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/leftypol/ - Leftist Politically Incorrect

"The anons of the past have only shitposted on the Internet about the world, in various ways. The point, however, is to change it."
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Not reporting is bourgeois


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Thread for the discussion, analysis and news regarding the savage and primitive barely contacted North Sentinel Island hunter gatherer people.
Think of it as geopolitics applied to the iron age.

Current population: ≈15 - 500

News:
https://www.survivalinternational.org/news/tribes/sentinelese
https://www.ndtv.com/topic/north-sentinel-island
https://www.hindustantimes.com/topic/north-sentinel-island/news

Latest developments:
-In April 2025, a YouTuber, Mykhailo Viktorovych Polyakov, was arrested after staging an attempt to contact the tribe. He trespassed, left a can of Diet Coke and a coconut, and may face significant prison time.

Timeline

i think a cluster bomb should be dropped on these guys

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>>2441815
Think of the BBC

Vid from 16th of October 2024

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>>2441788
Yep, it's Actually existing socialism time

>>2441788
>iron age
are you sure they have any metal technology? I guess they are still in the stone age.

>Mykhailo

I guess he managed to leave before February 2022 and he's avoided being Kinzhal'd for three years, yet he bothered to travel to a remote island where the indigenous are known for shooting arrows everytime someone from the outside world tries to get to the island. Peculiar indeed.

>left a can of Diet Coke

he deserved to be arrested and to face significant prison time.

>>2441846
>are you sure they have any metal technology? I guess they are still in the stone age.
Yes that's certain, they've scavenged the MV Primrose cargo shipwreck. They use iron tipped weapons.

reminder that they were only as hostile as any other group of uncontacted peoples up until Brits in the 1880s violently abducted 4 islanders, an elderly couple and 2 young kids, all of which became sick, and the elderly couple both died soon after
if strangers kidnapped 4 people from your family and then they got sick and 2 of them died, maybe you'd avoid contact with them ever again too

also you can literally see their paths and sometimes building on the edges of the island from google maps, it's worth checking ever 6 - 12 months to see the changes

>>2441846
>are you sure they have any metal technology? I guess they are still in the stone age.
And they would've been forever, if not for outside intervention since their island seems to lack any significant deposits of metals
they have scavanged from ship wrecks and scrap metal trash that lands on their shores, they lack the ability to forge the metal exactly but can reheat it and alter it slightly in that manner

Funny, I just flew above it yesterday


>>2441788
What's their opinion on the Israel-Palestine conflict and which side are they supporting?

Just leave them the hell alone. Must Western society smear its putrid faeces into every nook and cranny of the universe?

They don't live in the stoneage retard, they live in the current age and that affects their way of living. They are probably aware disease killed of all their neighbors and will kill them too.

>>2441988
>if strangers kidnapped 4 people from your family and then they got sick and 2 of them died, maybe you'd avoid contact with them ever again too
How would they know they got sick and died if they were kidnapped? Did they read about it on the internet?

>>2441846
>are you sure they have any metal technology? I guess they are still in the stone age.
It says in this video >>2441790 that they had iron tipped arrows in their first recorded contact.

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https://www.nationalgeographic.com/premium/article/first-woman-chattopadhyay-contact-sentinelese-andaman
Meet the first woman to contact one of the world’s most isolated tribes
>In the later 20th century, the Indian government, which administers the Andaman and Nicobar islands archipelago to which North Sentinel belongs, attempted to make contact with the Sentinelese—attempts that usually ended with a volley of projectiles fired by the island’s residents from the shoreline. (In one event in the 1970s, the director of a National Geographic documentary about the Andamans was wounded by a spear while filming). While most attempts were unsuccessful, two encounters in the early 1990s were notable for the fact the Sentinelese accepted coconuts from a team that included anthropologists from the Anthropological Survey of India (AnSI).

>As a Ph.D. fellow with the AnSI in January 1991, Chattopadhyay had her first chance to join a team going to North Sentinel. But there was a catch: women were not included in groups that went to establish contact with the “hostile” tribes the islands. “I had to give a written undertaking saying that I knew about the risks involved and would not claim compensation from the government for any injury or loss of life,” Chattopadhyay recalls. “My parents also had to give a similar written undertaking.”


