🗽UNITED STATES POLITICS 🦅"STOP TALKING ABOUT EPSTEIN!" edition
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>>2385602 >>2386960He hadn't lost everything. Given how explosive his case was, how much information he had and how many connections he had there was still the possibility of some amazing plea deal. But it was easier for them to just kill him instead.
>>2386962>>2386977Did he even have any family or anyone to threaten him with?
>>2387034Aryan Nations and The Order were in the Northwest. Ruby Ridge happened because the feds though they were terrorists.
>>2387053Rome got sacked several times and still didn't immediately collapse. Took centuries and even then the eastern roman empire continued on for another thousand years.
>>2387088king lear…you are not this threads pillar….
You are the sites pillar
>>2387071You are alright except your obsession with race maps makes me question your Marxism
your Humongous Black SSR still gives me nightmares
>>2386622BTW Iron Felix, I'm calling you out to be the retarded moralistic dumbass you are. You are steeped in guilt.
I am not a fascist and I think that concept "the volk" and race science are spooky as hell and are complete BS.
I swear turd-worldism is like a religion to so many burger "communists". Stop being spooked by this christian style of guilt and stop wishing for the JDPON Judgement Day and Rapture. It will never happen.
TL;DR Stop bring spooked and take your meds.
>>2387116You are an anarchy-Yankee-supremacist and retard Felix is right about you
You use 'spook' faggotry to cleanse the sins of your Empire and to defend the imperialism of your wretched volk
>>2387118>>2387068He is a zionist. He considers Jews to be genetically progressive people. A weird thing to say at a moment that the Jewish supremacist state of Israel are conducting a genocide.
What would you call a person who says that germans are naturally progressive people in the year 1942?
>>2387148No, I will not boycott the three most entertaining retards on imageboards
I dont come to leftypol for reasoned, mature discussions. I come here for apes shit-flining and these 3 never disappoint
>>2387166That's basically the vibe I'm getting from him, its like a Christian trying to make someone fearful of the spook of hell to force them into compliance with their spooks.
I was just pointing out how ridiculous it was that he was trying the same shit as Christians do when they try to "scare" atheists into being Christian.
>>2387172you are making up scenarios in your head
nobody is trying to make you scared
you could say its a … SPOOK! in your head
>>2387174Or rather, I was explaining how his mindset is similar to that of a religious person who can't stand people not being the same beliefs as his own. Trying to make a atheist "afraid" of hell when that doesn't work because the atheist doesn't believe in hell and thinks it's a ridiculous fairy tale so why should the atheist be afraid of it?
Trust me I know how religious people act and think; PFLP-Anon and Iron Felix very much have that religious mancheian/black and white mindset.
>>2387113My Maps are not based on Race, they are based on the Marxist-Leninist principle of Self-Determination of all Oppressed Nations in their own SSR as articulated in Lenin’s “The Socialist Revolution and Right of Nations to Self-Determination”
https://www.marxists.org/archive/lenin/works/1916/jan/x01.htm and Stalin’s “Marxism and the National Question”
https://www.marxists.org/reference/archive/stalin/works/1913/03a.htm and the National Delimitation Policy of the IRL USSR
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/National_delimitation_in_the_Soviet_Union , as all of the SSRs and SFSRs in my Map of the future Global USSR, are based on Nations/Ethnic groups which meet Stalin’s definition of the Nation as a "historically constituted, stable community of people, formed on the basis of a common language, territory, economic life, and psychological makeup manifested in a common culture", with the only exception to this being the Giant “Black African SFSR”, which I plan on splitting up into many new SSRs based on the Ethno-Linguistic demographics of Sub-Saharan Africa when I remake my Map in the near future, and I only lumped them together in the first place not because of Race but due to the fact that I am not as knowledgeable about the Ethno-Linguistic demographics of Sub-Saharan Africa as I am about the rest of the World, 😂🤣✊😜🇨🇳🇰🇵🇨🇺🇵🇸🏳️🌈🏳️⚧️🚀☢️!
