/anime/ - Anime

They're in discussions to make a live action Berserk and people are hoping Henry Cavill plays him.

>>21785
>henry cavill as guts
same energy as One Piece fans wanting Jim Carrey to play Franky

Berserk just seems to keep getting more and more depressing. For every battle won there's a catastrophic loss. For every good thing, there is dozens of terrible ones. How is Guts going to stop Griffith? I can't believe it would end in some grim-dark way because for all the depressive shit there was always this feeling of a light ahead in the tunnel somewhere… but I can't think of how that would be either.

How would Berserk go if the roles were reversed?

>>23303
Guts might be even more messed up than Casca was. Casca was never a beast like Guts, and more socially aware. She would probably not choose to run off to fight demons like Guts did. She'd probably stay with Guts, Rickert, Godot, and Erica. Apostles would probably keep showing up there, but all of them fighting together might be able to handle it.

The characters Guts meets and adds to his party would probably never enter the story. Without Puck, traveling to Elfhelm to heal Guts would be off the table. Without Schierke, they'd never meet Flora and find the Berserker armor. If you really wanted to force things to conform to the original story, you could just have Guts overpower any attempt to contain him and run off like Casca did in the Conviction arc, and have the plot be driven by Casca following Guts, who more or less follows the same path.

The biggest thing is probably the absence of moonboy unless Griffith is capable of impregnating Guts.

>>23305
Interesting analysis, far more detailed than I thought I'd get.
>The biggest thing is probably the absence of moonboy unless Griffith is capable of impregnating Guts.
Moonboy always felt out of place to me tbh but a violating MPreg aspect would be quite fitting for the bleakness of Berserk's setting.

Basically, I think Berserk is a PUNK series, very anarchist in flavor! Let's see now!
>There are no good authority figures, every noble is a piece of shit, coward, or demon
>King is literally an incestuous pedo
>All religions are brutal hierarchies perpetuating fear and lies that only serve to intensify chaos by intensifying oppression and delusion
>The closest thing to God is the Idea that Evil is a real thing and not something humans made up
>Guts is in a revolution against God/the Idea of Evil
>Guts is happy to be a mercenary cuck following the system and killing for money until he gets faced with the nightmarish truth of reality and must face off against the horrible demons (forces of reaction irl) that spring up to annihilate any who remotely threaten the hierarchy
>There is no savior just as there is no Gods or Masters
>All astral shit was imagined into existence by humans
SLAM A RAW HEAP OF IRON IN THE FACE OF THE CAPITALIST

I don‘t see how Nietzsche and Anarchism are reconcilable. Nietzsche seemed very fond of hierarchies. He wasn‘t the kind of person who wanted the hierarchy flattened for everyone to be equal.

>>23972
Anarchism = Autonomy, not Equality
Nietzsche and Anarchism are compatible

The idea of evil existing as a positive aspecf of reality is directly schopenhauerian, where he reverses leibinz's concept of God making an inherently good world. Good is just the *absence* of evil and so on.
Also, Guts is not Nietzschean, since his stated mission is to bring men to death, and so his ethos js again, pessimistic, not vitalistic.
Griffith is the one with undying (literally) ambition, and Evil is just the spiritualising of Nature itself in all of its chaos, and so is dionysian.
>anarchy
As in kropotkin and bachunin? Absolutely not. But in the premodern way, meh, but i would rather say Guts is expressedly apolitical. He has no "polis" to have politics with.

>>23974
The IoE is not an expression of Nature itself, it is an expression of humanity’s rationalizing about Nature and the desires and actions of humans.
Evil is not an intrinsic factor of the Berserk universe, nor is good, these are human abstractions. Rather, enough humans believe in Evil and fate as the cause for their suffering rather than random chance and an indifferent universe, so as to give birth to an Entity whose only purpose is to give mankind what they most desired, Evil upon which good could then be transposed, and fate written over random chance. The IoE exists to give humans what they subconsciously want, a purpose. It is the Idea of Evil rather than good because humans conceptualized the notion of evil’s existence prior to good’s existence, as they found pain and suffering to be the exception, rather than pleasure and contentment.

Griffith is not a Nietzschean figure at all to me, he fully surrendered to his own ambition in the end and accepted being a pawn in the IoE’s plan to deliver Mankind its greatest desire beyond the existence of evil and fate, a Savior to save them from evil and lead them down a different fate.

