The legality of abortion does not matter, women who desire to have an abortion will have it either way as the means to conduct a DIY abortion will always exist, be it outdated metal coathangers or contemporary "MISO cards" drugs
https://fourthievesvinegar.org/abortion-care/. Even if abortion was made illegal it would continue to occur and even if persecuted nothing can guarantee the laws won't simply be reverted. Even if abortion is prohibited on a constitutional level nothing can guarantee that it won't simply change after time. Actions to save babies from abortions are futile as it is only possible to punish women after the deed of abortion has been done. All actions to change laws are simply liberal reformism, it is nonsense to frame it as "conservatives versus liberals" when both are subjects to a liberal bourgeoisie state. Then comes the counter argument - "so by your logic murder should be legal because people will commit it anyway?", that is precisely not the argument, the argument is that legality does not matter since it will occur anyway and the emphasis is on penalization rather than prevention, laws against murder may act as a deterrent but ultimately they can only be enforced after the deed has been commited as a way of punishment. Then here comes my question - what is the point of punishment other than deterrence? Obviously punishment is not absolute deterrence since the crimes are still being committed in spite of its implementation. The answer may be "there is no absolute deterrent but its the least we can do". That's where you are wrong, it is not the least you can do. The least that can be done on the matter of abortion is to have population control as to not have any babies be able to develop as to be aborted, to limit reproduction or change it altogether and thus prevent sacrficies. So how can we survive as a species that has ceased to be able to develop life from insemination? The answer to that is that we must pursue immortality and invulnerability. That is the only plausible solution to end abortion once and for all - to prevent new births from developing at all whilst sustaining the life that already exists. Immortality is impossible you say? It is already possible within some organisms which have adapted, such as the immortal jellyfish and sure, we are not jellyfish, but we have the consciousness to be able to direct our development and work towards it through scientific development. So what do you object to? That we shouldin't "play god"? We have the gift of consciousness to decide for ourselves and since we know life is the most precious thing we should seek to preserve it as long as we can. There is no reason for us to believe in eternal life after death, since life on earth and the material world is what is real.
>>2513614
It is not the laws that matter it is the actions. Laws are simply an outline, they do not spawn enforcers. It is the enforcement of one will upon another that functions regardless if it is written or not. Laws are akin to notes.
>>2513615In example, how many laws get neglected? How many get enforced? Its all entirely situational, what guarantees the cop will enforce every law when most enforcers do not even study the laws they are supposed to carry out.
>>2513622Very few cops will know the entire criminal code “like the back of their hand.” They will only know the statutes they regularly enforce. They have to be explicitly told what to do. The rest of the written law is akin to an afterthought that can only function on civil reports.
>>2513627
It certainly doesn't prevent, it punishes, that is considered a deterrent and yet it is not an absolute deterrent, since it is not an absolute detterent it in itself allows crime to occur and stimulates it.
>if not, then why do we even have laws?
That's a good question, it has a lot more to do with the image of security than existing security. A sign that says "private property" may be able to do the deed to prevent trespassers, but a person dedicated to it will certainly neglect it. It is an outline of courses to be taken that do not strive to end crime altogether, but to keep it controlled - that is to continue crime and regulate it rather than abolish the possibility of committing a crime. The written law has no intention of ending crime, only managing it situationally.
>>2513639To end crime it has to be rendered impossible to carry it out. This is how engineering works. An engineer does not put up a sign that says "don't stand on this platform", he makes the platform impossible to stand on.
>>2513647
>you cant make un-killable people
Sure you can, you just need to dedicate to it. The greater the development of medicine the easier it is to repair a damaged person. This is teleological and what we should be dedicated to. Once previously impossible to survive diseases are now easily cured. Now presently impossible to recover from wounds will surely be able to be survivable in the future as long as we can dedicate toward the development of medicine. Nothing prevents humanity from developing regenerative abilites other than the lack of dedication towards working in that direction. People have survived shotgun blasts to the face by the mercy of modern medicine, surgery has become so advanced even such a face can be reconstructed to look presentable again. The only ones who object have no intention to develop and make life better, not that they have a better solution.
>>2513647
>>2513664
As for punishment of murderers I don't object as long as there is use to it. There can be no use to keeping a murderer fed for life, murderers should be utilitized to the fullest as to be productive to society, be it through labor camps that continue production or be it that murderers undergo the equilivent exchange of having taken a life that their forfeit theirs and so are to be utilized for human experiments for the development of medicine as to be able to save more lives.
The legality of abortion does matter, sure if made illegal some women will get after market abortions but what people car about is that there will be less of them.
>>2513668Modern prisons are parastic structures, which sustain criminals for no other reason than to keep them confined (i.e. a lazar house) rather than to make use of them.
>>2513672That depends on demand not on legality.
