🗽UNITED STATES POLITICS 🦅
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https://houdinimagazine.com/weeks-as-decades-reading-listPrevious thread:
>>2664844Remember, legal + illegal struggle
Remember, praxis + theory
Remember, it's not impossible
"Open the jail gates or we will close the mill gates." – "Big" Bill Haywood
Thank you dear comrade baker
>>2668448> is this not what a mass line means? going to the people to find the problems and then synthesis? Or are we going to pretend we can force them to believe in "the correct line"?No. That is bourgeois imperialist line. The oppressed and exploited people want self determination. Only the exploiter and oppressor dare question this. Communist Party line is mass line. Amerika must be destroyed and reformulated as decreed by Communist Party.
>I have met many, many black people fighting for their culture, contributions and history to be included in the 'national narrative' though. Afrikans' historical role is to reject the superimposed role in the amerikan historical narrative. Afrikan people dont want to be slaves to amerikans, therefore afrikans must have self determination as formulated by Stalin, as decreed by Communist Party. You betray all oppressed and exploited peoples by defying Communist Party line
>>2668583since you spend so much time arguing with namefags, just become one yourself so I can filter you, you're already 99% of the way there by how much attention you call to yourself in every thread
>>2668585I think he is one of the namefags. This dude is immediately recognizable because he never uses articles. I don't know if he does it as a gag or because he seriously can't into English.
>That is THE bourgeois imperialist line. >>2668585This really deserves not much attention because the Self determination of exploited and oppressed peoples ought not be debated. Blame the namefags who warrant correction
>>2668592i have fatigue of whatever this is
>>2668586Artikles are bourgeois. Why type extra,, useless words
>>2668582Why is she so qt?
>>2668598when did podcast become such a central part of burger politics, holy hell no wonder why everyone lost it when charlie got kirked
>>2668601Podcaster occupied goverment
>>2668582She's pro-genocide. And no I dont meant the Palestinians.
>>2668610Mix racing for me but not for thee.
fizzle
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/President%27s_Intelligence_Advisory_BoardHow many intellegence agencies do we have?
The soviets had like 2 kgb/ gru
>>2668609She's facilitating white genocide by fucking a white man.
>>2668582white genocide, literally
>>2668616Im against all genocide even if it's the whites
>>2668627it's really wild how the regime has pivoted from decades of having the most sophisticated propaganda apparatuses since Woodrow Wilson's presidency to just blatantly lying about shit all the time now that everyone knows is a lie.
testing if double hyphen – makes a minus or a proper em dash, because appearently minus sign and hyphen-minus are two different unicode characters.
>>2668630It is standard – —- there is both endashes and emdashes. Endash is two, emdash is three.
>>2668631Ivanka, Logan Paul, Desantis, whatever DonJr.'s daughter who is Elon's future baby mama, who are the two in the front. I thought that was Toe Rogan but it's not.
>>2668633Baldie is Dana White I'm pretty sure. Not sure who pigskin is.
>>2668629>it's really wild how the regime has pivoted from decades of having the most sophisticated propaganda apparatuses since Woodrow Wilson's presidency to just blatantly lying about shit all the time now that everyone knows is a lie.The culture war puts little value on the truthiness of things. Well, they are lying, sure but they don't expect to be believed. The reason their version is so outrageously false is because they are intentionally creating that distinction. Their version is meant to be wholly irreconcilable with observable reality or, in other words, it has to admit no compromise.
These "lies" are a shibboleth, a brand. If you are on their side, you know to say the thing, that nobody could confuse for anything but a declaration of loyalty. No more hiding behind irony, no more crypto- in the fascism. Porky have taken the temperature of things and determined that people are ready to support this stuff in the open.
The window of acceptability stretches to the right. While the left wing of liberal democracy mops up behind themselves by escalating the rhetoric against "authoritarianism" and, increasingly, communism. The bad left, the tankies, the "woke" which makes them lose elections. As soon as Trump retires "CCP" and AES will take his place as the boogeyman, I think.
BREAKING: JOE BIDEN IS STILL ALIVE
>>2668578What did the guy that ran up say?
>>2668629The NYT is still doing it in the old fashioned way, and it's a little jarring to see. It seems so lame next to a guy whose just going on TV and saying Somalians are human garbage and everyone who is killed by ICE is a terrorist.
>>2668650I’ve been in a deep depression and also snowed in. Was watching hasan clips from his latest stream and he was watching Fox News. It was outright insane, liberal rags are still giving eye rolling headlines and takes and right wing media is just “THE COMMUNIST GOVERNOR IS PROTECTING ILLEGAL CRIMINAL PEDOPHILES”. It was outright disgusting but they also seemed super desperate. It looked like how Jim jones was acting towards the end. They’re just convincing themselves at this point.
>>2668578He sprayed liquid ass on her. Fart spray.
>>2668578Not a big fan of Omar but I gotta respect that she was ready to square up
>>2668662Besides liquid ass, what are your theories /leftypol/
I'm going with Jessie's patented liquid meth with chili powder
>The Minneapolis police identified the man accused of spraying Omar as Anthony J. Kazmierczak, 55.
da eternal pole
>>2668665Fent. But since she was unaffected, my next guess is jenkem.
>>2668629I'd say its because we're looking at lying for the state vs lying for the man. Trump's absorbed the state into his ego; there's no America outside of Trump's skull. You can't divide America as it presently exists from Trump anymore than you can separate fire from fuel.
And the thing is while states can endure the death of any one man and develop policies that transcend singular politicians, states that are beholden to the individual ego are insane. Any failure of America becomes a failure of Trump specifically, every policy is a Trump policy. It's not "Great Man Theory" as some would claim, as it isn't elevating Trump to a uniquely positive or negative historical force, rather its the state captured by a senile and vain ego. It's not dissimilar to a monkey playing around with the control center of a nuclear power plant, there's no sublime will that undergirds everything, just animal instinct and pure causality.
Flat out denial of reality
has to be the order of the day because Trump swings wildly from one thought to another. There's no plan or scheme or coherent set of ideological principles, it's reaction distilled down to its most pure essence. Trump's a retard who will hear "we need to be transparent with the border wall" and think that means you need to have windows to see through it. Trump will watch "Escape from Alcatraz" and think that Alcatraz is a uniquely inescapable prison that needs to be re-opened. There's no principle behind it or greater thought, just that meme of the monkey with its neurons activating.
You can't say you misspoke or you were misinterpreted or create these vast narratives because by the time you're done constructing one, the monkey is moving on to the next thing. Hence it's just simply "Nah that didn't happen." ICE is in Minnesota because Trump, personally, wants to defy libs who say he can't do X, Y, or Z. When ICE kills another person the first person to speak on it in Trump's admin defines the narrative, and events are moving so quickly they're forced to construct quick lies that fall apart under even the most basic scrutiny.
>>2668674magas will look at that shit and call it staged but look at the very obviously staged trump assassination where he literally jumped up to yell "fight fight fight!" just for a photo op and think he's just a masterful leader.
>>2668674They were saying the war was on when kirk got kirked but now they are peaceful people who are besieged by false flags
>>2668669god I wish lying was actually illegal
social media has lobotomized millions of people and no one will ever be held responsible
(this is the attackers quora account btw)
it's crazy how the immigration "debate" has gone from immigrants are raping kids and eating pets into immigrants are defrauding the Federal government
Like outside of the "potentially funding Al Shabaab" thing everybody fucking did and will continue doing that in this country. What, you think the Irish went from lumpen immigrants into controlling American municipal politics in one generation because they work really hard? It's all scam all the way down
>>2668666>>2668672>Poolander squirts his PooMakes sense
>>2668668Not only is jenk real, it's more potent then fent
>>2668666We wuz saving the white race kurwa
>>2668583Not the anon that you're replying to, but having checked the last few replies I think he's talking about something that isn't really being addressed. Lots of "death to America" types either don't recognize or don't care that there's a historically oppressed minority here with nowhere to go that calls this country their home with essentially nowhere to move to that will tolerate them that isn't another western imperialist country (do not say Africa; they do not like African Americans).
When you have people like the guys in one of the other threads saying that killing all 330 million Americans is an acceptable loss, it comes across as larpy at best and dehumanizing at worst to the generational underclass who has been trying to make the country way less fascist.
>>2668705> (do not say Africa; they do not like African AmericansNasheed, stop just making up bullshit.
>>2668705I think it's insane to advocate for killing 330 million people just in general no matter their moral character. It's like a day of the cope larp but for leftoids
>>2668691It's the same as with hasan's "dog shocking" and the entirety of transvestigation. Schizo chuds see something unusual and start obsessively scrutinizing someone's every micro gesture to find evidence that what they're seeing is a show put on just for them or their enemies. Extreme scrutiny of details is impossible to falsify. Libs do it too when being paranoid about everything being AI
>>2668707>Nasheed, stop just making up bullshit.Interdiasporic infighting is a massive thing anon, I'm not kidding. Lots of Africans and Afro-Caribbeans dislike African-Americans because they see them as ignorant, cultureless rubes that are ignorant of history, or as rich people that come to their countries to exploit them despite being the underclass of the society in which they live (which is a complex issue in and of itself because many of the people who think that way do live in greater squalor outside of the US, which gives them extra rationale for thinking that way).
This beef isn't entirely one-sided either; a lot of African-Americans see foreign black people in America as posers (sometimes very wealthy ones at that) here for jobs that will abandon the struggle for black liberation in the Americas the second things get too difficult, which is sometimes true but not nearly as true as African-Americans think it is.
>>2668710Don't forget the guys who thought one of Charlie Kirk's bodyguards gave a signal for him to get his neck vaporized lol, that one's my favorite.
Honestly reality would be way more interesting if the bullshit these people believed was actually true.
>>2668713Aight, all you're talking about African immigrants in America, and that hasn't been my experience either. You were originally talking about Africans in Africa.
>This beef isn't entirely one-sided either; a lot of African-Americans see foreign black people in America as posers (sometimes very wealthy ones at that) here for jobs that will abandon the struggle for black liberation in the Americas the second things get too difficult, which is sometimes true but not nearly as true as African-Americans think it is.No I see it as one-sided completely that direction. African Americans are programmed to hate and look down on Africans like every American is.
Speaking of the subject, I felt like posting some of this Ishowspeed in Africa tour stuff before. Bro I've seen a number of African Americans breaking down in tears:
>WHAT?!! I THOUGHT ALL AFRICANS LIVED IN TREES?!! WE'VE BEEN LIED TO THIS WHOLE TIME?!?!!😭😭😭 >>2668689
>How would a gun owner react if I called the police and accused him of pulling a gun on me?<Are all Democrats angry and liars?I actually really really love this one. Reminds me of the old nonsensical non-sequitur copypastas people would post as replies mid-argument just to throw people off their game.
>>2668717>Aight, all you're talking about African immigrants in America, and that hasn't been my experience either. You were originally talking about Africans in Africa.No? I talked about both; the reason why African-Americans can't just "move to Africa" (assuming they even have the funds to do so and can get over the language barrier) is that they are not trusted there by large swathes of the population and are often not treated well.
>No I see it as one-sided completely that direction.Okay? I don't know what to tell you other than this isn't true. I'm not saying that *everyone* is like this, or that any of this is good, just that diasporic infighting is real and that people experience it constantly.
>>2668719>No? I talked about both; the reason why African-Americans can't just "move to Africa" (assuming they even have the funds to do so and can get over the language barrier) is that they are not trusted there by large swathes of the population and are often not treated well.What are you basing this off of? Lmao. You'll be revered like all Americans. I didn't say moving "back" is a good idea, yeah, you should probably learn the language depending, they don't speak English in every country in Africa.
>Okay? I don't know what to tell you other than this isn't true. I'm not saying that *everyone* is like this, or that any of this is good, just that diasporic infighting is real and that people experience it constantly.Bro, I've only ever seen it from the direction of African Americans hating on Africans. They feel deeply ashamed to be associated with African savages. African Americans see themselves as being a purely European people. Just like yourself. You don't consider yourself African lol. You generalize an entire continent.
>>2668721Yeah South Africa is a really fucked up place. There are many sub-saharan African countries that are safer than America.
>ethnic self-determination
libshit drivel
Next thing you'll say is "Africans sold us into slavery." You guys really got that "generational trauma" deep.
>>2668725This is a white supremacist talking point. No African-American people besides whack job conservative pick-me's take this seriously. I don't understand why you're talking out all this random anger on people that don't even believe what you say they believe.
