/leftypol/ - Leftist Politically Incorrect

>>2826254
>>>/siberia/ is for low-effort meme posting.
Stop shitting up the main board, for christ sake.

>>2826254
>David is a gourmet chef who works for a restaurant and makes $200,000 a year. Barry is the owner of a Deli Shop and makes $50,000 a year. Based purely on the information given, which person is a Proletariat? Barry, David, both or neither?
David and it doesn't matter, what matters is class consciousness.
>Do Native Americans, the descendents of the Pre-Columbian population of what is now the United States, have a unique right to their land based on their genetic makeup?
No, kill the religious tribal hippie spiritual vermin and their blood and soil ilk.
>Capitalist society is an improvement over pre-Capitalist society. True or False?
Yes.

>>2826262
Theres only one problem of capitalism that feudalism did not have though, that is the looming threat of potential extinction. So it wouldn't have been an improvement is the species goes extinct.

Neither

Yes


If by "is an improvement" you mean "was historically progressive" then true, otherwise it is a subjective opinion

>>2826254
>Do Native Americans, the descendents of the Pre-Columbian population of what is now the United States, have a unique right to their land based on their genetic makeup
No, but based on the tribal treaties that they signed and experienced betrayal over, they do deserve portions of ancestral land as recompense, at least in the short term until nation-states are abolished

>>2826264
Was the bubonic plague not an extinction event?

David, Capitalist society is an improvement, and Native Americans have a right to their land based on their nation and culture not their genetics.

>>2826258
I think this is a worthwhile political conversation to have. I'm not meming here.
>>2826262
You passed
>>2826268
Hello Mr. Hitler, welcome back
>>2826269
I don't care much about the legality of breaking treaties, the effect of the treaties being broken (Which was very much negative) are the problem in my eyes. In the context of a Capitalist society I absolutely support ceding large swaths of public land to Natives but on the grounds of lessening poverty rather than genetic or cultural right.
>>2826277
Nobody has an actual right to land whatsoever

>>2826302
Nothing I said was hitlarian in any way

>>2826302
Crazy to call anyone else hitler when you're rambling on about genetic makeups.
>I think this is a worthwhile political conversation to have. I'm not meming here.
Lol. Lmao.

>>2826277
Based lad.

If David gets laid off or his employer goes out of business, david has no more income.

A deli owner decides who gets the privilege of luxuries like food to survive, and maybe 4 walls and a roof to sit in between shifts. The deli owner could liquidate their property and make significantly more than they would in a year to invest or fuck off and do whatever, otherwise they wouldn't bother running the business in the first place and just get a similar job as david.

Additionally, he can take out loans, pay very little in taxes, and other benefits.

It indicates a lack of knowledge and life experience to think that the main benefit of owning a businesses is getting to write ones own paycheck, and a special kind of retardation to think that the hypothetical is anywhere near a gotcha.

Not unlike how patsoc fascists get when they talk about PMCs. Labor aristocracy is a thing but it will never change the fundamental class relations.

>>2826305
>>2826327
Nobody has any right to land based on their genetic makeup, or really any right to land whatsoever. The point I'm making is that to believe that genetic makeup can determine land ownership is extremely hitlerite.
>>2826346
The point of the hypothetical is that the income is irrelevant because being a Proletariat is about relation to the means of production, not income. The intended Marxist answers to the 3 questions are "David", "No, nobody has a right to land" and "True, Capitalism is an improvement over Feudalism".

>>2826393
No it's not, hitler was the colonizer in this comparison. The people with "genetic" right to the land were the slavs and soviet peoples of the east.

Native american heritage, as far as I am aware, is determined through lineage, thus genetic right to land

>>2826399
according to the department of the interior, if your dad is 100% Chocktaw and your mom is 100% Lakota, you're only 50% Native American. Cause each tribe is counted separately. It's a method of land theft used by the Department of Interior cause you need to be at least x% Native American to receive any gibs.

>>2826270
Is the feudalist mode of production responsible for the black death? Or was it simply a happening during that epoch?

>>2826254
I reject all 3 questions. this is like medieval scholasticism. counting angels on the head of a pin. pure philosophy. Marx wasn't concerned with weird outliers like the socially necessary labor time needed to paint the mona lisa, or whether a gourmet chef is proletarian, he was concerned with the average worker producing commodities in an industrialized society where feudalism had already ended.

>>2826411
Yeah, it's fucked up

>>2826277
>landback
sorry best i can do is create a brahmin caste of 90% european 10% native casino owners

>>2826302
Treaties really are the key to making decolonization in North America work without engaging in any sort of ethno-spookery. Many Indigenous people consider their tribal governments to be legitimate polities that never surrendered their sovereignty and ought to be viewed as nations within a nation. In some cases there was never any agreement extinguishing their independence to begin with, nor was there a physical conquest. For example the Six Nations Confederacy of the Great Lakes region continued to be an independent state until sufficient numbers of settlers arrived that the British government (on the Canadian side of their territory) just started ignoring them, and the recognition of their sovereignty just sort of faded out of existence. Today they claim that they were neither conquered nor signed away their independence, and that's essentially true. If you consider treaties to be agreements between sovereign polities, then you now have a legal and conceptual basis to address the unique tasks of decolonization (e.g. land concessions, fishing/hunting/trapping rights, etc.) without resorting to special treatment on the basis of ethnicity. Rather it would be on the basis of tribal citizenship.

>>2826429
Treaties are kind of worse than ethnospookery. Why should I give a shit about 18th century legal frameworks?

>>2826449
>Treaties are kind of worse than ethnospookery
How do you figure that?
>Why should I give a shit about 18th century legal frameworks?
First off because socialism won't abolish international relations, at least not for centuries. Socialist states should abide by their international agreements, at least where those agreements are not contrary to socialist principles. More practically however, it creates a legal basis for important tasks such as land reform and political autonomy without drawing distinctions between citizens on the basis of race.

>>2826254
The gourmet chef is not an industrial prole working at subsistence wages. He'll be a brand, he'll have reserves, he sounds like an independent contractor, he's a petite bourgeoisie or will be soon enough.

Native rights, depends on what the Supreme Court's mood is that day. If the US was like the Soviet Union they'd carve out some administrative regions for them. If Marx/Engels were in charge they'd be wiped out to the last man.

Is capitalism better? Too soon to tell. Check back in 500 or 1,000 years.