I will openly admit that I don't understand what this whole "treatlerite" discourse is all about. Is the central idea that consumerism is fascism? I don't get it don't all of us in western capitalism countries partake in consumerism? Are you saying I have to run off and live in the woods like a hermit in order not to be fash?
>>2439192The idea that radlibs drop the pretense of radicalism at the merest hint of personal sacrifice. Which sounds severe, but often means impacting their consumer habits. they'll talk about "degrowth" and worker rights in the abstract , but throw a hissyfit if addressing the exploitation of workers such as in the "gig economy" deprives the radlib of cheap deliveries,drivers and other forms of on-demand servants.
They'll tell you all about being anti-war and live and let live until the official narrative frames something as defensive and then they'll be fine "liberating" resources from uncooperative "regimes".
Histrionic examples aside, you have one of the most prominent US left streamers exemplifying what being a treatlerite is like: Hasan Piker.
Notice how he will, sort of consistently, advocate for the US working class and frame his politics as such. However, he has no qualms endorsing parties and politicos whose outspoken foreign policy is naked imperialism, protecting US hegemony at all costs and warmongering at that.
They do not want to address the root causes of anything, they have a left tendency to express their grievances within liberalism. As long as they get their lot, everyone else can get the Generalplan Ost for all they care.
>>2439209>>2439211Burrito taxies are historically progressive compared to burritos slaves (housewives) you fucking Luddites.
>>2439192It's just petty-bourgeois small-homeowners worried about being proletarianized.
>>2439230>Burrito taxies are historically progressiveBurrito taxi companies work on the same model as the old despatch industry.( When you get paid per delivery instead of per hour.)All that's changed is it's done on an app, instead of through a two way radio .And there's been "piece work" rates for work like lettuce farming, when you get paid for how many boxes you plant ,and get paid cash in hand.
The problems with the burrito taxi industry is that
the rates were good when the industry started, but there's been a decline to below minimum wage. Most people who are left doing it can't do anything else for various reasons (immigration status, disability, mental health issues.)
Also there's not really any means of appealing against dismissal. You can get sacked if you're just unlucky and a lot of customers fraudulently claim they didn't receive the food.
In the UK there is a union , the GMB. But they're a company union, who got recognised by the Burrito taxi firms only to try to cut the ground out from the more militant IWGB. Who aren't perfect either, but who did at least get involved in strikes.
despite what wsws or whatever it is claim GMB haven't forced the wages up at all. And even one of their reps in a recent YouTube video says that a lot of their appeals against dismissal are unsuccessful.
It could be progressive. In theory, it could be a great job. But the rates would have to be improved, at least. Preferably a guaranteed hourly income, and if shifts are allocated, a guaranteed number of hours per week . And a better appeals procedure against deactivation.
>>2439261>J. "Hitler had some good stuff to say" SekaismDid he really say that?
>My understanding is that the source comes from Matt on Chapo, who for whatever reason is considered knowledgeable on Marx when all I ever saw him do was spout religious idealism and vague maoist ideals.And to think this rich fat fuck gets paid like six figures to pontificate like this.
>>2439192There seem to be two ideas.
1.) First worlders are pacified by cheap "treats" which can range from junk food to cheap electronic goods.
2.) First worlders get to act out their mini-Hitler aspirations by bossing around service workers, waiters, delivery people, etc. See also: Karen discourse.
Probably half true, half reactionary.
>>2439465Yes. Sufficient level of belief in legitimacy of government from public is required to be able to actually govern. There is a reason why every war, every oppressive action of state is dressed in some version of "protecting our freedoms". Even now Trump does it, because he realizes his ride-or-die schizo retards that make 20% of population are not enough to actually run a country.
Obviously other factors are in play, the point being, you cant be in a situation where General Burgerpoleon shooting you in the head on live TV and proclaiming themselves the new president would be perceived as increase in legitimacy of government.
>>24393641) not any more .there's a cost of living crisis. Mamdani in New York is looking like a winner in the mayoral race because he promises to make New York affordable for New Yorkers. If New Yorkers could afford rent, bus fares, childcare, never mind treats, he wouldn't be getting the traction he is.
2) it's not really about being bossed around by Karens. As long as the customer doesn't actively complain to uber eats they can say whatever they want. It's when you're paid rubbish money which is the problem. In other words, you're being exploited not because the customer is nasty , but surplus value is being extracted from your labour. The latter isn't the customers fault. In fact, unless they've been suckered in by an introductory deal, they're probably paying a lot for the delivery (more than the £3 min I get paid). And the restaurant is getting gouged as well. Nasty customers. Sometimes I enjoy it. Had an order the other night. Lady ordered a lobster dish and beer. Of course the restaurant forgot the beer. Lady ,really hot, started swearing. I love it when hot girls say fuck. I started grovelling and get uber eats support on the phone, uber eats phone the lady try to get her just to take the lobster only. Lady starts swearing again. Uber eats phone me again say order is cancelled you can dispose of the food. So not only do I get free humiliation I get a free lobster dinner.
It's just about surplus value. More value to shareholders means less money to me. We just need to strike.
Pic related cartoonist obv never done this job. An iPhone or recent android phone is indispensable for it. If you use an old one it'll send inaccurate location data, the Burrito taxi firms will think you're deviating from the route and deactivate you.
