Pelosi is going there.
The US is urging companies to move chip foundries to its soil
Obviously China nor the US really want a war, but we know that sometimes things spiral out of control. So, is war over taiwan possible?
>>561636>Does anyone know what popular opinion in China is on the Taiwan question?I think Taiwan = China is basically the one thing that everyone agrees about.
>>561637And Nancy Pelosi is like the ice cream on the birthday cake.
>>561645Take your meds.
>>561646The West has a geopolitical shock-and-awe mentality. Shock and awe is what it understands. If you disagree with this, you're not a serious participant in any geopolitical discussion and can be dismissed at once. Whether this mentality has always been successful is completely irrelevant to the existence of the mentality.
>>561644I don't see a reason that prevents China from just shooting down Pelosi's plane.
The US will not start a shooting war over her, because they would loose very badly (according to military experts across the board).
Not to mention that both Russia and Iran would no doubt mercilessly exploit the US being busy brawling with the Chinese.
China has shown great patience and restrained as well as decisive action. They rammed a US destroyer when it got too close to one of those artificial military islands in the South china sea, and they totaled a US attack sub (sea-wolf class i believe it was) also in the south China sea.
Do you know of a rational reason why China would not react very harshly ?
Diplomacy wise this is basically the last step before the US officially disputes China's claim on Taiwan.
>>561652>I think the fundamental problem is that China has no ballsMy impression is that China is extremely cold and calculating.
And the hardliners in Beijing are not timid at all, they want a preemptive attack on US forces as soon as they come into range.
I think you are not realistic about this, to me it looks like the compromise position would be that China waits what Pelosi says during her Taiwan visit and if she doesn't reaffirm the unified China position with enough enthusiasm, they take her out on the way home.
>Shooting down Pelosi's plane would require MORE balls than invading Taiwan itself.I think that China is more likely to attack US positions than Taiwan.
From their perspective a military operation in Taiwan is like shooting up their own backyard.
Your perception that China is somehow bedazzled by the US self image of invincibility is misplaced.
China is projecting an image that is low on aggressive bravado, because they want to be seen as pragmatic trading partners, but that does not mean they won't burn the US for crossing the Taiwan redline.
Also China does not bluff. They announced "strong measures"
Like i said, are there rational reasons for China to not just shoot down Pelosi's plane ?
>>561664>they would, this would make the people in Biden's Administration extremely mad, their reaction to Ukraine was not rational, but emotional, I don't think they would rational here as well.I thought they wanted the Ukraine war, to separate the German economy from the Russian energy, to starve the Africans, and kick Russia out of swift and crash their economy. Their scheme kinda backfired, but does that prove they were emotional ?
I thought that the emotions you see in politics is just part of the spectacle, carefully choreographed by a PR company.
>>561690>Thinking Chinese nukes matter when China is one of the only adopters of an NFU policyLol
Lmao
Haha, even
>>561693Chinese hypersonics are nuclear weapons platforms, and consistently miss by 30km or more. You sound like the kids that screeched about how Russia was going to win the war because it hit an empty building with a hypersonic missile, or the other kids that screeched about how HIMARS were going to win the war for Ukraine.
You need to face the facts and realize that China is not prepared for a non-nuclear war with the USA. The only thing they would accomplish by starting a war is bringing another few centuries of humiliation to their country.
>>561709Saying Ukraine is NATO equivalent is probably a stretch but they were trained and armed by the US the last like 8 years and had the biggest army in Europe by the time the war kicked off.
But its not like NATo has a good track record of nation building
>>561708>Much like in your post about hypersonics, you seem overtly focused on toys rather than things that actually win warsUS was training Ukraine for insurrection war with javelins intended to be some godly weapon to be shot from hidden positions. Instead Russia roflstomped all those strategies Ukraine and US thought up. Speaks volumes of how far up their own ass US (and Ukie) generals' heads are
>>1094093>The javelins were very effective in their intended role. Lolno
>It's just that man portable AT weapons weren't enough to overcome overwhelming Russian fire superiority.Oh wow, it's almost like javelins ARE FUCKING USELESS BECAUSE THEIR INTENDED ROLE NEVER HAPPENED DUE TO REALITIES OF MODERN WARFARE
>>561653Were you "terrified" before the UKR-RUS war? If no, why are you now?
History is inevitable.
Embrace it.
