No.5053[Last 50 Posts]
Does /tech/ participate in the Fediverse? Seems to me that this is the sort of social media we should be trying to get people into, even if social media itself is kinda trash.
I've always disliked social media, but after the news at >>>/leftypol/1066439, I've been considering getting into the Fediverse. You see, I would like the people who DO use social media (basically everyone) to be on better platforms, but I feel I cannot demand that from them if I cannot even use them myself. For instance, it would be disingenuous to ask Comrade Cockshott to start his presence in Mastodon after getting banned from fedbook if I could not be there to follow him and boost his follower stats. So..
So, /tech/, any thoughts on the Fediverse? What are some good instances and communities I could join? What are some people I should be following? What implementations are better, Pleroma, Mastodon, something else?
Also fediverse general.
Also, for anyone who is not familiar with the Fediverse:>The Fediverse is an ensemble of federated (i.e. interconnected) servers that are used for web publishing, social networking, microblogging, blogging and file hosting, but which, while independently hosted, can communicate with each other. On different servers (instances), users can create accounts. These accounts are able to communicate over the boundaries of the instances because the software running on the servers supports one or more communication protocols which follow an open standard.
Adapted from the Wikipedia entry on "fediverse"
Example networks would be Mastodon, Pleroma and Diaspora. Here you can browse a list of some (officially endorsed) Mastodon instances: https://joinmastodon.org/communities/
. Note these are not *all* existing instances.
Cockshott wasn't actually banned tho
I don't really care about that other stuff but I'm really excited for the future of PeerTube.
That's good to hear. Guess I shouldn't have speedread through the thread. Still, this discussion is relevant, we cannot rely on proprietary corporate platforms for our communication. We know anyone could get banned at any moment. Even happened to my local org's fb page.>>5058
Peertube is very promising indeed. Allowing communities to set up their own site for video sharing is a great way to get people out of YouTube. Especially since the main problem in getting people to migrate to other places like BitChute and LBRY is that they're filled with shitty cryptoscam and conspiratard content. PeerTube avoids that problem.
Got any good instances or channels to share?
Not the anon that you are replying to, but this one is run by sub.media and friends: https://kolektiva.media/videos/local
>>5061>Especially since the main problem in getting people to migrate to other places like BitChute and LBRY is that they're filled with shitty cryptoscam and conspiratard content.
That's only part of the problem. The real issue at hand is just about everyone who has attempted to be an alternative to Youtube in the past was intent on copying their business model. The problem is Youtube for the longest time actually operated at a loss in order to strangle the competition. In doing so they were able to provide greater bandwidth and higher transcoding service in doing so. Only very recently has Youtube finally sought to capitalize on their monopoly with a deluge of aggressive ads and pay-for-movies schemes. Youtube competitors trying to be businesses find themselves in a battle they cannot possibly win. Vimeo is practically the only one that was about to carve out a small niche for documentary and film students by being a paid service for them–this has allowed them to subsidize the free users with better quality and transcoding standards for than Youtube. But decentralized alternatives like PeerTube finally provide a way around this conundrum: by distributing the hosting load among many independent servers and the users themselves it allows a community of non-profit-seeking peers to form that can sustain itself. At the moment PeerTube needs more transcoding options for instance owners to take advantage of this freedom (in particular I want to see a PeerTube instance that gives its users the freedom to use no transcoding at all, instead relying on file size limits), but this is a feature that can be added very easily (perhaps even trivially since it's open source) and conversations with the main developer suggest they might get around to it eventually. The added bonus to all of this of course censorship resistance.
Lainchan used to have a comfy PeerTube instance but it died early last year and nobody has heard from its owner since.
Nice. I've seen this instance before, but lost the link. Thank you for posting it.>>5063>That's only part of the problem.
True. I immediately regretted saying "the main problem" as soon as I saw my final post. There's a lot more involved here.
>The real issue at hand is just about everyone who has attempted to be an alternative to Youtube in the past was intent on copying their business model.
That is a very good point. Right now services like LBRY are very intent on shilling their business model, which is just YouTube with cryptocurrencies. Of course, if a service like this were to surpass YouTube (unlikely, as you pointed out), it would just develop the same problems YouTube currently has.