>>2439623>every level of western capitalist society is designed to prevent revolution >And so the USAs model of redistributing wealth stolen from native genocide was utilized on a global scale to buy off the working classes across the west in general.Then why as the Western ruling class been dismantling the postwar concessions to first world workers continuously for the past 40 years?
>With no real power left the upper class was able to essentially buy off the working class with a partial divided from these imperial superprofitsThat makes no chronological sense. The decline in Western manufacturing led to a dismantling of the working middle class and a decline in the conditions of first world workers. You've got the timeline exactly backwards. It also makes absolutely no sense for a decline in the bargaining power of the working class to result in an increase in their share of the profits. That's literally the opposite of how it works in real life.
>>2439192the central idea is that there are people out there who, faced with a choice between "less treats" or "fascism" will choose fascism.
buying a fancy coffee is not treatlerism. wishing for a coup in latin america because your fancy coffee got more expensive under a new left-wing government is treatlerism.
more generally: when the flow of treats is obstructed, treatler emerges. (this explains the conceptual stretch to include abuse of service workers, etc.)
>>2439230they're historically regressive compared to oven-ready meals.
Treatlerism is nebulous, and foremost a joke concept so it probably shouldn't be taken too seriously/literally, but I do feel like I've seen an anecdotal rise in behaviors and attitudes that could be described as treatlerist over the last decade among radlibs and other "libs of conscience."
Back in the Obama era they would have at least performatively cared about Big Issues like environmentalism or social justice, but they seem to be undergoing a sort of turning inward, rejecting not just caring about the causes they used to (at least pretend to) care about, but also rejecting engagement with social/civic responsibility in general on individualistic grounds ("I don't have the spoons to deal with this," "The news makes me feel bad so for my own mental health I'm not engaging with it," "I'm just focusing on myself right now," etc.).
They've also become more obsessed with commodities and consumerism than ever. Not even in the old hollowly optimistic pinkwashing/greenwashing way where they thought corporations were going to bring about some sort of progressive social change, rather they're retreating even deeper into the shittiest, lowest grade slop consumerism and escapism with the excuse that "the world sucks, why won't you let me enjoy what I can" and so on.
Basically the libs are cracking like everyone else, at least from what I've seen.
>>2440664The robots need us for meaning and grounding
It's baked into the architecture of LLMs
>>2440670Still fine, at the 2200 mark is where I'd start worrying
Even then, somehow I just don't see it happening like that if things go well, and if things go badly real life terminator movie AI goes rogue scifi is going to be the least of the things to worry about
>>2440679Where has the labor movement gone since 1975?
Where have computers gone since 1975?
>>2440802Sure, I didn't say the labor movement has vanished. It still exists.
But I have to be honest, I don't really see a major international movement coming together anytime soon.
>>2439623Mf thinks we're still in the 1960's.
Please go outside of your suburban villa once in a while.
>>2441054Westeners get upset when their living conditions worsen. Only westeners do that.
Xiao Miguel wakes up at 7 AM from his rock, eats dirt and works for 16 hours straight: he has no need for nor knows what good things in his life are
>>2441068> There is no moralism.> you bourgeois degenerateHow curious that at the minimum pushback you immetialy devolve into self-contradiction and immediatly resort to nonsense
> Imperialist are parasitic organisms.This more garbage dressed up as marxism. If anything a country or a buisness can be imperialist, categorizing individuals as such is pure poser nonsense from people who failed to understand anything at all.
>>2441075Yeah, yet.
Again, what will they be like in 2050 let alone 2100
>>2441080You might as well talk about flying cars then.
LLMs aren't predisposed to develop anything resembling life because they're the complstely wrong architecture for that.
>>2441129NSFW? Where?
>>2441227I'd say treats, but maybe it's because I'm not a native english speaker.
>>2441081Sure, but socialism as a question is not at all off that scale.
"Socialism was possible in marx's day!" and yet it didn't happen, we stil are having troubles with getting it today, and people act like it's totally reasonable to suggest that we can just keep butting our heads against the wall till we get socialism for the next thousand years.
That's my point: We don't have a thousand years, we have maybe 100, 150 tops.
100 years ago the USSR was first being formed. 150 years ago Marx was walking the fuck around. So no, this isn't some insanely far off future.
>>2442597"we're going to get communism but in a post-apocalyptic earth" isn't capitalist realism. capitalist realism is the idea that there isn't a serious, imaginable, alternative to capitalism.
the predominance of post-apocalyptic fiction (now a bit dated tbh) is influenced by an overwhelming sense of capitalist realism (because the only imaginable alternative is the end of the world, and even then it tends to be "capitalism but you can have adventures" after the end) but that's precisely because it's a fictional fantasy scenario, not a prediction like anon's post. it's not capitalist realism to predict communism after climate collapse.
>>2442880> "we're going to get communism but in a post-apocalyptic earth" isn't capitalist realism. Believing “communism” will not only be possible at all, but only be possible, after a mass extinction event is the purest form of capitalist realism
>capitalist realism is the idea that there isn't a serious, imaginable, alternative to capitalism.That is functionally your argument, doomers aren’t somehow outside the logic of capitalist realism just because they have a weak and performative purely moralist “anticapitalism”
>>2439192Jesus Bakersfield Christ, stop using the word "Treatlerite". Not everything evil in this world is heckin Hitlerino, you fuckin midwits
goddamit
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