/leftypol/ - Leftist Politically Incorrect

>>2660419
Black women do an exceptional amount of labour in leftist slaves. I don’t agree with leaving the left, but their anger is certainly warranted.

>>2660419
Those people are paid Democratic Party shills, idiot.

My two cents is that it’s simply too difficult for them to become educated. That’s it.

Americans know their country is horribly corrupt, but if you’re working 40+ hours a week just to pay your rent and put food on the table, you don’t have the energy to even think about the big picture, you only have enough energy to keep yourself alive. Even when times are good, you have to work hard, and when times get bad, you have to work even harder. Our education system, if you can even call that, is nothing more than a factory designed to prepare you for wage slavery, to become a center left liberal so that you can support all of the policies that make life easy for the bourgeoisie, all while thinking it’s the “moral” position to take, and that you made this decision yourself. There is sometimes a mention of the phrase “critical thinking”, but it’s nothing but a prop to make you feel intelligent. Those who actually practice critical thinking are laughed at, ostracized for not fitting in. Reading for fun or engaging with the subject matter makes you a loser with no friends.

This makes you into a perfect slave. You don’t have the capacity to do anything unless someone on a screen tells you to do it, making you a perfect victim of propaganda. You don’t have the energy to do anything but nod and agree anyway.

So the few people who go from center left to leftist will mostly give it up because they cannot bridge this gap. They cannot comprehend even reading secondary sources of texts written over 20 years ago, because they can probably only read at an eighth grade level. Without theory, leftism appears to be simply utopianism.

Then crisis comes. The economy crashes again, people lose their homes, their jobs, their families, and their lives. We know action must be taken, but we can do nothing except wait for orders from our masters, who console us and tell us that it is now time to “return” to a better place, a harsher place where we “actually had a functioning country”. You wake up from your utopian stupor and join the crowds of people calling for the death of the foreigners who are coming to destroy your country. You are happy, your purpose fulfilled.

>>2660419
>Black-Palestinian solidarity was so fucking forced.
Black Panthers visited Gaza and had strong relations with the PLO, idiot.

>>2660419
Ever consider Black Americans aren't nearly as left-wing as people think they are?

>>2660419
guys what if political alignment is not a function of identity

>>2660634
The IRA does not represent the Irish people and the Black Panthers don't represent African Americans.

>>2660419
Blacks are fully aware that white liberals only use them as a vessel and don't really care about them. How many black people do you think wanted to defund the police? They knew many of them would die.

>You saw this during Occupy. There was a huge push to get Black people from the hood to join the movement and all this talk about how Occupy was “too white”.
This was done by the people who were paid to destroy OWS.
IDpol was made to derail the entire left form a class warfare to an anything else warfare. Race, gender, sexuality, it don't matter as long as wall street can make more profit.

>>2660634
I thought this was well-known?

>>2660419
>so why do Blacks need Palestinian saviours?
The Palestinian people have provided the blueprint on how to resist.

OF girls are now becoming Evangelicals, possibly due to being conditioned into patriarchal thinking that lead them to doing OF in the first place.

>>2649015
>Also, why do we rarely see any prominent right-wingers turning to the left?
We do. It’s just called “deprogramming”.

>>2661997
The right will capture any territory we fail to claim. While the left has been banning SW from their spaces, and promoting purity politics, the right has been appealing to them, despite the absolute contradictions that creates.

>>2664761
Wrong. The right has money. All whores care about is money. Whores will always be rightist forces because whores are abolished in Communism

>>2649015
I get the impression many of these Dodd and Horowitz types are the same people that engage in Sealioning at every function they appear at and were basically the Leninhats of there org until interpersonal drama causes them to denounce the entire movement for not glazing them enough. This is also why they go straight to the right wing instead of just being a burnt out apathetic centrist since American Rightoid thought is predicated on that concept that your literally the john galt main character who the dumb poors hate for being oh so special. Also why many right wing talking heads are "failed creatives" who think the reason they're not famous is somesort of liberal conspiracy and not that fact that there art/performance is fucking buns.


