/leftypol/ - Leftist Politically Incorrect

Communism hasnt been achieved but people who are communists in ideology have accomplished a lot of things - the USSR, modern day China, freeing Cuba from slavery, Burkina Faso's liberation, Angolas and the defense of North Korea from genocide are the biggest accomplishments that come to mind.

Communism was attempted but never established fully in the sense of totally getting rid of commodities and money, but so far the attempts have brought some of the poorest countries in the world at the beginning of the 20th century to space faring civilizations in just a few decades. It’s sort of like being in 1200 AD and asking if capitalism and republicanism will ever spread outside Venice and Genoa.

>>2787807
yeah military sound good and all but what about like people who were starving since those fund went into military tech

>>2787811
That’s why China is winning the current cold war, because they don’t spend much on military and aren’t willing to get into an arms race with the US outside the AI sector

>>2787811
all these accomplishments came with insane growths in material conditions when sustained. The USSRs at its peak would make most people here start bouncing off the walls if it was offered in liberal economy like 2-3% of your wage a month going to rent.

Even in modern day, 90% of people in China own a house, landlords arent even a concern in day to day life like they are in the west.

>>2787804
Yeah it worked in the People's republic of Deez

>>2787812
sure but they're participating in capitalism economy, it just in term of politic they look communism.

>>2787813
yeah but what about the very cramped appartements

The famines and mass deaths in the USSR and China also occurred in the capitalist west the difference is all the deaths and destruction from uprooting the peasantry and putting them in cities took centuries in the west but in China and Soviet they had to cram all that development within a few decades

>>2787818
better than having thousands of homeless people in every city no?

>>2787816
They’re forced to play the game until NATO bloc collapses at which point there’s gonna be a lot of class struggle within the communist party itself over which path to take

>>2787821
yeah but in china they love to hide/kick off homeless people too

>>2787822
so like its not a concrete example of communism more like capitalism "just playing the game"

Honestly most people in China have on average, much higher quality of life and living standards than anywhere in the west

Dont be fooled by the image you might have in your head about were they are at, they have underwent rapid social and housing development and the infrastructure they have is unrivaled globally in terms of its utility and function for the masses.

>>2787824
They dont have homeless people in China, only mentally ill people - they have an abundance of homes to the point most people own more than one.

depends what you measure success by
the older russians seem nostalgic for it
no luxuries, but at least you had stability

>>2787826
Like within any political structure there’s factions with varying opinions and interests, some in the party are pure Chinese nationalists who would be happy to try and become an imperial hegemon over east asia, others are ultra left maoists who want to bring the cultural revolution back and kill all the businessmen, there’s technocrats who just want to preserve their careers

>>2787829
so if i applied that logic then the homeless people in america would be mentally ill people with access to crack

>>2787833
i was talking more in term of economy instead of vibes but i suppose there truth to your comment

>>2787837
the difference is that when the state comes and collects the homeless people they actually have houses to put them into

>>2787843
do you have evidence to back this up, regarding china there is been a lot of source that are controlled by the governement to the rest of the world, i wouldn't trust a chiness source other than tourist or foreign one on this topic

>>2787804
no because it's never happened, instead we only ever had "actually existing socialist" nations like the USSR and PRC which tried to pull off a managed transition to communism which was hindered by the fact that every AES country exists under siege in a global capitalist economy. If you point this out both communists and anti-communists get really mad at you. Communists get mad at you because you slandered their AES countries for not being perfect. Anti-Communists get mad at you because they think you're making excuses for a failed system by saying it was never tried in the first place. Communists will endlessly quote Marx saying that Communism is "not a state of affairs to be established but the real movement which abolishes the present state of things" and while Marx did say that it seems like a cope when you're trying to make a global proletariat who is still divided on questions like nationality, race, etc. unite against a global bourgeoisie that has figured out how to coordinate in spite of those things. Until the proletariat are just as organized as the ruling class, they can't do a global revolution. But they won't get that organized because the global bourgeoisie cooperates to make sure that doesn't happen. So your best hope is to wait for the global bourgeoisie to be highly divided and uncoordinated and have your revolution then. But the proletariat needs to be organized in advance of that. And what do the proletariat have trouble doing? organizing. Why? Because they hate each other because they're all brainwashed by le nation race religion spooks.

>>2787804
Yes it was achieved in Democratic Kampuchea

>>2787849
Notice how every single country with a high % is either a current or prior satellite of the USSR or China? Not an accident, thats the difference when commies are in power, workers actually own things.

>>2787853
>workers own property
yes; the more property owners, the better

Mods can you do your fucking job already?

>>2787860
How many times does this site have to broadcast its racism and disgust towards MLM before you get the hint?

>>2787858
communism is when everyone is rich, yes workers should own a home.

>>2787861
Oh it's been long taken. If it wasn't for NewsAnon I'd have gone long ago.

>>2787804
ussr and china lifted millions out of poverty, and went from laughable shitholes to superpowers thanks to it
cuba despite the crushing sanction still has better HDI than all comparable countries

Communism has ALWAYS worked, EVERY TIME it has been tried. Communism ALWAYS bring peace and prosperity. EVERONE WHO SAY, "Communism does not work." Is bourgeois or bourgeois labor aristocrat who exploit superprofit from and oppress true working people. They KNOW Communism work. That is why they LIE

>>2787871
what news anon does can be done with an RSS feed tbh. not to shit on comrade news anon

>>2787858
to be fair DPRK does have property ownership enshrined in article 24 of its constitution. I have seen anons here complain that AES nations are proudhonist in practice but I think all people really care about is whether they're better off.

>>2787872
cuba also trains more physicians per capita than any other nation. AES consistently outperforms in metrics like STEM researchers per capita and female college graduates. if their GDP PPP and average income is low, it's because they are low on the imperialist food chain rather than because their system is a failure. they'd be worse off under IMF loan sharking and structural adjustment. Just look at Ukraine.

>>2787884
http://naenara.com.kp/index.php/Main/index/en/politics?arg_val=constitution
>Article 24. Private property is property owned and consumed by individual citizens. Private property is derived from socialist distribution according to work done and from supplementary benefits granted by the State and society. The products of individual sideline activities including those from kitchen gardens, as well as income from other legal economic activities shall also be private property. The State shall protect private property and guarantee by law the right to inherit it.
Bourgeois private property is abolished in Communism. Socialist proletarian private property is sanctified in all Communist proletarian dictatorship. In DPRK, bourgeoisie is eliminated. In Communism, capitalism is eliminated.