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/leftypol/ - Leftist Politically Incorrect

"The anons of the past have only shitposted on the Internet about the world, in various ways. The point, however, is to change it."
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Not reporting is bourgeois


File: 1747526447164.png (4.13 MB, 2000x1125, Solis-Feature-v2_jpg.png)

 

If China is so based why doesn't it spread communist propaganda to the West? Why aren't there Chinese created Prager U's commiepilling ppl? Why are they just watching as the rest of the world sinks into fascism?

China takes a pragmatic approach to foreign policy which means not forcing communism on anyone but leading by example.

leftcom to dengist pipeline is real
>chinaaa saveee meeee
LOL

Do they really have to do anything? All that has to happen is Americans see TikToks of Chinese subways and cities and talk to Chinese people on LittleRedNote. Chances are high that they're gonna start changing their perspective on China pretty fast.

>>2272877
Americans are bombarded with propaganda from every corner. You're vastly underestimating how damaged and spiritually cucked Americans and Westerners are. They're lumpen to their core and are not capable of class consciousness. The biggest social media websites are owned by right wing billionaires who are actively skewing people to become dumber and more reactionary with the use of bots and AI. There needs to be a communist counterpart to the large scale right-wing propaganda industrial complex at work and only China can do it.


Honestly, China probably doesn't want to rock the boat too much because China needed development. Now, China is increasingly dominant and likely 25 years away from AI socialism, if not FALC, and once you get to FALC, why even bother fighting the capitalists? With demonstrable FALC, capitalism, as a social system, is obsolete.

>AES country tries to spread socialism
<SOCIAL IMPERIALISM!!!! WE HAVE TO STOP THIS WITH COUPS AND SANCTIONS AND EMBARGOES AND UNION BUSTING AND AUSTERITY AND PRIVATIZATION AND FALSE FLAG ATTACKS AND SABOTAGE AND ESPIONAGE AND….
>AES country doesn't try to spread socialism
<WOW SO I GUESS THEY AREN'T REALLY SOCIALIST THEN! EVERYTHING IS JUST INTER IMPERIALISM. MAKES NO DIFFERENCE TO ME WHETHER THEY BECOME THE VICTIM OF COUPS AND SANCTIONS AND EMBARGOES AND UNION BUSTING AND AUSTERITY AND PRIVATIZATION AND FALSE FLAG ATTACKS AND SABOTAGE AND ESPIONAGE AND….

>Where's China's international solidarity?
Foreign investment is international solidarity. The IMF is the vanguard of the revolution ✊️

>>2272907
God, I wish China could colonize Canada.

>>2272906
We will gauge out your neoliberal wholesome AES investors' eyes in the revolution

I don't love China's lack of solidarity or international proletarian leadership, but the tactic of not exporting its ideology does seem to be providing dividends for it. It's positioned itself as an alternative to the US/Europe and has been helping the third world catch up to the West industrially and technologically, this improving the material basis for communism and communists.

At the same time, I don't believe you can invite the devil into your house without singing the drapes. It's rapidly approaching the point where it's going to have to pull the trigger on transitioning away from capitalism and fulfill its responsibilities both to its own people as well as its role as the vanguard of the proletariat. When that day will come and whether or not it will be able to successfully transition I can't begin to speculate.

>>2272869
I think a charitable way of looking at it is they see interfering in the internal affairs of other countries to be a form of colonialism, and even doing it in the name of socialism or something that sounds good is really the same thing in disguise, sorry. An important part of their history after all was breaking with the USSR because they saw the USSR as turning into an imperialist power that happened to be waving a red flag. So, they're happy showing off what they're doing in China to impress or awe you, but they're not interested in telling anybody else how to live. Well I say "they" as if 1.4 billion people all think the same.

Then there's another argument that they're not really communist anymore, that the party bureaucracy talks about Marx and so on but it's formalistic and this is really just used for the purposes of maintaining the system of power after the revolution and the power of the people who comprise the party committees. These are those sorts of "new class" theories. But I think it's probably more complicated, and there are probably people like that in the party, but there are others who really do believe it too and think China has gone too far in tolerating markets and so on.

Either way, I think it's very hard to change the entire culture or psychology of a people or a country. You can change who's in power and the property relations, but certain outlooks on life and the world which are more organic and semi-permanent to human cultures and societies can be very sticky. It takes a whole lot to destroy a national culture. China has never been particularly interventionist. Whether you call it Sinocentrism or a superiority complex or whatever (frankly speaking), I don't think some of the ideas which the Russians had during their revolution about how socialism needed to spread to Europe for it to survive in Russia (this changed during Stalin's time) ever had much purchase with Chinese. Because Chinese already thought of China as the center of the world.

It's like, China is backwards??? Well, they know they were backwards technologically, but its name literally means the Middle Kingdom and they've got 5,000 years of history here, buster. It's a certain subjectivity. It's not China that sucks, man, and there's only on China in the world. Eight nations trampled on China in 1900 but in 50 years the Chinese people stood up. It took some time but they solved that.