>>2387197The first world Maoist does not give a fuck about Africans the same way he does for others
No surprise here
>>2387331you have it precisely backwards, purchasing power parity is much more relevant because it determines what the the normal working people can actually purchase with their local currency. Nominal is only relevant as a metric for imperial core capitalists who like to outsource jobs and import commodities. As dedollarization accelerates, the nominal will matter less and less and the PPP will matter more and more. If the average wages of a nation purchase a bigger basket of
essential commodities, that is a sign of growing strenght. Americans have the strongest currency in the world in terms of global purchasing power and yet local prices inflate because their currency's purchasing power is rapidly weakening. NATO is on top but falling. BRICS is on the bottom but rising.
>>2387336Thank you for the source. I have now read the text since I know it isn't copypasta.
To answer your question again. No I still don't believe them lol
>>2387393>one of his associatesWhy are you trying to downplay his decades long relationship to his girlfirend?
>(the source is schizo Ari Ben-Menasche)You didn't know anything about Maxwell but suddenly you're an expert in sources connecting him to mossad?
>why would this matter?ziobro, family connections are used in Mafia cases why wouldn't it also be used for government agents?
>>2387393some days ago, here in lpol I posted a reflexive idea on how the US left was seeing the right in the context of Epstein, philosophizing if the US left was diverging or converging towards the same rightwing idea that Epstein represented a truly horrible image for the American state in all the senses.
some people laughed and sarcastically replied that they were waiting for someone to say that Epstein was communist.
now, you come in and say that Ghislaine Maxwell's father wasn't one helluvah of a mossad agent (not only Ben-Menasche, but also Seymour Hersh confirmed this) you come in and ask: "why would this matter".
The question you should ask is:
>Why wouldn't this matter.Do you know how nepotism works? don't you think there's no nepotism in the elite? if Ghislaine's father was a mossad agent, (he was), then Ghislaine most certainly is also a mossad agent. and with her connections helped Epstein career.
by ignoring these links, you are more a liberal that:
>pretends in the west there is no nepotism>pretends that the mossad, the creators of horrible psychological and military operations couldn't build a network of pedophilia to sabotage the US operations.which is truly the depiction of idealism.
if anything, you should be angry, but here you come with smug questions just to be contrarian with /pol/ on everything, as if that's a compass in life: do always and say always the opposite /pol/ does and says.
>>2387419liberals love to apply "occam's razor" and "innocent until proven guilty" to the ruling class even though occam's razor only applies to explaining physical phenomena uncomplicated by human politics and the presumption of innocence is merely a bourgeois legal guarantee to make sure nobody is found guilty without evidence.
The truth is there is overwhelming circumstantial evidence of these crimes in the ruling class, but because they control the flow of information, the legal system, and the very due process by which evidence is examined, they are rarely found guilty.
And then the liberals just repeat lazy thought terminating cliches about evidence, due process, and occam's razor over and over because apparently unless the CIA films itself doing a coup and releases it to the public it didn't happen, and so forth.
>>2387424wait is this real?
I take pamphlets with a grain of salt, is this real?
>>2387479No it was dissolved in the 1870s.
You know, after the American Civil War ended?
https://www.tandfonline.com/doi/full/10.1080/15481603.2024.2346383#d1e1557It's funny how Trump is always bitching about the Ethiopian dam for some reason. It was always just hyped up bullshit. Egypt and Sudan both have many dams on the Nile.
>This study has analyzed water surface coverage changes and geomorphological changes of the Blue Nile associated with the construction and operation of the GERD using Landsat 5, Sentinel-2 imagery, and CHIRPS precipitation data. The analyses have been conducted with the control and impacted areas, with different sections and time periods before (2009–2011), during (2011–2019), and after (2020–2022) GERD construction.
>The most significant change in water surface coverage area, as expected, was observed at the construction site of the GERD (Section B), which expanded substantially from 30 km2 in 2019 to 721 km2 in 2022. On the other hand, the river flow from the GERD site to Khartoum exhibited a modest rise in water levels, with a 1.93% increase in 2020 and a 1.78% increase in 2022 compared to 2018. However, no significant changes in water surface coverage area were observed within the first 30 km downstream of the GERD Dam or the subsequent 180 km downstream of the Roseires Dam. >>2387468Conservatives hate FDR because he acknowledged the power of the working class and temporarily gave into some of their demands. Liberals love him because despite giving into the working class the bourgeoisie still held onto their power.
Ultimately FDR strengthened capitalism long enough to defeat the USSR and now the bourgeoisie are taking back all the benefits they gave workers.
