if that is the case then arab resistance against israel is also stalin's fault.
>>2912307>>2912327Production of surplus value is not the direct aim and motive of production in china. Because the economy is controlled top down by a communist party duh.
Whuch means china doesn't fall under marx's definition of capitalism.
>>2912203it's fine, banning chinese AI, to the extent that you can even do that, is the ultimate poison pill. you're putting your entire tech sector at risk to protect a special interest group made of like 3 CEOs. like imagine you were competing against indians that cost a fraction of the price, now the difference will be even more steep when they have access to the cheap kimi models and you dont. especially devastating if it's due to a "slow down" (AKA we reached the theoretical limits of the technology). it's good. great even.
>>2912480South Korea and Taiwan in the second half of the 20th century weren't capitalist either in that case
>>2912569you don't understand what dadaism is, burger
>>2912373The one correct take in that entire c9nference and all the DSA-ite "respectability" social fascists come out in support of eugenics lmao
Being on the same side as Agent Kochinski should give you pause
>>2912591crazy that what would have been a milquetoast take on biopolitics in 2018 or so would become so contentious when trying to correct for "woke" politics.
>>2912591>>2912373>The one correct take in that entire c9nference why does nobody else clock that the stuff she said in that clip is obviously written by an LLM?
<"It's not just X, it's Y"<can't keep a consistent definition of "fitness" and instead conflates at least 3 distinct ideas: exercising/training, utility to capitalism, and eugenics >>2912575Korea was anti-capitalist from 1910 until the Park Chung Hee's CIA Assassination
>>2912608Who cares about them and what do they have to do with is? They are on their own, they have nothing to do with us.
>>2912288>afghan history is positive towards chinafor helping the us send guns to the mujahideen to fight against a socialist government yes
>>2912601you're making a broad accusation based on a 10 second clip sourced from an agent kochinsky video
<can't keep a consistent definition of "fitness" and instead conflates at least 3 distinct ideas: exercising/training, utility to capitalism, and eugenicsdo you think MAHA, the underlying target in the whole conference, has a consistent definition of fitness, retard?
>>2912203>>2912243>>2912343A big part of this might be the physical constraints they've been running into. Even if their very optimistic estimation of more datacenter line go up forever is true those things take like 5 years to build. And the biggest problem, the energy grid can't support them, even after they've started burning tables and chairs in coal generators.
So let the frog cook a bit.
Idk they have the most supportive (read non caring) administration they could possibly want on that front though.
>>2912618>Idk they have the most supportive (read non caring) administrationthe thing is that they need an admin which is capable of long-term thinking. they need to walk back on rampant privatization and literally make the government do things, those things being a historically unprecedented effort to modernize the electrical grid. so they, ironically, need an admin that cares lol.
>>2912615>you're making a broad accusation based on a 10 second clip sourced from an agent kochinsky videoNo it's from watching the talk. Why would I watch a V–sh video?
>MAHAThe start of the infamous clip she's specifically talking about ideas the left has about fitness. She goes on to claim that these are inseparable from eugenics.
>retardhashtag not very woke of you
Apparently a guy was selling tickets for a fight with a chimp in tiktok? And the guy scammed everyone with the tickets? they were sold with cryptos on a website? And just when the date when the event was supposed to happen arrived the website disappeared?
And hten the guy appeared with a “Get rugged” t-shirt?
https://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/sports/mma/news/get-rugged-mma-fighter-cole-johnson-left-fans-stunned-with-his-chimp-fight-claim-as-the-truth-took-an-unexpected-turn/articleshow/134104357.cmsDamn too many stupid people in burgerrican.
>>2912621>The start of the infamous clip she's specifically talking about ideas the left has about fitness.you'd think the communist board would be wary of liberal socdems reproducing the logic of capital as it co-opts and blurs the difference between wellness, aesthetics and productivity instead of whining about wokeness or whatever based on the framing of my favorite pedophile youtuber. this is a pretty milquetoast take, and the fact that it's getting so much pushback is so fucking sad, but also revealing on how much DSA politics have succeeded in their task of diluting socialist politics into technocratic liberalism.
>No it's from watching the talkyou didnt watch shit, you got the same clip fed from the same circuit of hasan piker and Agent Kochinski commentocrats. you literally fell for one of these stupid xitter astroturfed discourses, embarrassing, i can't imagine being this retarded tbh, is this what 10 hours of twitter a day looks like
>>2912625>you'd think the communist board would be wary of liberal socdems reproducing the logic of capital as it co-opts and blurs the difference between wellness, aesthetics and productivity instead of whining about wokeness or whateverShe says outright that the idea of fitness is itself eugenic, after wrapping up various distinct concepts into a ball, and goes on to say "the more dysgenic the better." She's the one who's reproducing fascist ideology.
>milquetoastWhy do all the defenders of this shit keep using this exact word? The bigger picture of the talk covering eugenics being ingrained in capitalism is true, but none of it changes that what she says in that part of it is a terrible take and concedes huge amounts of ground to fascism. Her defenders can't even agree on what it is she means, only that if a career activist is speaking, you better not criticize their theory.
>>2912625>you'd think the communist boardthis is leftypol doe
>>2912601Those concepts *are* ideologically conflated under capitalism doe.
But I think I agree with the broader point that she's concedeng the ground to eugenic ideology by being reactive: fascists take position X, we take opposite position.
This is still on the eugenic plane, the point is to articulate a positive programme for proletarian "fitness", but that project only has meaning as part of concrete revolutionary organizing and those are soccdem akkademics, so they can only do abstract navel gazing discourse that reproduces hegemonic thought, lol
>>2912636>Those concepts *are* ideologically conflated under capitalism doe.>But I think I agree with the broader point that she's concedeng the ground to eugenic ideologyYes that's what I mean - by accepting and going with that conflation she is just reinforcing the bundling of all these things instead of engaging in a struggle dialectically to separate the good from the bad. Like how it's very important for us to take care of our (and each others') health.
>This is still on the eugenic plane, the point is to articulate a positive programme for proletarian "fitness",It's not even that, if you want to subvert the eugenicist ideology you can't just adopt its categories and flip the valence. Instead of saying something like "the more dysgenic the better" the line should be that everyone is dysgenic because the ideals of perfect genes simply don't exist and trying to approach that ideal would entail inbreeding. If you want to additionally argue for a positive program of health and fitness and the promotion of health, that's also good, but it's not even really the problem with the talk.
It's more that they bring up how capitalism is destroying public health in various ways but then they take MAHA and fitfluencer bro science type ideology as *the* ideology of capitalism which is just not true. Capitalism is at best indifferent to public health, and sometimes actively hostile. The belief that capitalism is eugenic in the sense of trying to promote people attaining an ideal (instead of simply as a means to discriminate against people) is just wrong. To then position a positive programme for healthiness ("the fantasy of being fitter than the fascists") as simply going with the flow of that ideology rather than pushing against the current is to just get backwards what's happening.
>>2912575RoK and RoC were not a socialist republic with a communist party in charge. That's literally the difference.
>>2912643We call him GoP now, chud.