<Floating coconuts


>“We were all a bit apprehensive [during the January 1991 expedition] because a few months earlier the team sent by the administration had encountered the usual hostility,” says Chattopadhyay. Her group approached the island in a small boat, steering the vessel along an empty beach toward a spire of smoke. A few Sentinelese men, four of them armed with bows and arrows, walked out to the shoreline. “We started floating coconuts over to them. To our surprise some of the Sentinelese came into the water to collect the coconuts.”


>In the two to three hours that followed, Sentinelese men waded from the beach into the water repeatedly to collect the coconuts—a novel product that does not grow on their island—while women and children watched from a distance. Yet the threat of an attack on the anthropologist outsiders remained present, Chattopadhyay recalls. “A young man aged about 19 or 20 stood along with a woman on the beach. He suddenly raised his bow. I called out to them to come and collect the coconuts using tribal words I had picked up while working with the other tribes in the region. The woman gave the boy a nudge and his arrow fell to the water. At the woman’s urging, he too came into the water and started picking coconuts,” she says. “Later some of the tribesmen came and touched the boat. The gesture, we felt, indicated that they were not scared of us now.” The AnSI team climbed to the shore but the tribe did not take them to their settlement.


>Chattopadhyay returned with a larger team a month later. “This time, our team was bigger because the administration wanted to make the Sentinelese familiar with all the team members,” she recalls. “They watched us approaching and came to meet us without their weapons.” Not satisfied with just collecting floating coconuts this time, the Sentinelese climbed into the team’s boat to take an entire bag of coconuts. “They even tried to take the rifle belonging to the police, mistaking it to be a piece of metal,” Chattopadhyay adds. One of the team members then tried to take an ornament made out of leaves worn by a Sentinelese man. “The man got angry and whipped out his knife. He gestured to us to leave immediately and we left,” she says.


>Bad weather spoiled a third trip, undertaken a few months later, “There was no one on the beach, and we returned without seeing anyone,” she recalls. After that, the administration decided to reduce the frequency of visits to North Sentinel Island to protect the residents from exposure to diseases that they likely lacked defences to.


>Chattopadhyay, went on to work in India’s Ministry of Social Justice and Empowerment, has no interest in returning to North Sentinel. “The tribes have been living on the islands for centuries without any problem. Their troubles started after they came into contact with outsiders,” the anthropologist says. “The tribes of the islands do not need outsiders to protect them, what they need is to be left alone.”

>>2442113
But if they've been there 60,000 years, I doubt the Europeans were truly the first people ever to land there. Any other seafaring people in the region could've landed there before and that could be where they got the iron from.

>>2441850
Can it really be considered an iron age if they have no knowledge on how to extract iron from nature itself?

Like, there probably was a paleolithic hunter-gatherer who made a really cool spear with meteoritic iron, but would you consider that that hunter-gatherer is in the iron age?

Isn't that the island that killed some weird Christian mercenary some time ago?

>>2442112
Because they returned the islanders once they realise they were dying

>>2441788
What are their opinions on lgbt rights?

>>2441846
>are you sure they have any metal technology? I guess they are still in the stone age.
The neighboring contacted people don't even know how to make fire (only preserve fires that start naturally)

>>2442118
stone, bronze, iron, etc aging systems aren't used any more because they are imprecise and don't really capture important developmental changes

You ever wonder if any gay stuff has happened there?

I feel sad for these guys never having to feel the joy of eating a double cheeseburger, or watching Rick & Morty late at night while drinking beer, or playing Binding of Isaac until you ragequit because of bad run.

>the savage and primitive barely contacted North Sentinel Island hunter gatherer people.
Marxism yet again proving to be problematic and in line with colonial attitudes.

>>2442356
Could you sound any more like a degenerate consumerist drone?

>>2442361
Is it better if I were to sound like a sexual degenerate instead?

>>2441788
>savage and primitive
Revisionists again regurgitating colonial and imperialist attitudes. What a shock.
>>2442359
Nothing "marxist" about this.