>>2660553
I also think some of the theory itself might weed some people out or at least anecdotally speaking(so feel free to disregard) they're plenty of people who are deeply uncomfortable with the idea that they're just one upon millions if not billions of proles or that history is shaped by material circumstances and not some fucking movie controlled by epic struggle between great men and ideas. Some mfers just don't like material analysis since it doesn't offer the same mental comforts as religion or idealism does. An extreme example would be every flat earther/creationist I have ever met- they don't like Science, heliocentrism, materialism or really anything after the enlightenment since that implies the universe isn't geocentric and doesn't literally revolve around them and that they don't have an all powerful imaginary friend who will grant them immortality in paradise when they die. I think some people are just too "weak-minded" per se for theory, not because they're stupid but because they can't handle the alternative without being overwhelmed with existential dread

tldr: egotistical mfers don't like theory since being a member of the proletariat implies they're just another schmuck like the rest of us

>>2649015
>Or, using the narrative they themselves most often parrot, they felt "betrayed" by the left so in turn they betrayed the left?
I vaguely recall David Horowitz using this exact phrase. “They betrayed me so I betrayed them.”

>>2665365
Reagan said that shit too, but about the Democrats.

>>2664792
Yeah, I know Horowitz definitely fits this description. He was always a nasty, combative guy even when he was a communist. He claims in his autobiography that he “knew” the Panthers were thugs and (allegedly) saw them engage in thuggery all the time, but brushed it off because he believed their intentions were good. The last straw was when the white woman bookkeeper he had introduced to the Panthers went missing and turned up dead in the SF Bay. He claimed the Panthers were behind it despite zero evidence (he said she had found some dirty business in the Panthers’ finances but who the fuck really knows?). It’s pretty clear Horo-shits was already in a contentious relationship with his comrades, the murder incident was what cemented it all.

>>2649015
I think it amounts to the right basically love bombing anyone who comes over to their side and the left being a circular firing squad that, at times, harms its members with little to show for it. I’m talking stuff like those Maoists in Japan that killed each other because they were convinced that everyone else was an informant, or the Weather Underground psychologically torturing its members in struggle sessions. You go from that to the Right where they’ll parade you around and elevate you just for having a pulse and agreeing with them and it’s a shocking turn that hardens what might otherwise be a cynical ideological move.

Like Eldridge Cleaver went from “raping white women is a revolutionary act” to being a Mormon (I believe at the time the Church still legitimately thought being Black meant you had “the curse of Cain” that justified being enslaved) that would talk at the RNC about how Reagan was so great. One of the RAF became a neo-Nazi. Bella Dodd was toured around the country by a Catholic Bishop. Even in ᴉuᴉlossnW’s day Fascists would make propaganda about how much they loved “converting” leftists. They’d often give them ministerial positions or some other kind of bribe. National Rally parades around former French Communists and delights in having them claim that it’s only the Fascists that care about the French Working Class.

Additionally, the Left sabotages any felt sense of victory. If some SocDem like Zohran wins then people will look for evidence to prove he’s a sellout. If a neocon who says “based” things wins, then the Right does a victory lap. It must be psychically exhausting to constantly believe you’re a loser that doesn’t have any victories to speak of, the Right showboats when it wins and declares that they were robbed if they lose, but they never willingly exclaim they’ve been defeated.

So yeah, think of it in those terms: you’re told you’ve never won, your teammates when they aren’t talking about how much they suck are willing to pounce on any perceived fault to declare that you’re an enemy, and then the Right is openly proclaiming they’re gonna win and keep on winning while essentially hoisting “former leftists” up on their shoulders then for cynical reasons at the very least you’ve got a reason, and if you go from the emotional whiplash of struggle sessions where you’re told you’re an evil traitor to an audience cheering that you’re “one of them” then you could feel even more contempt for the Left than before—you went through whatever amount of psychic anguish for “nothing” essentially.

There was some Twitter post that made the rounds online about some guy doing a “before and after I went right wing” thing, and he was bragging that he got a girlfriend and a dog, basically. The response libs rallied around was “Yeah well you just stopped caring!” And it’s like… okay? So he stopped caring and then he got himself a girl and a dog, what did “caring” get him? It’s basically sacrificing some supposed sense of moral clarity or “peace of mind” for material benefits, but if they never felt some psychic nutrition from “caring” in some vague sense what are they losing, really?

The point is I think there’s a psychological component to it, a major one, that straddles the line between cynicism and genuine belief.

>>2665611
/Thread

>>2665611
Once I think about it, when was the last time anyone in your org or activist circle looked you in the eye with a smile and said, "I'm so glad you're here. I appreciate you and everything you do."?

Conservatives are disingenuous as fuck, but leftists are almost detached.

>>2665611
>There was some Twitter post that made the rounds online about some guy doing a “before and after I went right wing” thing, and he was bragging that he got a girlfriend and a dog, basically. The response libs rallied around was “Yeah well you just stopped caring!” And it’s like… okay? So he stopped caring and then he got himself a girl and a dog, what did “caring” get him? It’s basically sacrificing some supposed sense of moral clarity or “peace of mind” for material benefits, but if they never felt some psychic nutrition from “caring” in some vague sense what are they losing, really?