>>2513645
It can only be a deterrent note, the real thing they may be afraid of that acts as a true deterrent is the consequences that come after being caught - what is to come in jail. So the real deterrent is not the written law, but what is the outcome of going into jail. It is not an absolute deterrent once again since some may find it worth the risk, so logically we should all strive for an absolute deterrent as to render it impossible to occur.
>>2513707I can give concepts to engineer deterrents, for example in the case of deterring adolsecent rape we could work on experimenting with modifying STDs as to be able to make a special vaccine that transmits a disease but does not affect the host, this conceptual vaccine would be able to make rapists extremely ill but not affect the host at all. If we neglect the need for population control then the effects of the vaccine should be able to be negated upon turning 18. This would be an extremely effective deterrent if we can modify the effects of the illness to be of the most devastating kind to the target and yet keep the host asymptomatic and unaffected.
>>2513752 Again not an absolute deterrent, an absolute deterrent would be akin to there no longer being any adolescents present. Be it that no new people are born or that humans will only be able to be born into an adult phase. Both are plausible, but currently and its important to underline currently improbable. Once humanity takes control of its development and is able to direct it they will become probable.
>>2513752This is science fiction, not policy.
Kill all murderers and pedos NOW
>>2513795>This is science-fiction Because we're not putting in the effort to work towards it. If we took the killers and pedophiles and conducted human experiments on them such things would be possible.
>>2513801Even more would be possible, cures for viruses to save lives would be easier if we can infect the pedophiles with viruses and experiment on them. Many things would be possible if we actually utilized them before disposing of them.
It's just about controlling women and preventing them from having any leverage against men. Man gets woman pregnant and shames/forces her into keeping it and now he has a hostage; he can turn a mother's love for her child into the ultimate form of leverage to keep her in line, she will be his property forever. Father's daughter gets pregnant he shames/forces her to keep it and marry the child's father and become his property forever. Safe and legal abortion takes away that leverage and gives women more power and a patriarchal society cannot abide that.
>>2513807If you tried to talk like that to these WASPs pictured on the OP they would begin to lecture you on the sanctity of life. It should be that the conclusion is that people born out of rape are unwanted and a burden on the consience of the mother since a birth is essentially an extension of a person by genetics, why would a person want an unwanted extension created out of a vile act to continue their genetic legacy? It is that people created out of rape should generally be prevented from developing at the early stage by induced death as to not burden the genetic continuity of the mother and do away with the disguisting consequence of being forced into taking someone else's genetic material despite being completely against it - it should be disposed of, not for the wellbeing or sanctity of its "life" but out of the consicence of the mother. Does this logic apply to disabled people? Yes this is why we keep looking for cures for disabilities and should continue to, they are a complete burden and dissapointment on the parents when they are unable to be productive or functional.
>>2513827To this they will call you a leftist nazi, deny being a leftist or a nazi, and instead proudly call yourself a eugenicist. Eugenics is the aim to improve the genetic quality of a human population and there is nothing wrong with it. It is not exclusive to race and can exclude race altogether.
>>2513827
>lecture you on the sanctity of lifeIt's a diversionary tactic. Doesn't matter if the baby is alive or it's dead or if it's the reincarnation of Jesus Christ - it's inside of a person's body and if they don't want it inside their body they have a right to Hoover it out. If a parent refuses to undergo a kidney transplant to save their own child, they have the right to do that and our society respects their right to bodily autonomy even if it means killing an actual living child, but suddenly the rules are different when it's a woman refusing to undergo pregnancy and childbirth.
>>2513807>It's just about controlling women and preventing them from having any leverage against men.According to Pew 38% of men want abortion to be illegal, 33% of women do. This isn't primarily a gender thing like progressive types want to claim, unless they want to say anti-abortion women are brainwashed which they will sometimes but they don't like touching the idea that women are doormats, outside of black pill feminist types.
https://www.pewresearch.org/religion/fact-sheet/public-opinion-on-abortion/ >>2513870Has the gap between the two changed over time? I would imagine that the gap has widened since the mid-20th century as cultural attitudes have evolved and women in the west have become less tradwifey.
Something to think about - the war against reproductive rights is as much of a propaganda war as it is a legal war, perhaps even moreso. It's very difficult to actually physically stop women from having abortions, especially in the modern age where information and pharmaceuticals flow through the world more freely than ever. Abortion pills can and do get sold on the black market like any other drug, they're not hard to manufacture, they're not made from rare unobtainium ingredients or advanced nanotechnology, they're perfectly safe and cheap and they work. So to really deter women from having abortions what you have to do is beat it into their heads that abortion is dangerous and immoral and scary and spread as much disinformation about abortion as you possibly can.
Abortion was only legalized in America in order to wipe out blacks.
https://www.instagram.com/reel/DNAArGDinxx/https://www.instagram.com/reel/DP2N_coCZHN/https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XbFKC3xySMwIt was only when white women began getting abortions that the right-wing sought to criminalize it.
>>2525642Black women deserve the right to their own bodies.
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