Political implications of more Americans converting to Catholicism?
The American right was heavily associated with Evangelical idpol for the past 50 years. They became the cultural backbone of the GOP from the 80s to the late 2000s. Now it appears like a huge number of former Evangelicals are converting to Catholicism. I even know some ex-Mormons who are Catholic now.
At the same time, it seems like leftists are embracing Catholicism too. Remember when everyone was convinced Pope Francis was a secret socialist? Jacobin mag goes out of their way with appealing to Catholics as well (every other article of theirs is something along the lines of: “Move over pink-haired bipolar feminist queers, here’s why the Catholic Church are the REAL socialists!”). People like Dorothy Day are propped up even though her actual contributions to the American left were minimal and symbolic at best (the Catholic Worker also referred to the priests killed by /ourguys/ in Catalonia as “martyrs” which is disgusting). Not to mention, the Jacobin crowd seems very big on appealing to right-wing Catholic sentiments like complaining about birthrates being too low and proposing Bernie-style policies like universal healthcare to “fix” it, as if low birthrates are a problem to begin with.
But anyway, if Catholicism becomes a major cultural force in America in the next few years how do you see it affecting the political landscape?
307 posts and 42 image replies omitted.>>2464468There are former atheists converting too.
>>2464937I mean there are always going to be individuals doing things like that, but all the data shows that religion is on the decline in the United States. Maybe there are a few people who seek it out for community, but there doesn't seem to be much evidence that this will reverse the trend of religious decline.
1/5 of the world’s population is Atheist or something and on a larger scale Catholicism has gotten weaker.
But again it doesn’t really matter, capital has replaced religion in the west and the majority of people can’t even quote a single bible quote yet call themselves hardcore Christians. Look at the israeli flags in some southern churches, for a lot of these people it’s just a way of spirituality validating their white nationalist beliefs
>>2465481White Nationalism/American Civil Religion is a branch of Christianity, and in particular Calvinist replacement theology. Read Eric Weed's "The Religion of White Supremacy in the United States."
White Nationalists really are religious and really are a kind of Christian, their branch of Christianity is American Civil Religion. It's not so different from Hinduism as a kind of religious racial-caste system. Yes, a progressive and secular American Civil Religion is as laughable as a progressive and secular Catholics, the best we can probably do is to cautiously tolerate it.
>>2465755Explain the Calvinist shit to me.
>>2469146Good. Never understood the faith alone bullshit.
A lot of people ITT have said that the explosion of converts to Catholicism is about ex-Evangelicals wanting a more intellectual faith. Another way of looking at it is, it’s the result of the left overwhelmingly embracing anti-intellectualism as it has been doing in the past 10 years.
So, for instance, a leftist will say: “Don’t call someone a retard because that’s oppressive!””
Whereas a devout Catholic will say: “Don’t call someone a retard because the intellectually disabled are full and equal people made in the Imago Dei who deserve basic human dignity as taught by the Church.”
See what I mean? The left provides no answers, just abstractions and slogans.
>>2482848Both of these explanations are question-begging.
More and more Americans converting to Catholicism is the solution to the autism question.
Autistic men should be encouraged to become priests and friars.
Autistic women should be encouraged to become nuns.
This is exactly how it was in the West before the Protestant Reformation.
>>2482848It seems like a lot of people are burning out of that low brow Evangelicalism that was very popular a decade ago. But there are also secular people who have become interested in Catholicism. Probably because its intellectually more sophisticated and the Catholic Church is a moderating force in social life with a wide variety of factions to align yourself with, although mostly moderate. People are drawn to the ritual and the mystique of it too.
You are probably right that a lot of people (leftists included) find leftist slogans and theories insufficient for life. So they want to embrace religion as a private matter for personal reasons.
Evangelicalism was overwhelmingly a working class and rural poor movement which included the petty bourgeois. Catholicism seems to attract more middle class, intellectual types, so there’s a risk of elitism overriding Catholic social teaching. While in America and Europe, Islam is now more or less the religion of the lumpen proletariat. So there’s a danger that Christianity could be disconnected from the lives of working people. In many ways it’s ceasing to be the force it once was. You can’t imagine someone like MLK leading a mass movement today. The black church has slowly become more and more elitist and less present among the urban poor.