>>2442332
"""Gay stuff""" happens in every single human and mammal society

>>2442359
>>2442461
https://www.marxists.org/archive/marx/works/1884/origin-family/ch01.htm
They literally have a hiearchical system of "savagery." Why do you guys always claim to be the purist "Marxists" but always get offended about the un-PCness anytime someone ever quotes or references Marx?

MORGAN is the first man who, with expert knowledge, has attempted to introduce a definite order into the history of primitive man; so long as no important additional material makes changes necessary, his classification will undoubtedly remain in force.

Of the three main epochs – savagery, barbarism, and civilization – he is concerned, of course, only with the first two and the transition to the third. He divides both savagery and barbarism into lower, middle, and upper stages according to the progress made in the production of food; for, he says:

Upon their skill in this direction, the whole question of human supremacy on the earth depended. Mankind are the only beings who may be said to have gained an absolute control over the production of food … It is accordingly probable that the great epochs of human progress have been identified, more or less directly, with the enlargement of the sources of subsistence.

[Morgan, op. cit., p. 19. -Ed.]

The development of the family takes a parallel course, but here the periods have not such striking marks of differentiation.

I. Savagery

(a.) LOWER STAGE. Childhood of the human race. Man still lived in his original habitat, in tropical or subtropical forests, and was partially at least a tree-dweller, for otherwise his survival among huge beasts of prey cannot be explained. Fruit, nuts and roots served him for food. The development of articulate speech is the main result of this period. Of all the peoples known to history none was still at this primitive level. Though this period may have lasted thousands of years, we have no direct evidence to prove its existence; but once the evolution of man from the animal kingdom is admitted, such a transitional stage must necessarily be assumed.[A]

(b.) MIDDLE STAGE. Begins with the utilization of fish for food (including crabs, mussels, and other aquatic animals), and with the use of fire. The two are complementary, since fish becomes edible only by the use of fire. With this new source of nourishment, men now became independent of climate and locality; even as savages, they could, by following the rivers and coasts, spread over most of the earth. Proof of these migrations is the distribution over every continent of the crudely worked, unsharpened flint tools of the earlier Stone Age, known as “palaeoliths,” all or most of which date from this period. New environments, ceaseless exercise of his inventive faculty, and the ability to produce fire by friction, led man to discover new kinds of food: farinaceous roots and tubers, for instance, were baked in hot ashes or in ground ovens. With the invention of the first weapons, club and spear, game could sometimes be added to the fare. But the tribes which figure in books as living entirely, that is, exclusively, by hunting never existed in reality; the yield of the hunt was far too precarious. At this stage, owing to the continual uncertainty of food supplies, cannibalism seems to have arisen, and was practiced from now onwards for a long time. The Australian aborigines and many of the Polynesians are still in this middle stage of savagery today.[B]

(c.) UPPER STAGE. Begins with the invention of the bow and arrow, whereby game became a regular source of food, and hunting a normal form of work. Bow, string, and arrow already constitute a very complex instrument, whose invention implies long, accumulated experience and sharpened intelligence, and therefore knowledge of many other inventions as well. We find, in fact, that the peoples acquainted with the bow and arrow but not yet with pottery (from which Morgan dates the transition to barbarism) are already making some beginnings towards settlement in villages and have gained some control over the production of means of subsistence; we find wooden vessels and utensils, finger-weaving (without looms) with filaments of bark; plaited baskets of bast or osier; sharpened (neolithic) stone tools. With the discovery of fire and the stone ax, dug-out canoes now become common; beams and planks arc also sometimes used for building houses. We find all these advances, for instance, among the Indians of northwest America, who are acquainted with the bow and arrow but not with pottery. The bow and arrow was for savagery what the iron sword was for barbarism and fire-arms for civilization – the decisive weapon.[C]

Imagine all the cool primitive sex they're having. From their POV a quick missionary is probably the hottest thing on earth.

>>2442598
Pretty sure they will be much less restrained in their sexuality because there is no superstructure in place to control people via for example sexual restrictions. Missionary is probably boring af to them because they‘ve always experienced sex first hand instead of through a screen. They probably don‘t even have incels.

>>2442598
>>2442614
Do they even have concepts of sexual orientation like we do?