The basic crux of mutual aid and "having empathy" is that you're not supposed to serve for a reward. You make sacrifices for others because "that's what you do," not because you expect to be fully reciprocated for your efforts. You know who also tells me that? My boss.

>>2665782
ye
>you have to do your moral duty even if it left you broken with no reward
is literally brahminical mentality. something you'd find in le rochelle. funny how things work with libs. I think it has to do with their class position; many libs are basically labour aristocrats, and much like the petty aristocrats of the medieval world these guys genuinely believed in the chivalric ideals about self sacrifice and whatnot

>>2665831
The PMC tends to be big on self-sacrifice and martyrdom. Academic elites love the idea of the noble death. Meanwhile, working-class people do whatever they can to survive.

>>2665611
>If some SocDem like Zohran wins then people will look for evidence to prove he’s a sellout
"Accepting new evidence is false consciousness" communism is about books written 100 years ago I guess
>some guy doing a “before and after I went right wing” thing, and he was bragging that he got a girlfriend and a dog, basically.
"I don't care about anyone except me and mine" - small soul neoliberal NPC dialogL
<Margaret Thatcher famously stated, "There is no such thing as society," emphasizing individual responsibility over collective welfare, which aligns with neoliberal principles that prioritize free markets and personal accountability. This perspective contributed to significant changes in the welfare state and economic policies during her time as Prime Minister.
<Neoliberal Ideology: Thatcher's approach is closely associated with neoliberalism, which advocates for free markets, deregulation, and reduced government spending. This ideology posits that economic freedom leads to greater prosperity.
<Economic Policies: Under her leadership from 1979 to 1990, Thatcher implemented significant economic reforms, including privatization of state-owned industries and cuts to welfare programs. These changes aimed to reduce the role of the state in the economy.
<Welfare State: Thatcher's government sought to diminish the welfare state, arguing that it created dependency. She believed that benefits should be a last resort for the truly needy, not a way of life.
<Cultural Shift: Her policies contributed to a cultural shift towards individualism in British society, often criticized for fostering materialism and a lack of community spirit.
being "right wing" is apparently just checking out and being a consumer of pure ideology, moving to the suburbs and losing your face and your fingerprints
>if they never felt some psychic nutrition from “caring” in some vague sense what are they losing, really?
Liberalism began 500 years ago, its been a long series of dismantling human society, like slowly cutting off an arm until the very last tendon of meat is left hanging. That's what atomization means, you have one finger and one button, that's it

>>2651435
>welfare fraud scandals made me right wing
yeah after 50 years of neoliberal brainwashing psyops from every post-Carter austerity scold president from Reagan to Biden. These neoliberal subjects are like that joke about monkeys attacking each other to stop them from taking a banana:
>If you’ve worked in an office setting, have a general interest in psychology, or been on LinkedIn in the past few years you may have seen or heard about the “Monkey Ladder Experiment” sometimes called the “5 Monkeys Experiment”.
>A group of scientists/researchers place five monkeys in a room that contains a ladder in the center and a banana atop the ladder. It isn’t long before one of the monkeys attempts to go for the banana but as soon as that happens, a scientist comes in and sprays all the monkeys with ice-cold water from a hose.
>If any other monkey attempts to go for the banana the same thing happens and continues to happen until all the monkeys refuse to go for the banana.
>At this point, a scientist switches out a wet monkey with a dry monkey who has no idea what’s been going on in the room and is probably wondering why everyone is so wet and angry.
>This new naïve monkey spots the banana and attempts to go for it but instead of being hosed down by a scientist, the other 4 wet monkeys hit him, preventing him from touching the ladder.
>One by one the rest of the wet monkeys are replaced with dry monkeys and each one attempts to go for the banana only to be violently stopped by the other monkeys. It eventually gets to the point where no wet monkey is left and only dry monkeys are in the room. Yet, they still won’t attempt to grab the banana thinking something bad will happen if they do.
ideology is like water that fish swim in, or ideology is like water that makes you cold and frozen in abjection as a punishment from fascist prison wardens

>>2665831
It's funny, because a lot of Black women on the left in particular are talking about how sick and tired they are of doing unpaid labour for other leftists and not getting anything back.

>>2651435
assuming this isn't just /pol/yp creative writing this is just a scratched lib who prolly shills autism speaks lol
>I got screwed over so everyone else has to as well !!!!!