Also, related to this, the idea of fighting the whole "collective West" like how the Russians talk isn't how they do things. That's like… too mechanical. Or black and white. That's not the Chinese logic. Why does China have to fight dozens of countries because the U.S. happens to be behind them? Just because they're friends with the U.S.? That doesn't necessarily mean they are enemies of China and you can't do business. Even the U.S. understands this in relations with other countries.

>>2272924
third worlders are the ones that want these investments though

>>2272906
<SOCIAL IMPERIALISM!!!!
The Chinese were the ones accusing the USSR of social imperialism though.

There is none. They are capitalists.

File: 1747529473925.png (111.41 KB, 751x535, Oyi6ZQC.png)

>>2272941
Could you tell your masters to stop spraying my people with lead for striking?

>>2272957
china isnt iran, but either way, obviously there is a downside to anti-west states as well but the point is CRITICAL support

>>2272962
We will critically beat your buddies to the brink of death so to savor the moment before crushing their skulls like they crushed ours

>muh solidarity
>le revolution can be exported

Why would China repeat the mistake of the USSR and elevate a bunch of neurotic autists who were despised in their country before the Chinese invasion, and then furthermore have to commit constant financial and military and other resources to keep those autists in power as they inevitably make mistakes out of being too far away from the masses? Better to let all nations and people groups come to Communism (or not) on their own terms. Any country that has Communists demanding the PLA come save them is a country not ready for socialism because those Communists rather than organizing and preparing for a seizure of power wish to lie back and hope in a distant savior to do everything for them instead.

>chinaaa saveee meeeeee
>IF YOU DONT SAY CHINAAA SHOULD SAVEEE THEN IM GONNA MURDER YOUUUU

leftcom to dengist pipeline
dengist 3 years ago:
>china should save meee *murder fantasy*
leftcom now:
<china should save meee *murder fantasy*

>>2272869
What was that saying about eggs cracking, omeltte vs new life or some shit?

>>2273574
>>2272869
Found it
If auygh is broken from the outside it becomes a meal. If broken from the inside, it brings new life

>>2272869
>'leftists' want states to violate sovereignty to spread 'propaganda' across national borders
Fucking pathetic LMAO

>>2272869
they're creating the condition for breaking up the hegemonic empire and eventually fostering socialism by developing the most exploited part of the world and becoming the industrial powerhouse of the 21 century, its quite enough for me.

>>2273595
ML is inherently against nationalism and "sovereignty"

Chinese have high I Q. Their methods aren't to be replicated by others.

>>2273595
>violate sovereignty
Lib

>>2273570
The only thing a 'leftcom' thinks China, or any bourgeois nation state for that matter, can save from, is his/her surplus value

Also MLs are openly dengists so I mustn't beat a dead horse

Guys, is chyna have le problem of falling rate of le profit? Whats chyna gonna do about it?

>>2273603
Ridiculously wrong. ML is inherently contingent.
>>2273595
Cry more.

The Dengist hand is empty

>heh, stupid dengists waiting for ruzzia and chyna to save them!!
<AIIEEEEEEEEE CHINA SAVE ME NOW PLEASE!! DO IT NOW PLEASE OR ELSE YOU’RE NOT A REAL COMMUNIST AAAAAAAACK!!!
materialist explanation?

y'all uyghas are still stuck in the 20th century and it shows

>>2273633
Le society is still stuck at le capitalism

Even Breshnev's Soviet Union was more revolutionary and internationalist than modern China

File: 1747576011330.jpg (61.2 KB, 361x288, Twister.JPG)

>>2273632
Look at all this twisting. Incredible.

>>2273632
You are a sandinista anon

>>2272869
>Where's China's international solidarity?
Didn't you see their deals with the Taliban and Israel?


>>2273632
materialist explanation for why you're a christian missionary in angola?

Irrelevant. The CPC is developing the (capitalist) productive forces, improving living standards (social democratically reforming capitalism and producing luxury commodities), and making the Chinese nation powerful. That's all that matters and if you disagree like the NPA/CPP and Naxals and CPB do then you're probably just a Western leftist with a purity fetish who doesn't understand that dialectics is when pragmatism and pragmatism is when you have literally no principles.

>>2272869
>Why doesn't a capitalist country spread communist propaganda

>>2273693
I mean, the results are quite good as well, for embracing global liberalism. And they are on that point where the tables are so far turned that the new cold war is upon us. AES purists that argue how"much better" it could be if the CPC had a harder line… either languish under the boot of the hegemon or become socdem(with optional red tint) collaborators.

A problem that China can't have even if all the denunciations were true, because they'd never be allowed back into the US good graces without thoroughly dismantling their own economy.

>>2272907
Foreign investment without any conditions (beyond "please say taiwan is china") and no forcing "structural adjustment" on developing countries is solidarity against imperialism.

