Have there been any studies done deconstructing the left-to-right ("Saul-to-Paul") political conversion narrative that the right-wing loves to throw around?
I'm talking about people like former CPUSA members who turned state like Whittaker Chambers, Bella Dodd, and Louis Budenz; neocons like Irving Kristol, Norman Podhoretz, and David Horowitz (rest in piss); or contemporary "conversion" stories like those of Abby Johnson. I'm obviously talking about Americans here but I'm sure you can name plenty of examples from other countries. What psychological factors cause someone to abandon leftism and fully embrace the right, and even worse, turn on their former comrades?
Is it simply the case that they upheld leftism as a dogma, so when their "god" died they found another god? Is it because they were always authoritarian assholes and embraced the right when the right gave them a better outlet for being authoritarian assholes? Was it because they found that the left was moving in a direction they didn't approve of, so they gradually became rightist? Or, using the narrative they themselves most often parrot, they felt "betrayed" by the left so in turn they betrayed the left?
Also, why do we rarely see any prominent right-wingers turning to the left?
122 posts and 15 image replies omitted.>>2666790>looks at her profile>is clearly exploiting her baby son for views and engagementI fucking hate momfluencers.
>>2666897think we need communist fiction aka fairy tales and myths. like we know theyre myths and anyone can contribute. idk.
>>2666897>If I remember right he was something of Bella Dodd's sponsor (and also helped convert her) and he was a committed anti-communist. This is exactly what happened. Sheen was part of a Catholic anti-communist network that specifically sought out former communists to convert them to Catholicism and get them to snitch.
>>2666979Gen Alphas and Gen Betas are going to have such a warped understanding of privacy.
>>2649015>neocons like Irving Kristol, Didn't Maupin claim the neocons were just Trotskyists on the payroll of the Congress for Cultural Freedom?
>>2666790>>2666849I might DM her and ask.
>>2649135>>2649076In Judaism, we say that one is not defined by their mistakes but but the way they rectify those mistakes. So, anyone who slips up should be given the chance to fix the problem, rather than outright ostracized.
I'm petty bourgeois but I became commie (anarcho-syndicalist / council communist, tankies will probably say that doesn't count tho). As for right wing grifters rarely becoming commie, well that's because that is their whole schtick, you generally don't have anything to gain by being commie as a PR stunt and if you're haute bourgeois you may as well be apolitical because it would be impossible to relate to the masses.
>>2664792One thing I will say about people in anarchist spaces is how many of them seem to have narcissistic mothers. Many times they’ll say they became anarchists largely because they were fed up at how many expectations their moms placed on them and how their anger towards their mothers were the first step in them questioning hierarchical authority. It makes sense then that their mothers’ narcissistic tendencies would rub off on them.
>>2670035The family dynamic is usually narc mother + socially inept father. No idea why so many socially inept douchebags are attracted to narcissists.
>>2649015Interesting how a lot of these people detected from the left after becoming Christian.
>>2670035its funny that you mention narcissistic parents since my father allegedly exhibited NPD characteristics(ofc this is just other family members with no medical knowledge making these allegations) and I was a self-identified AnCom throughout high school until getting some more life experience and reading some more theory. I could definitely see narcissistic helicopter parents causing Anarchism to have some more appeal to there kids but what really set me down the path of anarchism and marxism was being really into the environment and realizing a healthy ecosystem and "healthy" capitalist economy are incompatible with one another. That being said I haven't really organized in anarchist spaces so I can't really speak on them sharing traits with their Nmoms.
>>2664792>I get the impression many of these Dodd and Horowitz types are the same people that engage in Sealioning at every function they appear at and were basically the Leninhats of there org until interpersonal drama causes them to denounce the entire movement for not glazing them enough.Yes, they're usually the overly self-righteous ones who feel entitled to overstep/violate the boundaries of others on the basis of some "justice sensitivity" bullshit, then when comrades get sick of them they jump into another group.
>>2651578>Bella Dodd was a validation junkie, not unlike most of those insecure girls on Tumblr. She was an Italian immigrant who always felt out-of-place, joined CPUSA because she thought communism would help America, and became a successful labour organizer in the party doing legal work for unions. Then, after she got purged for Browderism, she became a born-again Catholic thanks to Fulton Sheen and started snitching on everyone in CPUSA thinking she'd be loved as an "American hero" if she did so.