>>561694>Chinese hypersonics are nuclear weapons platforms, and consistently miss by 30km or more.No that's outdated from a time when missiles only had inertial navigation via a mechanical gyroscope.
Today such missiles stack a hole array of navigation technologies on top of each other an get a combined precision of a few meters, which in practical terms is pin point accurate.
>You need to face the facts and realize that China is not prepared for a non-nuclear war with the USA.Pretty much all military analysts agree that the US would loose in a military confrontation near China.
Especially US naval forces are not prepared to face off against Chinese anti-ship weapons.
>>561719>Chinese mentality of "saving face."Does thiat explain it? Because for the life of me I cant figure out why this one visit is such a big deal
>>561723its goes both ways.
>>561717>So, useless toys for useless thought up NATO strategyJavelins are actually very useful for fighting enemy armor at short range, which is what they are designed for, and which is why Russia has stopped putting themselves in positions where they are vulnerable to them. Their decision to change their tactics to revolve around superior artillery actually reflects the effectiveness of the javelin in its intended role.
>Whichever else superior godly NATO weaponry are going to be proven of little use against barbarian Chinese tactics? Idk if you're aware, but generally speaking wars unfold with each side working to develop countermeasures to the weapons and tactics deployed by the other. No doubt a conflict between the US and China would involve adaptation and re-adaptation from both sides, with heavy losses from both sides and no guaranteed victory for either. If you think otherwise you have a childish view of how wars are fought.
>>561730>Javelins are actually very useful for fighting enemy armor at short rangeYes, the amazingly thought out tactic of having SUICIDE SQUADS LYING IN AMBUSH AND WAITING FOR ENEMY TANKS TO APPROACH
Works wonders against the enemy. Also, works wonders for the suicide squadmates' morale.
>Idk if you're aware, but generally speaking wars unfold with each side working to develop countermeasures to the weapons and tactics deployed by the other.You don't fucking understand what I am getting at. USA and NATO have spent gazillions for weapons for a doctrine that DOESN'T EVEN WORK. Countermeasures? For fuck's sake, Javelins ARE TOO HEAVY, you fucktard, they are literally thought out as a stationary defensive tool, while modern warfare is MOBILE, that's why Soviet/Russian-made RPGs are god and king in the same role. It's not COUNTERMEASURE, it's simple USELESSNESS of Javelins in their indended role. RPGs can be taken up and you can run away with them and change positions and all kinds of neat stuff. Javelins? Welp, you gotta die in the hole you dig up for yourself, buddy
>>561724i don't know what that means.
Anyway suffering is objectively pointless, nothing good ever comes out of it, people who disagree are either abusive assholes trying to justify torturing other people or they are deranged masochists.
>>561742RPGs and Javelins are not really comparable, since one is an ATGM and one is a LAW. A better Western counterpart for the RPG would be the Carl Gustav or AT4. You just need to compare the stats to see the difference: RPGs are only effective to about 500m while javelins have a range of 2500m. They are different weapons for different roles.
>Javelins ARE TOO HEAVYEver heard of mechanized infantry?
>>1094198why ?
>>1094208are you from Pelocistan ?