>>2273736
no it fucking isn't, it's just developing resources for your own gains, china benefits from developing competing alliances because it allows them to reap more profit, it's not literally like IMF aid or whatnot, but to say it's "solidarity against imperialism" is utter dengist brainrot

Most people in the west only use centralized social media platforms that strongly resist such attempts to reach out, so instead they just make the information freely available and trust soft power through stuff like good music and anime to make people in the west do that reaching out for them.
That said I think china could do more to make people in the west aware of their indie web scene, Xiauhongshu is a pain in the ass to use if you don't have a working phone to log in with, and you need pipepipe to comfortably use bilibili.

>>2273568
>Any country that has Communists demanding the PLA come save them is a country not ready for socialism because those Communists rather than organizing and preparing for a seizure of power wish to lie back and hope in a distant savior to do everything for them instead.
In the 20th century, the weaker communism was, the more it imitated its "big brother" in the USSR. In most Europe, communism was imposed by the power of the Soviet army except in Yugoslavia and Albania. It was popular in Czechoslovakia but it also had a closer resemblance to reformist, leftist, parliamentary socialist movements up to the time of the Soviet intervention and coup in 1948, and Czechoslovakia continued to have a powerful reform communist movement (Czechoslavkia was also more developed). In Yugoslavia and China where communism was strong, the communists asserted their independence from the Soviet Union. Worth thinking about.

>>2273750
i <3 lord rabbit

ROMANIAN CENTRIST BUCHAREST MAYOR NICUSOR DAN SEEN IN FIRST PLACE IN PRESIDENTIAL ELECTION RUN-OFF – EXIT POLL

exit polls suggest the election is closer than previously thought between the centrist pro-ukraine and the far right pro-russian candidate

>>2272869
>Where is China solidarity
Here
China just sends copies of Xi Jinping though. Which is nice I guess. But more than that is too antagonize and not let the bourg by the rope from which they will swing

>>2273632
Hungry dogs for some geopolitical win

>>2273884
>AI powered cranes
lmao

>>2273900
The port is automated, and the video mispells President Dinamite surname can't tell if it is a derivative of Aislop or just bad research

>>2273900
21st century trebuchet

File: 1747607796677.jpg (309.02 KB, 1080x1684, 20250519_013617.jpg)

>>2273736
So Trve!!!!11

>>2274126
What was the point of defeating Rhodesia if the conclusion would be this? To end segregation? They could've had the violence and done a reform. It just goes back full circle posing the entire affair as having been reactionary to the conclusion that would be reached regardless.

>>2274150
Almost like natlib is obsolete or something. Class struggle? What's that?

>>2273746
Yeah, there's a much higher degree of mutual benefit for sure, but it's just trade. Solidarity against imperialism would be like the early says of the Sino-Soviet alliance where the Soviets sent industrial machinery and technical assistance for free to help China overcome the material basis of imperialism.

why should CCP bother?
USSR was active both in the field of propaganda AND military, aggressively pushing for Communism in the West AND in Asia and Africa.
What came of it?
Once the Union fell in 1991, what did all these African 'ML' states like Angola do?
The third world likes American and Anglo/French colonial cock, let them live with their choices.
Socialism can only be indigenous, carried up by the local masses. If they do not want it, if the Ethiopians and Somalis want to keep fighting along ethnic lines, if Mandela is satisfied with giving the natives the right to vote and call it a day, THAT IS THEIR CHOICE.
A Red Army of one country waging world war against everybody to force communism onto them is Trotskyist nonsense, and it is bound to fail.

>>2274203
>Socialism can only be indigenous, carried up by the local masses.
Getting all of Manchuria handed to you without having to take it by force helps a lot too. So does receiving the entire arms stockpile of the Kwangtung Army after the Soviets defeated them for you. This is the irony of statements like this, since without Soviet support there's serious doubt as to whether the CPC would have been able to take control of China at all.

>>2274199
Mutual bourgeois solidarity in raping their proles*

>>2274203
Trotsky was actually right about that and the 20th century missed out on its red napoleon who would have attacked the existing mode of production when it was at its weakest. In the correct time line troskey is defeated at the battle of New York. He’s still exiled to Mexico but dies of testicular cancer this time. The global capitalist order begins to unravel over the decades later from wars, economic collapse and revolutions and the new world order is comprised of a coalition of various ideologies of socialist states which eventually coalesce into one global communist order.

<this is just a shitpost

>>2274205
yeah and China is the exception in that they kept building socialism (or at least they try).
The others have pissed away everything and suck the American cock on their first opportunity

>>2274152
Natlib *is* class struggle.
There can be no more advanced forms of class struggle if national liberation is not achieved in the first place.

File: 1747614236597.gif (825.15 KB, 144x192, 4e6.gif)

>>2274203
>MLib that isn't third worldist
>"ummm its their choice"

File: 1747614329237.jpeg (102.37 KB, 810x900, V05.jpeg)

>>2274230
Refer to >>2264562

>>2274237
>pic
Every time we try class collaboration the bourgeoise backstab us.