>>2387518>muh constitution, muh states rights, muh checks and balancesAll technicalities hiding class war. Lincoln sidestepped it to lessen the competition of workers with slaves while FDR sidestepped it to give workers who were dealing with mass unemployment and bad working conditions some extra benefits.
Conservatives hate them both for giving into the proles at all. Conservatives have always wanted naked tyranny but liberals want to give crumbs instead. It's just a difference in strategy.
>>2387546>Ackman was raised in Chappaqua, New York, the son of Ronnie I. (née Posner) and Lawrence David Ackman, the former chairman of a New York real estate financing firm, Ackman-Ziff Real Estate Group.[10][11][12]Clearly he started from nothing.
>>2387555>who fucking cares about Epstein.Everyone but panicking MIGAtards
>>2387555>It’s a bourgeois distractionthe bourgeoisie are distracting us from fighting them by accidentally revealing everything disgusting about themselves? Really makes you think.
>demonratsah yes the demonrats are deliberately drawing attention to the Clintons to do their own Q
>>2387617To be fair to Lincoln his generals deliberately sabotaged the war effort for the first year of the war because they liked slavery. And getting assassinated kinda ended any hopes of reconstruction or rehabilitating the South so that's not really his fault.
But, he could've made more of an effort to immediately punish Southern slaveholders with public executions after the war. Not doing that really backfired hard because he thought there'd be enough time to fix things gradually.
>>2387526>could be that he bought the house and then transferred ownership to a company he also owned, so maybe illegal or something but not unheard ofAccording to the article he lived in it for 2 years before his company bought it.
>Epstein moved into the townhouse in 1996, according to Vanity Fair, but there was no evidence proving he owned the home. The first proof of ownership, however, is dated 2011, at which point the home was transferred to a company owned by Epstein for $0.
>The townhouse was bought in 1989 by founder and CEO of L Brands Les Wexner for $13.2 million. Wexner then sold it in 1998 to the New York-based Nine East 71st Street Corporation (NES) for an undisclosed amount. Public records from 2011 show that Epstein held, to some degree, ownership of NES. Details of his relationship with the company are still unclear.https://www.vanityfair.com/news/2003/03/jeffrey-epstein-200303The Talented Mr. Epstein>Lately, Jeffrey Epstein’s high-flying style has been drawing oohs and aahs: the bachelor financier lives in New York’s largest private residence, claims to take only billionaires as clients, and flies celebrities including Bill Clinton and Kevin Spacey on his Boeing 727. But pierce his air of mystery and the picture changes. Vicky Ward explores Epstein’s investment career, his ties to retail magnate Leslie Wexner, and his complicated past.>March 1, 2003It's funny because that's in reference to this book about this murderer/conman. That's before any of his convictions too.
>>2387663I'm well aware that is their ultimate goal, but they dont have direct authority over local public libraries, at least not yet. By my estimates they're going to be one of the hotspots of the new "culture wars" so to speak, especially with how public libraries have specific initiatives and programs to help immigrants. But short of some kind of executive decree that puts all county powers into the hands of the executive they're not going away any time soon, although they might be subject to ICE raids which is all the more reason for me to be involved.
>>2387669Also this. The job is an opportunity to network with people who might be inclined towards the "radical left"
>>2387705>Why would anyone who is used to answering emails and playing solitaire all daydo people really think that's what office jobs are? Maybe for managers and execs, but the lowerdowns are basically constantly getting screamed at by customers over the phone, juggling like 8 different spreadsheets, being dragged into meetings which pulls them away from their work and makes them have to stay late, correcting incorrect and outdated info, etc.
I know plenty of people who quit office work and went into a unionized manual labor trade because that shit can be soul crushing. I also knew a middle school math teacher who quit to become a plumber.
>>2387728>My point was some pencil pusher in NYC has nothing to worry about having to be coerced into farming after socialismyeah sure but
>you assume these jobs that only exist when employing undocumented or slave labor would exist under socialism whyseems to imply that nobody will need to pick the crops "cuz socialism," it's like no, we need to automate these jobs, them becoming unnecessary is not an automatic process because even automation itself is not an automatic process. it's something that's implemented by real people doing labor.