Dying preventable deaths and being completely at mercy to the whims of nature and not knowing how the fuck the world works at all and casually killing every outsider you come across is good because uhm… They're just like that!
Every single human deserves the choice for something more, even if they may not take it. We're not here to build walled gardens and look down at everyone outside like they're interesting little ants. I'm not saying we should drag them kicking and screaming to civilisation yet - we're still figuring it out ourselves - but I think they really deserve better; I'm sure there's an ethical way to approach this if we gave enough of a shit.

>>2442911
ok coloniser

What would Lenin do?

>>2442940
Sentinelese autonomous zone

>>2442911
absolutely inhuman reasoning
>the only way these people without governments and property and scarcity can be free is if we force them into wage labour and give them iphones
mindless modernism.

>>2442940
Make them proletarian and then make a DOP

>>2442918
I agree that we shouldn't just bang on their [metaphorical] doors and ask them "Have you heard of our Lord and Savior Vladimir Lenin?", but the way North Sentinelese live is… NOT perfect and becames more and more dangerous the each passing year (at the very least because of the climate change). Pointing that out and discussing potential ways of uplifting these people doesn't make one a coloniser.

>>2442176
>Killing protestant missionaries
Holy based
>>2442911
European kkkracker colonizer c. 1900

>>2443020
>NOT perfect
<No need for clothes
<No wage labor
<No capital
<All resources readily and freely available
<Can spend all day eating, socializing, enjoying nature, working out and fucking
Excuse me?

>>2443043
If the way of life of these people is so good, why don't you go join them?

>>2442940
Deportation of the North Sentinelese to Goa

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>>2443074
picrel =(

>>2441788
They need to become proletarianized, they need to be integrated into the economic system and contribute to the developing of production

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>>2443074
I'm haunted by obligations, social ties and experience. But I'd probably be happier had I been born there.

Also consider, if their lives are not what they consider to be perfect, why aren't they trying to leave? They know there is a bigger outside world. They're capable of building boats, and have in the past. but it doesn't appear anyone in recent memory has tried to migrate to other islands or the mainland.
I don't think anyone should introduce ideas and technologies which would give way to a (capitalist) division of labor, wage labor and capital in the name of bringing "civilization" to the island.
And they especially shouldn't have their culture contaminated with misanthropic religions which argue the material world and human existence itself is shameful and sinful.

I think teaching them the basics of writing or how to make instruments (using materials accessible on their island) is perhaps okay. Protestant missionaries trying to teach them they'll go to hell if they refuse to convert or worship a particular god, and should wallow in shame and self-loathing on the other hand, isn't.

>>2443111
>>2443111
>I think teaching them the basics of writing or how to make instruments
This is what the brazilian government has been doing for decades, we contact isolates tribes, teach them basic portuguese so we could communicate and integrate them into the government so they can stand up for their rights and denounce farmers, gold-diggers and lumberjacks who encroach their lands, although there are always christcuck missionary parasites breaking this rule and trying to convert them

>>2443111
>why aren't they trying to leave? They know there is a bigger outside world.
They had a few poor experiences and it wounded them, and I doubt the average person would have the resources and willpower to make their own sea-worthy boat and go off into a place they've constantly been told is dangerous.
What good have they seen from us? They see weird metal birds, huge ass metal boats all wrought of some weird super material they don't know how to make and fashioned in incredibly precise, dangerous looking shapes. They wouldn't necessarily be aware of vaccines, healthcare, prosthetics, satellites, the internet, reduction of food scarcity, etc. etc.
>I don't think anyone should introduce ideas and technologies which would give way to a (capitalist) division of labor, wage labor and capital in the name of bringing "civilization" to the island.
It is not a noble way to live and you do not know these people. They are PEOPLE, they're not just some cool culture that we have to preserve. Even if you think their way of life is better, they deserve a CHOICE. They deserve to understand how the world WORKS and they deserve modern MEDICINE, and I'd argue it's always good to be more free from the burden of labouring all day - it's good to have tools! They're not stupid, they've learnt how to use all that metal for iron arrows and whatnot. And it'll better prepare them for the culture shock for the inevitable 2050 Total Communist/ASI Victory, of course.