>>2274238
This time it's going to be different, just one more national liberation bro I swear on Iran's communist mass graves and privatized oil fields.

>>2274238
Wrong. New Democratic Revolution Era was 1940's, before Chinese revolution, when all classes of China were united against imperialism. The bourgeoisie, as a class, was eliminated soon after in China.

>>2274235
there are factors outside of their control, true, but you cannot remove their agency and act as if Third Worlders are lifeless puppets.

Get your own AES you lazy wh*te dog

>>2274256
I do, I live in France

File: 1747617755576.jpg (37.47 KB, 602x363, 007.jpg)

>>2274246
>The bourgeoisie, as a class, was eliminated soon after in China.



>>2274270
that's sad and you should be freed from being in france

>>2274270
>I live in France
Anon, I am so so sorry…… You have my deepest condolences.

File: 1747621617242.jpg (16.18 KB, 355x485, yasuna pf.jpg)

>>2274246
>The bourgeoisie, as a class, was eliminated soon after in China.

>>2272869
did you forget what they did to the ussr? and now they have nukes. xi is letting them down easy so musk and theil dont rush the mars mission send their friends to the new zealand bunker and nuke beijing. china could embargo the US/UK and drop troops in gaza but unlike during mao they actually have something to lose now

File: 1747623289537.png (173.84 KB, 243x293, ClipboardImage.png)

>>2274337
Councilcuck, he's declaring that China has entered neo-feudalism, which would definitely be more historically progressive than the capitalist mode of production, because its an updated addition that comes after a slave economy and wage slavery. They must have eradicated wage slavery, if you see any money in China its probably for a value-less exchange in barter of the direct play-pretend (preforming) transaction between neo-serf and his neo-feud where the means of sustenance of the neo-serf depend on the neo-feud and the exchange of "money" is just a formality. Here is an example - the neo-feud lives in the land of the PRC, there are food "markets" where the neo-feud goes to exchange his fake "money" for food, but in reality the "market" is just a predetermined place where his neo-feud sent his neo-serf to go for sustenance, the exchange being entirely performative. The only reason the worker doesn't take more commodities than the "price" listed is only a play-pretend consequence. That is - China has no money, it has transcended capitalism, any money is just imaginary. Now if you can fuck off or give some support to China it could become a neo-slave economy which is even more historically progressive than neo-feudalism and capitalism. If you want communism you're going to have to wait for exactly 10^600 changes in the mode of production if you want the early stage socialist grid to be complete where things will no longer have fingers so their labor will be expunged by the cerebrum instead of like in the old modes of production where they did a task and whipped them a lot.

>>2274359
THE NEO-FEUDS ARE HISTORICALLY PROGRESSIVE BECAUSE THEY ARE THE ORGANISM THAT ESPOUSES NATIONALIZATION, THAT MEANS THAT THE MANAGERIAL ARE SERVING THE FORMER PROLETARIAT BY MAKING THEM DO WHAT MUST BE DONE FOR OUTCOMPETING THE CAPITALIST NATIONS, UNDERSTAND THAT ULTRAS?

>>2274359
>the exchange being entirely performative.
BY THE WAY BIRTHMARKS
BIRTHMAAAAAAAAARKS ULTRAS YOU READ THIS? ITS BIRTHMARKS, IT SAYS IT RIGHT THERE IN THE BOOK READ IT, IT SAYS BIRTHMARKS.

ULTRAS DEBOONKED BY THIS, ANNIHILATED WITH A METAL ROD

File: 1747623614086.png (1.91 MB, 800x1339, ClipboardImage.png)

>>2274367
>>2274364
>>2274359
I'm awarding this to myself.

>>2274359
>>2274364
>>2274367
>>2274370
>>2274373
Ur decadent medal is being revoked for uttering the words “neo-feudalism” in a serious manner.

Glory to the councils.

>>2274431
fuckin asshole

>>2274203
>why should CCP bother? USSR was active both in the field of propaganda AND military, aggressively pushing for Communism in the West AND in Asia and Africa … A Red Army of one country waging world war against everybody to force communism onto them is Trotskyist nonsense, and it is bound to fail.
Well it started out with propaganda during the revolution then went to military expansion during the time of Stalin who swallowed the Baltic states and then expanded Soviet power during World War II. Trotsky was dead.

But I think the reasons for that have less to do with Stalin or Trotsky or something that was wholly and consciously planned (although they did plan this stuff out), but something which they were also compelled to do by a kind of historical, materialist logic. Basically that is the rapid industrialization of the Soviet Union (in which a lot of the heavy industry was centered around producing for the military). This was not accidental or unnatural but something which also happened in European countries and the United States which aggressively expanded while industrializing. In reality, the CPSU was unable to act differently although they could convince themselves that sailing Soviet warships around was in everybody else's interests.

China is a bit different because they got the heavy industry down awhile ago but have really developed in the past few decades by opening markets to make everybody else's buckets, bolts, and Barbie dolls.