>>2387709i quit my cushy solitaire office job because it bored me to hell, my manager was quite literally taken out of 'the office' and i was close to losing it one day when he annoyed the shit out of me with his attitude and moody bullshit.
so far clueless as to what else to do because my degree basically dooms me to do office shit in big corpos
>>2387499what? a DNC candidate is doing DNC things?
people is going to get fetterman'd at the speed of light.
>>2387747*votes for democrats*
that was easy 😅
>>2387738I wasn't aware I ever said cotton pickers. I posted pic related which is guys harvesting what looks like white onions which are underground as the bulb and have those white flowers up top. Have you ever seen cotton before? It looks completely different. My point is that whether this is done by undocumented workers or not it's still done manually. These jobs haven't been automated yet. You were like "ummmm do you really think this will be necessary under socialism" but that wasn't the original conversation. You originally said "ummm field work what is this 1925" as if nobody does field work. The vast majority of crops are still harvested by field workers, whether they're working in combine harvesters or doing it by hand is immaterial.
you've moved the goalpost from "field work doesn't exist anymore" to "field work won't exist under socialism" to "that's cotton" even though it wasn't cotton.
btw I'm not even the original anon I just jumped in because the remark about "field work? what is this? 1925" was fucking stupid
July 14 (Reuters) - OpenAI, Alphabet's Google (GOOGL.O), opens new tab, Anthropic and Elon Musk's AI firm xAI have won contracts of up to $200 million each, aimed at scaling up adoption of advanced AI capabilities in the U.S. Department of Defense, the government agency said on Monday.
The contracts will enable the DoD to develop agentic AI workflows and use them to address critical national security challenges, the department's Chief Digital and Artificial Intelligence Office said.
https://www.reuters.com/business/autos-transportation/us-department-defense-awards-contracts-google-xai-2025-07-14/>>2387766i know. did you even read. it's onions in the picture. I'm not talking about cotton. anon said "field work? what is this 1925"
using a combine harvester is still "field work" and many other crops are still harvested by hand, like onions.
>>2387778socialism doesn't just automatically automate all the necessary farm work
I wasn't the same anon who suggested office workers need to get out in the field, I jumped in when you suggested "field work, what is this 1925?" I was talking about just that post, I was not in the conversation before that. I wasn't talking about "under socialism" which is hypothetical future shit, but right now. so much picking work is not automated yet.
yes of course demand for farm work will be less. we literally throw out half our food already.
>>2387544>Unions and so called working class “rights” only serve capitalism to maintain it and keep it going.eh, it's more like the peaceful steps towards a revolution, but they can be easily co-opted. but they are not bad per se, just depends on how reactionary is the state.
in any case, redlining was reactionary.
>>2387776it was actually gifted to him by the FIFA president:
https://www.thedailybeast.com/trump-kept-gold-club-world-cup-trophy-for-himself-so-fifa-had-to-give-the-winners-a-replica/>“They [FIFA] said: ‘Could you hold this trophy for a little while?’ We put it in the Oval Office and then I said: ‘When are you going to pick up the trophy’, and [FIFA President Gianni Infantino] said: ‘We’re never going to pick it up, you can have it forever in the Oval Office,’” Trump explained in a mid-game chat with the broadcaster, DAZN. He then revealed to reporter Emily Austin that the victor, Chelsea, actually received a replica of the original for winning the tournament.>The FIFA boss has been in Washington, D.C., 10 times since Donald Trump returned to office in January, in an attempt to woo the president. He has previously argued that proximity to the president is “absolutely crucial” to the success of the 2026 World Cup, which will be partly hosted in the U.S. >>2387797day 1 after the revolution you aren't going to have a bunch of machines that automate tasks poof out of nowhere, you have to make them in the real world, which means building factories, training people, procuring raw materials, etc. Just because capitalism holds back or even sometimes deliberately destroys the productive forces because it is afraid of the falling rate of profit does not mean that the new means of production will magically appear the moment the bourgeoisie are defeated. It takes WORK and TIME.
Listen to the section from this chapter titled "the deliberate destruction of the productive forces" starting at about 3 minutes
>>2387773Honestly not even announcing a party but still matching in polling is pretty good, 'course this is coming from an American perspective where third parties go to die.
