marx's statement that "everything melts into air" and "everything holy is profaned" under capitalist relations appears to be completely false. in all reality, capitalism has given us the most conservative, religious and superstitious era in all humanity. we are not more enlightened than the ancients and history does not resemble social progress.
Adorno already figured this out.
/thread
Even the religious conservatism of modernity is a sad joke that hadn’t escaped capitalism. The people talking about “traditional values” and “Christ is King” go to evangelical megachurches where the pastor flies in on a private jet and gives sermons on shit like “How the life of King Solomon teaches you to run your business.”
Look at American Christianity; it’s the perfect example of Capitalism decaying everything. It’s become a mass market product lacking theological backbone and turning the founding fathers and the constitution into holiness, Jesus is “a patriot”, an “American”.
Look at how Trump acts, and even the supposed “sacredness” of American institutions and the constitution has dissolved. It calls itself “conservatism”, sure, but it’s just the rapacious appetites of the Super-Capitalist party.
Op confused the conservative pretense for the reactionary substance LMBO
>>2536378bodied that freak
>>2536378define "reactionary"
>>2536363but what exactly is "traditional" here?
people talk about "tradition" like its the 1950s postwar social democracy, or victorian england or the middle ages, as if these were all the same thing.
>>2536378this
look at pedocon theory
>>2536352Saudi Arabia is more socially liberal than Rome and American hogs think theyr'e barbaric freaks. The only way to deny social progess is to be an aprim who thinks agricultural society is degenerate.
>>2536395 A political position that maintains a conservative response to change, including threats to social institutions and technological advances. Reaction is the reciprocal action to revolutionary movement. Reactionaries clamp down on the differences of the emerging productive forces in society, and attempt to remove those differences, silence them, or segregate them in order to keep the stability of the established order.
Examples of the political position of reactionaries can be seen throughout history: during the US Revolutionary War, the reactionaries were the ruling British aristocracy, who sought to maintain their feudal government over their American colonies, while the US revolutionaries sought to establish a government to represent the interests of capitalist values and practices. Hundreds of years later in Russia, the tables would turn and capitalists became reactionary while the Socialists are revolutionary.
>>2536352>the most conservative, religious and superstitious era in all humanity.you exaggerate greatly. people used to be burned at the stake, dude.
and even with " conservative, religious and superstitious" movements in modernity, they are always fundamentally historically illiterate. They pine to RETVRN to something that never existed, and they actively destroy the past in their efforts to pretend the past looked the way their nostalgia remembers it.
For example:
>trad nordic larpers eat raw meat <in reality nordic peasants mostly ate grains and veggies, only occasionally eating meat when they could get it, and it was cookedbut even picking random examples like this aside, you can see in the original 1930s fascism a desire to destroy the past expressed in the futurist artistic movement with which fascism had close ties:
<Within F. T. Marinetti's The Founding and Manifesto of Futurism, two of his tenets briefly highlight his hatred for women under the pretense that it fuels the Futurist movement's visceral nature:
<9. We intend to glorify war—the only hygiene of the world—militarism, patriotism, the destructive gesture of anarchists, beautiful ideas worth dying for, and contempt for woman.<10. We intend to destroy museums, libraries, academics of every sort and to fight against moralism, feminism, and every utilitarian opportunistic cowardice. >>2536453I thought conservatives try to conserve the status quo, i.e. keep things as they are, reactionaries try to return to how things used to be, and revolutionaries try to move things forward through both illegal and legal action, and reformists try to change things using the existing system
>>2536399hard to even imagine what is traditional since the 1800s began really. Before capitalism really took over, many elements of society were based on quite literally centuries-old traditions. Today every one of them has been turned into a complete commodity.
If conservatives really believed half the shit they preach we would see the Amish population skyrocket.
>>2536628I thought Amish were ethnoreligious and don't let outsiders in… but in any case their population has skyrocketed because they are one of the only groups in America that consistently has more than 3-4 children per woman.