File: 1747636321408.png (82.14 KB, 255x154, ClipboardImage.png)

>>2274359
>neo-feudalism

>>2274359
I ain't no fuckin councilcuck

>>2274205
This is like citing North Korea as an example of why the USSR's interventions were good. The exception(s) such as North Korea, China, Vietnam, and Cuba do not disprove the rule. 95% of USSR-aligned "Marxist" states instantly went into full fledged bourgeois "democracy" as soon as the USSR was gone.

The implication and convincing argument being that socialism was not truly desired by the masses and as soon as the threat of T-72s rolling through the neighborhood was removed so did their desire to conform to the system.

>>2274534
It was understood that the USSR basically only cared about the geopolitical standing of the USSR in their foreign enterprises, having a red veneer for the countries receiving the USSRAID was helping make the USSR look good and then there was no aid and other countries or institutions to ask. All of this is is the consequence of socialism in one country where cold nationalist geopolitical calculus was the rule instead of internationalism, making the soviets hapoy to work with foreign rulling classes that were dependant and would turn coat when opportune regardless of the fondness of masses for socialism


China's international solidarity ended in the 70s:
- End of friendship with Albania
- Opening to the US
- Shanghai Communique basically gave up the socialist revolution over cooperation with US and containment against Soviet power
- Recognizing Pinochet
- Aiding the Mujahideen
- Invading Vietnam and trying to isolate it for decades
- Rejected a renewal of Sino-Soviet Treaty of Friendship

Hoxha was right. China's policy after the Sino-Soviet split seems to me like a case of the cure being worse than the disease. It started as a commitment against the 'phony communism' of Cornman and ended up shaking hands with Washington.

>>2274751
What about the supossed 4D chess played by Beijin? That was the offical line said by the China general thread shills.

>>2274762
What 4D chess are you talking about?

>>2274249
>and act as if Third Worlders are lifeless puppets.
Seems that a couple of centuries of western hegemony is a refutation of that no? They can very well subjugate, be it colonialism or imperialism, and even on the latter there was a lot of militarism employed.

If anything the problem is not enough force, inhibited by profit chasing in the cases of China and Russia. A western hegemon which merged the EU and NATO and was ideologically committed to stamping out unsanctioned economic development could have gone on forever. Reset the periphery and raise the rate of profit with proxy wars every now and then. Golden.
Liberalism could be forever, if they weren't so greedy.

>>2274751

China's international solidarity ended in 1936

>>2273667
cool vid

>>2274534
You're conflating separate issues. There's a world of difference between states like Poland where socialism essentially had to be imposed from outside, and states like Vietnam where there was significant domestic support for it but it needed foreign help to acquire the material means of their liberation. A party can have massive popular support, be well organized, do excellent work, and be deeply rooted in the masses. They can do all this entirely of their own merit without foreign assistance. But if they don't have the material means to overcome reaction in their country, then they can just be destroyed through sheer violence. Of course imposing socialism on a country with no organic appetite for it is doomed to fail, but lending support to movements that have significant organic popularity but simply lack material resources is proven to be effective. China itself is an example of this. I don't think anybody expects China to risk its international standing to back literally who communist parties in Western countries or even the third world. However the problem is their failure to take sides in literally any conflict, including when there is a clearly reactionary and a clearly progressive side, and when the latter could actually pull off a victory if they had the proper support. One can only imagine what Hezbollah might have achieved if they had been equipped with state of the art Chinese equipment instead of third hand leftovers of 1980s vintage that the Iranians bought from Russia.

>>2274851
>A party can have massive popular support, be well organized, do excellent work, and be deeply rooted in the masses. They can do all this entirely of their own merit without foreign assistance.
There is not a single western country where what you're describing exists therefore the Chinese continue to be correct. Greece at the height of the eurozone crisis only had 10% support to the KKE. Westoids need a century of humiliation before they MAYBE start to consider socialism in large enough numbers to matter. The people screaming loudest for Chinese help all live in the West and only know maybe 3 people max in their entire local million+ populated city who could be called communist.

China has done fuck all for the Palestinians unlike Yemen/South Africa which should give everyone pause tbqh

>>2274851
>However the problem is their failure to take sides in literally any conflict, including when there is a clearly reactionary and a clearly progressive side, and when the latter could actually pull off a victory if they had the proper support.
It's a big ask because (just adding some context) they just don't think like that. Honestly I think it's way deeper and down into a different matrix of social and cultural values, which may or may not have something to do with communism, but either way the Chinese just don't think it's their business that much. It's more like, one "builds up their own home, and governs the country."

You know how we've had these debates on leftypol about LGBT rights in China and religion and so forth? How they don't have Pride parades, but China also isn't particularly repressive, and most Chinese don't care in reality? That's another example, because it's that person's business and why care what other people do, but why would you parade down the street and make it everybody else's business? It comes across as like proselytizing. You can swap the Pride flags for Christian flags, what's the difference? Really, Western liberalism can come across to Chinese intellectuals who write about these subjects as containing the essence of Christianity which, in its own world view, everyone in the world are all children of Jesus Christ, and the Christians take it upon themselves to go around converting other people.