>>2442940
get into a long winded debate about national self determination

>>2444411
The North Sentinelese aren't a nation retard.

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>>2443111
>why aren't they trying to leave? They know there is a bigger outside world.
Why would you try to leave? What would you hope to gain?

>>2444410
>They wouldn't necessarily be aware of vaccines, healthcare, prosthetics, satellites, the internet, reduction of food scarcity, etc. etc.
Why would they need to be though? When it comes to healthcare, if they have a non-biomedical view of disease and don't consider it something to be "solved", and are at peace with their own mortality and aging, including what many today consider "mental illnesses", what would it add to imprint on them the idea that diseases ought to be cured and there's something wrong with them?
If they believe they'll be reincarnated or ascend to an afterlife after death, what would it add to tell them their cosmology is false and not backed by modern science?

You can go further and extend it to writing itself; By teaching them to write, you're also imprinting the idea that there is value in permanence and potentially deny them ability to simply "live in the present". You might also introduce social stratification between those who are literate and those who aren't, as often seen in history. Where until very recently, in most parts of the world, only certain classes could read and write.
What if they view their daily activities not as strenuous labor and mere survival, but as an opportunity to socialize with others? As some supposedly "primitive" known tribes already do?
>It is not a noble way to live
Why? If they wanted to know how the world "works" they can venture out themselves. No one is stopping them, they have the means. At no point in the past 100 years have they made any attempt to either visit other islands or the Asian mainland, or leave with researchers, either individually or in groups.
Sure maybe they have some weird taboo against leaving, maybe they think they can't return if they do, or that they'll curse their people, or that their ancestors or gods want them to stay on the island, or fear there might be no one to take care of their elders, or some reason we can't phantom.
But they still have the ability to think for themselves.
So at some point you have to contend they choose to live like this, even though they should be well aware at this point it's possible to live differently.
Maybe they deliberately refuse outside technology because they see it as a threat to their way of life, or perhaps because they already share everything (primitive communism) and feel introducing outside tools they cannot replicate themselves would lead to instability and some having more power than others.
Just because they're supposedly technologically primitive doesn't mean they're mentally and philosophically primitive. They might very well have elaborate arguments and a well developed vocabulary in favor of their own isolation.

They should be left alone. This is a genetic bottleneck event that will end them naturally.

>>2442911
You're saying it like a liberal but I do think it is just purely the 'noble savage' myth that makes people celebrate North Sentinelese society. Modernity, industry and capitalism are overwhelmingly good things. It's also kind of like a religious idea, where everyone was better off in the Garden of Eden and industrialisation was a satanic thing that destroyed the natural order.

Primitive Communism is not Communism, it is not a perfect system that should be emulated, it is a less efficient economic system in which people's lives are worse off in every way. There is nothing good about people being poor and living short lives.

The issue is you are thinking of it incorrectly in terms of "dragging them kicking and screaming to civilisation". That is just liberal colonialism. If we do that they will just be taken over by a corp, they will all be kicked from their land and a U$ airbase will be built on top. Any form of capitalist uplifting is just thinly veiled colonialism.

Even if it were socialists trying to accelerate their societal development, progress cannot just come from without, it has to be an internal thing. So the whole idea of uplifting has to be dropped. People can't stay isolated forever, capitalism is already affecting the Sentinelese. In the ideal world medical equipment and such could be given but this is a capitalist dominated world in which anything like that would just end in the island being ethnically cleansed. We need to treat everyone as people and work on the issues they find important rather than keeping North Sentinel as a human zoo or going in with cracker's burden and displacing them all.

>>2444526
They didn't leave because all their interactions with the outside world until recently were terrible! What would they even do if they landed somewhere else, get abducted by scientists and then die of disease, or be murdered by some Indian fisherman who is worried about the competition? That's just such a ridiculous thing to say. A whole society is not content living a certain way. A society is a product of what economy it has. Their society is just stable, not praiseworthy. Do you really not think the young people on North Sentinel don't look up at the night sky and with things were better?You're taking their own agency away as people, turning their shit situation into a fantasy you can live through vicariously from your hyper-urban home which you won't and can't give up.

