/leftypol/ - Leftist Politically Incorrect

>it is ok when le epic based Anti-Imperialist Russia supply Israel
Yes but unironically.

>>2697116
They are supporting Putin's jailing of members of the KPRF.

>>2697116
Oil Change International
714 G St. SE, #202
Washington, DC 20003
United States

Fake news. Russia sell oil to other nation and those nation sell the oil, but westoid say it all russia. Oil change international is fascist

>>2697127
>Putin's jailing of members of the KPRF
Things that never happened

>>2697127
KPRF are ziggers

Ziggers are genuinely unworthy, they JUST want the world capitalist order to be Moscow based instead of New York/London based. It's a completely pointless ideology, on top of weak given how weak the Russian state itself is.

>>2697152
it was news in the ukraine thread

Lots of libs in this thread.
Read some Dugin and come back

>>2697156
Oh are you referring to the incident a few months ago where some leftist punks with no connection to the KPRF were arrested for publicly calling for a violent color revolution? Those are your “communists”??? LOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOL

>>2697160
https://kprf.ru/party-live/regnews/241453.html
Russia, being a bourgeois state, is repressing communists. Not on the level of Ukraine or any other eastern european country but it does. This fact does nothing to change the analysis of the KPRF and many other parties that the war in Ukraine is an anti-imperialist one, and that the People's Republics deserved protection.
>Astrakhan communists know firsthand how the government can deal with undesirable activists. In fact, today, with no other opposition left in the country except the Communist Party of the Russian Federation, we are constantly under attack. But we are not extremists. As Russia struggles with external pressure, the Communist Party of the Russian Federation is doing everything possible to achieve victory not only on the front lines but also in peacetime: victory over poverty, lawlessness, and social injustice.
This breaks the feeble brain of the natocommunist.

>>2697157
>Heh, you fool! If you simply read this book you'll know!
This fallacy needs a name. What does Dugin say that convinces me Putin's fascist and shitty regime would be a net good compared to the current shitty world order?

>>2697174
>What does Dugin say that convinces me Putin's fascist and shitty regime would be a net good compared to the current shitty world order?

In what way is maximizing the "current shitty world order" a "net good?"

>>2697172
Oh, well the KPRF is still the second most powerful party in the entire country and an integral part of an anti-fascist coalition with United Russia so this is a nothingburger in the grand scheme of things. You’re always going to have some retards though who think communism is adventurist retardation

>>2697180
Anon I really gotta ask you, do you unironically, sincerely believe that the Russian government doesn't regard communists (including the KPRF) as class enemies? That it doesn't regard socialism with hate and revulsion?

>>2697174
No one is suggesting Putin's regime as a replacement for the current world order, that's completely impossible even. People critically support Putin's regime for sabotaging the world order

>>2697188
But he doesn't. Putin's regime makes most of its money pipping oil from Siberia and Asia into Europe, it was fully integrated into Atlantic economic fascism before invading Ukraine, and its goal is to more effectively do that. Putin's regime is no threat at all to the United States in the way China will soon be.

>>2697182
Who cares? Minutiae of class struggle in a nation under siege is completely irrelevant to the real movement; what matters is that they oppose the current world order

>>2697188
>People critically support Putin's regime for sabotaging the world order
It would more accurate to say people (me included) critically support the elements in the russian goverment that stop Cucktin from trying to save the western world order, but yes.

>>2697199
I believe US-EU-NATO officials saying that Russia is their main geopolitical enemy and promoting anti-russian racism over you

>>2697200
> Minutiae of class struggle in a nation under siege is completely irrelevant to the real movement
Imagine if Lenin had said this instead of opposing WW1

>>2697199
>But he doesn't. Putin's regime makes most of its money pipping oil from Siberia and Asia into Europe, it was fully integrated into Atlantic economic fascism before invading Ukraine, and its goal is to more effectively do that. Putin's regime is no threat at all to the United States in the way China will soon be.

This whole conflict is happening because an independent Russia undermines US influence in Europe. Between Europe's reliance on cheap Russian energy and integration with China via the belt and road, US dominance in Europe would essentially be on borrowed time. The evidence for this manifested almost as soon as the SMO started, with Europe's econony crashing after cutting itself off from Russia and replacing it with much more expensive American fuel.