>Don't know anything about Budenz except Fulton Sheen converted him and his wife to Catholicism and got them to rat people out too.why is catholicism so attractive to right wingers
>>2676688In the cases of Budenz and Dodd, they were brought into the Catholic Church by Fulton Sheen, who was connected to Catholic anti-communist groups.
>>2660419I disagree with your statement that opposing ICE has nothing to do with the interest of black people but this is largely correct. Libleft coalition politics want to pursue every single goal they have, forcing every single member to participate, and in the end accomplishing nothing. I've ppsted here about how there is a huge pushback from NY Muslims against trans activism in the left, and that is one; many black people don't vibes with Levantines since Arabs control a lot of the stores in the hood and they associate pro Palestinian activism with these Arab storeowners and that is two. Many such examples abound too, and while today they are papered over because Trump is a common threat the moment we get a Dem presidency its all gonna erupt
>>2660419>They ask why should they risk being attacked by ICE in order to save Somalis when the Somalis don’t reciprocate that same solidarity?Somalis in Minneapolis are highly insular. It's not like they came out en masse during the George Floyd protests.
>>2679339>many black people don't vibes with Levantines since Arabs control a lot of the stores in the hood and they associate pro Palestinian activism with these Arab storeowners and that is twoThis is actually a huge problem in Detroit as well that people don't talk about. Detroit has a lot of Palestinian, Lebanese, Iraqi, and Yemeni immigrants who are notorious for running liquor stores and convenience stores in Black neighbourhoods (Detroit is 80% Black for what it's worth). A lot of Black Detroiters are saying these Arabs are stealing Black dollars and not doing anything for Blacks in return. It's identical to how Jews and Asians used to deliberately set up their businesses in Black areas back in the day, which was the main source of racial tensions between those groups. Kind of interesting how ethnic groups that are on the cusp of whiteness gain whiteness specifically through exploiting Blacks. Kind of like how the Irish in America became white once they all started becoming cops.
>>2668747Was she ever relevant in leftist circles?
>>2668747Is that the lady Maupin has the hate boner for?
>>2680301That’s Taryn Fivek
>>2684651If you support long lived social structures e.g. how lindy it is then you should be a monarchist or anprim.
>>2686205Bro I don't care about trans issues and neither did Marx, this is really isn't a 'gotcha' because it has nothing to do with the left/right distinction in the organic sense, it's psy-op slop that is irrelevant to all but 1% of the population.
>>2686299So trans comrades don’t matter?
Hate to say it, but I see why the political right is so appealing to disgruntled former leftists.
The left (at least, in the US) has no real political goals. It's confined to berating and cancelling each other over social media. And for what purpose? Weeding out oppressive behaviours? How does that lead us to accomplish our goals on a political level?
The right-wing, on the other hand, knows that it's creating a new world, a worse world, but that's how they want it. They remain politically-focused while the left only acts within the social realm.
>>2649015Many of these people develop an inner "fuck you" towards their former comrades as well as towards the public at large. Think about how jaded even armchair activists get with the public for not striking, voting for SocDems, etc., while also being THE PERSON providing the ideological ammunition and fuel to the activist base.
>>2660419>>2679339>>2679498I mean, a lot of this has to do with the issue of Black wealth and the fact Black folks feel like they can't get out of poverty because Black money doesn't stay with Black communities. A lot of Black nationalists will attack rich and even middle-class Blacks for having children with non-Black partners (usually white, Hispanic, or Pinoy) because the money won't be passed down to Black hands but mixed hands. Intergenerational wealth is something whites often take for granted whereas it's something Blacks consider crucial to the survival of their communities.
>>2649015The right pays them or promises them immunity against being persecuted by the feds.
>>2652722>It makes sense, then, that someone who was once a part of those highly authoritarian leftist spaces would end up falling into the authoritarian rightNot really. It would make more sense to seek out more libertarian spaces as a reaction.
>>2667390>>2666790How did you find them?
>>2699619I found Bella Dodd’s great-grandniece from one of her mother’s Facebook posts where she said Bella Dodd was her great-aunt. I cyberstalked her from there and saw that her daughter is now an influencer. People need to be way more aware of how much info about themselves they put online.
>>2661687See this is what people mean, like you can support Palestine without trying to connect two radically different issues, also the Palestinian resistence blueprint has been an objective failure more or less
>>2649156>there was a trend of ex-Jacobins who flipped to the Holy Alliance against Napoleonany specific examples of books about this?
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