Any sort of 'uplifting' (a disgusting word) just means primitive accumulation for the capitalists. And keeping them as a human zoo is all about the natural order of humanity, it is fascism.

Instead of this wankery, why don't you treat indigenous people as humans who also only live in their particular social-economic situation, like you or I do. We need to be able to understand the people around us and address their problems.

>>2444540
>It's also kind of like a religious idea, where everyone was better off in the Garden of Eden and industrialisation was a satanic thing that destroyed the natural order.
No. That's not what this is about. They're not the primitive sinless counterpart to the sinful modern world.
It's about the assumption that somehow their culture needs to be 'fixed" or there's something wrong with it, but every time I see people bringing up what's supposedly wrong and what they're missing out on, it's projecting their own values and fears on a different culture. Including their fear of death. But mostly nothing which has actually to do with communism.
It's especially strange people on a supposedly communist imageboard would critique the Sentinelese islanders for being "primitive" even though there is no evidence they engage in any form of wage labor, internecine warfare, or slavery.

>Primitive Communism is not Communism, it is not a perfect system that should be emulated

I think depending on the form it takes, the social relations under it should be emulated. Is socialism when everyone has plastic surgery, a car and shelves full of funkopops? I don't see why communism has anything to do with accumulation in itself.
This idea that what is primitive is "bad" and "Civilization" should progress in stages towards communism, is a lot more ideological and religious than arguing that maybe, if some people refuse to leave their island, even if they're aware they can leave, that maybe we should just leave them alone. And that whatever we do, perhaps we should first try to understand what they're on about instead of imprinting our own fears and assumptions (informed by life under capitalism, not socialism no less) on a people which appear to reject them.

>>2444547
Maybe, but that too is an assumption in itself too. Because from what is known in form of written historical record, it doesn't appear they were much different before Europeans arrived, and thus perhaps they have deeper reasons which go beyond a few "bad" interactions. It's again imprinting our own culturally peculiar ideas on an "alien culture", similar to how some people anthropomorphize animals and AI, and how liberals assume their values and way of life are the only ones aspired to and envied the world over.
Not saying this might be the sole reason they aren't exploring the rest of the world, but from my own experiences with many different cultures I know that many "universal" assumptions are particular to specific cultures, upbringings, social structures, (material) levels of development, faiths and "ideologies".

>A whole society is not content living a certain way.

How would we know if we cannot communicate with them, because apparently no one is willing to simply listen to what it is they're saying?
What is the basis for them supposedly being dissatisfied with their own way of life? Their lack of access to certain capitalist commodities we take for granted? How is that not us imprinting out own values and fears on people we cannot communicate with on a deep level at the moment?
Why is it absurd to assume people need plastic surgery, a big mansion in the suburbs, a shelf full of funkopos an Labubus, a successful career under capitalism and an expensive car in order to be "happy", but it isn't absurd to assume the Sentinelese must be dissatisfied with their existence because they can't order clothes off TEMU and don't have access to prozac?
We're not dealing with people who raid their neighbors for slaves or sacrifice them for some unknown purpose. This isn't comparable to how feudal and precapitalist slave states should be judged.
If tomorrow we had world communism, and people still choose to live like this, would you force them into a mental institution?