Max Stirner's Art And Religion might be helpful here.
https://theanarchistlibrary.org/library/max-stirner-art-and-religionIt broke up the old religion, but new religion has fossilized and awaits similar break-uppage.
yeah marx was wrong about a lot of things. my computer desk is still completely solid and hasn't even began to liquefy one bit
>>2536610yeah if you can't see that retvrn shit is clearly an expression of secular modernity idk what to tell you
>>2536900
Tide goes in, tide goes out.
Never a miscommunication
>>2536862Yeah the retvrn shit is literally a REACTION TO THE LOSS OF TRADITION
>>2536911Engels talks about "reactionary socialism" in
Principles of Communism (1847) and one can see how Fascism was an extension of that.
>>2536915democratic socialism has a different taint today given AES
>>2536358>>2536352I think this is an oversimplification, Marx could have easily predicted post-modernism here. The new spooks are more akin to animism and pagan deities than the 'classic' Christian/monotheistic/monolithic spooks. Less totalizing, decentrally oppressive, and instead of a dogmatist conception of truth, ever relativizing.
As for the relationship of the sexes, just looking at the divorce rates, failsons and faildaughters, the general state of childrearing influenced heavily by capitalist tech products, and the resulting anhedonia, attention deficit, and the generalized illiteracy of kids, is pointing to the fact that the form (bourgeois family) remained with its content (reproducing society on this societal/sexual condition) hollowed out.
Both interlinked phenomena, the general zeitgeist and the (dys)functioning of the bourgeois family unit, can be traced from the Marx quote, imo. Even within these realms capitalism is unable to revolutionize or even reform itself, the limitations being set by its core functioning principles (profit motive, market distribution, imperialist division of the general human population, etc.).
>>2536352>most conservative, religious and superstitious era in all humanitymy uyghur be living in iran or smth smh
no we're not, the most conservative, religious, and superstitious era was the 6th to the 12th century, and we are certainly more "advanced than the ancients" in every respect, if you somehow believe right now is more reactionary than 632 CE, when what was left of the progressive proto-capitalist pagan institutions had been finally raped to death and the result was the era of feudalism, then you are delusional
>>2537028Superstition yesterday was ghosts and fairies now we got ghosts and aliens and human rights and some entity caleld "history."
>>2537038>religion is when abstract conceptsdamn that's deep
>>2537038thank you herr stirner
>>2536352>all that is solid melts into airyea uygha our economy is being financialized and virtualized. matter (solid) is moving to china which has a DoTP and will secure that matter (material production) because they are based and (with a leninist state) superstructure
>everything holy is profaned. in all reality, capitalism has given us the most conservative, religious and superstitious era in all humanity.uygha he's talking about sacred, or traditional structures and beliefs that are being desecrated, disrespected, or demystified, like how we have mega churches that have little courrage and how the true almighty god is the dollar sign. the reactionary is a different concept
You mean the same Marx who called the idealist leftlibs of his time "Saints"?
Yet another thing Marx failed to consider 😢
>>2536352>capitalism has given us the most conservative, religious and superstitious era in all humanity>we are not more enlightened than the ancientsbruh they used to believe that the sun revolved around the earth and diseases were caused by demons
stop being retarded
>capitalism has given us the most conservative, religious and superstitious era in all humanity
Not even remotely true. We are not sending 100,000 children to war in Jerusalem because the Pope lied and said the Antichrist was there. We are not burning thousands at the stake for practicing medicine. Get a hold of yourself
The religious larp in modernity is a facade. The rise of fascist mythology is a performance. It's just something they use to cope in modern society, like how women use astrology. They're not going to go to kill themselves for it.
>we are not more enlightened than the ancients and history does not resemble social progress.
Now ironically, YOU'RE acting like the fascist with this stupid, nazi shit. Technology immediately debunks anything you say.
>>2536352>In all reality, capitalism has given us the most conservative, religious and superstitious era in all humanity.Bro they read the blood spills of goat guts before battle 2500 years ago. What the fuck do you mean?
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