>>561752>It is hard to convince them that someone visit a placing is a declaration of war…to be fair she's bringing an aircraft carrier entourage, that's very threatening
>>561742>SUICIDE SQUADS LYING IN AMBUSH AND WAITING FOR ENEMY TANKS TO APPROACHyeah, approach from miles away as you blast it the fuck out
with you would need to get into the line of fire, that's what I call suicide mission
>>561775tankposter he unironically typed this
If Russia is able to get stuck in a forever war in a country barely the size of Texas, China can just as easily get stuck in a forever war with Maryland Across the Strait
>theres no hope for him if hes the same anon China Daily dropped related article 2 hours ago
https://www.chinadaily.com.cn/a/202207/30/WS62e48983a310fd2b29e6f441.htmlPelosi visit to Taiwan warned by experts>China will definitely take comprehensive countermeasures, including military means, if US House Speaker Nancy Pelosi visits Taiwan, experts warned.>They made the remarks at a forum organized by the Institute of Taiwan Studies under the Chinese Academy of Social Sciences on Friday in Beijing. The event came after President Xi Jinping had a phone conversation with US President Joe Biden on Thursday.>Xi emphasized that resolutely safeguarding the nation's sovereignty and territorial integrity is the firm will of the more than 1.4 billion Chinese people. "Those who play with fire will perish by it," he added.>The call was made as tensions between China and the US have escalated amid reports that Pelosi, who had canceled a journey to Taiwan in April when she tested positive for COVID-19, is considering a new one next month.>Wu Yongping, director of the Institute of Taiwan Studies, Tsinghua University, said it is the will of the Chinese nation and China's national interest to resolve the Taiwan question and realize national reunification.>"China has always made it very clear, however, some countries and forces are making a serious mistake in downplaying this issue," he said, adding that "The consequence of challenging the will has been made clear by Xi in his call with Biden that those who play with fire will perish by it.">Zhang Guanhua, deputy director of the Institute of Taiwan Studies under the Chinese Academy of Social Sciences, said if Pelosi's visit to Taiwan is made, tensions between the two sides will rise, which will have a severe impact on peace, stability and development in the Asia-Pacific region.>Taiwan's economy will be the first to pay a heavy price, which will further impact the industrial and supply chains of the Asia-Pacific region and increase the risk of a global economic downturn and inflation.>"The visit will be a blatant provocation to China's sovereignty and territorial integrity and it will clearly reveal who is the destroyer of cross-Straits relations and peace in the Asia-Pacific region," he added.>Zhang Hua, a researcher in the Taiwan Studies Institute of the CASS, said the idea of US politicians winning votes by playing the Taiwan card to contain China is questionable as people in the US are more concerned about inflation, unemployment, race and gun issues than foreign affairs.>"If the visit is made, China is expected to take comprehensive countermeasures involving military, political, economic and other fields. These are costs that the US cannot afford," he said, adding there are short, medium and long-term countermeasures, explicit and implicit measures, as well as sanctions at the individual level.>"Escalating the so-called vicious circle will lead to serious military conflicts, which is severely harmful to peace," he said, calling on Pelosi to give peace a chance and not to make a historic mistake.>Leng Bo, a researcher at the Taiwan Studies Institute of the CASS, said Pelosi's visit will seriously undermine China's sovereignty and territorial integrity, challenging China's core interests, and it is intolerable.>"The Chinese military will not sit idly by, and China's countermeasures will definitely include military means, and the level of military means will be higher than in recent years," he added.>>1094382Please see
>>561795 anyway.
Making fun of a timetable is all you have these days, I guess.
HRRRR HRRRR, HE COULDN'T FUCK MY WIFE IN A WEEK. HE HAD TO SPEND MONTHS GETTING INTO HER PANTS. HRRR HRRRR, SUCKS TO BE YOU!!!!
Pathetic shit.
>>561805>I myself have said the war would be won in a week. And it was.we're hitting levels of delusional that shouldn't be possible
so what's happening in donbass now? airsoft games?
>>561807why don't you win the war first
oh, wait, you already did AHAHAHAHAAAA
>>561817Who is going to take part in a proxy war here?
Any conflict involving taiwanese troops is going to impact economic markets due to over reliance on taiwans electric machinery and tech
>>561758Lol, no. It's not in China's self-interest to start a war when their current strategy through soft-power and economic networking is already yielding results.
Secondly, although China has advanced its military and navy, it has little logistical support to project itself in any way like the US navy does. If it was to launch an agressive attack on Pelosi, it could only hope to win a defensive war, not one where it declares war on the united states as a whole.
It makes no sense for China to shit itself because of Nancy Pelosi's fuckery. The only reason Pelosi is doing this is due to the Americans wanting to flex on China. If China does nothing in response other than moan and bitch, to the Americans they'll think it makes China look weak which means that they have nothing to fear from their enemy. If China does attack, then to the USA it justifies going to war with them etc.
So yeah, China could be a petulant child and kick the cart over, but sadly for the sake of their nation, they're going to have to take the L on this one.
>>561818that's where I'm at
when I criticize Russia, it's because of geopolitical decision-making weakness, not military weakness
put it this way: if American decision-makers were suddenly transplanted into the bodies of Russian decision-makers and had to focus on the Ukraine war, with only the military resources available to Russia, Zelensky would be dead by now, and Ukraine would have already surrendered
>>561818>i-it's not even my final form hohloid!sooo you think if russia would just strategic bomb all the cities it would automatically steamroll ukraine? are you a child?
this is some next level coping lol "r-russia is just holding back! not our final power level!" yea, just cuck out, admit that you can't win on the ground man to man, and just suicide nuke everyone as a pathetic bitch you are
>>561822Russia is very clearly not just going all out and bombing civilians with no care.