>>2465481>1/5 of the world’s population is AtheistThose statistics are flawed. Demographers often see religions as clubs and people as members. If a person doesn’t claim membership, the demographer simply counts them as an atheist or secular, completely forgetting that atheism is also a club and not some empty default state. In many places, religion doesn’t work like this. There are many Chinese who venerate a city god or engage with Buddhist or Taoist ritual, but can’t give you a straight answer on what their religion is. Japanese often participate in Shinto but don’t consider it a religion. So “oh wow no religious affiliation in Japan and China, must mean they are all atheists” is fudged.
>>2484864>While in America and Europe, Islam is now more or less the religion of the lumpen proletariat. lmao what?
>>2484874The Catholic church (also Eastern Orthodox too) as an institution is much more intellectual than burger book burning evangelical mega-churches.
>>2484945Converting to Catholicism is not the same has joining the Catholic clergy itself. The average Catholic can't even give you the names of the three Holy Kings, let alone give you a definition of transubstantiation or have a theological debate, including those that went to religious school. You don't seem to grasp the huge difference here.
>>2484907Islam is popular among prison inmates, ethnic minorities, ghetto dwellers, unemployed urban poor, and refugees. That’s a very different demographic from the people converting to Catholicism who seem more educated, middle class.
>>2485035Largely because a lot of Muslim converts want order in their lives, and Islam provides that sense of order.
>>2485035Most of those converts are black and most dip out after a few years. Islam doesn’t have a high retention rate when it comes to converts.
>>2485035Don't muslims only take up about 1% of the population though? How can Islam represent the lumpen proletariat when its followers are a fraction of this class?
>>2485772He’s talking about Europe or Black ghettoes.
>>2485772It appeals to members of this class. I’m not saying lumpens are Islamic lol In many places, Islam has become this religion that appeals to people on the bottom of society. Like prison inmates or refugees. Its not even poor people, but people who are minorities or really screwed in some way. You see it in black ghettos in America, but also Latinos, Australian aboriginals, and obviously Palestinians.
If you look at a lot of the Euros and Americans who joined ISIS, they were all lumpens or ex cons or petty criminals, drug dealers, and hookers looking to reinvent themselves.
>>2485352Hard to say. Salafists burn out the way evangelicals do. I know sometimes guys in prison convert for better food or if they have bad charges and are hated by other inmates.
>>2485972A lot of autistic and bipolar people convert to Islam as well.
>>2487361Most Hadith are fake.
>>2487571thats why gadafi started his own islam
>>2487342Bipolar? Nah they usually become schizo pagans. I’ve heard there’s a transhumanist to Shia pipeline which seems like a joke.
>>2409636Yeah that's like terminally online trad converts. Your average parish isn't like that
Italy is slowly turning back into a Catholic theocracy, so there’s that.
>>2503411JD vance definately did this. I always said you can never trust an american catholic.
>>2507636The current pope hates Trump and Vance.
>>2464937Keep dreaming, christcuck.
Religion doesn't influence politics. Politics influences religion.
>>2512793Nice slogan, dickhead.
- Overall point is correct.
- Claim is obviously incorrect.
>>2521993Frank Pavone is who Caleb Maupin would be if Caleb was a Catholic priest.
Anarchists aren’t our guys
Based Franco crushed the reddit counter revolution that wanted Spain to be one large furry barista polycule with wholesome cottagecore rural commune vibes and established Spain as an independent, industrial power fighting for a multipolar world(USER WAS BANNED FOR THIS POST)
>>2409385Trump is a neo-Lysenkoist he doesn’t believe in genetics period much less “eu” genics, go back
this thread refuses to die smh
>>2462619>Most Trad”Caths” are trying to paganize Catholicism the way Dugin and his ilk have tried to paganize Russian Orthodoxy.It has way less to do with "paganism" and way more to do with how they're tired of liberalism and individualism and would rather seek an authoritarian collectivist institution that has a lot of historical grounding.
>>2462619>cucktholic teaching supports western imperialismwho woulda thunk
>>2522078>this thread refuses to dieJust like Catholic Church!
>>2538448Yeah I’ve noticed nearly all Catholic converts are in denial about the extreme corruption in the Vatican.
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