/leftypol/ - Leftist Politically Incorrect

>>2362090
I'm not searching out the evidence you're supposed to present to me, retard

>>2361180
The discourse surrounding Vietnam here is quite interesting, especially after China and Vietnam signed the joint statement almost 2 years ago. It's looking more and more like Vietnam isn't going to be the Ukraine of Asia after all. Wonder how long before the GFVN and FULRO is taken out of cryo-stasis under Langley and we're all told them in the name of True Socialism.

>>2362149
Asking people what they want to do IRL does not mean I believe words on imageboards matter. In fact it is evdience to the contrary.

>crying
anyone can make this characterization about any post. it is so lazy. actually you're the one crying and I am just stoically stating facts. (See how easy it is to stoop to this kind of rhetoric?)

>And saying you’re aiding in manufacturing consent for US invasion of China
Not precisely what I said. Let's revisit the full sentence in its context:

>>2361632
>At best it is just whining, at worst you will be helping your capitalist government manufacture consent for war

So I am saying when people come here and say "self-described AES nations aren't really socialist" I am saying that they are whining. But if they do it in real life with a prominent platform they are manufacturing consent. So I already had built into the statement the criticism that came afterwards:

>>2361856
>This would be valid if any of us went on somewhere like CNN or NYT or MSNBC, etc. not fucking leftypol lmao

The person who said this thought I hadn't already considered that because of their uncareful reading.

and recall that I was trying to generalize this point to OP's question and wasn't even talking about china specifically. it was the misinterpreters of my initial post here >>2361213 who made it about china and dengism without reading even though that subject was not even mentioned. Then they had the nerve to say zigger go die in a trench for putin even though that was not brought up either. There is a consistent overreactive anticipation on the part of my responders ITT: They're expecting a certain type of person to show up, and that type of person does exist but I am not them. I am making a significantly more nuanced points that has already included the critiques that my responders subsequently made without reading. Meanwhile my responders are responding to things I never said expecting I will say them when I have already said things to the contrary. Then they have the nerve to call me a debate addict while trying to perform epic owns of a position I don't have for an audience that isn't watching.

>>2362544
Lel I remember when leftcoms were claiming that China was doing imperialism against Vietnamese rocks in the South China Sea just a couple of months ago.
Now Vietnam is suddenly twice as bad as China KEK

>>2361811
>>2361822
Kek, the final step of the ultraoid.

>>2362337
no investigation, no right to speak. go back to reddit

>>2362825
No evidence, so you have no point and are coping

>>2362878
You are coping. The evidence is that the Party had exceeds its goals early and revises them upward. https://tapchicongsan.org.vn/web/english/focus/detail/-/asset_publisher/FMhwM2oQCZEZ/content/the-13th-national-party-congress-resolution/#

>>2362886
>Has yet to provide for a single piece of evidence that was demanded and keeps going on about how calling yourself socialist is the whole deal
You maga commies truly are the greatest retards

>>2362908
The evidence is before you. Vietnam stands free and prosperous. you slander Communist nations. you are anti-communist. you are the retard

Engaging with a glownonymous account in June 2025 is definitely a conscious choice you can choose not to make, his only goal is to clog up threads and waste time

The CPV never said they reached socialism. It’s basically a red socdem country.
>>2361577
To Lam is a goddamn idiot.

>>2362943
Vietnam is Communist regime. cope and seethe, social democrat neoliberal.
>>2363695
Wrong. Vietnam has reached socialism. Vietnam has socialist market economy. Read 2021 Political Report of the 13th National Congress of the Communist Party. You are a goddamn idiot social democrat.

>>2361733

Are you seriously using epsteinoid memri-tv clips. Showing your hand early aren't you shlomo?

>>2363701
>Vietnam has reached socialism. Vietnam has socialist market economy.
Ok, then I hope they have a communist revolution to advance more!