And I dunno, it's pretty retarded to act like Russia is fascist and evil for selling gas to Europe when China is just as if not even more directly integrated into "Atlantic economic fascism" than Russia.

Do Russiaboos realize modern Russia isn’t the USSR?

>>2697200
Sorry but the class character of a state and its attitude to socialism aren't "minutae." You can argue that the correct course of action under the current conditions is for communists to pursue an alliance with Russia's national bourgeois government. However you can't just delude yourself into thinking that they aren't long term class enemies, that they don't serve the interests of a class which hates and fears socialism because it is directly opposed to their interests. If you do that then at best you'll be blindsided when their inevitably betrayal comes like the Chinese communists when the KMT turned on them. At worst you'll become a pro-bourgeois fifth column within the communist movement.

>>2697270
Damn, I never thought about it like that…I'l Slava Ukraini now!

>>2697270
Yes. In fact, they prefer it to the USSR.

>>2697210
You fundamentally misunderstand Lenin's significance.
In practical terms the result of the actions of Lenin was a saving of Russia from the fate of Austro-Hungarian Empire and the Ottoman Empire, the overthrow of the old order was necessary for Russia to not fracture into several dozens of pieces as imperialists dream for Russia until this day. Lenin saw how the imperialism of the Tsar and the Cadets was leading to a destruction of the country and rushed to stop it and re-establish a unitary state.
Now compare that to the RF now: is it under threat of annihilation due to backwards imperialist leadership? No, in fact, the leadership has more and more been independent of the influence of finance capital in Russia. Finance capital in Russia has always been a foreign import into Russia, and only with the SMO has Russia finally been taking it seriously as a threat. Its literally the oppose to the courting of it despite the risk of national fragmentation that the Russian Empire engaged in.

>>2697281
>muh class character of a state
What class character makes up the Russian Federation? Do you think the SMO was done out of some bourgeois interest? You do realize that the bourgeois elements of Russia that existed prior to the SMO were 1) foreign capital, and 2) natural gas, right? If the RF only operated according to some bourgeois character why would it act against foreign capitalist interests while also disrupting the stability of energy exports? Isn't that lunacy? Ultimately, Putin launching the SMO is because of a far more fundamental concern, the support of the Russian people. The Russian people were tired of being fleeced by assurances that the Minsk accords were going to solve the crisis and Putin knew that he would have no political future unless he acted. This means that his political actions even for something like foreign policy, even for something as dramatic as the SMO, are more influenced by the needs of the masses than by bourgeois class interest.

>>2697637
>What class character makes up the Russian Federation?
The bourgeoisie, unless you're telling me that there was a proletarian revolution sometime between 1991 and 2022. At what point were the bourgeoisie removed from power in Russia?
>You do realize that the bourgeois elements of Russia that existed prior to the SMO were 1) foreign capital, and 2) natural gas, right?
I don't realize that because it's not true lmao. Do you actually think that Russia had no domestic or national bourgeoisie?
>If the RF only operated according to some bourgeois character why would it act against foreign capitalist interests while also disrupting the stability of energy exports?
Because imperialism is in many ways disadvantageous to the bourgeoisie of colonized countries. If we go with Micheal Roberts' model of unequal exchange, then the differences in prices caused by uneven development result in global south capitalists bleeding value to those in the first world. Russia's ruling class sought to break out of this dependency to avoid a loss of profits via imperialist exchange. Now I'll concede that this means they have short term interests in common with the Russian working class, which is why I don't begrudge the KPRF their support for the war or their alliance with United Russia. However it doesn't remove the long term class antagonism between the two.

What do MAGAcomms think of this?

>>2697157
>Read some Dugin
Never change /leftypol/. Bolshevik Orthodox control of the Snek Island soon, it was predicted in the Bible.

>>2697656
>If we go with Micheal Roberts' model of unequal exchange, then the differences in prices caused by uneven development result in global south capitalists bleeding value to those in the first world.
Sabocat, I know you are a smart poster, you made so many reasonable contributions to this board in all the usual shitpile.
But let me ask you this question: how do you think China is getting a positive trade balance right now? By paying their workers with Western tier salaries and selling their commodities for the same price as Western-made commodities?
Why are Chinese capitalists delocalizing their production in Vietnam nowadays? Just to develop the productive forces there as an act of solidarity? Or because labor force is cheaper there?
I'm not suggesting the African bourgeoisie is profiting from underselling things to France and Russia…unless, maybe there is something called "corruption" in this world…?