>>2912647>Socialism is not a mode of production or the revolutionary doctrine of the proletariat. It's basically just vibes and red flags bro, if you believe you're socialist then you totally are!SStaliniSSm was a mistake
>>2912653being obtuse is liberalism.
>>2912653you're just a crypto-kautskyite. the dotp is what makes a state socialist, read lenin
i'm going to give you one better: even if a state abolishes commodity production and the law of value within its borders, it wouldn't be socialist unless a leninist party was in charge of it
>>2912655an state dictated by the workers yes.
>picsholy non arguments batman.
>>2912656>a leninist party was in charge of itIt doesn't need to be a
leninist party, only a formation of the class conscious proletariat be that a party or not.
>>2912656like
>>2912660 said it doesn't need to be a leninist party, it's just that historically it were leninist parties that made actual revolutions.
any class conscious prole organization will do to be a dotp and socialist.
>>2912656Leninism has a zero percent success rate in Europe and America
>>2912666not really, no other actual leftist ideology made such impact in europe and america.
if you said Sucessful revolutions then you would be right.
A DOTP makes no sense because communism is the proletariat abolishing itself, the nature of any dictatorship is self preservation at all costs, in this case meaning the preservation of class distinctions lest the proletarian police put themselves out of a job by physically removing all the bourgeois and lumpen.
>>2912668Your own homeboy Lenin said “all else but power is illusory”, where have Leninists in the first world had power? A couple of elected seats? Being parliamentary remora on social democrats and trade unions that the Chinese broke?
>>2912666As opposed to other communist tendencies which have achieved plenty in the west…
>>2912671Perhaps it’s time for an entirely new tendency
>>2912245>china is socialistAnon, thinking that
is a quintessential example of leftoids hitting a total theoretical dead end. You are what you think your naysayers are, you are just to stupid/deperately ignorant to realize it.
>leftypol twitter capTop post is them stating a completely obvious fact.
Lower post is them is also stating a completely obvious fact: they are retarded.
>>2912671forgot about the ACP award
>>2912673In 50 years the US will be at war with canada, demoted to regional power, living in conditions that make post soviet shock therapy look like a joke, on the verge of civil war and balkanization, and still US leftoids will be wondering "why isn't socialism winning? Where is the revolution?"
Because they don't realize that the ongoing decline and destruction of their society *is* the revolution.
>>2912669>A DOTP makes no sense because communism is the proletariat abolishing itself, the nature of any dictatorship is self preservation at all costsDictatorship of the proletariat can be directly translated to proletarian democracy. It is the domination of the working class
as a class over the capitalist class. The self preservation of that class domination nessecitates the negation of capitalist class power, of capitalism, and thus the negation of the proletariat as a class. The DOTP dissolves not because the proletariat loose class power, but because the mechanisms of being a proletarian are no longer in operation.
>the proletarian police put themselves out of a job by physically removing all the bourgeois and lumpen.If you remove them physicllay but do not dismantle the
mode of production then those classes will reemerge. A class is not a physical set of people, it is a social relation. A class cannot be
abolished by decree, only by changing the mode of production. Communism abolishes the proletarian class because the mode of production has no capitalists. No capitalists = no proletarians.
>>2912667>implying that china can magically decide how much the workers are paidyou are not that different from the jacobin-magazine/verso-books type leftists that you're trying to criticize. both of you have dropped marxist economics in favor of vibe-guessing
>>2912643Azov Something's later youtube stuff strikes me as someone who creates content for the algorithms first.
It maps to a certain kind of audience,but only as a byproduct of the algo trends he chases. Redditor STEMlord stuff was trendyback then and now he aptly recognizes the boosting power of NAFO format propaganda and leftoid debatebro culture being in high demand, as we are plunged into apocalyptic, forever-neoliberalism.
It is no surprise that Adam gratuitously involves other tuber's faces and sprinkles "memetic"(from the point of view of the algo) videoclips around without much rhyme or reason. He's not speaking to you, the viewer, he's talking to the algorithm. And the algorithm understands.
He's doing SEO in video format.
>>2912705Do you think Americans would stop doing regime change operations if they became communist? Fuck no, they’d do it more and harder
>>2912682Are Chinese workers paid less than the value of what they produce? I'm talking about all the stuff that fills up McMansions in America. The U.S. consumes and China produces. So if you're thinking China is this alternative that zoomers have discovered after Mark Fisher roped after he got depressed, I question that because if China did not export that and Americans did not consume it, then the whole mess will blow up because it's part of the same system.
>>2912708Which is why china is doing controlled demolition of the US. Western workers should strategize on that basis, not on the delusions of first world socialist revolution
But westerners have a fixation on apocalyptic narratives. It feels vaguely family-annihilator adjacent, like let's destroy the whole world and go out with a bang while we're on top, so the history of humanity ends on the west, so it doesn't move on without them.
Too bad, the international proletariat is winning, and instead of epic mad max advrntures you're going to have to roll up your sleeves and build world communism with the rest of us
>>2912714> Western workers should strategize on that basis, not on the delusions of first world socialist revolutionAny hints wiseman?
>>2912705Western left has seemingly achieved since the fall of the USSR :
>Rivers of ink denouncing every form of AES>Renaming social democracy to socialism>Renaming (any amount of)welfare to social democracy>Then doing neoliberalism and imperialism for half a century instead anywayAnd now that the runway is running out, and it's our relative slice of heaven being told that actually 90s Russia was a model to emulate,they are like: "Alright, the time has come to start doing politics eh? The masses are just about destitute enough to fall in our lap and do
The Revolution (tm)." at best.
>>2912730Latin America is the west, they’re the ones that still have the Cuban revolution and ongoing guerrilla movements and the multiple pink tides
>>2912643>>2912698 (me)
That said I fully support youtube Drama involving Azov Something and BE(BadEmpanada is his content slop slave name).
I don't think Adam is as flatly stupid of a person as Ethan Klein was. But he's been cultivating the braindead NATOid viewership for so long that I can imagine something rubbing off of him, you know? Adam may just take the bait and get humiliated to tears live, out of hubris.
Though lets be honest here, anyone who parlays their way into a well paying internet job for posting low effort dogshit, can't be too stupid to begin with.
>>2912730Anyone who thinks revolution will come from masses tired of impovershiment needs to read about the Tocqueville effect.
And applied elite theory.
>>2909606Whenever Puddle of Mudd comes up I always think of the trailer for Ace Combat 5 where it completely ruins the mood set up by the rest of the trailer.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iWRdMX1VaZA >>2912760Dunno, man. He comes off really really stupid, and honestly he's like those sceptic channels from 10 years back that only debunked the dumbest flat Earthers, then went off course and turned out to be just as dumb reactoids
>>2912858>overcome elite theoryElite theory is not the same as Aristocracy.
Elite theory is study of how organized minorities rule over disorganized majorities.
In this case, Mao represented a new elite that replaced the old.
>>2912957Elite theory is retarded. Just mathematically it's impossible for it to be real. Every actual elite knows they're beholden to a mass base. They get overthrown precisely when the mass base rescinds support.