I'm looking through a list PeerTube instances, will post any content I personally enjoy here.
>>5064>if a service like this were to surpass YouTube (unlikely, as you pointed out), it would just develop the same problems YouTube currently has.
Exactly! I've spent well over a decade now investigating, researching, and testing out YouTube alternative, hoping to fine that one best alternative to migrate all my shit to and always ending up disappointed in the end. It took me ages to figure out why they don't exist. Hopefully more can realize the problem is systemic now, because within that lies a solution.
GNU Social vs Pleroma? For a private, invite-only social network.
StatusNet oldie here. It's been interesting to see the developments in the fediverse over the years. One unfortunate thing has been Eugen letting himself get pushed around by radlibs. He has forgotten that users are not important, especially not whiny ones that don't contribute.>>5142
Pleroma development was more active last time I checked, but GNU Social has had more features for a longer time. GNU Social also has !groups, which neither Mastodon nor Pleroma have last time I checked. There is an ActivityPub plugin for GS in the works, or maybe it's even finished.
So stablity/maturity-wise, GNU Social? I want something that will just work. I don't need fancy features. What attracts me to Pleroma, however, is Elixir. I'm guessing Pleroma can scale very well.
Can Pleroma not federate and have a private server? Mastodon and diaspora can't do this.
>>5146>Can Pleroma not federate and have a private server? Mastodon and diaspora can't do this.
Should be possible, but I'd ask on IRC about it. I'm pretty sure you can disable federation with Mastodon and Diaspora too if you really want to.
As for GS vs Pleroma, Pleroma has the benefit if being written in a based language like Erlang.
>>5147>Pleroma has the benefit if being written in a based language like Erlang.
Links to project page and current code repository plz
Looking into it, it seems Pleroma has invites, but it's not that simple to implement. Pleroma and Mastodon seem made for federation, and it looks hard to make them not federate. While GNU Social seems to have that option in its configuration from the start and you can build your site as a private, non-federated, invite-only network.
>>5151https://docs.pleroma.social/backend/configuration/cheatsheet/> federating: Enable federation with other instances.
Seems pretty easy to me.
You're right! I guess all that is left is to try both GNU Social and Pleroma and see which one fits the best. Thanks.
Bunkerchan instance when?
WE GOTTA MAKE IT HAPPEN PEOPLE
Well, continuing off of this: I ended up just dumping the videos in some """breadtube""" instance, since it seemed the most general leftist out of the ones I found, despite them specifically talking about anarchism in the about page, but not communism in general. I hope my content is allowed to stay there. Link is https://watch.breadtube.tv/
for anyone interested.>>5227
We can surely hope. Bunkerchan peertube would be really great. Could call it bunkerchannel, bunkertube or something like that.
I'm listening but I don't see what we would put on it. We don't really have 'leftypol content' at this point. We would have to develop a video production base first.
webms are in webm format so they can be uploaded to chans and shared that way. they're short videos, not suitable for a youtube-like platform, and definitely not worth spending money on when they can be hosted elsewhere for free and have even more reach than on an obscure peertube instance.
Is it time to start shilling PeerTube like crazy?
I need to finally settle on an instance to move all my video game stuff to, because I sure as fuck did not make a Youtube account in 2006 to spam people with ads.
>participating in anything with "fed" in the name
fuck off cianiggas
Really makes you think!
Anybody know a good mastodon server that allows MLs?
Doesnt have to be a tankie circlejerk that bans you for questioning deng xiaoping theory or anything. Just needs ML to be allowed.
Tondon has an anti-ML policy
I think your best bet is looking for generic instances, that do not pertain to any specific topics, but also happen to have somewhat loose moderation. Most political instances are either rightard freezepeach or pseudoleft anarcho-liberal themed, either of which won't be ML friendly. Some tech-related instances seem more chill. Also important to note that Pleroma instances tend to be looser than Mastodon ones, due to usually being run by literally whos instead of public organizations/companies.
So if I understand the fediverse correctly? People on mastodon can communicate with people on gnu social no problem? Aren’t the websites for each fediverse different?