>>2387777>>2387789>I swear to god I'm gonna kill Corbyn in Fortnite if he doesn't announce an actual party soonAccording to the Jerusalem Post, Corbyn just revealed the logo of his "New Party".
>>2387801so when you said
>socialism doesn't just automatically automate all the necessary farm workwhat you REALLY meant was
>socialism doesn't just automatically automate all the necessary farm work [on day one]ok thanks for your input bro
>>2387806it doesn't
automatically automate period. Not on day one. Not on day two. It's a gradual process that takes a long time. China had its revolution in 1949 and doesn't expect to be out of its transitional phase until 2050. Building a socialist society is not automatic. workers still need to do shit. And until things like harvesting crops is completely automated, there will still be humans in the field. Have you seen techbro shit like vertical farms and strawberry picking robots? They have thus far proven to be hyped up failures. It's not just a lack of willpower or not being socialist yet, making new technology is complicated.
> “Liberation” is an historical and not a mental act, and it is brought about by historical conditions, the development of industry, commerce, agriculture, the conditions of intercourse… >>2387827WHAT ARE YOU DOING, LABORER???
GET THE FUCK BACK INTO THE EVIL ASS RAPE MINES
>>2387773Labour, like all other bourgeois collaborators, should be destroyed. The UKKK has no right to exist, nor should it. Anything that degrades or diminishes their government is objectively good.
>>2387804I wasn't aware he was creating the "C"PUSA.
>>2387831Obviously not, but all waking hours will be productive and revolve around labor and contributing to the socialist revolution. Whether it’s physical work in factories or farms, education on theory, regular exercise and healthy meals to ensure peak performance, military training, or rearing children, every aspect of a person’s life should revolve around socialism one way or another
>>2387833“Slavery” is such a retarded thing to declare moral opposition to because slavery to one’s group is a vital part of a healthy functioning state and by extension communism. For if men are not made slaves to their group they will invariably be made slaves to another
>>2387843天生萬物以養人
人無一善以報天
殺殺殺殺殺殺殺
>>2387820>>2387825>>2387833Genuinely funny how at least some niche segment of the socialist movement out here just actively wants to create a dystopia.
As I keep saying, it's been made into a supplemental religion for a portion of its adherents. Just like how radical evangelicals will adopt absurd stances that do nothing but antagonize people as a result of their religion (remember distinctly this post of a prot mother destroying her kids pokemon cards because they used the term "energy" and "energy" is "not of god") you'll get Socialists openly abandoning the "movement" side of things to be a religious faith with some bizarre internal policing mechanism.
>"Under Socialism your living standards will fall!">"Under Socialism we'll bring back child labor!">"Under Socialism we'll all be working 24/7!">"Under Socialism we'll have a panopticon surveillance state!"I've literally seen all of these argued by "socialists" on here, and the only conclusion I can come to is that "Socialism" or "Communism" has just nestled itself in the religious part of their brains and so they feel compelled to talk about how awful it'll be so as emphasize the glories of paradise in the hereafter.
Political movements are based on improving things for people in their lifetimes. Religious ones glory in immiseration in the present for the glories of the hereafter. Should any of the former positions become the defining feature of "Socialism" than there's really no purpose to supporting it.
>>2387858This is just the other side of the same coin as Utopian Marxists that think we can eliminate labor, magically make mpreg possible, legalize all drugs, give every trans woman a real vagina, and provide every incel with a government-assigned robot anime daughter-sister-wife.
Well I'd still take the Utopians over the Feudalists, if only because I want the anime wife.
>>2387851the issue is a red fascism that gives emphasis to the identity of labour rather than its abolition. fascism as you know, is largely born out of syndicalism (as bordiga reports):
https://www.marxists.org/archive/bordiga/works/1922/bordiga02.htm>In addition, there were currents of the left bourgeoisie: the Italian radicals, left-wing democrats and republicans whose tradition demanded liberation of Trieste and the Trentino. And thirdly, the intervention movement also embraced some elements of the proletarian movement: revolutionary syndicalists and anarchists. And this grouping also included an individual of particular importance, ᴉuᴉlossnW, the leader of the Socialist Party’s left wing and the director of Avanti. What remained in the fascist movement were the far-right groups plus those from the far left: ex-anarchists, ex-syndicalists, and ex-revolutionary syndicalists.we see from the ACP for example, a "workerist" tendency based on the valorisation of value rather than its deconstruction. lots of the "left" is like this today. i would call it fascism, but you are the expert on fascism, so what do you think? to me, fascism confuses proletarian abolition with proletarian identity. the left to me is then inherently bourgeois in its historical character, while the fascist attempts to eradicate the bourgeois epoch in place of something else; something undefined.