>>2444588
>it's projecting their own values and fears on a different culture. Including their fear of death.
Death is an inherently bad thing. I hate it when people like you say we should just have another perspective on death, because that is just projecting your own opinion on it to random people. Most people are rightfully scared of death, and if they aren't it is often because they are religious. But there is no heaven or hell in real life. Once you're dead you're gone. It's fine to say that you'd rather have an impactful life rather than a long one, which is what I want, but you can't impose that on other people.
>It's especially strange people on a supposedly communist imageboard would critique the Sentinelese islanders for being "primitive" even though there is no evidence they engage in any form of wage labor, internecine warfare, or slavery.
Primitive (I think it is a very outdated word to use tbh) is not as a moral statement but as an economic / societal one. Read Marx and Engels. Also hunter gatherer tribes engage in warfare and loads of other shit things, they just don't do land ownership in the same way.
>Is socialism when everyone has plastic surgery, a car and shelves full of funkopops?
Obviously socialism is more than standard of living, it is about the working class being in control and abolishing class as a whole, but at the same time I am inclined to say yes. Plastic surgery and toys are objectively good things. They make the vast, vast majority of people happier. People have had toys and modified their bodies for as long as they could do so. The only issue is capitalism unequally distributes them, they are the result of colonial exploitation. In Communism there will be 1000x more video game factories and you will work to make video games for Sudanese consumption. Do you really think amenities are really bad or are you just unhappy because capitalism sucks and can't enjoy them?
>Not saying this might be the sole reason they aren't exploring the rest of the world, but from my own experiences with many different cultures I know that many "universal" assumptions are particular to specific cultures, upbringings, social structures, (material) levels of development, faiths and "ideologies".
Then we need to engage with them. They have important things we need to learn from them. But at the same time that does not make 'culture' right. Culture is dominated by the most conservative parts of it. I don't care about the reactionary parts of cultures or faiths or whatever. Also I don't think there is space for multiple 'correct' ideas in the world. There is only the correct, scientific, path of Marxism-Leninism-Maoism.
>How would we know if we cannot communicate with them, because apparently no one is willing to simply listen to what it is they're saying?
I know because that's how it is in every single society that has ever existed. It's just a part about humans living together. No group is ever homogenous. There is certainly a progressive force in the island already that wants to talk with the wider world more. One divides into two. There is no such thing as a static utopia. Primitive communism is just a very stable societal form.
>What is the basis for them supposedly being dissatisfied with their own way of life? Their lack of access to certain capitalist commodities we take for granted? How is that not us imprinting out own values and fears on people we cannot communicate with on a deep level at the moment?
Today is the best day to live ever for the vast majority of people in the planet. I'm talking about the poor in the oppressed colonial and semi-colonial countries. People objectively live better than in pre-modern times. They live longer, they are smarter, they are better educated, more able to access entertainment, better housing (most people lived in huts made of twigs and mud until 100 years ago). And this is despite colonialism robbing them blind!
>If tomorrow we had world communism, and people still choose to live like this, would you force them into a mental institution?
Yes. Or at the very least, their children would be taken from them and educated properly, since leaving them to grow up in white hippie larp communes would be child abuse.

>>2441788
The north sentinele are a major case of genetic bottleneck, they simply will not survive without external contact

>>2444680
No. I'm not necessarily arguing the Sentinelese already share my attitude to death, or that if they don't they should. But I am saying there are cases where the introduction of certain medical technology is not socially beneficial, and thus is worth questioning if it should be introduced.
I.e. if it causes them collective anxiety and dread, is that an improvement?
And I think primitiveness itself, as a concept, should at the very least be separated into the "socially" and the "technologically" primitive. Because as history has shown, social relations associated with a theoretical "advanced" communism can exist at various stages (See Inca Empire, etc.)

In a scenario of world communism, how would the Sentinelese, assuming that if we understood their language and could communicate with them about this, not be considered Communist too? Why should their children be taken away from them and put in boarding schools or given to adoptive families? If we find they're not being physically or sexually abused, and they are aware they can choose not to live like that?

And no, certain capitalist commodities and services are not inherently good. Beauty standards, which also drive the demand for plastic surgery, are under capitalism, the product of advertisement. Specifically by inducing insecurity and want in target audiences. Under world communism, maybe much of plastic surgery will no longer be practiced or be deemed necessary or desirable. Demand is also induced for other commodities (see children's toys and the "nagging factor").
Nor do I see why the "vast majority of people" should matter either. Because communism is ultimately, the struggle of Communists against Capital, much more than it is specifically the proletariat against the bourgeoise, or the proletariat against Capital, or humanity against Capital. Because as Communists, we explicitly value this struggle.
Which brings me to the next point: If a "primitive" communism already exists, why should communists insist on introducing tools, ideas and technologies generally which might destroy it? I don't think this would be acceptable under an "advanced" communism either. So I don't see why an exception should be made for a (materially) primitive communism.
If you already know the introduction of an idea or technology would lead to the reintroduction of capital and capitalism, then it's the same as acting as a mere "ideological" reactionary engaged in a "political" struggle against communism.