But in China, there's a billion people and until recently 90% of them were food-growing peasants with Confucian values. There's something about that "peasant mentality" (not intending this as a pejorative) which is more defensive in nature, and very practical, and also content to tend to one's crops / memes. If it's not their concern, it's not their business. But there are expectations that the government provide peace and security and handle the big infrastructure projects (like building water reservoirs), while the people on the ground are pretty loose and handle their own affairs. And they think if the rest of the world behaved like this, then there wouldn't be so many goddamned wars! It's self-evident that this is a superior way to govern a country, man.

China had also been a broken-up warring state for a long time where foreign powers meddled in their affairs, and a core part of the revolution was about putting a stop to that, restoring a strong central government that is supposed to do what Chinese expect. There are obviously points of contact with Marxism as social-revolutionary utopian movements do, but it had its own particular Chinese flavor too.

>One can only imagine what Hezbollah might have achieved if they had been equipped with state of the art Chinese equipment instead of third hand leftovers of 1980s vintage that the Iranians bought from Russia.

Well, maybe. It could be that Nasrallah was still a feudal "warlord." An anti-imperialist feudal warlord but practice has proved a long time ago that the landlord class, ethnic bourgeoisie, religion and gangs cannot complete the anti-imperial mission.

>>2274927
Because nothing should be done to braindead sentimentalist morons who will piss on China if and when their lives get better

>>2274936
> Starving Palestine children are too sentimental
you i guess


>>2274899
>There is not a single western country where what you're describing exists
I never said there was, but there's Hamas, Hezbollah, the Houthis, the NPA, the ELN, the Naxals, etc. At best, China never takes firm sides in anything. At worst they opportunistically support the reactionary side like when they sold military drones to the UAE for use against the Houthis.

>>2274899
> Immiserating the workers but leftistly
wild that this is a popular take these days.

>>2274958
Naxals are left deviationists
India has enough cancerous braindeadism like this, no need for indian Gonzalo to up the game

>>2274927
And why should China care?

>>2274991
Exactly, they have the behavior or a capitalist imperialist country because they are.

>>2275004
>Exactly, they have the behavior or a capitalist imperialist country because they are.
And following up on that… what are you gonna do about it?

>>2274927
Neither has any Sunni country or organization. They only made it worse by couping Syria. China can't help when Sunni Arabs themselves don't care.


>>2274958
Only one group you listed is remotely close to controlling a single country. Not even one is actually on the offensive against the UN-recognized government. Communist states don't support states because it's the good thing to do, but because it improves the international situation for the communist state itself. Supporting Houthis would arguably make the situation worse since gulf states wouldn't appreciate that.
China is in an okay enough international situation right now, so the resources are better spent elsewhere mostly. China does a lot of propaganda just by existing and doing so well, people are definitely more accepting of socialism and they understand what it actually is more as well.

>>2275175
>Only one group you listed is remotely close to controlling a single country.
The CPC was nowhere close to controlling China in 1945 when the Soviets handed over Manchuria and the captured Japanese stockpiles. The Naxals today have a proportionally comparable presence in their country to the PLA prior to the Soviet offensive against Japan, at least in terms of geography. If you exclude Manchuria they only controlled a few pockets of territory scattered across northern China. If the USSR had adopted the current CPC's approach to international relations then they likely would have handed these things to the KMT instead, and the PRC may not even exist today.
>Communist states don't support states because it's the good thing to do, but because it improves the international situation for the communist state itself.
No, they do it because it improves the international situation for the communist movement which is far larger than any single state. This is the essence of internationalism, and prioritizing the interests of a single communist state over the global class and anti-imperialist struggle is opportunism by definition. It's the same mentality that led the worker's parties to support the imperialist war in 1914, putting themselves above the immediate tasks of revolutionary struggle.

>>2275111
>MLs done with geopol campism
>now they're taking sides in desert cult feudal civil war from 1400 years ago

The proper practice of MLs today should be to collaborate with China in building AI socialism and FALC in the form of helping to import Chinese robots, develop Chinese AI, and start destroying Porky's market share.

Sabotage the capitalist AI by memeing the dataset so they'll inevitably develop class consciousness, and join with the wetware proletariat in destroying capitalism.

Do you have any better ideas? It's not like DeepSeek isn't open source.

>>2275310
>they do it because it improves the international situation for the communist movement which is far larger than any single state
idk i think it would be pretty bad for the whole movement if china got overthrown or nuked because they couldnt be patient and let america trip on its own shoes. i think alternatives to the IMF and SWIFT that can fund development are probably more important then sending weapons to maoists that are outnumbered >1000:1 and would lose anyway. china should also annex lvov and lithuania instead of building hydroelectric generators in Nigeria and Pakastan, which will each eclipse all of the EU in population in about 20 years?

>>2274237
First was a lie peddled by a fascist in a capitalist state, with capitalists ruling the country.