>>2668723>African Americans see themselves as being a purely European people. Just like yourself. You don't consider yourself African lol. You generalize an entire continent. I don't think you understand any of this at all. I've seen African people say that African-Americans don't get to "claim" to be African in the first place because of their completely different cultural context and the fact that they grew up in the Americas. I would *love* to see myself as African, but since I've never been there, I often question whether or not I can. I can only tell you what I've experienced in terms of anecdote as someone who is half African-American and half Afro-Caribbean because nobody has done any studies on this. I don't hold any of this against African people as a whole in any way whatsoever. I think you just have a really crazy view on this whole thing, especially since you completely misunderstood what's going on with the Ishowspeed thing.
>>2668717>Speaking of the subject, I felt like posting some of this Ishowspeed in Africa tour stuff before. Bro I've seen a number of African Americans breaking down in tears:>>WHAT?!! I THOUGHT ALL AFRICANS LIVED IN TREES?!! WE'VE BEEN LIED TO THIS WHOLE TIME?!?!!😭😭😭You realize this is not an example of them "looking down on Africans," right? The American education system rarely teaches about African civilization or the continent in general, and tends to stick to tribal regions and periods. African-Americans are told that while white people were building Greece and Rome black people were banging sticks together and living in dirt. People develop a deep sense of shame when they hear that, and when they find out that it isn't true, they experience deep relief and catharsis. You're completely misreading that entire situation.
>>2668727>I don't think you understand any of this at all. I've seen African people say that African-Americans don't get to "claim" to be African in the first place because of their completely different cultural context and the fact that they grew up in the Americas. I would *love* to see myself as African, but since I've never been there, I often question whether or not I can.Funny because I've only ever seen African Americans say that Africans can't call themselves "Black."
>You realize this is not an example of them "looking down on Africans," right?The rest of what you said hardly disputes that.
>>2668728Yeah African Americans repeat a bunch of talking White supremacist talking points, that's what I'm saying.
If anything Africans look up to African Americans because African Americans are the premier Black people of the world because America blasts its culture worldwide. African Americans are very aware of that too. Like also in the comments on the Ishowspeed stuff, I saw a lot of African Americans going "they only treating him well because they want our money." Lol. Yupp you guys know exactly what your position is in the world.
>>2668733>Funny because I've only ever seen African Americans say that Africans can't call themselves "Black."Well I think those people are stupid. In the eyes of a white supremacist system we're all black. Like I said, the beef definitely goes both ways and I have no interest in excusing the way that African-Americans treat Africans and Afro-Caribbean people.
>The rest of what you said hardly disputes that.How is holding a deep, spiritual shame regarding your personal ancestry "looking down on Africans," unless by "Africans" you're also including African-Americans as individuals? How can you blame people for being locked in a white supremacist system that they can't find their way out of? The entire point is that these people want to be proud of and revere their African ancestry and are not given that opportunity by supremacist schooling; then they find out the truth and are given the ability to see the continent and their ancestry as it is truly.
>Yeah African Americans repeat a bunch of talking White supremacist talking points, that's what I'm saying.Who's generalizing now? Not everyone does this. I have said from the beginning that this is not a universal thing on either side, just enough of a thing to make life difficult for all groups of people in all different parts of the world. I really don't understand why you're being so weirdly hostile about this whole thing.
>I saw a lot of African Americans going "they only treating him well because they want our money."I've heard my Afro-Caribbean family joke about scamming black tourists out of their money, so I'm not going to say that it's 100% not the case, but I also don't think that this is universal or even the most common method of thought.
>>2668734Thems some fly as white boys
>>2668739>Who's generalizing now? Not everyone does this.I know, it's still less of a generalization than the entire continent of Africa. But chill homey, I know like multiple African immigrants married to African Americans. I'm just really tired of you guys repeating this "Africans hate African Americans" nonsense, when everything I've seen is completely the opposite direction. I'm sorry your African girlfriends treated you bad dude. You should visit Africa sometime.
>>2668705This tbh. And i dont understand how some Maoists can claim that disintegration of America would be good for oppressed peoples like Blacks or Aztlans
We can see with the Kurds in Syria rn as a living test case of how minority nations fare in a disintegrating state
>>2668742>>2668742>it's still less of a generalization than the entire continent of Africa.Again, I did not say that everyone does this, and have clarified what I'm saying multiple times. I'm trying to take this seriously because diasporic infighting is an issue that's very dear to my heart and since I get the vibe that you're also black, I'm trying to discuss it in a very straightforward and earnest manner, and it feels like you're not interested in doing that.
>>2668746I know who you are. You said you dated African women and they were condescending to you or something right?
>>2668749What? No, that's a completely different anon.
>>2668750Aight, I still know who you are but I didn't remember if that detail was you or not. Yeah that guy is way more aggro.
I don't know what to say dude. It just doesn't line up with my experience at all. All my 2nd gen African relatives all are like fully assimilated into Black American culture. I've never heard any of the first gen ones say anything bad about African Americans before. It just doesn't line up with my experience at all.
So what experiences have you had that led you to this perception?
>>2668743A few more years and whites will be a minority in amerikkka though
>>2668762>I still know who you areYou don't, because I almost never post here. I guarantee this is the first time that we're interacting.
>So what experiences have you had that led you to this perception?A lot of it has been discussions with people who have had firsthand experiences. I've also had some personal run-ins with diasporic infighting; one example that comes to mind was when I was wearing kente cloth at a black diaspora concert and two Ghanaians asked me what tribe I was from. I told them I wasn't from one, and they laughed at me. I can understand the reaction to an extent considering the cultural significance of kente there, but among African-Americans it is also used as a symbol of pan-diasporic liberation, so I felt it was still appropriate.
I also run into it frequently while conducting research and conversing with people because I'm an artist that makes a lot of African-inspired art. I've been through a lot of different conversations and arguments with a lot of other people as to whether I'm committing appropriation, whether what I'm doing is "appropriate" considering I'm an African-American, etc. I've even had my heritage questioned on at least one occasion under the pretext that non-African black people have no cultural claim to the continent and its art, history, etc.
I hope that gives you a decent overview as to why this issue is important to me. I care a lot about the diaspora and its people and I want to see us prosper instead of just being a constant global underclass for capitalism. I was told to my face in grade school by a white girl that black people do nothing for society, and when my parents realized how shaken to the core I was they spent months teaching me about the great African empires—Mali, Songhai, Aksum, Great Zimbabwe, and others, so I was very lucky and spent essentially the rest of my schooling combating my teachers on poor African history. Lots of people don't get that kind of treatment, so I don't blame them for walking around with the blinders of white supremacy on.
>>2668770Yeah but they will be replaced by largely white passing Mexicans like Nick Fuentes
>>2668775I don't know about Ghananians or if I'm grasping all the details of this event, but my peoples, they would just be incredibly flattered. Like cultural appropriation isn't a thing with them. I've saw some facebook post where someone posted they had their Indian friend wear the traditional dress and do some traditional ceremony and all the comments were "tell her she's one of us now!"
>Lots of people don't get that kind of treatment, so I don't blame them for walking around with the blinders of white supremacy on.I don't blame African Americans. I've always felt more of an affinity for African Americans than White people or others being African myself. I was raised in a Black neighborhood, was raised by Black people in after school and etc. I have lots and lots of experience with being looked at with suspicion by Black Americans. I know they just look at everyone like that. They have a siege mentality, it's them against the world, and I get it. I mean this is like hood Blacks, if you're not from the hood you probably wouldn't even relate to it. Always been I got to earn my stripes with them and then I get my "real uygha" card. But I guess that just makes it emotionally sweeter once I get approved to that exclusive club. I know it's not from a place of hate like I said, I know Black Americans are paranoid as fuck. I remember I was hanging out with these hood chicks in the car in front of my house, and we were like "let's go inside" then this one Black chick said, "your parents aren't racist are they?" then the other chick said "He's Black!"
idpol muh race thread
>>2668780>my peoples, they would just be incredibly flattered. Like cultural appropriation isn't a thing with them.It seems to vary quite heavily. Like I said, I've had my own heritage denied by African people, but on the other hand, I have an adoptive aunt in the form of a little old Ghanaian lady who is one of the closest people I have to a grandmother. She loves my art and hopes it becomes famous.
>if you're not from the hood you probably wouldn't even relate to it.I am, and I know what you mean. It's part of the white supremacist program and you're right that it occurs to everyone until they get to know you properly. Even within black Americans as a group there tends to be purity testing and rather harsh self-selection ("acting white," etc; which I have also experienced firsthand) as a result of the vigilance and internal policing white supremacy promotes.
If anything, it's one big mess that I find very tiring. Things would be so much easier and we could get so much more done if more of it was set aside.
>>2668784Did the Nazis gas Germans and Jews at an equal rate?
>>2668786I have time only for the Soviet victims of Nazis. The rest I don't care.
Ilhan Omar is an irredentist Barréist, a Somalian chauvinist of the highest order. The man who sprayed her is a principled Dergist.
>>2668794No. There are Soviets (proles) and the rest are petit bourgeois and labour aristocrats.
>>2668798Agree, Buryats are the proles of the world.
>>2668784I don't know, this was just my reality for the majority of my life since birth.
>which is mostly for the blacks, hispanics, and lower class white people We used to have honest to goodness race wars between the Blacks and Latinos.
I guess it's easy to be like "idpol muh race" when it doesn't intersect with your reality.
>>2668802I mean sometimes I feel crazy thinking I'm race-obsessed now living in other places, but like things like this urbandictionary entry remind me it's not all in my head. That's how I was raised, that's how shit was. Race, race, race, everyday. I'm glad that other people don't have to go through that. Hopefully things are getting better in this country.
>>2668804the US is a british colony based on genocide and slavery. the topic of race is inseparable from its civic order.
>>2668804Lots of sheltered people who read too much theory think that you can Material Conditions your way out of racism. They haven't experienced people who just straight up hate your guts tip to toe for no fucking reason and only want Communism if it means your head comes on a stick with it.
>>2668804>>2668802I member when I was in school, and this teacher at my local high school published an op ed in the local newspaper talking about how shit the school and the students were and he got a bit racist with it. It was like a whole thing. I got a lot more stories.
Teacher Put on Leave Over Letter About Black Students - Los Angeles Timeshttps://www.latimes.com/archives/la-xpm-2002-oct-23-me-teacher23-story.html >>2668708True. It's just weird how prevalent it is.
>>26688021. Im not huwhite.
2. I dont see the point in bitching about racism. One always has the choice to NOT live among huwhites. But y'all will crawl up honky's ass and then bitch and moan for decades about the racism.
>>2668811>One always has the choice to NOT live among huwhites.<hate your oppression? Just move broGenius; why didn't the Palestinians think of this
>>2668811Explain ICE kidnapping little children
>>2668811>One always has the choice to NOT live among huwhites.Really? The trend in recent decades has been gentrification of Black neighborhoods. So go where? Back to the South? Live under a White state government anyways?
https://www.city-journal.org/article/the-great-remigrationThat's also happening. I actually think it's not a bad idea, I hate to be like liberals are the real racists, but they are. New York and LA have the most segregated schools in the country.
https://civilrightsproject.ucla.edu/press-releases/report-shows-school-segregation-in-new-york-remains-worst-in-nation/I had this one history teacher from Pasadena and he told us I guess what he experienced, when they overturned the segrated public schools, what the White people did is they just took their kids out of public schools and sent them to private schools. The city is majority White but public schools are like 90% non-White.
>>2668805For some reason certain leftists will talk up and down all day about how The End of History is capitalist propaganda meant to waylay attempts at recompense and liberation but will never stop to consider that Racism is Over is another such lie meant to do the same thing.
>>2668816I'm going to repost the whole thing because it's such a classic article. I remember it in detail. Great read. If you're American you've probably read about Meredith in your textbooks and seen the iconic picrel.
A Change in Image : James Meredith, Hero of a Liberal Cause, Stations Himself on the Political Right - Los Angeles TimesTo many, the name James Meredith is, in itself, a symbol. This man sitting in a small house on a quiet street in San Diego was the first African-American student enrolled in the University of Mississippi. The year: 1962.
For that reason alone, Meredith, 57, is a civil rights pioneer. Like Rosa Parks and Jackie Robinson before him, he is recognized for having been first, in some critical way, in the struggle for racial equality.