Yes, you've got the right idea. The easiest way to explain it is that it's like email: gmail users can talk to yahoo mail users, which can talk to hotmail users, etc etc. That's what it means to be a descentralized, federated network. The whole network is made out of these servers which are able to communicate with each other, since they all use a common protocol, called ActivityPub.
It also might be worth mentioning that mastodon and gnu social aren't websites, they're programs. They're programs you can run on a server in order to host your own little social media site. These servers are called instances, and they all use the ActivityPub protocol to communicate with each other. Users on a Mastodon instance like mastodon.social can talk to users on a Pleroma instance like pleroma.social or a GNU social instance. Anyone (whether an individual or an organization) with access to a server and a web domain can set up their own instance.gentooGentoo
Pick the instance well, since account migration doesn't exist yet and last time I checked there was no progress in the devs coding it. (but I haven't checked since they made the search engine improvements, when they prioritized crowdfunding features)
No, you're not wrong for it at all. I encourage any of us who can tolerate it to try to make some inroads in those spaces.
The Fediverse is great! We should definitely populate it with more leftists. I recommend setting up an instance of Hometown, a fork of Mastodon that lets you limit posts to only your instance so the federated timeline doesn't dogpile on you like Twitter is prone to promoting.
>>6468> recommend setting up an instance of Hometown, a fork of Mastodon that lets you limit posts to only your instance
Are you saying 'limit the accessibility of posts you make' or 'limit the source of posts you view on your feed'?
I've only used Pleroma (and PeerTube) which has an easy-to-find feed for viewing local posts (and not all the rest from federated instances). I assumed Mastodon would have done the same, because it's a pretty simple and useful feature.
The issue with restricting posts to your instance is I think it suggests a false sense of security. It's not inherently a bad feature but it's easy for an uninformed user (i.e. almost all of them, let's be honest) to think it's any more 'private'.
e.g. Mastodon's 'unlisted' feature is (was??) a similar examplehttps://blog.soykaf.com/post/privacy-and-tracking-on-the-fediverse/
(original creator of Pleroma, 'lain', posted early 2018)>“Unlisted” posts are not even in the ActivityPub standard. There’s no reason to expect any non-Mastodon server to respect the ‘unlisted’ setting, and they will most probably display those posts like public posts.>There is no end-to-end encryption on the Fediverse. Even direct messages are sent unencrypted. That means that the admin of any server that your message travelled to can read it by looking it up in the database.
Now the second is pretty standard for social media and isn't surprising, but the first could easily trip people up and is what I'm getting at. It's fine if people realize a blogging site shouldn't have any expectation of privacy (I mean, look at Parler lol), but I don't think that's a widely-held understanding.
(sorry, that was a rant)
I've also been getting the impression that Pleroma is superior to Mastodon. From what I've heard it's designed to be much simpler to understand and more configurable.
I would say it's better designed but has different bonus features, although I'm no expert (I don't have an account on either Mastodon or Pleroma). I think Pleroma easier for the host to maintain.https://blog.soykaf.com/post/what-is-pleroma/#how-is-it-different-from-mastodon
By the way:>Compatible with Mastodon clients (including the Mastodon frontend).>this includes Twidere, Tusky, Mastalab, Tootdon and many others.
I love open protocols.
What features does Mastodon have that Pleroma doesn't? I don't use them either lol
I know Mastodon accounts can subscribe to PeerTube channels and like/dislike/comment. I haven't tried but I doubt it works in Pleroma.
Fortunately someone made a reddit post today asking a similar questions:>Pleroma was behind in functionality but has caught up considerably. Mastodon last releases have been more about polish in the UI and in developing pointy-clicky admin/moderation tools, while Pleroma is still more focused on giving more flexibility to power users (e.g., pleroma's MRF [Message Rewrite Facility] is a really cool to process and programmatically moderate / transform any message received by the server).
it’s amazing how these people created a space free of marketing culture poison and they still insist on adding a points/likes system.
What are some nice instances?
I finally got fed up enough with Youtube's bullshit that I spend the last few days investigating the entire list of PeerTube instances on the official tracker.>>6690
LinuxRocks and yt.is.nota.live are nice PeerTube instances. There's some very comfy technology instances like the Diode Zone that are basically self-hosted too. If I could figure out if one needs an exceptional internet connection/high bandwidth and how easy it is to federate with lots of other instances I'd be interested in hosting my own.