And sure, I think there might be much we can learn from them, but I do think there can be multiple coherent and correct worldviews, even if they are seemingly different and do appear to overlap.
Because if you disagree with this stance, then you'll have to agree that previous "communisms" in either theory or practice (Including Marx at the time) are outright wrong owing to their "incompleteness". If you agree however that whilst our understanding can grow, past theories and attempt were also "correct", you will have to agree that there are approaches which might appear radically different, but are still ultimately "correct". E.g. some past Communist experiments were as Communists as today's Sentinelese are, and therefore, destroying their way of life is as wrong as wiping out the Paris Commune was.

Also you mention that "because that's how it is in every single society that has ever existed.". But my assumption runs deeper, not that there must be dissatisfaction on their part by some individuals, but that the Sentinelese are as capable of reasoning and decision making as anyone else, and thus also capable, if they so decide, to leave with researchers visiting the island, or simply sneak away on a fishing boat, or organize a change in the social relations within their culture if they find it doesn't suit them.
If workers are capable of overthrowing Capital on their own, and slaves can overthrow slavery, why wouldn't the Sentinelese be capable of overthrowing a social order they consider to be restrictive? Or you know, simply leave if they reject whatever taboos believed to bar them from venturing out?

I also disagree with the assumption of people objectively living better if this is solely reduced to access to commodities, and doesn't take into account social relations, and the degree to which people find their lives existentially meaningful.
Some of the adaptions and "advances" for example, have only become necessary because previous ways of living are now untenable due to population growth. The rest of the world for example cannot adopt a Sentinelese way of life, because modern agriculture and food security relies on industrially mass produced fertilizers and fossil fuel driven logistics. People nowadays "need" smartphones and computers for their jobs, for job searching, and for many other activities which previously were not mediated digitally through screens.
The ways modern economies and bureaucracies operate necessitates literacy on part of most of the population.
In many parts of the world, cars or other electrically or internal combustion powered vehicles are necessary to commute to work or even basic things like groceries shopping or visiting a doctor.
The existence then of these technologies and their widespread use does not imply in themselves that lives have meaningfully improved, if they're considered critical for survival, in a world where the alternative is starvation and death.

>>2444705
>whitoids coming up with more contrived reasons to colonize
they will do just fine.

>>2442118
>Like, there probably was a paleolithic hunter-gatherer who made a really cool spear with meteoritic iron
unlikely. iron working requires furnaces with higher temperatures than pre-pottery cultures were capable of making

>>2442361
you are on an imageboard, get off your high horse

>>2442689
no they don't

They have a population of 40
why are westoids so obsessed with em

>>2445208
Because every square inch must be colonized and inhabited by at least 1 McDonalds. The North Sentinelese haven‘t been blessed with school shootings and taxes yet and instead have to spend their days having sex in open air and eating fruits from trees while ignorant of what a BigMac is.

>>2445221
They could be having sex and eating big macs.

>>2445226
They could also be having sex while not eating garbage.

>>2445208
Western culture is obsessed with wiping out and civilizing savages. Its the frontier mythology. The only way you can assert yourself as modern and superior is by denigrating others. So what you have here is a form of narcissism where looking upon the "primitive savages" is a way of reassuring yourself that you are not a "primitive savage."

>>2445208
It will always be intriguing for capitalists, like a steak held above a dog, because it is a piece of common land. The bourgeois are just slathering human-killing dogs held back only by the chains of "rule of law" and "democracy". There is only greed in their eyes. The pole is property rights and they know it is necessary for capitalism to continue, so they accept law, because they know feral dogs are only put down. If not for the restraints they would jump to snatch the island for themselves to complete primitive accumulation. But the chains are made of plastic.

>>2441788
Okay but seriously… why is this thread not in /siberia already? With just as much success, you could discuss a sociopolitical issues of some random remote monastery.

File: 1756048594151.jpeg (17.4 KB, 227x225, IMG_7857.jpeg)

We should introduce them to consumer capitalism

We can start with labubus and dubai chocolate

>>2442911
rightoid coded


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