“James Meredith is a pioneer in American history and certainly in the civil rights movement,” says Niger Innis, director of the Washington, D.C., chapter of the Congress of Racial Equality (CORE). “In his own way, he was the first. Nothing more needs to be said.”
But what Meredith says, and is said about him, is often surprising, even shocking. His alliances with right-wing politicians, his disdain for the civil rights movement and his bold gestures–he is running for President–have left a residue of skepticism. To those who know only the name and its footnote in history, Meredith’s credentials and public posture often come as a shattering revelation.
From September, 1989, until last February, for example, Meredith worked in Washington as a domestic policy adviser to conservative Sen. Jesse Helms (R-N.C.), who nearly a decade ago filibustered against a national holiday in memory of the Rev. Martin Luther King Jr.
But Helms turned out to be “too liberal for me,” says Meredith, who was fired by the senator. He contends that Helms had grown increasingly concerned over a partnership that Meredith has cultivated for years with David Duke, a former Ku Klux Klan member who has become a Louisiana legislator and gubernatorial candidate.
“The reason I was given (for the firing) was that I was too far to the right for Helms, which is very true,” says Meredith, speaking at his home in San Diego’s Mission Hills neighborhood. “But the other reason was the David Duke connection. That was the biggest of all the reasons.”
During his tenure with Helms, Meredith says, Duke made him an honorary member of the Louisiana Legislature and “sent the certificate to Helms’ office in Washington. When they saw that, they got terribly upset. Helms had told me that, if it ever became public–my association with Duke–that I would immediately be fired.”
Neither Helms nor his press secretary responded to repeated telephone calls to their office.
In Baton Rouge, La., Glenn Montecino, Duke’s legislative assistant and spokesman, says Meredith and Duke have “no formal relationship at the moment” but hope to form one in the future. He describes their association as an “intimate friendship.”
Montecino adds that if Duke, the founder of the National Assn. for the Advancement of White People, wins the governor’s race this fall, Meredith may end up as a staff member.
Says Meredith: “Duke believes, and I do too, that there are millions of whites in this country who have been denied their opportunity at the American dream.”
At the same time, Meredith says he has Duke’s backing in his bid for the Republican presidential nomination.
The candidate describes himself as relentlessly “pro black.” But he says he simply disagrees with the “liberal agenda of the elite ruling class,” which “pigeonholes” African Americans, Latinos, women and gays into the same category and weakens–rather then emboldens–each group politically.
But it is African Americans with whom Meredith is concerned, and because he believes African Americans are stronger as a separate political force, he sees Helms and Duke as being more in tune with the needs of his own constituency than George Bush or even Jesse Jackson.
President Bush was right in vetoing the Civil Rights Act of 1990, Meredith contends, because its primary goal was to help women, gays and Latinos.
“It did nothing to help blacks,” he declares.
At the same time, he resents newly elected California Gov. Pete Wilson for using the Bush veto to lure white voters. He calls Wilson “one of the most powerful–and dangerous–men in America,” without elaborating.
Since 1989, Meredith’s base has been San Diego, where his family lives for what he calls “educational and medical reasons.”
He has three college-age sons by his first wife, who died in 1979, and a daughter by his wife of 11 years, Judy. All but one live in a rented house in Mission Hills, not far from downtown.
One son, who suffers from lupus, is confined to a local hospital. Another is a graduate student in business at the University of San Diego. The third is an undergraduate at the University of Cincinnati. Meredith’s daughter is a third-grader at the elite, private Francis Parker School, where tuition is $6,805 a year.
On a recent morning, Meredith, wearing a crisp, powder-blue business suit, said he had grown disillusioned by “the total lack of structure and organization in San Diego.” He says that, in two years, “no one in my family has made a dime in California.”
As a result, he says, he may soon return to his native Mississippi “so I can make ends meet.”
Civil rights leaders say Meredith once supported himself largely through public speaking. For most of the last three decades, he says, he made enough speaking at colleges in one month alone–February, Black History Month–that he was able to support himself and his family for the rest of the year.
But most of the speeches have ended.
“The liberals have completely blocked that off–totally,” Meredith says. “This year in February–zero. I’ve had to sell off about a third of everything I own . . . houses, land, just to keep things going.”
Benjamin Hooks, executive director of the National Assn. for the Advancement of Colored People, says listeners at Meredith’s speeches often leave disappointed and confused.
“I’ve had students come to me crying like babies after they had used their limited funds to hire him to speak,” Hooks says from NAACP headquarters in Baltimore. “What they got was a hodgepodge of nothing. They usually want to know if they can get their money back.
“Here’s a man who never had a mission, or if he did, it’s long gone. He’s obviously lost his way–if, in fact, he ever had one.”
If bitterness toward Meredith runs deep in some quarters, Meredith wants people to know the feeling is mutual.
“For 25 years, my biggest obstacle was that everyone thought I was one of the civil rights people, the liberal agenda people, the nonviolent people,” he said. “I have never been any of that, and the so-called leadership knew that–you understand? It was to their advantage to portray me that way . . . because of my history, which coincided in time with much of what they were doing.”
The individualism and isolation that Meredith cherishes began at an early age. Born in Kosciusko, Miss., in steamy Attala County, Meredith was taught by his father, Moses (Cap) Meredith, that “death was to be preferred” over suffering indignities at the hands of whites.
There are those who argue that Meredith’s stubborn pride has served to detach him not only from white people but also from people in general.
For years now, Meredith, who sees himself as a warrior, has been at war with the very movement he helped spawn. In 1989 he told the Washington Post that 60% of black leaders were involved in the drug culture and that 80% were into some form of corruption.
He suggested he would blow the whistle on them. It did not endear him to one-time colleagues.
“That was complete irresponsibility!” Hooks exclaims now. “Baldfaced lies! Meredith has no philosophy or approach. In conversation, he never goes from A to B, or even A to C. He goes from A to I and then back to F in this meandering mishmash.”
Hooks says Meredith has “betrayed” any alliances he might have had by “cozying up to the likes of Helms and Duke.” As a result, he says, leaders in the civil rights movement have come to regard Meredith as a maverick eccentric at best–and at worst, a nut.
“I don’t know how any articulate, intelligent, self-respecting black person could ever work for Jesse Helms or David Duke,” he says. “Unless he’s trying to convert them–you know, redemption for the sinner–but with Meredith, I don’t get that feeling.”
Meredith responds that he knows “they think I’m crazy, but it don’t bother me, ‘cause I think they’re crazy.”
In his 1964 book, “Three Years in Mississippi,” Meredith acknowledged that he was once diagnosed by an Air Force psychiatrist as having an “obsessive-compulsive neurosis” because of consistent anxieties about race.
But it’s “the liberal agenda . . . the biggest trick being pulled on people in modern time” that causes him sleepless nights now, Meredith says.
Suddenly, he flashes back to the era and the valiant gesture that stamped him in the public’s consciousness forever.
“I never understood the emotionalism that people were experiencing by watching the activities taking place (in Mississippi in 1962),” he says. “I was never really involved with that. I was at war . I saw myself as a general. I was commanding, against my enemy. And at that time, my enemy was the white supremacists.
“But even then, I knew who my true enemy was. It was the liberal elite, without a doubt. The white supremacists had a narrower goal. The liberal thing was more permanent–to make the black a second-class citizen forever, and to me, that was sinister.”
Moments later, Meredith rails against the furor over the Los Angeles police beating of Rodney King.
“It wasn’t David Duke who beat Rodney King, it was the liberal black mayor Tom Bradley’s police who beat Rodney King,” he says. “But liberals all over America have created a perception that the Klan did that.
“You can’t find me a black in America who, in the last 15 years, can give an account of men in hoods riding down the street scaring them, abusing them in any way. But there’s not a black family in America that can’t point to the police abusing them. We’ve got perceptions that don’t fit reality.”
Innis, the director of the Washington chapter of CORE and the son of civil rights leader Roy Innis, says he can appreciate Meredith’s motivation and that he has tried to understand him.
“I see no problem with a black man making sure that every facet of the American political spectrum is integrated and has a black perspective, whether it be conservative, liberal, Republican, Democrat . . . “ Innis says. “The media often give the perception that the black political point of view is a monolith, when, in fact, we’re not.
“We’re as diverse and varied a people as any ethnic group in the country. For that reason, it does not bother me that James worked for Jesse Helms. But David Duke is a different story. For David Duke, I have no comment. You’ll have to ask James about that one.”
Innis says it may be that after years of fighting the predator–or people who symbolize the predator–Meredith has taken on their viewpoint as a way of defending himself against them.
One prominent civil rights leader, who asked not to be quoted by name, says he has studied Meredith for years, fearing that he posed a problem for those wishing to “protect the reputation” of the movement.
“Was it a case of Meredith being one way and changing? No, I don’t think so,” the man says. “Many of us had misgivings about James Meredith from the very beginning. We were concerned about him even before he entered the University of Mississippi.”
Hooks says his concerns were magnified in 1966 when Meredith decided to walk from Memphis, Tenn., to Jackson, Miss., in the March Against Fear. The march ended for Meredith when a white man sprayed him with birdshot on a hot dusty road.
“There was no rhyme or reason for that (march) at all,” Hooks said. “It was just something he decided to do.”
“Everyone thought he would be killed,” James Farmer, the former head of CORE, agrees. “It was complete egomania.”
Meredith says the walk was intended to demonstrate that African Americans in the South should overcome their fear and register to vote, after the passage of the Voting Rights Act of 1965. Meredith, who sees himself sometimes as a biblical character, says that surviving a gunshot wound proved that, in God’s eyes, he was more like Moses than Jesus.
He once told an interviewer that “God’s role for me is similar to his role for Moses and Christ” and referred to himself as “the most important black leader in America and in the world.”
Ask Meredith about other African-American leaders, and again his comments are tinged with contempt. Jesse Jackson is “a Democrat. . . . Enough said?” South Africa’s Nelson Mandela is the harbinger of “nothing good, because it’s all about elitism.”
But ask him about Martin Luther King Jr., who championed his efforts as a Mississippi student, and suddenly a new Meredith is talking, a man who seems to have gone back to a simpler, more idealistic time.
“Dr. King articulated the hopes and the sorrows and the wishes of the black race better than anyone ever did,” Meredith says. “King was the only one in the movement that I ever had any relationship with at all. The others I had zero respect for.
“So what can I say about Dr. King? Well . . . I miss him. I really miss him. He was a great man.”
>>2668820Nightmare blunt rotation: David Duke, James Meredith, and (you)
I mean, shit, it's sad to say, but David Duke seems very tame by the post-Trump standards.
Where's that image of the KKK dudes at the Black Panther meeting or whatever?
They found the jenkem sprayers facebook.
Apparently he’s big into Trump
>>2668821Those guys were the YPO and they stopped using the confederate flag after the panthers asked them.
>>2668829<George Lincoln Rockwell (center), Head of the American Nazi Party, at Black Muslim Meeting, Washington, D. C.Ok yeah, I think my recollection was mostly correct. Probably coming together on pro-segregation.
>>2668830>>2668829https://www.nationalgalleries.org/art-and-artists/63200/george-lincoln-rockwell-center-head-american-nazi-party-black-muslim-meeting-washington-d-c>Members of the American Nazi Party attended one of the conventions of the Black Muslim movement in America with the aim of supporting its policy of racial segregation. The Nazi Party leader, who is shown here between two bodyguards, threatened Arnold that he would 'make a bar of soap' out of her because he found the presence of a Jewish woman photojournalist disturbing.
<Artist: < Eve Arnold (1913 - 2012) American Ebic trolling!
https://www.splcenter.org/resources/reports/american-black-muslims-neo-nazis-foreign-muslim-extremists-join-forces/
>In 1961, Elijah Muhammad, founder of the black supremacist Nation of Islam, met with Ku Klux Klan leaders at the Magnolia Hall in Atlanta. Although they had different ideas about the skin color of the master race, they shared the belief that blacks and whites should stay separate.
>The following year, Muhammad invited American Nazi Party chief George Lincoln Rockwell to address a Nation convention in Chicago, even though Rockwell had often called blacks “the lowest scum of humanity.”
>Flanked by a dozen storm troopers in swastika armbands, Rockwell told an audience of 5,000 Nation devotees that he was “proud to stand here before black men. … Elijah Muhammad is the Adolf Hitler of the black man.”Official Black Hitler of America, what an accolade.