>>2362925
You don't have evidence, we all know

>>2364193
The evidence is clear as day. Poverty is eliminated in vietnam. The real and continious improvement in living standard of proletarians demonstrates the socialist nature of vietnam. The exploiting class has been eliminated. A socialist system has been established. The transformation of private property to socialist system is complete. Vietnam is Communist.

I would like to thank the Actual Socialists for being some of the loyalest supporters of Empire our foreign policy. You stood by us against the USSR and continue to stand with us against the CCP regime. Although USAID is no more, you still have a place alongside us. Let's strike another blow together against the BRICS, the CCP and others that oppose the American Empire authoritarianism of all kinds! Just as you supported us in Libya and Syria against the Gaddafi and Assad regimes and just as the original Anti-Campist Max Shachtman supported our war in Vietnam 60 years ago, please join us again as we regime change support the democratic revolution in Vietnam! Once again, the Three-striped Yellow flag will fly over Saigon!

>>2361689
Doing the left door is important to doing the right door, since the left door falsifies the communist programme and theory.

>>2364304
The CCP sided with US foreign policy against the USSR. Chinese imperialism temporarily allied with US imperalism to fight Soviet imperialism.

The only real communists left on the planet are the only ones who criticize all imperialism.

By falsifying Marxist theory, leftists have been the most effective anti-communists on the planet for the last 100 years. They are the greatest allies of the capitalist ruling class of all capitalist countries - whether its China, USA, Germany, India, or Vietnam.

>>2364380
>leftists have been the most effective anti-communists on the planet for the last 100 years.
You mean the movement that's been dead since the fall of the soviet union at least?

>>2364304
But mr rubio we make a lot of money selling weapons to vietnam and they let us park our ships there, it's a natural ally against china

>>2364382
The movement was severely diminished after the collapse of the Communist party in 1920s USSR. Since then, for a hundred years, the real communist movement has languished. However, thanks to the efforts of some dedicated communists, the original theory and doctrine remains intact within a real communist party like https://www.international-communist-party.org/ and groups like https://www.ruthlesscriticism.com/

As capitalism approaches yet another major crisis and the possibility of a third world war, there is hope for the communist movement that a real communist party can once again win over a revolutionary working class, and establish global communism.

No one here has actually expounded on what Vietnam is doing economically or governmentally or policy, just taking about abstract garbage. No wonder western Marxists are so ineffective at anything practical. How can we have a discussion on Vietnam if it’s all bullshit abstract philosophy and not actual policy?

>>2364407
here's another thing you've probably noticed: critique or apologia of existing (eastern) socialism substitutes dirty jewish practical organizing (in the west)

>>2364407
A fifth proletarian manager appeared which means they are building socialism

>>2364413
>>2364415
There’s nothing wrong with critiquing Vietnam but we need to actually focus on policy. Years back there was a debate about work hours and pay, that is a practical discussion and not some retarded abstract philosophical discussions.

>>2364415
yeah i'm sure that being a billionaire in vietnam and in the west has the same societal implications
nevermind that most capitalist billionaires come from several generations of aristocracy or capitalist while socialist billionaires are made in one generation because of state policy. totally the same thing. i'm sure this guy has the same command of vietnamese labor power, their weal and woe, the same way bezos has; or that 'his' wealth is actually an indicator of political influence (like in amerikkka).
888-COME-THE-FUCK-ON-555
YOU ARE A FILTHY EMPIRICIST

>>2362076
Nazis never said they were socialist - at least not remotely in that way as it is formulated in the Vietnamese constitution. They had their own conception, they Marx and Lenin Jews and made clear they had nothing to do with it. It made to do with Spenglerist "Prussian Socialism" based on the Volksgemeinschaft, nothing to do with the working even remotely.

It's a completely non-argument. Vietnam is a Marxist-Leninist socialist republic that firmly in control of their bourgeoisie. Plus, their opening up was mostly just a concession to the US to stop being a global pariah. They still have thousands of co-ops, state control of the heights of the economy and every Vietnamese is a guaranteed a plot of arable land (there is no corporate agriculture in Vietnam).

