/leftypol/ - Leftist Politically Incorrect

Adorno already figured this out.
/thread

Even the religious conservatism of modernity is a sad joke that hadn’t escaped capitalism. The people talking about “traditional values” and “Christ is King” go to evangelical megachurches where the pastor flies in on a private jet and gives sermons on shit like “How the life of King Solomon teaches you to run your business.”

Look at American Christianity; it’s the perfect example of Capitalism decaying everything. It’s become a mass market product lacking theological backbone and turning the founding fathers and the constitution into holiness, Jesus is “a patriot”, an “American”.

Look at how Trump acts, and even the supposed “sacredness” of American institutions and the constitution has dissolved. It calls itself “conservatism”, sure, but it’s just the rapacious appetites of the Super-Capitalist party.

Op confused the conservative pretense for the reactionary substance LMBO

>>2536378
bodied that freak

>>2536378
define "reactionary"

>>2536363
but what exactly is "traditional" here?
people talk about "tradition" like its the 1950s postwar social democracy, or victorian england or the middle ages, as if these were all the same thing.

>>2536378
this
look at pedocon theory

>>2536352
Saudi Arabia is more socially liberal than Rome and American hogs think theyr'e barbaric freaks. The only way to deny social progess is to be an aprim who thinks agricultural society is degenerate.

>>2536395
A political position that maintains a conservative response to change, including threats to social institutions and technological advances. Reaction is the reciprocal action to revolutionary movement. Reactionaries clamp down on the differences of the emerging productive forces in society, and attempt to remove those differences, silence them, or segregate them in order to keep the stability of the established order.

Examples of the political position of reactionaries can be seen throughout history: during the US Revolutionary War, the reactionaries were the ruling British aristocracy, who sought to maintain their feudal government over their American colonies, while the US revolutionaries sought to establish a government to represent the interests of capitalist values and practices. Hundreds of years later in Russia, the tables would turn and capitalists became reactionary while the Socialists are revolutionary.

>>2536352
>the most conservative, religious and superstitious era in all humanity.
you exaggerate greatly. people used to be burned at the stake, dude.

and even with " conservative, religious and superstitious" movements in modernity, they are always fundamentally historically illiterate. They pine to RETVRN to something that never existed, and they actively destroy the past in their efforts to pretend the past looked the way their nostalgia remembers it.

For example:
>trad nordic larpers eat raw meat
<in reality nordic peasants mostly ate grains and veggies, only occasionally eating meat when they could get it, and it was cooked

but even picking random examples like this aside, you can see in the original 1930s fascism a desire to destroy the past expressed in the futurist artistic movement with which fascism had close ties:

<Within F. T. Marinetti's The Founding and Manifesto of Futurism, two of his tenets briefly highlight his hatred for women under the pretense that it fuels the Futurist movement's visceral nature:

<9. We intend to glorify war—the only hygiene of the world—militarism, patriotism, the destructive gesture of anarchists, beautiful ideas worth dying for, and contempt for woman.
<10. We intend to destroy museums, libraries, academics of every sort and to fight against moralism, feminism, and every utilitarian opportunistic cowardice.

>>2536453
I thought conservatives try to conserve the status quo, i.e. keep things as they are, reactionaries try to return to how things used to be, and revolutionaries try to move things forward through both illegal and legal action, and reformists try to change things using the existing system

>>2536399
hard to even imagine what is traditional since the 1800s began really. Before capitalism really took over, many elements of society were based on quite literally centuries-old traditions. Today every one of them has been turned into a complete commodity.

capitalism doesn't care about tradition vs modernity, if tradition makes money they support it, if being a gay furry hooked up on aderall makes you into a productive computer programmer for raytheon they let you be you.

If conservatives really believed half the shit they preach we would see the Amish population skyrocket.

>>2536628
I thought Amish were ethnoreligious and don't let outsiders in… but in any case their population has skyrocketed because they are one of the only groups in America that consistently has more than 3-4 children per woman.

Max Stirner's Art And Religion might be helpful here.
https://theanarchistlibrary.org/library/max-stirner-art-and-religion
It broke up the old religion, but new religion has fossilized and awaits similar break-uppage.

yeah marx was wrong about a lot of things. my computer desk is still completely solid and hasn't even began to liquefy one bit

>>2536652
Outsiders are allowed, it’s just rare that they cut the mustard enough to stay

>>2536610
yeah if you can't see that retvrn shit is clearly an expression of secular modernity idk what to tell you

>>2536900
Tide goes in, tide goes out.
Never a miscommunication

>>2536862
Yeah the retvrn shit is literally a REACTION TO THE LOSS OF TRADITION

>>2536911
Engels talks about "reactionary socialism" in Principles of Communism (1847) and one can see how Fascism was an extension of that.

>>2536915

democratic socialism has a different taint today given AES

>>2536358
>>2536352
I think this is an oversimplification, Marx could have easily predicted post-modernism here. The new spooks are more akin to animism and pagan deities than the 'classic' Christian/monotheistic/monolithic spooks. Less totalizing, decentrally oppressive, and instead of a dogmatist conception of truth, ever relativizing.

As for the relationship of the sexes, just looking at the divorce rates, failsons and faildaughters, the general state of childrearing influenced heavily by capitalist tech products, and the resulting anhedonia, attention deficit, and the generalized illiteracy of kids, is pointing to the fact that the form (bourgeois family) remained with its content (reproducing society on this societal/sexual condition) hollowed out.

Both interlinked phenomena, the general zeitgeist and the (dys)functioning of the bourgeois family unit, can be traced from the Marx quote, imo. Even within these realms capitalism is unable to revolutionize or even reform itself, the limitations being set by its core functioning principles (profit motive, market distribution, imperialist division of the general human population, etc.).

>>2536352
>most conservative, religious and superstitious era in all humanity
my uyghur be living in iran or smth smh

no we're not, the most conservative, religious, and superstitious era was the 6th to the 12th century, and we are certainly more "advanced than the ancients" in every respect, if you somehow believe right now is more reactionary than 632 CE, when what was left of the progressive proto-capitalist pagan institutions had been finally raped to death and the result was the era of feudalism, then you are delusional

>>2537028
Superstition yesterday was ghosts and fairies now we got ghosts and aliens and human rights and some entity caleld "history."

>>2537038
>religion is when abstract concepts
damn that's deep