>Sporadic contacts between Black Muslims and white supremacists continued after Louis Farrakhan set up his own branch of the Nation of Islam in 1975.
>Klan leader Tom Metzger was so impressed with Farrakhan’s anti-Semitic bombast that he donated $100 to the Nation after a Farrakhan rally in Los Angeles in September 1985. A month later, Metzger and 200 other white supremacists from the United States and Canada gathered on a farm about 50 miles west of Detroit, where they pledged their support for the Nation of Islam.
>“The enemy of my enemy is my friend,” explained Art Jones, a neo-Nazi militant from Chicago. “I salute Louis Farrakhan and anyone else who stands up against the Jews.”Handshakememe.jpg
>>2668829Oh yeah I seen that pic too but I never looked into the background, thank you for the links
>>2668813How do you deduce that I support ICE?
Crackkas are doing crackka shit. Either mount an armed struggle or shut the fuck and lick crackka ass like all you house negroes enjoy doing.
>>2668812Yeah the Palestinians are engaged in armed struggle to kick the invaders out. They do not beg to live in Israel.
Why can't the non-honkies in the US do the same?
If they do not want a separate state, then that means living among crackkas. Living among crackkas means accepting their racism.
>>2668672>Ok next serious guess. He probably sprayed her with bacon grease or something because the anti-Muslims think it's the greatest own to make a Muslim touch pork or something. Screencap this.That sounds really likely actually. Also unless you ever look at MAGA stuff online, you won't really get the depth of extremely retarded Ilhan Omar derangement syndrome among the chuds where they say she wants to ban bacon and institute sharia law while turning America communist.
It's so totally irrational that I can only wonder what bizarre racial psychological factors are playing into it. Somalis have a slender appearance, high cheekbones, which makes them look similar to Europeans with dark skin. I think this anti-Somali stuff is kind of like antisemitism.
>>2668803Rand may be the only elected official who read and understood the Federalists and Anti-Federalists and how the latter was responsible for the Bill of Rights being crafted before ratification of the articles of the convention was even possible. I'm afraid the rest of his party today only wants to lick the boots they then pretend to wear.
>>2668859east africans are white men in black skin, this has been known for many years
>>2668868I'm glad the observer asked for clarity. With his accent I thought he said "if you raise your boys I raise your voice". I think he meant if you use your voice I will erase your voice but too much is lost in translation. I'm wondering if the middle school bully tactics come from being bullied before becoming a monster of arrested development. Too much is lost in translation and I'm tired of trying to figure these people, I need a cleanser. Peace.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jUzw1YPa9X8 If Americans are fascist scum that benefit from.imperialism, then doesnt that mean they deserve to die? Wnd if they do, why would you care about the ICE protests? Why would the people protesting care about the left?
Revolution will never happen and the left is to blame.
>>2668893Revolution and insurrection aren't synonyms.
https://www.marxists.org/archive/marx/works/1872/09/08.htm
>In our midst there has been formed a group advocating the workers' abstention from political action. We have considered it our duty to declare how dangerous and fatal for our cause such principles appear to be.
>Someday the worker must seize political power in order to build up the new organization of labor; he must overthrow the old politics which sustain the old institutions, if he is not to lose Heaven on Earth, like the old Christians who neglected and despised politics.
>But we have not asserted that the ways to achieve that goal are everywhere the same.
>You know that the institutions, mores, and traditions of various countries must be taken into consideration, and we do not deny that there are countries – such as America, England, and if I were more familiar with your institutions, I would perhaps also add Holland – where the workers can attain their goal by peaceful means. This being the case, we must also recognize the fact that in most countries on the Continent the lever of our revolution must be force; it is force to which we must some day appeal in order to erect the rule of labor. >>2668855east africans and nilotes are some of the most gorgeous black people on earth, very tall with aquiline nose and aristocratic features in general, the hatred by white chuds is probably a feeling of inferiority by white people of squat and flat nosed anglo-scotch extraction
>>2668708>I think it's insane to advocate for killing 330 million people just in generalthe US is literally destroying the conditions for life itself on the planet, "advocating for killing 330 million" is a nothingburger compared to that
It would be more effective to make right wing propaganda and use that to fund leftist agitprop, then to solely make leftist agitprop because leftists do not support each other or their propagandists, where as the right absolutely does.
Since the left would rather tell people to kill themsleves than fund them, and the bar for leftist content is much higher, making rightwing slop ai propaganda is probably the best way to fund leftist work. Sad!
Death to imperialism
>>2668902You can get good money if you just find one good heir or more likely heiress. They often tend to lean liberal/left, because they were born with more money than they can spend so the only thing left to do is pity the proles. I mean Engels right.
>>2668904erm chuddy didnt you know without the american empire a bunch of wholesome chungus minorities would have nowhere to go? please check your privilege
>>2668708Nobody has ever advocated for that you hysterical radlib. The moment people even suggest America and Americans being held accountable for their rape and exploitation of the imperial periphery and the unimaginable poverty of billions your persecution complex kicks into overdrive
>>2668708All yanks are guilty.
ICE is arresting and killing people who want to be Americans. The left says that all Americans are imperialist dogs. Why does the left stand against ICE?
>>2668912How will americans be held accountable?
Oh shit im sorry
>>2668915Jews are worse and there isn't 330m of them.
>>2668916Its because the left isnt one group cracka
If you look at the comments here the "left" can be both pro trans and anti trans, pro reform and anti reform, pro lumpen and pro prole, pro religion and pro atheism, because the left is composed of a gazillion people from different school of thoughts
>>2668912>Nobody has ever advocated for that Whats the other option tho? Waiting for burgers to have a revolution while their rulling class keeps destroying the world?
>>2668900So is Asia and Europe. Dare I say billions mvst die?
>>2668893>Revolution will never happenand the left is to blame.yeah bro it was "the left" that killed all communists during the cold war
stupid liberal
>>2668931No you should join the bourgeoisie who are against american capital and die for them
>>2668932Its like he's purposely trying to wreck the place. Maybe he's getting orders from Putin after all
>here's a video of Alex Pretti honoring a veteran, look how good of a person he was!
meanwhile that same veteran was killing people in the global south, so why should I care about this shit? hmm.
>>2668937>believing that there were "illegals" therengmi
>>2668932Materialist explanation for this? Materialist explanation for sanctuary cities?
>>2668944You mean Cucktin and his ilk? They are dickriders.
>>2668947Yeah lol foreign consulates are legally classified as part of the foreign country that establish them. If anything it is the ICE agents that are the illegals there
>>2668952Putin is not against american capital
>>2668932>inner sanctumLol. Was it because his mind was on sanctuary?
>PLAYING WITH FIRE!The ironing.
>>2668594>Gavin Miles McInnes (/məˈkɪnɪs/; born 17 July 1970) is a Canadian writer, podcaster, far-right commentator and founder of the Proud Boys.
>In 2005, he married Manhattan-based publicist and consultant Emily Jendrisak, the daughter of Native American activist Christine Whiterabbit Jendrisak who describes herself as a liberal Democrat.its so funny man
>>2668957he wasn't really a hardline right winger until later anyway, i mean he cofounded vice
>>2668949Liberal “moderation”
>>2668933they cant enforce the system in the same way the US does so they can be spared (for now)
>>2668936And communists in the USSR and China killed rightists. So what? It's what you'd expect, and it's ancient history.
>>2668934thats actually more insane that advocating for total burger nuking
>>2668968>and it's ancient history.except it isn't, you are living the consquences of the killing of all communists during the cold war right now, thats why the left sucks currently on an international level
>>2668975>The defeat was suffered before ww2western ultroid copium
the communist movement was at its peak after the Nazis got ACK'd by the soviets
>>2668949the US is a house of cards held up by undocumented workers. Competent liberal bourgeoisie understand this. Bloodthirsty white supremacist petty bourgeois MAGAtards do not.
>>2668975Scarface is an anticommunist bay of pigs gusano character. He literally tells pigs at the beginning of the movie that he kills communists for fun and then kills a Cuban govt. official.
>>2668977massive levels of cope
>>2668979The criminal underworld in general are no friends of communists
Once a proud, intelligent Bolshevik asked an SR how it came to be that six lived in fear of seven. the buffoonish SR grimaced and, reactionarily, stammered out "six seven" while pretending to weigh his ignorance in his left hand against his fascist tendencies in his right. The Bolshevik dialectically reeducated the imbecilic peasant loving SR before him, explaining that the fear stemmed from seven's consumption of nine's labor. Still not understanding the Bolshevik stumbled before deciding to revise his answer (albeit not in a revisionist manner) and explained using a childish metaphor that "seven ate nine." Cackling in glee the SR counted on his fingers, 7, 8, 9.
>>2668578She's 100% banging her chad bodyguard
>>2668648He tried to stab her with a syringue
>>2668955Hes conducting war against them, you yankee monkey
>>2669004He is conducting a war against russian proletariat.
>>2668676The kid who shot at Trump got his skull split open and we saw the close-ups. Maybe it was staged but they certainly didn't let him live to tell the tale. We also got a photo of the bullet whizzing past his ear but I guess that could be photoshopped.
>>2668981i mean it isn't really that damning for that aformentioned stuff, i wouldn't call it racism but it was a fascination with the strange shit that was going on there at the time, but yeah they were proto-hipsters for the most part
>>2669005Security should have killed him on the spot. No mercy for rightoids.
>>2669006NATO would replace him with someone even worse if they could, and NATO is the source of the conflict.
>>2669005the timeline reveals this guy was always retarded and self sabotaging
>>2669005>hmm his kids don't agree with him, must be a psyopwhat is wrong with xitteroids and rightoids, beyond the obvious stuff
>>2669022They want to make his daughter a target scholastically
>>2668983that's an eternal story in america
>everyone has goldfish memory>lower class feels eternally "betrayed" because they are continuously deluded into thinking the bourgeois parties are on their side>vote for the opposite party they voted for last time>Yeah! D/R won! Now R/D oppression shall end!Ben Garrison honestly cooked with his march of tyranny cartoon. Critical support in that instance.
>>2668979The movie itself is arguably Cuban Communist Propaganda, by the time you get to the end where he’s psychotic, off a mountain of coke, and gets his sister he’s trying to fuck killed, the viewer ends up at the conclusion that Fidel was right to kick Tony out of Cuba.
>>2669005>two DWIsSkill issue
>>2669039> the viewer ends up at the conclusion that Fidel was right to kick Tony out of Cuba.as we've seen with Tyler Durden, The Joker, Tony Montana, Tommy Shelby, ozymandias, rorschach, walter white, don draper, patrick bateman, the punisher, etc.
"this is a cautionary tale, please stop buying larping as the antihero!!!"
this has happened so many times it's unbelievable.
>>2669048Did you mean Tony Soprano for the middle of that list?
>>2669039Charisma overrides morality. Style beats subtext. Audiences identify with anger faster than consequences. Warnings require reflection; emulation requires vibes. If you make the warning character cooler than the alternative, you’ve already lost. Fidel only shows up in Scarface for like 3 seconds at the beginning, and it's just a short clip of him saying Cuba doesn't need Gusanos. The only actual "Communist" character in
Scarface who gets any screen time is a weaselly soyjak looking government official named Emilio Rebenga that Fidel also kicked out. The gusano refugees chant "libertard" before stabbing him to death. It's shown as horrifying but deserved in the subtext.
>>2669053Tony Montana is the main character in scarface but Tony Soprano also fits the list of antiheroes that people emulate instead of seeing as cautionary.
>>2668935I'm convinced some supposed leftists don't actually want a global socialist / communist movement. Much like the right, they just want their turn on the Xbox.
>>2668909>>2668931Case in point.
>>2669058Actual politics is boring, mostly thankless work trying to get to ends for which there is no guarantee, it’s like gambling but without the flashing lights and music and cocaine or being in the woods with a weapon
>>2668708However many died in russia and china communist revolutions, more, proportionally, will die in amerika's
so what was the liquid sprayed on Ilhan? 'vinegar-like' doesn't sound familiar to me.
>>2669048>>2669056>>2669054>cautionaryyes they ARE supposed to be bad people but can "media literacy" pseuds stop treating all art like some fucking afterschool special
>>2669067There’s two ways you can look at it, either people who want to be the antihero are media illiterate and you blame them for it, or you blame the antihero media for making their characters charismatic despite supposedly being cautionary tales
>>2668900>the US isthe US ruling class is. did you think we would forget about class so easily?
