third world proletarians, the most exploited on earth, regularly ask why 1st world proletarians don't do more. why don't they rebel? why don't they have revolutions? why have the first world proletariat not lifted a finger against their governments? the conclusion is treatlerism. they are willing and gleeful collaborators who benefit from plunder and so have become a "bourgeois proletariat" (engels said this about english workers in the late 19th century) fine. but it is a futile effort to ask someone who supposedly benefits from imperialism to fight it. they are your oppressor. do not beg your oppressor to stop oppressing you. that's naive cuckoldry at best. the next question then becomes, why do the third world proletariat not destroy the first world? the answer is they are too weak. they lack sovereignty. they don't have nukes. the imperial core sanctions, coups, embargoes, invades, bombs them every time they try to rise up. the only one brave enough to rise up seem to be the hyper religious ones who have no interest in communism, and they tend to get destroyed because they don't have a materialist understanding and just vibe based on the idea that god will give them the strength to win against impossible odds. not good… ok so what we have is a pretty bleak situation. the 1st world proletariat won't revolt because they benefit, and the 3rd world proletariat can't revolt because they're weak. What is left? bernsteinism? thinking capitalism will destroy itself if you wait long enough? embracing climate collapse and post apocalyptic scavenger theses? well that's anticommunist and opportunist. anprim ideology?
we have to get to the root here. i'm sick of the circular arguments where third worlders/worldists beg treatlers to stop being treatlers , and treatlers antagonize third worlders and tell them to win against impossible odds without any help from within the belly of the beast?
certain posters on here like felix says you need a crisis in the imperial core that accelerates economic collapse to create conditions for proletarian revolution. but nobody wants to go around blowing up power stations on the off chance it makes a lobotomized population of reactionaries who can't even point to iran or ukraine on a map suddenly pick up guns and attack the imperial core superpower.
what is the solution? how do you get around questions of nuclear armageddon, 1st world apathy, 3rd world weakness, 2nd world opportunism, religious idealism, and climate collapse? Is there a solution at all?
This place exists for having circular arguments.
Nobody wants to prevent having them.
Based post. I have no idea. None of the communist orgs in my area seem serious enough, and I'm too much of a treatlerite to give the all my time and money when I know rationally they will never succeed in making much change. I make mild socialist arguments in discussions with my coworkers in the break room, and joined the parlimentary left party.
>>2740198>what is the solution? Economical damage in 1st world. Militarily you will get nowhere but feel free to try.
>how do you get around questions of nuclear armageddon,You dont. We all live on the edge of a knife when it comes to nuclear war.
>third world proletarians, the most exploited on earth, regularly ask why 1st world proletarians don't do more
Do they? Which communist parties in the third world are saying this?
Proles are a reactionary class and always have been no matter their hierarchy in imperialism, feudalism and slavery will return when climate destroys all capital and we can no longer extract fossil fuels or lithium
>>2740431If that were true there would have been a revolution in the 70s during the oil crisis
>>2740198>third world proletarians, the most exploited on earth, regularly ask why 1st world proletarians don't do moreThey don't.
>why don't they rebel? why don't they have revolutions? why have the first world proletariat not lifted a finger against their governments?Because they lack the organized party of the working class.
>the conclusion is treatlerism.If you don't have any interest in how communist parties actually form and operate, maybe.
>they are willing and gleeful collaborators who benefit from plunder and so have become a "bourgeois proletariat" (engels said this about english workers in the late 19th century)This only applies to a minority of the working class and that minority shrunk drastically in the last 50 years.
>the next question then becomes, why do the third world proletariat not destroy the first world?Because that's not the point.
>the only one brave enough to rise up seem to be the hyper religious ones who have no interest in communismWhat?
>we have to get to the root here. i'm sick of the circular arguments where third worlders/worldists beg treatlers to stop being treatlers , and treatlers antagonize third worlders and tell them to win against impossible odds without any help from within the belly of the beast?I agree.
>what is the solution? how do you get around questions of nuclear armageddon, 1st world apathy, 3rd world weakness, 2nd world opportunism, religious idealism, and climate collapse? Is there a solution at all?Getting off your ass is a good start.
>>2740507Lol like it matters what anyone does
>why 1st world proletarians don't do more.
Do you have any fucking idea how difficult it would be to revolt against the capitalist class inside the imperial core? It's not a matter of desire you stupid fuck, it's a materialist question, and right now capitalism has not been exhausted to the point of this becoming a viable alternative.
>>2740804When it’s exhausted there won’t be the resources to continue using any capitalist technology, back to roman slavery it is
>>2740494Not extreme enough.
>>2740806Delusional, Capitalism doesn't exploit resources until they are extinguished, they exploit them until it isn't profitable to do so, not like that matters because under communism we won't need to produce industrial levels of commodities
>>2740815You’re going to be my slave when we all move to the arctic
>>2740818Are you an 18 year old AFAB goth? Otherwise I don't care about being your slave
>>2740828Go back to harvesting my wheat before I feed you to a grolar bear or the other slaves
>>2740829I am 6'4, I would fold you line a pretzel you fucking manlet
>>2740830You’ll submit with a gun to your head just like Chagos, Felix, and CPUSAnon
>>2740815>leftcomSuch an easy position to be critical of every single socialist position. Its pure naivety.
>>2740833Not a single extant organization, almost like its pure academia
>>2740846Keep posting eventually things will change
>>2740507>They don't.i have seen it happen on this very board. like chagosposter does it every day
>>2740507>Getting off your ass is a good start.t. man also on his ass
>>2740832only feds call people who take action "adventurist". anything that goes beyond theory book clubs and ego stroking is adventurist to these peons. CPUSA is a known fed organization.
>>27401981st world doesn't have proletarians, it has debt slaves
>third world proletarians, the most exploited on earth
Turd worldist theorylet detected
>>2767114finish reading before commenting
>>2740198>what is the solution? Do nothing, win.
China is building productive forces all over the world. By 2050 Bangladesh Niger and Tanzania will have a billion people each and have nuclear power plants high speed rail and produce more steel than the US and EU combined. Minimum wage for the average prole there will be $50 an hour. GATT, NAFTA, TPP will lose all power. Once this happens the competitive advantage of the imperialist west will be absolutely gutted and demolished they will have to stop being service workers with bullshit jobs and actually make something. Hundreds of millions of petite bourgeois professional managerial ladder climbers will be reproletarianized and their jet skis repossessed by the dealership forcing them to get real jobs. These people will be furious and the monopolist bourgeoisie will get super cucked incapable of external expansion they will turn colonialism inward domestically and put the screws on with unimaginable austerity to prop up their wrecked profit rate. Contradictions will increase and crisis will become even more frequent? 2008->2019->2026? how about every year? twice a year? crashes every other month? hyperinflation? S&P and Dow go to zero.
>>2767625>Do nothing, win. Not exactly do nothing tbh fr tho.
if the proles arent organized then when the crisis hit they will turn ecofash especially the downwardly mobile previously pettyborg ones
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