Why the fuck does FINANCE make so much money despite not producing anything and therefore being even more parasitic and useless than even normal capitalist companies that make goods and services, its like capitalism in its purest form of just being a machine that turns money into more money with zero social utility.
What specifically do you mean by finance?
>>2578498Because their expenses are almost zero, so it's all profit.
Fixed capital requires investment because it consists of long-term assets, like buildings, machinery, and equipment, that are essential for production. These assets are not immediately consumed but are used over several years, and their acquisition often involves significant upfront costs. To acquire and maintain these assets, businesses need to invest capital to ensure they have the necessary resources for ongoing operations and growth. But businesses do not always have that capital available up front. For this they turn to investors. When businesses lack the capital to invest in fixed assets upfront, they turn to investors or external financing sources, such as loans or equity funding. Investors provide the necessary capital in exchange for a return on investment, either through interest payments or ownership stakes. This allows businesses to acquire the fixed capital needed for growth and operations, without depleting their cash reserves. However, because the investors are interested in making interest on their loan, rather than profit from the production and sales of commodities created by the fixed capital they are investing in, the interests of the investors diverges a little bit from that of the commodity-producing capitalist. Investors who provide loans to businesses are primarily focused on earning a return through interest payments, not on the profits generated from the actual production or sale of commodities. This creates a potential conflict of interest. While commodity-producing capitalists (business owners) aim to maximize profit through efficient production and market sales, lenders or investors prioritize ensuring their loans are repaid with interest, often pushing businesses to focus on short-term cash flow and debt servicing. This can sometimes lead to tension, as the business might prioritize paying off interest over reinvesting in production or long-term growth, potentially affecting overall profitability and innovation. The servicing of this interest leads to the creation of an entire industry around finance itself, rather than commodity production. The need to service interest payments on loans leads to the growth of the financial industry, which becomes a key part of the economy, often outpacing the importance of actual commodity production. Financial institutions, like banks, investment firms, and hedge funds, specialize in managing and facilitating the flow of capital between lenders and borrowers. They create financial products (such as bonds, derivatives, and stock offerings) designed to generate returns through interest, fees, and trading. As capital becomes more concentrated in the financial sector, more resources are allocated to managing debt and investments, sometimes diverting attention away from the productive economy. This shift can lead to financialization, where profit is increasingly derived from financial transactions and speculation, rather than from the production of goods and services.
what does leftypol think about daytraders? I mean yeah it's parasitic but you are being a parasite to big money if you make money on the markets as an individual so I don't see how it can be any worse than being a landlord.
>>2578768marx is my hero he gambled and didn't work
>>2578768> marx himself did it sometimes, which is funny because he made fun of lassalle for gambling. the bourgeoisie, especially the ones in government legislating industry regulations or awarding govt. contracts, win at trading stocks because they have insider info that day traders do not. Maybe he wasn't a God or prophet who could conjer up money out of nowhere with his omniscient wisdom, but another dumb faggot like you and me who needed money but didn't have it by being a bummy loser.
If only Marx had the balls to actually work a proletarian job, maybe his life wouldn't be so fraught and precarious.
>>2578772>Maybe he wasn't a God or prophet who could conjer up money out of nowhere with his omniscient wisdomnobody claims this
>but another dumb faggot like you and me who needed money but didn't have it by being a bummy loser.he had a PhD
>If only Marx had the balls to actually work a proletarian job, maybe his life wouldn't be so fraught and precarious.he was politically exiled from his home country, and participated in the first international, and researched at the british museum, all of which took up a lot of his time, not to mention his lectures, speeches, and several children.
>>2578777But did anything he ever did create surplus value?
>>2578779Yes, writing a book which is sold as a commodity generates profit for the publisher.
>>2578768>BTW… that's why even "day trading" is inaccessible to the proletariat: they are either broke or in debt.Me, and my parents, are all proletarians and have each earned enough money to invest in mutual funds. There are some nice benefits to socdem life.
>>2578772>If only Marx had the balls to actually work a proletarian job, maybe his life wouldn't be so fraught and precarious.but the life of the proletariat IS fraught and precarious, especially in the time/place Marx was writing about them:
https://www.marxists.org/archive/marx/works/1867-c1/ch10.htm
<Dr. Greenhow states that the average duration of life in the pottery districts of Stoke-on-Trent, and Wolstanton is extraordinarily short. Although in the district of Stoke, only 36.6% and in Wolstanton only 30.4% of the adult male population above 20 are employed in the potteries, among the men of that age in the first district more than half, in the second, nearly 2/5 of the whole deaths are the result of pulmonary diseases among the potters. Dr. Boothroyd, a medical practitioner at Hanley, says:
<“Each successive generation of potters is more dwarfed and less robust than the preceding one.”