>>2669067actually my conclusion is the opposite. we should take the antihero emulation tendency and use it to our advantage. We need Marxist Sigma Male Grindset media. The problem with Communist propaganda is it depicts Marx, Lenin, Stalin as Goody-Two-Shoes with spotless records. But American style antihero media that shows them as gritty realists making hard decisions would make people respect them more.
>>2669078Let them have fun
>>2669078not what I said lol
Make Marx Cool Again!!!!!111
>>2669074put your trip back on Houdini
>>2669084I'm not Erik but I understand why you think that in this instance. I don't normally talk about mass media but since the subject was already brought up and this is already a designated shitting thread I thought i'd weigh in
>>2669086ICE agents should be handled the way the IRA handled British Police.
>>2669081you can have fun, just dont call it communism
>>2669082explain how the fuck "we should take the antihero emulation tendency and use it to our advantage. We need Marxist Sigma Male Grindset media. The problem with Communist propaganda is it depicts Marx, Lenin, Stalin as Goody-Two-Shoes with spotless records. But American style antihero media that shows them as gritty realists making hard decisions would make people respect them more." is not ideological culture shit
this means you explicitly think communism is outside of the class struggle and needs to be relayed to lesser people
>>2669090>this means you explicitly think communism is outside of the class struggle and needs to be relayed to lesser peopleyou win, you made up enough shit i didn't say that i'm not gonn respond
you know you're reading a banger on leftypol.org when retards start a sentence with "this means you think" and then say some shit you don't think
>>2669048A lot of those characters are not anti-heroes though, but villains. Some of them not even villain-protagonists.
>>2669097the same thing happens either way
>>2669098No more media, no more fiction, that way this can never happen again
>>2669091>>2669095LOL you are so fucking retarded you dont even understand how propagandizing is just ideology and unrelated to the class struggle. peak amerilard thread
cue petersonian "thats not what i meaaaaaaaan" and never actually explaining anything
>>2669100i told you you win but keep having your one sided convo with a guy you made up in your head
>>2669098People like characters that are likable or relatable and a lot of villain protagonists (or even villain antagonists like the joker) have those traits.
The solution is making villains not cool and relatable but weird and cringe. Nobody thinks Spandam from One Piece is cool.
Marx is basically a comic book character, like from out of one of my animes
Why doesn't the left have its own comics. People need to see Donald Trump being blown up by Giga Stalin
>>2669105yeah the solution is making shallower art
>>2669108Exactly, we need an anime lenin showing workers killing those heckin Fascists!!!!
Stop pretending like you wouldn’t love a miniseries about August Willich
It's propaganda people, that's what it means. If you don't like this then you aren't a communist
>>2669112Proles have no consciousness beyond trade union consciousness, if they did we’d already be living in at least lower stage communism
zomg you're all reactionaries the only ones doing anything are the fed watchers in Minnesota your all a bunch of larpers who want help me draw my lenin magical pony crossovers
heil marx
>>2669112>you are a retard who thinksthere he goes making up shit nobody said again. filter the mass tor baiters
>>2669074You are right. Lots of people respect Stalin more when they learn he was born poor, beaten by his father as a child, and was a bank robber gangster. It's only the middle class liberals who pretend those facts are some own showing his "true character" as a criminal or something.
>>2669105Having a character designated a "villain" is cartoon shit for children. A compelling antagonist is good for stories
uyghas gonna post his Stalinist soviet artwork now being like "uhhhhhh vhy vasn't I bvrn under communism"
>>2669121>You are right. Lots of people respect Stalin more when they learn he was born poor, beaten by his father as a child, and was a bank robber gangster. It's only the middle class liberals who pretend those facts are some own showing his "true character" as a criminal or something.thank you. that's all i really meant.
meanwhile you got retards who always have to do that disingenuous thing where they pretend you're doing redditspeak like this one:
>>2669111 >>2669126fuck u reactionary fascist, we need to make Marx Cool again what don't you understand
>>2669107>Having a character designated a "villain" is cartoon shit for children. A compelling antagonist is good for storiesYou don't know what either of those words mean. An antagonist is just whoever opposes the protagonist, and "villain" and "hero" are character archetypes and have nothing to do with whether a character is the protagonist or antagonist.
The Sopranos for instance is a show about a villain protagonist, since Tony is actually not an anti-hero, but a classic villain (callous, selfish, id-driven) even if sympathetic and somewhat tragic. His antagonists (the characters that oppose him) are generally also villains (Richie, Phil Leotardo) with some exceptions (the FBI are proper anti-heroes, they do things people would generally consider heroic, but in deeply unheroic ways).
>>2669104>make ignorant statement>get critiqued>refuses to clarify>acts like a victimdid you just find out about this place from bluesky or something
>>2669120>still shitting your diapers Guys, I've got it: Communism Sopranos cross over
Where Marx is like Tony Soprano. Epic???????
>>2669129>i love making shit up nobody said!!!! you have to debunk the things I made up about you!!!!two can play at that game
Wait, I've got it.
Dragon Ball comics with quotes from Marx
>>2669131HBO Lenin would go hard thoughever
>>2669132>propose solutions that never go past the realm of ideas>directly state propaganda is needed to "reform" the view of communism>get told propaganda doesnt change material reality<you are making shit upam i talking to a 12 year old
>>2669137Nothing anyone who isn’t a billionaire does materially changes anything, proles lost the class war so it doesn’t matter anyway
>>2669137>propose solutions that never go past the realm of ideaswell that's a lie. i regularly propose solutions that go past the realm of ideas. you just don't know that because you're currently obsessing over one post I made in a throwaway conversation that was already about stupid shit.
>directly state propaganda is needed to "reform" the view of communismnot what i said lol especially the part you put in quotation marks
>get told propaganda doesnt change material realitynever said it did.
you sure are addicted to winning pointless debates on the internet .
>>2669140great he's gonna think you're me and take a victory lap
>>2669138some of it goes hard. I like battle of lake changlin
>>2669145Why did he circumcise his dick?
>>2669131we need communist fiction and story tales tbh
>not communistuhh dont care kill yourself
>>2669148We need communist reality but that’s never happening
>>2669148Could be fun maybe making a zine for communist fiction or something.
>>2669074Communism isn't about "the masses/the people" much less their opinion on whatever your favorite daddy figure is at all.
>>2669108You are in a discussion about TV shows and pop culture in general and bringing up the Bolsheviks physically generalizing existing proletarian struggle.
>>2669128> "villain" and "hero" are character archetypes This is tvtrope tier analysis. Nothing is set in stone as archetypes themselves change over time. Classic heroes like Odysseus were callous murderous selfish conman. They would be considered "villains" by Christianity influenced suburbanites today but in their time were not because they were Greek and badass.
>have nothing to do with whether a character is the protagonist or antagonist.Historically speaking most stories made heroes the protagonists so saying there is no connection is wrong.
>>2669147thats just a plainly retarded article, venezuela never had central planning, and the only reason capital isnt entering is sanctions and not the government policy which is socialist leaning but in a firmly liberal framework&institutions
>>2669155>This is tvtrope tier analysis.This is sadly most media "analysis" in the 2020s.
Capitalist development doesn’t lead to a bigger and more miserable proletariat, it creates a middle class majority with petit bourgeois consciousness and social mobility between proles, middle classers, and the lumpen. Proles will always have a better chance of trying to move up the ladder than to tear the system down.
>>2669148There are already speculative fiction about communism and anarchist societies tbh, but you're probably not reading them.
>>2669155>>2669159I don't use tvtropes, and "villain" and "hero" being character archetypes isn't in contradiction with changing societal values? a hero is just whatever a society generally considers to be virtuous and a villain is whatever is considered to be non-virtuous, and generally this matches the concepts of the superego and the id.
"virtuous" is someone that can sacrifice himself for the rest, non-virtuous is someone that would sacrifice the rest for himself.
>Historically speaking most stories made heroes the protagonists so saying there is no connection is wrong.I didn't say there's no connection, but that it's not the same. Even if the majority of stories have a hero protagonist there's still others that will have instead an everyman, an anti-hero or a villain
And by the way, I learned this by actually paying stuff in high school. The fact that you people thought "tvtropes" before "formal non-advanced education" is very telling.
>>2669153>Communism isn't about "the masses/the people" retard detected
>>2669163
Yes always, otherwise any one of the recessions and depressions we’ve had would have led to revolution, it hasn’t because even the destitute recognize they can get a 401k even at wendy’s
>>2669162Communist speculative fiction is anti communist, by making it fiction you reinforce the idea that it cannot become reality and thus no point in fighting for it
>>2669164>paying stuff meant "paying attention", got mixed up with was I was telling my bf irl
>>2669165Capital itself is the subject of history, not any human activity
>>2669170Jarvis, translate
>NOOOO DON'T DO ANYTHING, DON'T TAKE THE INITIATIVE JUST KEEP SUBMISSIVELY DOING NOTHING YOU FUCKING PROLE CATTLE PEOPLE >>2669159give us your superior analysis adorno
>>2669170a pseud retard then, my mistake
>>2669155>muh tvtropes>completely missing the point with irrelevant shitretard
>>2669178you don't have to sign your posts
>>2669170Sure. And since transwahmen are technocapital it means that they are historical subjects.
>>2669146the vast majority of circumised people did not choose to get circumcised. and burgers for some reason got sold on the meme that circumcision is hygiene because it prevents dick cheese (just wash your dick) and a lot of surgeons shill circumcision by telling parents their kids will get phimosis otherwise (phimosis isn't nearly as painful as circumcision and fixes itself after a while)
>>2669173When are you going to get it through your head that you don’t matter and nothing you do in your small little life matters? Get over your protagonist syndrome
>>2669181>come into conversation>declare unspecified group of people don't know thing>provide no evidence>wait for people to bitebait alert bait alert
>>2669184Unless you are a transwahman
>>2669184>i'm the protagonist, not youuh oh stinky
>>2668820This just sounds like the predecessor to "democrat plantation" nonsense. There IS something in this country that is designed to keep you trapped, deprive you of choices and makes promises that it never intends to keep: it's capitalism. I don't really understand how an educated person could come so close to the truth and then get side tracked like this.
>>2669180>>2669186They’re fun and I’ll always buy LSD from them but they’re possibly the least consequential population to ever live
>>2669168I know you don't actually believe that. Fiction is powerful stuff. Think about all the sci-fi that are being chased into reality by tech oligarchs right now. It's radicalizing. How about something like the Turner Diaries for the right?
>>2669187I matter least of all, I’m just honest enough to admit it
>>2669184>Get over your protagonist syndrometop 10 funniest cases of projection
>>2669190I do, fiction is inherently reactionary
>>2669158>>2669167>all caps pants shittingcringe af
ok buddy except all the posts are explicitly saying communism is about going to where the proletariat is instead of this hallucinated bullshit about "reading books" (projection, given you are literally proposing pop culture as an instrument of da revolution lmao) but keep feeling you are "at least doing something" because you watched andor or something LOL
most proletarians couldnt care less about marxs name, and the communist movement isnt some ideology waiting to be realized under his banner
>>2669161even marx already pointed this out two centuries ago
>>2669189They are a technocapital though
>>2669199More so than gay men or FTSMs?
>>2669117The reactionary gusano drive is all about wanting to have sex with lumpen criminals (ICE agents)
>>2669160What the fuck are you talking about with your "oh he said a word that we don't say which gives him away." Masses is like super old-school commie stuff circa 1920
>>2669185you can find the evidence in any dictionary of literary terminology and theory, and often in normal dictionaries. You can literally google what I'm saying right now.
>>2669195>"reading books" (projection, given you are literally proposing pop culture as an instrument of da revolution lmao)I'm alluding towards the fact that the majority of western so called communists think just reading all the theory and not applying it towards any concrete action in real life is actually conductive to anything. Making propaganda is at least doing something, even if very small. Just reading theory forever and not doing anything with it is not different that reading the 3 little piggies for 10 hours a day.
>>2669201>wanting to have sex with lumpen criminals (ICE agents)I don't know how true it is, but on TikTok, a women was getting with ICE agents on hinge or something and then doxxing them online. We need to radicalize more sex workers to do what the CIA did and have them sleep with the enemy for intel.
>>2669202let's look at your original post:
>Ameritards are so retarded they get angry when you point out that they don't know basic literary concepts you learn in high school lole.what concepts? you didn't even specify
>>2669204>a women *a woman.