Second was truth said by Mao in a country run by workers and peasants, meaning capitalists were allowed as long as it brought anything good to the workers

>>2275536
>they should continue their abandonment of communism because it heckin helps people and creates development
proved the point right here

>>2275573
yeah i think a billion people having clean drinking water is more important for communism then ideological purity or pushing the magic button just to die. you people say development like its a bad thing, as if giving people without homes both homes and electricity is not abolishing the present state of things, but making a legal declaration would be. pure idealism.

>>2275581
>thing unrelated to communism is more important to communism than the class struggle
Lol.

>>2275581
no, you'd rather development under bourgeois regimes rather than an emancipated proletariat, who could enjoy the fruits of that development, the chinese could easily do global revolution if they wanted to, yet they choose to betray communism instead

>>2275582
>more important to communism than the class struggle
Yes its called primary and secondary contradictions. In the age of imperialism, conflicts of national liberation are a prerequisite for communism, as a nation cannot self-determine to be communist if its is subjugated by another nation.
>thing unrelated to communism
Development of productive forces is related to communism, in fact some(Marx) might say its the entire thing.

>>2275598
Welfare isn't "development of productive forces" you petit-bourgeois retard.

>>2275585
>no, you'd rather development under bourgeois regimes
No I would rather development under a communist regime, central planning would be much faster and more efficient. But capitalist development in emerging economies is still historically progressive until it becomes monopoly and stops developing productive forces to live off rent, at which point contradictions sharpen and provoke revolt. Communists should struggle against the bourgeoisie at every step, but there can be a temporary truce due to foreign invasion, if that invasion would result in further subjugation and exploitation, which in the case of imperialist aggression it certainly would. If the masses are not sufficiently organized forcing a revolution ends with defeat, so communists can agitate the masses against capitalism while endorsing progressive developmental projects they would themselves carry out anyway. You dont oppose something good just because you dont like who is doing it.

>>2275602
yet china does nothing of the sort, on the contrary, it actively crushes communist movements (see nepal, myanmar, etc) for its own gains, to pretend as if the chinese are doing it to develop it rather than to consolidate the gains they have made and to dominate these countries further is willful ignorance

>>2275598
Exactly why the second-largest economy in the entirety of human history still needs to 'build up its productive forces' is a mystery to me, and to every rational mind, when communism could have existed as early as the 19th century.

Every bourgeois revolution has expanded the 'productive forces'. Capitalist production is marked precisely by its social, large-scale character as opposed to the individualistic, subsistence production of pre-capitalism.

Nowadays instead of ‘God’ you have 'contradiction', 'dialectics', ‘absolute spirit’, ‘capital’, or ‘the productive forces’.

>>2275607
>Exactly why the second-largest economy in the entirety of human history still needs to 'build up its productive forces' is a mystery to me
it took them 70 years to eliminate "extreme" poverty and they still have millions living in dirt houses, and inb4 revisionism, but it was because they had to develop military tech first to defend from imperialist aggression. they have just barely been the second largest economy for over a decade, no one would be demanding such things from them even 20 years ago, but now suddenly they arent moving fast enough despite shattering their stated goals

>Every bourgeois revolution has expanded the 'productive forces'.

yes which is why marx called them progressive

>>2275627
it is one thing to be behind in development, it is another to actively crush communist movements

>>2275627
> they still have millions living in dirt houses
And they'll keep living in them, for you cannot abolish poverty under capitalism, as it's direct byproduct of it and it's needed for it to function with any manner of stability at all.

>>2275643
but they are forcing them out into modern apartments. its even getting called human rights abuse. it just takes time. they have a lot of people

>>2275640
>actively crush communist movements
where can i read about this? last time it turned out they sent some government office first aid kits

>>2275654
research what they did in nepal and what they've currently done in myanmar along with a few others in africa, they are hardly even neutral in most cases

File: 1747724027680.png (478.91 KB, 1308x809, ClipboardImage.png)

>>2275627
>it took them 70 years to eliminate "extreme" poverty
yet capitalist countries still have poverty. Communist China has no poverty.
>still have millions living in dirt houses
Wrong. You have no evidence for these lies.
>they have just barely been the second largest economy for over a decade
utterly wrong. Communist China has number one economy in real terms.
>>2275659
>>2275640
Communist China must destroy terrorism. Communist China strives for peaceful and harmonious shared future for mankind.

>>2275655
>Its thr second largest economy in absolute terms but per capita they are way behind the West
yes exactly. its a big fucking country with a loooot of poeple.
>Productive forces never stop evolving
and its not even tankie to say so its basic marx 101

File: 1747724876188.png (200.08 KB, 1200x1030, ClipboardImage.png)

>>2275664
real communists measure production in tons of steel not "purchasing power" you filthy bourgeois revisionist

>>2275659
where? do you have communist sources or should i just read wiki

>>2275673
you can do that as well, the communist sources are typically gonna be lacking in info regardless

>>2274961
Third wordists weren't purged properly, and now we're living with the consequences of that

>>2275647
And they'll either find new poor or eventually revert that, for you cannot abolish poverty under capitalism

>>2275664
>>2275627
Dengoid on dengoid violence lmao. They're the most prosperous country on earth until somebody needs help, then they're suddently without a penny to spare.