>>23975
There is no difference between Nature and its abstract self-reinforcement. If Evil exists in the world, i literally cant ignore it, because its trying to kill me. I am part of its self-related Idea.
>a Savior to save them from evil and lead them down a different fate
But isnt he the ubermensch here by transcending limits? Guts is just a guy, but griffith is a god.

More importantly, is the series progressing after Miura's death? I remember it happened two or three years ago, but I've also read some of his collaborators may be carrying over Berserk.

>>23977
Yes. Some major supporting characters just came back into the story after having been absent for a long time.

The art is noticeably different but still high quality and stylistically very similar. The biggest complaint people have had is that the dialogue is pretty sparse and the pacing is pretty fast. It seems like they don't want to add anything to the story beyond what Miura told his friend Mori the plot was going to be.

>>23976
Actually the point is that Evil doesn't actually exist in the world. You don't get diseases and die because of evil, but because diseases happen to exist. People don't do violence because they're evil, but because they have s propensity toward aggression and a desire to commit harm. Attributing all this to evil is the problem, and that's what Berserk points to. Humans convinced themselves "Evil" exists before they conceptualized any god.

That's why the Entity isn't called "Evil Itself" it's called the Idea of Evil, or more accurately, doesn't actually have a name

>>23979
>>23976
You're speculating based on a chapter that was withdrawn and possibly no longer canon.

these fictionbrained threads remind me of "kimpossible anon" from last year or the year before

>>23980
I'm speculating based on a chapter that was removed for revealing too much to early that was proceeded by a chapter that ended by showing the IoE titled "God of the Abyss" and is thematically consistent with everything we've seen in the story thus far

>>1822765
In Berserk evil is real because humans willed it into existence.
The IoE was conjured by humans, the Apostles (demons) and Godhand are all former humans that chose to become what they are.

>>1822808
In Chapter 83 the IoE directly tells Griffith that it came about when humans cried out for reasons, reasons for why they suffered. Reasons for their pain. Reasons that they died random and absurd deaths. Humans decided that Evil is why. Evil curses them with sickness. Evil created predatory animals. Evil humans (also known as enemies) who live to spread wickedness brought more of this essence into the world. But this wasn't a thing before humans. The Universe doesn't care whether a tiger nurtures its young or devours them. The Universe doesn't care what happens to humans nor what we do to each other. Evil is not a reality external to humans. Hence why the IoE did not exist prior to humans. Because it's a personification…of an idea.

As for the Godhand and the Apostles, we're told and shown that apostles are all humans that made a deal with the Godhand, and we see from the Incarnation of Griffith into Femto that the Godhand also started out as humans.

>>1822765
kung
pow
penis

>>1822907
Kung. Pow. Penis.

Kung. Pow Penis.

>>1822907
You just explained why you would literally end up as one of Griffith's sheep ready to be served up when the time comes for the next big sacrifice
>Nature is fundamentally evil
Idealist nonsense and western life-denial
Nature is inherently amoral, morality is something created by humans, it's nonsensical to claim a virus is evil for infecting a cell or a tiger is evil for eating a gazelle.

There is no force called "Nature" that preordained reality, and stating that humans (that adhere to slave morality) get something psychologically and socially out of "pretending" evil exists isn't an argument that it actually does, it's more noble lie nonsense, like pretending God exists because people feel more fulfilled believing that it does

>>1822907
>>23984
The IoE is supposed to be that humans made evil a real thing because they couldn't accept the underlying nihilst reality, that bad things happen for no reason. They found the idea that some evil will made them happen was more comfortable. And then once you accept this, the power of evil becomes alluring since "evil" is the name you give the the source of all misery. Instead of merely being a victim you may seek to become a victimizer and have more control over your destiny. That's why people become apostles.

>>23988
Indeed, and it is also bound to fate.

The IoE represents three distinctly human desires, reason, purpose, and salvation; humans desire reasons for suffering and thus invent evil as an explanation, they desire a purpose for the outcome of their lives and thus decide events must have been fated to happen as they did, and now that they have invented evil and fate they cry out for a savior to save them from evil and to change fate. That is what Griffith's reincarnation at the Tower of Conviction represents. That is why the IoE is called the Desired God.
>>1822935
Lmao ngl I feel like you might have too many idealist natsoc spooks to understand the philosophy of Berserk
Amorality doesn't require good and evil existing anymore than atheism requires a god. Amorality is simply the state of things without humans assigning value judgments based on their own desire for pleasure and fear of pain.