"women" is plural, you can't say "a women".
saying "3 women were drinking milk" makes sense, and so does "a woman was drinking milk" but not "a women".
>>2669206read the thread
>>2669165in a rigorous sense it isn't, its about the material interests of the proletariat in specific, its about social relations not an abstract universal subject that doesn't designate anything related to its economic reality
the whole point of "marxism" is that its about relations, not "things"
>>2669207Fuck. Thanks for the correction, anon. I wrote down "women" thinking it was multiple after I wrote down "a". I will never post again.
>>2669208For there to be relations, there have to be things to relate to
>>2669210Still your post was pretty nice, reminded me of this girl that fucked a guy just because the guy had taken the dog of a friend away, and when the guy was sleeping she took the dog back lmao.
>>2669208if you're gonna be needlessly rigorous we were talking about communism, not marxism
>>2669201funny how she doesn't mention any kind of latinx in that ad
>>2669156you get it. praxis is larping. you have to kill your previous way of living. you must accept the role. theres no other way.
>>2669217It’s far more realistic to kill yourself outright
>>2669200So gay men and ffsms are also historical subjects then if they are also a technocapital
>>2669217Yeah anon kill yourself, anything but praxis please dont do praxis I'm begging you I'm begging you don't even try it, just keep reading more theory in your room but DON'T do anything please do not do things please please please.
>>2669220larping is killing your
SSelf
>>2669225Trvke
>To be a communist is not to become a better person, it is to cease being a “person” in the bourgeois sense altogether. The individual & its “personality”, as we know it today, is not an eternal essence but a historically produced artifact, born alongside private property, commodity exchange, and the fragmentation of the species into isolated selves for the objectification and sale of labor power within the capitalist marketplace. >>2669225No, putting a gun to your head and squeezing the trigger or deliberately overdosing on downers is killing your
SSelf
>>2669211What you call "the people", "the masses" is composed by different social classes, the individuals that compose these social classes and the concrete characteristics they have in the real world are produced by social relations of production, they are defined by the role they occupy in the economy, and according to this role they will have different interests that movilize them.
You are confusing the effect for the cause, you are doing the same thing Marx criticized Hegel for. "the people", "the masses", "humanity", "absolute spirit", non of these are really materialist terms.
I'm not saying "the masses" don't have a role to play, but saying communism is about the people or the masses misses the entire point of Marxism.
>>2669229Communism isn’t about it anything because it’s an impossibility and doesn’t exist
>>26692324chud /pol/ tier demoralization post, madone
>>2669233It’s the truth and you know it
>>2669234Yeah it's the truth everybody pack it up just SUBMIT to the status quo
>>2669164>a hero is just whatever a society generally considers to be virtuous and a villain is whatever is considered to be non-virtuousThat means the hero or villain can mean anything considering what is virtuous or good changes from value systems to value system. If the concept hinges on what the majority think at any given time at which point you always need a vote to decide if a character counts as hero or villain and that will change from group to group and time period to time period meaning there is no solid definition.
Ultimately saying "Tony Sopranos is a villain" is just a way to signal to your audience you have values that are different from those expressed by his character. It's not because he objectively meat some enteral criteria of villain archetype.
>but that it's not the same.Theoretically you can separate them out because what counts as hero is so changeable. But in reality most protagonists become the hero once they convince the audience they are one.
>The fact that you people thought "tvtropes" before "formal non-advanced education" is very telling.The fact you are give the same analysis as tvtropes tells us the level of tvtropes tbh
We need a communist harry potter to inspire the masses
Get JK on the phone
>>2669236Every breath we take is stolen oxygen from actually productive people in the third world anyway, if communism happened we would have rationed electricity and constant blackouts as reparations and that’s in no one’s interests
>>2669238I liked the Owl House…
>>2669237>That means the hero or villain can mean anything considering what is virtuous or good changes from value systems to value systemWhat culture considers callous people that do things for their own benefit at the expense of others to be a hero, and a person that sacrifices himself for the rest to be a villain?
while its true that there are variations based on culture, these two things are universal. I think you're just grasping at straws because you refuse to admit you're wrong on a basic concept. I mentioned it before but this is something you can easily research and any literary concepts and theory dictionary will give you the definitions I gave you. Even normal, regular dictionaries actually.
the massive demonstrations in Minneapolis are a good thing to see, but everyone sympathetic to this as a "general strike" really must ask themselves this question: is it really properly a strike if you go back to work the next day and nothing has changed? not to denigrate workers whove organized and are participating in these demonstrations, but if you are calling for a general strike, you must fight for its extension and generalization if you want to "get the goods," as they say
>>2669243>the massive demonstrations in Minneapolis are a good thing to seeTerminal lib brain
>>2669222I know we all already knew she was faking it but LMAO
>>2669226Is this a real quote from somewhere? It sounds fucking awful.
>>2669252Guess where it is from
There’s a lot of debate over doing things or not. I think people really need to dispense with this idea that doing something wrong is worse than not doing anything imo.
>>2669251Doing nothing is preferable to siding with the left wing of capital as it chimps out for treats and makes a nuisance of itself
>>2669253Wherever it's from, it doesn't sound great.
>>2669257That's an absolutely insane way of characterizing the past week.
>>2669257Jarvis, translate
>DO NOTHING! DO NOTHING! SUBMIT! BE IMPOTENT! JUST KEEP READING MORE THEORY AND BICKERING AMONGST EACH OTHER, JUST DON'T TRY TO DO ANYTHING THAT COULD EVER HAVE AN EFFECT ON THE REAL WORLD >>2669248in an effort to appear less lib you become more nihilist
Guys, Iron man. But he's a communist.
>>2669257> left wing of capital >treatsfeds really landed on the perfect rhetorical strategy for derailing any discussion.
>>2669266If 20 years from now this shit is revealed to be COINTELPRO 2.0 I wouldn't be surprised at all.
>>2668544>>2668546there's more than a few things that are dead simple to obtain and get that would be pretty lethal like that
cyanide is also braindead simple to make if you can handle toxic gasses
>>2669242>What culture considers callous people that do things for their own benefit at the expense of others to be a hero, and a person that sacrifices himself for the rest to be a villain? Ancient Greek and Mesopotamian as already pointed out. But even taking a look at autobiographies and histories written just a few hundred years ago shows people had wildly different values than modern urbanites from first world countries
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Benvenuto_Cellini#Autobiography>these two things are universal.Those ideas are largely Christianity based and not all societies judged people based on how willingly they will kill themselves for others.
>Even normal, regular dictionaries actually.Because those record normative definitions used by people not an indepth historical analysis of the concept.
>>2669258Its from Le ICP.
>>2669248Every second ICE is slowed down by the hecklers is another second they can't kidnap another person. If anything, these demonstrations boost the morale of those in the city.
>>2669214>needlessly rigorous the rejection of an universal abstract subject as the agent of history is not "needlessly" rigorous, its basic scientific socialism
>>2669262Yeah that’s it good prole, resist the heckin orange man and voot bloo! #NoKings #HandsOffNATO
>>2669260They haven’t even burned down a police station, never mind the fact that they have no class consciousness nor revolutionary potential nor even any idea why they’re out there, their favorite politicians told them to be mad and here they are on the street alternating between dancing like imbeciles and trying to attack law enforcement. If you think there’s anything remotely communist about any of this then Marxism is truly dead in the west
>>2669268just like with CIA coups it won't matter.
if you say some shit that went down in another country was CIA, libs will concern troll with "proofs? proofs?" then 60 years later when they declassify it they won't admit they were wrong.
same with COINTELPRO shit like this
>>2669268you don't need feds for this wrecking, you just need a culture of impotence and hyperfocusing on the past rather than the present, quoting shit from at best the 1960s and 70s but more typically the mid 20th century, we don't live in 1936 anymore, we don't live in 1958 anymore, we have to adapt to the times that we actually do live in
>>2669274Insane Clown Posse or Indochinese Communist Party?
>>2669277YEAH that's right, if you do things you're a vootminded liberal, real hardline communists such as you and I just sit on our asses doing fuckall.
>>2669275And every second you take trying to elevate the condition of the herrenvolk is another second the imperial war machine is allowed to continue the rape and exploitation of the periphery for YOUR benefit, but you already knew that
>>2669278funny how these multiple agencies exist with vast budgets, but according to libs they dont do anything except 20-30 years ago
>>2669276Marx repeatedly said revolutions are the locomotives of history, show me a revolution that didn't have the broader majority of people participating in or acquiescing to it? to say revolutions are possible without 'the masses' is crude intellectual philistinism
>>2669251he likely doesn't read books, just does nothing
>>2669286youre just a christian moralist. just say so
>>2669282There’s nothing to organize because there is no meaningful proletarian base in America, this has been explained countless times
>>2669272>Ancient Greek and Mesopotamian This is just incorrect or comes from reading ancient stuff poorly.
Also the Cellini thing you posted isn't actually connected to anything, you kinda just felt like posting it.
Nato without America: Europe ‘thinks the unthinkable’
>“This crisis is much worse than anything we’ve seen in 77 years of Nato history and in many ways, anything since December 7 1941, which is when the United States formalised the idea that the security of Europe was fundamental to the security of the US,” says Ivo Daalder, a former US ambassador to Nato. “That idea that was formalised in treaty form in 1949 is gone. It’s over.”NATO IS DEAD
https://archive.ph/Ig8Xw>>2669255>I think people really need to dispense with this idea that doing something wrong is worse than not doing anything imo.writing articles dickriding tim walz while dems send cops to help ICE is worse than doing nothing, keep this action for the sake of action in your strasserite discord or something
>>2669294>stop organising>actually its not organising because uh… because it just isntmake up your mind retard. people are going outside and putting their lives at risk but apparently theyre dipshits because they dont virtue signal enough for you
>>2669294every time you or some other anon says this I point out
1: There are proletarians in America
2: Even if they weren't many of the petty bourgeoisie and labor aristocrats will be re-proletarianized as the empire declines
3: homeless and prisoners suffer too even if they're harder to organize they have been organized before
4: Stalin literally tells you to go after the downwardly mobile petty bourgeoisie
>>2669266>>2669268>>2669279Nah dude don't you get it? Not getting killed in broad daylight is merely a treat dangled in front of the Amerifat masses. Protesting against state tyranny is thus counterrevolutionary and demands re-education. Marx Lenin and Mao would agree!
>voluntarism
>>2669296>NATO IS DEADI wish. It is being undermined but Trump is just trying to shakedown the European clients of the US protection racket. Until Europeans actually kick burgers out of Europe, NATO is alive and well.
>>2669304they've recognized the incident at greenland is the start of something, they're trying to buy time
>>2669300And once again it’s explained to you liberals that the service economy which makes up the overwhelming majority of “le working class” in America is fundamentally liberal and has no incentive to support communism, same as all other Americans who directly benefit from imperialism
>>2669289>to say revolutions are possible without 'the masses' is crude intellectual philistinismshit nobody said award
>show me a revolution that didn't have the broader majority of people participating in or acquiescing to it?if there wasn't a relation of social antagonism then there wouldn't be revolutions regardless of how much "le people" you add, do you understand now?
>>2669301Police in AES kill people too, guess China is fascist now and needs a revolution!
Retard
>>2669309Okay, so do nothing. Got it.
Are you going to suggest next that we carpet bomb everyone in America to end its tyranny?
>>2669311a second proletarian revolution, yeah
>>2669312that's their next answer "HUNDREDS OF MILLIONS MUST DIE" nonsense, nothing but reactionaries in a red coat
>>2669311>>2669314I see that I satired too close to the sun.
>>2669310so your point the entire time was
>communism is not about 'the masses' because class relations existdebate addicts jumping into conversations they don't at all understand, classic
>>2669319Your post actually reads less deranged that the average "muh treatlerite everyone who wants to do anything is a liberal" poster
>>2669319No arrow therefore you say this and look like that
>>2669310>shit nobody said awardit is, in fact exactly what you said
>if there wasn't a relation of social antagonism then there wouldn't be revolutions regardless of how much "le people" you add, do you understand now?is this more "you didn't use the right word, therefore you're 100% wrong" nonsense?
just how do think the right got as far as it is rn? by larping on 4chan? no, it through HUGE online organization all of this has been brewing for years! nows finally our chance to radicalize some libs/center "leftists" and some of you just give up?