>>2387857>These people should just stop with the charade and join up with NRx already. Their ideal society is already pretty close to that of Curtis Yarvin or Nick Land.Unironically I think these types and the Nick Land folks prove that the "Death of God" in western society has been an absolute disaster. It's not necessarily that religious thinking has declined but rather it's been sublimated into politics; it's not enough to merely labor and struggle in this world under the belief that the hereafter will be better, instead the religious impulse expresses itself in some desire to create a society wholly "unlike" what we have now. The NeoReactionaries want us to live in monarchical city-states. The Third Worldists want us to live in the killing fields. Fascists want us to be transfigured into muscular Greco-Roman statues. The Prots want to usher in a Thousand Year Kingdom.
But the fact is that when it comes to politics, especially working class politics, you want to create a politics
for people. The number of folks that'd actually want to live under Serfdom or what have you are so insignificant a minority that they basically don't exist beyond extremely loud individuals. The topic of actually getting people to believe in their nonsense is irrelevant because it's not about an actual living political movement, but rather expressing ascetic purity. Back in the day, Monks would ritualistically mutilate themselves. Today the modern flagellants are people who adopt bizarre and anti-social ideas in the name of proving their piety. If one was a Libertarian, for example, Murray Rothbard's writings about "a market for children" and the right of parents to starve children to death serves no function beyond an intellectual exercise "proving" that their particular priest is willing to take the next step; like some Buddhist monk immolating himself to prove that all things are transient, the Libertarian extremist is willing to let babies be eaten to prove that liberty is the highest ideal.
Unironically I think these people need some kind of spirituality, if only to get all their batshit insanity out of their system. It can be literally any kind, Hell, even going mad and calling yourself a Socialist and a Wizard like Alan Moore or Eliphas Levi would be
infinitely healthier than expressing their spiritual impulses through politics with an actual material stake.
>>2387851>>2387870I wouldn't even call it fascism since fascism at least tends to be upfront about its expectations. This shit where you throw in some 1984 dystopia with some hammers and sickles attached is more akin to what I call Marxism Euronymousism, or Euronymous Thought if you prefer. A member of the infamous black metal band Dissection, Euronymous self identified as a communist not because he believed in liberation of the working class or anti-imperialism or was even really against commodities. It was because he went to Poland, saw people suffering, and the misanthropic shithead was automatically like "erm BASED department???" So his attraction to communism was entirely based on his belief that it would make people suffer which for him is good because he was a walking cartoon villain.
Thus, "communists" like the ACP or Felix in some cases should be grouped into Euronymous Thought, as they are more concerned with how communism is going to punish people rather than actually improving the quality of life.
>>2387882warehouses use manual labour, so it is already fetishised by workerists. what the implicit criticism of unproductive labour carries is sexism and queerphobia.
men's work = good
effeminate work = bad
>>2387905right now, i am transferring my thoughts to you through the medium of the internet. i create no value, even i transform society.
>>2387907machines increase production at a rate that they diminish value - so the less value per product means more liberation.
>>2387909>>2387911so what is the material difference between the operations of a barista and these people?
>>2387870>the issue is a red fascism that gives emphasis to the identity of labour rather than its abolition.You really hit the nail on the head I think. Something Fascism is really obsessed with is image, specifically the image of movement, strength, action, hard labor. This trend towards the "image" of labor rather than a scientific understanding of it, leads folks like Haz to decry Baristas as "not true proles" because they don't work in the steel mills. To folks like Felix, "labor" is always the most undignified and physically demanding thing, the third worlder splitting his fingers picking crops by hand.
But though I've studied fascism more than most, I wouldn't call myself an expert. Still, I've said before that I think the only reason Haz and Maupin aren't calling themselves "National Socialists" is because Hitler took the term first. And a fun little fact about ᴉuᴉlossnW is that prior to his nationalist turn, he made a big stink of being anti-nationalist, saying "The Italian Flag was only fit for a dung pile" or something like that. So I personally think that a lot of the militant anti-national types are far closer to fascists than they believe themselves to be.