It's just cope by westoids to simultaneously deny spcialism is posdible + deny responsibility for their own countries' atrocities, like they're some smol beans snd can't be held accountable
>>2912973very vulgar understanding of elite theory
>>2912974>my geocentric model is actually very intricate, it's not *just* vulgar "sun revolves around earth"Who cares. Not every crackpot akkkademic navel gazing "theory" is worth giving a benefit of the doubt to
>>2912979Elite theory is a valid extension of class analysis, in fact some of the most influential and early writers are Marxists. The only naval gazing here is treating classes and the state as these hovering clouds that don't merit any further analysis, fundamentally non-materialist.
>>2912992It's the very intruduction of transhiatorical, ontol9gical category of "elites" that's a floating unjustified abstraction.
It's going *more* abstract from class, not more concrete.
The more concrete direction is the question of political organization and social reproduction of classes in society, conditioned by material and economic conditions, not dissecting some nebulous category of "elites"
Is there an actually good leftist online community anywhere?
xcancel dead again, the bourgeoisie took it from you
>>2913120literally yeah, elon musk took it down, and took down the nitter project too
I am greatly enjoying the crusade against Destinity Dave Explains is on.
>>2913118She's an evil bourgeois bitch but Joyce Messier deserves better than being forever associated with the most annoying user in lefttwt and original coiner of Treatlerism theory.
Who are some officially proved YouTubers by /ISG/?
>>2912730>Renaming social democracy to socialismStalinists did this, not the western left.
>>2913130>and original coiner of Treatlerism theory.like i said, a legend
>>2913132trvth svper nova
>>2912642>It's not even that, if you want to subvert the eugenicist ideology you can't just adopt its categories and flip the valence.See, this is a fair critique (a far cry from chatgpt generated bullshit), but I still think it engages with a single sentence from the 50 minute talk (which points me back to falling for enrage bait on xitter), and I still consider that the brunt of the talk to be fairly spot on
>The belief that capitalism is eugenic in the sense of trying to promote people attaining an ideal (instead of simply as a means to discriminate against people) is just wrong.She didn't even say this, she ties fitness under capitalism as tied to the production of the future workforce, and that MAHA stretches it to projecting "national strength" too
> To then position a positive programme for healthiness ("the fantasy of being fitter than the fascists") as simply going with the flow of that ideology rather than pushing against the current is to just get backwards what's happening.It's so funny because then you would be in agreement with her when she brings up "communists" ceding ground by "competing" in fitness competitions against fascists in xitter, you'd think this would be more in-line with current ideology than a single slightly cheeky comment about "the more dysgenic the better". it just doesn't seem like you're very fair or balanced with your criticism, and it seems like a post-hoc justification for falling for ragebait, which would still be embarrassing.
>>2912957>Neema ParviniPower comes and will always come from the masses btw
>>2913130>original coiner of Treatlerism theory.is this real? beast mode if true
>Punches Jesus
I do this
>>2913189It comes from the complicity or passivity of the masses.
Every day that capitalism stands is every day that the proletariat allow it to.
>>2913335I'm sure this will age well and she won't regret this in the least
>>2913335Okay but where's the toxic yuri fanart of the two of them
>>2913372iSSraelis should be unethically cleansed
>>2913356>zohranSo the other one is a zionist too? I'm confused.
>>2913395Yoo they got a Trot AI lmao
>>2913481her face is so weird
>>2913492The fact that normies cream their pants over her is proof that they are insane.
>>2913523>the jimmy dore showmakes me sick motherfucker, how far we done fell
>>2913492>her face is so weird>>2913510>The fact that normies cream their pants over her is proof that they are insane.You're being deliberate contrarians. She's easily +8/10 natural and the clip adds filters.
>>2913481Queen of the Pick Me's
>>2913546>Queen of the Pick Me'sI don't know about that. I'm fully convinced by the ad and she's well paid for it. I like her and she feels like a pretty cool person.
>>2913545She's obviously hot. I think the contrarianism comes from the fact right-wingers have decided she's the undisputed hottest woman of all time and basically the only hot woman on the planet right now and if you disagree you're a fag. It's weird.
>>2913481this is the trad aryan wife. I mean this in a semiotic sense.
>>2913549>She's obviously hot. I think the contrarianism comes from the fact right-wingers have decided she's the undisputed hottest woman of all time and basically the only hot woman on the planet right now and if you disagree you're a fag. It's weird.Yes, 100%
>>2913545>that is 8/10 in muttoidlandlol. lmao, even.
your standards have become nonexistent because so many of you are so fat that you all view any woman who isn't visibly obese as "hot".
Does anyone here actually watch sports?
>>2913563>lol. lmao, even. Okay, but do you watch sports?
>>2913549She is hot for sure, but like you're saying it's way exaggerated. Reminds me of the way people used to talk about Megan Fox back in like 2012, except in her case I think it was warranted.
>>2913545i think i'd find her face weird in reality as well. bet it'd be even weirder without makeup and professional lighting and filters.
>>2913569drooling and simping over celebs as arbiters of beauty has always been pretty retarded tho
>>2913576>drooling and simping over celebs as arbiters of beauty has always been pretty retarded thoToday was actually one of my more mundane days and this clip made my day.
>>2913578which is fine and dandy, i am the last one to judge for people taking joy in looking at naked bodies.
>>2913225>Anyone here follow Rob Ashlar (@RashmanTheHorse)? […] Sometimes I get a feeling he is pro-AQ and sometimes antiYeah I follow him. Idk either, he seems sympathetic to Sunni jihadists as a social revolutionary movement, but I've also seen him describe Osama Bin Laden as a rich clown playing revolutionary and Daesh-ism as a deranged nihilistic thing, but he is very knowlegeable. He wrote a long history of the Sunni insurgency in Iraq for Cosmonaut.
>Assad dead-enders call him "ISIS Rob" lol.Yeah that's a funny nickname too.
>>2913205>borders are evilit's true, jeezy did illegally immigrate to egypt as a baby to escape king herod the babykiller
>>2913563As a counter-point, could you post what type of woman would constitute an 8/10?
I know it's reddit but there has been a real obvious push of zionist rhetoric and bots all over, it's really fucking obvious.
>>2912245guy who thinks china is socialist and that capitalist realism (the book) was promoting capitalist realism (the ideology). probably also thinks Das Kapital is pro-capitalism.
>>2913607i think he correctly intuits that there's something wrong with Anthropic monopolizing access to information, but he has the kind of old-fashioned conservative brainworms where he thinks it is all in service of spreading the woke agenda. honestly it's a somewhat rare take because conservative boomers love AI, and i suspect he arrived there because he draws for a living.
>>2913696
>Every fucking kid in the West is subjected to these three ideas straight from birth
>China is not socialist
Actually it's "China is communist tyranny unlike the liberal democratic west"
>>2912673>Anon, thinking that is a quintessential example of leftoids hitting a total theoretical dead end.On the contrary, you have to fight hard against the propaganda and programming from childhood in order to recognize China as socialist.
Every fucking kid in the West is subjected to these three ideas straight from birth, via internet censorship and English-language or outright glowie controlled sites:
- China is not socialist
- China betrayed Vietnam/The USSR/Albania/etc.