>>2651455
>shouldn't be obligated to pay taxes because "the world wasn't made for autistics"
ok so who is the world "made" for then? People in general regardless of tism levels should learn in school to internalize the concept of social construction and the fact that society didn't just fall out the fucking sky or get beamed directly into some prophets head who then wrote it all down. All societies are "made" by social relations and class struggle, maybe I'm misunderstanding the activists here but its just seems like a very idealistic view of society and history where they never once considered the fact that you could just change society to be more accommodating.

>>2666489
The person who made the post said they’re autistic themselves, idiot.

>>2661997
>make money working
>make money taking your clothes off for internet weirdos
>make money not taking your clothes off for internet weirdos
all capitalism is the extraction of surplus value. in this case it is somewhat ironic that OF strippers are bragging about their fans paying them to stay dressed.

>>2666635
I can't believe an actual autistic woman arrived at a place where teenagers call themselves autistic because they can't stop quoting hitler.

>>2649113
>>2651578
>>2656106
>>2664792
>>2665611
Wanna know something funny? Bella Dodd’s great-grandniece (the great-granddaughter of her brother) is a well-known bookfluencer (Brielle Persun, formerly Brielle Colby). Her mother Teri Colby (Teri Marsilio) is a hardcore Trumper who participated in the January 6th riots. Fucking Kek.

>>2666489
I’ve always hated statements like: “the world wasn’t made FOR ME!!!” because they always come off as intellectually immature. No one consciously “made” the world the way it is; the world we have now is the result of centuries of historical forces. There isn’t some grand conspiracy against autistic people, and quite frankly there’s zero element of capitalism’s “anti-autistic” nature that doesn’t apply to any other disability or chronic illness such as lupus or whatever.

>>2666790
You should ask her about her aunt Bella. See if she knows about the Catholic Church infiltration conspiracy and if she’s ever spoken to Paul Kengor.

>>2665772
>Conservatives are disingenuous as fuck, but leftists are almost detached.

From personal experience it seems almost generational. Like most of the older comrades I've met have been encouraging and really friendly, helps that a lot of them have families and are grandparents. Younger ones it definitely feels like they're waiting for a slip up to berate you or just completely indifferent to whatever work you do.

>>2665782
Isn't the premise behind mutual aid that it's… well, mutual?

Okay, enough snark, allow me to explain a little more. No one is saying everything should be "transactional" including empathy, but the difference is that when it comes to things like charitable giving, there's usually at least something to keep you going: someone saying thank you, someone letting you know you made their day, so on. Say you decide to shovel snow for your neighbors one day, just to help them out: if they don't so much as say "thank you" then you'll feel less of a reason, I imagine, to do it in the future. If you decide that you aren't going to shovel snow for them and they're pounding on your door the next day saying "Excuse me but WHY aren't you shoveling snow out of my driveway?" You'll likely think they're entitled.

So yeah, in that particular example the dude "stopped caring" and got rewarded for it, but if that prior sense of "caring" was just individualized and he's doesn't see even an acknowledgement of that "caring" then there's a chance he'll just say "well they only actually give a fuck when I stop doing shit for them".

There's also, I think, a profound lack of grace in some left wing spaces. I said before that younger leftists often feel like they're waiting for you to slip up just to rake you over the coals for it, an example that comes to mind is one of my old coworkers was involved in some left wing orgs like the SRA and the like. Around COVID he became a kind of Vaccine Skeptic, yes I personally think that's a silly position but I didn't hold it against him. The other people in the org, though? People he knew for years and worked with? It was just instant "Well you're a piece of shit, don't talk to me ever again." He wasn't pushing it, I told him straight up I could respect his decision while getting vaccinated myself, but as soon as he bought into Vaccine Skepticism he was basically persona-non-grata among his former comrades, and I could tell it really hurt him.

>>2666849
I'm surprised to see the "Catholic Church Infiltration" shtick get mentioned on here as often as it does but speaking as a Catholic I can say it almost certainly never happened and is more or less a John Birch style mental illness. There were Catholic clergy that skirted right up to the edge of Communism, with a few wholeheartedly embracing it: Camilo Torres Restrepo for example was a Revolutionary Guerilla and a Catholic Priest who was later laicized (at his own request, mind you) but continued preaching a doctrinal fusion of radical socialism and Catholicism (one of his quotes was, to paraphrase, "Jesus would be a guerilla") and stuff like liberation theology, but there's very little evidence that the church was "infiltrated" with Communists going through seminary and becoming Priests.