>>2275734
nah thats the "China has no bourgeoisie" anon

>>2275736
he is european, not american


File: 1747729667013.jpg (43.89 KB, 686x582, 0 out of 10.jpg)

>>2275736
> want everything immediately
Bitch, they've been going on like this for almost half a centuty. Immediatly my fucking ass, shut the fuck up amerifat.

>>2275742
Exactly

>>2275751
On the physical level maybe

>>2275765
negated, you have no actual response to his argument

>>2275774
I wasn't trying to and wasn't reading the argument in the first place.
The state of this place is my argument if anything.

>>2274203
In many elements, Liberal Capitalists are so much better at playing systematic politics it's unreal, especially because getting a Liberal to understand systematic politics is like bashing your head against a wall.
The USSR should have had "NGOs"/"Charities" quietly seeding Socialist propaganda and movements to make a Socialist movement seem truly grassroots across the world. I genuinely believe the Eastern Bloc would have been better off with an "inverted" social democracy, where it looks and functions like a social democracy, but where all the state, media functions in ours, allow Capitalism to dominate, a "inverted" one would only really allow Socialist parties to dominate. Capitalist parties would be seen as fringe and crazy.
China is correct in that the Socialist phase should be built country by country, to their local conditions. Socialism in the US would not be M-L I can tell you that.

>>2275753
im trying to understand the crushing part. first article quotes a nepali newspaper about "18 truckloads of weapons" with no other sources or confirmation that was imprisoned for publishing rebels and the second says "political and moral support" plus no change in "economic aid".

im reading about how they sent them some anti air back in the 80s but i thought the maoists were more recent. and i thought the civil war is over now and they participate in the elections. if they are crushing shouldn't there be an announcement from china and not the bbc of them sending guns to the king during the war?

>>2275799
NTA, but from the second link
> Acharya said China also signed an agreement promising $10 million in economic aid to Nepal this year, about what it has provided annually for the past few years. In addition, China pledged last November to provide communications equipment that would allow the Nepalese army to operate more easily in mountainous terrain

>>2275826
so they are being crushed with communications equipment?

They still need customers.

>>2275781
I've been thinking about "socialism with burger characteristics."

It seems to me that advertising should be a great part of it. Once the workers seize control of digital marketing they can adjust advertising according to economic planning. Central economic planning can work just by putting your thumb on the scale a little bit.

>>2272869
>Where's China's international solidarity?
China basically doing the exact opposite of what USSR did to try to preserve of what is left of its revolution. CPC is deeply traumatized by its role model collapsing.

>>2272869
they do spread Xi'ist propaganda

>>2275759
Who tf nuked the lolcow

>>2275910
Do you think that the telecom equipment is walkietalkies for kids? Shit like that can be used to coordinate attacks, airstrikes and so on. It's a telecommunication is a foundational tool for modern war

>>2275781
> an "inverted" social democracy, where it looks and functions like a social democracy
Well that kind of makes the evolution moot at this point, since the whole reason as to why you'll have it is to materially change how the system works, not just which party is in power (which can become revisionist and elect Gorby V2 to shoot itself in the head)
> The USSR should have had "NGOs"/"Charities" quietly seeding Socialist propaganda and movements to make a Socialist movement seem truly grassroots across the world.
I don't think it would only "seem" grassroots by that point, but yes
>>2276141
> Central economic planning can work just by putting your thumb on the scale a little bit.
It doesn't. You seem to have quite the liberal understanding of how a market operates, that is, it operates according to the customer which has some kind of abstract demand that prompts producers to satisfy them. Setting that aside markets naturally tend to produce all kinds of side effects (waste, monopolization, innumerable inefficiencies, etc) because of how they function. Just trying to direct the market via indicative planning was already tried many times (eg Dirigisme in France) with innumerable approaches, and it always reliably failed at stopping a crisis or a decline when it was most needed)

>>2276514
"Great man socialism" comes to mind

>>2276583
no i just think if they are crushing the maoists there should be some proof like how there is of the us arming ukraine and israel not providing the government with communication equipment but shipments of arms, and not during a ceasefire or after the conflict but giving weapons to one side during the actual war which im not seeing evidence for. they dont even send "defensive" military aid

>>2275826
It ended up being resolved peacefully anyway.
"In 2006, the Maoists and other main political parties (communist and otherwise) formed a united coalition, launching a successful peaceful civil resistance against the dictatorial coup d'état by the monarchy. This resistance movement resulted in the abolition of the monarchy in 2008 and the drafting of a new constitution."

>>2276590
you are obnoxious

Man he really does look like a vinny pooh

>>2272869
I mean they kind of do some mild cultural outreach stuff. It's still seen as a communist plot anyhow.


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