- China is imperialist and threatening others, or even outright fascist (as has been repeated here before by certain posters who have no idea what fascism actually entails)
You are not immune to propaganda but the worst part about it is you claim that your stance, which lines up perfectly with what Western governments want, is the correct one. Even Russian government repeats the same smear (China abandoned socialism etc.) through its media. One would think it's odd that both Russia and America use the same talking points to denigrate China but that doesn't ring alarm bells amongst the "anti campists" for some reason.
Belarusian Communists actually visited the CPC for private discussions, and they came back reporting that in internal political communication the CPC characterizes people like Trump as far right fascist imperialists who are seeking to violently maintain their hegemony to the detriment of workers around the world, and that the far-right offers no real solutions to the problems confronting the working class. One of the Belarusian analysts noted that the idea of China "abandoning socialism" was repeatedly pushed on them by the Americans over the years, but they clearly saw first-hand that the CPC's officials had not abandoned ideology and the Americans were lying.
(repost since I accidentally cut off half of my original post)
>>2913707The West uses different narratives to unify hatred against China. Against retarded Conservatives and standard neoliberals they use the Communist tyranny line, but for the left they're clever enough to attack China from a purity standpoint and to use stuff like Vietnam's disputes or Hoxha/Albania or outright Maoist rhetoric to try to do so. Somehow leftcoms never catch on to this narrative discrepancy or how the Americans successfully managed to unite everyone around the idea of hating China.
>>2913714>China is not socialist Objectively true.
>China betrayed Vietnam/USSR/AlbaniaObjectively true.
>China is imperialistObjectively true.
Didn't read the rest of your Dengoid cope btw
>>2913731stinky rotten bait
>>2913756Biden? Didn't he die or something?
>>2913760No. Maybe there's something to those blood infusion longevity treatments because it seems like the worst people ever also live the longest. If you want to live to 100 you either need to be a Japanese farmer or a yankee war criminal.
>>2913714>Every fucking kid in the West is subjected to these three ideas straight from birth, via internet censorship and English-language or outright glowie controlled sites:>China is not socialistThat one is a double edged sword. It's socialist or not socialist depending on whether or not bourgeois propaganda wants to emphasize how evil and repressive they are or wants to handwave away its economic success. When talking about how repressive and unfree it is then this is shown as the inevitable result of communism. But when trying to explain why it's so successful then it suddenly becomes capitalist. In either case, any objective assessment of relations of production in China will show that it is a capitalist economy, even if this is just a stage in socialist construction.
>China betrayed Vietnam/The USSR/Albania/etc. They literally did though. They went to war with Vietnam and waged two proxy wars (in direct cooperation with the CIA) against the USSR in Afghanistan and Angola. China was objectively part of the Western geopolitical camp from 1976-1991. Also, the Sino-Soviet split is hardly featured prominently in mainstream discourse around China, most likely because the average normie wouldn't care if China betrayed the USSR. Also Western porkies probably aren't keen to advertise how closely they worked with China against the Soviets in the 80s given that they are now trying to demonize them.
>China is imperialist and threatening others, or even outright fascistI agree that this one is not true.
>>2913691there are only three e's, oh-ohhhh
there are only three e's, oh-ohhhh
>>2913846Asmon mostly reacts to the crazies on the left
>>2913752Saved. Real Marxists are anti-western. Forget about Marxism 200 years ago.
The real conflict of today is The West vs. The Rest. You are not a Marxist if you are not anti-Western.
>>2913848Was he reacting to the crazies on the left when he called for foreign children to be murdered
>>2913481truth nuke: every attractive woman or man that appears on a screen and bases the validity of his/her points on attractiveness is a prostitute
all marketing is also prostitution
only debate bros can talk politics and philosophy without being prostitutes, only workers that don't need to show their face or height to earn a living are prostitutes
I say this as a guy who got hired in a zoomcall/email type job due to having above average looks, if you depend on your looks for people to listen to you and/or pay you you are a type of whore.
therefore the true merit of an argument is shown only on anonymous internet forums.
>>2913900bad empanada is a superior intellectual specimen than Hasan the manwhore because bad empanada is ugly and balding, yet he annihilates Hasan every time.
>>2913481I will never understand how people thirst for women showing half a titty when deepthroat double penetration anal face slap porn exists
>>2913492This
If you already like gringo aesthetics already I can see forgiving the butter face, but I haven’t seen a white woman I’d miscegenate with since 2015.
>>2913901At least Hasan is useful for deflecting away the right’s obsession with transgenderism.
>>2913205Jesus was more of an apocalyptic preacher than a hippie. And modern religion is more of an ethnonationalist ideology than a set of principles, so this is actually very consistent.
>>2913481She'd be nowhere near as famous had she been non-white and had smaller tits.
>>2912643Tellingly, the Empanada won't touch the RF invasion of Ukraine, even if it gets shoved in his face by the shittiest of NAFOids for half an hour straight.
BE is still convinced that if he waits long enough, he won't need to backtrack on his early takes, because the RF will eventually "lose". Which is a safe bet to make because these things come with totalizing propaganda on all sides proclaiming their victory at the end. Same reason why he hasn't even touched the Nordstream sabotage or the economic rearrangement of NATO allies, in the context of the cold war. It's the elephant in the room when he talks about Venezuela, (or S Smerica and MENA). Or when he wears the third-worldist hat and rails about the privileged first worlders and western imperialism. BE can't acknowledge the cold war, without inviting unfortunate conclusions.
I think BE is waiting for the official narrative to drop, so he can follow the compatible left spinoff. Which may be an inflection point for this miniature version of the "dirtbag left" that has formed around BE's disruption antics. Many people (chiefly, the NRS funded and China adjacent left) are holding this hope that such crisis of globalized capitalism will eventually give way to more regional conflicts, and those to pockets of socialism. I have a feeling those people will yet champion many Rojavas, "student uprisings", "XYZ Activists" and "leaderless/horizontal movements" before they get blackpilled to something worse.
>>2913980Idk. I think people overrate how much this is a thing in Star Wars for example, where the rebels still have military uniforms and are pretty professional. In the original trilogy they are a proper army.
You definitely have a point about films and games a whole though in recent years, and this is especially so with 'woke' films or games.
On the other hand there has also been a militarisation of the good guys, turning them into the U$ marines basically. Loads of films in the last 20 years have done this. Terminator turned the human resistance from scrappy, dirty rebels into the U$ army. The competency of the good guys faction is basically tied to what American ideology the creators follow. If they are conservative, the good guys are marines. If they are liberals, the good guys are spiritual eco-anarchist freedom warriors.
It makes sense why leftists don't want to make the good guys soldiers (in stories where they should be), because they are afraid to glorify the military. But this also a large propaganda mistake. Socialist art should glorify revolutionary soldiers and guerrillas, while also being realistic in its depiction of war and armed struggle.
>>2913928Of course AOCIA came in to defend Ed Sheeran of course
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KOy6MegaMdQ One Battle After Another is one of the worst films ever and is a demoralisation op. It uses 'realism' as an excuse to make fun of revolution, and shows revolutionaries as weak and pathetic. Like legitimately I can't think of a more counter-revolutionary film than this one, and the ending is especially bad (with energy channelled into liberal actions).