>>2697656
>>this means they have short term interests in common with the Russian working class
Such as sending them into frontal assaults against heavily fortified enemy positions with mosins and no body armor. Great that Russians are such good little zergs, you don't even have to give them any consideration!

Lol

>>2697771
This is funny, because if you take Lenin's theory of imperialism seriously today and apply it to the modern material conditions, this is the exact Top 3 of the biggest imperialist powers today. Export of commodities is the cornerstone of imperialism as defined by Lenin and Hobson before him. America is a declining imperialist power because it continuously import more than it exports. When America invade a country today, it's not really to force the native population to consume American commodities, but more to plunder their natural resources, which is at odds with how Lenin defined imperialism in 1917.

>>2697771
now do one for *gives*

>>2697213
thats literally true though

>>2697200
This is a colosally retarded statement kys immediately

>>2697629
this is just ahistorical. lenin wasn't trying to save russia, he was trying to bring about proletarian revolution in russia, regardless of whether it would destroy russia or not. because he was not a russian nationalist. his goal was international proletarian and he succeeded by creating the USSR, which was not one nation, but several nations in what used to be just the russian empire. if he had failed, tsarist russian empire wouldn't have been balkanized. it would have remained in tact, and continued slaughtering proles in the imperialist WW1 until it ended. you're just projecting the current ambitions of NATO back onto WW1.

>>2697821
Balkanization happened under whites. You can look into history or never speak about it again.

>>2697823
during the civil war, which was caused by proletarian revolution, which was caused by lenins revolutionary defeatism. revolutionary civil war is a good thing. without revolutionary civil war there would never have been a white army in reaction to a red army. just tsarist russia continuing to fight in ww1 against germans and then eventually signing something like brest litovsk, only without proletarian revolution.

>>2697663
Okay, and? MBP is only done by a handful of insular Hasidic sects. It's not like they're doing it to goyish babies.

Russians sell their oil on Facebook marketplace, and Israel buys it. It's not like the government can stop it.

Ah the leftypol KPRF paradox makes an appearance immediately. Being the second largest party in Russia means the KPRF *must* be controlled opposition, but also on occasion members of the KPRF are arrested thus proving Russia is as hostile towards Communism as any other state.

These threads are motivated by getting rekt in /ukr/ one thing, Western chauvinism. Russia is quite an outlier in the US dominated globe by the US’s choice, serendipitously that results in situations where Russia willingly or unwillingly fights against US hegemony and I think for most that’s something at least interesting to spectate, if not analyse. However some on this board are deathly committed to proving Russia is not an outlier despite all evidence, including but not limited to the West constantly boasting about isolating Russia and agitating the world for more isolation, via false comparisons (I.e equating open oil trade with direct military support) with the only tangible motivation being fucked off that the Western Left are not even a footnote in the politics of the 21st century, much less a force for manipulating the chaos to their advantage.

If Russia’s bourgeois self-defence is coincidentally stealing your anti-imperial thunder, then the problem is with you. Critical support for NATO annd US imperialism in crushing Russia, just so you can reclaim being the vanguard of agitation against NATO again in your bi-monthly newsletter, is the height of opportunism.

>>2697821
Technically speaking the balkanization began after the bourgeois February revolution, and was probably inevitable with or without revolution seeing how the likes of Austro-Hungary went. The bolsheviks did end up reversing it.

>>2697779
The export of commodities in general is not the cornerstone of imperialism, the export of capital is.

>>2697828
Remind me if any short-lived puppet regimes were formed on Soviet territory as a result of Brest-Litovsk

Yank scum deflecting as always

>>2697821
>he was trying to bring about proletarian revolution in russia
Which was the only means to saving Russia from forever being the sick man of Europe. Proletarian revolution freed Russia from the chains of the Romanovs and allowed it to undergo rapid development, both in economics and culture.
>which was not one nation, but several nations
Russia was the leading nation, I don't know where this meme came from to where people think otherwise.
>if he had failed, tsarist russian empire wouldn't have been balkanized
Tsarist Russia didn't even survive way before the Bolshevik uprising, and the Provisional Government was bursting at the seams. Ethnic separatism was flaring up everywhere and the Duma was of little real authority, only the Sovnarkom succeeded in bringing in the bulk of those separatist forces under the unitary state.