>>2387916What adds profit to a capital accumulation.
If a custodian is employed at a factory and cleans that business, they are not productive.
If the same custodian gets transferred to a private custodial service that gets hired by a factory, the same janitor doing the same work is now productive
>>2387870>to me, fascism confuses proletarian abolition with proletarian identity … the fascist attempts to eradicate the bourgeois epoch in place of something else; something undefined.I think that's part of it but also combined with Sorelian vitalism and the figure of the super-heroic Dionysian barbarian who has a "fear of being laughed at" but strides victoriously across the age. It's like a heroic fantasy with a romance hero. Hitler was a romantic figure and that's how hardcore neo-Nazis see themselves. Like knights in armor on their quest like Don Quixote. There's also psychological armor which ones wears as protection from the existential Big Other.
An element that freaked out the right in the 20th century was the decline of a fantasy version of chivalry with its notions of dest-uh-neeh and honor and duty and all that crap… m'lady… that they believed in (or thought they believed in). "Blood and honor." And that was going into decline in the modern age with its tendency to subject everything to scientific planning or decadent consumerism. Where's the nobility!?!?
>>2387869But they won't and will find billions of excuses as to why.
>>2387878>He left Rød Ungdom, allegedly because he came to realise that they were "just a bunch of humanists".[74]>Hellhammer said "Euronymous wanted to be the most extreme person, and he thought that communism was very extreme", but that he later claimed to be a fascist.[52]Those people only like the liberal idea of communism being a super scary dictatorship and always end up something else when they actually find out what it's about.
>>2387922to marx, slaves created no value because they never got a wage; they represented fixed capital, like machines. my data can be stolen, but in that case, i am a slave.
>>2387924>What adds profit to a capital accumulation.right, which from the time of smith was defined as "productive" labour as opposed to "unproductive" labour. even smith recognised the necessity of unoroductive labour, he just saw that materially, it never generated value. the qualification of productivity can seem vague, but we may still make extreme examples. a janitor to smith is not productive, yet a factiry worker is. but okay, to you, a janitor is productive. would you say then that there are gradients of productivity? for example, is a factory worker kore or less productive than a janitor?
>>2387931what makes their labour unvaluable? it can be an open question, as i am seeking to entertain.
>>2387904>pol potUnironically the niche fanclub he has among some western leftists is a great example of what I'm talking about. One can't look at the Khmer Rouge and tell me there's anything noble or "good" about it, unless one's own idea of what's "good" has been so warped by heady ideals that it doesn't resemble anything close to human thought.
Which, again, it might just be healthier to get into Occultism at that point. At the very least doing rituals in robes isn't harming anyone… probably. At the very least it wouldn't be harming Socialism by saying "We're all gonna be working and watched at all times." Shit, if you're really desperate for punishment, go on some religious fast or something. The Hermetic Order of The Golden Dawn are still around, just do that. But for the love of God just don't selfishly grab a movement for the liberation of the working class and make it about slave labor and karmic punishment.
>>2387955>The Superman movie could literally have Superman turn to camera and break the fourth wall to explicitly encourage the audience to join Hamas and I would still think you are crazy for calling a Superman movie "anti-Zionist".That seems dumb.
>It being a Superman movie precludes that.Why?
>>2387963>Which, again, it might just be healthier to get into Occultism at that point. At the very least doing rituals in robes isn't harming anyone… probably.Yeah O9A and occultist neo-nazis commit more murders and commit more actual violence than regular wignats by a large margin, whose energy usually goes into starting larp parties rather than mass shootings.
>At the very least it wouldn't be harming SocialismMarxist socdem larp parties harm the name of socialism more than 1000 unironic Pol Pot supporters, I will stand by that, a mind full of heavy ideals is an good one.