It partly, I think, has to do with Fulton Sheen and the culture of The Church at the time. If I remember right he was something of Bella Dodd's sponsor (and also helped convert her) and he was a committed anti-communist. Though to be fair the Catholic Church's position on Communism at the time was in part motivated by repression against Priests during the Spanish Civil War (this is what got Tolkien to support the Nationalists' as well, IIRC) and internal struggles within the Church. Sheen himself had a quiet struggle with a cardinal over the appropriation of charitable funds (to Sheen's credit it seems he was in the right here) and both the reform process of Vatican II and the discussions leading up to it likely caused some psychic distress in conservative elements of the Catholic world.

I mean it's hard to describe how revolutionary Vatican II was at the time, it completely changed centuries of dogma and led to a minor schism with the Sedevacantists. And in periods of immense turmoil, its common to blame some "secretive" group behind it all: Masons, Communists, Jews, what have you. Communists became the perfect scapegoat for why the Church stopped speaking Latin and changed so many elements of Mass. In much the same way that "modern audiences" has become a term of scorn among right wing media consumers, reform in the name of modernism similarly became the conspiratorial scheme of some secretive cabal of Communists rather than an attempt to survive into the coming centuries.

>>2666897
>There's also, I think, a profound lack of grace in some left wing spaces. I said before that younger leftists often feel like they're waiting for you to slip up just to rake you over the coals for it,

Keep in mind, a lot of younger people go into far-left spaces because they have a lot of trauma in their lives, like they’re queer and faded a lot of queerphobia growing up, or they’re autistic or whatever and faced a lot of harsh judgement from others including bullying. Having trauma causes you to develop a highly authoritarian personality. So, these types of people will claim to be triggered by every single little thing and berate the fuck out of anyone who isn’t morally perfect in their eyes. Plus, the culture of having a lot of marginalized identity groups in your space creates a lot of hidden tensions (walking ouyghshells) since you don’t always know when your words or behaviours will be interpreted as oppressive or exclusionary.

>>2666790
>looks at her profile
>is clearly exploiting her baby son for views and engagement
I fucking hate momfluencers.

>>2666897
think we need communist fiction aka fairy tales and myths. like we know theyre myths and anyone can contribute. idk.

>>2666897
>If I remember right he was something of Bella Dodd's sponsor (and also helped convert her) and he was a committed anti-communist.
This is exactly what happened. Sheen was part of a Catholic anti-communist network that specifically sought out former communists to convert them to Catholicism and get them to snitch.

>>2666790
Whittaker Chambers’ great-granddaughter

>>2666979
Gen Alphas and Gen Betas are going to have such a warped understanding of privacy.

>>2667390
Fucking KEK!

>>2649015
>neocons like Irving Kristol,
Didn't Maupin claim the neocons were just Trotskyists on the payroll of the Congress for Cultural Freedom?

>>2667390
Stalin's granddaughter.

Nina Power was a leftist intellectual who is now a conservative. She's a friend-of-the-friend so this is personal.

>>2666790
>>2666849
I might DM her and ask.

>>2649135
>>2649076
In Judaism, we say that one is not defined by their mistakes but but the way they rectify those mistakes. So, anyone who slips up should be given the chance to fix the problem, rather than outright ostracized.

I'm petty bourgeois but I became commie (anarcho-syndicalist / council communist, tankies will probably say that doesn't count tho). As for right wing grifters rarely becoming commie, well that's because that is their whole schtick, you generally don't have anything to gain by being commie as a PR stunt and if you're haute bourgeois you may as well be apolitical because it would be impossible to relate to the masses.

>>2664792
One thing I will say about people in anarchist spaces is how many of them seem to have narcissistic mothers. Many times they’ll say they became anarchists largely because they were fed up at how many expectations their moms placed on them and how their anger towards their mothers were the first step in them questioning hierarchical authority. It makes sense then that their mothers’ narcissistic tendencies would rub off on them.

>>2670035
The family dynamic is usually narc mother + socially inept father. No idea why so many socially inept douchebags are attracted to narcissists.

>>2649015
Interesting how a lot of these people detected from the left after becoming Christian.

>>2670035
its funny that you mention narcissistic parents since my father allegedly exhibited NPD characteristics(ofc this is just other family members with no medical knowledge making these allegations) and I was a self-identified AnCom throughout high school until getting some more life experience and reading some more theory. I could definitely see narcissistic helicopter parents causing Anarchism to have some more appeal to there kids but what really set me down the path of anarchism and marxism was being really into the environment and realizing a healthy ecosystem and "healthy" capitalist economy are incompatible with one another. That being said I haven't really organized in anarchist spaces so I can't really speak on them sharing traits with their Nmoms.