It's kind of amazing to me how many propertarian and ostensibly leftist instances that claim to care about free speech also have "no commies" or "no nazis" rules. Such hypocrisy.
User ranking can be legitimately useful in some situations (esp. in non-political and non-commercial settings where there is less incentive to game the system).>>6695>It's kind of amazing to me how many propertarian and ostensibly leftist instances that claim to care about free speech also have "no commies" or "no nazis" rules. Such hypocrisy.
This. It's like Google saying We Value Your Privacy™. Just admit it's not the case and no-one will leave.>leftist instances […] have "no commies"
Fun if true. source or gtfo
id participate but i dont know which instance to pick
For uploading or just browsing and commenting? Do you want a comfy community or mass reach?
All I can say is pick well and join me in asking the devs to start on implementing account migration: I chose a decent instance and started uploading but then a perfect instance was launched a year later and you can't just move the account over keeping the likes and comments. Luckily I haven't had an instance get shut down but it's almost an inevitability, right?
I meant there are propertarian "free speech" instances that have "no commies" rules and there are leftist "free speech" instances that have "no nazis" rules. Peertube.social is a prominent example of the latter.
By the way Marxanons, there's multiple anarchist PeerTube instances and even one explicitly for breadtube. We better get on the bandwagon before the anarchists leave us behind.
>>6705>Oh no think about the nazis and porn
Who cares, every instance can make their own rules. Why the fuck would you as a communist share an instance with nazis? And there's surely an instance specifically for porn already, just using common sense.
Don't call yourself censorship-free if you're not free of censorship.
>Why the fuck would you as a communist share an instance with nazis?
There are several reasons to do so. One is to foster an atmosphere of genuine free speech to build communities of resistance when the crackdown arrives, the other is to occupy places with people who can be rescued into the fold of anti-capitalism by proximity to our arguments. The latter is the same reason I still lament the death of the 8ch and the fact that we never joined the webring of 8ch diaspora sites.
The far-right already have Gab, this Mastodon has solidified itself as a hub for the far-left and non-reactionary libre software hackers. >One is to foster an atmosphere of genuine free speech
Okay crypto-lib go make your free speech zone with Fuentes, Chomsky and /pol/ - nothing's stopping you.
>>6711>Okay crypto-lib>only real leftists are censor-happy
Good call moron, I guess the mass purging of socialist orgs on Facebook the last few days means nothing to you. Imagine saying shit like this on an image board. An image board that descends from three
censorship battles, no less.
And /pol/ is very far from a free speech zone, you fucking idiot. It's why we had to make /leftypol/ in the first place.
>>6713>All platforms are the same
What your dumb ass can't wrap your head around is the fact that this "censorship" as your using it here, conflating it with Facebook of all things, doesn't apply. Gab is literally a safe haven built out of
Mastodon infrastructure. Porn is already on Mastodon. Your initial conception is fundamentally false. MLs are on Mastodon. Solarpunk anarcho-vegans are on Mastodon. Programmers of illegal copyright-circumventing software is on Mastodon. If one out of 1000 number of instances in a free federation says "no dogs" that doesn't mean the federated decentralized network
censors dogs, fuckhead, especially when it's quite possible that there are already seven instances specifically dedicated to dog discussion already. Your misunderstanding comes from not knowing jack shit about the technology in question but still making a fuckload of assumptions, while arguing inside the framework of a fucking liberal
. Newsflash: free speech is a fucking myth to keep you in check you basic bitch retard how about you analyze the free speech "empowering" communists throughout history. The bourgeois can disappear you whenever the fuck the want - That's power. Our
power isn't some fucking 1776 constitutional amendment they
handed to "us", rather it's our ability to strike a stop to their machines and services and murder them by force afforded by the sheer mass of our class acting in self-interest for the productive mode of communism.
A decentralized federation only resists censorship if it actually has at least some members committed to free speech. That is my concern. All it takes is for these silo'd topical members of a federation to one day decide that those ideas over there that they don't like are too dangerous for them to federate with anymore for the open exchange of ideas and debate to collapse.