If they wanted to just obliterate Ukraine this would be very different, they would also lose support from locals if they were just straight up Massacring their innocent people as well, which they are not.
>>561820On the other hand,
>We make no promise to renounce the use of force, and reserve the option of taking all necessary measures. This is by no means targeted at our compatriots in Taiwan, but at the interference of external forces and the very small number of “Taiwan independence” separatists and their activities. The PLA will resolutely defeat anyone attempting to separate Taiwan from China and safeguard national unity at all costs. China literally said in 2019 it would kick ass of anyone daring to encourage Taiwanese separatism.
>>561840Land in Taiwan
America knows that China won't response by their military, since the PRC's military organization is not structured for offense nor invasion.
The PRC will win this war economically and with diplomacy
>>561844I was alwas pro-PRC tf you talking about?
They won't shoot down the plane, they will do it economically
>>561845I would give more credit to Deng opening up markets, and billions of foreign investment.
>>561846SO WW3 was just some funny banter
>>1094301>>1094305>zelensky being evacuated = Kiev is takenWhat a genius. As you know, Zelensky was offered to be evacuated. It was publicized that he refused to evacuate and hence became a hero for staying.
Everything else you posted is dogshit evidence.
1. Random posters doesn't mean board consensus or majority opinion.
2. We were getting previously unheard of amounts of glowposting during that time, both from Russian nationalists and other pro-russia rightoids and NATO freaks.
>>1094324First pic is literally true. Not sure why you posted it.
>>561791I'm not following the war, but I havent seen the borders generally controlled by Russia moved since a long time.
>>561838The US can't cut its production in China. It would be suicide. All industry has moved abroad. They'd be losing trillions in capital. Any porky would rather Pelosi a million times than risk trillions in capital.
On the other hand, China is commited to peace, so far…. and a war is very unpredictable which means a monkey wrench in the Chinese socialism project, so I doubt the government would approve of any act of war.
But then again, Russia invading Ukraine was a big surprise. Also a big surprise was that Russia withstood the sanctions. Also impressive so far has been NATO going all in to keep the war going in Ukraine, which ceteris paribus would/should have ended long ago.
American politicians must feel the walls closing in. A war with China means gambling American hegemony. But no war with China means eventually losing hegemony…
>>561850So what? It's only money, invest it in some more thankful country.
>Russia invading Ukraine was a big surpriseLOL, that literally USA nomenklatura plan
You are maximally deluded.
>>561851My apologies, then.
>>561852You are a fool, it is real, it is taking limited resources and making proles dance for your 5 year plan, until you realize like CCCP, you done goofed.
Also ask Argentinians, or your average world country, if people want their fake toilet paper fiat. Guess what, it's a NO!
Is this commie or MMT party line?
>CREDIT, not DEBTCredit … is the trust which allows one party to provide money or resources to another party wherein the second party does not reimburse the first party immediately (thereby generating a debt),
You are also deluded if verbal masturbation like this makes sense to you
>>561850>1. Random posters doesn't mean board consensus or majority opinion. <every post literally about how russia has alsready won and ukraine state has crumbledyeeeea, not a board consensus, riiiiight
>2. We were getting previously unheard of amounts of glowposting during that time, both from Russian nationalists and other pro-russia rightoids and NATO freaks.<I-It was a flaseflag!!lmao, something pol and this place have in common
embarrassing
>First pic is literally true. Not sure why you posted it.russia is stuck in donbass after how many months? not quite a "couple of hours" huh?
>>561876>lmao, something pol and this place have in common1. I'm saying that we had glowops from both sides, which implies there wasn't consensus.
2. You're posting on this board, and you disagree, hence not a consensus.
3. Billions of dollars of foreign government money
are being "thrown in the dustbin" basically immediately. The only side effect of this is the continued killing of people. Or do you think the billions of dollars for the war effort in the form of weapons, equipment, bombs are being used to build hospitals and schools?
Lying, smug, and bad faith. The trifecta of a rightoid.
>>561893I think one of thebiggest problems is that the (new at least) elites believe their own propaganda. Fords son, you know, would have gotten a different education than Fords books were.
But Baerbock?
>>561897The fuck are you trying to say????