>>2364425
>They still have thousands of co-ops, state control of the heights of the economy and every Vietnamese is a guaranteed a plot of arable land (there is no corporate agriculture in Vietnam).
Many capitalists have this as well

>>2364421
Plus cooperatives are quite big in Vietnam plus they have a pretty high amount of land ownership. Don’t quote me on that. I don’t have the statistics, I would like recent ones if they are out there.

>>2364420
>>2364421
🙄 A billionaire is a billionaire dude.
>>2364425
> and every Vietnamese is a guaranteed a plot of arable land
Petty-bourgeois "socialism." Nobody should own land.

>>2362908
MAGA Coms and Haz dislike Vietnam, they said so multiple times. You can't even get your strawmen right

>>2364430
Maga coms don't have a consistent ideology like every bourgeoise ideology because they are reactionaires, retard.

>>2364427
Que? Tu sabes lear idiota? The capitalists in the Vietnamese economy cannot command labor the way capitalists do in other nations, that’s what the anon is saying. Vietnam is much more progressive than China in this respect. China is sort of reversing the trend by their rural revitalization initiatives but it’s more of an entrepreneurial program than it is for a way to give laborers a real stake in their lives and options the way the Vietnamese have. They can labor for a company to supplement their already existing land. I fucking wish I could have the option to work in my own or work for some company if I wished.

>>2364429
>A billionaire is a billionaire dude.
this is literally a tautology and a non-answer without any kind of relativistic/dialectical approach and reminiscent of anarchist/liberal absolutist talking points with justify and perpetuate the old world. bleh.

>>2364429
Do you know the history of landlordism in Vietnam and especially colonial plantationism? My god you are a retard. It's a small plot where they grow rice for subsistence. Even peak Stalinist USSR had people grow vegetables in raise chickens in their backyard.

>>2364425
>Nazis never said they were socialist - at least not remotely in that way as it is formulated in the Vietnamese constitution. They had their own conception, they Marx and Lenin Jews and made clear they had nothing to do with it. It made to do with Spenglerist "Prussian Socialism" based on the Volksgemeinschaft, nothing to do with the working even remotely.
You have to understand that "Anti-Campism" as a tendency primarily exists to justify regime change from the "Left". It shouldn't be any surprise that they use the same fallacious and libelous tactics that pro-NATO liberal-nationalists use against the people's democracies of Eastern Europe.
>>2364430
>>2364432
Why do people still talk about a meme tendency that for all intents and purposes, exists exclusively on Haz's Discord? Has anybody even met an unironic "MAGA Communist" anywhere?

>>2364433
Notice how you didn't refute my objection. Now you're moving the goalpost to it doesn't matter that capitalists do the same thing

>>2364429
Fucking kek. Even with Stalins collectivization, the majority of peasants still owned their land as cooperatives. It wasn’t the peasants that undermined the Soviet Union because they were quite much more well off than the urban laborers, in fact what undermined the Soviet Union was the white collar PMCs taking over the government, a government that was a workers government when Stalin was running things.

>>2364436
We're talking to you right now

>>2364436
>Has anybody even met an unironic "MAGA Communist" anywhere?
I did, a girl. In Vienna out of all places

i finally understand why lenin said that you cannot understand marx without reading hegel
A = A but also A != A breaks anarchist and liberal minds

>>2364438
I did refute your objection, you are ironically the one moving the goal post lmao. Now that is some obvious projection my guy.

>>2364446
>N-No u
Gottem

>>2364427
Not under a socialist republic based on Marxism-Leninism. No SocDem country has this much control over their national bourgeoisie - a domestically grown bourgeoisie subservient to the party after the original one was completely eradicated. What SocDem country has ever done that?!

>>2364448
I win. Uphold AES Vietnam as the greatest socialist success in this century.