>>1822987
Berserk is a work of fiction, you don't need to agree with Nietzschean philosophy, but Berserk is a Nietzschean story, there isn't a deeper level where actually it's hyper-moralist and promotes Uber slave morality

>>23972
Nietzsche was heavily inspired by Wagner who at one point was an anarchist who worked together with Bakunin. This had a profound influence on Nietzsche's political writing. When he talks of the free spirits, the followers of his philosophy enacting great influence and steering society, they don't do this by the rule of law. Nietzsche despised the rule of the state and saw it as a secular religion. Leaders in Nietzche's view were writers and artists influcing society through civil society. This is in line with Wagner's anarchist and may even be traced back to Bakunin's idea of the "invisible dictatorship", were a small group may inspire and steer the revolution through education and rhethoric rather than an offical position of power enforced by the monopoly of violence

>>1823215
Wagner was very expliclity an anarchist early on in his life and in his very early writing. He expliclity planned an uprising with Baknunin until it failed and he got banished. I wouldn't suggest Nietzsche is an anarchist per se, he obviously spoke negatively of them (although this was due to their tendency at the time to use enlightment secular religion schools of thought, this changed when Nietzsche got incorperated into the tradition. This is the same story as Stirner). I am however saying Nietzschian anarchism is possible, and the link is not as strange as it may appear with a superficial understanding of the "hierachy" in Nietzsche's work

>>23992
yes
but i think this has to do with the open signifier of what an anarchist (anti)politics can represent in itself. everyone is an anarchist in most things already.
in the end, in "antichrist" nietzsche seems to wish for a further impersonalising of the will by placing his faith in science, for the quality of post-humanity, which i also think is his cynicism; of the project of the ubermensch itself.
i think for example, a pagan hero like achilles was simply born as a higher type, the same way in the iliad the gods are called a "race" unto themselves. the act of willing ourselves to be greater can work, but only relative to our mere humanity.
i think being human is good enough in any case.
But i will def look more into wagners anarchism.

>>21791
>>21785
I can see Jim Carrey (Ace Ventura era) playing such an eccentric character. Cavill is going to be in a WH40K project too apparently.

WAIT WAIT WAIT

WE WENT THROUGH ALL OF THAT

TOWER OF GOD, CITY OF DEMONS, VRITTANIS, EIGHT YEARS OF THE FUCKING BOAT, AND ELFHELM

JUST FOR GRIFFITH TO SWOOP IN, KIDNAP CASCA, AND BRAINWASH HER BACK INTO USELESSNESS???

GOD FUCKING DAMN IT

>>25168
Not exactly. It seems like there's some kind of magic involved, like a charm spell, and it's not fully effective. Given who all is in Falconia at the moment it's likely that a restored Casca is going to meet the working girls she was with in the Conviction Arc. It also seems like Griffith was able to find Elfhelm because moonboy could find Guts and Casca and he used the opportunity to show up.

>>24289
Franky is based on Ace Ventura. The point is that they're not gonna get someone like Jim Carrey for a Netflix show, and Henry Cavill as Guts is similarly unlikely. Guts is also like half Cavill's age.

>>25170
I was hoping for some adventures with a restored casca and the gang since she got that elf ranger gear but I think you might be onto something with the working girls.

What I don't really get is why Elfhelm and everyone on it disappeared but Puck is still around. Also do we know how much time has passed since they were on Elfhelm? They said that they was a time dilation but it seems like a matter of months rather than years. I thought Rickert and the assassins were going to some hideout, so it's weird to see them in Kushan territory now, especially since Skellig was supposed to be in the north? idk

What I really want to know now is what's gonna happen to Guts. I was expecting him to get some kind of power up on Elf Island, but so much for that. His body is fucked and his armor is eating him alive, and this recent shit with Griffith shows that he's just not up to snuff. Maybe rasta grandad will realign his chakras or something but right now he's just fucked. And to add insult to injury they fucking Yamcha'd him, god damn.

>>25171
Regarding Puck, he has been acting strangely and there might be something happening.

>Do we know how much time has passed
Not very much considering:
<Moonboy only showed up once
<Elfhelm is supposed to have some kind of time warp, but when Rickert shows up he is not noticeably older.

>Kushan
Well since Ganishka is no longer around there's a power vacuum in the Kushan Empire. Daiba being one of the top guys seems to have backed Silat, who probably had some kind of claim to begin with. Given the status of the New Band of the Hawk, the Kushan probably are glad to fill the power vacuum. It's very possible however that the characters showed up there so quickly simply because the manga is being paced faster now. If it was Miura there might have been several issues of travel, but since it's not core to the story it's not being done by Mori. He said he was going to stick to the parts that Miura actually told him about and not really embellish too much.