Also I've been talking about PeerTube this entire time, not Mastodon.
>>6718>rather it's our ability to strike a stop to their machines and services and murder them by force afforded by the sheer mass of our class acting in self-interest for the productive mode of communism.
Flowery words that count for absolutely nothing if you can't plant the idea in workers' minds in the first place. Please get your dumb ass educated on the Red Scares already. Communications control and propaganda absolutely matter.
>>6721>When freedom of speech is stricken from the constitution people's tongues disappear and success becomes impossible, Just like in Tsarists Russia, occupied China, Junta Cuba and -wait…
I bet you aren't even using anonymizing technologies. >Communications control and propaganda absolutely matter.
Then stop arguing for synthesis organizations with defenders of capital you clown.Rely on the laws of the tsar and organize with the Whites!
-Vlad the Loonatic, 1817
Real talk: what the fuck is going on with powerful e-celebs like Jimmy Dore and Lee Camp as they push all these lame non-federated clones of prominent monopoly models like Rokfin (youtube), PanQuake (twitter), etc? I have observed clones like these over a decade fail over and over and over again until finally coming to the conclusion that trying to clone their business models is a one-way ticket to failure because the monopolies can afford to run at a loss to corner the market. It's absolutely infuriating watching their followers flock to these shitty alternatives during this big opportunity the grow the fediverse during a major crackdown on speech.
tell them in case they don't know any better
Google, Twitter, and Facebook have really been escalating the crackdown on left-ish media the past few days, we really need to get the word out about the Fediverse right now.
How would we do this? I feel like we need to get a few big names I'm afraid.
I think one of the more interesting parts of the fediverse is the self hosting aspect, getting normies to care about this stuff is borderline impossible, however if you host your own instances you can approach them more easily with "Hey buddy, wanna try some federated microblogging?"
On a personal level I'm redirecting people on my Youtube channel to superior video uploads on my PeerTube channel. But we have to actually get non-content-producing people to make their own accounts and start using them somehow. I have no idea how that ever happened on Youtube since I started using it to host my videos from the very beginning.
In fact I remember a time on Youtube when people commenting on your videos all themselves had their own videos.
I'm starting to feel like I might need two accounts for PeerTube: One account on an instance that I think is actually conducive for hosting my stuff, and another account on a different instance that follows just about everyone so that I'm not restricted in the videos I can leave comments on. I wish instances wouldn't avoid following others, it's so anti-social.
Now that peertube supports streaming. When should I expect seeing one of you streaming silent hill there?>>6812
Get a mastodon account for that
I only stream good games tbh famalam
The e-influencers are getting real agressive with their Rokfin shilling this week. I am genuinely concerned for the future if they corral people into another fucking centralized Youtube clone.
Can someone explain to what the hell the difference is between PeerTube, D.Tube, and LBRY? I've already chosen PeerTube as my alternative to migrate off Youtube, and I'm really annoyed that I can't mount a proper argument against the other two.
So apparently LBRY is being sued by the SEC over claims that the company violated securities laws by selling their cryptocurrency in order to fund their work without registering it with the SEC as a security.
Is this where all of these social media alternatives that feel the need to shove crypto into their service are headed? Bruce Schneier sure seems to think so. In addition to crypto being little more than a zero-sum pyramid scheme, he says all it really does is invite government investigative and regulatory meddling by the IRS, the SEC, FinCEN, and probably the FBI:https://www.schneier.com/blog/archives/2021/04/wtf-signal-adds-cryptocurrency-support.html
I kind of hope this gets some people to choose PeerTube over LBRY in the future.
The only good reason for cryptocurrency to exist is for buying drugs anyway
I doubt that will repel anyone, but it should.
https://reclaimthenet.org/youtube-ceo-basement-authoritative-sources/>YouTube CEO Susan Wojcicki has acknowledged that the platform’s policy of boosting “authoritative” mainstream media sources and suppressing independent creators in search makes it “harder, in some cases, for channels, maybe who are getting started or smaller, to be able to be visible when there’s a major event or when people are looking at something that is science or news related” but insists that that the policy is “really, really important.”>Last year, YouTube’s Chief Product Officer, Neal Mohan, said that YouTube needs to raise up authoritative sources because people who create content in their basement are just “espousing their opinions”:
Are you doing your part to wean people off of Youtube, anon?