>>561896You may be right
>>561901Leftypol project, we all join the PLA
One problem: we have to get up at 3:30 a.m. instead of going to bed at 3:30 a.m.
>>561906Well good for them. But my advice is to take it a step further and trade up in politics instead of riding around with the training wheels still attached.
Their destination: elementary school
Pelosi's destination: WWIII
My destination: flavor town
>>561925> surrounding KievWith how many men? And how many POWs did Ukraine capture when they "forced" Russia back? Since you know it all, I await your numbers with interest.
> stalemate in the eastScreencapped.
>>561937I wrote the theory
And I'll do the praxis
>>561663>>1094257THIS, UNFORTUNATELY.
I FUCKING
WISH CHINA WAS STILL VID RELATED…
https://yewtu.be/watch?v=FZqKQW5f6bg >>561940>>561944Those cop-outs may work more generally, but they don't work in this case.
China could've said nothing about the Pelosi visit and focused on the patient execution of its long-term strategerrrry, but instead it warned of serious consequences, and government mouthpieces were even talking about downing the plane.
"There'll be serious consequences in fifty years over this Pelosi visit!"
Nah.
>>561934I tend to have your view that China will likely go extremely heavy handed against anything that looks like recognition of Taiwan as a state separated from China. And that includes sinking an entire US navy battle group, to hammer home the point that Taiwan is part of China. This is how states negotiate territorial questions. We should also consider the framing of this topic. The US is not sending Peloci with a big military escort to visit Taiwan, the US is sending a big military battle group to threaten China and Peloci's visit is the diplomatic fig-leave for gunship diplomacy
What everybody is forgetting is that the US is intending to make Taiwan a vassal like they did with Japan, that is full of US military bases, to encircle China. The US has a very clever ideological framing that if the US were to occupy Taiwan like they do with Japan, that would somehow mean that Taiwan is independent. Chinese propaganda is pretty bad, they could frame their position as a defense of Taiwan from US occupation, but for some reason they don't.
However with all that said, the Chinese are also very clever, and they might not care as much about Taiwan as they make it appear. This might be an elaborate ruse, a way to focus the attention of the US away from something else that they are doing somewhere else. The neo-liberals that are running the US empire tend to focus on one thing at the time and distracting them with a hot-button topic like this would be the perfect way to outmaneuver them. We are not analyzing the entire spectrum of activity on the world stage of China as well as the US and as such we lack the context to make good predictions. I'm not really pushing the angle that China is playing the US, but rather that nobody is really considering this as a possibility.
>>561960They can't talk about defending Taiwan from the US because they have to maintain the line that Taiwan is China no matter the circumstances. They barely admit they don't directly govern the island.
I don't think there's an issue as clear as China's position on Taiwan. It has been maintained since the civil war. It is a requirement for China to even negotiate with a foreign nation that they recognize one china policy. China constantly reinforces that Taiwan is a part of China both to its citizens and in international contexts. They are not playing around, they couldn't be more clear about it.
>>561829REMEMBER THIS DOCUMENT!!
It's the litmus test for the worth of the CPC's word under the leadership of Xi, this bumbling new decade of international uncertainty.
I'd love to have my low expectations of these fat-cat bureaucrats proven a little wrong, but I'm still fairly convinced that China's "military response" will amount to nothing more than the #93468436th parade, an angry letter to Pelosi, and some sanctions.
>>561829Fair, but this is 3 years ago and a lot has changed.
China, like any nation state will engage in its own saber rattling, but they question is would it be in their interest to let Taiwan seperate and retaliate now when the US is still an incredibly dangerous foe?
I think not. Unless China is willing to launch a defensive war, then it might stand a chance, but as it stands now, I don't think China would willingly escalate the situation.
put me in the screencap if im proven wrong >>561746>Ever heard of mechanized infantry?Ever heard of ARMORED CARS NOT ACTUALLY PROVIDING ALL THAT MUCH DEFENCE? What the actual fuck, just watch some videos from Ukraine war, it's pretty fucking clear that Javelins straight up aren't FIT for modern mobile war, they are just a dead weight
>RPGs are only effective to about 500m while javelins have a range of 2500m.Yes, go on and shoot a tank from 2 kilometers away. Lol, lmao even.
>>561990China's whole deal is recovering from the century of humiliation. It was the center of the world for technology, culture and economy. Then it got blasted by western powers who went as far as taking territorial concessions.