>>2914008Would it surprise you to find out that its director is a zionist
>>2914008Its loosely based on a Pynchon novel called vineland which is about leftist revolutionaries on the eve of reagans reelection in 1984
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vineland
>Vineland is a 1990[a] postmodern novel by Thomas Pynchon set in California in 1984, the year of President Ronald Reagan's reelection.[6] Through flashbacks, its characters, who lived through the 1960s, account for the free spirit of rebellion of that decade, and describe the traits of the "fascistic Nixonian repression" and the war on drugs that clashed with it. The book portrays transformations in U.S. society from the 1960s to the 1980sthe book of course is much smarter than the movie
>>2913846"all i wanted to do was play video games"
>>2914008>>2914009>>2914010I haven't read the book, but the movie literally makes them a billion times more capable than the groups they were based on(the SLA and WU.) In the movie, they're liberating immigrant detention camps and killing off conservative politicians. In real life the highest-ranking political figure these groups managed to kill was a local black superintendent. they also got themselves blown up when they tried to make a bomb and all died/got arrested in their only shootout.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Marcus_Foster#Deathhttps://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Greenwich_Village_townhouse_explosionhttps://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Symbionese_Liberation_Army#Police_shootout >>2914011>"all i wanted to do was play video games"They made all the women in my games ugly and then I got recommended Asmongold. A lot of his videos are just common sense.
>>2914018>This is what I mean when I say that these guys are not ideological RWers, their political views begin and end with the goonslop they prefer. I have more respect for RWers who are consistent with their politics.Not sure about any of that but whatever is going on, it's working.
>>2914018Idk I think it's more consistent fascism to just be like "yeah women shouldn't be able to read their porn books but men should have 100% access to porn games, because it's not the same". Kind of shit Plato would have said
>>2914034I'm not talking about fascism, I'm talking about the right wing thought general and even left-wing thought. the ACP guys are against smut as well.
>>2914007What's going on with these interviews where AOC just walks down the stairs of Congress, gets immediately confronted with some specific popcultural issue (last time she was asked about fucking Clavicular) and she knows exactly all about it?
Seems surreal, something really feels off about her during the last couple of months
>>2914042also thinking "Plato is Fascism"
>>2914044Getting ready to lose the next big election. Pokemon Go to the polls and such
>>2914052Tries to deflect from him losing his cases
>>2914052I don't think macklemore is antisemitic but that outfit was crazy lol
>>2914018>>2914034>>2914042>>2914046Sirs, I have a humble question. What do you think about the theology in W40K?
>>2914061Weird question, but like pretty much everything in 40K, it was “inspired” by other media the writers liked. In this case Leto II from Dune and King Huon from Michael Moorcock were mixed together with the aesthetic of Catholic imagery, especially Jesus on the cross. I don’t think there was ever any serious theology considered beyond it looking metal, but of course it evolved over time into mostly pseudo-Catholicism, Orthodoxy, or Islam depending on the character and chapter.
The followers of Chaos criticism of him is basically 1:1 what an edgy Nietzschean would say about Christianity, while the way his followers believe in him is also very Christian-like.
>>2914061God awful. WH is like taking Dune and remove all its smart commentary about religion and power and turn it into dualistic slop.
>>2914061>W40Kfascistic culture
>>2914088How is it dualistic slop?
>>2914104If the Tau manifest the Greater Good as a warp entity then that would officually be /ourguy/.
>>2913870I am so glad that cultural era has mostly passed. Not that we have anything better; its a different kind of shit, but just because we are fed horseshit now doesn't mean I am not happy that we are fed a lot less dogshit.
>>2914251
>Of course you're a Warhammer fan. Leftypol continues to make the most reactionary choices possible in any given situation.
Oh, let's not describe half of what's real and just focus on the other half and call it all of reality. Is that what this is?
>>2914251
who is leftypol
>>2914274If you're not not a bot on a shelf, how would you know?
>>2914274What's sad about it?
>>2914291never mind, it's not sad. the purpose of a system is what it does.
>>2914391Extremely rare Poland W
>>2914104I think WH40k pigeonholed the C'Tan into generic eldritch evil.
C'Tan, are superintelligences old as the universe's first steps, evolved from the medium of celestial energy . C'Tan are masters of the material and reject the warp. The physical universe is a canvas with scarce secrets to them. And they have demonstrated the power to seal the warp.
Non eldritch rolecasted C'Tan could uplift the whole of sentient life with optimal technology, ultimate understanding and true immortality beyond the need for the warp or "souls". It would literally be a god of materialism, if the writers hadn't made up all that nonsense about devouring souls and discarding their cosmic insight to become retarded cliches as soon as they are given an physical body.
>>2914104Malhal before it was retconned was claimed to be the god of anarchy for what it's worth.
>>2914445thats how he gets those clicks and his brainwashed followers donate money
>>2914445>but when there is a report that Netanyahu might have known about October 6th?i wont watch this video but this is neighboring conspiracy theories about HAMAS being some sort of israeli psyop, which is an openly liberal zionist talking point, and i would at least raise my eyebrow at someone peddling it because there's also no real practical reason to bringing it up or debate it, really. israel was committing a genocide before oct 7th too.
>>2914455>conspiracy theories about HAMAS being some sort of israeli psyopMust be refering to how Israel propped Hamas against Fatah 3 or 4 decades ago. But that's just a case of shortsightedness just like how the US propped the talibans against the Soviets.
>>2914459>Must be refering to how Israel propped Hamas against Fatah 3 or 4 decades ago.yeah but it's extended it to make it seem like it's entirely a netanyahu project culminating in oct 7
>>2914230Funniest thing about wh40k is that you have all these objectively evil factions from barbaric space fascism to aliens whose culture is based on rape-torture, to omnicidal robots to space locusts to fungus with guns
And then you have the Tau, who represent the grimdark horrors of a vaguely problematic collectivist government as perceived by a western liberal.
>>2914484I thought the tau were a vague parody of NATO's rainbow imperialism?
>>2914463>yeah but it's extended it to make it seem like it's entirely a netanyahu project culminating in oct 7People can genuinely believe in these theories but I think there's a lot of motivated reasoning going on, like trying to get others to detach their support for Palestine from Hamas (because they're Islamists), but they don't want to say that attacking Israel is bad per se, so they'll say the attack was an Israeli plot. Partisangirl also said stuff like that (before 10/7) because Hamas didn't like Assad so actually they were an Israeli psyop or something. A lot of people have certain established beliefs and affinities and then they hunt around for "facts" that support it so if you don't like Hamas for some reason, but you're not a Zionist per se because of the people you're socializing with, then the motivation is stronger to advance a conspiracy theory about Hamas, whereas if you were just a Zionist you'd just consider them to be terrorist enemies. So there can be an internal logic to conspiracy theorists even if it's some bullshit that people just made up.
Is it possible though that Netanyahu was warned in advance and did nothing because he wanted to react heavily and exploit it? Idk, it's possible but he could've also fucked up or not expected the attack to be as bad as it was.