<In like manner another doctor, Mr. M’Bean:
<“Since he began to practice among the potters 25 years ago, he had observed a marked degeneration especially shown in diminution of stature and breadth.”
<These statements are taken from the report of Dr. Greenhow in 1860. [35]
<From the report of the Commissioners in 1863, the following: Dr. J. T. Arledge, senior physician of the North Staffordshire Infirmary, says:
<“The potters as a class, both men and women, represent a degenerated population, both physically and morally. They are, as a rule, stunted in growth, ill-shaped, and frequently ill-formed in the chest; they become prematurely old, and are certainly short-lived; they are phlegmatic and bloodless, and exhibit their debility of constitution by obstinate attacks of dyspepsia, and disorders of the liver and kidneys, and by rheumatism. But of all diseases they are especially prone to chest-disease, to pneumonia, phthisis, bronchitis, and asthma. One form would appear peculiar to them, and is known as potter’s asthma, or potter’s consumption. Scrofula attacking the glands, or bones, or other parts of the body, is a disease of two-thirds or more of the potters …. That the ‘degenerescence’ of the population of this district is not even greater than it is, is due to the constant recruiting from the adjacent country, and intermarriages with more healthy races.” [36] >>2578790Well today the most immiserated proletariat are the people mining the minerals which end up in your devices. And that's why Lenin wrote extensively about the labor aristocracy in imperial core countries and the need for anti-imperialist solidarity with oppressed nations:
<Obviously, out of such enormous superprofits (since they are obtained over and above the profits which capitalists squeeze out of the workers of their “own” country) it is possible to bribe the labour leaders and the upper stratum of the labour aristocracy. And that is just what the capitalists of the “advanced” countries are doing: they are bribing them in a thousand different ways, direct and indirect, overt and covert.
<This stratum of workers-turned-bourgeois, or the labour aristocracy, who are quite philistine in their mode of life, in the size of their earnings and in their entire outlook, is the principal prop of the Second International, and in our days, the principal social (not military) prop of the bourgeoisie. For they are the real agents of the bourgeoisie in the working-class movement, the labour lieutenants of the capitalist class, real vehicles of reformism and chauvinism. In the civil war between the proletariat and the bourgeoisie they inevitably, and in no small numbers, take the side of the bourgeoisie, the “Versaillese” against the “Communards.”
<Private property based on the labour of the small proprietor, free competition, democracy, all the catchwords with which the capitalists and their press deceive the workers and the peasants are things of the distant past. Capitalism has grown into a world system of colonial oppression and of the financial strangulation of the overwhelming majority of the population of the world by a handful of “advanced” countries. And this “booty” is shared between two or three powerful world plunderers armed to the teeth (America, Great Britain, Japan), who are drawing the whole world into their war over the division of their booty. - Vladimir Ilyich Lenin, Imperialism, the Highest Stage of Capitalism, PREFACE TO THE FRENCH AND GERMAN EDITIONS
<Imperialism is the highest stage of development of capitalism. Capital in the advanced countries has outgrown the boundaries of national states. It has established monopoly in place of competition, thus creating all the objective prerequisites for the achievement of socialism. Hence, in Western Europe and in the United States of America, the revolutionary struggle of the proletariat for the overthrow of the capitalist governments, for the expropriation of the bourgeoisie, is on the order of the day. Imperialism is forcing the masses into this struggle by sharpening class antagonisms to an immense degree, by worsening the conditions of the masses both economically—trusts and high cost of living, and politically—growth of militarism, frequent wars, increase of reaction, strengthening and extension of national oppression and colonial plunder. Victorious socialism must achieve complete democracy and, consequently, not only bring about the complete equality of nations, but also give effect to the right of oppressed nations to self-determination, i.e., the right to free political secession. Socialist Parties which fail to prove by all their activities now, as well as during the revolution and after its victory, that they will free the enslaved nations and establish relations with them on the basis of a free union and a free union is a lying phrase without right to secession—such parties would be committing treachery to socialism.https://www.marxists.org/archive/lenin/works/1916/jan/x01.htm >>2578687thats great but why does industrial capital tolerate this and not just form their own banks instead of letting finance capital siphon off their profits
>>2579570i mean they do. but then many industrial capitalists become finance capitalists, because financial markets offer quicker and often higher returns than reinvesting in production. so as surplus profits accumulate, it becomes more profitable for industrial capitalists to place money into financial assets or create finance subsidiaries. 🤑