>Guts
He didn't go to Elfhelm to power up, that was for Casca. Now that the group is with the Kushan and all the Elfhelm witches, they will have the opportunity to do something for Guts. On the other hand, the whole theme of Guts being worn down from fighting may end up taking him out of the fight. He might end up being more of a symbol that others organize around. Consider how many people he already added to his party, and how powerful most of them are.

He probably has enough left in him to push to the end, but it seems like he's already past his peak. The story seems to be setting up a parallel situation to Skull Knight and Guts being threatened by being hollowed out by the armor and ending up like him. It makes more sense to set that up to subvert it by having him choose humanity, and that's basically what his whole arc has been about. Unlike Gaiseric, Guts still has living people tying him to his humanity. That would mean not fighting until he is consumed by the armor.

>>23993
>everyone is an anarchist in most things already
No? To be an anarchist you must have a strong anti-authoritarian disposition. And most people are sheeple/bootlickers/ideologues and so on… Same for Nazism: the Nazis are worthless without their leader, without their Father, they're like orphans wishing to get better parents. I have more respect for the bourgeoisie and authoritarian leaders then I do for the Nazis because the Nazis, despite their boasting, will never actually hold any power and are just pitiful to look at. Are those people supposed to be the Ubermensch? Please.

>>25172
>It's very possible however that the characters showed up there so quickly simply because the manga is being paced faster now. If it was Miura there might have been several issues of travel, but since it's not core to the story it's not being done by Mori. He said he was going to stick to the parts that Miura actually told him about and not really embellish too much.

That's the impression that I got, yeah. To be honest I don't really know how to feel about this. On the one hand I think it's noble to try and respect Miura's vision for the story, but on the other I don't think trying to remain strictly faithful to whatever details Miura imparted really accomplished that.

First, whatever he mentioned to Mori might have been true at the time, but any writer will tell you that the story develops as it is written. New ideas pop up, themes change in sometimes unexpected ways, and the writer's perspective on things can also change. I think it's obvious just by reading Berserk that the Miura of 1990 and of 2021 were very different as artists and writers.

Second, I think the embellishments were a major contributor to Berserk as a story itself, both in its art and its writing. Part of what makes the characters and the world so fascinating are all the little details, and there's lots of extraneous information that sets up stuff for later or contributes to making the world feel much larger and alive than otherwise.

To put it simply, if the point is to honor Miura's work by "not embellishing it" (or adulterating it) with creative input from Mori, then just cancel it now. Miura has always had an insanely high standard for Berserk, and publishing a hollow version of that does a disservice to everyone involved in it. What we're getting is an interpretation of Miura by Mori anyway, so if that's how things are going to be then he should fully commit and do the story as Miura would, embellishments and all.

>He didn't go to Elfhelm to power up, that was for Casca.

Well sure, but something has to change for Guts to keep on Gutsing. Guts was only just keeping pace with apostles even after getting the berserker armor, but now even with it he's basically constantly convalescent. I thought he was going to get some kind of improvement when visiting the dorf that made the armor, but that doesn't seem possible now.

I don't think it's possible for Guts to step back and not fight, primarily because people have been waiting 30 years for the showdown with Griffith, but as far as the story is concerned humans can't compete with apostles and monsters. You could argue that the hawk had the element of surprise, but we still see 500 war demons rout a kushan army of 250,000.

I don't know, I guess we'll see, but without a whole new body at least it's hard to imagine how Guts can keep going. And now they're in fantasy India and our homeboy can't even sweat, god damn.

>>25174
>On the one hand I think it's noble to try and respect Miura's vision for the story, but on the other I don't think trying to remain strictly faithful to whatever details Miura imparted really accomplished that.
Yeah a lot of people feel that way, and they seem to be getting more comfortable with filling in some of the empty space. The chapters have been getting more dialogue, which was notably very very sparse right after they took over.
> but any writer will tell you that the story develops as it is written.
True, but Mori said that Miura had the big picture outlined from early on and not much had changed. Regardless, it's not just Miura's work any more. It's Studio Gaga's, and just like Guts's friends they are doing the part of the job that he couldn't. I agree it would be better if they took more ownership of the story as they get more comfortable with taking over. The abruptness of his death probably influenced how they initially decided to approach it. Maybe with more time they will soften on that stance.

>I thought he was going to get some kind of improvement when visiting the dorf that made the armor
He is more in need of an upgrade to the Dragonslayer since it doesn't hurt Griffith. If anybody can help with that, it's probably the one character shown capable of hitting Griffith.