>>2914459>Must be refering to how Israel propped Hamas against Fatah 3 or 4 decades ago. But that's just a case of shortsightedness just like how the US propped the talibans against the Soviets.Shortsightedness is also very characteristically Israeli. Right now they're in a whole sweat about Turkish influence in Syria and how alarming that is so LET'S ATTACK TURKISH INTERESTS IN SYRIA. I really think Americans in D.C. sat down with them and were like what the fuck do not do that, stop being idiots.
>>2914488It's WH40K. They're whatever they need to be, just like everyone else.
>>2913686>capitalist realism (the book) was promoting capitalist realism (the ideology)It does that by conjuring up the mystifying notion of "capitalist realism" which rests on the premise that
- USSR and China are not "real alternatives"
- Westerners are "ideologically brainwashed" rather than being mini hitlers
>>2913900I'm reading the Elric books now and they're kinda cool.
>>2913686Communism is pro-capitalism
>>2911853>One of these people said that fat people are being genocided by glp-1s, a completely ridiculous take that is maybe even harmful as leftists need to be able to clearly call out actual genocides happening due to imperialism without seeming like dupes who call everything genocide. The "Socialism Conference" has hosted and promoted regime change apologism back in 2019. Shouldn't be suprised that a conference that promoted regime change and the "Uighur Genocide" and "Free Hong Kong" also believes that "Fat Genocide" is a thing. Only in America could "Fat Liberation" ever even be a serious topic. You do not hate these people enough.
https://thegrayzone.com/2019/07/06/dsa-jacobin-iso-socialism-conference-us-funded-regime-change/>Socialism is now apparently brought to you by the US State Department.>From July 4 to 7, thousands of left-wing activists from across the United States are gathering in Chicago for the 2019 Socialism Conference.>At this event, some of the most powerful institutions on the American socialist — but avowedly anti-communist — left have brought together a motley crew of regime-change activists to demonize Official Enemies of Washington.>Another longtime ally who has spoken at every single annual Socialism Conference since 2009, Anand Gopal, works at a liberal foundation that is directly funded by the US State Department. He is headlining a panel this year to provide “A Socialist View of the Arab Spring.”>Yet another 2019 conference panel rails against the socialist governments of Nicaragua and Cuba — two-thirds of John Bolton’s “troika of tyranny” — with outspoken proponents of regime change. One of the speakers, Dan La Botz, hosted an event in 2018 that featured right-wing Nicaraguan activists wearing masks and disguised as students, who were junketed to meet with Republican lawmakers in Washington by the US government-funded right-wing organization Freedom House.>>2911847>She still said that being dysgenic is good, actually.BTW, "dysgenic" doesn't exist.
>>2910925so a literally who who stalks another literally who
>>2914602they wouldn't even let scooby doo into the courthouse with him.. amerikkka is a cruel nation
>>2914447>Malhal before it was retconned was claimed to be the god of anarchy for what it's worth.Malal? That's… an interesting choice? The anon
>>2914104 asked if you had to invent one to represent the left or leftist things. You don't have to invent one for greed because we've got that culturally as the Mammon.
Others who don't get W40K can watch a video on the Warp to get what we're talking about.
>>2914488>I thought the tau were a vague parody of NATO's rainbow imperialism?The Tau don't know about the Warp yet
>>2914445>when there is a report that Netanyahu might have known about October 6th? A crazy conspiracy!>>2914455>i wont watch this video but this is neighboring conspiracy theories about HAMAS being some sort of israeli psyopIsrael supported Hamas against PLO the same way the USA supported mujahideen against Taraki, Iranian clerics against Tudeh, and Al Jolani against Assad.
How hard is it to understand that imperialists support jihadists against secular nationalist and/or socialist forces, as a precursor to supporting zionists against jihadists? All support is conditional and predicated on later backstabbing.
Anyway zionist and neocon imperialists knew both about 9/11 and 10/7 in advance. both events were highly beneficial to their hardliners and foreign policy strategists. someone like BE hates recognizing this because the israeli and us civilians are ontologically evil and deserve to die… therefore anyone who does mass killings of them cannot possibly be useful idiots of the most bloodthirsty factions of the imperialists looking to rally the population for more war.
>>2914505Same. It's been cool to see the origin of alot of the tropes and worldbuilding that may seem cliche now, but were new then and handled in a surprisingly thoughtful, even-handed way by Moorcock those decades ago. Like I very much appreciate that while Elric is a quintessential "i'm not like the other guys" guy with a crazy background, he is actually quite human, fallible, and sympathetic. A good blend of capable, aloof, and utter goober. Handful of moments I straight laughed out loud at Elric's corny ass. Fun series.
>>2914622>picalways makes me laugh
>>2914391This guy's crowdwork is always really funny. I do wonder how you stumble into his show as a Trump dickrider though lmao
>>2914391>what's your favorite war<whichever is the most profitablethe burger is honest and bloodthirsty
>>2914445Didn't watch the video award
> say that bombing gays is bad
> you have been banned from reddit
Lmao
>>2914512based and historical progression pilled?
>>2914663the straights should be bombed too, chud
>>2911853>The other one basically said that disabled people have revolutionary potential and should not be left out. An entirely obvious conclusion to anyone who spent 30 seconds engaging in mass politicsWhat's insidious about it though is that it's trying to spin the recent pro-fitness trend on the left as reactionary. The issue isn't just what she said (though that was pretty retarded given she literally said that being ugly and unhealthy is a good thing), but how she's trying to make you view fitness, strength, and discipline as inherently reactionary or fascist coded.
>>2914602Bro's not gonna pull any femboys looking like that. Luckily he'll have time in prison to get swole and learn the art of gay sex.
>>2914700they're not really wrong. the state is just another firm. this is a point one can throw at Austrians
>>2914700Yes, this is pretty basic Marxism actually. I'd only split hairs over 2 aspects of what the posters there said. There's a little bit of confusion over the objective mechanics of capitalism and what the bourgeoisie do - i.e. the bourgeoisie carry out the tyranny of capitalism, but they are beholden to capitalism rather than singlehandedly responsible for reproducing it, which falls on society as a whole, including the working class. Secondly, the distinction between socialism/DoTP and communism is not clearly drawn here, which could lead one to accept what Marx calls "crude communism" - the community as universal capitalist - to be the goal.
For further reading see:
Marx - 1844 Manuscripts - Private Property and Communism
Kautsky (1902) - Social Revolution
Lenin (1918) - State and Revolution - The Economic Basis of the Withering Away of the State
>>2914722>Yes, this is pretty basic Marxism actually. No it isn't. Marx doesn't use communism to refer to a "socialism with a mixed economy". I didn't even read the rest because that statement was so monumentally wrong it can only go downhill from there.
>>2914700I do wonder how Midwestern Marx fell into this cult because a lot of points he raises in his videos are pretty alright
>>2914725You've misread, he said
>socialism with markets is not a mixed economyIf you wanted to make an uncharitable reading here, you could say that's a justification for Dengist style revisionism. I took it to mean that markets are not the sole issue with capitalism or inherently capitalist, which is true
>>2914727I can't with these guys man.