>>2669322>so your point Its not my point, is Marx's point.
>debate addictTurns out on /rightypol/ pointing out basic Marx makes you a debate addict chud or something, classic.
the left suffers because most of you just want to feel good and do virtue signaling about how radical you are without ever going outside and doing real things in the real world. say what you want about socdems but they can actually appeal to people and mobilise them , this isnt limited to america, communists are ultimately meaningless in any other country in the world
real life politics is boring and frustrating, you need to build things and it takes time, you need to fight and a lot of the time youre going to lose, you have to make concessions and work with people who disagree with you. thats how normal adults, not LARPing teenagers, handle politics
>>2669328Right didnt do anything.
>>2669295>This is just incorrect or comes from reading ancient stuff poorly.This coming from someone who supposedly only know things based on paying attention in high school?
>Also the Cellini thing you posted isn't actually connected to anythingI didn't memorize the passages off hand so I linked the wiki page. It points out he treats his murders and assaults as being normal. Read just about anything written by a solder like Bernal Diaz or Xenophon and you can see for yourself how they had different values from modern norms and saw themselves and their companions as great people. Of course you will just classify these real people as "villains" to fit into your liberal world view I bet.
>>2669330Factual, quality post.
>>2669331oh so the groypers just popped out of nick fuentes's bussy one day?
>>2669330>do somethingLike what?
>>2669335Groypers didnt do anything.
>>2669339ok man whatever you say
>>2669341You are a communist yes? You didnt pop out of someones bussy either.
>>2669309you didn't actually address directly anything anon said even though he directly addressed and deconstructed what you said. NOTICING.
>>2669336NTA but literally anything? Go to a protest in your area and use the frenzy that people are feeling to sign them on to even more leftist opinions. You don't need to hand out Marx pamphlets (and shouldn't, it's too blatant), but you should talk to people and get them signed on to an org in your area you find respectable or at least most in line with your values.
On that note, volunteer with an org. Donate to an org. It doesn't even need to be a leftist org, it just needs to be something that does the right thing. My family and I have volunteered at local food pantries / donation centers for years. Do you know who I've NEVER seen at ANY of them? A Leftist.
>>2669336like the mass demonstrations we are seeing? everytime the broader left starts fighting for something, communists denounce it as lib shit so they can feel superior.
>>2669345trvth nvke
>>2669343my point is that people dont just become nazis out of nowhere it takes fear, fear of browns blacks jews etc communists can also (beliveve it or not) USE PROPGANDA
>>2669345People who dont know what they are talking about shouldnt agitate. It will only alienate workers further
>>2669312America is retreating from imperialism on its own thanks to based retard Trump meanwhile China keeps winning by developing its own productive forces. The situation is optimal
>>2669346>the broader leftSo not communists
>>2669345Workplace organizing cant be forced by a single individual. It happens spontaneously
>>2669353Holy cope dude, I guarantee you there's an org you can sign on with within an hours travel of your house. Try giving a shit.
>>2669327>it is, in fact exactly what you saidIn fact I said the complete opposite, I said I think what people mean by "the masses" do have a role to play here
>>2669229 at the end.
>is this more "you didn't use the right word, therefore you're 100% wrong" nonsense?I'm just pointing out basic Marx, I'm sorry if scientific socialism makes you mad.
>>2669347You are a communist, therefore party did its job
>>2669352yes dude, because you have common goals. ultimately commies and socdems have a different objective, but they can fight together over specific well-defined goals.
>>2669359So, one person can force a union to happen in a workplace that has no union? Is that what you are saying?
>>2669357You have no guarantees
>>2669363no that is not what i'm saying. I'm saying it isn't spontaneous. At least one person, but usually more people, need to get the ball rolling on a conscious, devoted, non-spontaneous effort to organize.
>>2669360what party bro? there are no communist parties in where i live as far as i know
>>2669366Alright dude. I can't force you so I guess you have no choice but to read books and do nothing.
>>2669365For how much they talk about strength they're comically thin skinned scaredy cats. Verily.
>>2669372I dont read books.
>>2669266It makes me glad that this place is so utterly irrelevant.
Like if the feds really are trying to wreck this place, then we truly do live in the Reddit Reich because only a government of terminally-online morons could ever believe that this place is important.
you ever notice how the one thing that REALLY gets under rightoids' skin is questioning their blind trust of online sources? >>2669377
marx is that you?
>>2669382
why are you pissing and shitting yourself so hard?
>>2669370It is spontaneous. If it isnt then go start a union
>>2669382
chatGPT response
>>2669359Tldr on salting?
>>2669388
TRVKE
>>2669388
God you people really are deeply retarded losers for thinking that starting fights on an imageboard every day is worth your time.
oh wait lemme guess PoStInG iS pRaXiS lmao fuckin' loser dipshit
>>2669368i mean tbh the "just doo something" libs have not shown any concrete program and method to achieve so ofc people will take the piss on it
>>2669389It’s where you apply to jobs with the purpose of unionizing them.
>>2669361I don’t share common goals with Nazis. Maybe you do, but that makes you my enemy too
>>2669393Posting is praxis
>>2669389click the video, it gives you a pretty good rundown from the IWW. But yeah like this anon said
>>2669396 >>2669392
i fear the radiation poisoning has rotted your thinking skills into just slinging slurs and whining about being an impotent bitch
>>2669396So, an organization sends militants with the purpose of agitating the workers? I am not a part of an organization.
>>2669399only retarded internet addicts believe that
>B-B-BUT IT TOTALLY ISnah that's a lie you sad fuckers tell yourselves so you can justify your behavior to yourselves
Nobody with an actual job gives a fuck about LE EPIC TROLL POSTING OLOLOLOLOL I TROLL U, grow the fuck up dipshit
>>2669396most workforces in the US already have some form of a union man, leftoids out here really reinventing the wheel for no reason
just join the DSA or even the Dems, and then network with labour orgs there. They have much more resources and actual discipline than you can ever hope to muster
>>2669271damn these uyghas are slime, I miss the old jews that would struggle for social revolution and justice
>>2669405It is praxis nevertheless
>>2669409>NOOOO IT TOTALLY IS I'M BASED AND EPIC FOR BEING A TROLL ;___;ahahahah you fuckin' sad loser lmao
>>2669409praxis in the same sense as going outside naked while being painted with hammers and sickles while jacking off would be?
>>2669397socdems are not nazis lmfao. do you realise youre operating on a schmittian fascist dichotomy? youre treating people who disagree with you as inherent enemies
>>2669393>PoStInG iS pRaXiS>>2669399>Posting is praxiswas marx posting when he wrote das kapital?
was martin luther posting when he wrote the 95 theses?
is history just a series of shitposts and effortposts?
>>2669407
guy who became a communist because he thinks marx was antisemitc
>>2669411Sure. Praxis is just doing things mang
>>2669408there is inherently nothing progressive with this or that minority identities. The same thing is happening rn with the Dems putting all their eggs in the "upwardly mobile Muslim immigrants" basket
>>2669412The only difference between a social democrat and a national socialist other than honesty is rhetoric. Both support the strengthening of imperialism to support social programs at home
>>2669413No, it is not. Your have internet-brain retardation if you think writing a book and agitating is the same as trolling a bunch of niche online bubbles
Either touch grass, grow up or KYS, your call.
>>2669414ive come to the conclusion that they are schmittians with red paint
>>2669417
have you even read on the jewish question?
>>2669419Praxis is just doing things man.
>>2669417
"on the jewish question" is marx's polemic against antisemitism by showing its hypocrisy in a christian society…
SNCA
>>2669422hahahaha holy shit you've turned yourself into an NPC
>>2669355epic.
I want to see the face of conservacucks reading jefferson's phrase "When tyranny becomes law, rebellion becomes duty" graffitied in front of ice or any other governmental institutions complicit in the decay of quality of life of the average burger.
>>2669425Free will is not real man.
>>2669422>MUH POSTING IS DOING THINGS MANPosting does nothing, nobody reads this board except bored communists who are already radicalized and /pol/ trolls.
You want to "do something?" Talk to people outside and touch grass instead of trying to troll while preaching to the choir.
>>2669427>shifting goalposts because you can't defend your own behaviorclassic dumbass move lmao
>>2669423no its Marx also railing against Judaism, which at this point of time is trying to balance between the Spinozan pro integration stance and the trad Jewish lifestyle of talmud and ghetto. Marx said that none of this shit is relevant because Jews are already de facto just a banking caste in European capitalism
liberal larping should be punishable by death
>>2669430>defendWhy defend?
hasbara moment: 'Marx was antisemitic'. pol: BASED + REEEEE NOT TRUE HE WAS A J WORD-N-WORD! REEEE
>>2669432
never said marx liked jews lol. he just didnt think they were subhumans as the nazis did
>>2669434>Being this much of a retard trolllmao
>>2669312 fedposter, fedposter. NONE of you are free from fedpoasting
>>2669432
the type of person who reads all the exaggerated anti commubist slander agaisnt the USSR and thinks : "BaSeD! ThEy sHoUlD'vE KiLlEd 200 MiLiOn"
you will never be taken seriously
>>2669439
holy LARP
>>2669432
the jew is the immediacy of the capitalist; he is the image of naked self-interest, while the christian dresses up his service to capital by ascetic discourses. its a hegelian analysis of form and content pertaining to the same thing. the jew is openly capitalist and so is persecuted, while the christian hides his shame of being an "inwardly circumcised jew" as paul tells us.
>>2669443>>2669444guys he's a delusional idiot from japan, don't take him seriously (at least he claims to be)
>>2669345>You don't need to hand out Marx pamphlets (and shouldn't, it's too blatant)Milton Friedman pamphlets then? How do you expect burgers to stop being libs if you don't expose them to Marx?
>>2669428Praxis just means practicing mang. Posting is a practice.
きみはくそだ！！！
>>2669447damn bro youre so hecking radical! thats so edgy
>>2669448>third worldist>is firstoidwhats the materialist explanation for this
is the "japan" anon just iron felix or some other namefag that got pissed at the board
>>2669460not every "hundreds of millions must die" retard is iron felix
japs are weird man
>>2669449>How do you expect burgers to stop being libs if you don't expose them to Marx?"Meet the proles where they're at." It's called a sales funnel; if the only thing people know about Marxism is "muh black book 80 quadrillion dead" you play it cool and talk to them normally and suss them out and deliver some basic tenets in a relatable, understandable way without saying where they came from, OR you direct them to a group or org that's normie-friendly that is relevant to their current grievances and lets them do praxis right away (e.g. ICE-watch, which desensitizes them to the idea of standing up to the state and opens them up to additional leftist action).
>>2669436marx simply saw the truth, that ALL religion was about money, such as he tells us in capital vol 1 (1867):
<The English Established Church, e.g., will more readily pardon an attack on 38 of its 39 articles than on 1/39 of its income.https://www.marxists.org/archive/marx/works/1867-c1/p1.htmall that is holy is profaned.
the present immigration conflict doesn't really represent any special opportunity for revolutionary activity. it's firmly a matter of reform. reform is only relevant to the revolutionary in as much as it conditions revolution. i can see why a communist would be interested in e.g. demilitarizing federal law enforcement. if people were talking about going out into the protest to organize and agitate for that specific goal, or with some other real end in mind, then i would understand. instead you get this vague "do literally anything" shit that just betrays that the person speaking is just reacting to demoralization bait and hasn't really thought that deeply about anything beyond a base emotional instinct to act.
>>2669467>just lie to the plebsyou do you.
>>2669463do you seriously think a random anon would be this dedicated? he had been doing this for three separate threads already and he didnt do it anywhere else outside of usapol this ngga definitely had an axe to grind
>>2669465
idc if someone says slur or not its just you are being a retard rn
>>2669473there are >1 people with similar ideologies, all retards, but all different
>>2669465
>knew about sarah ashton cirillo and iron felix
yep this uygha is an oldfag
>>2669470the primary issue with ICE is that they are vigilante bandits who dont follow police procedure - so its about being consistent with the law.
If you dont feel confident and dont know theory properly you shouldnt agitate. Also, does one on one talking counts as agitation? People already disseminate their world views when they talk casually. I bet agitation speeches most be structured, something that you cant achieve in casual talking.
take a sip whenever you read "jewish nigger"
>>2669478sarah cirillo is the pro ukraine journalist who trccn out in the early days of ukraine war btw so the likelihood of that anon coming from the russia ukraine war thread just increased
>>2669482I'm lightweight. I'll be dead if I did that.