>>25175
>Regardless, it's not just Miura's work any more. It's Studio Gaga's, and just like Guts's friends they are doing the part of the job that he couldn't.

That's true. I guess ultimately it would just break my heart for Berserk to end up limping to the finish line, being broken up into "the great part when Miura was alive" and then "the lousy ending."

>Rickert
You know, I hadn't thought of that but he was Goto's apprentice. And Silat has shown off some pretty funky weapons in the past, so maybe time in the Kushan empire has exposed him to new smithing techniques. The strength of the dragon slayer seemed to be in all the animus it had absorbed by killing demons, but some sort of upgrade doesn't seem out of the question. Maybe to Gut's arm, too? Rickert seems to be something of a mechanical genius, and Guts is already using what looks like individual charges in his cannon. Making the next logical step to all in one shells would make sense.

>>25176
In Rickert's first appearance he's already maintaining weapons and is later shown using a more advanced repeating crossbow, like a gatling gun version. 100% being set up as a weapon master.

Rickert's slap also implies that there's some factor needed that Guts doesn't have and obviously is independent of the inherent damage a weapon would grant. The angle with The Dragonslayer being imbued with power from the apostles seems likely, especially since Guts actually did hit Griffith, but only severed one strand of hair. I'd speculate that in kind with The apostles, Godhand, and IoE, the feelings and beliefs someone has about Griffith affect their ability to hurt him. Griffith lives rent free in Guts's head as a symbol of evil that has been out of his reach for years. Rickert didn't have a similar relationship to Griffith or witness the Eclipses so wouldn't have the same baggage.

If you like symphonic metal this entire album is about Berserk

>>25177
>The dragonslayer

I think when Schierke is introduced there's a scene where she sees a black aura coming from the sword. I can't remember if it's her or someone else that theorizes that its absorbed malice from all the monster Gutts has killed with it, making it a supernatural weapon akin to the magic weapons that Serpico and Isidro use.

>the slap

You could be onto something there. I think the difference is that Rickert wasn't personally wronged by Griffith like Gutts was, and so his retribution isn't an act of personal vengeance but is more righteous retribution. Iirc he admonishes Griffy about how it was Rickert that had to bury all their comrades.

So I suppose Gutts' "upgrade" could be putting his personal vengeance aside in order to avenge the band of the hawk as a whole, if that makes sense.

>>1822
Baki is the most based and redpilled manga and the original anime was kino af.
> Peepee training.
> Have sex bitch.
> Get instant gains boosts post nutting:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NoAnhB5Uu6k

>>25178
The WHOLE thing is? I'd only heard about Band of the Hawk!

Nevermind, it turns out I had mixed up Beast in Black with a different band called Battle Beast.

Battle Beast did the song Band of the Hawk.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8lEhUf4ip-I

>>25184
Isn't Beast in Black some splinter group from Battle Beast?

>>25183
An interpretation from one of the comments:

0:00:00 Beast in Black : The Beast of Darkness in Guts mind.
0:04:29 Blind and Frozen : Griffith lamenting about letting Guts go.
0:09:32 Blood of a Lion : Guts courage or the Millenium Falcon Empire arc for Griffith ?
0:14:35 Born Again : Subtle mix between Griffith feelings for Guts, Charlotte feeling for Griffith, and the symbolism of Femto's birth ?
0:18:26 Zodd the Immortal : Well… Zodd the Immortal.
0:22:00 The Fifth Angel : The rise of Griffith as Femto.
0:25:30 Crazy Mad Insane : Guts rage against the Griffith (don't know why there's a cybernetic voice lmao).
0:28:57 Hell for all Eternity : Causality and the horrifying twist of the afterlife.
0:33:43 Eternal Fire : ?? The thrill of the fight ?
0:37:15 Go to Hell : Guts raging about Apostles
0:40:15 End of the World : ???
0:45:23 Ghost in the Rain : Desperate Guts and Skullknight under the rain after the Eclipse. Also a lovesong to Casca.

Never got to post in the anime hot takes thread, so I'll post it here:
Berserk sucks until Guts gets raped

Before here's no reason to give a shit about anything other than the art.
After, we get to see a story that's the edgy metal stuff, while also his life time experience of dealing with the trauma, even in the most subtle of ways.

>>26838
Guts shows classic signs of that trauma from the first volume.

Guts & Griffith were in love in the Golden Age arc.

>>26839
Yeah fair, but it takes a back seat to the edgyness, plus it's hard to care when you don't have any connection to this world.