>DSA are reformist libs! We're the only true revolutionary communists!<Btw markets and corporations will totally continue to exist under socialism guys, only libs want to get rid of themThey're arguably more reformist than DSA, they just posture as more radical.
>>2914728Taken in context with other statements its obvious that he's trying to portray mixed economies and social democracy not just as socialism, but as communism. It's blatantly revisionist.
>>2914729>more reformist than DSA, they just posture as more radical.Damn you just described +85% of the posters here
>>2914728>Dengist style revisionismDeng saved the PRC from revisionism
>>2914700it's a case of sophistry vs sophistry
yes, saying "corporations" instead of "capitalists" is radlib coded
but it is obvious that when dsa opposes corporations, they are opposing private enterprises, not the concept of a productive body
so to say that they oppose any productive body by arguing about the semantics of the word "corporation" is pointless and disingenuous
the part about republican rule of companies is actual revisionism; marx wrote multiple times about the incompatibility of such arrangements with the demands of modern productive technologies. the part about private companies being merely extensions of the capitalist state also goes against the marxist position. that is, unless you do the most generous reading possible and assume that he's talking about democratic control through the proletarian state, rather everything being a coop
but even if you (foolishly) take that generous interpretation, it is still sophistry; marxism is a very down-to-earth craft, which doesn't mean it is anti-intellectual, but whenever someone starts talking in platitudes and complete abstracts like these, your first assumption should be that they are being cryptic on purpose because their theory is weak
>>2912667their per capita consumption is through the roof and outpaces the USA. yo can't get 2nd hand shit there because they buy everything new. everyone has an electric car already. their consumer electronics market is absolutely on fire, fully a generation ahead of the west if not more. food is plentiful and cheap. workers are taking long leases on multiple homes easily.
this mentality that the chinese are poor is 30 years out of date. the 996 foxxconn tech worker stuff is a decade out of date. they have better jobs, better conditions, and relative to the cost of living are paid better than you.
china won, the west is fucked, wake the fuck up samurai.
>>2914729>>2914753The thing is, it was a response to a question about how communism would look like on a subreddit (r/asksocialists) that is not specificly for Americans, but belongs to the ACP.
These kinds of posts just seem like a long-winded obscurantist justification for showing up at socialist events with an American flag and a cowboy hat - especially the reference to Sir Edward Coke (lol) and the "democratic-republic".
It also seems like they tend to believe that everything is determined by the political superstructure, because corporations are an extension of the state anyway (weirdly right-libertarian thing to say), and we just need to apply our glorious all-American values of the Founding Fathers to our economy and democratize it (what this exactly means stays obtuse) and
revolutionarize the mode of production (what this exactly means stays obtuse). None of this is antithetical to imperialist monopoly capitalism btw.
>>2914798I guess it goes without saying that it was supposed to be appealing to chuds
which, funnily enough, ended up being way more harmful, embarrassing, and useless than anything a socialist has ever said to appeal to liberals
>>2914700>MarketsTo Marx, markets mediate commodity exchange through the private ownership of the means of production. In his writings, he clearly advocates for centralising all means of production in the state, and establishing a planned economy, with direct distribution, not trade:
<Centralisation of credit in the hands of the state, by means of a national bank with State capital and an exclusive monopoly […] Centralisation of the means of communication and transport in the hands of the State […] factories and instruments of production owned by the State; the bringing into cultivation of waste-lands, and the improvement of the soil generally in accordance with a common plan.https://www.marxists.org/archive/marx/works/1848/communist-manifesto/ch02.htm<The life-process of society, which is based on the process of material production, does not strip off its mystical veil until it is treated as production by freely associated men, and is consciously regulated by them in accordance with a settled plan. https://www.marxists.org/archive/marx/works/1867-c1/ch01.htm<Within the co-operative society based on common ownership of the means of production, the producers do not exchange their products […] in contrast to capitalist society, individual labor no longer exists in an indirect fashion but directly as a component part of total labor.https://www.marxists.org/archive/marx/works/1875/gotha/ch01.htmSo, like many others, this person projects themself onto Marx.
>CorporationA corporation is the formation of a body (e.g. incorporation):
https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/corporationThis person seems much more like a Syndicalist than a Marxist.
>>2914798I've said it before but I think that the ACP has a lot in common with the very early Italian fascists, who often tried to portray themselves as the "real socialists" and "true revolutionaries" in opposition to both the ruling class and Marxists. The only difference is that instead of representing their break from Marxism as the true revolutionary path, they're taking a revisionist route and diluting the meaning of Marxism into something non-communist. Their positions contain the same kind of appeals to petty bourgeois interests and sentiments.
>>2914729DSA are reformists because they believe they can reform capitalist society through electoralism and worse by reforming the democratic party lol. ACP, whatever can be said about them, are not reformist as they believe revolution is required in order to bring about said change in society. This is basic stuff
Whatever particular position you have on the longevity of markets under the dictatorship of the proletariat, doesn't factor into it that much
>>2914819In that case Lenin was criticizing a policy only to later learn it's useful once you've actually taken power. Here you have the ACP denouncing the DSA as "reformist" while openly saying that they have no intention of actually abolishing markets or corporations.
>>2914827>ACP, whatever can be said about them, are not reformist as they believe revolution is required in order to bring about said change in society.ACP is reformist because they don't believe in changing society but continuing under the current mode of production.
>>2914827The idea of markets under the DotP is a revision of Marx.
Lenin called it "State Capitalism".
>>2914728>ACP is reformist because they don't believe in changing society but continuing under the current mode of productionThat's not what reformism is though, nor do they believe that they are continuing the current mode of production. It basically just comes down to if you think China is socialist or not
>>2914833>The idea of markets under the DotP is a revision of MarxIt's not.
<Will it be possible for private property to be abolished at one stroke?<No, no more than existing forces of production can at one stroke be multiplied to the extent necessary for the creation of a communal society.
<In all probability, the proletarian revolution will transform existing society gradually and will be able to abolish private property only when the means of production are available in sufficient quantity.
>Lenin called it "State Capitalism".State capitalism made to serve the people is socialism, as per Lenin. Only trotskkkytes and ultroids have a problem with this
>>2914836>That's not what reformism is thoughMy mistake, they want to seize power in a revolution and then not do anything with it. So that creates the absurd situation where they're more radical than DSA in their methods but less radical in their goals.
>nor do they believe that they are continuing the current mode of productionThey may not believe it but they are.
>It basically just comes down to if you think China is socialist or notChina claims to be using markets as a stage in socialist construction moving towards communism. They don't claim to have achieved communism or any sort of end state. Meanwhile these mfs are literally claiming that Marx's concept of communism allowed for markets and private property.
>>2914836>It's not. It is in they way they are portraying it. Marx says that the DotP cannot abolish private property and markets immediately, but he also says that it must move inexorably towards their abolition and that socialism won't be achieved until they do. They are effectively arguing that the DotP doesn't need to eliminate them at all and simply needs to regulate and reform them. It's just social democracy.