>>2669399>>2669399>Posting is praxis<ENGELS:>But before there was argumentation, there was action. Im Anfang war die Tat [In the beginning was the deed] … The proof of the pudding is in the eating.<'The most telling refutation of this [scepticism and agnosticism] as of all other philosophical crotchets, is praxis, namely experiment and industry.Praxis to Theory is to put the theory in action to test how stands. Posting in lpol alone isn't praxis. this has been discussed over and over, and that's why people like bordiga are named armchair lords for theorizing a bunch of stuff, leading the revolution from the comfort of a sofa. you don't need to prove anything about socialism here. we all know it works. you can theorize all you want how to move the US into socialism, you do the praxis outside the board.
>>2669481having moral discourse is more beneficial than having dogma. not because its pragmatic, but because its true. capitalism is an evil system - i dont know why people here have an issue stating it plainly.
>>2669488
stop shilling for your articles retard
>>2669491lenin never fought in a trench because he was a bald man in a suit. he literally led revolution from a chair
>>2669494iron felix doesn't talk like that. this is how iron felix talks:
>THE VAST MAJORITY OF AMERICAN ARE WILLING AND GLEEFUL COLLABORATORS WHO WOULD KILL BILLIONS TO DECREASE THE PRICE OF THEIR PRECIOUS FUNKO POPS BY 0.0000000000001% >>2669500????
thats exactly how that anon talks
>>2669491Okay? So praxis is just doing things.
>>2669491>muh armchair bordigabordiga himself did all of the things engels did, functionally though they were both armchairs
>>2669493Describing capitalism as evil is not agitation.
>>2669501there's significant and obvious differences.
felix:
<rarely curses<doesn't use slurs<doesn't troll and genuinely believes what he says<doesn't pretend to be japanese >>2669503the jock vs nerd dualism can be oversimplified but its absolutely true. People who can write a three volume dissertation on Hegel and classical greek slavocracy generally do not have the temperament to go fight in battlefields
>>2669493because imageboard contrarians are always trying to appear "less liberal" and "less moralfag" than each other. the goal is to appear as "hardcore" and "not normie" as possible. it's a race to the bottom lol. already I can hear the clickety clacking of the keyboards mad at you for using the word evil.
>>2669491Praxis is happening everywhere and was happening in history always mang.
>>2669503Engels actually picked up a gun in 1848.
>>2669510You are moralizing.
>>2669511no it doesnt ngga if praxis happens all the time why would anyone need theorycels
>>2669503Marx was the armchair debatelord. Engels picked up a gun in 1848 and fought under August Willich in Germany.
>>2669496Lenin was a pseudonym he used to cover his track for all the illegal praxis he did, as Stalin, as Trostky. All pseudonyms Lenin's real name was Vladimir Ilyich Ulyanov. all of them actively leading or coordinating, with tangible actions participated in agitation, concerting riots, blowing trains, counterfeiting, robbing banks, etc.
praxis>>2669502"breathing is praxis"
how about no.
Fed thugs who executed Pretti placed on leave:
>The two federal agents who opened fire on a Veterans Affairs nurse in Minneapolis have been placed on leave, an official with the Department of Homeland Security said on Wednesday, as more voices, including some in the Republican Party, broke with the White House over its handling of the fatal shooting.
>>2669514Without praxis there are no theorycels. Action preces consciousness or something
>>2669517>Lenin was a pseudonym he used to cover his track for all the illegal praxisHis illegal praxis was writing illegal books, being a member of an illegal party, and smuggling in illegal books. He was not a bank robber and even Stalin only stood across the street from the bank robbers in Tiflis and phoned Lenin when it was done. It was guys like Kamo who were actually shooting police and breaking kneecaps. The woman who shot Lenin was an SR who went to jail for 11 years for killing a tsarist official. As far as we know Lenin never personally shot people or anything like that. He was the guy giving you the GTA missions, not the guy taking the missions.
>>2669517Breathing in certain ways is praxis
>>2669517>all of them actively leading or coordinatingno, Lenin approved of the robberies but did not lead or organize them. It was separate branches of the party, generally led by more impoverished, lumpen members like the Georgian Stalin who actually did the robberies. Jock vs Nerd dualism everyone
>>2669522all 3 are good because different shit works on different people
>>2669493>(dogma) is more beneficial than dogmalmfao
>>2669510moralism isnt just "when you have morals", its believing there is such a thing as objective morals like the retard above
>>2669520>as more voices, including some in the Republican Party, broke with the White House over its handling of the fatal shooting.lol "Broke with" i.e. wagged a finger and winked
>>2669529so the only reason you don't torture children is because their crying annoys you and you would get in trouble?
>>2669528For this reason its important to asses one's knowledge in order to develop an understanding of what you'd be most effective as. For example I personally think I'm a good agitator, but not too good at the other two things.
>>2669510no, i think its a specifically "marxist" thing. the idea that politics and society as a "scientific" construct gives a false sense of impersonalisation, as if the mechanism of political action is based in mere causation, like chemicals reacting or an apple falling from a tree, rather than the pathos of a common interest. the idea of communism as the telos of this passionless object called history, made devoid of spirit and inspiration.
>is communism good or not?<i cannot say, it only isits the de-politicisation of discourse.
>>2669512so did bordiga, did you forget he founded the communist party of italy? that he spent years in prison?
what is new in the free world?
>>2669532tbh you just need to ask a more practical question, like "do you approve of revolutionaries committing rape", if not then you believe in an objective morality, and its ok most communists do even though they will never admit it
>>2669535did he shoot anyone or did he just write illegal things
>>2668578>what is new in the free world?everything sucks and i wanna kill myself
>>2669529>morality is dogmanot really. it is the inherent sympathy we have with each other. you do not need to teach men to be moral for them to be so, otherwise the first two men who met would have tried to kill each other, and the species would be extinct.
>>2669467>"Meet the proles where they're at."There is a point where this becomes "reinforcing the status quo". The ideas of each era are the ideas of the rulling class. If "proles" "where they're at" believe and do things that are against their own interests, the point is to correct that, not to enable it.
>>2669538>"do you approve of revolutionaries committing rape", if not then you believe in an objective morality,you're retarded. the reason revolutionaries shouldn't rape is because it makes them disliked when they are trying to legitimize and solidify their seizure of power by being less cruel than the current ruling class.
>ummm you can't heckin convince people of le gommulismno but you can annoy people into fighting back who would otherwise just go along with "new boss" replacing "old boss"
>>2669356This will deserve its own thread.
>>2669547> the reason revolutionaries shouldn't rape is because it makes them disliked when they are trying to legitimize and solidify their seizure of power by being less cruel than the current ruling class. This is objectively wrong because in any revolutionary society everyone has been hardened around that no one really cares about cruelty against enemies anymore. Nobody in Syria bat an eye at the Islamic revolutionaries treating the Kurds and Alevis brutally. What you're doing is that you feel a moral disgust and try to cover it up with a practical appeal, as i said most communists believe in objective morality but will never admit it
>>2669551Mods permaban this man seriously
apparently preaching to the working class is the agenda for communists. and this from so called materialists, lol
>>2669532do you only do things bc you think every belief of yours is objective loll. try reading the post more slowly next time until you get it
>>2669522>Propaganda: Something that flips people to your side without using negative emotions, but also not educationthis is easily the most retarded definition of propaganda ive ever seen
>>2669544>it is the inherent sympathy we have with each other.what does that shit have to do with Good and Evil doe
>>2669554what? i'm not saying it is bad. I am on the side of believing in objective morality dumbass. I am saying that communists posturing as based materialist atheist believing in soyence instead of morality is hypocritical as fuck
>>2669557feel free to correct it
>>2669551>in any revolutionary society everyone has been hardened around that no one really cares about cruelty against enemies anymore.even cruelty against enemies is usually in response to cruelty, real or imagined. people never stop reacting to cruelty, because cruelty itself is a an escalation against real or imagined cruelty. people who are cruel just for the sake of being cruel are rare. most imagine they are dispensing justice in response to the wrongs their victims have done.
>>2669523ho-ho-ho, you really need to read this book, if you truly believe that Lenin was a simple book smuggler.
https://www.marxists.org/history/etol/writers/harker/EIGHT%20HOURS%20%2B%20A%20GUN.pdf?
>>2669556dodged their question award
>>2669559You think rapes have to do with revolution and are part of it.
>>2669561absolutely. The point isn't whether the cruelty comes out of nowhere, but whether it is valid to appease widespread appetite for cruelty in a condition where it is normalized, i.e during a civil war. If you are a true based soyentific atheist you will say yes we have to indulge on this appetite because it is beneficial for us to redirect public anger against the enemy. If you are a spooked moralist who dares to believe in such unscientific nonsense such as that every human deserves an amount of dignity, like me, then you will say no
>>2669524>existence is praxis!how about no.
>next: imagine existence is praxis too!>next: imagine existence of doing praxis, is praxis too!and so on and so on.
>>2669527what's:
actively leading or coordinatingalso:
>>2669562 >>2669565you can tell that most "anti-moralist" posters have burned all their bridges. They have no friends or family anymore. It is very easy for them to say these edgy things because they have nobody left to lose. They alienated everyone who cared about them and are now "free" to show everyone how much less of a moralfag they are.
>>2669563>do you prefer republicans or democrats<im a communist>errrrrrrrrr youre dodging the question!!kill yourself
>>2669567>If you are a spooked moralist who dares to believe in such unscientific nonsense such as that every human deserves an amount of dignity, like me>like mewhat?
>>2669570the mass tor baiter always makes up shit nobody said. NOTICING
>>2669565no, but it is absolutely a thing that will happen in a revolutionary condition, because during a civil war things got heated and the public becomes desentisized to mass arbitrary violence. The point is whether you have the balls to say that this shit is wrong even though everyone around you considers it normal. And if you do that then you believe in objective morality. QED
>>2669577No, he is just a theorycel autist angry at how backward we are. What he posts however has to do with what is being posted
>>2669558what is sympathetic is our inherent goodness
evil goes against this
thats why the evil are few yet the many are weak
new thread, chuds
>>2669581new thread, chuds
>>2669581new thread, chuds
>>2669581new thread, chuds
>>2669581new thread, chuds
>>2669581new thread, chuds
>>2669581new thread, chuds
>>2669581new thread, chuds
>>2669581new thread, chuds
>>2669581new thread, chuds
>>2669581new thread, chuds
>>2669581new thread, chuds
>>2669581new thread, chuds
>>2669581new thread, chuds
>>2669581>>2669578Rapes and murders are already happening. Revolution has nothing to do with it.
>>2669578you are trying to get blood from a stone
a lot of people here are red fascists who believe in the schmittian exception - "its good when we do it".
>>2669578>things will happen Sure. But why do you insist then
>>2669579>i'm a democratyes, yes. his greentext is never an actual quote. see how this game works?
>>2669580humans have sympathy for each other because they are social animals, not because of "inherent goodness" you filthy idealist
>>2669586when things happen will you risk your position and safety to speak against it? thats what ive been trying to say all this time. If you oppose cruelty, even though it will make you unpopular, even though everyone is desentisized on it, even though it is inconsequential in the long run, then you believe in some form of obejctive morality.
>>2669534>its the de-politicisation of discourse.equating morals with politics is liberalism by definition
>>2669606is communism good or not?
>>2669612why do you care about politics?
>>2668691true believers get reeducation camps, liars get executed
>>2669592can animals not also possess morality?
>>2669471>>2669546>not scaring people with shit they're not ready for is "lying"Do you think nazis lead instantly with the Jewish Question and esoteric hyperborean mysticism, or do you think they lead with "ever wonder why your life is ass and dogshit?"
>>2669622why not just tell the truth?
>>2669614Because of my material conditions, just like you.
>>2669622Why are the Nazis your role model?
>they're not readyWhy not?
>>2669624>>2669625Tell them the truth if you want to; if you want to go out to a protest and Marxpill people I'm all for it.
You're not, though, and you won't. All of this is just a game meant to justify your position of
>read books and do nothing. >>2669625>my material conditionsif someone gave you a billion dollars to forget about politics, would you, since your material conditions are satisfied?
>>2669201Will a future socialist USA deport Gusanos?
>>2669589even if you don't like how it sounds, it is ostensibly true
>>2669201>That vidPlease say sike
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