This is why they can't have an independent hong kong, or taiwan, they won't suffer any more concessions to the west. There's also the fact China is a multiethnic nation, if they recognize taiwanese independence, they're in danger of making meme movements like tibetan independence more likely.
China has over a billion people and is very rich in natural resources, it doesn't really need more than traditional China to be a world power. However nations don't just give up land because it sets a bad precedence. They decided Taiwan is a part of China, and got the world to agree on that, so they need to enforce it or potentially risk even losing land they actually control like tibet.
>>561999But is it worth poking the hives nest if it means international war and fighting a war that they may stand a chance to lose? It doesn't seem in China's interest to go to war when they're already thrashing the US in economic hegemony while the US itself is collapsing in on itself.
I guess what I'm trying to say is that launching an attack at the US will only be a short term gain but hurt them in the long term, wheras if they play their hand carefully they'll win the war without firing a single shot.
>>562002>Last secondsDamn they have the dolphins on their side
It's over for NATO
>>562003Stop being bad at geopolitics and appealing to trite reasoning like "war is bad for business". You sound just like those idiots that thought international trade made war impossible, or thought Consooming foreign goods is actually existing multiculturalism and heckin wholesome globalization and sweatshops are actually good for the third world.
Appeasing bullies like NATO literally doesn't work, China wasn't building up its fleet to run away at the first sight of a challenge. They had to dig in their heels eventually.
https://youtu.be/xguam0TKMw8?t=1728 >>562003I agree, they win by doing nothing. They don't really care about taiwan or they would just invade it, they'd rather keep the status quo or peacefully integrate the island.
They might feel forced to act though since their national and international credibility lies on this since it's been such an important issue for so long.The US keeps fucking around with the one china policy, probably nothing will happen this time, but one of these retarded incidents is bound to escalate into the find out phase.
Here's her plane if anyone wants to track it:
https://globe.adsbexchange.com/?icao=ae503d,ae29fdAlternatively I guess it could be MC4351 if she somehow got to Guam already. But that's probably it. Same aircraft and callsign she went into Honolulu with.
>>562018>>562022man, time is a bitch
she looks like a ghoul now
>>562009Mao with with that hairdo looks like Coppola's Dracula long forgotten chinese half-brother.
I personally prefer trot edgy avant-garde style. This is like Columbine but with ww1 civil war characteristics.
>>562009> it commands a certain respect both to and from the interactions I have with other proletarians in the grocery storeI saw Tankposter at a grocery store yesterday. I told him how cool it was to meet him in person, but I didn’t want to be a douche and bother him and ask him for photos or anything.
He said, “Oh, like you’re doing now?”
I was taken aback, and all I could say was “Huh?” but he kept cutting me off and going “huh? huh? huh?” and closing his hand shut in front of my face. I walked away and continued with my shopping, and I heard him chuckle as I walked off. When I came to pay for my stuff up front I saw him trying to walk out the doors with like fifteen Milky Ways in his hands without paying.
The girl at the counter was very nice about it and professional, and was like “Sir, you need to pay for those first.” At first he kept pretending to be tired and not hear her, but eventually turned back around and brought them to the counter.
When she took one of the bars and started scanning it multiple times, he stopped her and told her to scan them each individually “to prevent any electrical infetterence,” and then turned around and winked at me. I don’t even think that’s a word. After she scanned each bar and put them in a bag and started to say the price, he kept interrupting her by yawning really loudly.
>>561974On the anglonet, the kind of people who whine about tankies are way more cringe, and waaaaaaay more numerous than the so called "tankies" which has become a blanket term for people who are to the left of mainstream economics and foreign policy.
also, let's be real, yankees were the real tankies all along
>>562034everything i don't like is reddit
>>562035everything i don't like is tankie
>>562046You said people do reply to flagposters, and yet you know full well that
>>561974 did not reply to a flagposter. This is why people insult you, because you are fully aware you are being a faggot.
>>562051 (me)
Already know it will just have some smart ass non answer and then you'll reply to this with a smart ass non answer.
>>562059Sorry. I don't know the situation. I figured they couldn't.
>>562060Even better.
>>562014Yeah it was removed from flightradar24, but ADSB-Exchange doesn't do any kind of censoring like that. The reason it disappeared a couple hours ago, I think, is the lack of ADS-B (and related technologies) coverage in that part of the Pacific.