>>2914842Well it’s a good thing then that communists aren’t interested in “achieving socialism” or other utopian fantasies but rather being the real movement
>>2914841>My mistake, they want to seize power in a revolution and then not do anything with itI don't think that's what they want to do
> So that creates the absurd situation where they're more radical than DSA in their methods but less radical in their goalsThe goal of the DSA isn't market abolition either though, it's to reform the democratic party to a more soc dem aligned position
>They may not believe it but they are.Not really, they want to "sublate" the current mode of production. To them that means establishing a dotp and managing the economy through that. If you want to consider that to be continuing the current mode of production that's fine, but then china and the ussr didn't do anything either
>China claims to be using markets as a stage in socialist construction moving towards communism. They don't claim to have achieved communism or any sort of end state. Meanwhile these mfs are literally claiming that Marx's concept of communism allowed for markets and private property.The question is whether you consider China to be socialist or not. If they are in the early stages of socialism then the existence of markets and private property is not antithetical to that stage, as they are included in it.
>Meanwhile these mfs are literally claiming that Marx's concept of communism allowed for markets and private property.Who are "these mfs"? Some guy on reddit? Do you know he's even a party member? Where is this outlined in the party program?
>It is in they way they are portraying it. Marx says that the DotP cannot abolish private property and markets immediately, but he also says that it must move inexorably towards their abolition and that socialism won't be achieved until they do.And that is what people believe they are doing no? Also please provide said Marx quote about when socialism will or will not arrive
>They are effectively arguing that the DotP doesn't need to eliminate them at all and simply needs to regulate and reform them. It's just social democracy.A dotp can by definition not just be a social democracy and markets and corporations (private property) cannot be eliminated at one stroke. As far as I understand the ACP believe that the establishment of a dotp through revolution will eventually lead to the abolition of private property, just like what China supposedly claims. This is more revolutionary than the reformist DSA, which does not believe in revolution therefor the "democratic" in democratic socialists of america
>DSA vs ACP
days without inter-dengist nothingburgers on leftypol = 0
>>2914888Lassalle won unfortunately
>>2914852>The goal of the DSA isn't market abolition either though, it's to reform the democratic party to a more soc dem aligned positionDepends on the caucus. The DSA as a whole has no line on that issue, but numerous caucuses (including those with significant representation at the highest levels) say openly that they want to eliminate capitalism.
>If you want to consider that to be continuing the current mode of production that's fine, but then china and the ussr didn't do anything eitherChina and the USSR did abolish the existing mode of production because they expropriated private property and replaced markets with a planned economy, which is what the ACP is explicitly saying they don't want to do.
>Who are "these mfs"? Some guy on reddit? Try Haz and Hickel, who openly say that communism is compatible with small business ownership and landlordism. Even the party program makes no mention of a planned economy or eliminating private property even in the long term. They essentially propose an NEP style program and leave it at that.
>Also please provide said Marx quote about when socialism will or will not arriveTechnically it's Engels but:
<Above all, it will have to take the control of industry and of all branches of production out of the hands of mutually competing individuals, and instead institute a system in which all these branches of production are operated by society as a whole – that is, for the common account, according to a common plan, and with the participation of all members of society.<It will, in other words, abolish competition and replace it with association…<In fact, the abolition of private property is, doubtless, the shortest and most significant way to characterize the revolution in the whole social order which has been made necessary by the development of industry – and for this reason it is rightly advanced by communists as their main demand.So in other words, while you can say that private property and markets can exist under a DotP, they are inherently incompatible with socialism. Seeing as the purpose of the DotP is to construct socialism, then it follows that they can only exist in a transitional phase before being eliminated.
>As far as I understand the ACP believe that the establishment of a dotp through revolution will eventually lead to the abolition of private propertyI've quite frankly never heard any of their prominent members claim this and it doesn't appear in their program. The phrases "communism" and "socialism" appear nowhere in their platform or declaration.
>>2914832not even the USSR abolished the firm or the market to be fair
>>2914889why is Lassalle memed as a proto-Dengist on here?
>>2914892>Depends on the caucus. The DSA as a whole has no line on that issue, but numerous caucuses (including those with significant representation at the highest levels) say openly that they want to eliminate capitalism.Then they shouldn't be part of a reformist organization
>China and the USSR did abolish the existing mode of production because they expropriated private property and replaced markets with a planned economy, which is what the ACP is explicitly saying they don't want to doDo they though? And did they though? As far as I understand they look to china, thus the private property and the markets and yadayada. If you don't have a problem with China on these fronts then I don't think you should be worried about it
>Try Haz and Hickel, who openly say that communism is compatible with small business ownership and landlordism. Even the party program makes no mention of a planned economy or eliminating private property even in the long term. They essentially propose an NEP style program and leave it at that. They're talking about making money for the party as I understand, plus again landlords and small businesses exist in China. The party program talks about immediate actions they think are possible, not what they want the far future to look like, some stage of production that not even china has arrived at yet. It does talk about abolishing intellectual property I think lol
>So in other words, while you can say that private property and markets can exist under a DotP, they are inherently incompatible with socialism. Seeing as the purpose of the DotP is to construct socialism, then it follows that they can only exist in a transitional phase before being eliminated. Sure but I don't think that's incomparable to what that redditor was saying. They're basically just talking about socialist transition and sublation and other sematic bullshit
>I've quite frankly never heard any of their prominent members claim this and it doesn't appear in their programThey claim to be a marxist leninist party no? Maybe not so explicitly but that is ostensibly what they are
>The phrases "communism" and "socialism" appear nowhere in their platform or declarationIt appears all over their propaganda/content and is all they talk about though. I mean the propaganda of the party itself is pretty dry, but they call themselves the communist party lmao. This just sound delusional/dishonest tbh
>>2914674>episode 88I snorted
but this guy is the embodiment of r/neoliberalism and is too embarrassed about that to just be honest.
>>2914674I grew up with old guys around me who were WW2 veterans. I think the current generation of young guy grew up without much WW2 history being taught to them as relevant and so comparisons to hitler make less political sense and are taken less seriously by them. whether this makes them more amenable to fascism has yet to be seen, but especially in the wake of Israel accusing everyone who criticizes them as antisemitic, I feel that we are really entering a post WW2 era where the cultural currency of hitler comparisons are going the way of the dinosaur.
>>2914766>their per capita consumption is through the roof and outpaces the USA. No it doesn't.
>everyone has an electric car already.No they don't. Most Chinese don't drive. China's state statistics bureau reported last year that there are 182 million privately-owned cars in China:
https://www.stats.gov.cn/english/PressRelease/202502/t20250228_1958822.htmlThat's not really a "problem" because public transport is way more extensive. Also more people ride bicycles, scooters, and e-bikes. Or you can take a cab. Also in terms of household goods, they don't consume as much as Americans because their living spaces are smaller on average. China can't consume the entirety of its own production. But countries today also don't live in self-contained bubbles. That's all I'm saying, there is a relationship between the Chinese economy and the rest of the world and there's a relationship between why Western economies look the way they do, and why the Chinese economy looks the way it does, because it's part of the same system.
>this mentality that the chinese are poor is 30 years out of date.Compared to 30 years ago, obviously. But it's still a developing country. Also it's a really big country.
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