>>2387970this is where you are being hysterical. calm down.
as i have explained, productive labour is oppressive; unproductive labour is liberating. you are confusing normative terms for scientific ones. greater productivity leads to lesser value being produced; this is marx's basic formula for labour power:
https://www.marxists.org/archive/marx/works/1867-c1/ch01.htm>The introduction of power-looms into England probably reduced by one-half the labour required to weave a given quantity of yarn into cloth […] and consequently fell to one-half its former value […] The value of a commodity, therefore, varies directly as the quantity [duration], and inversely as the productiveness [intensity], of the labour incorporated in it.value [SNLT] = [duration/intensity]
for example,
[8hrs/800units] = 0.01 SNLT [per commodity]
[4hrs/800 units] = 0.005 SNLT [per commodity]
so less valuable labour = more overall productivity
(wealth is not the expansion of value, it is its reduction, by the cheapening of commodities for consumption). a richer society has less valuable labour therefore. this is WHY in poor countries, things are expensive to them.
>>2387976its fascist to glorify hard labour, yes.
>>2387978bro the AI drew him jacked.
honestly it made him look really friendly too.
Take out the text and this is straight up a pro felix meme
>>2388010I look at this as a clinical dissection of a system where people try to absurdly pick sides despite it being impossible and pointless.
I'm aware of how this works i just find the intent searches ridiculous
>>2388010>as i have explained, productive labour is oppressive; unproductive labour is liberating.Ah yes who is more liberated than a maid?
>greater productivity leads to lesser value being producedNo it doesn't. It leads to the value of individual commodities becoming lower, but generally the same amount of labor continues to be put into commodities, creating a greater amount of material wealth while the total value doesn't change that much (being essentially a function of the size of the working population and a matter of how hard they are worked). In the power loom example the value of cloth may have fallen by half as a unit price, but the amount being produced was increased by double, or else some portion of the labor that went into making the cloth went into something else.
>>2388026valorisation = self-expanding value
capitalists try to expand value as much as possible to counteract falling rates of profit that come from increased automation. value-producing labour is glorified because it is directly profitable, while unproductive is indirectly profitable (for example, you cannot realise the value of a coffee *without* a barista, but the value of the coffee is itself not created by the barista - this would be implying that the means of production had no value immanent to them beforehand).
>>2388031its better than being a silver miner
>>2388037>It leads to the value of individual commodities becoming lower, but generally the same amount of labor continues to be put into commodities, creating a greater amount of material wealth while the total value doesn't change that muchthis is where you must see waste and overproduction in capitalism. wasted commodities destroy their own value, so that labour is lost from the whole. if we were to make production efficient, it would be lowered therefore, and so less value would be produced directly.
>>2388036im not trying to pick sides. my criticism is that glorifying value is a trait shared by capitalists and red fascists alike. the error from the left is presupposing value = good. remember, use-values are contrary to exchange values.
>>2388025>socialism is national liberation and actual sovereignty for the colonized world,Socialism is workers collectively owning the means of production. Nations are just a means to the end of socialism not the end itself. It seems you are simply a nationalist.
>europe and japan have NOTHING TO OFFER. Except all the resources on those lands, including the labor power of the people living there.
>>2388007
>That still doesn't answer why electricity is a decadent luxury that westoid parasites can only get thanks to enslaving the third world. As if we dont have oil production within the borders of America. As if solar power and other renewable resources dont exist. So why would a socialist America (or whatever nation takes its place since America must be destroyed and all that) be deprived of electricity when it can produce it itself?Because in some religions, like certain interpretations of Christianity, there needs to be a "Hell" the bad people end up in to assert the superiority of the good people in Heaven. I can't remember who said it, but there was some old line like "Part of the pleasures of Heaven is being able to look down and see the torments of Hell"
So to create Hell in the first world, which is really all these people want, they need to think of what ways they can materially deprive first worlders. So they want to basically send us back to the stone age. They want kids dying of curable diseases, they want electricity being revoked, they want water to be contaminated. They try to create some justification like "The only reason you have clothes is because of the third world" but the reality is they just want to come up with no ways to turn the first world into a metaphorical hell.
>>2388060the barista's labour is useful, not valuable.
thats the difference
>>2388084coffee as a commodity has a use-value and exchange value.
my claim is that its use-value is delivered to you by the barista, but the "momentum" or conservation of its exchange value is transferred from its means of production. this is its immanent value, which is realised in its mode of saleability.
>>2388091bartenders are not there to provide access to alcohol, they are there to restrict it
DOWN WITH BARTENDERS
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