>>562015From what I can see on ADSBExchange, I haven't seen much Chinese military aircraft activity at all all night, but they are able to hide from such sites as well, so who knows?
If she's going direct to Singapore, which is about the range of that aircraft I think from Honolulu, she should be landing around 6-7 PM EDT (GMT -4) today.
>>562073China should just keep accumulating mobilized forces in Fujian now right until the
invasionrestoration of order in the unruly wayward province
>>561998>it's pretty fucking clear that Javelins straight up aren't FIT for modern mobile war, they are just a dead weightIf you have a mechanized unit then it literally doesn't matter how heavy they are, becsuse you can just store them in your IFV. As the saying goes, when you're mechanized your kit carries you.
>Yes, go on and shoot a tank from 2 kilometers away. Lol, lmao even.There have been ATGMs that can hit tanks at this range since the 60s.
>>562092From 96
>>562093>>562086Honolulu Weekly 3-13-96
China poised to pluck Taiwan like a wonton.
© John Pritchett |
https://www.pritchettcartoons.com/taiwan-ton.htm Btw, NATOids, here's an origami tutorial for a paper tiger:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PRX5yoeJqSkYou got absolutely cucked by China
>>5621271. Trips
2. I hope the PLA incinerates this cunt once and for all with a nice ballistic missile; alternatively, if they Ustica her before she even gets close to the island, that too would be a good thing.
>>562132The military escort would be gunship diplomacy. And China would communicate that they are not intimidated by simply blowing it up. (China does have a technological edge over US in missile technology, an that would give them the upper hand in this battle)
If Polesi went alone, that would be the US attempting diplomatic normalization of not recognizing One China (or unified China) before they make it official. If China wanted to shoot down her plane, they could deny her plane permission to enter Chinese airspace and shoot it down on the grounds of violating territorial integrity. But there is another consideration that China also wants to deter secession in Taiwan, and they might be tempted to let her enter Taiwan so they can use a missile strike to take out the political leadership of secessionists too.
From the perspectives of the Americans, this is a stupid move because China doesn't seem to care much about informal relations between Taiwan and the US, or anybody else for that matter. China also made assurances that international access to TSMC microchip products would be guaranteed, so the risk of a chip cut off was very low. China has allowed the US to sell weapons to the Taiwanese military. Pelosi could have requested an official visit to China and insisted that she also could go to Taiwan as part of her visit, and she would have been granted that request. She also could have gone as a private tourist.
So basically the US gets everything it wants except the ability to establish official US military bases and form a military alliance with Taiwan. This was a pretty sweet deal all things considered, and they are in the process of throwing it away.
>>562152Communist=bad
China=communist
Therefore China= bad
Taiwan against China
Therefore Taiwan against communist
Therefore Taiwan against bad
Therefore Taiwan good.
The reactionnary mind isn't really complicated to understand.
>>562161SHe would be the perfect target because most americans would be happy
>right hates her>left hates her<only liked by the literal 1%yeah its wolf warrior time
>>562168>Do you really think it is not rational to go to war when a foreign power kills one of your most prominent politicians in cold blood?Is it worth going to war over a politician ? probably not, it depends on the conditions tho, it might be the last straw that tips the balance.
But in Pelosi's case it appears to be that she is planning to penetrate Chinese airspace (or contested territory if you don't uphold the unified China position) with a warplane escort and a navy battle group in tow, while Chinese authorities are issuing unmistakable warnings.
If she gets shot down, she committed suicide by China. Even if you think China has no claims on Taiwan, you have to admit that she is willingly and knowingly running headfirst into a highly contested danger zone. She doesn't have to do this, she is not forced to ride on the spear tip of the US military that is designed to intimidate China.
>>562178The Soviet Union was a multiethnic empire, which is not supposed to be bad. As technically an empire, the Soviet Union was still better than the current state of affairs in the nations constructed of the former Soviet Union, who are wracked by nationalism, comprador neoliberalism, and stupid feuds over racial spooks. The situation could be akin to the status of what had comprised the Ottoman Empire, which also devolved into stupid shitfights by imperialists plots and reactionary nationalist self determination.
Divide and conquer is how Western imperial core maintains its parasitic hegemony over the world system.
Simply go to the Balkans, Middle Eastern region, or to the Indian and Pakistani borders and check how distractions are sown by the Western European powers to turn people against each other in constant strife, all the while the global North of Americans and western Europeans leech off these weakened polities.