Can someone recommend me a small scale pleroma instance?
After reading this thread ive decided I want to try plethora. The instances is the only issue I'm left with. Many instances seem to be liberal enclosed spaces. Theirs a lot of blocking of any remotely offensive content, not just rightists but porn/hentai.
I'm mostly looking for the kind of community /leftypol/ is. Free and open without being retarded about it. Any advice here?
Maybe we need to make our own.
Wait, you mean Pleroma? How's that different from GNU Social/Mastodon anyway?
Yeah sorry autocorrect. Pleroma seems much better than mastadon, look at this https://blog.soykaf.com/post/what-is-pleroma/
Wouldn't be against petitioning for a leftypol hosted one. We have our own cytube already. But if someone out there already made one with a similar philosophy I would prefer to help support what's out there.
Nope I just don't care enough. I don't think the solution to time wasting spectacle online is GNU/garbage-spectacle
I only want to microblog myself. If I wanted to watch others I could already waste time on twitter without an account anyway.
Just keep a journal.
t. LARPing pseudo-revolutionary headed for burn out.
Federated social media could have a positive impact and might be the future if trends of censorship continue.
Fediverse is old news. if there's a decentralized net, it's going to come from blockchain. look up SingularityNET and IPFS
>>8579>if there's a decentralized net, it's going to come from blockchain
Name one positive thing that blockchain actually adds
to these systems.https://www.schneier.com/blog/archives/2019/02/blockchain_and_.html
>>8580>Just about everyone using bitcoin has to trust one of the few available wallets and use one of the few available exchanges
this guy doesn't know what he's talking about. you can make a wallet in seconds. you don't even have to use it.>Name one positive thing that blockchain actually adds to these systems.
if a server shuts down it doesn't mean data suddenly disappearing into nothing.
>>8591>if a server shuts down it doesn't mean data suddenly disappearing into nothing.
You don't need blockchain to build a distributed system. What else does blockchain add?
It makes building it convenient. Just download the blockchain and your system is hooked up.
What ever happened to juche.town
It looks like Youtube's decision to start putting ads on any and all videos without compensating uploaders for monetization is finally going to be extended to the rest of the world (it was first pushed on the US last November). Will they have finally gone too far? Is this the decision that slays the beast? Big opportunity for PeerTube growth?https://www.entrepreneur.com/article/372635>YouTube announced a change in the terms of its service, among which it stands out that the video platform will begin to place ads on all audiovisual materials. However, you will not share the profits with the small creators.>Through a statement sent to its users, the platform explained "YouTube has the right to monetize all the content on the platform and ads may be shown in videos of channels that are not part of the YouTube Partner Program.">This will not allow small content creators or those who are not part of the YouTube Partner Program, that is, channels that do not meet the amounts of views and other requirements that are requested, not have access to the monetization of the ads that the company places on its videos.
I don't understand how can people use the 'net without an adblocker.
Friends force other friends to use adblockers
This is dumb, just fucking talk to people. There are literally no consequences to being an out in the open communist
That isn't true and it isnt primarily about that. For everything, decentralization is the better option
What mastodon instances are actually worth joining reeee
Freespeechextremist.com and all the others banned by mastodon.
I certainly use distributed internet infrastructure, but "le fediverse" just refers to distributed social network since all they talk about is alternatives to Twatter, Shitcord and Soybook, so I don't really care about it much.
I have a secret leak source that says there will be a leftypol plemora instance soon
It's better than twitter.
It won't be if all the retards from here start shitting it up.
Seethe and Cope titteroid.
another freeze peach website using freeze peach to mask their far right positions.
Big escalation on Twitter last week. Twitter is now knowingly allowing phony accounts to stay up whose purpose is to smear the reputation of people it has banned for wrongthink.
Anon are you doing your part to guide people to GNU social/Mastodon/Pleroma… Instead of that stupid fucking Panquake project?
Love it or hate it, the point is to get people to stop surrendering their speech to a menacing corporate-state entity.
democratizing discourse bro
it's just like your local water cooler but online
Unique IPs: 8