>>562142>finally a western plane in an attempt at gunboat diplomacy gets shot out of the fucking skybruh the revenge on gunboat diplomacy happened:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Amethyst_Incident
>The first shell passed over the ship. Then the bridge, wheelhouse, and low power room were hit in quick succession, Lieutenant Commander Skinner was mortally wounded, and all the bridge personnel were disabled. The coxswain on the wheel, Leading Seaman Leslie Frank, was seriously injured and as a result the ship slewed to port and grounded on the bank. Before the ship grounded, the order to open fire had been given, but when the director layer pulled the firing trigger, nothing happened, because the firing circuits were disabled when the low power room was hit.
>First Lieutenant Geoffrey L. Weston assumed command of the vessel, although he was also wounded himself.[12] PLA shells exploded in the sick bay, the port engine room, and finally the generator, just after the injured Weston's last transmission: "Under heavy fire. Am aground in approx. position 31.10' North 119.20' East. Large number of casualties".[Note 2]https://www.usni.org/magazines/naval-history-magazine/2011/october/asian-warm-cold-war>During 1947, Mao’s communist forces became increasingly hostile toward Marines stationed in North China and the naval personnel at Tsingtao. In June, Mao’s troops fired on the repair ship USS Deliver (ARS-23) working to salvage a pontoon that had gone adrift near the port. Supported by covering fire from the Deliver and the destroyer Benner (DD-807)—the purpose of which was to “discourage and drive off rather than injure the attackers”—a landing party from the destroyer Hawkins (DD-873) recovered the pontoon.
>Two months later, bad weather forced a Marine pilot to land in communist-held territory near Tsingtao, and Mao’s troops traded fire with a landing party of Marines from the heavy cruiser Saint Paul (CA-73) and sailors from the destroyer Tucker (DD-875) sent to retrieve him. To avoid any escalation of the situation, the Americans destroyed the plane and withdrew. The communists released the young naval aviator but only after protracted and lengthy negotiations with U.S. diplomats.
>In December 1947, the communists shot and killed one Marine and captured four others outside the base and only admitted it in February 1948, along with a demand that the United States withdraw its forces from Tsingtao and stop aiding Chiang. Not until April were the captured men and the body of the slain Marine returned to U.S. custody. >>562205Taiwan is not its own country. The government that controls Taiwan is the Republic of China engaged in civil war with the People's Republic of China.
They do not represent any other nationality other than Chinese, the notion that they represent some other culture is false. The ROC settled 1.3 million people from mainland China and governed serving this population only, not even recognizing the indigenous population as being anything different than Chinese at the expense of the local cultures, for several decades to the point where Taiwan very much represent Han Chinese culture and oppresses the indigenous population even if the west would like to hoist them up to show how Taiwan totally isn't China.
>>562217 (me)
fug wrong post number :
>>562193 >>562193>First China, it claims it's part of their territory but they don't have any say over what happens there. It even has US military personnel stationed there. The US has sold tons of weapons to them tooTaiwan is governed by the remnants of the nationalist forces which Mao
mostly defeated in the Chinese Civil War. The Chinese Civil War is perhaps the most interesting conflict of the twentieth century for how long it is and how many factions, but technically it is still going on today, their is still technically a war between the CCP and Republic of China.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5c3jLDdDuD0>Then there's the US, that doesn't support taiwanese independence officially, Yet claims it would intervene militarily if China -invaded-, but how could China invade it's supposedly own territory?Because
The People's Republic of China demanded that America stop recognizing the Republic of China aka Taiwan in order to allow for trade between Mainland China and America.
>>562231The Chinese are capitalist when successful and communist when not, duh.
China has record economic growth? The free market in action, look not at the colossal size of Chinese state owned companies!
China has surveillance state? The evils of communism, obviously no good capitalist regime would ever restrict freedoms!
>>562216>The government that controls Taiwan is the Republic of ChinaExactly. They have their own government therefore are their own country. That's how countries work.
>>562231They are communist only according to anyone who doesn't know what communism is.
>>562239>Oh, you're the baiter from the Urinal thread???
What did I even say that was bait? Countries aren't a real thing in the first place, if a government claims it is a country and has the power to back it up then it is a country. I'm not sure what you think it takes to make a "real" country.
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